Steel is broken

Just remove Stealth Rock so Charizard Y and Volcarona can Fire Blast their way to the top

>>32404867
>this again
zzzz

if you couldn't blanket check fucking everything with steel the game would turn into rock paper scissors at the team preview

>>32404867
Blame the Tapus

>>32404867
>A weakness to electricity
MAKE BOLTBEAM GREAT AGAIN.

It's really just certain Steel pokemon, like Excadrill, Celesteela, Skarm, and M-Metagross. Maybe Heatran too.

>>32404867
If you ask me, not resisting Dark and Ghost in Gen 6 was a decent debuff.

>>32404867
>complaining about the best defensive typing is now good offensively
Is because Fairy-type legendaries. For those that don't know, Legendaries are the best special attackers

>>32405048
Yes, steel needs this. We need new type balancing. Rock resists ice, ice resists grass, grass resists fairy, Dragon resists flying, and steel is week to electric type.

The problem is actually the Fairy-type Pokemon. Steel was pretty much designed to be a defensive type, but now it has to fulfill the offensive role as well. Poison isn't prevalent enough in the meta except for maybe Alolan Muk to bring Fairies down a notch.

>>32405310
Make fairy weak to grass, this would really fuck over my bro Azumarril, it's needed

>>32405320
Nah, Grass and Bug both need to resist Fairy. In my personal opinion, Fairy should do neutral against Fighting (thus making Psychic less obsolete), while Poison becomes SE against Water.

>>32405357
Psychic should be SE on steel, like spoon benders, it only resists psychic because of the balance issue in Gen

>>32405320
>Sap Sipper
Not much of a fix

>>32404867
They need to make fighting types prevalent again

>>32405357
Bug doesn't need anything. There are seven bugs in OU

>>32405370
Good point.

>>32405365
Ironically, I think the Fire/Fighting starters might be viable enough. Sneaky Pebbles doesn't hurt too much, Fire helps neutralize Fairy damage, and they have decent movepools to work with (Gunk Shot Infernape).

>>32405363
No, I can hardly embrace the dark and ghost buffs by removing the steel resistance. Steel is designed to be defensive, removing its ability to resist switches and you defeat the type. Removing three resists is far more damaging than providing one weakness

make fairy not super effective against fighting.
Fightings return, steel suffers. There you go.

bst mean nothing a example to this is kyurem-B greninja and breelom

>>32404867
honestly the whole typing chart should be revamped there's so much wrong with it right now. Ice needs to resists stuff its SE against, maybe not dragon, grass needs resistances and less weaknesses, posion should be SE against water, it's so obvious ant posion would need a buff in attack while water can handle another weakness etc...

I'm not saying al types should have qual amoutn of weaknesses and resistances, that would ruin it, but some types are more fucked than they should be

>>32405370
Pinsir and Volcarona are overpowered mons crippled by their Bug typing. But I agree Bug doesn't need any type chart improvements, U-Turn is already a huge niche.

>>32404867
>since the first gen
you know steel wasn't a tipe on the first gen, right?

>>32405865
problem with this reasoning is that bug types without u-turn are utterly and completely fucked

>>32405278
Terrible ideas

please people used to complain steel was useless offensively before gen 6

Threads like this makes me understand why Gamefreak completely ignores their fan base.

>>32404867
You're ONLY complaining about Steel because of how good Megagross is and if it were banned you would start complaining about Tapus.

>>32406211
I've been out of the game for a few months. Why are people on Smogon suddenly complaining about Megagross? It was seen as a good but perfectly manageable glue for offensive teams back in Gen 6 and didn't get any buffs this gen other than instant Mega speed and Psychic Terrain (the latter is more of an argument to ban Tapu Lele). I guess the decrease of Dark types due to prevalence of Fairies is part of the problem, but it shouldn't last once the more obviously broken things are banned and the meta settles.

>>32406275
of the pokemon hurt by fairies, Darks were hurt the least. Stab knock-off is still every where.

Fairy only hurt outrage spam as far as dragons go, but they absolutely destroyed the viability of most fighting types.

>>32406342
>they absolutely destroyed the viability of most fighting types
Thank you for pointing that out

>>32404867
>fire is hindered by sneaky pebbles
Or you could just live without the STAB
I repeatedly get memed on in the fucking battle tree by 'mons using moves that have no fucking place with them and still one shot me despite no STAB
Steel needs to be super effective against a few more types and gain some resistances, and in return, some weaknesses that in my head makes sense

>>32406275
>It was seen as a good but perfectly manageable glue for offensive teams back in Gen 6
Is that why >57% voted to ban it?

>>32404867
> It resists the highest BST type in the game
Yeah and most of the common dragon types carry a fire move, ground move or both
> It is also immune to being worn down by toxic
What is Salazzle
> Its first weakness - fire - is hindered by ever prevalent stealth rocks
Defog and Rapid Spin, hazards aren't that hard to deal with
> Its second weakness - fighting - has arguably been the most hard-hit type in the game in the past half decade
Must admit, fighting is in a bit of a sad spot but does still work alright with certain type combinations such as fire/fighting and steel/fighting
> Its third weakness - ground - is often offset by the fact most steel types have huge defence, also two of the three most overused steel types are immune, anyway
I can't deny this one

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>>32406356
Really, I don't know why GF opted to nerf Fighting.

>Fairy made it so there were less viable counters to Dark types, which is still offensively one of the best types.
>Fairy made it so steel was directly AND indirectly stronger due to lack of fighting
>There was already a type with fighting immunity running around
>Poison is now more popular because of fairy and it also resists fighting

Like why?

Look at all this faggots that don't understand what fairies are.

They are the precursors of evil abominations, the "I cheat button" of folk tales.

They are only weak to a plebothinum of sorts, hence the poison and steel weakness, literally poisoned and killed by cold iron.

Fairies where so fucking op in myths they even commanded dragons and lesser beings like bugs to do their biddings, heck in most tales of dragon slaying it is a fucking fairy that gives the tools to a human so they could kill a dragon.

You can't punch a fairy, you can't out trick a fairy with purple and orange polka dots morality.

Thematically all of fairy resistances and strengths are justified, although they missed an opportunity to give ice a resistance to it due to most fairies being governed by winter.

Stell doesn't need a nerf, fairy, ghost and water need a nerf on their offensive presence.

The current rise of steel types is mostly because of the existence of top tier threatening offensive fairies.

And no, ice can't resist water. That's the biggest mark of an idiot posting, do some research on specific heat, then be glad water isn't super effective on ice.

>>32406763
by that logic we should be reverting psychic to its gen 1 bullshit status because its also an I cheat button of scifi

>>32406763
reasonable resists for ice could include flying and ground though

>>32405146
Don't kid yourself there was no debuff.

Steel lost 2 resists yes.

However in real terms it also gained 1 resist & 1 effectiveness because of Fairies addition.

It broke even, there was no nerf.

>>32406763
>fairies being governed by winter.
This bothers me so fucking much.

Ice should have been a hard resist for Fairies or even better an immunity. Just that one extra type who can come in on a Fairy attack would matter so much and it may as well be one of the weakest typings since it's thematically right.

>>32406603
>complaining about poison being more popular

>>32406982
The problem itself is that poison resist fighting, it's that fairy resists fighting AND poison resists fight.

Poison itself is fine. It's a defensive type, that's destroyed by earthquake.
Fairy is a solid offensive and defensive type and that's weak to two types that had little offensive presence outside metagross and gengar.

>>32407441
>The problem itself is that poison resist fighting,
*isn't.

whoopsies

>>32405278
>>32405320
>>32405357
Can anyone explain the logic behind grass resisting fairy?

>>32408368
Fairies are usually depicted as guardians of nature, so it would make sense for them to be reluctant to hurt grass-types.

>>32406603
>Really, I don't know why GF opted to nerf Fighting.
Conkeldurr, Terrakion and Japan's Heracross PTSD. Fighting type was pretty stupid in gen5.

>>32404867
Alright boi.

>Its first weakness - fire - is hindered inherently by ever prevalent stealth rocks;
Good thing Flamethrower/Fire Blast and Fire Punch are basic bitch coverage then, right?

>Its second weakness - fighting - has arguably been the most hard-hit type in the game in the past half decade;
Because people have stopped running fighting moves because of those nerfs, right?


>Its third weakness - ground - is often offset by the fact most steel types have huge defence, also two of the three most overused steel types are immune, anyway
>muh type demographics
AKA you have goose egg on this one, because you just claimed that a type with a weakness to literally the gold standard of moves in the game isn't that hampered by it.

>Its original inception was to be primarily defensive, with no strong use as an offensive type, and it worked well in that situation for generations.
Because Magneton/Zone, Scizor, and Metagross are all primarily renowned for their defensive capabilities. Just like the good ol' days, boyo.

>It resists the highest BST type in the game;
>It resists the type that counters the type with the highest BST in the game;
>It is immune to the type that counters that;
Goddamn just name the type you autist. BST demographics DO NOT MEAN SHIT. You will never see any of the pokemon with shit BST because they are shitmons, and thus they are irrelevant.
And it's a damn good thing Steel resists Fairy, because not a lot does. You think being the only not-shit type to resist another dominant one might be a big fucking reason why Steel clogs upper tiers?
Actually, let's take another look at this. Steel is still shit offensively, only 3 types are beaten by it, 2 of which are covered completely by fighting, but a fuckton of other stuff too. But then there's fucking fairy. You think being the safest counter to the currently most OP type MIGHT have something to do with its popularity spike as of late?

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>when adding fairy they buffed steel and nerfed bugs
for what reason?

>>32406763
Steel needs a nerf. There's no reason why there should be 12 Steel styles running around OU, almost twice as much as any other type.

It needs to have a third resist whacked off the list. Ghost and Dark weren't enough.

>>32411120
Smogon tiers aren't exactly the best way to gauge how strong a type is. There's three ghosts in ou, should ghost type get a buff?

>>32411120
It's like you actually want Fairysplosion.

>>32411151
I think they should make fairy resit steel and weak to bug since bug needs the boost and needed it before fairies nerfed it.

>>32411114
They nerfed u turn. That is what they went for.

>>32406275
It was fucky in ORAS too, but with the change and removal of several other megas that could check Metagross Mega. Plus, we have the tapu bullshit that Metagross likes to fuck with all four of it's power legs because an offensive steel type is now mandatory. And on top of THAT, we have the UB, who metagross is a cool guy and doesn't afraid of anything.

>>32411171
See, Steel isn't OP, Metagross is just the hero we deserve.

>>32406156
Decided to give this thread another chance. Stand by what I said