HGSS are considered one of the best games when they struggle

>>32296911
I always figured them level curve was intentional so that the game would be harder

like the game expects you to beat a level 60 foe with 50 level items through tactics and some blind luck

the rest of your criticisms are gay except for the fact that Team Rocket is dangerously underutilized and that their teams are garbage

>>32296911
>Pokemon distribution is ass, you encounter the same Pokemon throughout the entire game for the most part
Nobody ever uses the Safari? You can get a huge load of new Pokémon by the time you get Surf which is Gym 4 + clearing the Lighthouse.

>>32296943
You're implying these people have played the games and not just regurgitate talking points.

>>32296911
>slow paced plot that's not about the end of the world
>a flaw

>>32296911
Flaws are subjective. what you consider flaws, others either like or don't see as a big deal. I enjoyed hgss to the point that they're my favourite two games in the franchise... No one's wrong for liking or disliking a game so stop moaning.

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>>32296911
The leveling curve is garbage, but for the opposite reasons you described. There are several points in the games where the NPC trainers fail to keep up with you and you end up becoming too powerful. See: the split route after Ecruteak (either you go to Olivine/Cianwood or Mahogany first and leave the other path for later) and the entirety of Kanto.

>>32296962
blind love for the game is your flaw nostalgiabro

>>32296984
and baseless, empty assumptions that don't refute my post are yours.

>>32296911
>>levelling curve is still as garbage as it was before, and the game punishes you for having a team of 6
>>it takes forever to level up mons

Only people who are bad at Pokemon complain about this.

>waaaah I can't beat NPCs unless my Pokemon levels match their Pokemon levels ;_;

>>32297019
Not OP, but that's not it at all. The issue with the leveling curve is the progression between NPCs and bosses. The normal trainers cap off at level 20something, while the boss trainers all progress normally. The game ends up throwing level 20 Rattata and Grimer at you right before the nearly level 40 Houndoom boss.

There's no reason a trainer right before the Elite 4 should have a level 30 Mareep. You're just beating up shitmons that give out no exp before the next boss trainer. There's no incentive for fighting NPCs when just grinding wild mons will get you the same amount.

It's boring.

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>>32297019
>point out a legitimate game design flaw
>HURR DURR YOU'RE JUST BAD AT POKEMON

Johtoddlers everyone.

I honestly think HGSS is one of the the Top 4 best games in the franchise, as well as BW2, ORAS and Emerald.

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>>32296911
/vp/ is too embarrassed to admit they're genwunners so they just group together with the johtoddlers and circlejerk the remakes. That's why HGSS gets it's dick sucked while FRLG gets no attention despite fixing all of gen 1's problems, fear of HURR DURR GEN 1 WAS NEVER GOOD posts.

Which is a shame because actual johtoddlers aren't bad.

>>32297053
That just means the real problem is as described in >>32296981

>>32296962
OP here. I'm not moaning I'm trying to figure out why HGSS are so widely praised when their extremely mediocre games.

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>>32297447
it's because they're old enough to post here. Hoennfags were doing the same thing before ORAS destroyed their hopes and dreams. It's gonna get a whole lot worse when the Unova remakes come around, that gen is already divided to begin with.

I'm replaying SS and I can't believe how fucking boring the game gets after the third gym.

>>32297484
What are you talking about mate? ORAS wasn't exactly how we Hoenn fans expected to be, but it was very good either way.

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oh boy this thread again

>>32296911
They're fine considering the source material, but not the best remakes nor the best games of that generation.

>>32297321
>I'm trying to figure out why HGSS are so widely praised when their extremely mediocre games

Weird, I ask myself that with gen 5 all the time!

>>32299200
I think they set the bar higher at the time.

I ask myself that with Gen III and Sun/Moon.

>>32299262
I ask myself that with Sun/Moon only, I thought gen 3 was an extremely solid gen at that point in time and I still think that holds true

>>32297214
FRLG is just boring because Kanto is boring

>>32297321
because people disagree with you

>>32297552
>ORAS
>very good
oras was fucking terrible

>>32297552
>but it was very good either way.

It was shit m8. I legitimately would rather play Emerald if I want the best Hoenn experience.

>>32297103
But it's not a legitimate game design flaw. It was designed that way to be more challenging. But of course autistic shitters like you who feel the need to grind when it isn't necessary complain about it instead of gitting gud.

I agree with you OP, I couldn't even finish this game.

>>32296925
Denial

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>>32296911
Storm Silver addresses many of these issues, like:

> gym leaders actually have decent teams

>Team Rocket does more bad shit

>more pokemon to encounter

>expanded postgame via accessible legendaries

Let's face it, everyone will say that the levelling curve is shit or that the Pokemon distribution is bad but it's easily one of the best Pokemon Games.

-hardcore artificial difficulty brought on by forcing you to grind and actually not be bad
-the only pokemon game with two regions brought to you again on a new system - no need to fix what isn't broken
-has super cool functions like the radio and the goldenrod city bug catching contest
-brings you the Platinum battle frontier just to add icing on the cake
-the pokewalker isn't that bad

>>32299724
>the only pokemon game with two regions brought to you again on a new system
Two regions which combined were smaller than the previous game

>brings you the Platinum battle frontier just to add icing on the cake
That wasn't icing on the cake at the time, that was Gamefreak forcing you to replay the frontier or cheat just to get the three useful new tutor moves it introduced. It's only better than ORAS in that regard because the frontier was more fun than the maison.

The gimmicky shit was fun though, and a lot of the little things like the UI and the haircut guys also increasing the beauty stat were nice touches.

Sucks
>last game before animated sprites and they were way overdue
>wild pokemon selection sucks
>level curve sucks
>battles every second in the grass

These are some of the most dated games in the series. Especially compared to infinite use TMs and the new experience system in Gen5. These feel like GBA games still.

>>32296911
>>the plot is as bare bones as it gets
This was great though. Pokemon stories are always cringy as fuck and terribly written, the more they stay out of the way of my fun little coming of age adventure the better.

I didn't care for much of the other shortcomings because I could still find what I wanted to use and grind them to a point, even if it could get pretty annoying at times, I still got by just fine and enjoyed my playthrough, the atmosphere more than made up for it.

>>32299870
>These feel like GBA games still.
How is this an argument against any game? I'd rather a game felt like a GBA game than some DS shit like ORAS.

>>32296911
> muh gen 2 level curve

this is a "problem" only /vp/ has because you guys have an irrational hate for gen 2.
probably because over half the people here started with gen 3.

>>32296911
get gud

>>32296911
>leveling curve
A shitty meme that needs to die already. You're only spouting this because people are too retarded to go to a wiki and compare trainer levels.

>it takes forever to level up mons
Not a complaint.

>Plot
Subjective.

>Pokemon distribution
If you were complaining about lack of new pokemon in johto, fine, but you choose to complain about something thats completely false.

>trainers
Not a complaint. pulled this out of your ass

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>>32299409
>only game in the series with this issue
>posts like >>32297053 and >>32296981 elaborate on it
>IT'S NOT A LEGIT FLAW LOL GIT GUD SCRUB

Once again, Johtoddlers can't think of any arguments.

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>>32300067
>pulled this out of your ass
Have you even played HGSS? Most of it is either pic related or worse

>>32296911

>1

But they did fix the level curve. Not to the amount that it should have been, but they did fix it, by making the Kanto battles overall a higher level, as well as giving you more areas to grind in

>2.

see point one. You got route 47+48 to grind in, trainer rematches, gym leader rematches, pokewalker, etc.

>3

well, thats just how the games were , they did "improve" on it by giving Lugio and Ho-oh story relevance and by making Neo Rocket actually have faces. But since its a remake, its not like they could have done much without completely changing the story.


>4

thats why they made route 47+48 , a safari zone and the Pokewalker. Combine all of that, and the distribution is fine. tho Houndour is still relegated to Post Lance, which is still stupid

>5

but this time, the boss trainers have coverage and are able to actually use the higher attacking stat. Plus Chuck went from Mind Reader+DynamicPunch to Hyponsis+Focus Punch, which is a much better strategy. I know Archer has physical Houndoom, but he really is the only one thats like that.

Even though I know this is a lost cause, it actually triggers me to see people constantly complain about the "level curve" and it not being fixed.

First of all the game actually has higher trainer levels, specifically in kanto were they were boosted by 10-15 levels.

Second, by the time you reach the elite four, lance's highest pokemon is 50, your pokemon are around 38-45 assuming you beat every trainer in the game up to that point. The elite four itself helps you catch up to lance. If you complain about this, then you have the mentality of a 3 year old who couldn't beat Gary in Red and Blue.

By the time you beat blue your pokemon are now in the 50's range, which is a good stopping point for the end of any pokemon game. Red is the super megaboss that you have to grind for in order to stand a chance, and most pokemon games have something like this at the end.

Finally, Kanto isn't exactly post-game but rather considered part of the main game itself, even though it acts like a post-game, which provides a very lengthy adventure that most pokemon games fail to match with their main game. In other words, most players would feel inclined to stop playing after beating the elite four, but HGSS gives you the desire to finish exploring whats left, not to mention its a revisit of a region you played in on the past.

I'm not saying the game isn't without flaws, but its considered the best alongside BW2 because of how lenghty the adventure feels and just all the extra content it has.

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>>32300082
Those levels are perfectly fine for that point in the game. Fuck off with your shitty excuse of an argument.

The real problem was Kanto levels and that was addressed.

Oh I see now. People who complain about the level curve are underage that started with XY and abused the EXP share and amie.

>>32300113
>le underage meme

Ebin

>>32300125
>shitposts
>cries when someone shitposts back

Absolutely top tier post

>>32297552
Bullshit.

I get that HG/SS didn't change enough and thats why people are against it, but at least it just straight up did just that; it didn't bother changing anything.

ORAS was so fucking half assed. They'd remove dungeons, eliminate backtracking, change entire cities, but then also refuse to change puzzles that require stupid HM's that ruin your party, not bother to change the worst regional dex (But then give you access to heaps of new Pokemon BEFORE the last gym.. like if it was post game, sure, but if you're gonna give access to them then why not earlier?), giving away a Lati early on, etc.

HG/SS in my opinion is a decent game because it's simply a 1:1 remake with updated mechanics. ORAS is shit because it tries to be the same but changes too much stuff that didn't need to be changed yet at the same time refuses to change the stuff that needs to be updated because "We want it to be be the same".

Fucking so stupid.

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>>32296943
>using the safari

i'm not about to have this happen.

>>32300168
cool blog bro

>>32299870
>These feel like GBA games still.
What did he mean by this?

Maybe I'm just a dumb gentuer, but I actually like the minimalistic plot

What level curve apologists don't understand is that it's annoying to deal with on subsequent playthroughs. It's got nothing to do with le gitting gud.

>>32296911
There are my personal fave pokemon games. But i cant deny op's points. Plus, why are SO many johto mons ONLY available in kanto? And sneasel, houndour, and larvitar are essentialy postgame only. You couldn't even get a dark type. Gym leaders used mostly kanto pokemon, i think out of all 8 gym, we only battle 3 or 4 johto pokemon, steelix, miltank, kingdra, and im probs missing one. This and what op said is definitely frustrating.

>>32300265
Piloswine.

>>32300104
Do you honestly think that Tackle on a level 30 Koffing is good game design? And no, level 30 enemies that late in the game are not fine. The reason they're so low is that Johto has the least trainers of any region, which gives it that barren empty feeling that people love so much.

>>32300240
This I can agree with, when the plot gets in the way of enjoying the game then something went wrong, I had this problem with Sun/Moon.

>>32300352
First of all, you're complaining about a regular rocket battle that got changed to be a miniboss. He kept the 6 koffings for a reason.

Second of all, yes for a trainer that has 6 pokemon those levels are fucking fine at that point in the game. The gym leader you fight before that mas mons in the higher 30's.

Your levels will end up around 10 below lances highest mon when you start the fucking elite four. The only thing that people dont like about this its that they are used to leve 50 mons by that point.

Its fucking fine, the level curve is balanced around having two regions to explore.

HGSS also gave: more places to grind pre-E4 for shitty autistic players that need to overlevel for lance, higher levels on trainers in lanto, and gym leader rematches every day of the week so you can boost your grind for red/e4 rematch more easily. You can even call all gym leaders during the week so you can fight them all on one day.

>>32299387
>>32299398
>>32300164
You are either samefagging, or y´all are stupid, as Guzma would say. ORAS was very good, as I said. They expanded a lot more areas than what was decreased in size; you just prefer to omit/ignore that, because your edgelord hatefest would be ruined then.

I am not hating on HGSS however. They are a very good remake as well.

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>>32296911
>levelling curve is still as garbage as it was before, and the game punishes you for having a team of 6
I agree the level curve is still as bad as before., but going Chuck -> Pryce -> Jasmine makes it a little better. Not an excuse, just a tip.

>it takes forever to level up mons
It's not that much worse than other games. Still sucks, though.

>the plot is as bare bones as it gets, I'm not asking for SM or BW but at least DP
Neo-Team Rocket is realistic, and their whole thing is being gangsters. You can't honestly tell me you prefer the "literally kill everyone and/or create a new world" plot that the psychotic villains of the later games are all about, can you?

>Pokemon distribution is ass, you encounter the same Pokemon throughout the entire game for the most part
They could have done a little better, I'll give you that, but certain Pokemon are native to certain regions.

>some boss trainers have gargabe teams, you'll be lucky if they have one stab move.
Agreed.

>all these flaws are looked over because "muh postgane"
Agreed.