ITT: How do we fix them?

>>31722916
Bug is doing just fine. Scizor, pheromosa, buzzwole, golisopod, scolipede, volcarona, and m-pinsir are all great

they tried fixing grass in alola by making so many grass types, but fuck it they all suck
ice got neglected
steel got neglected
dark got neglected, though they fixed dark already

>>31722916
>ice resists grass
No

>>31723078
Making pokemon of a certain type is not a fix you retard

>>31722950
I think the biggest problem with Bug is that it shares a lot of weaknesses with Grass, but doesn't have as many offensive strengths as Grass does. Or at least the things that Grass beats show up more often than types Bug beats.

>>31723078
Dark didn't get neglected, they made all Dark-Types immune to Prankster, remember?

>>31722916
RIP alola marowak

>>31723078
Steel's fine tho

>>31723172
In fact steel is too good

>>31723194
Water and fairy are too good. Steel is fine.

>>31723204
kek

>nerf grass
Eat literal shit.

>>31723204
>Water now weak to Poison
>Steel now weak to Psychic
>Fairy now weak to Bug

>>31723225
But what about the buffs? It gets auto Leftovers in weather and immunity to Fairy

>>31723204
>most common type in ou
>useful priority
>still has the most resistances
>on top of an immunity
>with addition of fairy its stab is now actually useful

All water needs is a scald nerf.

>>31723253
Weather is dead. Fairy immunity is hit and miss usefullness-wise.

Ice Resists Water

>>31722916
Straight up make ice immune to water imo.

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>>31723289
>Weather is dead.
U wot m8

>>31722916
Here's what I'd do OP:
>Grass gets resistances to rock and fairy. Grass-exclusive abilities get slight buffs (i.e. leaf guard also boosts SpD in the sun). Alternatively, grass is the only type that gets boosted both in rain and sun, with a 50% SpD and SpA increase respectively.

>Ice gains resistances to ground, flying and water, giving the plethora of defensive ice types a purpose. Ice types have their defense boosted by 50% in hail, and the distribution of ice coverage (specially among water types) is reduced: instead of sistematically getting ice beam and blizzard, most water types that aren't based on cold water creatures only get aurora beam or icy wind at best

>Rock gains resistances to electric and ice. Rock types now remove stealth rock upon switching into them, and the distribution of stealth rock and the stronger rock moves, like stone edge, gets more limited to actual rock types.

>Bug gets a resistance to fairy and that's it. It has good moves like u-turn, lunge, leech life, and so on, and the distribution of the most annoying ones (sticky web) is pretty good already.

I think with those changes the types as a whole could be considered fixed. The shitmons on each of these types would mostly continue on being shitmons, however, as having a decent type doesn't mean much without stats and movepools to back it up.

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>>31722916
>He wants to give one of the best offensive typings multiple buffs with absolutely no nerfs

You can't balance for shit and its obvious you're an Icefag.

>>31723204
Water is fine. It's decent offensive-wise and defensive-wise. But why don't you tell us what's so broken about Water that you think it needs a nerf? I'll wait.

>>31723687
scald
ice beam

>>31723687
It's too good defensively. A Poison weakness would fix that.

>>31723735
Water is no better than Psychic defensively.

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>>31723772
>he has never had to deal with bulky Water types
>he doesn't realize Psychic has an extra weakness on Water and got cucked by Fairy doing its job better

>>31723772
Water's Grass weakness is nullified by all Water types getting Ice Beam

>>31722916
Why are people so god damn insistent on making the literal Glass Cannon type have a fuckton of resistances?

Ice is fragile as fuck, it only deserves to resist water

>>31723902
>Why are people so god damn insistent on making the literal Glass Cannon type have a fuckton of resistances?
>Glass Cannon

Because GF keeps insisting on making the type slow and bulky

>>31723902
This. Ice is OP offensively. All it needs to do is resist itself and water, which is an extremely sensible nerf - if you can call it that - to water.

>>31723900
Yes, and it gets hit by a lot of shit for neutral damage.

Ground and Rock which Water is super effective against hit Water for neutral Damage.

Poison, Flying, Bug, Psychic, Ghost, Dark, Fairy, Dragon, Normal, and whatever else hits Water for neutral damage.

>>31723879
>>he has never had to deal with bulky Water types
>>he doesn't realize Psychic has an extra weakness on Water and got cucked by Fairy doing its job better

>Bulky Water Pokemon performing their niche well means they are overpowered and need to be nerfed.

Okay, I forgot Psychic is also weak to Bug.

>>31723929
Except Water doesn't need a nerf because it's not a broken type.

>>31723927
Well that's GF being GF anon

>>31722950
Buff Psychic instead. That'll make bugs more useful.

>>31724079
By making them SE against Steel?

>>31722916
Grass is fine the way it is, no changes, aside from maybe a few more grass moves and more Grass types with bulky, tanky stats on both sides, not just special defense, like it's a good mixed wall. Add in better distribution for coverage moves, like a few more grass types with Earth Power, Heat Wave, or Superpower and they're good to go.

Ice needs to resist something other than itself. I recommend Dragon and Ground. Also, make a few more fast ice types, too many slow ones with crappy bulk. We need more stuff like Weavile, Kyurem, and Jynx, less stuff like Avalugg and Mamoswine, and Abomasnow. And for Christ's sake, let hail increase their Defense if we're going to be stuck with shitty slow ones

Rock is also fine, just make more fast rock types. Lycanroc and Aerodactyl is a good start, really. also, a couple special attacking rocks with actual rock moves would be nice. Again, it's not that the type is bad, GF just likes to make them all shit.

Bug has a similar problem to rock. The type is fine, it's that people get upset when they get attached to an early game bug that's supposed to be kinda bad as their bro and it turns out to be shitty. But then look at Beedrill, it's mega is a monster. Best fix for this is to give some of the crappier bugs a 4th stage Evolution only available in post game (Just say they evolve with new item Bug Stone or, in Beedrill's case, a mega stone) and thrtow is some really good move tutors for them, like decent coverage and support moves, only available in move tutors. Now your early game bug bros will still be usable in competitive battles without being total shit. Having an abundance of postgame-only high BST bugs with actual good moves and coverage will make people realize the type isn't bad, GF just loves making bad bugs. remember, there are tons of good bugs too, like Scizor, Volcarona, Heracross, Pheramosa, Genesect, M-Beedrill, Scolipede, Araquanid, and M-Pinsir.

>>31724089
>>31724079
>bending spoons

I can dig it Dear God, Gardevoir and Lele though

>>31724089
No, by making Psychic moves have "tricky" effects. Such as having Flash be a Psychic move and having it reduce Accuracy and Evasion of the opponent by two ranks when used by a Psychic type. Or something of this line.

>>31722916
Any fix has to begin by reverting the chart to gen 5 imo.

Buff those based on fairy.

>>31724109
Fairy is now weak to Ghost.

Stop making slow, "bulky" ice, and rock types

Bugs just need less shitmons and more greatmons (although this technically applies to all 4 types in general)

Grass I have no idea

>>31725497
grass needs more tangrowth and ferrothorn I guess.

>>31723417
Bug's problem is that it is resisted by 7/18 types.

That means when facing duel types there is a 41% chance the enemy resists bug and a 35% chance that they doubly resist you.

it needs the resistance from fairy, ghost, poison and fighting removed.

>>31725694
Why Fighting over Fire?

>>31725694
oh yeah that reminds me
>bug resists fighting
>but fighting resists bug
why

>>31725720
its like ghost is just doesn't really have any business being there, Fire makes sense since a bug is gonna have a hard time against flames unless its water based.

>>31725737
Both resistances should be removed to be perfectly honest.

>>31724117
I always thought Flash should be an Electric type move.

>>31726670
That anon's probably a motherfag.

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>>31723772
>Water is no better than Psychic defensively.
>2 weaknesses and 4 resistances vs. 3 weaknesses and 2 resistances

>>31722916
Ice should just resist Water and/or Ground. Also not giving every water type in existance ice beam would make them more deserving of a spot on your team.

Rock needs better moves in general. Maybe make them neutral to steel, fuck this overpowered bullshit type.

Grass should be neutral against flying both offensively and defensively. Maybe provide passive recovery in sun and rain.

Bug is not a great type, but it would be miles better if GF stopped making so many of them shitmons on purpose. It has some of the best moves in the game, just making more good bug types should be fine. Being neutral against fairy would also help. Why Bug out of all types was nerfed, I will never understand.

>>31722916
One thing I always thought Ice should have, but also weakens Water: Water types are more likely to be frozen by Ice type attacks that cause freezing.

>>31722950

Those are good in spite of being bug type, not because. Scizor is the only bug there that could be argued to benefit from its bug typing, and that's because it synergizes well with steel, not because scizor loves the bug type coverage.

Pheromosa and buzzwole are just minmaxed monsters, golisopod sucks and you should be ashamed of including it, scolipede is only good because speed boost/baton pass, it would be much better as a pure poison to lose weaknesses, volcarona is good because it has great stats and quiver dance, m-pinsir would be better as pure flying to lose weaknesses

>>31725694

This. Bug isn't great defensively, but that makes sense at least. Offensively I'd honestly say it's the worst type in the game, yes worse than poison/steel/normal, at least those can use really strong STAB attacks without most of the metagame being able to safely switch in. I run monobug and I even have a hard type justifying bug type attacks.

ghost, fighting, and fairy could easily have their bug resistances taken away while making sense, and making bug neutral to even one of those would probably help immensely, but I'd honestly like to see all three neutral to bug. The fire/flying/steel resists make sense, and they could even add rock to that list

>>31727281
Bug should be one of the best type offensively lorewise imo. When you think of a swarm of bugs, you think of a massive destructive force, not some weak shit that for some reason is only strong against plants, people with psychic powers, and people that use dirty tactics.

>ice should resist water
and them scald will be se morons

>>31725737
Both are hero types

>>31727637
But Fighting and Bug don't resist themselves...

There is no reason fairy resists bug. Not even a huge bugfag but it needs a buff and fairy needs a nerf and third weakness.

>>31727727
Well Gamefreak has vapor for brains

>>31727744
Fairy should be like Ice, as a glass cannon sort of type. Make it weak to fire (forest fires repel fairies) and make Bug and Grass be immune or at least resist it, because fairies don't want to harm nature.

>>31727987
>because fairies don't want to harm nature
>The fair folk caring about anything

>>31727987
Fairy being weak to fire nullify they purpose as dragon counters

>>31728007
I was thinking more like Tinker Bell type fairies. They're tied to nature, aren't they?

>>31728021
Fairy types is a mix of different interpretations of fairies not only the "disney" one

>>31728020
They're still immune to Dragon STAB, aren't they? Dragons do tend to have fire coverage, but every type gets coverage against it's counters (Looking at you, the fuckload of Water types with Ice Beam/Punch)

>>31728048
Dryads

>>31728050
Yes but they have to run a coverage move both against steel and fairy, fairy being weak against fire will give dragons better flexibility with was likely the reason of dragon overpower

>>31728116
Then modify Dragon too. Perhaps make it weak to Steel: the knight in shining armor always slays the dragon and saves the princess.

>>31728177
>Make it weak to Steel
This is what gamefreak should have done not made fairy

>>31725497
>Bugs just need less shitmons and more greatmons

Bug doesn't excel Offensive-wise or defensive-wise. At least make it do neutral to Fairies or something.

>>31722916
To this day I don't understand why fairy resists bug.

>>31728190
Dark and Steel didn't need to be made either to be honest.

>>31729126
Yes thats true, just made ghost and bug resist psychic and have good attacks

>>31729133
Pretty much but I'd actually just make Bug resist Psychic and have Psychic's hit Ghosts for neutral damage. If they'd had just made stronger bug Pokemon the game would've balanced itself out eventually.

>>31729148
Scyther/Scizor and Pinsir are strong they just don't have good stab attacks before gen4

>>31728050
Fire doenst need a buff. Like fuck are you retarded? Make fairy weak to bug instead

>>31729230
>Make fairy weak to bug instead
Never

>>31722916
>Make Rock resist Electric, Bug and itself
>Dragon no longer resists Grass
>Ice resists Flying, give pure ice types an ice version of stealth rocks, ice types get a boost to accuracy (all moves not just Blizzard) during Hail
>Fairy and Fighting no longer resist Bug; Bug is super effective to Ground (burrow)

>>31729357
>Black Ice will never be a thing
GF really needs to help Ice types

>>31725694
I would agree if bug had moves on the same level as rock, were everything is either a physical attack of low accuracy, a special attack of meh power and bad distribution, or stealth rock.

Bug has u-turn, sticky web, leech life (now), lunge (not enough distribution yet), bug buzz for subs, quiver dance, tail glow (not enough distribution).

In other words bug is an utility type like grass, and there's nothing wrong with being resisted by 7 types. You want poison, fairy, ghost and fighting resists gone. What the hell do you think will happen to u-turn spam then? you'll be benefitting the best u-turn users, which not necessarily means bug types. Giving them a resist to fairy, one of the most used types, benefits bugs directly and not everything else, which is the point.

Is like when people suggest fixing ice by making it SE on water. You're helping water types with ice coverage more than ice types themselves.

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>>31722916
> Defensive Rock
Weak to: Fight, Water, Grass, Steel
Resists: Electric, Fire, Flying, Normal, Poison

> Defensive Ice
Weak to: Fighting, Fire, Rock, Steel
Resists: Water, Ice, Dragon, Flying, Ground

> Offensive Grass
Strong against: Ground, Rock, Water
Weak against: Bug, Fire, Flying, Steel


Also, I remove the fighting weakness to Fighting and make it weak to Electric and fairies are weak to Fire.

Ice
>Resists dragon, water and flying

Grass
>no longer weak to flying or ice

Rock
>resist rock, ice, electric
>no longer weak to fighting and ground

Bug
>fire, ghost and fairy no longer resist it

Id add more weight concepts. Like force switch moves like Roar and whirlwind don't affect rock types over a certain weight, maybe even all pokemon.

Id make bug type pokemon power each other up. Like plus-minus in double battles. It buffs bug moves. Increasing bug type moves used by them by 30%

All rock type would have decreased rate of taking critical hits

when ice type use ice moves there's an increased chance of flinching

Id give grass type immunity to "light" based moves. Which would be things like Moonblast, dazzling gleam, signal beam, aurora beam and so on.

Grass being weak to ice is so fucking dumb. Grass in real life resists the damage of ice better than most life forms, they survive freezing temperatures all the time. You'd probably have to tweak a fuck load of pokemon because of these changes, but w.e

>>31732065
>Grass being weak to ice is so fucking dumb. Grass in real life resists the damage of ice better than most life forms, they survive freezing temperatures all the time.

Except grass type isn't actually grass, it's any plant or fungus. It's only called grass because the same sounds better.

Anyway, some plants may be able to survive relatively brief periods of cold and ice but very few can survive large amounts of it. Hence why there are almost no plants in Antarctica but there are plenty of animals.

>>31727567
by that logic fire would be the strongest

Rock resists itself
Ice resists Fairy
Bug is not resisted by Fairy

>>31722916
Ice can't resist water, just be grateful water isn't super effective on ice.

Specific heat is a bitch.

>>31723245
Fairy was made to nerf u turn, dragons and dark spam.

>>31731581
>Giving shit ass ice types that many resistances
>Making one of the resistances water type.
Go hold an ice cube under running water and watch what happens to it. Then come back and you can explain why ice resisting water was a retarded thing to come up with.

>>31725457
Just make it weak to bug

>>31732589
make fairy weak to everything

>>31732430
There are no Plants in the arctic because there is fuck all soil quality or in fact NO soil.

The fact that Northern Russia,Scandinavia and Canada are full of HUGe macro-organism style tree systems shows Cold doesn't effect them that much.

How to fix Grass

>Resists rock
>Earth power becomes a staple

how do we fix electric and fire?

>>31723117
Yes

>>31731581
>Resists: Water, Ice, Dragon, Flying, Ground

Giving Ice and Rock, two of the best offensive types, this many resistances with absolutely no nerfs.

>>31729126
To be fair, Dark and Steel were made at a time when GF didn't know there would be a competitive scene and thus didnt worry about fucking over specific types

>>31732585
Or put a bottle of water in the freezer and see what happens...

Oh wait, water resists ice.

Ice resisting water would be a nice addition to ice types and would be a small nerf to water types. If Ice resists water and fairy and you have OK defenses.


I add a item that increases Ice or Rock types def. and sdef. by 1. An eviolite for Ice and Rock. Call it Mystic Crystal or something, both ice and rock have affiliations with crystalline structures. That would be broken as hell, but we all know how ice and rock suck defensively so they deserve it.