now that the dust has settled, is it actually good or just a

>670 BST
>Both STABs hit more than half the dex for at least normal effectiveness
>Basically a Mega with an item slot

Was there ever any doubt

>>31592246
well /vp/ and smogon called how it's going to be shit

>>31592246
>>670 BST
640

>>Basically a Mega with an item slot
Lacks an ability and requires set up.

It's good, but as /vp/ and smogon called it, Protean is still better.

>>31592198
it's good. it forces a lot of switches even more so than any other fast sweeper and gets free damage thereby

>>31592198
It doesn't really matter whether it's better than Protean or not.

The fact is, Greninja can have two entirely different forms, and it's impossible to determine which it is until it uses a move. The versatility it has makes it virtually impossible to consistently counter it.

>>31592364
No one is discussing Greninja. Greninja was always a good mon. We're talking about if Assninja is better than Proteaninja.

>>31592308
I guess that's true. If anything it made Proteanfrog better because Protreanfrog counters Ashfrog's counters.

>>31592399
Forgot the last part: So people who expect Ashfrog get obliterated by Proteanfrog.

>>31592399
>>31592415
can y'al explain that to me? I thought they were pretty similar, fast special sweepers with similar moves, or not?

>>31592438
Gunk shot and Hidden power fire.


>>31592198
Honestly? it's good as fuck. A+, almost S tier. the sheer power and how people are so scared of letting it transform (rightfuly so. after transforming it's basicaly the best late game cleaner in the game). Ash-Greninja is a nightmare to HO and balance too. Add up rain and it's even more retarded.

next games tutors would probably allow it to have Gunk shot too for Fini. and even without Protean it's does huge amount of damage pre transform.

4 Atk Life Orb Greninja Gunk Shot vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Tapu Fini: 161-192 (46.9 - 55.9%) -- 80.1% chance to 2HKO
4 Atk Greninja-Ash Gunk Shot vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Tapu Fini: 180-212 (52.4 - 61.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
4 Atk Life Orb Greninja-Ash Gunk Shot vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Tapu Fini: 234-276 (68.2 - 80.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

4 Atk Life Orb Protean Greninja Gunk Shot vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Tapu Fini: 242-289 (70.5 - 84.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

File: 1472835968000.jpg (60KB, 499x499px) Image search: [Google]

60KB, 499x499px

>>31592399
>>31592415
>tfw the mindgames you can do in making people question if you have proteanfrog or Ashfrog
>tfw if they mispredict which one it is they get wrecked by the frog
The frog fucks good

>>31592198
It's just as good as/maybe slightly better Protean Greninja in gen 6

But it has indirectly buffed Protean Greninja unpredictability

>>31592198
yes but Protean Greninja is now better because of how it is a guessing game if you are fighting a Battle Bond or Protean Greninja. Also, Protean fucks Battle Bond's checks