Why did they take Levitate away from Gengar?

>>30995500
Why did they give Pelipper Drizzle? Your guess is as good as mine.

>>30995500
So he could become the new face of your favorite, "My life sucks, but at least I'm not THAT guy" meme.

>Photography trial
>Gengar is clearly levitating
>In the same gen they take his levitation ability away

lol

Btw even the game knows he's trash because he's always ran with focus sash now which is the cheapest item ever created.

>>30995511
To prove a point that anything can be overpowered at the drop of a hat

Sugimori is being punished for designing Goodra.

I swear they did it just to fuck players over in the battle tree by disabling a useful attack

D R A I N T H E S W A M P
E N D T H E S T R E A K

He has legs

>lose an Earthquake, Earth Power, and Spikes immunity
>gain the ability to take advantage of Terrains, like Psychic Terrain which would protect it from Sucker Punch, while also gaining the ability to absorb Toxic Spikes, which Toxapex can use

A trade off?

>>30995628
>>gain the ability to take advantage of Terrains, like Psychic Terrain which would protect it from Sucker Punch, while also gaining the ability to absorb Toxic Spikes, which Toxapex can use

Reach.....

A loss desu. It's unreasonable considering alot of new poke are getting Mold Breaker equivalents anyway.

Sugamori is basically retired and Morimoto thought it would be a nice way to get back at him since Sugamori always screamed at the designers for every game Gengar is in to make sure he's top tier.

>>30995579
Saya Tsurata designed Goodra according to this:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/User:Altruis/List_of_Pok%C3%A9mon_by_their_designers
Sugimori had Art Block in Gen 6 so he only designed the box legendaries and even then he needed Ohmura's help with them.

>>30995500
So he can benefit from terrains now.
He learns Thunderbolt and commonly uses it. Being boosted in Electric Terrain.
He can use Psychic and now it doesn't need to worry about Sucker Punch in Psychic Terrain.
Has more longevity if used with Tapu Bulu, thanks to both Black Sludge and Grassy Terrain.
Also it can absorb Toxic Spikes now.

Even if it was inmune to Earthquake, Earth Power and the like almost everything that carried those was able to one-shot him regardless, you're trading a switch in for more play options.

>>30995754

Sugamori did Goodra itself, not the prevos.

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They warned us, but we didn't listen

>>30995709
Nihilego also has Toxic Spikes, so between it and Toxapex I think it's pretty reasonable to assume that Toxic Spikes will be more common.

Gengar can now absorb them if needed.

>>30995760
I imagine that since Gengar doesn't have much bulk, it could say, take advantage of both Grassy Terrain and Black Sludge in tandem with Substitute. I don't think Cursed Body will work with Substitute unfortunately, but I'm sure a SubDIsable set could still find use.

I do still feel like it's a trade off. What are some Pokemon (with Ground type moves) that Gengar would be able to switch into before? If it was say, Excadrill, to block its Rapid Spin, doesn't it usually carry Iron Head as well? Gengar's not living through that. Unless Excadrill is usually Choiced or something. Gengar also still has two other immunities to take advantage of, and doesn't it have some 4x resists? To Poison?

>>30995923
>Gengar can now absorb them if needed.
This is very, very insignificant compared to being immune to ground weakness.

Gengar is everyones bro, but they raped him this Gen

He's still OP. Please just remove him from the game.

>>30995961
>very, very insignificant

I don't know, I'm hearing that Toxapex's usage is through the roof, or at least, is pretty high up there. Nihilego's got just enough to help it stand out as well (both with offense and support), and either one or both of them will be packing Toxic Spikes.

That said, I'm curious. How common were Choiced Ground type attacks before? That's my only way of thinking it could easily switch in. Because again, say you switch into something that tried to use Earthquake. Wouldn't it usually have another strong move to take it out?

>Point out that Gengar can now absorb spikes and take advantage of the two best terrains in 7th Gen
>Retards claim it's "insigificant"
>Literally Tapus and Toxapex in every single online battle
>Not a tradeoff

How can one thread be so full of completely deluded autists?

>>30996051
>Toxapex's usage is through the roof, or at least, is pretty high up there. Nihilego's got just enough to help it stand out
Because Gengar takes 'very effective' hits from ground moves being poison type.

>>30995961
>Gengar is everyones bro
#notmybro

bye bitch!

>>30996120
What? My point was that those two Pokemon are likely running around setting Toxic Spikes everywhere, so Gengar can now absorb them and be a team player for your side by preventing your team from getting poisoned.

What does it have over those other two? More of an offensive presence than Toxapex, and more immunities to use than Nihilego. I think those two are very viable, and I would think that Gengar still has enough viability too.

>>30996051
the idea was to be faster than whatever Quaker you were switching into, then oneshot it or force a switch. there wasn't a lot that could stay in on Gengar after it switched into their quake.

I agree the intent was to boost its usability in a terrain-based meta, but I'd have preferred that it be an additional possible ability instead of replacing levitate. That and possibly giving it something other than Cursed Body (imagine if it got Merciless or Infiltrator instead) would have been great.

>>30995877
Oh shit

>buffed in literally EVERY SINGLE FUCKING GENERATION from 1-6
>tier whores with zero taste in Pokemon aesthetics clamor that Gengar is their "bro" in every fucking "favorite Pokemon"/Ghost type thread, despite there being countless better designed, more interesting Ghosts
>receives a nerf for the first time in its existence in Gen 7, a nerf that comes with some positive tradeoffs
>incessant pissbitching from the Gengarfags
Eat it. Eat it and fucking choke on it. This one's for Chandelure, you cunts.

>>30996178
>so Gengar can now absorb them and be a team player for your side by preventing your team from getting poisoned.
We dont need Gengar to absorb them are be a team player. Listen to yourself. Every other poison does that already.

>>30996185
>Merciless or Infiltrator on a gengar
It's like you retards want the base form to be more broken than the mega

>>30996178
its a fine pokemon but without levitate there are probably better options

I dont see what gengar can do against nihilego or toxapex anyways if it jumped in after spikes were set

>>30996185
Alright, I understand now.

Also, I agree that it should've been an additional ability. Have it keep Levitate as normal, and then give it something nice as a hidden ability. Infiltrator sounds pretty nice. That way, you can use Gengar how it was used before, or you can use it in a different way (the current way now) to have it be grounded and take advantage of Terrain and absorb Toxic Spikes. More options, everybody wins. Even if it was something as simple as Pressure, but something to make it grounded.

>>30996213
Gengar, Nihilego, and Toxapex are just the only Poison type OUs that I know of. Either way I imagine you wouldn't want type redundancies.

>>30996231
says the guy who wants him to be able to fuck over anything packing Earthquake.

>>30996254
>Gengar, Nihilego, and Toxapex are just the only Poison type OUs that I know of.
You can send in any poison type to absorb toxic spikes. The option is more highly common.

>>30996250
I think Gengar would at least force a switch with Toxapex since I don't think there's much it can do to it either due to its passivity. Gengar on the other hand can use Taunt or do whatever.

I don't think Gengar or Nihilego could do too much to each other, although it's probably more of a disadvantage on Gengar's end thanks to Nihilego's high SpD.

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>>30996279
>wants him to be able to fuck over anything packing Earthquake.
>which is everything

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>>30995877
I don't ge...those sneaky bastards.

>>30996254
>Gengar, Nihilego, and Toxapex are just the only Poison type OUs that I know of
Venusaur

Alolan Muk has a strong niche but will probably not be OU by usage. Same with Scolipede, Tenacruel, Amoonguss, Nidoqueen/king, and Mega Beedrill (when released.)

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>>30996207
Yes, put those tasteless bitches in their place.

>>30996373
>Mega Beedrill is grounded

Well

>>30996434
Gengar was essentially a flying-poison type being a ghost afterall.

It gave his precedent as a strong poison type to introduce or lead the type.

Why suddenly nerf it now? Was Gengar broken in VGC or something? Who's next?

>>30996373
>Tentacruel
care to explain? he seems like uu toxapex at this point. I don't see what he does that toxapex doesn't

>>30996313
my point is that so many things learn earthquake, and pretty much the only physical attacker that can learn it but doesn't use it is Marowak and that's simply because Bonemerang is better.

Yeah, it's possible to sniff a Gengar switch-in and clobber him with something, but by and large if Gengar switched in and you were using Earthquake, you just gave the momentum of the match to your opponent.

I don't agree with it but I absolutely see why they did it.

>>30995500
Because it doesn't float

>>30996513
Barrier
Clear Body
Raindish
liquid ooze aint bad either with black sludge

>>30996596
i thought liquid ooze was the preferred ability for him since clear body is kinda pointless with him having haze and all

like he could run a gimmicky set with barrier and acid spray or things like that, but those sets all seem inferior to a standard set similar to toxapex's

>>30996185
I wholeheartedly agree with everything you said, but why Merciless and Infiltrator? Merciless is just as situational as Cursed Body, and requires you to run Sludge Bomb over Wave. And not a lot of things get to outspeed Gengar and set up a sub, so infiltrator seems situational as well.

Intimidate would have been better

>>30996505
Gengar was hardly used in VGC. Its stupid that it got nerfed instead of the genies

>>30995500
They thought they were buffing him and created a meta of terrain. After all, grassy terrain gives him half hp from EQ.

We all know how good they are at decisions.

>>30996978
The shitty thing is, given how we get a powercreep every gen, half these terrains will go away. Misty for sure. Psychic will remain since Top Lel is a bitch with scarf, and Electric will remain since Koko is a beast.

>>30995500
People are overestimating the impact of this. Gengar is still really good. He was always frail, adding a weakness doesn't do much. The bigger problem is that he's not really fast enough because of all the retardedly fast shit running around. But he's far from bad.

Also cursed body hax is pretty funny when it works.

>>30996592
THIS.
Levitate would make more sense for Goldeen than Gengar, and I mean very little sense but at least you SEE it.

>>30997079
Either way, it's going to be UU. OU is too much of a clusterfuck, and from the looks of it, shit like Tyranitar are dropping too.

Gen 7 UU is going to be a replica of Gen 4 OU. Cant wait

>>30997146
>OU is too much of a clusterfuck

Explain.

>>30995548

Pelliper aint overpowered, it's just finally viable after 13 years.

>>30997173
Filled with Tapus, UBs, Megas (albiet a handful), and mons like Garchomp and Latios. It's basically Ubers-lite.

The few regular mons remaining are likely to drop once Bank comes out and we have access to the Genies

>>30996919
Merciless means crits while the opponent is poisoned, so you could in theory use Toxic and get 100BP always-crit Hexes. Obviously this'd be kind of (really) broken but the point is you can definitely do stuff with that. You don't "need" to run Sludge Bomb, either, not sure why you would think so. Infiltrator I admit would be a bit useless by comparison, but then again it also allows bypassing reflect/light screen for what that's worth.

Intimidate would be another nice option, but Gengar kind of lacks the bulk for something like that IMO.

Hell, they should have just buffed Cursed Body or something.

>>30996178


And they could have done all of that without getting rid of levitate on Gengar as you know, give the pokemon a second ability.

you know, because having two non-HA abilities is a thing.

>>30997267
>100 BP always Crit Hexes

130 BP you mean. 65 BP that gets doubled. Which always Crits. That sounds fucking monstrous. I want it.

>>30997267
Ah alright. I said Sludge Bomb since the meta is filled with fairies, and Gengar is the only reliable poison type that can outspeed most of them and get a clean kill, not to mention it doesn't have the bulk to use toxic and wait another turn to abuse hex; it likes to hit and run

How would you buff Cursed Body? Personally i'd increase the chance to disable a move up to 50%. Or keep it at 30%, but also have an effect similar to Aftermath, where it deals damage after being KO'd, like a curse.

>>30997318
I thought it was 50BP, my mistake. Still, a 135 +crit would probably kill anything

>>30997352
Either make its proc rate 50% or drop it to, say, 25% proc rate but make it apply to any move that does damage.

>>30995877

...son of a...