How does a man go from designing one of the worst entries in

Masuda fucked off more often,

>>30639117
wasnt limited to a remake

first was a remake, second original content

full creative freedom

>>30639117
Did he design Mimikyu?

>>30639117
He saw what he did wrong and learned from it.

>>30639150
>>30639151
>>30639158
Plus this

>>30639117
one word: KANTO!

>>30639635
>He saw what he did wrong
But he did zero wrong. Everything good about ORAS came from him

ORAS isnt even as close as bad as /vp. tries to picture it and SM is far from being perfect.

If anything SM has less post game material than ORAS, also DexNav is a lot more unique and engaging feature than SOS battles (its ok for Totems but sucks for wild mons). Finally the legendaries Groudon/Kyogre/Rayquaza/Deoxys felt a lot more powerful than Solgaleo, Lunala or Tapus. Delta Episode is a lot more epic in comparison to lookers missions with UBs

>>30639815
Oh and secret bases, PSS and contests.

SM doesnt have any side stuff (pelago is useful but hardly engaging)

>>30639117
He himself said he wanted the remake to feel like the original RS. They did. They were much better than RS, actually.
It's just that they were as good as Emerald.

>>30639117
Liking SM just encourages Kanto pandering.
WTF are you guys fucking doing. You're encouraging these fuckers.

>>30639815
>Delta Episode is a lot more epic in comparison to lookers missions with UBs
Wow I dissagree entirely.
Delta Episode's climax of M.Fug vs. Deoxys was great, but everything up to that was a slog. The looker mission was far more exciting encountering a whole slew of crazy trans-dimensional aliens that were apparently able to kick the tapu's asses.

>>30639865
What are you talking about besides Alolan forms? The heavy story focus and trial system are specifically un-kanto.

>>30639117
>one of the worst entries in the series

It's not that bad, dude. Worst remake though, probably.

>>30639899
But they didnt considering the region wasnt destoyed nor nobody was hurt

The Ultra Beasts concept is one of the most ridiculous ideas GF eever had. Its juts an excuse to push some of the weirdest designs ever because their explnation is: "t-they are from different world so they are weird..."/ What world? What happened there? Are these regular mons or legendaries? Etc wewill nnever know, you can be sure of that

>>30639934
>Implying Pokemon Stars won't expand on the concept.
Sun and Moon was just the introduction of the Ultra Beasts. There are still mysteries surrounding them. There's definitely going to be a Kanto Sequel or a Third Version game.

>>30639117
That's not XY

>>30639914
Not them, but another reference I can think of is the stupid switch behind the poster comment. Also the dumb nugget bridge sequence in the zen garden. Red and Blue/Green are technically also in the game for pandering.

I think XY had more gen 1 pandering though.

>>30639934
Hapu certainly makes it sound like the fight ended in the Beast's favor. They just didn't have interest in causing mayhem to anyone but fallers.

It's pretty clear they are regular pokemon too, not legendaries. In the short time you are in Ultra Space you see like 20 Nihilego, and that was just in that small area you visit. And in that minimal window of time where the beasts were able to travel to earth, you get multiples of the version exclusive UBs. There's clearly a great deal of them, which alone makes them seem like they are not legendary in their own world, just to our world, thanks to their ridiculous power.

>>30639989
>Kanto sequel

Yeah no.
Stars maybe but that doesnt mean there will be more Ultra beasts story. If anything more interdimensional stuff.

Besides GF gaave up on megas despite their popularity. Ultra Beasts arent popular, in fact people hated the concept fromm day 1 they were introduced.

>>30639995
There's also the Machop Vermilion City Reference. And the Charizard Ride thing. (He isn't even in the Dex!).

>>30640003
My inner autism says UBs are sub-legendary pokemon in the main universe.

>>30640016
Ultra beasts aren't the marketing parallel to megas. They are considerably deeper into post game content and more of a final mystery for the player to explore.
The Z-move push is much more similar to Megas, they even marketed similair watch toys.
They seem less popular than Megas though.

More time, more money, more freedom.

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he's in my city right now

>>30640016
>in fact people hated the concept fromm day 1 they were introduced.
Holy shit, this much delusion. Everyone was stoked for lilliesquid, Gains skeeter, and Lusaroach. Literally everyone. Now, aside from the group that wants to fuck Celesteela, the UB's are very well received as designs on a "This is something legitimately new and interesting" level. The plot has been craked open with Necrozma, who also has the UB sound effect. this plot isn't done.

>>30640023
>And the Charizard Ride thing. (He isn't even in the Dex!).
This actually massively triggered me. Why not Salamence? Because blahblah genwun.

>>30640077
No, everyone thought they are connected to humans because some of the characters looked like th US

>>30639995
>>30640023
>Red and Blue/Green
>Charizard Ride
They had characters and ride-able Pokemon from each and every region. I don't see anyone going "M-muh Hoenn pandering!".
A few small references are there for each region. Fuck, characters like Looker and Cynthia have been everywhere. If anything, Sinnoh is the region being pandered most.

At this point, it's just become a meme to go all "KANTO PANDERING REEEEEEEEE".

>>30640161
At least those Pokemon were in the Dex.
And it's not a small reference. Red and Blue are literally the posterboys for the Battle Tree. The rest are fucking afterthoughts. The MC is from Kanto. They could've picked any other region. But guess what. Kanto fucking pandering.

>>30640190
Oh fuck off. Red and Blue barely had any screentime outside of the Tree. Compared to Looker or Anabel, who have a full sidequest of their own, Red and Blue did fucking nothing.

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>>30640204
Looker's literally in every game, so nothing there.
Anabel on the other hand is just to please the Hoennbabies because their remake was shit. And they already had her design ready from the scrapped frontier, so they used her instead of a literal who.

>>30640161
There are references in every game for just about every main region, yes. As I previously said, Red and dickbag are basically in the game for pandering. They were in B2W2 as well, but I wouldn't really consider that pandering with all the other characters out there.

Red and Asswipe were even advertised for the 20th anniversary.

tbqh I see Sinnoh being referenced as much or maybe less, and not really pandered.

>>30640161
Dont bother anon, as you said Kanto pandering is the new meme

>>30640105
ubs are wasted potential and the fact that everyone thought they'd be related to aether members but they weren't is one proof
honestly, sm isn't bad for a playthrough, but with this, some very questionable design decisions and lacking postgame, you can't help but feel it could've been so much better and since gamefreak went out of their way to kill all the patterns in gen 5 and 6, we can't even tell if they will ever fix it and go back to making games with more robust postgames

>>30640253
Looker being in every game doesn't excuse anything. If Red or Blue were in every game, you would be literally shitting yourself from being triggered so hard.
And Red/Blue had their design completely changed too. Hoenn not only just got a remake, but also now they get a character from their game appearing in SM as an important NPC. But no, that's not pandering at all. Red/Blue's appearance is.

>>30640269
Define what do you think is the difference between being referenced and pandered. Alolan forms are clear pandering, but aside from that, everything else can be labeled a reference.
How is Red/Blue's appearence any more pandering than Wally/Anabels? Or Grimsley, Colress or Burnet's? Every single one of them, barring Wally, had more screentime than Red/Blue.

>Red and Asswipe were even advertised for the 20th anniversary.
Who else would they? Zinnia?

>>30640283
I'm going to take your advise. They're putting up really good arguments here, and I don't think I can keep this up.

>>30640333
>Who else would they? Zinnia?

They could've bring back all past champions, no one would complain and it would feel special

>>30640333
That's why you don't seem me getting triggered from Anabel. Because they don't push it in my face so hard. Anabel wasn't being advertised. Literally no other characters were advertised except for Red and Blue. They're totally not hiding their bias there.

For your second point. You're literally proving our points right! They had no reason to put Red/Blue in the forefront! They literally had no screentime, yet they were shoved in ahead of the others. Again, as I said before, they were shoved aside for Red and Blue. Because why? Pandering. Kanto fucking pandering.

>>30640333
As the the other anon said, don't bother. It really is a meme now. They could've brought back no characters from previous gens, and everyone would've been triggered. GF went out of their way to bring back a few, now they complain about that.

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>>30640390
It's not a meme. There's a legitimate argument behind that statement. You're just so used to the Kanto pandering in each gen, that you're fucking blind to it now.

>>30640333
>Dexio and Sina
For Megas/Zygarde
>Anabel
Probably for "ORAS's lack of BF", or maybe random
>Looker
Has been in basically every game since Platinum
>Grimsley
Random for all I know
>Red and ____
20th anniversary
>Cynthia
Seems a little random, maybe they wanted to add another champion after Red and Gary, idk
>Colress
He just kind of pops into places since his debut, minus ORAS.
>Wally
Probably has something to do with ORAS being the previous games.

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>she has been in more games that Red and Blue

Fucking Sinnoh pandering

>>30640416
Not that anon, but it started with Kalos for me.

I'm mostly just buttblasted Alolan forms were Kanto-exclusive. References or pandering, the rocket switch and nugget bridge parts were lame.

>>30640460
The Alola region itself is Kanto pandering.
>Each Island named after a color
Hmm. I wonder what that could be a reference to....

>>30640161
>>30640269
>>30640283
>>30640333
>>30640381
>>30640460
>/vp/ is starting to see kanto pandering as a bad point
this board isn't blind as i used think it was.

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>>30640381
30 seconds in one trailer is putting out in the forefront and being advertised? Really?
Fucking Ash-Greninja was more advertised than they are, and it's Red/Blue's 20th anniversary; they deserved more than they got.

>>30640419
Thanks for putting that out there, though I don't see any point if you were trying to make one.
Though I did notice that out of all of these, only Dexio/Sina, Looker and Red/Blue's appearances are justified.

>>30640416
What argument? All I see you saying is "they shouldn't have, because they've appeared too many times.".
Of fucking course they've appeared more than Alder. They had a 14 year headstart. They've been around way longer than Alder, so obviously you've seen them more. If anything, Cynthia and Looker, who've been around 10 less years, yet have had more appearances are the ones being pandered.

>>30640460
Fair point, but this can be defended too. Kanto Pokemon have been around for the longest. We've seen the same Ninetails for 20 years now. They're the ones who needed a rehash more than, say, Sinnoh Pokemon. But giving a few Johto mons Alolan forms would've been nice too.

I know I said I'd stop last time, but this time I mean it. If anyone have a brain, they'd understand. If they don't, they can go cry about Kanto pandering more.

>>30640599
It's more than characters appearing for Kanto. It's literally anything and everything in the region that's referenced.

>>30640642
as opposed to other regions which just has pokemon and characters from that region.

>>30640421
Might want to redo that math. Red and Blue have appeared in every generation barring 6.

>>30640665
Reminder: 23% of the Alola dex is composed of Kanto Pokemon (Not counting Alolan forms/Additional Pre Evolutions/Evolutions)

>>30640680
technically this is generation 6.5 so...

>sun and moon
>best game in the series

let's not go that far. It was solid, but flawed. Also, I bet if you cut out the cutscenes and lag from the battles it's the shortest game.

>>30640680
>RGBY/FRLG
>GSC/HGSS
>BW2
>SM
They've appeared only 3 times outside of their games. Only one of those times, in Gen II, were there only Kanto characters appearing. The rest, they've appeared with characters from each and every region.

Now for Cynthia:
>DPPt
>HGSS
>BW
>BW2
>SM

and Looker:
>Pt
>BW
>XY
>ORAS
>SM

>>30639117
For instant praises just add waifu

>>30640750
So
Red: 13
Cynthia: 10
Looker: 8

>>30640381
Why the fuck would they advertise Anabel? Most of the viewers would go "who?" If they tried to reference her. Red and Blue have more of a legacy behind them, and seeing them redesigned would have a stronger reaction.

Get it through your thick skull /vp/, Gen 1 = money. It's what got pokemon back into the public conscious and is the reason SM is doing as well as it is.

>>30640783
So you're saying Kanto pandering is real?

Thanks for proving my point, famalama.

gen 1 pandering isn't a thing. Yes they reference kanto, because it's the first fucking game in the series. All games like to pay respects and reference their first game.

How many mario games reference 1-1 from SMB1? I'm guessing just about all of them, yet you don't see anyone complaining about NES pandering or whatever bullshit. This argument is retarded

>>30640799
It's entirely different for Mario. Two entirely different genres of games.

>>30640799
The pokemon fan base is the only fandom autistic enough to hate their series roots.

>>30640799
>it outshines the other games because its the first
but hyrule warriors, sonic generations and super mario maker isn't about just the first entry in the series.

>>30640599
>Thanks for putting that out there, though I don't see any point if you were trying to make one.
I was just trying to answer this:
>How is Red/Blue's appearence any more pandering than Wally/Anabels?

>Define what do you think is the difference between being referenced and pandered.
Red and frienemy were probably just "references" for the 20th anniversary, but the whole 20th anniversary thing seems like pandering. Granted I could understand the reason and it seems logical, especially with Go normies and VC newcomers getting (back) into pokemon. I just find it bad timing because XY felt overboard with the gen 1 references/pandering.
>>30640599
>Fair point, but this can be defended too.
Right, the Alolan forms were probably for the 20th anniversary, and giving people coming back a new experience from familiar faces.

I just remembered another thing that kind of bothers me is that the Kanto pokemon fill up way more of the dex than the rest of the generations/regions in Alola. Granted they're more then welcomed to include pokemon I haven't used on my teams yet, it just kind of adds to the annoyance. Same thing happened in Kalos I think, but I never noticed it back then...

>>30640782
Oh, so remake appearence count. You're suggesting that, to cut down on their appearances, they should've changed the protagonist in their remakes, or they should ONLY appear in the remakes, because remake appearances are enough.
I mean, I knew you were being autistic, but this in a whole new level of autism.

>>30640854
No, Red's appearance as pandering doesn't matter. It's not Red that's the problem. It's Generation 1 as a whole, from characters, to locations, to the Pokemon themselves.

>>30640879
Generation I was remaked once, and Generation II, which also had Generation I, was remaked once.
They haven't gone overboard. They've only remade them once. Unless they were cutting out the Kanto postgame and making HGSS and GSC lower quality games they already are, each appearance of Kanto is justified. It actually adds more content in an otherwise mediocre game.

>>30640851
Neither is Sun and Moon, though. There's references across all generations in some form or another.

>>30640919
>remaked
>remaked
Underage. Opinion discarded. You don't know what it's like to live through Kanto pandering for so many years. You've only been alive for what? Two generations?

>>30640561
This board has hated genwunners and such since 2013 as far as I've seen.

>>30640599
>>30640852
Oh also the forms probably gave the originals a "buff", like I see Alolan Ninetales better than it's original, but the forms still see fairly weak. Heck, most of the new pokemon seem like fragile glass cannons.

>>30640852
>I just remembered another thing that kind of bothers me is that the Kanto pokemon fill up way more of the dex than the rest of the generations/regions in Alola.
Again, a fair point. But Kanto has more Pokemon than other regions. 2x more than Alola and Kalos, and 1.5x more than Sinnoh and Johto.
Actually, about Sinnoh. It had new 107 Pokemon. Out of those 107, 14 were Legendaries, 16 were evolutions of older Pokemon, 7 of which were Kanto Pokemon. You can see why they have more Kanto Pokemon in Alola dex compared to Sinnoh.

But that's no excuse. This applies to other regions, but to much less extant. They really need to make the PokeDex more diverse.

>>30641015
what about hoenn and unova pokemon?

>>30641099
They're off much better. That's why I was specifically talking about Sinnoh. Especially Unova, with 156 new Pokemon, and only 10 Legendaries, Unova and Kanto both have exactly the same number of normal Pokemon.

>>30640940
Tone down that autism anon. Remakes of games that had Kanto in them is not Kanto pandering. Seems like you had some bad experiences in real world Kanto. Might want to resolve those issues before getting into debates about it with others.

A third of Alola's dex are Kantomons.

>>30639117
No Maduda fuckery