What went wrong?

>>30580865
Gamefreak continues to not understand game balance, more shocking news tomorrow at 11

>>30580865
>Tapu Koko
>Celesteela
>Marowak
>Gyarados
>Garchomp

you all wished for a meta with no genies and no megas

this is your monkeys paw

Someone mistook Milotic for Gyarados

As someone who doesn't give a shit about the metagame, what makes Marowak so good? Is the change in typing that good for it?

>>30581068
it eat ultra beast for breakfast

>>30581068
Yes, but mostly lightninrod to cuck tapu koko

>>30581068

It's immune to kokos electric with lighting rod and resists fairy with fire type.

>>30581068
Immune to fighting and electric (Lightning Rod), resist bug, poison, steel, and fairy, all of which are prominent in the meta game atm, and also fire, grass, ice.
Basically shuts down all the good UBs, Tapu Kek, Tapu Bulu, prevent safe Tapu Lol switch-ins. If it runs Will-o'-Wisps, it also threatens to cripple any physical attackers.

Whats on that whimsicott? I love that little fuck

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Porygon 2 instead of Porygon-Z

>>30580865
The meta is 2 weeks old you fuck

>>30580865
Holy shit I just realized it's a never ending feedback loop!

>Need to Bring Celesteela to wall Offensive threats like Chomp and Gyra.
>Need to bring Topu Kek to counter Celesteela.
>Need to bring A- Marrowak to counter Topu Keku.
>Need to bring Gyra/Chomp to check A Marrowak.

Then you just bring 2 other random top tier mons.

Tapu Fucku

The metagame is young.

People are netdecking.

Counters will be produced which will get counters as well.

Come back in a month and we can talk about the meta.

>>30580865
>>30581950
What people don't realize is that the chomp-koko-celesteela core counters itself.
Tapu koko has a great matchup against 2 of the 3 and has an exactly even matchup against the 3rd. People are essentially building teams that check/counter themselves and battling those against each other. Why someone doesn't just flip the script is beyond me. Probably just because the meta is young. New shit will develop with time.

What is the standard set being run for Marowak? I have adamant thick club, 240 HP, 252 Attack and 16 Sp. Def with Flare Blitz, Bonemerang, Shadow Bone & Will O Wisp

>>30582040
That's pretty standard outside of the WIll-O-Wisp but that's interchangeable with Stone Edge for the attack coverage.

>>30582040
In VGC format it's almost full Sp.D and HP to hard counter Topu Keku and other UB's. It's Att isn't really needed since with a Thick club it still always 2 hit KO's almost anything.

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>head into Battle Spot singles for the first time with a Toxapex/Tsareena/Silvally core
>Garchomp everywhere
>Mega Metagross is unstoppable unless I get a burn on it
>Celesteela never does anything to my team, but takes forever to go down
>more fucking Garchomp
This is my first time doing competitive somewhere that isn't Showdown and it's no fun at all. I'm about to start breeding a Togekiss for the sole purpose of pushing Chomp's shit in, but what should I do about Mega-Gross?

>>30582174
Go to showdown again
Battle spot is pure cancer

>>30581762
Prankster Shenanigans (Taunt, leech seed, etc) while providing tailwind support.

>>30581827
>What is Eviolite

>>30581827
Conversion 2 sucks, Eviolite makes Porygon2 a tank since it also has Recovery options

Porygon-Z is entirely different to the way you use it

>>30582256
Conversion sucks?

Have thunderbolt as your first move, ice beam as the next for coverage along with HP Ground for electric and steels types that are strong against the first two. Modest, Max out Sp. Attack and Speed, 4 on defense because whatever + NORMALIUM Z

>Porygon-Z used Conversion!
>Attack, Defense, Sp. Attack, Sp. Defense and Speed gets raised to 1.5
>600+ Sp. Attack, 400+ speed, now good defenses (confusion and foul play risk now but oh well)
>Usually goes first because of Porygon-Z's not quite good but already decent maxed out speed stat
>Will not die easily after the conversion unless surprise banded earthquake or scarfed superpower/close combat
>FUCKING ADAPTABILITY


Porygon-Z is fucking amazing in this meta. Adaptability plus ASTRONOMICAL boosts in ALL its stats, it's thunderbolt can murder anyone. Oh, Garchomp you say? Literally any ground type, you say? Welp, speed plus sp. attack boost and an ice beam BTFO's all ground types. Dugtrio? Magnezone? HP Ground.

Porygon2 may be a good wall but god damn Porygon-Z is just better now.

>>30582459
>Porygon-Z is fucking amazing in this meta
Yeah no. Maybe in singles. In doubles it's shit.
Boosting is bad and slow and takes too long and loses too much momentum. None of the top teams use porygon-z conversion and everyone knows about the trick at this point.

Also you didn't post the much better set which is shadow ball HP fighting

>>30582518
Was talking about singles, my b.

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>Gengar got nerfed
>Garchomp untouched

Garchomp nerf when? He's had it good for too long.

>>30582537
just pack something with HP Ice or Ice Beam, nobody runs it with Assault Vest for some reason because Scarf and Rocky helm+Rough Skin maymay are still popular

>>30582208
>I'm shit at pokemon so i run away and play minigame.

>>30582537
Garchomp got cucked by his own Mega, which sucks.

>>30580865

Why are people using these mons instead of the old stuff? What happened to Mega Mence and Landorus?

>>30584425
Mence is banned and Landorus isn't even in this game yet.

>>30582537
He's only being used because Landorus-T isn't available in the current format. He'll be goner by next year assuming VGC18 allows Natdex.

>>30582040
Go 244 HP and 12 SpD, you're wasting EVs at level 50 with your set.

>>30582537
She'll get Dragon Dance in the DP remakes.

>>30582016
SO if chandelure was available, would it be better than alolawak??

While I don't really care about centralization, it bugs me that Celesteela is on every team because of how long the Leech Seed & Leftovers animations are.

>>30582174
if your team comp doesn't work, obviously make changes to it.

can anybody tell me what's the build around Garchomp, A-Marowak, and Celesteele?

>>30580865
Whats a good nature for the kawaii tapu gyaro

>>30587183
No, because Chandelure doesn't have Lightning Rod.

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>it's a /vp/ thinks they know how to play VGC episode

>>30580887
Ok anon, you like many others like to call GF out on their shit in terms of balancing like some sort of experts. How would you balance the game? Honest question. Or do you just spout whatever bullshit /vp/ tells you like a retard?

>>30582016
This. Meta is too young right now. This happened in gen 6 as well and the meta was drastically different by the end.

>>30580918

To be perfectly honest I'm fine with it. I hated genies because they were ugly as fuck, at least Tapus don't look like a hot pile of shit.

>>30582174
Right now Metagross' moveset is pretty limited to EQ, Explosion, Zen Headbutt, Hammer Arm, Meteor Mash, and BP so try something that resists/isn't weak to all that. I recommend Arcanine, Gyarados, or a bulky ground type like Mudsdale, Garchomp, etc.

Gamefreak doesn't understand what is ban worthy and what isn't.

>>30580865
Would things be better if legendries were all banned?

>>30580865
Is Gyarados really that good? This isn't doubles, right?

>>30582537
>He's had it good for too long.
I heard the same thing about Gengar. Both are retarded ways to balance a game.

>>30580865
>Try running Gyarados due to the urging of everyone
>Get curb stomped every time
>Drop from 1350 to 1180
>Swap it out for something else
>Literally go up in Elo again to 1380ish

How does one even run Gyarados?

>>30588038
Not that anon, but if GF was interested in balancing their games, they would release updates and patches to balance it like any other competitive game developer. Nerfing/buffing some stats, moves and abilities should happen throughout the game's life cycle.

>>30584125
>Implying Garchomp even needed a Mega
>Implying Garchomp is even forced to use his Mega
>Implying his Mega isn't just another option it can fall back on like the 1000 different sets it has

Tapu Keko

>>30589063
considering the release cycle is yearly, they don't need to pull a riot and update the game every two weeks. Neither dota2 nor street fighter frequently put out balance changes.

>>30580918
Anything is better than genies, even Tapus.

>>30589060
You don't run Gyarados, Gyarados runs you.

>>30587635
I remember how Pokemon Stadium 2 had a faster item animation, and had the HP bar go up mid-animation.
Why can't we go back to that?

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>>30582537
>Nerfing something that is completly outclassed
Nerf Landorus first and then we might talk

>>30580865
>can only use things found in Alola until January
>most of the new stuff is shit so everyone uses the few good ones
Huh... competitive sure is weird. I wonder why they don't use the shitty options?

>>30581827
Z-Conversion for Porygon-Z, Eviolite for Porygon 2.

>>30580982
Milotic is actually legitimate. Competitive in a meta where Gyarados is 'every fucking team' levels of meta and Arcanine/Krook/Salamence are all not-uncommon is a very useful ability.

>>30590285
Could Adrenaline Orb Milotic be viable?

>>30587183
Chandelure is available, and no it isn't. Lightning Rod is what puts Alolawak over it desu.

>>30589078
>1000 different sets it has
it literally runs the same 4 attacks every time

>>30589014
Gyarados is very fucking good. DDdos was what won VGC14, don't you remember? Lacking the mega isn't that big of a deal. It can also run bulky sets.

>>30582016
Incineroar is the anti-anti meta hero we need. With HA it would be disgusting. Even with fucking blaze it's actually really good. I'm at 1780 rating in Battlespot and I'm starting to see people use it since it counters Celesteela/Maro-A/Toplel and can check Topkek in lead.

>>30580865
>fem.ale goo.dra over garchomp
/vp/ on suicide watch

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>>30580982
>Someone mistook Milotic for Gyarados
my top two favorite water types, this is great. continue

Now I know it got "nerfed" but is there any reason Gengar can't do well against these teams? It's grounded now so it benefits from terrain, and Sludge Wave/Shadow Ball/Thunderbolt means it has a type advantage over the entirety of those teams. Then a WoW and then maybe get a Bulu partner and you should be able to handle a lot of stuff.

I mean it's possible and honestly likely that I'm just retarded, and I haven't gone into the stat nitty gritty, but it seems good on paper

>>30590415
What set are you running?

>>30582537
Fairy Type exists

>>30581991
please, you know every team will be copy paste by the end just like all the other seasons

>>30582174
try not using a fucking shitmon like tsareena

>>30589060
>>30590415
it's a bulky roardos this time around

>>30580918
Who the fuck wanted NO megas? No specific megas, maybe.

>>30582537
>Swinub use Ice Shard

>>30582537
>KISAMA!!!!!!!

>>30582174
Get a counter. I love to BTFO garchomp leads with hidden power ice xurkitee.

>>30582537
Gengar has been bullshit forever. Even will becoming vulnerable to Urfquake in base form, still has really good stats and Mega.

>>30580865
this is why I don't play competitively. it's always the same shit.

>>30580865
Reminder that Pelipper + Swift Swim Relicanth can rekt these teams

>>30591372
Yeah, roar is SUPER important in this meta, you actually have to have something that uses it. Fortunately all of the good intimidate mons have it, and so does Incineroar.

>>30590985
Bulky set with FO Lariat Flare Blitz then either taunt/roar/coverage and Incinium-Z. You need a few points of speed investment to guarantee that you beat uninvested Celesteela and some Sdef to make sure Koko's thunderbolt is a 3HKO instead of 2HKO, a little attack will ensure you can KO Koko with FO into Moonsault, Moonsault will flat out KO Lele without defensive investment. Max HP and the rest into attack, Adamant nature.

>>30592136
What kind of nature/EV spread do you have? Guessing Adamant?

Can someone post the sets for all those competitive mons

>>30591769
Oh no! The meta isn't always your favorite shitmoms how cruel!

>>30590309
Completely viable. With some investment you can get it to outspeed and OHKO non-scarfed chomp with a boost, while easily tanking scarfed EQ and returning a kill with ice beam.

>>30592298
PROPRIETARY :^)

(I don't actually have one bred, I just see it used against me all of the time and have been trying to guess the set with calcs to breed my own)

>>30580865
801 Pokemon and this is the teams in the competitive scene. Where's all the variety?

>>30592420
Second this

>>30592888
>801 pokemon

Including only fully evolved aloladex pokemon the total pool of legal mons for this tournament is only about 100.

>>30592735
Eh maybe I'll breed up some FakeOut Littens.

>>30592888
Only 300 are in the game. Most of those aren't fully evolved or meant to be used in competitive. The rest aren't good enough.

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>random battle request while running around the festival plaza
>some tryhard with the gladion pose with the most cookie cutter tryhard rain team with like 4 legendaries
>vietnam flashbacks to gen 5 as drizzle begins
>I have my main story team thats just for fun
>6-0's me

why do people do this? why don't they go on battle spot? or showdown?
I cannot comprehend why someone would challenge random people with the most boring ass team imaginable. I mean it was partially my fault for accepting but just what

The sad thing is that I designed my first vgc team without checking out showdown at all and it's almost identical. Seems like the logic kind of team to build atm.