APOLOGIZE

>Golisopod
>Palossand
>Pyukumuku
>Passimian
>Guzzlord

>good

What are we supposed to be apologizing for?

But I did nothing

>>30516698
Isn't salazzle also good?

>>30516698
So these are the OU Pokémon?

>>30516763
No, because what the fuck is worth using toxic on that normally can't be poisoned that it can't just flamethrower into oblivion? Tentacruel? Toxapex? Both of them absolutely destroy Salazzle, Toxic or not.

Corrosion would have been an amazing ability on something with solid bulk and NOT Fire typing. Salazzle was a mistake.

>>30516838
Yeah but it had good speed and special attack. It's definetly better than shit like golisopod which is included in the op.

>>30516838
Venoshock.

>>30516967
Your better using Nasty Plot to boost all your moves instead of traying to poison two specific walls than could kill you for just trying just for boosting Venoshock

>>30516915
It's speed and attack are -okay-, not good. And it's bulk is absolute trash.

>>30516967
That doesn't save it at all.

>>30516967
>Salazzle used venoshock!
>it doesn't effect ferrothorn...
corrosion doesn't actually let you hit steel types with poison retard

>>30516838
Heatran

>>30516915
Being better than trash doesn't make it good. Salazzle is doomed to UU, possibly RU.

>>30516698
>no decidueye
Sealfag detected.

>>30517101
>Heatran used Earth Power!
Yeah that's a real good fucking idea. Send your Salazzle in to die so it can use Toxic once.

>>30517101
>Heatran used Earth Power!

not memeing, Earth Power heatran is common enough, is used a lot to hit oposit heatran, so fuck salazle

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>>30516782
no, these are the OU pokemon

>>30516715
>"what's good is what smogon tells me!"

>>30517117
Considering that trash is in the OP, it's odd to exclude it.

>>30516698
>legends are competitive worthy
You don't say?

>oh no the ultra beasts are unleashed!
Alright lets check out each island...
>all the islands are fine
What the fuck GF.

>>30517177
None of those are good though.

>>30517068
Yes it does

>>30517228
Poison the status, yes.
Poison the type, on damaging moves?
nay.

>>30517173
Primarina, bewear, mimikyu, and kommo-o have already dropped to UU.

>>30517173
>pokemon aren't viable unless they're legendary or fairy typed

good job gamefreak

>>30517177
Can you defend passimian? in singles is literally my turtle's Primeape and in doubles you cannot take an ability than actually worth a dead teammate

>>30517173
>Ninetales, 10% Zygarde, Muk, Marowak, and Kommo-o
>OU
Lol no.

>>30517173
Ninetales, Necro, Muk, and Clown waifu will drop off once the new gen sheen wears off.

>>30517177
>what's good is whatever I say is good!

>>30517277
marowak is the tapu koko check

he's definitely OU

>>30517270
UBs aren't legendary.

>>30517288
He's only a fucking check in VGC, in singles he's absolute trash.

>>30517226
Says who? Smogon? Usage percentages despite 90% of the players just copying each other without testing everything/new things?

>>30517317
>immune to electric
>resists fairy
>bonemerang/stomping destroys it
it's still a check senpai

>>30517333
There are better checks in singles. Ones that have FAR more utility.

>>30517333
That's th lone reason I run u-turn instead of volt switch

>>30517286
It is, if you're up for the challenge

>>30517273
>cannot take an ability than actually worth a dead teammate
How do you know this? Have you tried every combination?

>>30517317
>UBs
>not legends
They are even coded as legends in the games. Fuck off with that shit.

>>30517333
Scarf Excadrill does the exact same fucking job but MUCH better and has much more general use.

>>30517401
excadrill is not in the game right now

>>30517251
>already dropped to UU.
There's no usage stats so no they haven't.

Usage rates in the beginning of gens are all fucked up anyway and don't really mean anything. I'm sure Latios is going to be UU briefly because everyone's using the new stuff.

>>30517401
does scarf Excadrill hit as hard tho

is scarf Excadrill immune to fighting

>>30517317
>in singles he's absolute trash.
do you even play what you're talking about?

Can you pokebank yet?

>>30516838
>Not Wanting to cripple tanks like those and way fucking more including the new bamboo princess of healthy meta
How fucking retarded does one have to be to think salazzle is bad?

>>30517319
>Says who?
Says me? I'm not parroting some authority. I've used most of those mons, they suck.

>>30517407
Oh boo fucking hoo. It will be in a few weeks, and at that point Marowak is dropping to NU.

>>30517463
Celesteela carries EQ you retard. Anything Salazzle will "cripple" will get it fucking killed, and it's only going to slow down what it hits.
>MUH AIR BALLOON
There are WAY better counters for shit like Celesteela and Heatran than fucking Toxic.

>>30517499
but we're talking about right now

not in a few weeks

>>30517535
Right now is irrelevant when the bank opens in a month. If it were further out, I'd agree with you. But it isn't so it doesn't really matter.

>>30517557
well ok then

>>30516838
It's funny because toxic is the only move that benefits from corrosion and things like sludge bomb/wave still cannot hit steel types.

>>30517341
He is already confirmed OU, you cannot denny that, even if you dont like it, he is still used a lot for good by hight ladder
>>30517347
He can only take the same abilities than something with Skill Swamp, than means no Wonder Guard, a SSwimmer without water stab dont worth a Kingdra, for Beast Boost better use a UB, he dont worth a mega to take place of Mence or Kanga, he dont get the movepool or stats of Greninja for Protean or Blaziken for SB.
Maybe try for Innars Out (if compatible).

Passimian got bad stats AND movepool, not much than you can do by choosing a teammate to kill when you could just use Skill Swamp instead.

>>30517317
have you been living under a rock?
marowak has been on every team in singles as of late due to being a tapu check, who are all rampant in OU.

>>30517600
>He is already confirmed OU
I'm not arguing that. I'm saying he won't be once the bank opens. He will fall down multiple tiers.

marowak will be the sylveon of Gen 7
Stay in OU for a long ass time, but everyone knows it would fit best in UU.

>>30517499
>It will be in a few weeks, and at that point Marowak is dropping to NU.
Anon I don't know if know how things work but the pokebank OU ladder is available right now and Alolan Marowak is on a sizeable portion of teams and is regarded as good or at least anti-meta. It checks a lot of things and is itself pretty difficult to check. I have absolutely no idea why you think it's bad.

>>30517652
Sylveon shouldn't have been in OU because it was outclassed.

What exactly outclasses Marowak?

>>30517685
I'm not saying anything outclasses.

>>30517653
>I have absolutely no idea why you think it's bad.
>Slow as all fuck
>Garbage bulk
>4 extremely common weaknesses
>The things it checks have better checks
If it were faster, I'd see your point.

>>30517648
You know than smogon plays with bank mons?
They dont care about waithing for GF, they have two ladders, one with bank and one without one, and they only care about the one with it because is the one than will be standard until the next game

>>30517251
>mimikyu
oh hell no
you don't play much if you think mimikyu is anything less than ou
everybody uses mimikyu

>>30517716
>>Garbage bulk
not really

>>30517728
I'm aware. But everyone is just using new shit for now. Right around when the bank opens, that will change.

>>30517744
60/110/80 isn't -bad-, but it is very mediocre when the thing has no speed.

>>30516915
Salazzle is literally made of jizz socked tissue, it'll get raped by the first priority move anyone throws at it or anything it doesn't instantly kill

Marowak is just going to get its shit pushed in by Lando-T when the meta finally settles down. Slow as dick too so there really is no excuse, and there is little variety in Marowaks sets too.

Good typing, but kind of got fucked in terms of stats.

>>30517743
Everyone uses it so it must be really good.

You suck at logic.

>>30517778
Marowak is good enough to keep being OU, usless something happen to his niche, like Tapu Koko going to Ubers for some reason, or just everyone decide to use Rotom-W as their electric type (or not use one at all),
>>30517743
He dont have stats good enough for OU, he is used as a sweeper but is not fast enough, meaning than he relly on Shadow Sneak no hit 4-5 members of a regular offensive team
But he cannot go lower than BL anyway, in the SM UU beta tour is broken

>>30517277
Alola Marowak is a good counter to all the Tapus and UBs except, iirc, Fini, Guzzlord and Nihilego

>>30517277
Marowak has a niche in OU as long as it's running Lightning Rod

>>30517882
>>30517932
Smogon tiers are usage based dumbasses. That's why they're called OverUsed, UnderUsed, etc.

>>30517499
Oh man boo hoo, my fragile sweeper somehow got killed but will kill the most annoying creature to be introduced since the fucking genies and can run focus sash which allows it to hit it hard as fuck what will i ever do with such a "bad" pokemon? who would ever need actual damage dealers that can cripple tanks to the point of inusabilty?
Jesus fucking christ how retarded is everyone nowadays? where's hitler when you need him...

>>30517173
Mimikyu isn't OU because it needs its team to clear out and set up entry hazards for it to sweep, and any thing faster with Shadow Sneak is likely going to ruin its day once its Disguise is down, which it will most likely lose setting up the minimum required 1 Swords dance.

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>>30517716
Anon if you only list the negative points of a pokemon they all seem shit
>slow, garbage bulk
the bulk isn't bad and is capable of checking what it's meant to check
>4 common weaknesses
That most of what it's supposed to check don't posses
>the things it checks have better checks
Like what?

Here's some positive points you missed:
>three immunities and seven resists
>hits hard as fuck (like, literally Mega Mawile tier)
>has stealth rock
>has wisp and knock off which everything really hates to switch in to
>checks a bunch of tops threats

>>30517857
>Marowak is just going to get its shit pushed in by Lando-T
You can say literally the same thing about all the stuff Lando-T could check in ORAS, which was a large portion of the tier

How something performs in a meta is more important than its stats and weaknesses at a glance. People in the ORAS OU viability ranking thread would often claim Clefable wasn't S-rank simply because "it's stats weren't good enough." Same shit here. Use a pokemon before you criticize it.

>>30517499
>Celesteela carries EQ
not always

I've seen
>substitute
>protect
>leech seed
>heavy slam

very often

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>>30516715
>golisopod
>golisopod
>pyukumuku
>bad

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>>30518046
>Golisopod switches into Stealth Rock
>takes 25%
>gets hit down to 50%
>Emergency Exit
>forced to take another Stealth Rock 25% hit if he wants to come back

>>30517177
>le smogon are sheep xd meem
you're a fucking retard if you think that a pokemon with no attack moves and literally no way to threaten an opponent hiding under a sub or a poison type is going to be something other than setup bait, Pyukumuku is FUCKING SHIT

Palossand is also fucking shite, the worst part is how he gets increased defense against a prominently special type, I don't have any doubt that the ability is good against certain water types but those water types are in lower tiers (Kabutops, Carracosta, Feraligatr are all RU and lower) so he's more of a meta call in low tiers

Golisopod is trash against anything that resists water + bug or gets hit neutrally by it, basically any steel type in existence can switch into it not to mention that Tapu Lele outright fucks him in the ass with LOL NO PRIORITY

Passimian has outright stats but an awful speed tier, like Palossand he's going to shine on lower tiers to discourage Defog usage but in OU he's thoroughly outclassed

Guzzlord is too fucking slow, gets no recovery outside of rest and doesn't even get Dragon Dance, Bulk Up or any boosting move to make use of that fat ass he has, 101/97 attacking stats are fucking mediocre in SUMO meta and thanks to the lack of moves he has no usage as tank, boosting attacker, wallbreaker or fucking anything

>>30517778
>Speed is everything hur dur
Marowak just went under the Clefable and Azumaril effect were a change in typing has made go from unusable to OP. Its a Bulky Ghost/Fire type with an item that gives it huge power and it still has access to 2 really good abilities, its not going anywhere for a long time

>>30518046
>golisopod BTFO so bad it had to Emergency Exit out of the list and switch back in

>>30518093
Pyukumushit is finding an odd niche right now

Basically it's role is to Jihad a big threat on the other team.

>>30518046
>Pyukumuku
>Mr "I can't do shit once you hide after a sub and/or are a poison type"
>good

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>>30518093
>you're a fucking retard if you think that a pokemon with no attack moves and literally no way to threaten an opponent hiding under a sub or a poison type is going to be something other than setup bait, Pyukumuku is FUCKING SHIT

>>30518121
It's probably gone in January.

>>30518168
he's gonna call Shuckle shit

brace yourself anon

>>30518151
there are way better suicide leads for hyper-offense teams
>>30518168
>posts a literal shitmon that even has more potential because it got Sticky Web + Stealth Rock

>>30518151
That's essentially what it was designed to do. It has a niche in being an emergency button for set-up sweepers but it's really easy to take advantage of and usually is only good for the slow baton pass.

>>30518168
>gimmick
>good

By that logic Golisopod is glued to the same tier. So either you agree that Golisopod is good, too or you agree that they're both not good.

>>30518214
Not a lead. It's like a bomb you keep in your back pocket until something needs to be stopped.

>>30518207
LOL, you're a fucking retard because Shuckle has an actually good usage, hazards spamming, for fuck's sake, Pyukumuky doesn't even get Encore

>>30517173
they aren't OU but they're the only Alola-mons that aren't complete and utter shit

i would like to call dhelmise good but desu I'd never, ever spend a sixth of my team slots on it, so I guess it really is ass

>>30518214
pyuku is not a lead

>>30518282
dhelmise has a pretty sweet niche as being the only ghost-type rapid spinner, as well as a fairly strong trapping move

>>30517463
A lot less retarded than someone needs to be to think Salazzle is good, that's for sure.

>>30517251
>these pokemon have already dropped to a tier that doesn't exist because ???

what did you gain from this

>>30518262
I wasn't defending nor hating on Shuckle

I was just telling anon to brace himself for the incoming backlash

>>30518168
The main difference is that Shuckle has Encore.

>>30518168
You know, Shuckle is like no used in doubles, and like BL2 in Smogon singles, and he can at least use entry hazards, SR and SW, and can still using moves after taunt, cause he actually learn offensive moves.
And even then, is not that good. Pyu is worse, because he not even have hazards to support his team, or Trick Room, and for screens better use something faster.

>>30518046
Fuck, I meant palossand. I run a defensive one with a weakness policy and it does good for me.

Pyukumuku is something I fuck around with and have a sof spot for.

I legitimately think golisopod is good. Maybe not amazing but usable.

>>30518257
so a pseudo-revenge killer? You have scarfed mons for that, those can actually fullfill two roles, sweepers once their checks/counters are gone and as check, and as I said before if they use Substitute then any use Pyukumuku has is gone as Innards Out damages the Substitute, for fuck's sake, if you want a guaranteed suicide revenge killer go for a Destiny Bond mon

>>30518151
No its niche is to stop mons from killing it despite it being a technical shitmon. You are creating opportunities where it is actually sub-optimal for the opponent to kill a mon.

>>30518397
>sub-optimal
>switch your setup sweeper with Substitute into Pyukumuku
>hide after a Sub, go for +4, Pyukumuku dies and Innards out damages your sub while you have a +4 mon

>>30516698
Sorry

>>30518440
You can name the number of mons that run set up+sub on one hand. If you are changing the meta to where set up mons carry sub instead of coverage or something else, you have a very viable mon.

>>30518168
Shuckle IS shit, but lets put that aside for a second. Shuckle at least gets encore to prevent it being set up fodder, and is basically guaranteed hazards.

Pyukumuku is literally playing five to six, it loses to everything with taunt, every steel type bulky mon, and if you're using it for momentum, there are a million better options. It doesn't even have enough hp to make innards out a kill on anything, and even if you DO take one of their mons down with it, chances are that one mon that you took down with it did way more damage to your team than your pyukumuku did to theirs

>>30517938
They run EQ or Bonemerang, they 100% counter Nihilego

>>30518478
Dont forget Taunt
Also, you could not kill the Pyu in one hit if you dont care enough to prepare a counter to him, is not like he can do anything to something than is inmune to Toxic or is under Misty Terrain.

>>30518514
Anon it can't even check because it outspeeds and hits you with STAB SE Power Gem.

>>30518514
>>30518514
fucking HOW, retard?

>>30518499
Shuckle was banned from RU. I wouldn't call that a shitmon.

>>30518601
you click Earthquake

duh

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>>30518499
>shuckle is shit
Fuck you even if it's true.

It has encore and sticky web at least.

>>30517938
>>30518514
>>30518601
>>30518637
252+ SpA Nihilego Power Gem vs. 252 HP / 68 SpD Marowak-Alola: 314-372 (96.9 - 114.8%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

180+ Atk Marowak-Alola Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 5 Def Nihilego: 580-684 (161.5 - 190.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

>>30518714
(I don't know why I typed 5 def, I meant 4 def but the idea is the same)

>>30518714
counter confirmed!

why did you say muk twice anon

>>30518755
meant for
>>30517284

>>30518478
>you can name the number of mons that run set up + sub on one hand
OU
Gyarados
Dragonite
Bisharp (steel type so Toxic won't be doing shit)
Poison Heal Breloom (immune to Toxic)
Sub + Swords Dance Chomp

any grass/electric attacker that runs a sub

and that's only for OU

Pyukumuku isn't doing shit in OU or any tier other than PU, because Sub + Boosting strategies are even better in lower tiers as specific coverage to beat a specific mon is less neccesary

also as >>30518572 said, you could just simply not kill Pyukumuku in one hit, if the little shit uses Counter/Mirror Coat you can just kill it in multiple hits if you put him under Taunt

basically anyone smart enough is going to setup on it

>>30518780
>>30518755
Are you illiterate?

>>30518842
Toxic isn't the reason why that anon mentioned sub, dipshit

>>30518046
Defend Pyukumuku right now.

>>30518842
>Gyarados
yes
>Dnite
Literally never
>Bisharp
Literally never
>Breloom
Uncommon
>Sub+SD chomp
VERY uncommon

>multiple hits
Doesn't work if it has pain split

I mean agree it's aggressively mediocre but these aren't the reasons it's bad.

>>30519012
It's cute

>>30519012
min defense IVs and EVs, switch into a boosted sweeper and taunt and force them to kill you or lose their boosts

>>30519012
I run a careful one with 252 hp and def. Has a baton pass, z memento, recover, and toxic.

Its fun.

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>>30519012
Unaware+Psych Up+Baton Pass

>>30518959
>Toxic isn't the reason why that anon mentioned Sub
I'm the anon that started the Sub argument and Toxic was the entire reason I used the Sub argument fucktard, because I knew someone was going to go "IF IT SETUPS YOU JUST POISON IT LOLOLOL"

>>30519014
>Bisharp literally never
you fucking wut, Swords Dance has a 60% usage in Bisharp, Bisharp doesn't need to use Substitute as killing Pyukumuku in 2-3 hits guarantees Innards Out doesn't do shit
>Breloom uncommon
is the 26th most used OU mon

>doesn't work if it has Pain Split
Substitute negates Pain Split

I never said that those were all the reasons it was bad but it's part of the reasons it's bad

anyone smart is going to setup on it and you can't even fucking deny it

what about vikavolt?

>>30519185
Weren't you talking about Sub+boost sweepers?

Only Gyarados does that at a common rate.

>>30517463
Smogautists think anything that isn't OU is a shitmon.

>>30518157
Soak for poison
Switch for sub

>>30519271
Only big talkers who want to seem like they're good say that. The actually good players would use a lower tier mon without a second thought if it did something they needed it to.

>>30519271
>/vp/ think anything that isn't OU is a shitmon.
FTFY. Plenty of smogon players play in lower tiers.

>>30519254
yeah but then I realized that basically everything poison/steel counters Pyukumuku along with attackers that are already under one status (basically Poison Heal and Guts attackers)

super effective attackers without any setup move also easily get rid of it, anything that can Taunt it counters it, anything with Magic Bounce/Magic Guard

basically you're guaranteed to have one, two or even three answers to Pyukumuky in a common team

>>30519300
>just switch out
you know that switching out means that the pokemon was successfully countered right? For fuck's sake, is this the kind of retards I'm discussing with?

>>30518025
Suck it nerd.

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>>30517998
>Where's hitler when you need him
Hitler is dead like the little bitch he is.

>>30517648
>I'm saying he won't be once the bank opens

Why the fuck do you retards keep saying this

I can only think the people who do are the ones who were saying Marowak would be a shitmon pre-release

>BUT LANDOT

Can't even switch in on Bone without defense investment and needs absolute max investment to not get 2HKO'd by Blitz, offensive/Scarf set is 2HKO'd cleanly by either of these

And so what, they check different things, unless you think LandoT is suddenly going to become a Lele/Koko/Phero/Bulu check like Marowak is

The only thing that would make Marowak drop is if all the UBs and Tapus besides Fini got banned since it checks all of them, until then it's not going anywhere because of how ridiculously good it is against top threats, this is the same shit with Mandibuzz only multiplied (since Mandibuzz only really checked Aegislash while Maro checks tons of shit)