Type Redesign

I honestly think the current system is pretty good. It isn't perfect (Why doesn't Normal have any offensive advantages? Why does Grass have so many weaknesses? Conceptually, why aren't Ground and Rock a single, unified type?), but I feel making drastic tweaks to it at this point would destabilize the metagame to a detrimental degree.

>>30468290
>Why aren't Ground and Rock the same type
Rocks =/= Earthquakes and Mud

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make fairy type just like pic related

>>30468247
Make water weak to ice

>>30468247
Here's what I would do:

>offensive types
Fire
Ice
Electric
Fighting
Dragon
Dark

>balanced types
Water
Normal
Ground
Flying
Psychic
Bug

>defensive types
Grass
Steel
Rock
Poison
Fairy
Ghost

>offensive types should have more coverage but less defensive utility

>defensive types should have more defensive utility but less coverage

>balanced types should be in-between

>>30468321
This.

Also, there's no real reason for Bugs to do half-damage to Fairies. Walk that back.

Ice Type should
>Resist Water
>Resist Normal
>Resist Dragon
>Lose Rock Weakness

Grass Type should
>Resist Fairy
>Resists Rock
>Do normal damage to Steel

Bug should
>Resist Fairy
>Do normal damage to Ghost and Poison

>Remove Fire's Fairy resistance and give it to Grass.
>Fairy no longer resists Bug.
>Make Ice resist Ground, Flying, or both.
Game is fixed.

>everyone wanting to nerf fairy despite it not even cutting into the top 5 most used types in OU
What is this sweet new meme?

>>30468530
>all these people who bought the dark meme in gen 3
thats why

>>30468530
>New meme
The only thing that seems to be new here is you, buddy.

>>30468247
Give grass 1 less resistance (I vote flying)
Give poison 1 more offensive 2x (I vote dark)
Make ice resist water and fairy
Make bug normally damage fairy
Make bug resist ghost
Make psychic 2x against fairy

>>30468663
Meant to say 1 less weakness for grass (to flying)

Ice now resists Flying and Water in addition to ice.

Grass now resists Fairy too, and deals neutral damage to bug. Because fuck bugs.

>>30468368
>Place Dark in defensive
>Move Rock to balanced
>Move Ground to offensive

>grass resists fairy
>bug resists fairy
>fairy weak to bug
>ice resists water
>optional steel weak to electric

I think these changes would help balance some of the weaker types

>>30468298
>not getting the point that they should just be "Earth-types"

As for myself, Ice being weak to Fighting-types and Rock-types has no place in logic. Ice, like most crystals, goes from being extremely durable to extremely frail based on where it is hit. And while it may be easy to chip ice, it is very hard to break it. Also, Ice should resist Water, after all, Water is Ice and vise/versa.

>>30468321
This.

Why is Pokemon the one game where Water RESISTS Ice?

>>30468663
Ice resisting water is fine...everything else not so much.

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>>30468247
>Acid and Acid Spray still don't deal 2x on Steel-types
>mfw it would fucking reconsider Ferrothorn and Mawile

Remove fairy. Shit idea for a typing.

>>30468321
water neutral to ice
poison super effective against water

Psychic resists fairy.
There, you can enjoy pokemon again.

Ice now resists water and ground. Loses rock weakness.

Grass loses it's ice weakness.

No changes to fairy. Losing resistance to bug is a meme.

Psychic resists poison.

I think there's a gap for one more filler type to put all the weird data/sound/typeless/magnetism and other ideas into. Like Porygon is a normal type, when that's a type I would associate with beasts and animals.

I know "Sound" type is a repeated meme but I think it could still work, and there are still some weird unusual Psychic and Electric moves that could go into it. I would call it "Data", "Wave" or something similar but it's hard to find an encompassing word that doesn't sound absurd.

It doesn't have to be a drastic reshaping of the type graphs either, just one immunity, one weakness, one SE, that sort of thing. Maybe something to give more of an edge to Ice types which are still pretty bad (Poison is arguably in a good place, now)

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In any other JRPG, having 18 types and possible dual-type (162 combinations?) seems like way too many, and in Gen 1 it shows, with mistakes such as having more Grass/Poison species than pure Grass and the only Ghost-type family being dual-type. But as the franchise kept going and hundreds more species were added, it makes perfect sense and is part of the appeal of Pokémon games. I can't imagine how the current games would work with fewer types.

Ice should resist water plus flying or rock.

It's a joke how 2/3rds of Ice types are slow and bulky while having the WORST defensive typing in the game. ANY sort of buff to its resistances is desperately needed.

>>30472217
Why not just "abnormal".

Resists normal and fighting, and weak to psychic.

>>30468247
Since we've come so far, there's no way to completely revamp everything, nor should we.

But if we were making the game from the ground-up, I would have
>made Ground and Rock into the same type, Earth
>made Flying into Wind type, make most normal/flying types just pure Wind
>Normal is renamed Null, has no weaknesses or resistances or anything, and instead of being doled out to every random generic beastmon, it's reserved for the weird/gimmick ones like Ditto, Porygon, or Smeargle.
>no Dragon or Fairy type at all
>Grass renamed Plant
>Steel renamed Metal
>most Ghost types rolled into Dark, most Dark-types loose the sub-type. It now means actual DARKNESS and general spooky shit, instead of just "being mean".
>Light type introduced, it's supereffective against Dark and vice versa. Quite a few former-Fairies pick this up, but also some legendaries.
>introduce Beast type, which covers most of the former-Normals. weak to fire and steel, strong against grass and fighting.
>remove Bug type (as much as I love dem bugs) and roll them into Wind, Poison, or Beast types. Moves like X-Scissor and Bug Buzz are now Beast-type, but only can be learned by former bugs.

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Make every type's weakness-resistance ratio 1:1
Remove types that are simply a species group as opposed to an element (Fairy, Bug, Dragon, Ghost)
Pick rock or ground, not both
Rename some of the other types to be more broad, such as flying->air or psychic->magic
Unsure as to whether or not dark and fighting should stay
If Dark stays, add Light. If Evil counts as a type so should justice
Optionally add some more types for certain reoccurring move types that remain as normal
Examples include: Sound, Gem, Tech for the record, I don't think any of these have enough moves or pokemon to support their addition yet

>>30472282

Not... really? FFIX is rather well balanced and has fire, ice, lightning, poison, water, earth, holy, dark, and non-elemental magic. And that's just magic. There's also blunt, cut, and neutral for physical damage. A lot of this is hidden in the game's code, but every monster has base resistances and weaknesses to those elements. Considering Pokémon was released after FFVI, which also had Gravity and a ton of other wacky elements, more than Pokémon RBGY and that game was decently balanced as well. It was more the bugs and Game Freak's silly design choices than it being a balance problem.

For example, Psychic was overpowered for the wrong reasons. If Ghost had resisted Psychic, and not have been bugged for Psychic to be immune to Ghost and Shadow Ball and X Scissor existed in gen 1, we probably would have never had seen Dark-types come to be.

In a similar vein, if Game Freak had given Dragon one other weakness beyond itself and Ice, like say Normal-types for a bit of irony, we would have never had seen Fairy-types.

Of the types added since gen 1, I think Steel is the only case of it being needed, since there was no type devoted primarily to defense. Also, Ground and Rock really should have been just "Earth."

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bug should be weak to water and resistant to electric

fairy shouldnt be such a confusing type and hard to remember it's weaknesses/strengths against other types

>>30472582
you just said it has 9 elemental types, which is exactly what happens when you merge Pokemon's 18 by half.

>>30472611
if anything, Electric should be SE against Bugs. Bug Zappers, remember?

Ground, Rock and Grass combine to one typing: Earth.

Ice merges with Water, now it's just under Water.

Flying becomes Wind.

Bug and Poison merge, now it's just under Poison.

Fairy fucking dies, all retconned Normals become Norbals again. Light type replaces Fairy as it should have been from the fucking get go.

Cosmic really should be a typing but who cares really

>>30468247
>fire no longer resists ice
Ice isn't OP since gen 1. No reason to keep this resist.

>steel resists dark and ghost again
Getting dark and ghost resists is a huge hassle right now.

As a doubles player, that's what I'd do. The resk is ok.

Honestly I just really hate the fairy type. The type balance was perfect in gen 5, instead of creating this mess they should've just nerfed Outrage and Draco Meteor.

>>30472792
>fire no longer resists ice

I agree. the common retard doesn't seem to understand that Cold and Hot are equal opposites. everyone just thinks "HURR FIRE MELTS ICE CUBE"

>>30472766
>being this asshurt over fairies

>>30472634
>missing the three physical elements
Okay. 12 vs Pokémon's original 15. If we want to compare RPGs of the same era, FFVI has closer with 15 as well (gravity, healing, death).

>>30472766
who even would be Cosmic? Minior, Lunatone, Solrock, Beheeyem, Clefairy, anyone else?

>>30472920
Deoxys. But psychic has cosmic covered already so that would be redundant.

>>30472534
this might be the worst idea I've ever heard

>>30472920
Deoxys, Dialga, Palkia, Giratina, Arceus etc etc all those crazy Deity pokemon basically

>>30472920
Staryu line, Porygon2 and Porygon-Z. Perhaps the Nidoran family (they evolve via moonstone). Likewise Espeon, Umbreon, really any pokemon that evolves based on time of day.

>>30472931
I kinda hate that Psychic is the catch-all for unexplainable crazy shit.
>it comes from space, it must be psychic!
>it's a bell that levitates, it must be psychic!
>it's a super-powerful legendary, it must be psychic!

Split that shit up, man.

>>30472991
hold up why the fuck is a computer program "cosmic".

>>30472949
>guy below me says the exact same thing
>only I get called out
is this what persecution feel like

>>30472566
I'm going to reply to all of your points because I'm autistic.

>Make every type's weakness-resistance ratio 1:1
While a nice idea, there should be at least one type that is defense oriented and at least one that is offense oriented. Steel is defensive, ice and rock are offensive.
>Remove types that are simply a species group as opposed to an element (Fairy, Bug, Dragon, Ghost)
What would they be replaced with then? I agree that there is getting to be a lot of overlap instead of exploration of them, though.
>Pick rock or ground, not both
Rock is offensive "earth" and ground is more neutral. They do different things. What would the combined type be offensively/defensively?
>Rename some of the other types to be more broad, such as flying->air or psychic->magic
Bird type, Evil type. I do agree with this.
>Unsure as to whether or not dark and fighting should stay
I'm going to roll this up with the next one,
>If Dark stays, add Light. If Evil counts as a type so should justice
Fighting IS justice type. Additionally, Kamen Rider is so ingrained culturally -at least in kids- that bug and fighting (justice) resist each other and both are effective against dark (evil).
>Optionally add some more types for certain reoccurring move types that remain as normal
>Examples include: Sound, Gem, Tech for the record, I don't think any of these have enough moves or pokemon to support their addition yet
I'd be kind of OK with this, but also think it would get too confusing. There's about three pokemon per each of your suggested type, and maybe five whole moves for each. Besides sound, which we have a list for.
However, tech and gem really don't seem to have enough to become their own types and I have a bad feeling about creating a type with the special gimmick of "all STAB moves ignore Substitute."

>>30473101
>First person to say it
>Wonders why he was the first to get called out.

>>30473066
>This upgraded version of Porygon is designed for space exploration. It can't fly, though.
>With planetary development software installed, it became capable of working in space.
>It was upgraded to enable the exploration of other planets. However, it failed to measure up.
>For the purposes of planetary development, Porygon was updated with the most cutting-edge technology available.
>Porygon was updated to a new version in readiness for planetary development. But that dream remains unrealized as yet.
Really, and that's Porygon2. Porygon-Z is all about inter-dimensional travel.

Reduce it to 3 types.

Normal beats Psychic
Psychic beats fighting
Fighting beats normal

Legendary Pokemon have a 4th type that is SE against all other 3 and can only be collected.

>>30473219
well fuck me, I just thought it was upgraded for Gamecube graphics instead of N64.

>>30472766
>>30472920
>>30472931

Doesn't matter if Psychic makes cosmic "redundant".

I've been tossing around the Cosmic idea for a while myself.

I'd say the following either gains Cosmic as a secondary or becomes pure Cosmic. I hope you like my ayy lmao idea.

>Clefairy line (Fairy/Cosmic)
>Nidoking/queen (Ground/Cosmic)
>Starmie (Water/Cosmic)
>Mew (Cosmic)

>Unown (Cosmic)

>Lunatone (Steel/Cosmic)
>Solrock (Fire/Cosmic)

>Baltoy line (Ground/Cosmic)
>Beldum line (Steel/Cosmic)
>Regi (all secondary Cosmic)
>Jirachi (Steel/Cosmic)
>Deoxys (Cosmic/Psychic)

>Bronzor line (Steel/Cosmic)
>Palkia (Cosmic/Dragon)
>Cresselia (Cosmic)

>Siglyph (Cosmic/Flying)
>Solosis line (Cosmic)
>Elgyem line (Cosmic)

>Minior (Cosmic/Flying)
>Cosmog line
That's what I think anyway. Some of them are a bit reaching, but I like it anyway. I don't really know what the weaknesses/strengths should be so I'll take a stab at it now.

SE against Water, Fairy, Dark
NFE against Normal, Bug, Ice

Resists Psychic, Fairy, Fighting
Weak to Normal, Dragon

>>30472534
>earth, wind, plant, beast, light
we yu-gi-oh now

But it does make more sense

>>30473267
Porygon2 and Porygon-Z are just the saddest space ducks, aren't they?

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>>30472611
>buffing water more

:^)

>>30473237

Disgusting

>>30473129
imo a lot of Rock and Ground's SE's don't make much sense, and I don't feel the need to follow them.

Ground against Poison? fucking why? You put mud on your wound when a snake bites you or something?
Ground against steel? You use a shovel to dig in the ground, this should be backwards.

Rock against bug because you can squash a bug with a rock? Do people do this? I just use a shoe or magazine, I don't have fucking rocks lying around. and don't bugs like to live under rocks? Plus Bug won't be a type in this New World Order.
rock against Ice, despite ice being one of the things that is most damaging to sculptures and buildings and sidewalks and shit when water sinks into cracks and freezes, expanding and breaking them?

I'd just call it Earth.
Water, Grass, Ice all SE against it.
it resists Wind, Fire, whatever generic type replaces the Bugs and common Normals, and immune to Electric.
SE against Electric and Fire.
Resisted by Water, Grass, and Steel. Cannot hit Wind.

Balance is something that'll be all over the place as well, we'd have to look at the entirely redone chart to determine if this ends up being OP or too weak or what.

>>30473285
I quibble about the Nidos, because aside from using the Moonstone they don't feel cosmic, alien, or otherworldly at all. I'd rather just retcon them to use a different stone, or maybe just by level-up. While we're at it, make Nidoran a single pokemon that splits evolution lines due to gender.

>>30468454
But anon, it already resists dragon

>>30473686
no

>>30468247
ice resists ground and either fairy or water,loses fighting weakness
bug is normal on fighting
maybe have steel resist either dark or ghost again

>>30473574
Yeah, like I said, probably the most reaching on the list.

How do you feel about the rest of it?

>>30472766
Good to know you aren't in charge of game design

>>30473922
The rest seems good.

How about which moves would become Cosmic?

>>30468316
Fairy has to be weak to Steel - cold iron is the traditional weakness of fairies. They're weak to Poison as well because man-made pollution is also a danger to nature and the fae. Making Fairy weak to Grass makes no damn sense at all, if anything they should resist grass, as Fae tend to be nature spirits.

>>30473539
>You put mud on your wound when a snake bites you or something
>You use a shovel to dig in the ground, this should be backwards
That's the wrong mindset. Those are defensive reasonings, and pokemon is nebulous already about what each "element" is.
Can you poison the ground? A little, but it dilutes and becomes fine again. Metal comes from the ground, and dirt fucks up machines, especially the cogwork steel tends to represent.

You've *never* squished a bug with a rock before? I guess that since people don't actually throw stones at birds, flying shouldn't be weak to rock either.
What does that mean then, bugs should be weak to normal because you can step on them?
That thing where ice breaks rocks is represented by ground being weak to ice, which is somewhat confusing.

That type you just described is INCREDIBLY weak. Like, Bug tier.

>>30474088
But don't do that because bug and grass are already overresisted.

>>30474028
No idea what moves would be retyped to Cosmic. Probably just make some new ones gg

>>30474142
so because it's hard to poison the dirt, that means Dirt is really good against poison? seems like you just described reasoning for Ground to resist Poison, nothing more.

>dirt fucks up machines
>cogwork
most Steel Types use it because they're armored, not because they're mechanical.

and no, Flying being weak to Rock is stupid as well, only exists to justify Rock as a typing. It makes even less sense if Flying is changed to Air or Wind.

Bug is another stupid type that's just a species descriptor and ought to serve as an egg group, or unofficial set of shared moves, but the only justifiable Strength it has is against Grass, it just serves to be weak fodder for other stuff. Get rid of that one, too.

and I just described Ground but without a few SE's, how is that "bug-tier"? Especially since Rock doesn't exist anymore either. Hell, let's give it a SE against Fighting or something because you can't punch dirt, whatever. Makes as much sense as the Poison one.

>>30473403
Your mom? Yes she is.

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What do you think?

>>30474503
>normal gets more immunities
Maybe one, but three is too much.
>bug resists fairy
Yes please.
>ice SE vs fairy
That's a little weird, but I agree with ice having more SEs than NVEs.

Can I get a changelog or something?

>>30474675
Sure.


Offensively:
Water NVE against Ice.
Grass neutral against Flying.
Ice neutral against Water and SE against Fairy.
Poison SE against Water.
Flying neutral against Grass.
Psychic SE against Ghost, neutral against Steel.
Bug neutral against Fairy.
Dragon ineffective against normal.
Steel neutral against rock.
Fairy ineffective against Normal, NVE against Grass and Bug, neutral against Fire.
Defensively:
Normal immune to Dragon and Fairy.
Fire neutral to Fairy.
Water weak to Poison, neutral to Ice.
Grass neutral to Flying, resistant to Fairy.
Ice resistant to Water.
Flying neutral to Grass.
Bug resistant to Fairy.
Rock neutral to Steel.
Ghost weak to Psychic.
Steel neutral to Psychic.
Fairy weak to Ice, neutral to Bug.

>>30474783
I really don't think psychic needs this buff.