>ORAS finally makes acquiring hidden abilities intuitive and

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>XY finally makes EV training intuitive and easy

>SM fucks it up again

>>30340552
SM is shit.

>XY and ORAS do almost everything right
>SM regresses and removes core features and forces kid-appeal mechanics and cringe characters like rotom-pokedex on you
THIS is their excuse of a 20-year anniversary game? Die Ohmori, talentless hack

> XY makes breeding and farming berries easy and intuitive
> SM fucks it up again

RIP the Maison loop

>>30342528
You're fucking dumb as shit.

EV training is faster than ever. Learn to play.

>>30342593
but anon, SM is better than XY and ORAS. /vp/ told me so

>>30340552
wat
it's easy as fuck to get hidden abilities if you're not a retard

>>30342603
...but only if you decide to memorize each mon for what EVs it trains, grind like crazy in the festival plaza doing minigames (provided any are open at the time and you don't get locked into one you have maxed out the score on), obsessivley chain hunt pokemon to grind EVs, then switch forever and ever to keep up chaining.


Easier my ass.

>>30342598
You have to be brain damaged to think farming berries is hard

>>30342632
Get power item
Chain a fight for 5/10 minutes depending on if you have pokerus or not
Max stat, that easy.

Alternatively, leave your Pokemon on Isle Evelup overnight and you get a full 252 stat while sleeping. You literally don't even have to play the game to do this.

>>30342645
It was nice to be able to run by the farm while hatching eggs. So smooth- just make it part of the loop! No extra stops needed to keep the berries maxed out beautifully while working on breeding wonderful pokemon.

>>30342632
>using false swipe once then killing 5-6 of the spawned friend is "hard"

>>30342632
>Easier my ass
except he said faster, not easier

you should reconsider your life choices though if you think the minimal amount of reading required to EV train using SOS battles amounts to any sort of "challenge", though

>>30340552
>XY and ORAS makes playing with others online intuitive and easy
>SM fucks it up

>>30342632
>I Don't Know What I'm Talking About: The Post
It takes 7 kills to fully EV train a stat now.

>>30342651
>leave your Pokemon on Isle Evelup overnight and you get a full 252 stat while sleeping.

Wouldn't that just do the same as untrained EV leveling or does it actually do ideal EVs?

If it's like the untrained EV level-ups where it just puts it evenly into everything then you're back to the festival grind.


Also requiring the power items to not make it insane makes it impossible to EV train outside of late game or even postgame if you don't have the items for some reason.

>>30342593
We Yo-Kai Watch! now.

>>30342603
Dude, hordes were nearly a 100% chance of getting the EVs you wanted in XY. In ORAS they literally made them 100%

In SM you have to go through the slog if SOS battles for a chance of getting an additional Mon to appear even with an adrenaline orb and grind shit like the pelago and plaza.

Its considerably worse because it changed a five minute job to about 1 hour + depending on your luck.

>>30342661
> switching every round to be able to do this is fun and easy.

>people complaining about anything since dream world

>>30342677
And hordes took about 5 battles what's your point?

>>30342705
Exp share gives EVs you know?

>>30342699
Literally just use Isle Evelup, never spend time EV training again and instead keep breeding more mons

Wow you've cut your workload in half from G6

>>30342699
And then there's the times where the SOS just refuses to appear and they keep tapping your in-training mon to death.

If the mon is low enough level to not have to reset with the festival plaza first then it's going to die. Also festival slog sucks.

>>30342699
You can tell by this post that you haven't ever even tried SOS training.

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>>30340552
Yeah but we don't have to play XY or ORAS again

Will gladly take that

>>30342598
Berries are lazy easy this gen. Never did it in xy but in SM I can leave like 12 berries in it and come back for over 100 later. Breeding is faster but fuck the tauros hurts the hand too much.

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>>30342699
>10~ chained kills in the same encounter
>1 hour +

>>30342730
...on every pokemon? Isn't that just the same as the normal untrained EVs or are you saying it's worse as you can accidentally fully train special attackers on normal attack just because it's in the party to level up?

>>30342699
>Over an hour to EV train
If it's taking this long, you must seriously be retarded.
You can fully EV train a pokemon (without pokerus) in like 20-30 minutes.

>>30342705
Switching what?

>>30342732
>Literally just use Isle Evelup, never spend time EV training again and instead keep breeding more mons
In that time I could have trained a few boxes of Mon.

SM doesn't allow for such a quick method.

>>30342771
It does, you just don't know how and apparently refuses to research into it.

>>30342746
Been doing SOS training. Going 3-10 rounds of either the stupid mon not calling or failing to call anything even with HP in the red is frustrating.

Wasting all my money on healing items and burning through berries like they're going out of style out here.

>>30342732
>its quicker because you can do something else!
What is this retarded logic?
You could stockpile your bred Mon and do them all at once in ORAS as quick as shit. Going through the pelago is fucking tedious.

>>30342756
that was exactly how it worked in hordes as well, you fucking genius.

slap a strong mon with false swipe and good attacking moves in front, put 1-5 mons you want to EV train in a particular stat, go out and find the correct mon to grind on and kill him and six of his friends

bam.

>>30342784
Anon, if the new method relies on luck and waiting a few hours then its worse than the previous method that didn't and had you actively playing the game.
This isn't rocket science.

>>30342598
Well, while you can't crossbreed berries anymore, the berry island does make growing them easier because your Pokémon will attend to them while your away, so you always get the maximum yields as if you were constantly watering them every half hour without having to do anything.

>>30342528
EVs are doable in SM it's just that Gamefreak downgraded from Gen 6's system. What I'm really pissed about is trying to get to level 100 in this game is a nightmare. There are no wild mons or trainers that go beyond level 70.

>>30342787
>Wasting all my money on healing items and burning through berries
Most of the EV training happens on route 2, against fucking level 10 pokemon.
>Going 3-10 rounds of either the stupid mon not calling or failing to call anything
Going over 3 turns without a new pokemon being called is very unlikely.
Fucking go catch a level 40-something sneasel, teach it false swipe, and then that can do all of your sos chaining.

It's pretty obvious that you haven't done any research on how to EV train and are probably mentally retarded.

>>30342771
In the time you slept/were at work/jacked off, you could have trained 18 mons using pelago :^)

>>30340552
I'm just salty at the fact that they removed the infinte loops for hatching eggs.

>>30342852
> Going over 3 turns without a new pokemon being called is very unlikely.

But it still happens. It's luck based.

>>30342661
not hard but its more tedious dipshit

>>30342784
It literally doesn't.
Adrenaline orb doesn't guarantee a chain and leaves you waiting for another Mon whereas hordes in ORAS were 100% with sweet scent. Not to mention you could just kill them in one turn with EQ or something instead of waiting it out with false swipe for a chance of another Mon appearing which may or may not happen when the pokemon calls for help.

Isle Evelup is just a redundant feature given hoqw much time it takes compaed to both hordes and SOS battles.

>>30342867
SM is pretty much 10 steps back in QoL features.

>>30342831
There were no wild mons or trainers beyond 70 in Gen 6 either unless you used an exploit or grinded Battle Chateau(and even then the restaurant in Lumiose was 100 times better, probably my favorite grinding spot in any Pokemon game)

they make things more tedious in SM and the fags still try to defend it, and yet you guys make fun of reddit for sucking on gf's rotting dick

>>30342903
At least they finally fixed the PC. Yay?

>>30342905
No I forgot to mention that the mons you can encounter in the wild give absolute shit exp like Cottonee and Fearow. Both are extremely common in Poni Wilds (which is the highest level encounter rate and those mons are only level 57 max). Also level 70 is really pushing it, I should've said early to middle 60s for trainers because that's what it really is like.

>>30342925
oh fuck this guy figured out that /vp/ is one person

>>30342935
Eh not really. They gave you more battle boxes to work with but that's the only noteworthy change.

>>30342905
There are also Blissey bases and O-powers anon.
That made the process considerably faster.

>>30342962
He's not specifically talking about /vp/ as a whole, just the idiots that would actually stick up for these design decisions.

>>30342962
the way you all hivemind over this game, it coulda fooled me.

>>30342988
>unless you used an exploit
Though i do miss O-powers.
>Tauros tornado with a Flame Body mon and Hatching Power lv3
yes bb

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>>30342690
>EV Training during the main game

WEW

>>30343035
>bb
kill yourself

>>30343035
How is an O-power an exploit?

>>30342593
how is being too easy and lacking content doing everything right?

>>30343035
>tool you're given in game to use freely
>exploit
What.
This isn't like Pokémon's version of wavedashing anon.

>>30343045
No.

>>30343050
It isn't, but replacing every base with custom-made teams exclusively for grinding is.

>>30343054
>too easy and lacking content
sounds like sm

>>30343054
Ironically ORAS has far more content than SM.

>>30342750
Yeah, completely getting rid of d-pad movement was a mistake.

There aren't really even any items you need to use outside of battle anymore. Fishing rod is automatic, honey is useless, repels ask you to renew...

>>30342867
>loops
Aside from Lumiose, what other loops were there?

>>30343140
Down by the Maison by the berry farm. Long stretch of road with optional loop around the berry farm itself if you wanted a detour.

>>30342886
>whereas hordes in ORAS were 100% with sweet scent
You still had a chance of getting the wrong horde. And quantitatively speaking it is faster to EV train in SM.

>>30343171
That was XY. In ORAS there are specific areas that give you only the Mon you need.

Also quantity doesn't matter if it takes longer to reach.

>>30343171
>I've never played ORAS
In ORAS EV hordes are 100%. No wrong hordes in the slightest.

http://nuggetbridge.com/blogs/entry/680-ev-training-horde-hotspots-in-pokémon-omega-ruby-alpha-sapphire/

>>30342690
Just play the fucking game. It lets you choose which EV you want to train

>>30343428
>if it takes longer to reach.
It doesnt

>>30343614
Yes it does.
Sos relies on luck and doesn't give you EVs as quickly.
Isle Evelup takes hours for a single stat.

Its slower anon and that's a a fact.

>>30342871
Idk bout you, but they appear to me every other turn

>>30343140
The battle resort in ORAS.
Because of how the camera rotated, you could set it up such that all you had to do was hold up and you'd keep going in loops.
As an added bonus that's also where the breeder and iv judge are

>put amie in again
>remove minigames

for what purpose

>>30343650
>Sos relies on luck and doesn't give you EVs as quickly
It maxes out a stay after 7 KOs in a single battle. You need 6 battles to max a stat in hordes.

Plus Pelago is meant to do passive EV training. It doesn't waste your time so you can do other stuff besides playing pokemon. And I think there's a drink in festival plaza that maxes out a stat.

That alone makes it better than ORAS.

>>30343751
The loop stopped when it hatched an egg though.

>>30342964
Have you played this fucking game at all? The PC is the best PC in the history of Pokemon.

>>30342925
Read this thread, there are people in here who clearly haven't even actually played SM and are bitching at it for the sake of bitching at it.

Hell there's a retard who apparently didn't even know Exp. Share spreads EVs to your whole team.

>>30343898
>The PC is the best PC in the history of Pokemon
Fucking this.
No more pointless "withdraw" and "deposit" options.
No more having to open "someone's PC".
Just straight to the damn box.

>>30343947
Shit I didn't even notice it.

>>30343741

I'm pretty sure it's dependent on what pokemon your chaining. Most of the early first island mons are as fast as you say they are, but try chaining Oricorio for instance. You'll constantly be going 3-5 turns at a time where it just doesn't call for help.

>>30343947
Also IV judge literally every time you look at boxes, not just when you're at a PC. I was expecting it to not show the judge feature during trades etc. but it's available!

What's the easiest way to get a specific number of EVs? I know SOS chaining is best for maxing a stat out but I don't quite know how it works so if I want an EV spread that isn't 252/252/4 what do I do?

>>30343844
And 7KOs isn't guaranteed anon let alone with the specific Pokémon you need to train on meaning most of your time is spent with waiting or running.
In ORAS of you use sweet scent you will always get those pokemon in a horde and it takes one turn to kill them all with a move like Earthquake.

In other words in the time you've summoned one Mon with SOS battles you'd be at least 1/3rd of the way through in the best case scenario where the Mon appears on the same turn you used the orb which is extremely unlikely.

>It doesn't waste your time so you can do other stuff besides playing pokemon.
>And i think there's a drink in festival plaza that maxes out a stat.
That's the problem it only affects one at a time so you have to actively change what the Pokémon is training in when it comes to the pelago.
As for the Plaza, it relies entirely on grinding FC unlike Join Avenue that used your own money.
Neither are really good methods for quick training.

>>30343947
Eh, deposit was better for breeding.

>>30344014
But why would you do that?
It's like using lvl 42 Fearows instead of lvl 8 Meowths.
They can do jackshit, call for help with a higher success chance (practically every turn, but it sometimes doesn't appear) and you only need a pokémon with false swipe.

>>30344111
Do a bit of math and see how many KO leaves you closer to your desired amount.
Fine Tweak with Poképelago

>>30343947
All they needed to do was keep organize boxes at the top.
Now you can't quick dump eggs or rejects into the PC

Does having pokerus make isle evelup go faster?

>>30342651
>Get power item

This alone already locks it to endgame only and makes it more tedious than immediately EV training with bags.

>>30344119
There are 18 slots for 3 different training options.

>>30344142
For breeding you get the choice to replace a Pokémon from your team each time you get an egg. There's no need to even go to the PC anymore

>>30344186
Anon, if a Mon needs attack and HP you can't do them both at the same time.
It's either one or the other.

>>30344185
I got three yesterday(Attack, Speed, SpAttack) by jobbing at the Royal.
It's not on the battle tree, but on that one facility where you are introduced early in the story and you get points for being there.

>>30344168
Do power items give 8 points or is it 8 + the KOd pokemon's value? What if you would get a different stat from the pokemon you faint, such as power lens after fainting a Geodude?

>>30344202
I think you've missed the point.

>>30344204
Oh, sorry, misunderstood.

>>30344119
>That's the problem it only affects one at a time so you have to actively change what the Pokémon is training in when it comes to the pelago.
What? Why would you change what it's training in instead of leaving it to max out the stat.

Just try EV training anon. You are overplaying the "issues" of SM EV training. Waiting 10 seconds for a mon to appear isnt a big deal. Especially when you get a pokemon every other time.

>>30344226
Its all good.

>>30340552
Oras did nothing right

Delete this post now

You're an idiot.

You can get hidden abilities and max EVs in under 5 mins.

For the HA just do the standard SOS battle false swipe + adren orb setup and then just bring in something with worry seed (exeggutor for example) to check the ability. HAs usually start appearing after 4-5 chains.

For the EVs just slap on whichever band corresponds to the EVs you need and then SOS battle with pokerus and you can get max EVs in like 7 chains.

>>30344220
You don't have to deposit hatched pokemon anymore, when you get a new egg just replace it with a hatched mon. If they made the daycare dropoff work with the PC instead of just party it would literally be perfect.

>>30344233
>Why would you change what it's training in instead of leaving it to max out the stat.
To have a usable pokemon maybe?

>You are overplaying the "issues" of SM EV training. Waiting 10 seconds for a mon to appear isnt a big deal. Especially when you get a pokemon every other time.
Its more like you're unerplaying it.
Just look at his you're not even calling it better any more.

Oh and 10 seconds is a gross understatement seeing as sometimes a Mon can fail to appear when it calls for help.

>>30344210

"Wait, where are you going? You haven't finished your island trials!"

"FUCK YOU, TIME FOR BATTLE ROYALE"

>>30344250
>You can get hidden abilities and max EVs in under 5 mins.
>he's never trained in SM

>>30344236
Oras had a good post-game move tutor.

>>30344269
Pretty much.
Team was Explosion + Explosion + Greninja for extra jobbing.
Fast and easy. (Compared to BP grinding.)

How can I see the exact numbers of the invested EVs in SM? The Reset Bags allowed me to do that in Generation VI. Is there really no way in SM?

>>30344300
I haven't seen a way.
But if it was told by a reset bag, isn't it kind of pointless.

>>30344315
You can save before you use the Reset Bag and just soft reset after you got the information!?

Damn SM are shit.

>>30344260
>To have a usable pokemon maybe?
Why would you want to use it untrained?

Just leave it the sessions you want to train it in each state you want it trained it.

>Just look at his you're not even calling it better any more
I am? I don't need to repeat it in every post.
And pokemon appear most of the time that the turn it doesn't is negligible.

>>30344315
Fuck, missing question mark.
*?

>>30344300

Spam berries.

>>30344280
Delete thos

>>30344280
ORAS fell in the remake/"third" game group, which always get move tutors. First games of a generation have never gotten move tutors.

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>add hyper training
>oh you need to be level 100
>oh they still dont actually up the ivs it just acts like they're maxed so no 6iv ditto for you
>oh and it needs an item
>oh and the item is extremely rare
>oh and exp scaling is back
>oh and there's nowhere good to level pokemon to 100 at

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>Have to either autistically calculate each EV or make guesses based on a tiny little graph with no axis labels

>>30344348

I don't understand why they made them pseudo IVs. Just to be dicks? Who fucking cares if we breed with them.

>>30344349
>counting
>autistic

How did you get through life unable to do simple number tallying? The stuff you're EV training on like level 3 Caterpies all give identical EV amounts.

>>30344349
Shut up or stupid /vp/ might actually stop believing that 252/252/4 is the ideal spread for everything and that there are no more desirable spreads that are annoying as fuck to train now.

>>30344382
With the massive amount of walls they throw up in your face i wouldn't be shocked if they secretly encourage cheating. For real, apricorn balls are rarer than the master ball? What the fuck?

>>30344394
>using hyper specific calc based spreads
>in a brand new metagame

I wouldn't do that until we find out what's staying and what's not. All those tailored spreads are useless now.

EV something to survive Pheremosa? Banned.

EV something to never be 2HKO'd by random overspammed OU mon? Mon becomes unused this gen.

How many play sessions to max out a stat's evs?

>>30344394
Ouch.
When my best pokémon are using that one, that hurts.

>>30344416
There are no bans on Battle Spot and other official metagames. I don't give a shit about Smogon bans and their metas.

I still would like to hit specific HP numbers for multiple reasons and specific Speed stats for other reasons. Like ensuring that my Instruct monkey is slower / faster than its partner and shit.

>>30344440

Non-mixed sweepers tend to be 252/252/4. Only thing weird spreads are on is bulky and defensive stuff, or dropping HP to 248 for stealth rock/leftovers or outspeeding slow shit.

>>30344322
You haven't actually tried to EV train before this gen have you.

Let's start again.
The biggest issue with it in SM is how incredibly slow it is compared to the previous gen.

Pokémon appearing via SOS is inconstent at best whereas it would appear consistently before and you could quickly finish off horde and move on to the next finishing a stat in the best part of three minutes and move on to the next one you need.

The pelago as you said is a passive gain. But only works slowly over time for a single stat at a time.
I'd understand if there was a training regiment you could set like after each hour it would change what you're training in.
But as it stands its not a practical method in the slightest.

>>30344460
Well there are banlists but they don't change once a month because enough butthurt kids cried "broken".
Fuck all of that.

>>30344460
>comes in playing his "literally what" and VGC shit metas
>I DONT CARE ABOUT THE MOST POPULAR PLAYED SHIT IN THE WORLD

Then don't come in here talking about it, because nobody here cares about or was referring to your shitty meta. Guarantee you nobody but you is EV training shit in this thread for Battle Spot.

>>30344482
Who even plays OU on cart!?

>>30344474
>Well there are banlists but they don't change once a month because enough butthurt kids cried "broken".

Literally not how the bans work, but I don't really give a shit. Their bans were getting out of hand once they started banning like every mega. And now they unbanned a bunch of crap but kept certain megas banned for some reason.

>>30344494
>YouTubers playing WiFi on cartridge instead of just playing the same shit but faster and more conveniently on a simulator

>>30344472
>I'd understand if there was a training regiment you could set like after each hour it would change what you're training in.
Again, why would you do that when you can finish one training then start another one.

>>30344495
They banned Mega Sableye after a Suspect test that ended a day before Generation VII dropped because it was too annoying with Dugtrio and TrapStall teams. Dugtrio got buffed and the Mega Sableye did not apply to Generation VII the very next day.
trolololololol

>>30344482
lol talk about pot calling the kettle black
smogon is infinitely more irrelevant on cart than VGC, and if you're dumb enough to play OU on cart over simulators without injecting you fucking deserve the hassle

>>30344494
me

>>30344518
Amen.

>>30344509
>why would you do that when you can finish one training then start another one.
Not too smart are you.
So you can have a fully trained Mon when its over. Not just a Mon trained in a single stat.

Isle Evelup as it is now only allows you to max one stat slowly over time.

>>30342756
It was like that in XY dumb fuck. If you didn't know that I guarantee you
A) Never actually even trained in XY or ORAS.
B) Have a bunch of poorly ev trained moms.

Good job

>>30344509
Are you retarded?
It's so you don't have to set another one.

What he's saying is this
>open pelago
>dump Mon
>select stat training
>leave
>come back
>select different stat
>leave
That's how it is

This is how he's saying it should be.
>open pelago
>dump Mon
>select stats to train in and how long
>leave
So you have a fully trained Mon by the time its done
Do you really not understand what's being said here?

Hell they could even have the amount of EV's you gain next to the time you set for more precision.

>>30342528

That's not true at all

Unlike X and Y where you have to need to hope to God you get the punching back you wanted, poke Palego let's you jut buy the boost you want

>>30342593

>kid-appeal mechanics and cringe characters like rotom-pokedex on you

Except nobody complained about Rotom Dex

Rotom Dex letting you know where your next destination is gives you an idea of how much you can explore until then

>>30344470
Well, I'm on a monotype run with massive disadvantages, so I took EV training up.

When this is all said and done, I hope to salvage some pokémon for battlespot.

>>30344660
Fuck Rotom Dex for turning the bottom screen into shit.

>>30344639
>using bags for anything but precision
>not using hordes for a fuck ton of quick EVs
Also you get bags by doing training courses for a specific stat.

Did you retards not play a single gen 6 game?

>>30344639
I hope you didn't EV train solely by using the bags you get while walking.
You might be the single most retarded person on the board.

>>30344639

Are you so retarded that you used punching bags and super training to get your EVs? It's called horde training.

>>30344615
>Do you really not understand what's being said here?
I fail to see how it's such a major problem that renders it useless to EV train. It's like saying Hordes are useless because there isn't a single horde for each possible spread.

>>30344219
It gives you +8 to whatever stat no matter what pokemon you faint.

>>30344751
Of course you wouldn't you've never bothered to EV train before this gen.

The problem is that its both slow and still requires the player to fucking pay attention so they can change it. It completely defeats the purpose of a passive system if you have to do that.

>It's like saying Hordes are useless because there isn't a single horde for each possible spread.
You are the single most retarded person in this thread.

>>30344742
I've come to the conclusion that the people calling SM's systems good are GO kiddies.

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>>30343081
> actually condemning Blissey bases

Holy fuck. This is it. The pinnacle of retardation and faggotry.

Literally throw your 3ds out the window

>>30344687
An option to sweep to the side or something to see something like the connection screen on ORAS.
The name eludes me.
>>30344827
I get what he is saying, but yeah.
Blissey made thing easier.
Sucks if you wanted a fight though.
>>30344815
Not the best doesn't mean it isn't good.

>>30344839
>Sucks if you wanted a fight though.
Anon, you do realise you can add more than just Blissey bases right?

>>30344799
>to fucking pay attention so they can change it. It completely defeats the purpose of a passive system if you have to do that.
You don't have to pay attention. Just put the pokemon and set the amount of play sessions you need to get the EVs you need. And once it's done you the pokemon to train a different stat?

Is that the whole problem? That after the 31 hours you have to set it again if you want to train another stat? Is that the deal breaking issue that renders it useless?

>>30344839
Player Search System!? I miss it dearly.

>>30344859
Yeah, but thats what he was implying.
I just went to whatever base appeared while connected to ze webz.
>>30344864
I liked it.
I like the map a lot too though.
I'm the kind of person that gets lost in a paper bag.

>>30344863
>31 hours
Can you even comprehend what you can do with 31 hours?

Of course you can't.

>>30344250
DexNav will forever be the king of HA finders. Nothing GF will do will ever surpass it

>>30344893
It was too easy to the point of there being no reason to call them "hidden".

>>30344893
Dexnav > hordes > DW = safari > SOS = Grottoes
Did I miss anything?

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>>30342677

Are you going to reply to this? >>30342720

>>30344905
>hidden means long
They're hiding in plain sight. :^)

>>30344888
I can do other things that don't require me to use my 3ds. You see that's the point of Pelago. It does stuff for you. Like how it grows berries without you having to water them.

>>30344905
Uh.
I wonder if they actually thought that QoL features muddled too much with the mechanics.
>>30344913
Not that guy, and never used Hordes, but you can get 7 ko in on encounter, if you do it against pokémon well below your level.

>>30344933
>but you can get 7 ko in on encounter
In a longer amount of time than it would take to do 5 hordes.
Also hordes didn't have that level requirement to make it faster. It just was.

>>30344687
They haven't got the bottom screen right during walkabout since HGSS

>>30344933
Who cares how many "encounters" it takes, when it takes a fraction of the time

>>30344962
HGSS had a shit bottom screen.

>>30344958
You need a high level mon to make it faster. Otherwise you stay with 5 pokemon attacking you.

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>>30344839
>Sucks if you wanted a fight though

>Not having the secret island specifically filled with blissey bases and only blissey bases

>>30344905
>actually condemning being practically given HAs

Pic related. Both of you

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>>30342651
>Its help didn't appear
>Its help didn't appear
>Its help didn't appear
>Its help didn't appear

Am I missing something? I take the Pokemon down to 1 HP with False swipe and pop an adrenaline orb, but only about 1/5 calls for help are actually answered. This would be 100% better than any previous method if it didn't take so long for a Pokemon to show up

>>30344815
SM system is good. It's not perfect but it's good. Pokemon games never evolve linearly; it's always two steps forward one step back. In this case they took two steps forward in directions they haven't done before and really nailed them, and the backward steps aren't deal breakers at all.

>>30345000
Because using one Surf with a random level 30 Pelipper is hard to do against a horde of level 3 Zigzagoon or level 12 Sandshrew or level 13 Swablu or level 12 Spinda...

>>30344930
You could also train up the same amount of pokemon an play with them within a single hour previously which allows you to actually use them in the same day.

I think the only reason you're finding the pelago useful is because you don't know any better when it comes to EV training and that SM removed everything that made it fast.

>>30345029
>this
>forward
This is very much three steps back with no progression on QoL anon.

>>30345035
>You could also train up the same amount of pokemon an play with them within a single hour previously which allows you to actually use them in the same day.
If I wanted to use the pokemon the same day I'd inject them.

>>30345012
Pretty sure that's probability at work.

>>30344910
Dream world can suck a radioactive dick. I didn't buy a pokemon game to play some shitty new grounds flash adventure.

>>30345034
...Thats how it worked with hordes?
Levelwise, its the same with SOS.
>>30345034
Shit son, I don't know.
Have you been struck by lightning lately?
Thats some shit luck.
>>30345067
I hope no one associates me with this guy.

>>30345000
I just used the latios that they gave me for free as a surf slave. Used a Lapras in XY that I found after the 3rd gym for the same thing

>but anon, that's a waste of a latios
He didn't have defog, he was useless by default

>>30345000
>You need a high level mon to make it faster
No.
Hordes always have a significantly lower level so in an area with 30s the horde would be late teens early 20s range. Using surf is pretty much a OHKO for every horde bar probably Oddish.

>>30344975
Maybe I'm thinking of platinum then. All I want on the bottom screen in the fucking X menu.

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>>30345067
>If I wanted to use the pokemon the same day I'd inject them.

>>30345124
No HGSS had that. It was just shit.

>>30345094
With SOS battles you have to keep one alive at all times.
With hordes you can just kill and move on to the next with sweet scent.

>>30345067
So we're all in agreement that this anon is retarded right?

>>30343868
It's easy to reset though

>>30345065
>catch to party
>egg to party
>no pc menu
>pc judge
>no hm slaves
>no fucking dream world or pokewalker or link cables
>can switch between night and day
Granted festival plaza is a lot of crap (at least there aren't daily mission limits), hidden abilities are harder to get, and leveling is a chore.

But if you take a holistic view then SM is by far the most player-friendly mainline set of games.

>>30345281
I wouldn't really call those QoL improvements seeing as they don't really present real improvements to the game like at the PSS and breeding changes did.

>>30345302
Do you not understand what qoc means?

>>30345302
>as they don't really present real improvements to the game
Isn't that what a QoL improvement is?
Just making UI and managing easier without affecting the mechanics?

>>30345281
>then SM is by far the most player-friendly mainline set of games.
That's ORAS anon.

>>30345035
>I think the only reason you're finding the pelago useful is because you don't know any better when it comes to EV training and that SM removed everything that made it fast.
I ev trained in X/Y. It's a good system. But SM is just as good if not better because you have a lot of options to EV train. Pelago is good because it does the work for you, not because it's faster.

Though I'll admit it. SM got rid of the things that made gen 6 good. Which is Friend Safari, Dex nav and poke miles.

>>30345302
>pc judge
>not a qol upgrade
You're a fucking idiot.

>>30345332
>But SM is just as good if not better
Its literally worse anon. There's no argument otherwise especially since there's a luck based factor over it.

>Pelago is good because it does the work for you
Over an entire day, for a single stat at a time and for max of what, 18 pokemon?
18 Pokemon could have been done in an incredibly short time before.
Just to put things in perspective it takes about three days to fully EV train those Mon in the pelago.
If you wanted to do that in the previous game you Would be done in an hour and wouldn't have to turn on your 3DS at all for the remainder of that time.

>>30345485
Do you not sleep?

>>30345514
That's the beauty of it.
I can sleep as much as I want. I don't even have to touch my 3DS unless I want to play with those trained Mon.
With the pelago I have to wait three days to even use them and if I forget to change it one day I have to wait even longer.

>>30345514
Do you? Because you have to remember to set that shit each day.

>>30345485
>If you wanted to do that in the previous game
I don't want to. That's the point.

>>30342935
Feels slower to switch stuff around in my opinion, i like the added functions from bank that can select multiple pokemon at once, but that's about it.

Horde battles are trash, and I can name several instances it was horrible.
>Trainning in ORAS
>Where do I go for Sp Att?
>Route 117 for roselia kills
>Nothing but Oddish and zigzagoon
>Several maril
>Every 10 minutes there would be what I'm looking for.
Not to mention you need an multi-kill move to do anything.
Hordes were more luck based than anything in SM.
The punch-bag thing was horrible as well unless you wanted to top a stat off.
Pelago is tine consuming, but it's effective.
S.O.S chaining literally take ten minutes against the right chain.
Horde battles in ORAS were only great if you were doing Attack-speed at rayquaza tower.
There was no place you could train Sp. Def either, which infuriated me.

>>30345607
If I want them as soon as possible yeah. If I just want to chill then I just set it again when I wake up and go on with my day.

>>30345646
Well you could have just tried to kill Spinda hordes which have a much higher encounter rate.

There actually was a place for SDef. The route next to Meteor Falls where you could just kill Swablu horde after Swablu horde...

It's not the games fault that you're bad.

>>30345670
This.Knowing what you're doing is a part of the game.

>>30345697
>>30345670
IF KNOWING WHAT YOU'RE DOING IS PART OF THE GAME, THEN S.O.S BATTLES SHOULDN'T BE SOMETHING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT HUH?
Kay I was pretty retarded not to think of Swablu, but horde battles were nothing but a nightmare.

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ITT:

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>>30344639
>i punched bags for hours to ev train 1 pokemon

>>30345765
Please Nebby, get back into the bag. People will see you.

>>30345646
You dumbass
Rusturf for HP
Pyre for attack
Desert for defence
113/9 for sp attack
115 for sp def
104 for speed
And they're all the only hordes to be found on their routes.

>Not to mention you need an multi-kill move to do anything.
Because the game totally isn't filled with them and the obligatory HM one.

I'd say this has been one of the best threads we've had lately.
The people who have any idea of what they are talking about haven't been corrosive and have explained their points, and the ones who have no idea have been pretty obvious.

>>30345776
I did it to train my shiny treecko I used for ORAS as my starter.

>>30345765
SOS battles are something to complain about because they remove the certainty present in ORAS with a luck based factor that more often than not won't activate as intended.

Basically you can prepare for it but it still only gives you limited control and speed.

What's the best way to reset your EVs now that you can't use Reset Bags?

>>30345817
Is this post meant to be a joke or can you not into English?

>>30345765
>THEN S.O.S BATTLES SHOULDN'T BE SOMETHING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT HUH?
SOS battles have a random element and are reliant on Pokémon either calling for help or not doing so as necessary. This means that they're annoying both when you need them and when you don't. There is nothing you can really do to enhance this process.

Horde Battles are a 100% guarantee in ORAS to be what you need as long as you're not retarded. If you don't need them, you can Run. If you do need them, you have several moves that can take care of them, including at least two very good TMs (Earthquake, Dazzling Gleam) as well as a fucking HM (Surf.)

>>30345854
I'd say berries.
>>30345871
Tired and running on fumes.
What did I fuck up this time?

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>>30345851
>Find pokemon
>Use false swipe
>Swap mons
>Use orb
>Go nuts
And bam, you have S.O.S training. You can use turns where the mon doesn't show up to buff or heal. Easy peasy.

>>30345910
I don't think you understand.
The problem isn't that its hard but that its a slower and more tedious system.

The fact the you have to waste turns waiting and using false swipe just brings home the point that SOS battles are a step back from hordes.

>>30345910
You don't even need to swap. False swipe ice shard Pressure Weavile does the trick.

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>>30345765
>IF KNOWING WHAT YOU'RE DOING IS PART OF THE GAME, THEN S.O.S BATTLES SHOULDN'T BE SOMETHING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT HUH?

>Being this retarded

>>30345967
Isn't pressure a terrible thing for SOS?

>>30345910
And this is hordes
>fly to route
>sweet scent
>Surf/EQ
>next horde

And that's it. No stalling or waiting like SOS.
>next horde

>>30345954
It's not slower, Horde on average took 20-40 minutes. S.O.S took me 10 minutes. It's a bit of a set up, but spamming sweet scent and running from mons that you don't want add more time than necessary.

>>30345980
Not if you just want to EV train. Besides, you can swap mons easily.

>>30345954
>accomplish everything in one battle instead of 8
>guarantee the right Pokémon show up instead of taking a random chance
>slower and more tedious
Yep, you're retarded

>>30346011
>Horde on average took 20-40 minutes.
How did you manage that? Doing a single stat takes about 5 minutes if you don't use stat items like calcium.

>running from mons that you don't want
You realise this shouldn't happen on the correct routes right?

>>30346022
I'll add that you need to know which pokémon calls what.

>>30346022
You're juse lying now
For starters another pokemon showing up isn't guaranteed each turn with SOS battles meaning you'll be wasting other turns.
Secondly in ORAS you can't run into hordes that give you the wrong EVs providing you're on right route. This anon even posted the list >>30345791

Am I being rused right now or have you never tried horde training before?

>>30346043
It's how hordes are set up, I don't know how it managed to take me that long. But I seriously doubt it takes 5 minutes. And people are point out that I've been using the wrong routes, but I no longer want to touch the shit stain that is 6 gen.
But that might turn this thread in to a genwar, and I don't want to derail it.
On a technical point, S.O.S makes more sense to have because Hordes clogged the frame rate to high hell.

>>30346022
>instead of taking a random chance
That's exactly why people don't like SOS battles. Its random chance while hordes were certain

>>30346126
>talking about framerate problems while trying to defend SM bullshit.
lol

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>>30346155
>Emulating SM
>I've had no drop in frames until I use a z-move.
lol

>>30344910
>dream world
>above anything

>>30346126
>But I seriously doubt it takes 5 minutes.
Its the fastest EV training method we've had yet.

>S.O.S makes more sense to have because Hordes clogged the frame rate to high hell.
You say that but because of the additional trainer model the game doesn't perform much better with additional pokemkn on screen in SM especially on an O3DS. Not to mention you have to keep one alive to continue the chain while you can just wipe them all out and move on with hordes.
They really shouldn't have added the trainers in hindsight. We still would have had Triples and Rotations if they didn't do that.

Anyway, there's really no reason why it took you that long you know

oh boy, everybody seems to be sucking XY and ORAS's big gigantic dick now.

>>30346169
Instead you have to put up with frequent crashes and graphical glitches

>>30346195
>oh boy, everybody seems to be sucking SM's big gigantic dick now.
Ftfy.
Can't say anything remotely negative about the new games because they're new!

>>30346195
>>30346235
Oh, fuck off you two, you can like things without being a shill or buzzword of choice.

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>>30346186
I didn't about how slow Hordes were until I started training in SM. It was just "This is how to EV train the fastest."
I have a N3DS, so I don't really care what O3DS users say. And keeping on alive isn't that hard unless it has take down.

I hate beldum so much.
And I kind of agree with trainer models, they just up and leave when any kind of attack is made, there's no point in having them there.

>>30346235

>im being retarded with game mechanics, blame the games

wut.

>>30346258
Not around here. This is 4chan. No matter what your opinion is, it is always wrong and you are always an autistic "faget".

>>30346258
No one said anything about shills.
This thread is more about pointing out he ignorance of players.

>>30346281
>the game has retarded mechanics compared to the last, better blame the player

wut

>>30346299
Fair enough, but no one said anything about the game being new influencing anything.

Lets just bury all the copies of SM in the desert and move on to Generation VIII asap imo.

>>30346269
>I didn't about how slow Hordes were until I started training in SM.
What do you mean here?
Hordes are literally the fastest and most consistent method of EV training to date.
There's no luck or random elements you just kill and move on without waiting like you would in SM.

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>>30346336
That sounds an awful lot like you want to start a genwar.
There's an awful lot of people here who actually like SM. Nobody asked for your opinion buddy.

>>30346379
Why is /vp/ suddenly mature and reasonable this morning?

>>30346329
You say that but there's some cleared bias towards SM for some reason seeing as people are denying the random factor of SOS battles.

Even the people talking about hordes mention that XY isn't the place to do it and that it has some flaws there.

>>30346409
not him, but maybe because those people are doing something right in utilizing SOS battles?

>>30346409
I'd say there is a random chance, but the numbers said here are usually the best/worst cases.
As I type this I'm training a Deino and only two turns have passed with no more ghastlys.

>>30346379
Great idea. Let's do that! I start...

Sun and Moon are not the best Pokémon games of all time.

>>30346364
I found it slow, I can't explain (Well, I can, I was apperntly using the wrong places to train.) but putting a move like EQ or surf or something like that on a mon I want to train took more effort than it's worth.
I want you to take the effort you made into hordes, and put it into S.O.S. Please, any real randomness can be minimized easily. I still find S.O.S being faster.

>>30346459
OMFG UR JUST SAYING THAT JUST TO BE CONTRARIAN

>>30346454
Further report.
I fucking hate Spite.

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>>30346459
>there will never be a pokemon game as good as Pokemon-pinball
Kay, genwar over.
Let's not derail the thread anymore.

Why is it always about how they feel and never about objective facts with females?

^What.

>>30346491
>not the pokemon trading card game
baka

>>30346493
Wot?
>>30346511
Click the number to reply to a post newfriend.

>>30346448
>because those people are doing something right in utilizing SOS battles?
You could be perfect at it but it still won't mitigate the random element of SOS battles. The whole problem is that it's a very inconsistent system.

You might get extremely lucky and get 7 successful calls in a row or be unlucky and get absolutely nothing.
Of course there's the middles ground where you get them every other turn but then you've already spent more time on it than you would have with hordes in ORAS.
Get what I'm trying to say?

>>30346537
>replying to what is probably some convoluted bait.
No thanks mate.

>>30346195
>Admitting that Horde battles are better than SOS is sucking ORAS and XY's dick.

Kek. Here's your (you)

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>>30346491
>Pokemon Pinball
>Not Pokemon Pinball: Ruby and Sapphire

>>30346011
>20-40 mins
How? You used the items and had pokerus right?
Except for the Sandshrew horde it usually took me 2~3 min per stat
>sweet scent
>surf
>repeat until stat is maxed

>>30346583
>playing this on VC now

>>30346195
>big gigantic
kind of redundant

>Add a second orb that guarantees the sos call AND the pokemon spawn
>now we'd have the shiny hunt orb and the EV train orb
Did I fix the SOS system?

At least XYORAS don't have gigantic blue waffles.

>>30346657
You've eliminated the factor that makes it a chore so yes.

>>30346657
Add a Soothing Orb or something for the fuckwads who run around with the slowest available mon on the first slot

>this thread
Personally, i agree that a shitton of stuff that made the main game feel more "organized" (like super training), and late game breeding more qol (hatching eggs) were a lot better in gen 6, particularly XY.

I however, wholeheartedly disagree, that once you are 100% setup, ev training is more tedious in SM.

First off, in main game on gen 6 super training made it easier to get your main game mons to have a proper EV spread. Post game the breeding was significantly improved as well (qol-wise) and also EV training with hordes.

SM does all this better except two things: EV training during main game and a good place to hatch eggs. The breeding in of itself is way faster, and the EV training is also much faster with chains because you only do one encounter per Stat. Theres also the pelago and plaza (treated separately) which makes it much easier to grind EVs as well once you have them maxed out.

SMs biggest sin is not having an egg hatching loop and EV training being made as hard as possible for main game.

>>30344697 >>30344712 >>30344742 >>30345776

I actually Super Trained over 20 pokemon in X and Y. Problem?

>Gamefreak isn't just handing me pre-trained, perfect pokemon from the start
>Worst games ever, why does gamefreak hate me, they want me to cheat REEEEEEEEE

>>30346749
While I agree with you, this doesn't agree against the "randomness factor" people seem to have against the S.O.S system.
Can you make an argument for that?

>>30346749
There is an egg hatching loop theres a small tile behind a hole in a fence directly in front of the egg giving girl that you can get tauros stuck in and run in circles

Its the best egg hatching loop weve ever had because you can watch the girl from it and grab your egg in half a second

>>30342905

Gen 6 also didn't use scaled experience. It may be better for SP but fucking hell it is awful for post game.

>>30346799
Alolasomes are the worst aren't they.

>>30346851
I can't wait until the first idiots start complaining about bricking their own Circle Pads by using that stupid method.

>>30343839

Because the mini games and got tedious to grind. Refresh plus beans are way better then amie and the cakes.

>>30346899
Then have the minigames but have them solely for the whole entertainment stat or whatever the musical note was called. Don't remove them entirely.

>>30346841
Horde battles also had a randomness factor because the horde you needed wasnt guaranteed.

SOS battles have the potential to be faster simply because its only in one encounter. Also when the pokemon is weak its almost annoying how constant the sos pokemon are, i noticed this myself when i tried to catch pokemon during my main game. As long as you avoid shit like sos encounters that can spawn a mon different to the one youre fighting (carbink with sableye for example) its fine, and its what common sense dictates you to do anyway.

The only other thing I can give gen 6 is having the best exp grind in oras. SM is better than XY at this once you get a maxed rare kitchen in festival plaza.

The REAL problem SM had were the post game TMs and move reminder inE4.

>stuck with scald on feraligatr till league unless i keep it as a totodile till level 42
That was the real bs

>>30346749
You're not really making sense here you know and you're failing to adressmthe parts th actually !make SOS chaining worse.

I mean the whole "one encounter" point isn't really valid when you have to sit through something that's just as long as the regular encounter then there's the fact that after that scene there's a chance it'll fail meaning that scene has just was just a waste.

The Pelago is slow in and of itself anyway.

>>30347041
>Horde battles also had a randomness factor because the horde you needed wasnt guaranteed.
No they didn't.
If you went to the correct route you would get 100% encounter rates for the Mon you needed. Of course this only applies to ORAS which many people have already stated.

>SOS battles have the potential to be faster simply because its only in one encounter.
See >>30347064

God typing all of this out on a tablet is getting to be a pain.

>>30347041
But apperently on some routes, hordes are guaranteed. So there's no randomness?
I may agree with you, but please read what people were arguing about in the thread in the first place. Otherwise your post may have just loop the argument back to the start as seen here >>30347064.

>>30347064
As far as ev training goes SOS is the equivalent to horde battles in SM. Pelago and plaza are just plus rewards you get for grinding it.

Now heres the deal.
>SOS battle
>get encounter you need
>false swipe/hold back
>grind the sos which will appear at a really annoying consistent rate
>profit

>horde battle
>get encounter you need
>kill it
>trigger horde again
>hope its encounter you need
>repeat this 5 times

SOS is definetely faster.

>>30346898
It works pretty damn well. The analog stick just needs to be rotated enough for the tauros to keep running.

>>30346195
I bet you also think missing Dexnav is sucking Gen 6's dick as well.

>>30347123
>>30347117
Admittedly i was basing myself of XY, but even so i still think sos is faster simply because you only go through one encounter.

Maybe equal to hordes IN ORAS, assuming the encounter you need doesn't appear the first time, but there are routes/areas that only have a few mons to circumvent this

>>30347127
>>grind the sos which will appear at a really annoying consistent rate
That's the thing, it doesn't appear consistently an its totally down to the RNG whether or not it'll proc and if it'll produce another pokemon.

>hope its encounter you need
There's no hoping necessary if you're training on ORAS. There's a route for each stat that's always 100% .

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>>30346781
No problem, i just feel sorry for you

>>30346749
SM's biggest sin was not having Dexnav desu.

>>30346851
But the Luminose City and Battle Resort Island egg roads literally just required you to hold down one direction input for your character to keep moving.

>>30347176
For reference
http://nuggetbridge.com/blogs/entry/680-ev-training-horde-hotspots-in-pokémon-omega-ruby-alpha-sapphire/

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>People are REALLY overplaying the ONE turn a mon doesn't show up.

>>30347250
>one turn no sos
>second turn sos no mon
>third turn success
The worst part is that these can happen at any point in time during the battle.

>>30346851
>>30347230
Okay forget about what I said, I'd take being able to see if my pokemon's egg is ready over simple egg grinding movement anyday.

>>30344382

It at least makes hidden power less work. I got HP Ice Xuritree easily, I just have to put in the grind to fix its speed.

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>>30347327
>second turn sos no mon
Doesn't happen.
Unless you've got shit luck.

>>30347201
>That's the thing, it doesn't appear consistently an its totally down to the RNG whether or not it'll proc and if it'll produce another pokemon
M8, I dont believe this for one second based of my experience. They appear at way to high a consistent rate.

>>30347402
It really does not and I agree people are overplaying that whole one turn no mon thing.

Its way to common to see sos mons when the mon is at low hp and it makes catching pokemon a pain too

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>>30347402
>Implying luck can be controlled.
>Says it doesn't happen then contradicts himself afterwards by saying unless you have shit luck.

I see you're retarded.

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>>30347529
>Looking too deep into that post
Sounds like you're down on your luck bro.

>>30342690
>Not wanting unique EVs for your storybros to show the battles they've won along the way
>Not crafting your genetically superior kill-machines after you've proven yourself stronger than The Four Heavenly Kings
>Not living long enough to see yourself become the villain

>>30344185
A) you get points for losing Poke Royale
B) why the fuck haven't you finished the game? Breeding and training are Post-game shit.

>>30347230
>SM's biggest sin was not having Dexnav
THIS
IT'S ALL I WANTED BACK AGAIN
WHY GAMEFREAK WHY

>ORAS comes out
>ORAS IS GARBAGE GAME FREAK ARE HACKS
>SM comes out
>SM IS SHIT WHY CAN'T IT BE MORE LIKE ORAS BECAUSE ORAS WAS PERFECT
Do I need to post the General Opinion Simulator again?

Just because some people liked XYORAS more than SM doesn't mean that they liked XYORAS much.

I have a dream that one day even the stupidest underaged autistic faggot /vp/ retard will understand this simple fact.

>>30348037
>doesn't even know how to reply
Hello newfriend
I heard Reddit loves ORAS, no wonder you're defending it

>>30348089
Get back into the bag Nebby. It is dangerous for you out here.

>>30348124
You're right, there's too many newfag retards defending ORAS.

>>30345012
It depends on the kind of pokemon. Some are just more rare.

>>30346454
M8, magnemite are way easier for Special attack.

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127KB, 400x551px

>>30345646
This just may be the stupidest thing I've read today

Comparing SM to ORAS is unfair as GF always intentionally nerfs the start-of-gen game to help sell the mid-gen games.

>>30346126
>But I seriously doubt it takes 5 minutes.
Horde training was fast as fuck if you werent retarded. Yes. You could max out an entire party in 5 minutes

>>30342830
You don't even need to cross breed any more. The two berries exclusive to cross breeding can drop as normal from those berry trees.

>>30349198
Thing is, this is the first gen to remove beneficial battle features.

File: 1478660701644.png (362KB, 522x476px) Image search: [Google]

362KB, 522x476px

>SOS chain Staryu for 7.5 hours
>Alakazam grew from level 26 to 46 whilst doing so
>Used up all 63 leppa berries so couldn't even keep going
>Still no shiny

Fuck that was painful

>>30346462
>but putting a move like EQ or surf or something like that on a mon I want to train took more effort than it's worth.
That's why you lead with a random trashmon or HM slave that has surf. (And use exp share obviously) Again, I used the free latios because you can slap fly and surf on it, and its stronger than anything you will find on a horde.

Failing that, you could use a pelipper or some easy to find trash

>>30347127
>hope its encounter you need
How many times do people have to tell you there are 100% encounters in ORAS? There is no chance involved.

Furthermore, each battle lasts a single turn. Five battles and it's over. If the SOS battles last longer than 5 turns, then they lose to hordes by default

>>30349436
SM SoSs are better than XY hordes. The only way you can say hordes are better than SoSs is with ORAS, but that irrelevant because if SM had hordes they'd be XY quality.

>>30349442
>not having 400 leppa berries
You do have a level 3 pelago, right?