What do you think the stats on these will be? Is Ice/Fairy a

I'm actually curious if alolan forms will even have different stats. If you change its type, appearance, movepool AND stats, then why even call it that same name anymore? It may as well be a completely new pokemon.

It's worse than pure Fairy. STAB Ice Beam isn't worth it.

Not good enough for OU imo, too many common Steel types such as Scizor, Ferrothorn and Heatran exist to resist both of its STAB attacks (unless it can still learn fire moves)

>>29689341
>post yfw they unexpectedly make regular Ninetales Fire/Fairy

No one will end up OU. Their base stats will probably be the exact same as their counterparts just scattered differently

>>29689391
are you actually retarded

if it retains its stats, plus if it gets snow warning as a hidden ability. It's still shit. But it might have some niche with snow warning

>>29689391
They might get the same BST as a common denominator.

Defensively it's pretty bad, SR weakness hinders its longevity, and burrito punch slays it unless you have Tapu Lele, though you're forced out by steel types regardless.
Offensively it's OK, though both its STABs are walled by Steel and Fire types.
Maybe UU

>>29689341
I think it will be a more fragile, offensive variant of regular ninetales. Instead of kanto ninetales' 73-76-75-81-100-100 spread, I have the feeling they would give alolan ninetales a 73-81-75-100-76-100 spread. Speed is on a good mark at 100, and STAB moonblast/ice beam (with maybe coverage thunderbolt?) and 100 SpA is interesting.

I'm also counting on it getting snow warning as HA to parallel ninetales' drought, which would mean perfectly accurate STAB blizzard.

Dunno how good the typing is. If it is this fragile it won't take a single hit and any bullet punch user destroys it, but its team should be able to help it with that.

I personally think it'll be UU, but who knows.

>>29689487
Maybe they could still know fire moves. If not you always got hidden power to fall back on

>>29689341
> stats?
Don't know. They might stay the same. All we can hope for is it dumps some of that useless Attack in favor of more speed, sp atk, or bulk.
> Ice Fairy?
It's okay. Ice is garbage, but fairy kinda counter acts that. It's no longer weak to fairy type.
Will it be OU with decent HA?
Probably not. It would have to have a busted hidden ability for that to happen. Snow warning or misty surge seem likely, and neither would make to big of a splash.

>>29689552
>No longer weak to fairy type
I'm trying to wrap my head around what you were trying to say here. Could you explain?

>>29689341
>pichu used iron tail

>>29689501
Didn't think of 100% blizzard if it got snow warning. Pretty impressive :)

>>29689341
>Is it a good typing?
>Machop used bullet punch
:^)

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>>29689611
>It's another ''Shitmon wins to a very powerful mon because ''MUH 4X WEAK'' logic'' Episode

>>29689462
Nope. Care to explain why you think I am?

>>29689471
it would be better off wishing for something like magic guard. this snow warning meme is just for shitters.

>>29689656
>very powerful

Base 100 speed might be decent but with all the speed creep going on I fucking doubt it.

We will never have a good offensive Ice type that isn't Weavile.

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>>29689697
>Pichu
>Winning to Ninetales

>>29689341
If shift some points around, it will hopefully have a troll speed of 101-107

>>29689434
>b-but what if the OU meta changes ?
i know those beasts are probably not going to move to NU but maybe there will be some serious threats to them
i'm thinking the priority-cancellers, mainly
But yeah still UU imo

>>29689733
I didn't say anything about Pichu.

Thinking Alola Ninetales will be "very powerful" is just wishful thinking, don't you think?

>>29689608
i think she meant fighting type

>>29689656
another newfriend

>>29689733
252+ Atk Pichu Iron Tail vs. 0 HP / 0 Def (Ice/Fairy) Ninetales: 304-360 (105.9 - 125.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

>>29689697
Implying Rocky Helmet Pichu isn't on the Uber banlist

>>29689656
I like ninetales too, but i know it´ll be forever a shitmon.

>>29689656
But BP is an actual threat, (you)

>>29689341
>Is Ice/Fairy a good typing?
>Klink used Shift Gear!
You tell me.

>>29689778
yeah and who is faster you fucking moron? do you think ninetales can't ohko Pichu?
>inb4 focus sash
ninetales can carry it too

>>29689820
>Ninetales used Ice Beam!
>Pichu hung onto its Focus Sash!
>Pichu used Iron Tail!
>It's super effective!
>Ninetales hung on its Focus Sash!
>Pichu used Quick Attack!

>>29689853
ninetales knows quick attack too

>>29689341
Technician as HA would be broken as fuck.
>bosted Frost Breath
>boosted Draining Kiss
>boosted Hidden Power of any type
>potential for carry over fire attacks from breeding

>>29689853
alolan ninetales knows ice shard. gg.

>>29689879
Who would run Quick Attack on a Ninetales?

Wait, iron tail is actually strong I thought it was 40 BP or something

>>29689341
75/120/70/50/70/120
Learns, fake out, ice shard, sucker punch and a fairy type priority attack.
HA technician

>>29689341
It's offensively broken.

>>29689917
Who would run Focus Sash Iron Tail Pichu?

>>29689955
There's not much you can do with Pichu anyway. Seems likely enough.

Ninetales with physical moves, not so much.

>>29689950
Not really. They overlap too much offensively (SE effective against Dragon, resisted by Fire and Steel) for it to be in the ranks of Fighting/Ghost, Ice/Ground, etc.

>>29689391
> why even call it that same name anymore

because the entire point of this Pokemon is shameless nostalgia pandering.

>>29689434
If this thing can get Fire Blast to btfo Scizor and Ferrothorn, it might be able to do decent.

>>29689950
When a Ferrothorn or a Forretres can OHKO it with a gyro ball, then something is wrong with it.

>>29689484
Most likely this

>>29689391
>>29689462

Volbeat/Illumise and Plusle/Minun support the first anon. If stats also change, then Alolan forms are far more distinct from their originals than those pokemon, sharing only name. I would argue that even without a stat change, they're already more distinct than those above.

Functionally, Alolan pokemon ARE new pokemon. The experience of raising them varies drastically, as will the meta surrounding them. Insisting that they're the same is allowing yourself to get hung up on semantics.

>>29690032
>If this thing can get Fire Blast to btfo Scizor and Ferrothorn, it might be able to do decent.
252 SpA A-Ninetales Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn: 268-316 (76.1 - 89.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 Atk Ferrothorn Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def A-Ninetales: 780-916 (271.7 - 319.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

>>29690032
>44 Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def A-Ninetales: 484-576 (168.6 - 200.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
>44 Atk Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Ninetales: 432-508 (150.5 - 177%) -- guaranteed OHKO

>>29689341
>And will it be enough to be OU if it gets a decent hidden ability?
At this point this is what I am most interested in if the Alolan forms keep their HA's or even get brand new HA's.

Because to hell with GF if they really take away my Harvest Alola Exeggutor in exchange for fucking Frisk.

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>>29689435

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>>29689391
My theory is yes because of pic related.

>>29690063
Don't get me wrong, I'm not insisting they be exactly the same, I'm only questioning why they should still be considered of that species if they're completely different. I have no stake in it either way. If the point of these alolan forms is that they are old pokemon with a fresh coat of paint, wouldn't it make sense for at least one aspect of them to be the same? I suppose you coupd consider their name to be that thing, but that seems a little weak to me. I like what another anon said about giving them the same BSTs with some tweaking to adjust their role and better accomodate their new type.

>>29690589
Nice find anon. That's more than enough to convince me.

>>29689937
Yeah. It really does look like a powerful physical attacker doesn't it anon.

>sarcasm.

>>29689341
OU Suicide Lead:
Ninetails@Focus Sash/Light Clay
Snow Warning
252Sp-Atk, 252+ Spe
Aurora Veil
Blizzard
Psyshock
Memento

>>29690731
Yah so does Snorlax.

>>29690777
I'm assuming Timid, too. I would like it if it got those moves (and Snow Warning is almost a given since its regular HA is Drought)

>>29690811
i think aurora veil is almost made for alolan ninetales, i think her, primarina and the water tapu will have access to it.

>>29691156
>not aurorus the literal walking aurora

>>29691156
>names mons with potential access to Aurora Veil
>Aurorus isn't mentioned.
>two Water Fairies are.

>>29689801
>having a 4x weakness makes it bad

I guess most Dragons are bad, then? spoilers they aren't fucking moron

>>29691194
>>29691261
well aurora veil is a fairy type isnt it? also is aurorus name even related to aurora in japanese? in geman it is based on some dinosaur and i think the japanese is almost the same

>>29691410
it doesn't matter what aurorus' name is in japan, they still based it on an aurora with the sails on its neck. the fact i'm having to say this makes me think you're beyond help.

>>29689611
>faggot used shitpost

>>29690664
Their designs and flavor are still similar to the point that if they were new Pokemon, people would call bullshit.

>>29689656
Then how about "Pichu used [Steel type Z-Move]" instead ?

No it's going to be slower than normal Ninetales because gamefreak fucking love making slow ice pokemon.

I hope you like base 75 speed

>>29689391
I'd be so fucking pissed if they didn't
>another special defense fairy with less redeeming qualities than vanilla Ninetales

>>29692128
>Pichu used [Steel type Z-Move]
Do you even understand how Z-Moves work?
Pokemon can only use Z-Moves of their respective typing

>>29692110
Fair point

>>29690664
>completely different
>quadrupedal fox creature with nine tails
>quadrupedal fox creature with nine tails

How much more similar do they have to be?

>>29692284
No?
You only need a move of the same type.

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>>29689341

well why don't you judge it yourself....pic related

>>29692284
Wrong.

>>29689950
>Offensively broken
>both walled by two different types

>>29692284
An Alolan Exeggcutor used the Normal Z move in a trailer

>>29689676
Serene grace ice beam and moonblast could give it a niche.

>>29689341
No it's not a good typing, you know how common steel types are? Ferrothorn, Bisharp, Excadrill, etc.

Same goes for coldsteel the hedgehog, fire types are also one of the most commonly played types.

>>29692284
Do YOU even understand how Z-Moves work?

>>29689712
Now watch almost every fully evolved mon this gen have below 90 speed.

>>29689341
It needs to worry about

Heatran, Scizor, Bisharp, Ferrothorn, Excadrill, Magnezone, Jirachi, M-Metagross in OU. There is no chance in hell it'll ever be OU.

Nor will it be UU because of Aggron, regular Metagross, Lucario, Empoleon, and Doublade.

BL2 you have Steelix & Durant.

RU you have Registeel, Magneton, Bronzong, and Escalvalier.

NU you have Klingklang, Steelix, and regular Aggron.

I won't even list the Fire & Poison types

Point is, it's lucky that PU even exists, since that's where it will be, guaranteed.

>>29692852
Sad that all those Pokemon OHKO A-Ninetales easily

>>29689712
>what is Mamoswine

Will A-Ninetails learn any fire moves? I'm wondering if a regular Vulpix that's banked in will evolve into Alolan Ninetails and thats how you get a combination of the two movesets

>>29693006
No, that's not how it works.

>>29689955
Verlisifag.

>>29691295
Most Dragons have 550+ BSTs, and Dragonite has Multiscale.

Not that your point is invalid, 4x weaknesses don't always break a pokemon unless it's Rock

>>29689611
Pichu's attack missed!

>>29693185
>implying Ninetales is strong enough to do anything about it missing

>>29689664
Not them, but Pokemon are not just stat blocks. The model/sprite/design of the Pokemon is obviously part of it.
Alolan forms are clearly derivative in design.
Ignoring that is pretty retarded.

Ice/Fairy is going to end up in PU due to its shitty defensive typing and its inability to hit through Steels.

Still, I'm glad that we're getting an Ice/Fairy for Sun and Moon. Pure Ice and Pure Fairy Pokémon have been done many times over and are frankly boring at this point.

>>29692320
>Design is the only thing that matters when determining the differences between 2 pokemon. Type, moveset, abilities, and stats are all unimportant.

>>29693239
Not him, but there are plenty of pokemon that are different species but have similar designs. The electric rodents, especially Plusle, Minun, and Pichu; Volbeat and Illumise; the Nidorans and their evos, etc. Similarity in design doesn't mean it has to be the same pokemon.

>>29693841
The differences between the two forms are hardly on that same level, do you think every dog breed is its own species too?

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>>29693165
>unless it's Rock
Not if you are brave enough