Where the fuck is she, bros.............

She's not canon

>>29560082
exdeath's favorite place
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5O3exiRpAw

she is actually red gone travestite

She isn't real. How does it feel to like a character who isn't even real in a fictional world?

>>29560082
literally my mom's r63'd red

>>29560082
In the trash. Where she always belonged.
Oh, and in PokeSpe manga. A level below even trash.

>>29560082
in 2004 where she belongs

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>>29560082

>>29561486

Yeah she is; if it had the possibility of happening, it's canon. Learn what the word means

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posting bester design

>>29560082
In noncanon hell, together with all the other female protagonists.
She is the queen of all noncanon pokemon characters, if it serves as any consolation prize.
Hahahah.

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>>29563366
Posting fixed version.
Please, don't add noncanon characters to the picture.

>>29563383
>>29563366

Why is Blue shorter?

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>>29560082
In kanto making the dinner

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>>29563366
>that skirt showing off her leg

muh dik

>>29563399
Manlet dom on Taller sub

>>29563456
>muh dik

Sauce?

>>29560082
Not canon.

>>29563233
That isn't true in the fucking slightest you mong.

>>29562470
id love that

>>29563456
im gonna need some sauce anon.

>>29563479

Uh no, it is correct that Leaf is canon. Or rather it's more accurate to say the possibility of her is canon.

"Canon" = "That which is in the source text"

The source text being the games in this instance. What is canon is that *either* Red or Leaf was the protagonist of FRLG, without preference given. It is canon that Red is the protagonist of RBY and Origins. But that doesn't mean Leaf doesn't exist in the context of FRLG or that she somehow doesn't count. She is, by definition, canon.

Of course in the literary classical sense, canon means something different, namely the body of an author's collected works.

Spend more time paying attention in class please.

>>29563456
Dick pic pls

>>29560082
Who is that girl?

>>29563633
All the mental gymnastics behind this post are amazing.
Here is the thing: Red and Blue are in the game, while Leaf isn't. Why? Because:
1.GF doesn't care about her.
2.Red and Blue are more interesting and more loved by fans
3.She isn't canon, Red is canon. Just like all other female protagonists.

Accept it already, Leafcuck.

>>29563633
>it is correct that Leaf is canon.
No. She doesn't even have a fucking name. She has never appeared in any of the games, or represented in any official media like Origins or Generations.

Her only presence in the games at all is when you play as her in FR/LG, which is explicitly non-canon, because Red is the canon protagonists. This has never ever been portrayed differently, and never will.

>>29563633
>But that doesn't mean Leaf doesn't exist in the context of FRLG
She literally doesn't. And it's not often I use that word, but seeing as I get to use it accurately here, I am going to restate this so you understand. She literally. Doesn't.

Literally.

>>29563471
>>29563579
Artist is Gerph

>>29563827
i'm pretty sure they wanted you to post ur dick anon

>>29561486
>play as her in FRLG
>catch a Pokemon as her
>transfer it all the way up into Pokebank
>use it in SM against Red and Blue

How can she not be canon if her Pokemon can be?

>>29563827
Was asking for dick pics

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>>29563673
Points 1 and 2 are valid but none of that means that she isn't canon. It was explained already in >>29563633 that what is canon is not Leaf herself but rather the "potential to have been either Red or Leaf".

>>29563682
None of that means she's not canon. Learn what the word means. The possibility of being chosen as the player character is what counts as canon. Her name isn't a factor in this argument by the way. Origins and Generations are also canon, yes, but much like FRLG itself, only in terms of their own framework. The word canon doesn't mean "author's favorite", it means what was shown in the source text. And what is shown for FRLG is that either Red or Leaf was the protagonist.

>>29563735
As was already explained, what is canon is the possibility of her existence rather than an absolute one way or the other. It is seemingly canon at this point that Red is the one that makes it to Alola though, I will cede that to anyone who attempts to use it as some kind of point.

Y'all need to stop thinking in such black and white terms, canon = what might have been as well as what definitely was.

For another example, there are lots of games with branched/multiple endings. One ending is not canon over another - they are all canon because canon means "what was in the source text".

>>29564067
Claiming to have some high ground by flaunting your "textbook definition" isn't going to make her any more Canon.

She doesn't canonically exist in the Pokémon universe, period.

>wh-why wont you just learn what the word means?! ;-;
>i-im smarter than youuuu!

>>29564067
>It is seemingly canon at this point that Red is the one that makes it to Alola though
How are you so fucking dense?

"Leaf" is literally a genderswap. Her mother when you play as her, is Red's mother. Her house is where Red's house is. She goes on the same journey he would, ect, ect, ect.

Except none of that happened. Red's mother gave birth to a son, as seen in;

>HG/SS
>B2/W2
>S/M
>Both Origins and Generations, the game accurate adaptations.

Saying "It is seemingly canon at this point that Red is the one that makes it to Alola" might just be the stupidest fucking thing I have read in a while. How the fuck did you write that and not realize how retarded it sounds? Makes no fucking sense.

>>29560082
Still trying to get a perfect IV Softboiled Clefable to transfer to Gen VII.

>>29564139
Just get one with the nature you want and use bottle caps for the IV

>>29563366
Which one of you will fix this disgusting background

>>29564441
>Take png
>Take screenshot of it instead of saving it

Fucking tumblr

>>29564513
Google image search doesnt give any other versions

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>>29560082
In another universe, my dude

Leaf more than any other female protagonist is closest to a rule 63 version of Red. Her presence just feels bizarre around Red outside of Pokespe where they look reasonably different from one another.

>>29560082
Blue and Red are a gay couple on vacation, so there is no need for her.

>has official art and name
>is not canon
People sure are retard here. If it was produced and accepted by an official source, it is canon. Just because you can't find it in the games, it doesn't it is not canon, or do you think that exegguctor with long neck only became canon after its reveal in SM?

>>29563366
>bester
MODS

>>29566642
It doesn't even need to be produced, if Nintendo says that Pokemon Uranium is canon, it is, and there is nothing the fans can do about it.

>>29566642
You literally just described how something becomes canon.

>>29566689
Exeggutor with long necks existed since its appearance on the box of the Jungle set in pokemon tcg. And not a single official pokemon source said that it was wrong, so it existed, but until now, not a single official pokemon source decided to use it.

>>29563873
Seems like you don't know how the word canon works.

>>29560082
Not canon

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>>29566666
nice post, satan

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New Leaf pic from Pixiv, boys

>>29566843
thicc

>>29566843
Will meme magic make her appear in the game? It worked with Harambe.

Dead. People thought Red was but actually she is.

>>29566843
Why does red look autistic?

>>29567002
Because he is. Why else do you think he never speaks?

>>29563233
I bet you think the female protag in persona was canon too.

>>29563633
>What is canon is that *either* Red or Leaf was the protagonist of FRLG, without preference given.
Except, you know, those very real and very existent sequels. That confirm Red is the canon protag and show nothing of Leaf, not even a passing mention.

>>29566843
>different artist
>same Leaf

So this is now the unofficial older Leaf, huh?

>>29567865
>implying FRLG takes place in the same universe as SM

>>29566642
She just exists as an avatar for female players or people who want to play as a female in general.That's why she has an official art and name. The canon Trainer from kanto games is Red, that's why you fight him on Mt Silver even if you picked the female chara.

>>29564067
>The possibility of being chosen as the player character is what counts as canon.
Yeah no, there are hundreds of games that feature playable characters where their appearance is non-canon.
To list some
The other characters in Viewtiful Joe.
The female protagonist in Persona 2.
Evil Ryu in Street Fighter

>>29566642
>name
Thanks go agreeing that she's non canon because she literally doesn't have a official name.

>>29567887
>what is GSC
>what is HGSS

>>29567887
It takes place in the same universe as HGSS though.

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>>29567869
yes.
here's another albeit slightly tumblrized Leaf.

>>29567951
Plus the only distinction between the two universes is mega evolution and infinity energy. Everything else is the same.

>>29567955
>tumblrized
That shows. Jeez.

>>29567920
Point exaclty where did I ever say that she is the canon main character of RGB. You can't, because I didn't.

>>29567937
Just checked, and she doesn't have an official name, but it doesn't mean she isn't canon.

>>29568012
>but it doesn't mean she isn't canon.
Except for the fact that she simply doesn't exist in any other games. In fact her existence would create a hell of a lot of discrepancies.

Face it she's just meant as a female counterpart for Red in FRLG. Nothing more, nothing less.

Also in your other conversation, you seem to be forgetting HGSS exists.

>>29567972
And the fact that ORAS took place way after RBY/FRLG, unlike the "original" universe where they occur at the same time.

>>29568012
>Point exaclty where did I ever say that she is the canon main character of RGB. You can't, because I didn't.
Not him but in order to be canon at all she would have to be the one on top of Mt. Silver as we takes Red's place in its entirety. Seeing as she isn't depicted I'm HGSS, which was made after her creation, in any form or fashion it's safe to say that she isn't canon.
And unlike the other female counterparts she doesn't appear throughout FRLG when you choose Red either. Hell there isn't even a house for her unless you want to suggest she lives in the street.

>>29568102
Uh anon?
They occur at the same time as the events in FRLG too.
Its a divergent timeline, not a legitimate alternate universe.

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>>29563366
You know nothing fool

POSTING THE TRUE HIGH QUALITY ONE

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>>29568012
>Point exaclty where did I ever say that she is the canon main character of RGB. You can't, because I didn't.

The thing is, she appeared first as a playable character in pokemon FR/LG If she was canon she should have been presented as the main character of the kanto games. So if someone says she is canon that is exactly what they imply. Unlike Red and Blue she doesn't appear in other games and doesn't even have a house. She is just the female protag of the gen 1 remake get over it it isn't a big deal anyway.

>>29568216
Literally fucking using May's pose in a blatant ripoff.

The face isn't even remotely the same anymore, fuck off this is terrible.

>>29568076
>discrepancies
This is why retcons exists, if an official source finds a discrepancy that they thing that should be changed, they retcon it, but Leaf isn't retconned. A lot of shit causes discrepancies AND is canon in many franchises.

>She is just a counterpart for Red
I never said otherwise. She is also the counterpart of Blue in the manga, but it doesn't mean she isn't canon because she have counterparts.

>>29568150
>she doesn't appear in HGSS, which means she isn't canon
A lot of shit isn't in HGSS, it doesn't mean they are not canon, unless an official source said "If Leaf isn't in HGSS, she is not canon", she not appearing in HGSS means nothing.


I'm not saying that she needs to be in the game because she is canon, even because a lot of shit is canon and is not in the game. Official sources recognizes Leaf as an existing character and that is all to being canon or not.

N O T C A N O N
O
T

C
A
N
O
N

>>29568241
>So if someone says she is canon that is exactly what they imply
So you are making up your own definition of canon? If something exists by an official source, it is canon, and according to official sources, she is a character that exists, even though she doesn't appear in any game unless you choose her as a main character.

And as I said before, I don't care if she appears or not, but saying that she isn't canon is dumb.

>>29568257
>>29568324
This is not what canon means, Ash-Greninja wasn't canon until he appeared in the game.

>>29568385
Canon is literally official. Ash-Greninja was canon before appearing in the game.

>>29568257
>A lot of shit isn't in HGSS, it doesn't mean they are not canon, unless an official source said "If Leaf isn't in HGSS, she is not canon", she not appearing in HGSS means nothing.
I pose this question to you then.
Is there an official source saying she is?
Is there a set of events for her character?
Is there anything for her?

There's no inkling of her canonicity in the games or officially anon. She's just a gender swapped Red for the female audience.

>>29568424
>Canon is literally official.
That's not what canon means. There are many instances of official materials being non canon.

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here's a fixed version of it from another thread

>>29568102
According to what? Wally? He's just a manlet with a disease

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>>29560082
>A fucking Leaf

>>29568424
Canon is not the same thing as official, you pedantic retard. You're making up a false definition of the word.

>>29568427
You can choose her as your playable character, she is official. If you try to make money with Leaf art, Nintendo can sue your ass, because it is an official Pokemon character.

>>29568448
>That's not what canon means
It literally is.

>>29568448
>>29568509
>Canon doesn't mean official
underages spotted.

>>29568561
Yeah and every spinoff like mistery dungeon/colosseum is canon too you fucking retard?

>>29568520
>It literally is.
No it's fucking not, you gibbering autist. Regardless of the choices you make in FRLG, Red appears with a fixed team in HGSS. Red's unchanging team is canon. It is static media. If you played through FRLG, released your starter, and became champ with Beedrill and Butterfree, it doesn't fucking matter because it has no bearing on the subsequent games. Red in HGSS will not have Beedrill and Butterfree, so your optional decisions in FRLG are not canon. Choosing between Red and Leaf is an optional decision.

The story of Kanto is set in stone. You have options when you play it, but your decisions don't matter.

>>29568583
You need to be over 18 to post here, kid.

>>29568607
>I have no argument so I will just call him underage
ok last (you)

>>29568632
All spinoffs are canon. they are official pokemon games, and part of the pokemon universe. Reburst is canon, liking it or not.

>>29563366
>bester
kek'd

>>29568605
>only static media is considered canon
Leaf will always be there as an option no matter what you do. Even if somehow Charmander, Squirlte or Bulbasaur would suddenly disappear if you chose the other, they would still be canon, even if never ever mentioned again aside from that early game choice.

>ITT
"Canon is only what I think it is", this is called headcanon kids, you are just making up your own. Every single site is going to tell you that the definition of canon is "Official, original, genuine".

John Gamefreak here.
Leaf is totally canon and will be in the game. Stop making these threads.

>>29568520
>>29568561
Canon by definition is the series of events that is accepted as the main or genuine route of the story. It doesn't matter if it's an official work or not. If they creators don't consider it canon or acknowledge the existence of the character then the material is not canon.

Unless you consider something like Dragonball GT canon. After all Toriyama did do some work on it and its an official Toei work.

Why it's so hard to understand that everything that is on games is canon? How the fuck Leaf isn't canon?

>>29568738
>Why it's so hard to understand that everything that is on games is canon?
Because not everything is canon.
>How the fuck Leaf isn't canon?
The real question is how she is canon if she only exists as fem Red. Red being the one who was the official protagonist of Kanto.

>start new game of FRLG
>pick Red
>save in my room, never leave, never get a Pokemon
Red isn't a Pokemon trainer, it's canon because I had the option to choose this. And because it's canon, everything that contradicts it is non-canon :^)

>>29568727
If Toriyama says that GT is canon, what are you going to do about it? Canon is not what the fans thinks that is right or wrong.

Also,
>Canon by definition is the series of events that is accepted as the main or genuine route of the story
Source: your ass.

>>29568762
>Because not everything is canon.
Wrong, it's on game? So yes, IT'S CANON.

>>29568762
>How she is canon if she only exists
You answered your own question, having its existence recongnized by official sources is all it takes for something to be canon or not.

>>29568696
of course all starters are canon, we just dont know the fate of the one not chosen, maybe another trainer picked it, maybe its one of red's current fully evolved starters, but the existance itself is canon, now when the opposite gender character dosnt appear in the game at all then it just becomes a genderswap version of the other one, and it doesnt exist
>leaf
doesn't exist
>kris
HAHAHAHAHAHA
>lyra
second rival
>may
rival
>dawn
second rival
>hilda
unkown origin trainer that helps you at the battle subway
>rosa
same as hilda
>serena
rival

>>29568821
>If Toriyama says that GT is canon, what are you going to do about it?
Anon, GT isn't canon. That's the point.

>>29568864
And how the fuck would I know? If Toriyama says that GT isn't canon, then it isn't. It's as simple as that.

>>29568836
>Wrong, it's on game? So yes, IT'S CANON.
There's several things in the games that aren't canon. I'll move to my computer and list a few.

>>29568879
>And how the fuck would I know?
For one Toriyama has actually said that it and the movies aren't. Then there's the fact that Super has already changed so much that GT can't happen.

>>29568879
ok now you're just baiting

>>29560082
Only GF knows.

>>29568883
What does canon means to you? Holy shit.

>>29568727
GT is canon, deal with it.

>>29568891
>>29568899
I don't follow DBZ series, so I have no idea what Toriyama said is canon or not, and I 'm not going to google every single thing Toriyama said, to see if something is currently canon or not.

>GT can't happen
Unless Toriyama retcons it, it still is canon even if completely contradicts everything that ever happened.

>>29568926
GT was never canon. And that's a literal confirmed statement.

>>29568935
>Unless Toriyama retcons it, it still is canon even if completely contradicts everything that ever happened.
Funny you would mention that because he's already retconned a hell of a lot of elements that made it into GT. One of the big ones being Kibitokai and the fact he doesn't exist any more.

>>29568860
>we just dont know the fate of the one not chosen
Just like Leaf, we just don't know the fate of Leaf. Gender doesn't decide if something is canon or not.

>>29568952
So my first point was right. If Toriyama says that GT is canon, you wouldn't be able to do nothing about it, it would be canon.

>>29569018
*As opposed to the fans not liking it.

>>29568952
Now you are trolling

>>29569018
>So my first point was right.
Not really because it depends on GT being up in the air. It has been confirmed non canon.
With that said even if he hadn't said anything there would still be elements that make it non canon. Such as the entire Baby arc and the Black Star Dragonballs as the latter's race only existed in the Plan to Eradicate the Saiyans OVA and the Black Star Dragonballs were never detected on the Dragon Radar at all during Dragonball despite the fact that they could be picked up by the regular Dragon Radar.

For the last time. Canon isn't just as simple as it being official.

>>29569004
it is when she didn't exist in the first place and was added as a genderswap in a remake

>>29569033
Not him but Tori strictly considers it a side story. As in it's not canon.

>>29569018
yea

>>29569101
Remakes are side stories, so they aren't canon?

>>29569065
no such thing as unofficial canon, that'd be headcanon

>>29569065
>Canon
> 2.1 The works of a particular author or artist that are recognized as genuine.

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/canon

>>29569065
>For the last time. Canon isn't just as simple as it being official.
Wrong as wrong gets

>>29568465
can someone add a bulge to leaf amd breasts to red
blue is fine as it is since he is asexual

>>29569238
go back to tumblr

>>29569118
Who told you remakes are side stories? They're literally remakes of the main story which makes them canon.

>>29569126
And essentially GT was the headcanon from the writers at Toei. Tori just did a few character designs and left.

>>29569136
There is such a thing as context. As in is it the genuine continuation or are they a genuine character.
As it stands GT is not the genuine continuation of Z.

Same goes for Leaf, she isn't a genuine protagonist as she has no place in the continuity. Unless you want to suggest that after Red left town his mother adopted a girl and every NPC repeated the exact same series of events when she went on her adventure.

>>29569679
>headcanon from the writers at Toei
If Toriyama recognizes that, it is canon.

>>29563633
Thing is, all sequel games have worked with the canon that Red was the protaganist.

While she is canon, SM isn't in that timeline.

>>29568908
Canon is the true, confirmed route that doesn't present any contradictions or discrepancies in the story or lore.

For example Leaf isn't canon because that position is filled by Red according to GSC/HGSS and SM. If she was it would make every other game that references or shows Red non canon as Red wouldn't be the canon protagonist.

If everything were official then nothing could be canon in the slightest because it would all clash.
To name a few
>The Red and Blue orbs being in Johto despite the fact that they're never meant to leave Pyre and they're guarded
>The Jade orb's existence
And any other item where only one exists but they were given to the protagonist during the story for that matter like the DNA Splicers.
>encountering and/or catching any legendaries outside of the ones native to the region that are encountered during the story
Although in ORAS it can happen because of Hoopa but that's all up in the air.

>>29570078
>Canon is
Nice headcanon of what is canon you have there.

>>29569920
>If Toriyama recognizes that, it is canon.
Despite the fact he's gone out of the way to show it isn't canon with his later works and said it's a side story that doesn't affect the main story.

You should really learn what canon means.
When it comes to fiction like Pokemon and Dragonball only the material that's an official part of the main story is canon. In other words they can be official creations but if they don't fit in with the main story they aren't canon.
This isn't rocket science.

>>29560082

Getting her anus gaped by Venusaur.

>>29570192
>This isn't rocket science.
You tell me, since you have your own headcanon of what is canon or not.

>>29570220
I am telling you.
You just won't accept the truth that this is the accepted definition of canon.

>>29560082
No one gives a shit about her, it's all about the colors couple. Deal

>>29563399
i wondered the same thing. In game Blue is a little taller, almost the same height..But Red is noticeably taller in the artwork.

>>29570246
>accepted definition of canon
[citation needed]

>>29570276
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Canon+fiction

There aren't honestly people who think that she's a real protagonist right?

>>29566442
This. Third wheeling is the worst

>>29570306
>It has subsequently been applied to many media franchises. Among these (...)some of which may contradict or appear to contradict each other
Contradicting itself doesn't make something not canon. Also, it says right there that a lot of franchises do alternate universes to explain contradictions like spin-offs and such, and pokemon does that too, with ORAS explicitly telling you that.

>However, certain ideas may become influential or widely accepted within fan communities, who refer to such ideas as "fanon"
What you have there is fanon, something that is widely accepted as true by the fans even though it has no official source.

I think you should read what canon actually means.

>>29570664
It even says about stuff like official media not being canonical, like Star Wars, when Disney retconned a lot of shit to an alternate "continuity" called Legends.

>>29570664
>literally just looking at the unlocked wikipedia article
>the same article that says that official works aren't necessarily canon or can drop out of the canon
You can't make this shit up kids

You literally just skipped a chunk of the article saying that official works aren't always canon and picked out lines that don't even apply to the argument you're currently in like the fanon shit.
What the fuck does that have to do with anything?

>What you have there is fanon, something that is widely accepted as true by the fans even though it has no official source.
The irony, you're saying he's going by fanon and yet you're the only who's using their headcanon and misinformation to argue.
Hell, GT was already discredited as a side story in a separate continuity by Tori fucking years ago.
Leaf was non canon from the time she was introduced because of GSC making Red the one and only canon protagonist from Pallet Town and there's been no statements from the creator or other wise that she's anything more than a genderswapped Red.

Stop going by your retarded headcanon you jackass and use some common sense.

My god if Leafcucks can cause a this uproar over their waifu not being the canon protagonist Gamefreak better not address the gen 3 4 and 5 protagonists.

>>29570664
>>It has subsequently been applied to many media franchises. Among these (...)some of which may contradict or appear to contradict each other
You skipped a bit
> in which many stories have been told in different media, some of which may contradict or appear to contradict each other.
>in different media
This is important as it implies that official works aren't always canon which was one of your earlier points that everything official is canon to the main story of the games.

And then it goes on to say that different media or versions are sometimes either delegated to it's own canon or continuity here.
>When there are multiple "official" works or original media, the question of what is and what is not canonical can be unclear. This is resolved either by explicitly excluding certain media from the status of canon, by assigning different levels of canonicity to different media, by considering different but licensed media treatments official and equally canonical to the series timeline within their own continuities universe, but not across them, or not resolved at all.

In other words they're canon but only relative to their own story outside of that they don't exist. A lot like Leaf, picking her as the protagonist makes her the "canon" protagonist for that story and only that story. In the continuity of Pokemon as a whole she doesn't exist and is non-canon.
At least for the time being, if she's ever incorporated into the main story then she'll be canon to that universe, sort of. In order to incorporate her into the main universe they would have to rewrite her whole character and give her a completely separate history to the Leaf you played as in FRLG. So she would be Leaf but not your Leaf similar to how Gwen Stacy in Marvel's 616 is and isn't Spider Gwen. Same look, different histories.

Next time you try to educate someone on canon make sure your're correct before you make a fool of yourself.

>>29571178
The problem Leafcucks have is that she doesn't exist, at all.
With the other protags it doesn't matter because they have a role and exist canonically as either the protag, rival or one time character.

>>29570957
>>29571186
First off, I never said that GT was canon or not.

>official works aren't always canon
It says on the book wikipedia is mentioning about how something official can become non-canon, it is not something like a contradiction that is going to make something official into non-canon. And it is not the fans that are going to change something canon into non-canon.

Fans doesn't choose what is or what is not canon, it is up to the franchise to decide that, otherwise, it is considered "fanon", or something that is not official, but widely accepted by the fans. It is up to the franchise to decide if a spin-off is considered canon or not, and if it is, in what continuity or universe it belongs to.

Reburst, pokespe, ashnime, and main games are all canon, but each of them part of their own canon. And the main games in even made of multiple universes, as told by Delta Episode in ORAS. Differently from more adult franchises like StarTrek, Nintendo doesn't really care if multiple canons contradict with each other, so afaik, the only stuff that they retconned are stuff like the presence of real life animals in the pokemon world.

Actually Hoopa proves that pokemon is all just multiple universes with its dimensional rings, which it can bring pokemons from different universes.

>>29571354
Pokemon has multiple places where it shows that they are all in different universes and they sometimes overlap, and that there are pokemon that can bring stuff from one universe into another like Hoopa you mentioned. But in Delta Episode, one of the professors said how you can dimension shift with the teleporting pad technology, so humans are able to change between dimensions even in universes that doesn't have Hoopa.

>>29571186
>Spider Gwen
DC and Marvel are famous for their amount of canon universes, almost every single movie/comic/graphic novel/game is its own universe, with its own versions of the same characters. Or are you going to tell me that exists only 1 canonical Batman? There are even multiple series that overlap and bring together counterparts of multiple universes.

The fact that you choose between Red or Leaf shows that she is a canon character of that world, but not the one you choose to play, what happens to the one that you didn't pick is never addressed anymore unlike the pokemon starters, so only GF(and not us, fans) can say what happens to Leaf when Red is the Champion of Kanto.

she1s the new champion

She may not be the canon protagonist of Kanto, but she definitely exists somewhere.

Her Pokemon can be transferred into Gen 7, still retaining her OT. She can be encountered in Emerald through linking, and we know Emerald exists as an alternate universe/timeline thanks to Zinnia and ORAS.

As a trainer, she's in Colleseum and XD, which are compatible with the Gen 3 games.

Just because she isn't able to be encountered in your storyline like Lyra/May/Dawn/Hilda/Rosa/Serena can doesn't mean she doesn't exist. Never saw a Drampa while playing HGSS but that doesn't mean none exist in the canon.

>>29571354
>Fans doesn't choose what is or what is not canon
No one was talking about fans until you brought it up.
It was all what's inside the games such as their continuity and what followed FRLG and quotes from Tori about GT. Unless you want to consider the creators being fans of their own work then no one was talking about fanon.

>it is up to the franchise to decide that
Which is what everyone but you was doing.
The games haven't given Leaf any appearances, references or even a passing mention. There's not even a single hint about a girl around Red and Blue's age living in Pallet. The only part of the franchise where she actually appears is the manga and that's not even the same character we're talking about but rather a depiction of the unused female character the RG artworks.

> And the main games in even made of multiple universes, as told by Delta Episode in ORAS
Hold on for a moment there anon. As far as alternate universes are concerned there are only two and they aren't legitimate alternate universes but rather a divergent timeline.

> Nintendo doesn't really care if multiple canons contradict with each other,
One, this isn't Nintendo. This is Gamefreak. People need to stop making this mistake.
Two, unless the series has had no strict continuity like Mario or Xenoblade they have been fairly consistent.

>the only stuff that they retconned are stuff like the presence of real life animals in the pokemon world.
That's not entirely true as we still see characters making reference to real world bugs and insects. If I remember right Hau uses some kind of saying that makes reference to a chicken or something.

>>29571546
Anon, the comic example is just an example of the same character having two different histories across two continuties. How could you think that's an implication of there being one and only one version of a character?
Basically I was saying that a theoretical new Leaf wouldn't be OUR Leaf as she would need a new story separate from Red

>>29572727
>Never saw a Drampa while playing HGSS but that doesn't mean none exist in the canon.
That's because it didn't exist at the time.
At the time being the key words here as it was added in later on.
You could also explain it by saying the pokemon wasn't native to that part of the world.

Unlike Leaf who hasn't been seen, heard or spoken of since FR/LG. She simply exists as an alternative Red.

>>29566642
Yellow has official art and name, does that mean she's canon?

>>29566642
>Just because you can't find it in the games, it doesn't it is not canon
That's exactly why she's not canon. Just like Exeggutor they just existed as concepts separate from the games.
In the case of Leaf that still applies as a third trainer wasn't an element of RBGY or their remakes.

>>29566642
>do you think that exegguctor with long neck only became canon after its reveal in SM?
Yes you dumb shit, because that's when Game Freak publicly confirmed, announced and revealed that this was in fact an existing creature in the Canon Pokémon world. If they cut it, it would be like the other hundreds of scrapped Pokémon that also had names and artwork.

Just because GF made something, doesn't mean it's Canon.

Canon more or less just means "do the creators have to take this into account in the future? Is this is fixed factual element in the works?"

In which case, Leaf is not, she was promptly ignored the moment she was introduced, and always treated as the non-canon alt to Red.

And no, she doesn't even have a name. Leaf is just what Bulbapedo tried (somewhat successfully) to force onto the community, but it's about as Canon as Silver being named Soul.

Red is canon to the "main timeline" of the pokemon games, because he appears in HG/SS as the final boss, meaning that Leaf was not chosen as the main character in RF/LG and she never existed.

Leaf is canon to her own timeline in FR/LG, in which she was chosen as the protagonist, but that canonicity only applies to that game and nothing else.

>>29572805
>The games haven't given Leaf any appearances
Except the part where she appears when you can choose your playable character. And that single appearance is enough to make her existence canon. Nothing else explicities that she stops existing when you pick Red.

>GF
For starters, its Nintendo that owns the Pokemon trademark. TPCi, the company that manages the pokemon brand is a conjunction of Gamefreak, Creatures and Nintendo. And since Nintendo owns over half TPCi, Nintendo has the final word on important decisions involving pokemon. GameFreak is just a third party company that does the main games, so yeah, if the game is laggy, it is gamefreak's fault, but if you don't like the new direction pokemon is taking, complain to Nintendo.

>Hau talking about chicken
He says chicken skin in one of the trailers, but only on the english version of the game. Just like in BW where a guy in subway mentions something about a hornet. It is just some stuff has passed translation, there were a huge amount of references to real life animals in gen1, in games, anime, and other media, but they turned out almost non-existent after that

>>29573757
Considering literally every official media follows the idea that Red is canon, and that they couldn't be fucked to give Leaf a name, I'd say it's even stretching it to say that she is canon in any timeline. At all. Even in the context of "only in FR/LG".

Besides, Canon as a concept only works to serve the purpose of understanding the facts of connected bodies of works. Saying that Leaf could be canon in a separate timeline that is limited to just FR/LG is ridiculous, because that LITERALLY makes it not canon to the rest of the entire games franchise.

I mean think about it, her mother would be Red's mother. It's literally just his mother having a daughter instead of a son, it makes no sense. Leaf was never supposed to be considered Canon, ever.

>>29573693
>If they cut it
That's the point, the scrapped pokemon were stated as that, scrapped pokemon, but the exeggutor with the long neck was never said to be a scrapped design, just a thing that only ever appeared once, and never mentioned later, just like trainer joey, he exists and is canon, but never ever mentioned ever again, and no one ever bothered to ask if he would make another appearance in the series.

>Just because GF made something, doesn't mean it's Canon.
Well, if GF did it, it is almost certainly canon. Unless they announce that it is not canon, it is canon.

>the rest
Read the thread.

>>29573834
>Except the part where she appears when you can choose your playable character.
>And that single appearance is enough to make her existence canon.
>Nothing else explicities that she stops existing when you pick Red.
Every single protagonist in the games has an NPC alternative. While Ethan may be the canon protagonist for example, Lyra exists in the Pokémon world as his childhood friend, with her own house and such.

This is true all the way back to Gen 3 itself with May.

True, except of course, for Leaf.

The only """""""existence""""""" Leaf has is a genderswap of Red, in the same house as his, with the same mother. When you play as Red, Leaf doesn't exist. She was just a genderswap. No NPC, no house, no nothing. This continues with HG/SS. Nothing.

And it continued with PWT and S/M's Battle Tree.

She simply doesn't exist. She was only ever a genderswap because gender options were a staple at that point. Red was, and still is, explicitly canon, and they didn't bother to create an NPC character for Leaf to exist too.

In fact, the ENTIRE REASON we're calling her "Leaf" is LITERALLY because she doesn't show up, and such we never got a proper fucking name for her!

Seeing as Red is explicitly the Canon protagonist, I shouldn't have to tell you that by disagreeing with me, you would prove to be a complete and utter moron.

>>29573927
>That's the point, the scrapped pokemon were stated as that, scrapped pokemon, but the exeggutor with the long neck was never said to be a scrapped design, just a thing that only ever appeared once, and never mentioned later, just like trainer joey, he exists and is canon, but never ever mentioned ever again, and no one ever bothered to ask if he would make another appearance in the series.
Are you trying to say that Alola Exeggutor existed prior to SM? Are you actually fucking retarded?

>>29573927
>Well, if GF did it, it is almost certainly canon. Unless they announce that it is not canon, it is canon.
That's not how canon works you fucktard. It's not "canon until proven otherwise". Are you telling me that all the scrapped Pokémon ideas are somehow Canon because Game Freak hasn't publicly announced each and every one of them as not being Canon? Do you realize how retarded you sound?

>Read the thread.
Nice argument.

>i-i cant refute anything you said, so i'll direct you to my past arguments that were already refuted! That'll sure change your mind!

>>29573932
>Red is canon
Never said otherwise.

>Leaf doesn't exist because there isn't an NPC for her
Now this is bullshit. Just like saying that Red's father is not canon because he doesn't have an NPC.

>>29573997
>Now this is bullshit. Just like saying that Red's father is not canon because he doesn't have an NPC.
Red's father obviously fucking exists. Red even talks about him in the games.

Leaf doesn't. Her only shown existence was the daughter of Red's mother in his place, and she is non-existent when you canonically play as Red.

This isn't hard to understand.

>>29573983
Yes, its design existed way before SM. I'm also mostly sure that Alolan Exeggutor only exists because of that image from the Jungle set of the ptcg, to show people that they didn't forget and that an exeggutor with stretched neck is canon.

>>29564613
The Leaf Timeline!?

>>29574054
>I'm also mostly sure that Alolan Exeggutor only exists because of that image from the Jungle set of the ptcg

Anon, Game Freak often admit to barely remembering their own games, you think that they intentionally designed A-Egg as a nod to an old obscure TCG artwork?

Are you crazy?

It's just a coincidence, nothing more, you'd be foolish to think it was intentional.

S/M is the first and only time long-necked Exeggutor's have been introduced to the games canonically. They were conceptualized for SM/Alola, even if the TCG had a similar design over a decade ago.

Just because the TCG artwork existed, that does NOT mean long-necked Exeggutor were always canon. That's simply not how Canon works.

>>29574042
>Leaf can be chosen as a playable character
>it's not canon because she is not mentioned later if you pick Red
Not being mentioned =/= existing. You say that both can't exist because they have the same house when you choose either as your character, but you forgot that stuff changing depending on who you pick happens in all games. The character you pick in the games becomes a mute, and the other you didn't pick becomes much more active. Just because you picked Leaf, it doesn't mean Red stopped existing. The game never mentions about the other not existing, so saying that the other ceases to exist is headcanon.

>>29574204
>Just because you picked Leaf, it doesn't mean Red stopped existing
I know from the rest of the franchise that my choice was non-canon. I know that Red was the canon existing protagonist, and that Leaf has never had a canon appearance in the history of the franchise. I also know that she never will.

You can not prove this wrong.

>>29574204
>but you forgot that stuff changing depending on who you pick happens in all games
You mean like how Lyra is shown to be your best friend? May is your rival? And Leaf is... Wait, that's right, Leaf is nowhere.

>>29574204
I bet you think Kris is still canon too

>>29566843
Got a link to their page?

>>29574297
Why did they replace her with that far inferior ugly shitty clothed Lyra? Kris was perfect.

>>29574361
>fat
u wot

Also Lyra is cuter than Kris

(^:

Kris just looks like a frankenstien hybrid of Dawn/Lyra/May

Seeing as we had those girls, we didn't need Kris, so I am glad they replaced her for a new design.

>>29574128
From the pokedex entry:
>Exeggutor originally came from the tropics. Its heads steadily grow larger from exposure to strong sunlight.
Or do you think it is just a coincidence that head on the tail of the Alolan exeggutor is smaller than the others that faces the sun?

>>29574396
That says absolutely fucking NOTHING about a long-necked Exeggutor.

Of course their backstory was that they originated from the tropics, it's a fucking PALM TREE.

Alola-Exeggutor is revisiting this backstory and expanding it cleverly. It does NOT however mean they were sitting on the design for two fucking decades, or else they would have implemented it in Hoenn.

>>29574396
>head on the tail of the Alolan exeggutor is smaller than the others that faces the sun
D E E P E S T L O R E
E
E
P
E
S
T

L
O
R
E

>>29574439
It is not like they worked for 20 years with a long neck Exeggutor poster on walls.

When confronted with choosing and making Alolan form for the pokemons, they gathered everything they published about it, and made an alolan form that reflects that.

>>29574510
Well that's exactly what I am trying to say. It's possible they looked back on old Exeggutor stuff, sure. Maybe they did find that old TCG artwork which may have helped them design A-Eggy. Or maybe it's a coincidence, and they just realized a long-necked Exeggutor would look better in this tropical region.

The main point though, is that A-Eggy is still a new design, with a new typing, designed for S/M, and wasn't a canonically existing creature in the games until Gen 7 implemented its existence. Old TCG art, and unused concept art is simply not Canon, or else all of those Delta Species cards would also be canon. I mean, Alola Forms are similar, but you get the point.

>>29574579
>A new form of a Gen 1 mon is a new Pokemon

SM apologists are disgusting

>>29574579
I never said Alolan Exeggutor, I said long neck exeggutor existed way before Alolan exeggutor, and then later I said that there are high chances of Alolan Exeggutor not having a long neck if they didn't have that Jungle set image, since nothing else pointed to it having a long neck aside from that image.

Delta species are canon to the franchise, but not to the main series universe. This is why I don't think we will ever see something called "Delta Species" in the main games that doesn't have anything to do with the tcg delta species.

File: Juni.png (84KB, 264x232px) Image search: [Google]

84KB, 264x232px

>>29574740