why doesnt the jp audience like zinnia?

I like her because she's hot as fuck.

Maybe they don't think she's hot.

No one likes Zinnia. She was a mistake

>>28443935
Because she is Ohmori's self insert.

>>28443935
Zinnia is best

>>28443935

That's a lie. Some of them like her and some don't like her.

It's logically impossible for everyone to hate the samething.

Zinnia is great

>>28443989
>Crazy tribal lady from a long line of dragon people is the self insert of a japanese man who makes videogames
What?

Because she's the shittiest, most hamfisted character in a pokemon game and that's fucking saying something.
You need to stop thinking with your tiny dick.

>>28443935
Reminder that the man responsible for btfo this is also directing sun and moon

>>28443983

No and It's logically impossible for everyone to hate the samething.

>>28444013
>btfo

meant to say directing, man I need to get some sleep

>>28443935
Oh boy, where do I start
>overall jerk to everyone
>was the one behind everything that happened before the Delta Episode just so she could summon Fug
>destroys a surefire plan because of a possibility of parallel universes and bets it all on another possibility while trying to convince everyone that it's gonna work
>said plan wouldn't work and she would have doomed the entire planet had MC not been there at the right place at the right time
>fucks off right after, abandons her fucking pokemon and doesn't apologize for anything

>>28444009
>He doesn't know
Japanese men fantasize about being rowdy girls all the time. The also fantasize about being little girls getting raped or being the subject of NTR.

>>28443935
she's a pretty shitty Mary Sue even if she's cute

Because she's shit and they have taste

Because she's a crazy bitch who hijacks the plot almost like a writer self-insert in fanfiction would. At least all the characters in the game treat her like a crazy bitch too and don't kiss the floor she walks on, that'd be over the line.

Overall I can tolerate her because the rest of ORAS has much better writing and characterization than the original RSE. But she's still my least favorite Pokemon character and the Delta Episode is pretty shit.

>>28443989
No, she's Nukita's waifu ala Lightning or Rose.

>>28443989
>Interviewer: What's the character that most resembles yourself?
>Ohmori: For me it’s Zinnia – intelligent, nihilistic and with a wicked sense of humor.

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>>28443935
>Tfw one of the best girls got tacked on one of the stupidest things in the remake

Zinnia deserved better than this, she could've been in Sun and Moon.

Because Japan doesn't like good characters.

>>28443935
Who ever likes women?
Women are shit
Men are much better

>>28443935

I like Zinnia because she's reminds me of this one character I have.

They're both really obnoxious cunts.

>>28443935
I couldn't stand her. It was like someone wrote a fanfic and forced their bad OC into the story. It was also really annoying to me how she treated the other characters.

I can't speak for why Japan doesn't like her (if that's true).

>>28444086
According to some so far accurate leaks she is. But the damage has been done

>>28444071

Look let's not go that far.

We're talking about a nation that unironically loves Gundam Seed here.

Even a broken clock can be right once.

>>28444114
It probably felt that way because the Delta episode had to be tacked onto the already whole story of Ruby and Sapphire. It'll probably be a much better with Sun and Moon.

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>>28444120
>Gen 6 pretty was so bad all the good shit has been tainted now

>>28443935

Zinnia is the Lightning of Pokemon. If we never see her again it will be too soon.

Almost a textbook mary sue.

>actual real mastermind behind Aqua/Magmas plan
>beats all the other main characters offscreen
>sabotages Stevens plan with no guarantees that her own plan would work
>her plan would have failed and everyone would have died if you didnt happen to keep the meteorite this time around
>Dragons

Delta Episode plays out like a mediocre fanfiction.

>>28444217
That's not Cynthina.

>>28444217
>Zinnia is the Lightning of Pokemon

You mean Cynthia and Lucario

>>28443935
Im from Japan and I really like her, I don't know one single person who doesn`t like her, where do you get this from anon? that simply not true.

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>>28444084
Actually it would be more like.

>Zinnia is the character everyone loves. She’s like me.

>>28444275

yo yellow nigga wheres corocoro

>>28444055
>>28444245
The irony is is that without the actual Mary Sue, the player character, her plan would have failed miserably.

>>28444120

She's never mentioned in the fucking chinese leak.

We have a fucking image sorting this shit out and you still can't get it right. Your parents should aborted you.

>>28444299
I'm still mad at Hideous Baby
I hope he never touches Tales again

>>28444217
The Lightning of a franchise is a creator's pet that is shoehorned into everything for no real reason.

So Charizard and Lucario are the Lightning's of Pokemon. Zinnia's more unique in her shittiness.

Zinnia was completely fucking wrong about everything and nearly killed millions of people THREE GODDAMN TIMES for a fever dream that she expected us to take as gospel truth.

FUCK ZINNIA

>>28444312

>the way we see Zinnia is the same way the npcs see us

Deep.

>>28444346
Worse than Wesley Crusher? Dayum.

She is a piece of garbage that nearly destroys the world twice and the game tries to hard to make her look cool and complex so you like her...they even did the most kingdom hearts theme ever, just for her.

They tried too hard in making us sympathize with a terrible person.

>>28444346

Lightning wasn't shoved into anything without reason. I hate her too but she had three games that sold well, and none of her cameo appearances are really out of place.

And the proper term has been The Wesley for a long time. The Star Trek fandom coined it before you were even born kiddo. A creator's pet that no one likes but they keep getting attention.

>>28443935
I like Zinnia, she is the most unique villain of the pokemon franchise so far, and i can barely think of any characters in other media that are such fuck-ups like her.

>>28444417

No one is worse than Wesley Crusher.

That fucking episode where he's more capable drunk of his ass at the age of 12 than the adults still pisses me off. Fuck Wesley.

>>28444333
I have to wonder how his pretty good record early on with directing Destiny Remake and producing Hearts DS went on to just completely shitting the bed from Xillia on.

It may be too soon to say this, but many series these days need a Fukaya.

>>28444444

>>28444500
Truly a wonder
Hearts DS is my favorite Tales game

>>28444275
What island are you from, anon? Japan's communities are SEGMENTED, due to that stupid hentai-writer's self insert.

The fact that your community isn't that mad about her, must be one of those isolated cases, but most of all japan is torn between two things:

-Irrational hatred because of this being nothing of value to add to the remakes
-Simply tolerate her or like her as fap material, which isn't bad, but does nothing at all for the games.

Seriously, whatever island you are, that has to be one of those cases.
The fact that they thought that this and the maison could be a well-thought replacement for the battle frontier is STILL to this day a fucking disgrace.

>her face right before she battles you
She can't possibly look any more like a brain dead monkey
>HER ANIMATION WHEN THE FIGHT STARTS
NEVERMIND SHE FOUND A WAY

>>28444582
All too true.

She reads like a retard. D.E. would have been the same or better without her

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>>28444656
>HER ANIMATION WHEN THE FIGHT STARTS
literally the best part about her.

>>28444632
What hentai did the writer do? I hear this several times, but never get details.

>>28444723
Why did she do this anyway? She was perfectly functional up until you start battling her, then she goes full degenerate.

>>28444774
>perfectly functional
Let's not exaggerate here

>>28444632

>that stupid hentai-writer

Oh right, didn't the Japs dig up that the Delta Episode writer was some hentai artist?

There is a pastebin.

>>28444774
As said, she's the new head writer's Lightning or Rose.

>>28444368
>three
You mean two?

>>28444774
It's kinda like she's shifting her weight side to side like a boxer, just with her arms relaxed completely. I think she does it to get in a fighting mentality. I'm also grasping at straws

>>28444839
She fucked up the link and fug not having enough power, I think that's it

>>28444723
>>28443935
Question is, how who she had been a better character? Would it have been better if she became a main villain during the delta story instead of trying to make her into a hero?

Anyone got that image from the interview explaining aster?

>>28444632
>well-thought replacement for the battle frontier

Honestly I think Masuda probably said "nah fuck that shit" because he didn't work on Emerald and was being autistic himself about Hoenn

>>28444869

They should have just not had her.

>>28444869
Yes.

Also making her do ANYTHING during the main story, because suddenly "oh it was all me" in post game was dumb. Also probably not insulting Steven constantly while being an asshole herself. Also just scrapping the whole thing

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>>28444869
>how who she had

>>28444745
Check the archives. The pastebin's there.
>>28444801
Indeed. The delta episode was written by a guest writer, as well as the character, which is a sad thing to remember.

>>28444933
Whoops, meant how would* she had been

If Zinnia and mega Rayquaza are scrapped off from the game no one will lament it.

Well except some r34 artists.

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>>28444801

Found it. Copypasting from an old pist.

>Masafumi Nukita is the hentai writer. Specifically he worked for a company called Nude Maker.

>Now we can't know 100% for sure if it's him, since his name is written in hiragana in the ORAS staff credits and hasn't been directly interviewed, but there's some connections. One of the magazine interviews with Masuda and Ohmori lists Nukita's name in kanji, and it's spelled the same as the hentai writer. One of Nukita's friends wrote a game with a character supposedly similar to Zinnia and similarly hated by fans, Nueko in Oreshika 2. The jokes and references in Japanese ORAS fit with Nukita's tastes. He also seems to have left Nude Maker around the time he would've joined Gamefreak.

This is the Scenario Director and Lead Dialogue Designer or ORAS.

>>28443963
I hate her personality, but would fug.

>>28444256
>>28444258

But Cynthia is actually good.

>>28444869

Don't pull that "It was my idea to wake up Kyogre/Groudon" bullshit.

Don't destroy the link cable. Instead have her convince Steven with her arguments.

Maybe incorporate her more into the main plot as a rival. May/Brendan hardly count, and Wally is just one real fight, so it wouldn't be hard.

>>28444774
Bloodlust or something. Zinnia is chuuni as fuck.

>>28444808
>new head writer
Delta Episode was done by a guest writer with no involvement with the main game and, as far as we know, on anything else in the franchise.

You know, if they wanted a big tit crazy girl they could have hired anyone on trigger or anyone involved in monster girl quest...

But this guy? God, no wonder Zinnia came up as garbage. 2/10 nice tits yet I won't Hora Hora her.

>>28445053
Cynthia's is still an author's pet

>>28445016
>Nueko in Oreshika 2
Holy fuck that is hilarious

http://www.siliconera.com/2014/07/23/oreshika-tainted-bloodlines-getting-slammed-japanese-players-amazon-2/

>>28444935
Well I didn't find a pastebin in the archives but I found a post detailing it a bit more.

Honestly I enjoyed most of ORAS' story more than that of any other mainline game, so I wouldn't mind if he stayed as Scenario Director. Long as he doesn't do anything as retarded as Zinnia again.

>>28445016
I remember hearing about Nueko. Apparently she was an extremely annoying character and also pissed off fans of the original game in particular because while the main gimmick of the games is you have to keep your family line going constantly she's outside of that and a bunch of the game's other mechanics. You can basically say fuck actually playing the game and just use Nueko instead who the plot revolves around even though it's supposed to be about your family getting revenge and not this random broad.

I haven't played either for myself, though.

>>28444333

These digits

>>28445066
There wasn't time to "convince" people with arguments. Besides that, this is a video game. It makes a lot more sense for a character to be proactive to keep the action and story moving than to have the characters sit and negotiate. Besides that, the problem with the link cable and the devon plan was more a principle thing and we are supposed to agree that yeah Pokemon should not be hurt or worse to enact their plan when Zinnia's race of people have been planning their own way to deal with this for who knows how long. And considering this is the Pokemon world, which paints itself as a place where something like their prophecy being true can happen, there's no reason for us as the players to doubt her. It's bot like Pokemon is about disproving legends being real and shit.

Other Zinnia pastebin

http://pastebin.com/6iXDxAcf

Seriously, Zinnia is fucking garbage. And these threads keep getting made and it's always the exact same bullshit over and over again. And the people who defend Zinnia literally make the same three arguments:

>She's so hot though.
>She was right about 2 Hoenns so she did nothing wrong.
>I liked her so it's OK.

>>28445016
>Nueko in Oreshika 2 has a connection of shittiness to Zinnia
It all makes sense. Fuck Nueko. Oreshika would be so much better if using her wasnt mandatory.

>>28445327
>There wasn't time to "convince" people with arguments

Oh fuck off, faggot. She had enough time to orchestrate the fucking Primal Whale/Lizard bullshit and run around stealing everyone's Mega rock and the Draconids were monitoring the shit since time began apparently, and you're saying "there wasn't enough time?" Seriously, fuck off.

OMFG, I played that game, and Zinnia is indeed Nueko OMFG OMFG OMFG.

Please let this idiot stay away from my toe cleavage goddess Lusamine!!!

>>28445342
There's nothing that really makes what she says about two Hoenns right, though. One could as easily just assume ORAS outright retconned RSE and she's just full of fucking bullshit.

>>28445391
Go back to wherever you came from

>>28445417
I always saw the whole parallel world thing as a reference to the games replaced by the remakes. Like they still happen the same way in parallel worlds.
But /vp/ blows it out of proportion and uses it as an argument to "prove" Gen VI never happens in the same timeline as the previous games.

>>28445381
The meteor is right outside fucking earth when you fly up there. Yeah, there's fucking contradictions in the story, especially one where a whole subplot is inserted into the original plot. Big fucking woop. Pokemon has never been a paragon of consistency or sense. That doesn't make this good buy it doesn't makr it something worth nothing about. Characters not explaining their viewpoints and negotiating others due to urgency is a an age old plot device to get stories going and form a conflict. It is nothing out of the ordinary here.

>>28445244
>all the people in the comments defending Nueko
I forgot Silliconera was a bunch of weebs.

>>28445489
>worth nothing about.
Worth complaining about. I think I was going to say nothing notable but changed my mind and autocorrect took the reigns.

>>28445417

Yes, she also cannot prove it to anybody and it's unclear as to whether or not she even knows for herself or it's just a theory since it's never explained how she knows about the two Hoenns.

The two Hoenns thing is literally never explored in the game plot itself so it being true is something only you can say, no one in the actual games knows if it's real or not.

And yet niggers still defend Zinnia by crying about the two Hoenns. There was a Zinnia thread a while back where some guy kept arguing that Zinnia was right because maybe she used a Ghost pokemon to look across dimensions at the other Hoenn, even though the game never even implies this and if she did she should have shown someone else instead of just shit talking everybody with no explanations.

>>28445521
Horrible thing is, I was interested in that game when it was announced, now it doesn't even seem worth it to pirate.

>>28445327
>There wasn't time
Nigga, do you KNOW how many times I've reset to try for a decent Deoxys, got bored after an hour, did fucking nothing story related for a day or week, then gone back and tried again? It was a minimum of three months before I finished the game.

>>28445489

Hey retard she had time to manipulate a massive criminal organization into awakening a primordial beast and did this complex plan to steal a fucking orb and put energy in a meteor and whatever and after you foiled that she STILL had time to wait for your ass to finish fighting the Elite Four and the Champion and then she went around stealing everyone's rock and breaking into NASA and then even had a chat with you on top of the Sky Tower.

She had a fucking lot of time, faggot.

>>28445391
>implying Lillie isn't totally gonna be Zinnia 2.0

Also I keep hearing Masuda said once he wants more "romance" in the series, maybe that's why they hired a hentai writer.

>>28445527
>maybe she used a Ghost Pokemon[...]

That insane theory makes me think of Fire Emblem Fates Conquest with Azura and the fucking crystal ball.

>>28445417
Hoopa proves a multiverse exists. Zinnia was right.

Maby she is a ultra beast

>>28445604
>wants more romance in the series
>hires a hentai writer
Of all things you could do

>>28445527
>Yes, she also cannot prove it to anybody and it's unclear as to whether or not she even knows for herself or it's just a theory since it's never explained how she knows about the two Hoenns.
>The two Hoenns thing is literally never explored in the game plot itself so it being true is something only you can say, no one in the actual games knows if it's real or not.
It's never explored but it doesn't mean it didn't happen or wasn't true. Do you believe Mewtwo was not created as a mew clone gone wrong because the game never explores that? Are we supposed to believe the history of thr brothrrs in Unova might not be true because we don't experience it? We have no reason to believe it's false, and the scientists at least know other dimensions exist. It wasn't JUST the issue of destroying an alternate Hoenn either. The reason she dislikes Steven and the Devon Corp in general is because the moral ambiguity of Infinite Energy and it's creation. Them enacting their plan would take more sacrifice by Pokemon than ever before, and there's no reason for that when the Draconids had their own plan.

>>28444582
>Liking Hearts
Wew, I bet you think Graces is the best game in the series.

OMFG so Zinnia is the Nueko of Hoenn while Lilie is the Nueko of Alola...

I don't want to play this game anymore...

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>>28443935
Let me ask this: Is there anyone that likes Zinnia who isn't blinded by their dick?

>Muh tragic mourning young mother

You let headcanon run wild. Aster was her predecessor, not her lost successor.

>>28445679
I actually think Vesperia is, even with broken ass shit like Tidal Wave, but Hearts DS remains my favorite.

>>28445706
Good taste then, nevermind my post. Vesperia and Destiny DC for life.

>>28445578
But she didn't start stealing key stones from all the major characters until that plan was foiled, and that's what was being bitched about, her not explaining what she was doing during the Delta Episode because it can be assumed the characters would have understood what she was doing.

>>28445653
Game Freak should hire Kagami (of Taimanin Asagi fame) as an artist and ShindoL as a writer since he's now babby's first h-plot writer

>>28445736
What the first one that would have failed anyways? Which would have fucked over the world before Fug would do anything?

>>28445663

How Mewtwo was created doesn't actually matter. How Zinnia knows there's two Hoenns actually matters because she is the one doing all this shit because she knows there's two Hoenns.

So if she knows there are two Hoenns, why is she unable to prove it? Surely there is some kind of process since the Draconids knew about the two Hoenns for literally ages. And why is the two Hoenns thing a huge secret? Is this an actual thing or is this just some bullshit legend? When Cozmo asks her how she can know, she doesn't say she has proof. She says "well it's just a theory." So what the fuck is it?

How much Zinnia knows about the two Hoenns and how she knows it is a huge fucking deal because if there's actually a way to monitor the other Hoenn, she could have saved herself a LOT of trouble by just showing somebody else. And if there is no way and it's just a theory, then she nearly fucked everyone over for a theory.

>>28445746
Or they could just hire ReDrop and call it a day.

>>28445663
>Do you believe Mewtwo was not created as a mew clone gone wrong because the game never explores that?
?
did you not read the diaries in the burned out mansion? it mentions that mew gave birth and they started experimenting on the newborn.

>>28445763
Yes? What's the issue? The Delta Episode is all about a back up plan for thst plan. Ignoring that initial plan only exists because it had to insert itself into the existing story of RS to make any semblance of sense so logically it HAD to fail.

>>28445822
They could've left her out of the main plot entirely.

>>28444111
This far into the thread and no one checked your double trips? For shame /vp/.

>>28444478
Not mention Wesley's actor, Wil Wheaton, is a complete fucking douchebag irl as well.

>>28445822

You are missing the point, you retard.
You
Are
Missing
The
Point

The point is that some retard(You) is going around saying "she didn't have enough time, that's why she had to resort to force." But she had enough time to go deep cover in Team Aqua/Magma and manipulate them into doing this Primal Kyogre/Groudon bullshit that surely took at the very least months because Team Aqua/Magma had to do all the research and make the spacesuit and everything.

>>28444120
Zinnia is not in Alola but she will appear in Sinnoh.

>>28445768
>How Mewtwo was created doesn't actually matter. How Zinnia knows there's two Hoenns actually matters because she is the one doing all this shit because she knows there's two Hoenns.
This line of logic makes no sense and it also failed to acknowledge the other example given. It didn't matter how mewtwo was made but it matters that they prove there's two Hoenns because it's an aspect of the plot that exists? How is tanymoee important?

And why does she have to "prove it"? Why does it matter if it's proven if we have no reason to believe it was not true? Go back to the mewtwo or two brothers plot points. we know that the backstory snd explanation behind then is true because we have no reason to beloeve its noy. why would Gamefreak be trying to pull a fast one about it? Especially when the character telling us about the alternate dimension hoenn is meant to be in right in contrect? There is absolutely zero reason to believe it's false. No, that's not a real world way to look at y. But it ISNT the real world. We don't look at Pokemon's legends and myths and rumors as possibly not real because the universe is a place where they ARE real. Legends are REAL, prophecies are REAL. We have no reason to be skeptical this instance isnt real as well unless you want to intentional play dumb in order to nitpick things you don't like. It's like complaining that a rumor in a video game says there's a super strong monster hidden in some dungeon. It's probably going to be real 99% of the time.

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>>28445604
But they did "romance" a few years before ORAS.

>>28445937
Im not missing any point. There was obviously more time months ago then there is when the post game starts. What you're saying makes no fucking sense. There isn't going to be equal amounts of time when she starts the aqua/magma shit as when the Delta Episode starts.

>>28445810
But we didn't SEE it, did we? How can we know it's all true? Do you see how ridiculous that sounds? It's a video game, not real life. It wouldnt be there if it wasn't meant to be true unless the game explicitly makes a point that it might not be which isnt the case. We are supposed to believe theres an alternate Hoenn.

>>28446019

It's a false equivalence, you stupid faggot.
Stop trying to defend your shitty waifu with these bullshit arguments. How Mewtwo was created isn't important because Mewtwo is not central to the plot. Zinnia is literally responsible for the entire plot of ORAS since she's not only behind the Delta Episode but the Primal shit too. So obviously her reasons are important, and then they can't even explain how she knows about the two Hoenns or if she can even prove it. That's garbage.

You are comparing something totally unimportant, that if we knew about it it would just be filler, that is explained anyway(Mewtwo's creation) to something MASSIVELY important that the entire plot of the fucking game revolves around(the two Hoenns since the whole game's plot kicks off because Zinnia wants to save the other Hoenn). Your comparison DOES NOT WORK and you are an idiot for even making it.

Fuck off, Zinniafag.

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>Draconids are a death cult ran by Zinnia's grandma who wants to the destroy the world because reasons
>Creating the Orbs and Primal Reversion, building that tower which attracts Deoxys and the meteors, using the unwitting Zinnia to support Team Aqua/Magma and smash the transfer device, etc is all to that end
>Rayquaza is actually their archenemy

Would this be a better plot than the Delta Episode?

>>28446074

Are you trolling or are you actually this fucking stupid? The point is she had a shitload of time to convince people in other ways that a meteor was coming. Apparently her people knew about the meteor for HUNDREDS OF YEARS and then she had however long it took for her to infiltrate a criminal organization and manipulate them into following her convoluted plan which involves building a submarine, putting volcanic energy into a meteorite, and awakening a primordial being.

So the argument that "SHE DIDN'T HAVE ENOUGH TIME" doesn't make any sense. That's the point, you mongoloid.

>Zinniafags keep moving the goalpost in discussions
Why I'm not surprised?

>>28446212
I see PokéSpe Fug is still ruthless.

>>28446212
I wonder how 2ch felt about these pages.

>>28446221
"You guys need some imagination."

>>28446212

Does she survive this somehow?

>>28446274
She's in a wheelchair in the final chapter.

>>28446151
Why doesn't it work? Why does it matter whether there is two Hoenns or not in context? The story is written and it's going to happen that way whether there is or isn't ACTUALLY two hoenns. It wasn't even the whole reason she sabatoged Devon's plan which no one has acknowledged yet. If it's a false equivalency, actually prove the point wrong instead of crying about it, and furthermore instead of attacking my rhetoric and strawmanning about my ibeing a "zinniafag" as though whether I am or not has any bearing on my actual words, why don't you actually focus on the actual point and meat of my post? It's a lot easier to cry about false equivalencies but its far from the cornerstone of what I'm saying and deflecting from the point to focus in that is stupid.

>>28446212
No, her being a fucking villain by stupidity is great, all it needs is for other NPCs to realize that harder and by the of the Delta episode she realize what a gigantic asshole she is.

>>28446316
>If it's a false equivalency, actually prove the point wrong

I did, you retard, in the post you quoted.

>>28446274
Yes. PokéSpe characters tend to survive the most ridiculous things.

She is injured and currently confined to a bed though.

>>28446330
Yes, the problem with Delta Episode is that it tries too hard to paint Zinnia as a heroine despite all the shit she pulled.

Since people brought PokéSpe Zinnia into the thread, I think she was handled better for that very reason. She realizes what a fucking retard she was being. She's also not as big of a cunt before it, which helps.

>>28446217
You can't deal with the fucking meteorite even if you prophesized about it until it is actually happening, whichwe have no reason to assume wasn't sometime around when Magma/Aqua started doing their thing which would be comparatively recent versus hundreds of years ago. And at the beginning of the game, there is more time for an elaborate plan in order to fit into the the existing story told in RS. But by the end of it, there is obviously less time. Again, no point is being missed.

>>28446343
No you didn't. You also s to all didn't acknowledge the brothers war comparison or even really the Kalos war backstory. How do we know that really happened or that it's true because we don't actually see it?

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>>28443963
preach it brudder

>>28444045
who is Fug?

>>28446730
How new?

I'll explain if you tell me how long you've been here?

>>28446730
>Being this new

>>28443935
I liked her. It was the first bit of actual lore in the Pokemon universe that interested me.

>>28446730
Critical thinking not your strong suit, huh.

Yeah there was a lot of lore behind those tits...

Seriously, she wasn't well written and she was on our face making us realice how much of a Mary Sue she is by walking out of this without punishment.

>>28444312
You can't be a Mary Sue if you're the protagonist of the damn story.

Since this is a Zinnia thread, might as well ask.
Anyone has fanart focusing on her back?
Fucking love clothing that exposes the back like the one she wears and never found anything with Zinnia.

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>>28446876
yeah you can though?

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>>28446730
Not knowing fug.

>>28446730
A bad fucking nigga you best not be trifling with

>>28444312
I mean, like with almost every story ever where if the protagonist didn't exist shit would go badly? Why do people always bring this theoretical up like it's some point against her? Have you ever read diction in your life? Hell, non fiction even to some extent. Going "If the MC didn't exist the world would be fucked" applies to many things so many GOOD things even, that it's such an absurd complaint. Doesn't make Zinnia good but it also isn't a point against her inherently.

>>28446730
so where did you just come from m8? reddit or tumblr? is this the first thread you've clicked on?

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If one thing's certain, she had a good amount of r34.

>>28446876
What?

>>28444425
Her games sold because of the FF name alone. Each Lightning game sold less then the last one, anon.

>>28443963
Japan usually doesn't care for tan or darker skin characters.

>>28447034
>quantity ≠ quality

>>28447014
Though, the characters that that doesn't explain themselves in order to artificially create conflict in a story where there would normally not be much is inherent a bad point. It's extremely common but not especially good.

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We have this thread everyday, at least let's post cute Zinnias

>>28447082

That's bullshit, Japan goes apeshit for the brown girl fetish as much as we do.

It's more likely that Zinnia is written so badly, and her personality is so repugnant and Delta Episode is so stupid, that people don't even want to fap to her.

>>28443935
The people who say the JP fanbase hates her are retarded. She has more art than a lot of Pokemon characters who have existed for much longer- art that is not lewd in any sort of way so it's clearly admiration of her as a character.

Yes, a certain sector does hate her, as does a certain sector on /vp/. Doesn't mean a majority does, just a loud minority.

Also the people who call her a "villain" or a "failure" are dumb. Her goal was to destroy the comet without destroying an alternate dimension. She succeeded. She's a hero. Just admit you like sucking Steven's cock already.

>>28443935
Why would anyone like Zinnia? All any Pokemon "character" is is cosmetic. It's not like they're actual characters with motives and personalities. She's just that girl in the cape who has something to do with Rayquaza.

Well, Blue and Silver had personalities, but that's it.

I think the worst part is how she nearly destroys the world twice over and at the end she doesn't even apologize, and you are instead told to forgive her because she had good intentions so she was actually heroic, and then you have to go around to all the shitty places handing back out the stuff she stole.

>>28447153
>Blue and Silver had personalities
>Blue and Silver had personalities
>but characters that came after them didn't

Replay Gen 1 and 2. Then come back and tell me that with a straight face. They're perhaps some of the blandest NPCs in the series, outside of the ones they blatantly put no effort into.

>>28447142
Not only that but she and the MC didn't have to sacrifice however many Pokemon it would take to make the infinite energy to fuel their plan to do it either which was imo the larger point which is why it's such a big deal that she dislikes Steven for being associated with Devon.

>>28447179
Wait, she asks for forgiveness? Isn't that a fucking apology?

>>28443999
>It's logically impossible
nothing is impossible

I don't think many people like her honestly. Only people who focus on her design alone.
The way she is introduced is very off putting, and in general kind of forces her way into the story and just assumes the player character agrees with her and all her nonsense.

Her "knocking you out" probably didn't help a lot of people, specially since it was completely out of nowhere and served no purpose.

Besides the culmination of Rayquaza and Deoxys fighting in space, most of the Delta Episode was very sloppily done, and that's literally all of the Zinnia we get.

>>28447142

But she didn't succeed. The first time she tried it, Fug didn't appear, and everybody would have died if not for the player character showing up.

Then the second time she failed again, because Fug didn't have enough energy, so if you weren't there with the most coincidental meteorite of all time, everyone would have died.

And Fug didn't even accept her anyway, so even if she had the meteorite everyone might have died anyway because she was always an unworthy shitter.

Zinnia did literally everything wrong and failed at everything she tried to accomplish, the only reason the world wasn't destroyed is because of the PC.

>>28447224

No, she leaves you some shitty note saying she's going to go off to find herself, and her grandma apologizes on her behalf and asks you to go easy on her.

>>28447179
>she nearly destroys the world twice over
Stop this shitty meme.
The first time would have been easily handled because of the Master Ball. It was in the evil team's hideout so they clearly had intent to use it at some point, and it works on the superancient Pokemon, so it would've worked for them too.

The second time, let's suppose that Rayquaza needing your meteor wasn't a last minute hack decision to make your character a Mary/Marty Sue. In which case, she did save the alternate Hoenn from Steven and Cozmo.

>>28447142
But is it a success if it only worked because you were there?

She failed and destroyed option B. She was wrong about Fug having enough power, And you just happened to have a meteorite that wasn't her plan. If you traded it for a tm like in RS the world would have been fucked

>>28447203
Thy have a personality. They're just cardboard cut archetypes. ESPECIALLY silver. And most major characters are at least that much in Pokemon so the criticism is still moot.

>>28447203
They were given personalities in HGSS

>>28445342
Game Catalog tells me the japs really hate meme lingo suddenly showing up midway through series.

Wonder how they'd feel about English Pokemon always having had meme lingo.

>>28447251
It makes sense why she was unworthy. She tried disrupting the balance of the world

>>28447251
That sounds like an apology to me. It's not a sobbing heartfelt I'm sorry but I think you can tell is not that type of character.

>>28447255
>The first time would have been easily handled because of the Master Ball. It was in the evil team's hideout so they clearly had intent to use it at some point, and it works on the superancient Pokemon, so it would've worked for them too.

So where in the game did Archie/Maxie say "okay we summoned Primal Whale/Lizard, time to use the Master Ball?"

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>>28447255
>let's suppose that Rayquaza needing your meteor wasn't a last minute hack decision

>let's rewrite the canon to make it fit the way i want it to be

>>28447307
>doesn't return anything she stole
>makes you do it
>doesn't change
>doesn't learn anything

Why is she a good character?

She's supposed to be a good guy too

>>28447257
>But is it a success if it only worked because you were there?
Are you implying that it's not a success in the millions of stories where the protagonist existing to stop the BBEG or whatever other calamity from doing their thing aren't "successes"? Why does this particular instance in a Pokemon game of all things the one that triggers you?

>>28447364
That's not her plan though. SHE FAILED to control Fug and destroy the meteor

You did it, you saved the world, you succeeded

>>28447282
This. Silver in particular was very bland, though he did have a character arc, HGSS fleshes it out a lot and gives it actual closure.

I feel like most of the narrative Zinnia provided could have easily, and more effectively provided by other existing characters in the story.
She just felt out of place, like someone told the staff they needed at least one new human character design for Delta Episode, and no one knew how to integrate a new character smoothly.

>>28447363
Did I say she was a good character? Can you quote where I said that? I don't even think I implied it. But people make a big deal about her not apologizing for doing all the shit she did.

>>28447364

No one is triggered, shithead. It's just bad writing and people are calling it out.

You didn't even answer the question, your rebuttal is basically "who cares it's a kid's game lol." You argue like a woman.

>>28447311
They didn't, but it isn't something that needs to be said. It's a context clue. It isn't spelled out in RBY that Silph Co. was taken over for the Master Ball either so that Giovanni could capture Mewtwo, but that's the implication.

>>28447335
I'm not rewriting the canon. It's just so blatantly obvious the ONLY reason that scene is there is to make the player feel special YET again.

Seriously I mostly like ORAS's changes, but the one thing I hated was how much of a damn Mary Sue protag becomes. Like seriously people have the gall to call Zinnia a Mary Sue when the protag is ten times worse? It's bullshit.

>>28447363
>doesn't change
>doesn't learn anything
She does though? She clearly ate her humble pie and left on a journey to grow further.
And it's probably better for you to do it anyway, she'd just get arrested- which would be bullshit as she was instrumental in saving the world in a non-evil way.

>>28447416
I mean well written that's the argument.

Not morally good, because she's clearly far from it

>>28447363
Because she's a strong and independent female who needs no man.

>>28447432
>They didn't

Yeah, exactly, get fucked.

>>28447419
>You argue like a woman
Ah, there it is.
AntiZinniafags are misogynists. Should've guessed from the nazi gif from earlier though.
Go back to /pol/.

Can someone explain where the "Zinnia is brown" meme came from? She's fucking white. Pure white. Both her parents are white. Don't let your fetish cloud your reasoning.

>>28447476
And you go back to tumblr or reddit.

>>28447480

She is more tanned than normal.

She comes out of nowhere and acts very disrespectful to a majority of the cast, acts like a total know-it-all, kicks your ass off screen for literally no reason, then it turns out her big plan would have failed if you didn't interfere, begging the question of why she was needed in the first place.

Pretty much, if you happen to be a player that was fond of any of the main cast, it's only natural that you would find her off putting.

>>28447393
Her plan failed. So what? Plans fail in stories all the time wnd just as often the protagonist manages to find their ay through as it did here. It's dramatic tension. How are they gonna get out od this one? If you didn't exist who would have stopped Groudon from wrecking the world or whatever? This hypothetical scenario is pointless.

>>28447480
I never understood why people think Zinnia is tanned either. She doesn't in neither official art nor game model.

>>28447513
She's not even as tan as Shauna or Phoebe.

>>28447513
No, she's not. You can't successfully lie about something I can literally verify with my eyes.

>>28447203
Literally every Pokemon "character" ever falls into one of two categories
>evil team person
>non evil team person (everyone else)
Blue and Silver are the only ones who act differently or have any unique mannerisms of their own.

And the last time I played Gen I was like 2 weeks ago and I'm currently playing Gen II now. I think you should actually play a Pokemon game that's not XY or Pokemon GO.

>>28447480
The first shot we got of her was the big DE artwork spread with shadows cast over her

>>28447419
Thee answer to the question is "yes" as implied by question I answered it with, which you also did not answer. It has nothing to do with being a kid's game. It is a fact that the vast majority of stories have protagonists that are the reason shit doesn't go to hell. Why is it such an issue here?

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>>28447476
>not liking my cute nazi gif
i'm not who you're arguing with, i haven't even played oras (doesn't look different enough from r/s/e to me, and i played those a hundred times), but it's funny that you think my cartoon stick figure in a coat makes me some ebil muh soggy knees

http://vocaroo.com/i/s0FmjYsBev6T

>>28447472
So you need everything spelled out for you?
Deductive storytelling is a common thing, especially in RPGs.

>>28447504
Eh, nah. I'm not a SJW or a normalfag. I just have a sense of human decency.

>>28447519
I'm not sure why anyone would like Cozmo or Steven enough based on what we got of them.
Wally and May/Brendan, yeah, she was a dick to, which I'll admit, but she didn't harm them or their Pokemon- just took their keystones. And why would you feel sympathy for a big bad having something stolen by someone doing good?

>>28447547

Shauna is obviously some kind of Algerian.
Zinnia isn't brown but she's definitely tanned, and it's noticeable. I think she's supposed to be an Ainu or something.

>>28447226

Nah. That's not true.

>>28447432
>Like seriously people have the gall to call Zinnia a Mary Sue when the protag is ten times worse? It's bullshit.
Probably because the story revolves around the player character from the start, while Zinnia is a sudden foreign element that is gone as soon as she appears.
The fact that the game suddenly revolves around HER for her short visit is indeed a little strange.

>>28447448
I know what you meant and the request for you to point out where to implied that she was well written stands.

>antagonizes Steven constantly
>steals from people
>destroys other potential way of saving the world
>says I have a plan, and doesn't tell anyone "you need imagination"
>doesn't state why infinity energy is bad
>writes a letter and fucks off which only says "I thank you for that" leaving out everything else
>you return everyone's shit

She's also the only Villian besides Ghetsis (attmpeted murder) and Cyrus (emotionless sociopath) to not have regret for her actions

>inb4 she was right

Lysandre KNEW he was right that the world is unclean
Maxie/Archie KNEW he was helping human/Pokemon
N KNEW that he was saving Pokemon

Yet they all felt bad for their actions and Zinnia (being a good guy) did probably the most actual evil actions out of people in Pokemon felt no remorse.

How is she supposed to be a good guy?

How is this well written? Fuck Zinnia

>>28447590

Cuz it's shitty writing. I point out shitty writing in everything. If you acknowledge it's shit too, why do you care?

>>28447631
>antagonizes Steven constantly
I don't get why people think this is a bad thing.
Steven is a dull fucker.

>>28447597
Was the vocaroo really necessary?
Say something cute.

>>28447600
>by someone doing good?
I wasn't convinced she was actually a goodguy, until her plan was explained. Shortly after which her plan failed. So there was little time for me to believe in Zinnia's goals.

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>>28447480

Hoenn is part of japan

>>28447657
He's still a nice guy who helps the player quite a bit. Zinnia just gives everyone trouble.

>>28447687
>Was the vocaroo really necessary?
i thought it was, felt that it would show absurdity in assuming that all people who disagree with you are "filthy muh soggy knee sticks" just because they don't like your character or point out holes in your shitty logic

>>28447600

The Master Ball wasn't for catching Primal Whale/Lizard.

You lose, good day.

>>28447657
You're literally saying botany ok to bully someone if they're boring

>>28447631
Also forgot to add she's a bully who picks on the weak for key stones and doesn't attempt to take stronger trainer's (You and Steven)

So in response to not fighting him she insults him and his plan

>>28447632
It is not shitty writing for the protagonist to be the entire reason for a plot to exist or be contained. That's calling like 90% of fiction shitty writing. That's absurd. Yeah, go figure, the main characters are the driving force for resolving the plot. You aren't an observer of the pokemon world. you are an active participant. Zinnia was written poorly but that is NOT the reason.

>>28447750

She almost destroyed the world, faggot. She would have, twice, if you weren't there. Her plan was shit and she failed. She's a shitty character.

Your "b-b-but it's a kid's game" flailing will not change that.

>>28447631
>She's also the only Villian besides Ghetsis (attmpeted murder) and Cyrus (emotionless sociopath) to not have regret for her actions
Not true. She clearly feels remorse for her actions. She just expressed them in an odd way, and she's an odd bird anyway.

>Zinnia (being a good guy) did probably the most actual evil actions out of people in Pokemon
Ah yeah, because taking two keystones and breaking a cord that would've lead to an extinction event on another planet is evil.
Fuck, Silver is more "evil" than she is, and he's not painted as strictly immoral.

>>28447710
It's located where Japan would be, but in reality it's another world with similar geography

>>28447783
I'm not even sure is still a strawman. It goes BEYOND strawman. It doesn't even ATTEMPT to argue the same points. Its barely even tangentially related to the topic at hand.

>>28447734
I wasn't that anon you were trying to btfo...

>>28443935
I like her because she looks and acts like she wants that MC dick

>>28447830

I really don't give a shit, I was originally arguing that Zinnia failed at everything she tried and you opened your fat mouth to talk about something else. And it's midnight, I have work tomorrow, and I'm too tired for this shit. Zinnia is garbage and I'm sick of you Zinniafaggots constantly diverting the argument and bringing up tangential bullshit to try and defend her. There is no way to defend her. She is just a trash character and if there's one thing these threads have taught me, it's that her fanbase is trash too because they can't argue worth a damn.

>>28447226
Humans will never own pokemon as pets in real life. That's one impossibility.

>>28447808
Except Silver tried to return what he stole you faggot

Also cite anywhere of Zinnia feeling regret for her action.

Zinnia broken into Brendan/May's house and battled them and is implied to have hurt them. Broke into Wally's house and stole his. Ran up to Courtney/Matt (spun them around implying contact) and got their key stone. Destroyed the Link Cable. Busted her way through Magma/Aqua base and fought and took Maxie/Archie and took their key stole after that. She's a shit

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>>28444632
The Delta Episode was more of a replacement for Emerald's plot changes as a whole. The Mossdeep takeover, battling Wallace's champion team, and summoning Rayquaza is all directly lifted from Emerald.

They did a shitty job at it, especially the takeover, but they were aiming at stuff other than the Frontier.

>>28447940
Also constant insulting of another character, which she never fights.

>>28447940
>Except Silver tried to return what he stole you faggot
I don't remember this happening.

>Also cite anywhere of Zinnia feeling regret for her action.
How is someone going on a quest for self-reflection and asking you to take care of things they clearly regret not, you know, regret?
Why does it need to be said?

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>>28447631
>>antagonizes Steven constantly
I did like how he never really gave much of a response.

>>28447657
I guess you could say Steven's a bit stone-faced

>>28444082
>No, she's Nukita's waifu ala Lightning or Rose.

The only one here I recognize is Lightning.

>>28447966
Oh boo hoo she insulted your perfect prettyboy capitalist. Who cares?

>>28447657

The real problem is that she doesn't back up her insults.

She never once tries to actually fight Steven for his key stone unlike Maxie/Archie and May. It makes her look really pathetic.

>>28448006
Are you saying bulling another character is a good thing for a kids game?

When she's suposed to hero of the story

>>28447979
Yeah. He's an adult

>>28448039
Yet she's clearly able to defeat him if she was able to take down Wally.

... or am I the only one who had more trouble with Wally than Steven?

>>28448006
Well there's not much else to her character.

>>28447994
Oh wait, Rose from Tales of Zestiria right?

>>28447966
Would it have been mattered I'd she fought him? If she won would that make it okay? That's silly. That's like a 12 year old mindset or an anime villain mindset that the one who wins a fight is right to do what they did.

Also, she dislikes Steven because how the Devon company creates infinite energy. She's not nice about it but its not like she's just a bitch for no reason.

>>28448077
I thought she didn't fight Wally?

>>28448062
Bullying someone who is okay with killing a whole entire other planet isn't bullying in any sense that matters.

Do you expect me to believe Steven doesn't trust what the Draconids say is true? The only way you could be stupider is if you said Cynthia didn't believe them. He's a fucking archeaologist. He SHOULD believe an ancient peoples.

>>28448077

She didn't take down Wally. She just stole the key stone from his house while he was somewhere else.

>>28448119

It's not about being right, but if she is going to shit talk him so much she could throw down at least once.

>>28447978
>>How is someone going on a quest for self-reflection and asking you to take care of things they clearly regret not, you know, regret?
No she didn't say that
>"“I was finally able to bring everything to an end. I thank you for that. I think I'll spend some time now trying to find out if it's also possible to forge a new beginning for something once lost. Until we meet again,"

That's your shitty headcannon

>>28444869
>Would it have been better if she became a main villain during the delta story

If her actions and dialogue were EXACTLY the same, just with the other characters treating her as a villain and the arc ending like it does in Pokémon Adventures fug it would improve the story tenfold.

>>28448129

Where is their proof?

>>28448129
>He's a fucking archeaologist. He SHOULD believe an ancient peoples.
how is that even remotely sequitur
archeologists dig up shit about mythology all the time; do you seriously think that the people who dug up old greek artefacts believe the stories of zeus and apollo? if anything they're less likely to believe it because they're scientists who would likely study where these beliefs came from and why they were the way they were.

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Because Zinnia's brand of "crazy" isn't based on stalking the mc out of love, doing it for the lols or being bitch. It is literally based on some sperg cultist who is a straight up asshole to everyone she meets.

The only endearing quality she has is that she's decent fap bait. Everything else about her and her backstory is forgettable garbage.

>>28446730
>being this fucking new
Lurk the fuck more

>>28448062
Nigga people bitch and whine about characters not bullying us enough in these games and hate having friends who are actually friendly. Don't try to play that card. Being one of the protagonists or heroes of a story doesnt mean you have to be a nice guy. Many good stories have been told featuring protagonists who were not nice people. This is not one of them but this is a stupid criticism.

>>28448119
If she wanted her plan to work. Why not explain her plan once?

Instead of saying "you need imagination"

>>28448155
But she's shit talking him for reasons unrelated to his skills as a trainer.
It's irrelevant. And even if they battled what does that mean in the context of the game? It doesn't add anything. The only that'd change is you walking in on them afterwards or something. It doesn't really matter

>>28448199
>literally Pokemon
>the actual antagonists become nice
>the hero is the meanest character

>Nigga
Oh you're just retarded

>>28448250
>former champ
That's literally his nickname

>>28448188
Pokemon universe is a place where legends about Zeus and Apollo are real and the game does not hide this. Almost every game is in fact about those gods and legends coming to life in front of your eyes.

>>28447978
>Professor Elm even expressly states that Silver's Pokémon have come to trust him when Silver returns to the lab, presumably to return the starter he stole

Would you look at that, character growth

>>28448289
that doesn't mean that every single legend is true, though, and it doesn't make sense that he (or anyone, for that matter), would just believe it without any reason to actually believe that it's true.

>>28448289
Execpt she doesn't tell him (or anyone her plan) until the Spear Pillar which was locked for a long time or something

I hope this thread has taught us a valuable lesson about the type of person who likes Zinnia.

>>28443935
Zinnia was completely in the right, it's just that Mega Fug didn't trust her.

>>28448212
Because it's a plot device, and an EXTREMELY common one. Its purpose is yo create a conflict in a plot that might notborgerwise have one, which allows the story and excuse to keep moving and be dynamic which is especially important in a video game.Doesn't make it good but it's also not notably bad here, and Pokemon hasn't and doesn't tout itself as a literary gold mine. This is par for the course for the series.

>>28448401
>it's a plot device

YES THATS IT. WE'RE CALLING THIS SHITTY WRITING

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>>28448376
>scientists don't trust her
>the player doesn't trust her
>not even the being she's gathering keystones for trusts her

>>28448327
It does mean that if its part of plot that we should assume that it is true because narratively there's no reason to bring it up if it's not. It's pointless. As said earlier, it'a like why there's rumors of a secret cave or a powerful weapon its always true in video games, for example.

>>28447600
>I'm not sure why anyone would like Cozmo or Steven

Are you really defending Zinnia while not liking Steven?

>>28448427
You're also calling her a bad person, which she isn't. That's what I'm arguing against personally. Yes Pokemon has shitty writing, no one is surprised. Yet she's the only character who gets shit for it.

Then again I disagree with the idea that N is a villain or truly antagonistic at all. He is a pure soul will good intentions who literally had no idea he was enabling his evil father's goals.

>>28448467
Denialfags win 9/10 times, but for whatever reason when they lose everyone shits on them repetitively yelling out denialfags BTFO'd again and calling them stupid

>>28448427
A plot device isn't a shitty thing in and of itself you imbecile. Now I know you actually know shit all about storytelling. And i even say in my post it isn't good one anyway. Learn some reading comprehension That wasn't even a long post.

>>28448454
>>the player doesn't trust her
Bullshit, I trusted her.
Admittedly I thought she was going to pull a Yoda rather than turn out like she did, but I trusted her from the start.

>>28448515
She doesn't feel bad for what she does.

Which is why I love N he changes and feels bad for what he does but understands what needs to done

Looker side missions were great too

>>28448467
but that doesn't mean that STEVEN has to think that it's true. and, furthermore, there is a reason it could be brought up if it's not true; to confuse the reader, to lead them into believing it is true when it isn't, or to introduce doubt.

>>28447978
>I don't remember this happening.
It happens in the remakes only.

>>28448454
>the player doesn't trust her
The option to trust her is there actually.

She just has a giant case of "I'm the chosen one", and then proceeded to get NTR'd of the position by the MC.

I don't blame her though, she probably grew up knowing everything about Rayquaza that she was the most logical person to be chosen by Rayquaza. Kinda like Kung Fu Panda.

>moral of ORAS is "different people are different, get along with people who are different"
>Zinniafags and Zinniahaters shitflinging at each other

Ah, irony, my old friend...

>>28448541
>
The term is commonly used in a derisory manner, on the grounds that the best stories are character driven, and using an object to make things happen is thus seen as a sign of bad writing.

>>28448541

It's a shittily written plot device, imbecile

>>28448592
What? There is no moral in the delta episode

>>28448622
I fucked up that spacing

>>28448555
You used the sample archaeologists in real life wouldn't believe in Greek gods because they dig up ancient greek artifacts or whatever, which would be crazy because obviously Greek gods don't exist in the real world. But we and other characters know "gods" do exist in the Pokemon world so the analogy is pointless. Yeah, it's true that it could be brought up to intentionally confuse the reader, but I thought you and I could safely eliminate that as the intention of the writers in this instance.

>>28448655
I was talking about ORAS in general, not the Delta Episode.

>>28448592
>Villain team leader admits to fucking up and being in the wrong, apologizes to player and rival team leader
>Both teams try to understand each other

>Zinnia apologizes for nothing and fucks off before making anything right

Not quite the same.

>>28448626
Do you read? I said that right in the post you replied to.

>>28448675

The moral of ORAS is Zinnia is stupid since all the events happened due to her.

>>28444869
HAVE HER APOLOGIZE AT THE END HOLY SHIT THAT WAS LITERALLY IT

WHY COULDN'T SHE JUST FUCKING APOLOGIZE

>>28445246
Nah, the issue is that in spite of the gimmick, you physically could NOT exclude Nueko from your game experience, you were literally railroaded into having her around and the plot basically revolved around here, limiting player choice -- in addition to being annoying as fuck and one hell of a sue.

>>28448698

Then it's shitty writing.

>>28448707
You're kidding yourself if people would seriously be okay with her if all she did was apologize.

>>28448769

She could also show her tits.

>>28448769
I would be a lot less mad personally.

You could argue she changed as a character after that, and not be a bad human or be left as a bully.

>>28448664
To add on to this, the idea of spirituality and supernatural creatures with great powers isn't at odds with science in Japanese culture. Though a large majority of Japanese people wouldn't call themselves religious or practicing Shinto, they still visit shrines and temples and such with regularity, and believe or follow superstition (such as saying "moshimoshi" on the phone to make sure the other person isn't a monster in disguise). So, for a Japanese game to assume a legend is real wouldn't be a stretch.

>>28448664
>which would be crazy because obviously Greek gods don't exist in the real world
that's not what i said, and, as an aside the concept of gods isn't easily falsifiable since many religions claim for them to be "outside the laws of nature" (possibly to blanket-deny people who point out some glaring holes in their ideology).

i said that they wouldn't believe them because they examined the beliefs and can usually determine how and why they came up with them; for example, x god mirrors y god from this other religion, which in fact conquered x at some point, so it makes sense that some of y's beliefs would be imparted even after y left. or, another example, they came up with an origin story of the world because most people are curious about where they came from, and used gods as a plot device because, surely, no mortal has the sort of power one would need to create a world, stars, and so on. analyizing things objectively like that makes it much easier to figure out why tales like this were thought of and passed along, since they tend to be done organically/logically if you look far enough and not simply randomly.

>>28448769
If she actually returned the shit she stole, apologized to the NPCs and showed genuine remorse, I would like her.

Fuck I'd just like to rematch her to hear that sweet music again, it was wasted in that easy-mode fight.

>>28448871
That's bullshit and you know it. That you would like her if she just apologized and returned what she stole herself. It changes absolute none of of the tons of other tiny shit people want to nitpick about her. Not to mention someone doing wrong and then going 'oh sorry" about it doesn't change the fact that they did wrong. If it's such a big damn deal that she nearly killed the world twice or whatever, returning the shit and saying surely shouldn't cut it.

>>28448929
>That's bullshit and you know it.
Nah, fuck you. That would change her character by showing something called REMORSE, which she doesn't show at all otherwise. As it stands her character has no real conclusion and just leaves you to deal with the clean up.

You realize Silver stole a pokemon and N wanted to do some crazy bad shit too, right? Characters can do bad things and still end up likable.

>>28448978
Silver stole a Pokemon and HAD N had no idea he was doing wrong. Characters can end up likable. But people actively want to hate this character and it is NOT just because she didn't just apologize for nearly destroying the world twice, oh and also stealing some stuff. If absolutely NOTGING changed and she left an apology and said shr gave back the stuff not whatever on that last note, are you telling me with a straight face "yeah shes cool now"? Really? You expect me to believe that? If she had people would be doing exactly what I'm doing no, that feeling remorse for it doesn't justify the shit she pulled. This isn't just Silver stealing a Pokemon. Its not even N unwittingly being a part of a gambit to take over a region.

>>28445521
Honest to god anon, it really isn't. I've never seen a single character destroy a narrative that hard.

>>28449087
If it was an apology as poorly written as your post, then yeah, I wouldn't be satisfied. But if she actually showed remorse for her actions, it would put a nice conclusion on her character arc and open up the possibility for a high level trainer for us to battle (such as Silver, N, Colress). As it stands she feels like a less complete character than fucking Eusine because there is no satisfying payoff to her arc. She just fucks off at the end.

>>28445604
Thank fucking christ Masuda is leaving.

>>28443935
Zinnia is the best character to come out of Gen 6.

Let's be real here, if the Zinnia writer is still employed for sun and Moon, we gotta brace ourselves for the second coming of Nueko, and it's probably going to be Lillie or Lusamine the ones receiving this guy attention.

I don't want to hate our Toe Cleavage Goddess, but if she is literally Zinnia I will end up heartbroken.

>>28449375
I have a new thing that will ruin Sun/Moon for me. Another Delta Episode-style bullshit from the same team. And it'll probably happen, too. I finally found the thing that's killed my hype, two months before release.

Shit.

>>28443935
She's a dumb Mary Sue who is extremely fucking annoying.

She is the worst.

>>28449449
There was a "leak" that said Zinnia, along with some other characters, is going to be in S&M. I'd hate for her to be forced into another game if that's true.

>>28449496
It was another fake and gay leak. Not real, not legit, and in no way true.

>>28449496
Please don't tell me it was one of the Chinese leaks. I can only take so much.

>>28449532
Thank fuck for that.

>>28449375
Lillie DOES seem like she might be the kind of person to run off with UB-01 and try 'defending it' from people who don't want to harm it, thus causing a big issue over nothing.

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>>28444045
just curious, where/when/how the hell did fug actually start

>>28449601
Something to do with the German type name for "Flying" iirc being in a screenshot of Rayquaza in ORAS.

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>>28444111
Checked

>>28449625
Ah makes sense. Must be that dumb face, always gets a chuckle out of me

>>28449496

As far as I know Riddler never hinted at anything about Zinnia.

She probably isn't in. They actually hear the Japanese fans.

>>28447581
I'm not gonna make a whole list of characters that proves that wrong or even try to point out what's wrong with your logic, but I'll just say that Colress easily disproves you on both points. He's part of an evil team but he only chooses to be there because it furthers his own goals. Between you and Team Plasma he doesn't really give a shit either way, he just picks the side that he thinks will progress his research.

>>28446730
you aint worth enough to know fug

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>>28446730
Rayquaza.
Back to redshit with you, underage.

>>28448095
Yep.

>>28449375
I imagine he might, since on XY Nukita was an assistant writer or something like that before he became Scenario Director for ORAS. Seems to me like the start of the sort of passing of the torch SM is doing.

As for another Zinnia, who knows. If it happens I'd bet on Lillie, and it will be terrible, but other than Zinnia and Delta Episode I actually liked the changes to the RS story, so I have hope if they are back maybe they won't make that mistake again.

Because it is part of her character that she loved someone that died, and that makes her a slut in Japan because muh pure waifu

>>28443935
>fit short hair tomboy
>no midriff

Simply stupid design.

>>28449375
It depends. No matter how much the autistic kid that said "japan doesn't hate her, just a specific group does" wants to believe, people in japan were against its writing for Sun/Moon.

I want to think that Ohmori has learned something about terrible writing after OR/AS, but the possibility of that moron of Nukita still being there prevails.
Now, i'm worried about Nueko 2: Electric boogaloo.

For fucks sake, even Toshinobu Matsumiya was a better writer. WHY didn't they hired him for this one? He did a tremendous job for all the other games!

>>28451880
>Matsumiya
>not wanting the return of Tajiri

>>28451968
Taijiri would be fine as well, but he said it first. He didn't liked to be so pressed by making the stories for his games, other than the first two (which is why Miyamoto helped "a little" with it)

He's not coming back to make another game, though. He said it in the GCCX Game Freak special. Directly to Arino. It bothers his autism (and it's more akin to not liking being pressed to do things)