Why does the Pokemon English dub suck so badly now?

>>28271903
Shitty budget

>>28271961
Why can't they up it, though? Why are TPCi even cheaper than 4Kids?

>>28271903
I guess that confirms I wasn't just hearing things when I heard a dumbass call Houndour a "Houndoom" in the spanish dub. It was probably the same episode too.

>>28272005
No, you weren't, it was some Team Flare grunt.

TPCi had a Voltorb say "Electrode" in the 3rd Hoopa short dubbed, too, this is crap even 4Kids stopped doing later on...it's unreal.

Is the Spanish dub as terrible as the English dub is now? I know Gabo got the boot, but not sure how his replacement is.

>>28271903
The dub is a vehicle for selling toys, nothing more.

btw when I said "dub" I meant "the anime"

>>28272056
I know, but TPCi are so cheap, they make that blatantly obvious with their terrible dubbing.

At least the Japanese Version tries to hide that and puts some degree of effort into its acting, music, and dialogue...but the current dub? No.

Even 4Kids was better, 4-freakin-Kids, even they never replaced the Japanese music in Movies later on, something TPCi is guilty of for the last 2 (going on 3 if the trend continues) films.

The dub is pure cancer.

I actually miss 4Kids. TPCi dub is soulless

>>28272165
It went downhill in late 2006, but XY onwards is the worst it's ever been, sadly agreed.

>>28272262
Same. The fact 4Kids kept more of the Japanese music overall in both the Anime & Movies at this point, had better OPs, voice actors, and their dialogue was far more natural and less jaded hipster (especially in regards to TRio) than TPCi sure doesn't help my opinion of the current dub.

At least 4Kids treated Pokémon with some respect, despite their faults, but TPCi literally doesn't give a crap how bad the quality gets as long as they get good ratings (which, it's not, as they only get 7-8 hundred thousand viewers on CN these days).

>>28271903
I like the dub and watch it when I can.

>>28272375
Why, though? It's quality is the lowest it has ever been at this point.

I'd get liking the dub if this was early on, but now?

Heck, even the Pokémon's voices have gotten worse over time...Goodra, Talonflame (especially the newer voice it just got), Noivern, Greninja...you can't really think any of those are bearable.

Hoopa's was also terrible, too, ugh. The Pokémon's voices have even gotten worse.

>>28272410
Eh. Its simple fun show to watch. I like most of the voices.
>FreeShrugs.jpg

>>28272424
>I like the voices

I don't see why considering Ash and TR have worse voices now than they did when 4Kids had the license (especially James...he sounds like an old guy with a cold now) and Bonnie sounds ear gratingly squeaky and yet womanly, but ok, though the dub's bad writing and excessive music replacement (and continuing the only bad things about the previous dub, edits/errors) don't help, just saying.

>>28272452
Okay.?

>>28272468
To each their own. That said, did you know the TPCi dub had a rapist as its voice director for 7 1/2 years? That's really telling how little they care about the show, desu.

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>>28272484
Didn't know that. Thats kinda cool.

>>28272500
How so? The guy even admitted smugly to a fan he didn't care how much music was replaced, how many script rewrites their were, etc. All he said he cared about was that the show got good ratings...which is hilarious, considering its ratings are declining over time.

I really think Pokémon should get a better dubber, because this is just embarrassing, desu.

>>28272500
This guy?

http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Tom_Wayland

Punchable

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>>28272513
>>28272518
You're now the voice director for the dub who do you cast for SM?

>>28272518
Agreed, his attitude and direction were both shit. Wayland sadly may be gone, but both Theresa Buchheister and Lisa Ortiz haven't changed a thing about the dub's quality (or lack of it) since then.

As long as Cathcart has free reign over the script, though, I fear the dub won't be bearable for a few more years. If only TPCi would take DuArt's license to dub away like they did to 4Kids and TAJ before them (both of whom were better at dubbing Pokémon than DuArt at this point).

>>28271903
>Now
The dub has always been bad.

>>28272561
The first three seasons have their charm if you ignore the movies, but after that....

>>28272541
Dump Ash and Team Rocket's current VAs, and rehire Taylor, Stuart, Lillis, and Price. Also bring Zagnit back as Oak, while I'm at it.

Keep 100% of the Japanese OST, and at full volume, too.

Finally, a faithful translation for all characters, no JCC-style rewriting of everything from TR and most of the stuff Ash and co. say.

>>28272561

No, the dub was a lot better in earlier years.

>>28272579

Movies 4 to 8 also have their charm dubbed, though, they were better dubbed than the first 3 so I can say that, and they had their Japanese OSTs fully intact as well.

Meanwhile, Seasons 4 to 8 still keep a little more than a third of the Japanese music, which is better than 9-10 and 17-present, so the dub was at LEAST more watchable back then.

>>28272055

His replacement it's utter trash. Sounds like a 50 year old trying too hard to sound hip and cool. Ash language feels very outdated and the tone is way too childish. It's pretty jarring next to Gabo's.

>>28272645
Sounds a lot like Natochenny's Ash vs. Taylor's Ash, geez, I'm glad I went Japanese w/subs rather than the Spanish dub.

I heard TPCi ruined the Brazilian dub cast with recasting all of them after 18 seasons, too, just sad.

>>28272611
The problem with the score of the seasons 4-8 4Kids episodes isn't just them keeping less Japanese music, it's also their shitty ADD scoring. Especially in the AG episodes. Those episodes were 22 minutes of back to back 4 second music cues.

I've tried the english dub once or twice ans it's pretty terrible, even from a french guy's perspective. Everyone talks in a very forced way, even the french dub is better.

>>28272733
I get that, but honestly even their ADD scoring wasn't as bad as the stuff Goldfarb has come up with for the XY episodes, and it too suffers from a lack of never shutting up with zero silence.

At least 4Kids' dub music sounded like something from seasons 4-8 that fit the mood, though, it matched scenes it was placed in...I've heard TPCi's latest dub music in seasons 17-19, and that UFO/elevator stuff has NO place in Pokémon.

>>28272735
Good taste, Anon, glad even you can see how forced the acting is.

I think Veronica Taylor (old ash) is a pretty good voice actor. She has a high vocal range

>>28271903

Where can you watch the subbed version?

>>28272792
Veronica Taylor was pretty good as Ash, May, and Delia, I'd have to agree.

I liked Eric Stuart as Brock and James as well, really, the 4Kids actors fit their characters for the English dub.

In comparison, TPCi's actors still sound extraordinarily forced ten years in, and many still can't emote worth a damn, which is...sad.

>Ashes voice getting grainier and grainier

>>28272806
kissanime.to, please do, it's so much better than the crappy TPCi dub. You'll notice an instant leap in quality when it comes to the music and dialogue, regardless of your stance on the acting.

>>28272829
Sarah Natochenny has gotten too effeminate and raspy with her Ash voice in XY, I'd have to agree. These days, in the dub, Ash sounds like a teenage girl reading the title cards, and a woman doing a raspy, deep voice otherwise...it's so weird.

I'm so used to the Pokemon dub that I frankly don't care if it's bad or not. Unlike some people I don't take the anime too seriously and just watch it for fun. One Piece 4kids dub will still be the worst of the worst imo.

Dub Team Rocket > Japanese Team Rocket

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>>28272861
>Mid series veronica taylor

>>28272882
You got used to crappy dubbing, Anon, TPCi's dub of Pokémon is bad and just because 4Kids' One Piece dub was also bad, isn't an excuse to stomach it.

>>28272892
Cathcart pls go.

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>>28271903
>why does the english dub suck so bad?
Well the entire Ashime sucks so what do you expect?

>>28272882
Good taste anon

>>28272907
It's amazing how much Taylor progressed and how much Natochenny regressed, really, that's all I have to say about Ash's English dub voice. Matsumoto is queen, though, obviously.

Cathcart and Knotz are cancerous as TR, though, I didn't think they could get harder on the ears than in DP's dub...but XY's dub proved me wrong.

>>28272922
Bad taste, is more like it.

Getting used to crap doesn't make it smell any less, guys, time doesn't erase a bad dub from getting worse over time, which Pokémon's has as of the last few years.

>>28272939
No. Good taste.

>>28272861

The raspy voice is weird considering Natochenny is HOT.

http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Sarah_Natochenny

>>28272920
I guess, but it's obvious the dub had more effort put into it early on than it does now. They even used to release music on CDs and had dub-added songs back when 4Kids did the dub, as well as special features like a Japanese trailer of Heroes on the Celebi Movie DVD.

TPCi doesn't do any of that shit now, and CN lets the Series rot in a 6 AM time slot, it's pretty sad to watch.

>>28272951
Sarah Natochenny may be hot, but her voicing Ash, is definitely not. She has no emotion in her performance, it's like she's reading lines off a page now...how can Natochenny be so bored all the time?

>>28272944
http://pbskids.org/arthur/games/factsopinions/

>>28272892
This too. Fuck that dieing of lung cancer jap meowth

>>28272978

I was saying I want to pound her butt despite her bad acting, anon.

>>28272999
>Liking Cathcart's gangster alleyway "Do your worst impression of Maddie Blaustein" take
>Dissing Inuyama's take

For fuck's sake, I may not like Jap Meowth the most, but she's way better than Cathcart's take. He's so deep and gruff that he's legit painful on the ears, not to mention the abrasive "Dig it, jack," "Lugs," "My achin' mug," etc. dialogue he writes.

Dub TR has been shit since halfway into DP, and that hasn't changed with XY (in fact, it's gotten even worse in all 3 characters' cases).

>>28273005
Understandable, I don't fault you for that.

lol just because I'm used to the Pokemon dub doesn't mean I think it's great. I still prefer 4kids dub over TPCi. Again I just watch it for fun. I don't even think the Pokemon Anime in general is all that great. Why do I still watch the Pokemon anime then? Just for the heck of it.

>>28273026
You're okay, then, I don't mind you: still, it wouldn't kill them to up the quality of the dub? It'd honestly go a long way in making the Series more popular again.

CN doesn't help, though, they don't even do reruns these days. I don't like the TPCi dub myself, but come on, is more Teen Titans Go! really worth it?

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>When you have to pause the show for a minute to cringe at the rock music they shove into the background

>>28273016
Thats like your opinion man.

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>>28272484
>i don't like the guy, he's a rapist

>>28273066
Likewise, though if you don't like Jap Meowth, current dub Meowth is as shit or worse, desu. It's also deep, gruff, and sounds like he smokes a lot.

Both of 4Kids' voices for Meowth were better than TPCi's voice for him, honestly, Cathcart can't voice anyone well these days in general (see: James, Prof. Oak).

>>28273059
The UFO music is the worst, like when Inkay tries to go to that kid in the TR dress up as Ash and co. episode early in XY, or in the Hoopa Movie when Ash is flying on Latios.

The ballet and/or elevator music during the battle with Diantha in the dub was also total shit, though.

At least 4Kids' placed their dub music appropriately when they used it, despite blaring it too much at times, but TPCi's even worse about this since XY began.

>>28273088

Huh? You don't mind rape then?

>>28273099
Nah. Jap mewoth is worse, but we'll agree to disagree.

>>28273088
It's not just because he's a rapist, Buster, it's because he legit said he didn't care how badly he treated the dub when he was in charge. Wayland legit told a fan he didn't care how much music was replaced or how much the script was rewritten, etc.

Wayland was a dick, desu. That said, Ortiz's direction is just as crappy as his was, so nothing changed since he left.

>>28273115
Eh, I'd take Inuyama's scratchy voice over Cathcart's gravelly smoker voice for Meowth, but to each their own, guess we'll agree to disagree there.

I wish Nathan Price would get Meowth back instead of JCC, but what can you do, TPCi are too cheap to rehire him and JCC has too much control over the dialogue now so his crap is a permanent fixture of the current dub.

>>28273130
And I'd take cathcart over a cheese grater.

>>28273117

need context. if i was pestered by an annoying weeaboo manchild and chastised about how i handle localization i'd tell him to fuck off too

>>28273141
Cathcart would be a cheese grater to me, but ok, I do think Meowth has the worst voice of the Jap ones (I also think Cathcart's Meowth is awful, though). That said, his dialogue is way better in Japanese regardless of opinion on his voice: there's none of that gangster slang and "Oy vey," or "We had trouble luggin' a large load like," stuff TPCi shoves in his mouth in it.

I'm not even kidding, I genuinely like TR's dub dialogue.

>>28271903
TCPi's in-house studio only dubs this single show, that says enough about their level of quality and talent available

>>28273147
It was a fan who went to Midwest Media Expo who asked him about the Pokémon dub, and Wayland told this to him.

That said, Wayland fucked off and the dub is just as bad with Ortiz in charge so far, so...maybe TPCi is just shit with Pokémon dubbing in general?

>>28273158
What's to like about unfunny alliterations, slang, and rhyming introduced by an old man who thinks he's funny and also bashes the Japanese TR as "not being funny" compared to the crap he calls comedy, though?

Cathcart in general has an ego the size of a house, too, guy dissed the 4Kids dub and Japanese Versions online as "old guard truthseeker" on Serebii forums. He also said he was the best dub James and it'd be proven in time (more like the worst dub James and it was proven in time) on Bulbagarden under the same pseudonym.

>>28273170
It's actually kind of amazing how TPCi is kinda like the Odex of America dubbing. The worst possible voice talent available that is so cheap it consists of talent too cheap for 4Kids to hire, a script writer who was so bad in the 4Kids era he had to have most of his dialogue rewritten according to Maddie Blaustein who has been chief script writer since TPCi took over, and on top of that, Ed Goldfarb and his awful UFO and elevator music score with XY's dub.

They're legitimately worse than 4Kids was, by miles, it'd be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.

>>28273191
I don't give a shit about the guy's ego. He made TR more enjoyable to me.

>>28273222
>He made TR more enjoyable to me.

This review says it all about TPCi TR to me, couldn't disagree more, Cathcart (and Knotz) took all the fun out of them and made them intolerable.

http://dogasu.bulbagarden.net/comparisons/diamond_pearl/ep153.html

>>28271903
You forgot
>Never updating the title cards so it's always Ash and the old Serena design because TPCi are too lazy to change it to the other 12 cards that exist.

Still, I agree, TPCi's dub is garbage and there's really no defense for it at this point.

>>28271903
I sadly have to agree. This guy says it best, really:

https://twitter.com/TheAnimationMan/status/752586777441865728

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>>28271903
>>Removing the AmourShipping hint in the XY119 dub from Serena

Stay mad amourfags.

>>28274697
I'm not an AmourShipper, though, Anon: that said, it's because TPCi is removing references to love. For all their silly editing, 4Kids of all people actually ADDED love references at times and kept most of them...

It's stunning TPCi's dialogue is less mature than 4Kids' was, but it is.

>>28274708
Actually most of the dub has the exact same amour things the original has. It must have not been very important if they got rid of it.

I think one of the people that subs episodes said that it wasnt actually her about to confess in xyz 28.

>>28274708
Are you serious? What the heck did they do to the formal party? Or Serena having an orgasm from pretending to be Ash?

>>28274733
They still did get rid of it and replaced it with this, though, Anon.

TPCi have been hiding death since BW, and are now hiding love in XY...I mean, come on, this is stuff TPCi in BF/DP and 4Kids would actually keep and/or ADD to in the past.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvUTtXe7P8M

I know the dub has gone downhill since almost 10 yrs. ago, but this is just ridiculous.

>>28274749
They didn't alter the latter, but they had Serena's VA squeal like a Raven in the dub in the former: the real butchery is in the Winding Woods episode, see >>28274758.

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>>28274758
Dub Serena sounds like a woman, that's not a 10 year old's voice...at all.

Ash sounds like a raspy voiced woman, on the other hand, and Natochenny still can't scream or emote worth a damn.

And people wonder why no one likes the dub nowadays...it's not about being a weeb, TPCi's dubbing of the Series is flat out terrible.

>>28274810
Ash's voice is actually one of the few I don't find completely awful.

>>28274758
Woah! It's like the 90s all over again. Early 90s. I know complete amateurs that can act better than this. Does an actual autistic person write this? Because they sure don't understand how people talk.

>>28274817
I'm curious who you do find awful, if so, but personally I'm not a fan of his current dub voice actress' voice, or acting, myself.


I thought Veronica Taylor acted the part with more emotion and her voice was more boyish, myself. You'd think given she had less time, 8 years, Natochenny would've been alright by now...but no, she still blows compared to Taylor, imo.

>>28274843
>I'm curious who you do find awful
The only ones that aren't completely miscast, awfully acted, or both are Ash, Meowth and Jessie. They're all worse than their 4Kids voices, sure, but they don't make me cringe when I listen to them the way most of the rest of the dub does.

>>28274830
It's been the same old guy who has been in charge of writing the dub's scripts since Season 9 and was the worst writer in dub Seasons 5 to 8, good ol' JCC (James Carter Cathcart aka Jimmy Zoppi), though it does seem like his lack of writing talent has increased since halfway into DP when he thought humor was shoving alliterations and slang into people's mouths along with never-ending rhyming even outside of the TR mottos.

Guy needs to get the boot, desu, his script writing is one of the biggest offenses of the TPCi dub and the fact he's been around since Season 5 (albeit back then 4Kids' writers rewrote all his garbage according to Maddie Blaustein through Season 8) back when 4Kids had the dub just sucks.

>>28274843
I dont like either of them, ive been fine with every other voice actor other than james but I think both have just been awful.

>>28271903
I personally think it's the fault of all the religious retards still working over there. Why are they even allowed to have jobs?

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>The dub openings will no longer be more than 30 seconds
I used to enjoy singing the earlier dubbed songs from Hoenn in my head, but what was TPCi thinking?

>>28274860
It's really saying something when TPCi botched the XY characters' dub voices even more than they did the recasts...man, the dub has nosedived the last few years, absolutely tragic.

I think Meowth and Jessie sounded better in Battle Frontier than they do now, though, both offend me for different reasons (Meowth to me is far too rough and gravelly now in the dub, which makes you forget that he actually does have a sweet side, along with the slang dialogue JCC himself writes for the characer & Jessie's current VA has gotten far too high pitched and whiny since DP for my tastes). Ash has been all over the place for me, though I've noticed a decline since late BW in Sarah's performance throughout XYZ, personally.

I'm glad everyone seems to agree on James' current dub voice being crap, though, Cathcart makes Stuart's worst sound great by comparison these days.

>>28274904
Yeah, James is probably the single worst voice in the dub. What the absolute hell were they thinking?

>>28274901
It's not just Pokemon, pretty sure that openings in general have about a maximum of 30 seconds allowed to squeeze in more room for advertising in the timeslot.

>>28274886
Beats me, though I'd say the two people I want off the dub the most are JCC (awful script writing) and Ed Goldfarb (awful music replacements). I would like the voice cast to be changed again, but not if DuArt has a choice in that, after seeing what they did to Sawyer...I know they'd eff it up even more with their dub staff.

>>28274901
TPCi really dropped the ball on the openings, true, in particular the 1st DP theme and the XYZ dub theme are total shit. Even 4Kids' worst theme was 1,000 times better than those two...TPCi seems to lack any musical taste in general, sadly.

>>28274874
I thought Taylor was solid and improved a great deal over her run...Natochenny, more or less the reverse, though.

>>28274901
That may not be entirely TPCI's doing. Advertising wants to hog all the time. This is also why the show itself is a few minutes shorter as well.

I kinda like Clemont's voice desu

>>28274918
It sounds like TPCi are trying to emulate AG Eric Stuart's James...and it's backfired horribly, with TPCi James sounding like a mix of that and his own DP James, the result of which is this hideous old man with a nasty cold voice.

>>28274927
That didn't stop Steven Universe from churning out a better OP than XYZ's "Stand Tall" dub theme, though, TPCi do lack passion for intros.

>>28274942
CN plays a part in the time limit, but...even when 4Kids had only 10 more seconds than that in their "Advanced" intro, it still came out better than a majority of TPCi's themes, so TPCi's laziness is a factor in the crappiness of many of the post-4Kids intros in my book.

>>28274951
I'd say he's better than Ash, TR, and Bonnie's dub VAs, but he sounds too manly for a kid Ash's age. I was hoping Ortiz would direct the cast better, but no, it's Wayland for the third time in that regard (Buchheister was the second Wayland in VO direction quality before she got the boot).

The shit writing and rehashing the same plot every episode is a much bigger problem than the dub

>>28275007
>The shit writing

But the Pokémon English dub has had that since Season 9, Anon, the show only acquired shit writing when Season 14 began.

I agree, however, that the episodic and repetitive formulaic plots of the Series itself are a bigger issue, but the dub's lack of quality these days does nothing to offset the originals' issues, only aggravating them.

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>>28274865
>Worst dub writer in Seasons 5-8
>Been writing TPCi's awful scripts since Seasons 9-present
>Shit as James, Butch, Oak & Meowth

Is there anything this man hasn't destroyed? Did TPCi really have to keep the weakest link from the 4Kids dub of ALL the people they could've kept? Idiots.

What exactly do you mean to accomplish, though? It is no secret no one likes the dub, and all attempts to change that have failed. They don't even provide the same things all other dubs have on having a sub option. (or even to play the raw with no subs) Then again, the only reason I can stand this show at all is because I don't really watch either, I just look at screencaps and troll around for translations if there is something that needs clarification. I will also understand that this isn't some really involved show where you want to know everything about the characters and it's production. That only begs the question of why are they so scared of everyone knowing it's an anime? I'm sure even kids know. It can't be marketed the same way other anime are? Even cutesy anime are handled by somebody, I won't accept that answer. Perhaps they really are stuck in the 90s and want to pretend that the Japanese doesn't exist. That wasn't even true when anime became popular. The bottom line is you need to get rid of the old fuddy duddys that don't know anything about modern times.

>>28275088
Yes, I know that is not something that anyone is willing to do either.

>>28275088
That would be >>28275088 and Ed Goldfarb in particular, but socking those two would leave the lack of voice acting quality as a major issue regardless.

Personally, I'm of the opinion DuArt should be dropped and the dub should leave NYC to get either a FUNimation dub or a Viz Media dub of the Series from wherever they leave off.

TPCi need to do better, because going cheap is making it evident they're stuck in 90s dubbing practices, if not subpar even by that standard.

>>28275117
Sorry, same guy as above, meant that would be >>28275058 etc.

>>28272960
The horrible time slot is probably the reason why the dub's so bad. The localization team knows no kid is going to get up that early to watch Pokemon, and anyone who does like Pokemon that much would rather watch it in Japanese.

>>28271903
Because no one even pretends to care anymore.

>>28275252
This doesn't help at all. I'm dumb enough to still watch the dub, but a 7 AM time slot (which happened just this season: prior to this it was 8 AM) is hell even for kids, let alone a guy my age. I can only hope that the fact that repeats of last week's show are now on at 7:30 (this changed maybe two weeks ago) means something.

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>YFW We don't live in the timeline where 4Kids dubs the show forever

>>28275463
JELLY DONUTS
E
L
L
Y

D
O
N
U
T
S

>>28271903

>now

Are you telling me the hoarse, throat-cancer filled voices were tolerable before?

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>>28271903
Don't forget all the replaced food.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjphanrGEKQ
They sure do hate riceballs...

>>28275117
The hard part is convincing them they'd get better profits this way, and they have little reason to think they will. This is the kind of anime only the hardcore will go for. The niche of the niche. The best angle they can possibly have for it is the matter that it's something their kids will want to watch, too. (although it would be in a section that most people would steer their kids away from) Then again, I don't know how similar anime is marketed in the west in terms of DVDs. It seems to me it's possible to just sell it like one would any other animation collection, just put in a raw/sub option and your anime fans will be happy, too.

As for ratings, let's get real here, our society has been conditioned to randomness. Kalos was not structured for that, but I know the argument exists that earlier sagas WERE more random and they still didn't do any better. The primary thing it needs is a network that will give it better attention and not have it be a footnote because they'd rather have their own productions over anything else. It's been years since I've seen anything animation related on television, so I don't know who would treat it better. All I know is that it would have to be at least basic cable to get the kind of numbers that would be worth anything. Nothing other than CN that I'm aware of will even look at anime. The alternative would be for the least costly cable packages, which I do believe have some of the more dedicated animation channels. I only know Disney XD to have anime, and that's only because of content that used to be on Jetix. I am unaware if they have anything more recent.

>>28272410
>yfw Greninja's voice carried over to Smash

http://ask.fm/Clarknova/answers/138654747881

http://ask.fm/Clarknova/answers/138654747881

http://ask.fm/Clarknova/answers/138654747881

Head of Toonami blows dubcucks the fuck out .

>>28271903
>and peas and carrots = veggies
I don't watch this shit but what's wrong with that?

>>28275342
Kids do wake up early since school days in burgerfam begin before 8 am

Now I need to ask what kind of entity Toonami exactly is and why they have no dialogue with CN.

>>28275760
The lower grades don't actually start school quite that early, but the kids are probably up anyway. That doesn't necessarily mean the kids are up that early on Saturday, the only day Pokemon is even on; combine this with the on-demand feature of many TV providers, and no wonder no one watches it in its timeslot.

>>28275776
Toonami used to be the arm of CN that showed anime during the day, edited for both an American audience and to be kid-friendly. It's now part of Adult Swim, and CN is trying to run Adult Swim as a separate deal as much as they can other than happening to be on the same channel.

Should I watch the sub instead of the dub?

>>28271903
>Removing the AmourShipping hint in the XY119 dub from Serena
Kek

>>28276021
Of course.

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Hey at least they have same sex couples!

>>28276049
Well then, this is my first time watching an anime by using the sub's.

I'll get used to it.

Thanks!

>>28276057
B-b-but florges is a dude! Clearly!

>>28271903
Team Rocket is very good though. Only good part of the dub even if the actually script is kind of lame.

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>>28276107
Buddy.....

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>>28271903
TPCi will never ever have an opening as good as Advanced Battle...

>>28276057
That pic
>>>/tumblr/

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>>28276107
>Male Florges

Huh kind a funny since your talking to the creator of a fan fiction called "Male Florges"

>tfw when you can't stand misdubbing but you've gotten used to hear spanish Ash for over 15 years
Why does this happen to me...

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>>28276141
It's a official. They become tumblr. What's next? Gamefreak going to make pokemon that's transgender

>>28276057
Everyone knows Ash's Goodra is MALE.

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>>28276174
They ruined the Latin Spanish dub. Ever since Gabo left, shit started to collapse. They're not allowed to say Mexican pendejadas anymore.

>tfw you'll never hear James singing Club America's anthem again.

>>28276272
No...he's actually asexual

>>28276361
>he
You just accepted HE is MALE.

>>28276386
Stupid auto correct!

>>28272907
I still miss Veronica Taylor to a stupid degree. Crazy to think this and the SOVA thing was 10 years ago now.

>>28272782
In case you want a taste of some kalos overload:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8x98aR-exg

It's pretty solid overall, though Ash sounds weird now since he's had the same (male) voice actor for 20 years. Jessie's got the best voice though.

>>28273251
Dogasu is so far up his own ass I can't take anything he says seriously.

>>28276406
Did you write xir/xem :^)

>>28276406
>>28276473
You should always use "them" when you're talking about someone whose gender you don't know, just like any normal person in real life does.

>>28276303
That shit was absolutely jarring for non mexican spics and turned me off the spanish dub and made me look refuge in the fucking 4kids dub

That's how bad it was.

Now I'm weeaboo enough to get around with the japanese audio and basic subtitles.

This scene is a pretty good example of how you can completely ruin an intense moment by simply swapping out the background music.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=KS-u1rVFoYU

>>28276507
I would adore a Chilean dub filled with weon and CTM or an Argentinian one with tons of ches and pibes. Slang makes it better, m8. American shows use slang all the time, yet the Brits and the Aussies never protest.

Would you rather the castellano dub instead?

>>28276536
Did you ever had Locomotion/Animax (rip ip)

Bunch of those dubs were neutral enough, you can pull it off if you're a decent translator.

>>28276558
Many of their dubs were done in Venezuela and they literally only use the same 10 people for every show.

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After the league bullshit, I just plain quit caring. I personally found XY to be equally faulty in both dub and sub.

Love the recent dub OPs though. Can't wait for the long version of the current one.

I'm sure some gaylord will say Goldfarb pls cause they cant fathom that anyone could actually like anything about the dub but whatever.

Seriously though, that league shit just about killed all the passion I had for this show. Anyone got fries for this salt? Cheese for this whine?

>>28273147
You need more context to act more or less negative? Careful your character is showing

>>28277015
I hate the recent dub OPs, and I think Goldfarb is the worst composer the dub has ever employed, but I'm not knocking you for it. 4Kids' and even earlier TPCi had better singers than him, though, if you ask me.

Also, I have some salt, take it. You might want wine instead of "whine," though.

>>28276509
TPCi's dub has gotten progressively worse and worse over time, with XY-XYZ being the peak of its lack of quality, and this video proves that to be true.

I'd take 4Kids' worst dub music a thousand times over any of TPCi's dub music via Goldfarb's stuff from the last few seasons, it's that bad.

>>28276429
I also miss Veronica Taylor, but I think Team Rocket got even more screwed than Ash in terms of their voice actors and dialogue.

I miss Maddie Blaustein, Eric Stuart, and Rachael Lillis the most, as well as the old 4Kids script writers: TPCi's Team Rocket is terribly voiced and their dialogue is cringe-worthy. If I have to hear one more "Luggin' a large load like," or "Oy vey" from Meowth or "Primo perps" from Jessie & James, I'll...ugh, TPCi TR SUCKS.

>>28276303
>>28276507
MAN latin spanish memes were great. Shit had me cracking up every time. Oh the good days

>>28276117
I disagree, TRio are the worst offenses of the current dub for me (Brock previously was, but he's gone now, so that's moot). TPCi James sounds like an old guy with a cold doing his goofiest Eric Stuart impression, TPCi Jessie is a high pitched valley girl imitation of Rachael Lillis' take, and TPCi Meowth is this really gruff and gravelly slang-y attempt at copying Maddie Blaustein. To each their own, though.

>>28276463
Dogasu's actually right about how intolerable TPCi's TR is, though, I'll give him this point.

>>28275483
The dub's voice acting has been that bad since TPCi took over, but it's gotten even worse than when they first started lately.

>>28275478
BERRIES
E
R
R
I
E
S

VEGGIES
E
G
G
I
E
S

>>28275663
>Implying TPCi is any better about calling food other names than what it is, when they aren't
>4Kids also kept rice balls sometimes anyway (see: EP055, AG006, AG040)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3TQKpVfEvo

I STAND TALL CAUSE I KNOW I AM WINNER.

>>28279671
Why is Clemont dead inside

also VEGGIES

>>28275737
TPCi think "peas" and "carrots" are offensive now, things an infant would eat, for god sakes.

This makes the rice ball cover ups seem tame, honestly, at least with that you could argue a cultural barrier existed. This? What the actual hell?

>>28275698
That Gollum dub voice is all kinds of wrong for Greninja.

AMÉRICA
TU SERAS EL CAMPEÓÓÓÓÓÓN

>>28277015
This.
I flat out stopped caring for both versions after that loss.

>>28279674
Worst. Dub. Intro. Ever.

Even I could do better than that, heck, anyone on /vp/ could.

>>28279723
BERRIES that are APPLES t. TPCi

Even 4Kids' got apples right (see "Sick Daze" where Ash says "I guess I had too many apples today!" during Johto), but TPCi messed that up, this is ridiculously dumb food censorship.

>>28279899
I actually really enjoyed Kalos Quest intro.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEeLdGEF3uI

>>28279878
The dub is far worse, regardless, just because the show is shit now, doesn't excuse TPCi's garbage from being what it is- garbage.

>>28279740
>TPCi think "peas" and "carrots" are offensive now,
[citation needed]

>>28279674
The most least hype intro ever.
At least XYZ gets you pumped for a battle.

>>28279928
It's probably the best of the XY dub themes, though it really sucks compared to 4Kids' themes, Battle Frontier, and Galactic Battles openings, imo.

Stand Tall is just cancer and needs to be dropped, though, and the XY Remix was garbage, it makes the Johto Remix look great by comparison.

>>28279949
That's why TPCi hid their existence under the obligatory collective term "veggies," but if you need proof, here you go:

"
I disagree with a lot of that but I don't want to veer things too off-topic. I will say, though, that real fruits and vegetables exist in the original version and have existed in the original version since the very beginning. The dub creating its own canon over something as ridiculous as food is completely ridiculous unnecessary.

There is absolutely no reason they couldn't have translated "peas and carrots" correctly. I promise you nobody would have cared or thought it was weird or out of place or whatever else.


#14 Dogasu, Nov 24, 2014"

Source: http://forums.bulbagarden.net/index.php?threads/s17-ep-45-splitting-heirs.170753/

Yes, TPCi is actually surprisingly worse than 4Kids about food censorship now, this is no joke.

>>28279970
IKUZE!

XYZ's Stand Tall is also arguably the worst dub intro, with only DP Rap as a contender.

>>28275711
He knows that no matter how badly TPCi/CN handle the dubbing and advertisement of the Series, there will always be idiots who will watch any dub as long as "Pokémon" is slapped as the label on it.

If you had TPCi's god-awful Pokémon English dubbing with any other Series, it'd have been mocked and ridiculed so much, that it would've been off the air a long time ago. That said, it does look like its demise has begun, the dub can't even get 1 mil viewers the ONE time it airs now on CN every week. I'd say the shitty dubbing is catching up to TPCi.

>>28280108
Don'r forget that first BW intro.

>>28280438
Rival Destinies and the XY Remix are also pretty shitty.

In general, TPCi was shit compared to 4Kids with intros (among various other things. notably TPCi's acting, dialogue/scripts, and dub BGM being largely worse than 4Kids' was). Pretty laughable that the reason for TPCi taking over was to cut costs and save money on production, rather than change the quality in any way, but it sure has shown over the years.

>>28271903
If the following people were dropped from the English dub's production, I might actually watch the dub again:

Sarah Natochenny- Wooden, listless Ash almost 10 yrs. in her acting/delivery and her voice sounds raspy, deep, and effeminate at the same time. Also her attitude is shit, she calls anyone who doesn't like her Ash as "Haters gonna hate," talk about immature.

Bill Rogers- Terrible Brock, Lucario, Scott, etc. and he also shitposted on Serebii with JCC and lied about the 4Kids' VAs replacement (which Rachael Lillis confirmed and proved with her statement in response to his way back when). Also he said Wayland left because of other opportunities in NY, when actually, he raped a woman.

Michele Knotz- Shit attitude, throws a bitchfit when someone says they think Veronica Taylor or Rachael Lillis were a better May, Misty, and Jessie than her, and trolls YouTube videos mentioning her acting like JCC.

JCC- OGT, need I say anything more? Also shit attitude towards writing TRio's dialogue since DP, his crap is not funny.

Ed Goldfarb- Awful music replacement score that never, ever shuts up, either, UFO and elevator stuff doesn't belong in Pokémon.

Fire these 5 and you may make the dub watchable again, just saying.

>>28280522
I still don't get why they don't just use their own music from japan. He'll there are fandubs of songs that are better than the Original shit they use.

>>28280753
I'm as confused as the rest of you are there. TPCi are literally the American branch of Pokémon Japan, yet can't even keep as much Japanese music as 4Kids did in their later Seasons for the last few years...that's just ridiculous, especially considering 4Kids didn't have the resources they do nor rights to the Japanese music without paying for it as they were a third party company.

What gets me is TPCi obviously do have the rights to the Japanese music (see: Hoopa dub Movie Trailer 1, dub Volcanion Movie Trailer), but end up replacing almost all of it anyway (see: Diancie Movie & Hoopa Movie, and most likely the next Volcanion one, too). Supposedly, just like they cheapened out on the voice acting, TPCi's reasoning for this is to make more money by exporting their shitty dubbed music to other countries with their dub, though.

>>28272541
Fuck the VAs
I suck as many Japanese dicks as it takes to get Yuki Kaijura and Yoko Kanno collaborating on music, Gen Urobuchi on story, Kenji Kamiyama directing, and Madhouse on animation.

It will be depressing, uplifting, and awesome in heretofore unseen amounts. And the soundtrack will fucking rock.

>>28280901
Hire better VAs and that's already a vast improvement over the TPCi/DuArt dub in my book.

I'd be willing to give anything new a chance at this point, really, but the current dub needs to be purged at this point- it's absolutely intolerable these days.

>2004+12
>Watching dubs in ANY LANGUAGE

TPCi ruined anything since Hasta la Pasta (Or similar, I don't remember, is the last episode dubbed for 4Kids)

>>28280064
TPCi has been doing that forever. There was an episode very early in DP that revolved around bananas where they were called "fruit" in every instance. Nobody really knows why they do that, but they must have some sort of reason since they've been doing it for the last decade.

>>28275058
If they scrapped Cathcart, the script and all 4 of the roles he took over would most likely improve with different people doing those jobs...but TPCi are too far up his butt to care.

Pretty sad the man sockpuppeted on forums under self-perceived anonymity and was the worst 4Kids talent on Pokémon, yet himself and Kayzie Rogers (also one of their weakest talents) got to jump ship to TPCi's terrible dub.
That's also why the contract excuse doesn't hold any merit he and Bill Rogers lied about at the time, because if it did, JCC and Kayzie Rogers wouldn't have gotten the chance to jump ship none of the other 4Kids' crew did at the time.

>>28281066
"Fear Factor Phony" is the exact episode the dub went downhill to be specific, and yes, "Pasta La Vista" was the last time the voice acting and dialogue were good in English dub Pokémon (outside of Movie 8, which is the last dubbed Pokémon film that is actually good).

I can't believe it's been almost 10 years of TPCi and not only have they gotten worse over time at dubbing the show (just look at the recent dub theme, listless acting, TR dialogue, & the music replacements as proof of this), but they show no signs of wanting to change a thing. It will eventually bite them in the ass, though, the ratings are dropping for the dub a lot these days, and it will continue with their crappy attitudes.

>>28281088
DP is when the dub started getting absolutely painful in general, but I didn't know that, thanks for that. Halfway through Cathcart thought it'd be a good idea to shove alliterations, slang, and rhymes down TRio's throats, and they've never been the same since then in the dub, though. It fucking sucks.

>>28281088
Banana was too complicated and too phallic a word for a children's cartoon. What choice did they have ?

>>28276509
It's not like 4kids would have kept that track. Instrumental versions of the Japanese theme songs have always been replaced, outside of Advance Adventure. (there apparently weren't any licensing issues with that song, since both 4kids and TPCi used it)

>>28281207
But rice balls/onigiri isn't complicated, right? It's not like everyone knows and eats bananas on the planet, but not everyone knows what onigiri is, right? Right?

They had a choice to keep bananas in the dub, same goes for apples (instead of calling them "berries"), and same goes for peas and carrots vs. the plutonic "veggies" crap TPCi went with.

>>28281195
Dub has to compete with, lol so wacky teen titans go marathons every day.

>>28281249
4Kids kept like 70% of the Japanese music in the first 3 seasons and about 33% in Seasons 4-8, which is better than the 12% TPCi have kept in Seasons 17-19, so I wouldn't say that.
Also, TPCi kept more Japanese music in BF than they have since XY began, 28%.

It's entirely possible 4Kids would've kept the instrumental, seeing as they mostly kept battle music later on and the dub music they used later was in casual scenes most of the time.

Well I already run out of salt, and, thankfully, could watch the anime.

But once sun and moon anime is out I'll watch the sub.

>>28281279
The fact the Pokémon dub is losing ratings to a show like Teen Titans Go only highlights how terribly TPCi English dub it, really, that's embarrassing. Back when 4Kids had the dub in earlier years and it aired on Kids WB, Pokémon was its highest rated show.

>>28281319
The sub is so much better, in every conceivable way, it's not worth it to watch the mangled dub version now.

>>28281317
It's not just battle music though, it's an instrumental of XYZ. The Japanese theme songs seem to have an extra layer of licensing issues attached, which is why the non-vocal versions are always replaced in the dub (again, aside from the first AG theme for whatever reason).

Ready Go! is a good example. That song used to be the Japanese version's go-to "we need exciting music to play" track for YEARS after it stopped being the theme song, but 4kids couldn't/didn't license it. XYZ Theme almost certainly would have been a similar case.

If there's a thing I don't like it's the exclamation mark in the dub's episode titles. They feel useless, annoying and forced.

>>28281539
they use the rocket-dan danka in the dub, though.

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is the music really different in the dub? I mostly noticed 4Kids' music being different because it's always a guy playing a violin followed by a long "schhwiiiing" cymbal sound

>>28281556
funny, i just made this. I was going to point out the total lack of puns using pokemon names and the their template titles that use "____ing a ____", but i just now noticed the exclamation points.

>>28281539
That's fair, but 4Kids would've still kept more Japanese music than TPCi is keeping these days in that scene, if the % of tracks they retained in their dub even in later Seasons is any indication. The XY dub barely keeps a little more than one-tenth of the Japanese OST these days, and even 4Kids' worst Season kept double that amount.

It's really inexcusable that TPCi keep less of the Japanese OST than 4Kids did nowadays, especially when 4Kids kept almost all the Japanese music in their AG Movies and TPCi is replacing almost all of it in their XY Movies.

>>28281556
I think a lot of TPCi's titles are dumb in general and they actually make me miss some of 4Kids' goofy pun titles, like these "gems" from TPCi:

"Prunning a Passel of Pals!"
"Getting the Pre Contest Titters!"
"A Trip Down Memory Train!"
"A Gaggle of Gadget Greatness!"

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>>28281444
I just wish the actual subs themselves were better. Who the fuck wants different colored font for every character? Like some characters end up with dark red/grey/green subs, who the fuck can even read that shit? Why do fansubbers always need to be such special snowflakes?

Just sub your shit with a nice, easy to read sans serif font in white with a light black outlline, why is that so hard?

Sorry, I haven't even watched all of XY yet, I'm just salty over the subs and need to vent.

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>>28281711

4 u

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KS-u1rVFoYU

>>28281741

Wait until you start seeing karaoke covering half your screen.

I appreciate the effort but that shit is fucking obnoxious.

>>28281711
Yes, TPCi actually replace more of the Japanese OST than 4Kids did nowadays, in fact: I thought 4Kids' stuff blended in a lot better, desu.

And yes, the dub titles have gotten worse, at least the pun ones were somewhat creative. Saying "____ a ___" or "___ing a ___" is dull as fuck.

I'm not exactly seeing any effort to change anything here, and all other attempts failed.

>>28274758
I can't notice much difference with the dialogue or the tone, other than the atrocious voice acting and unnecessary music.

Care to help an autist?

>>28281741
>>28281774
If only TPCi would give official subs like even 4KMedia do for Yu-Gi-Oh now...alas, they refuse.

>>28281997
TPCi changed "That's why I...that's why I" to "You're not the real Ash" garbage, more or less, however the other two do stick out glaringly more, you're not wrong about the latter.

>>28281997
The tone makes the whole thing sillier. Ash barely even sounds angry. It sounds like they're building up to a gag that never happens.

>>28274901
The last good dub opening was Unbeatable, which was back when 4Kids still did the dub.

I havent watched the dub recently, but I saw an episode of the XY dub, and it literally was the original song.

Shitty as fuck . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktJeRAHcMg4

>>28281818
TPCi seems to have given up on even remotely trying with the dub these days: not sure why, but it sucks.

>>28272269
I'd say after Hoenn it went to shit.
DP was pretty bad apart from Dawn's VA.

>>28272518
Wasn't he a rapist or something?
I remember a woman claiming he raped her at a con a year or 2, ago.

>>28282143
TPCi was clearly riding on nostalgia fans to return if they did a crappy ripoff of the original 4Kids dub theme from Season 1. Some idiots fell for it, but most like you admitted it was terrible.

>>28282144
Well, what do you expect from people that don't care about the production IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY, much less ours? Again, I will question, why does anyone bother?

>>28282148

>>28282177
Yes, and Wayland was the TPCi dub's longest running voice director so far, with 7.5 years. TPCi hired a rapist as a voice director...for 7.5 years. Let that sink in, guys.

>>28282148
Hoenn is the last time the English dub is tolerable to me as well.

BF was the decline for the dub, DP was even worse, it was a little less crap in BW but BW itself sucks so that doesn't matter, and XY's dub is flat-out unwatchable.

>>28282143
BE A HERO BE A HERO

I like that the second one of the xy songs the most.

>>28282221
That's a shame because they SHOULD care about Pokémon more than they do. TPCi's staff treat it like a chore for them and read their lines listlessly off a page, while backpedaling it with outdated catchphrases like "I'm so psyched," "A'course," "Oy vey," and the like.

They should bother because a better dub = a better show = more profit = more viewership = more popularity.

>>28282177
>>28282236
You can "claim" whatever the fuck you want. Doesn't mean the guy was actually a rapist.

>>28282304
I agree, but it still blows compared to "I Wanna Be a Hero" of all things, which was back in Season 6.

>No more Eric Stuart
What's he doing nowadays?

>>28281711
Mostly shitty guitar riffs and >>28281743

>Scrapped most music, like Iku-Ze as well as Typu Wildu during Electivire v. Infernape fight

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLVRGR-KWZI
>Didn't use this for the BF intro

>>28282322
If he wasn't a rapist, how come he hasn't been active on social media since then, and he hasn't gotten any new work or been heard from since the allegations, nor responded to them?

Wayland was an alleged rapist, regardless of opinion, and he wasn't exactly the best person to work on the dub (to put it mildly).

>>28282109
>TPCi changed "That's why I...that's why I" to "You're not the real Ash" garbage, more or less
She says basically the exact same thing in the original, she just doesn't stumble on her words as much.

>>28282236
BW was so shit. I will never forgive what they did to N's english voice.

>>28282322
No one is claiming anything.
They're probably just trying to start a discussion.

>>28282387
Because once you're accused of being a rapist you're shunned from society. That shit stays on your record permanently and since people are too dumb to think for themselves they immediately assume he's a rapist instead of thinking that the girl may have been bullshitting like they usually do. And he was "meh" on the dub.
>>28282407
I'm just talking about the girl's claims.

>>28282386
Eric Stuart's back as Kaiba for the new Yu-Gi-Oh dub film "Dark Side of Dimensions" along with Dan Green, but that's about it for him, he mostly does music with his band these days (he recently raised a fundraiser to help his band member with cancer).

Eric's Brock and James were so much better than Bill's Brock and JCC's James, though, I really do miss him: he was one of the dub's best VAs, imo.

>>28282407
How bad was it? I didn't bother to watch BW, but N seems like the type to have a voice similar to Griffith's.

>>28282386
Eric Stuart mostly does the convention circuit nowadays. I can't remember the last time there was a local con without him as a guest.

>>28282486
I remember seeing a part of a vide on YT, detailing the 4Kids dubbing process. It seemed like everyone enjoyed their job. No doubt that's the complete opposite (if people even bother to show up), for the TPCi dub.

>>28275117

NYAV Post dude.

best New York recording studio.

Hell they could bring back Veronica Taylor, Rachel Lillis and the old gang, hell they could use LA talent too.

it'd be a win win.

>>28282399
It's still rewording it to make it less plutonic and shippy, so TPCi are hiding that aspect a bit.

Granted, it's got nothing on the slang, alliteration, and rhyme filled dialogue given to Ash and TR in general, but it is a dumb change.

>>28282471
I understand your reasoning, but that said, I'd say Wayland was a bit of a dick in general, given he said he had no regard for dub quality and didn't care how bad it got or how much music got replaced or dialogue got rewritten etc. back when he was directing the dub.

Not that Ortiz or Buchheister did any better, because they're same-y quality as Wayland was with direction, but I think he was "shit" tier myself.

>>28271903

It doesn't.

>>28282386
Type Wild wouldn't have made sense in the dub anyway, since the song was only used then because it was the ending theme during the original Kanto league. Something like 2BAmaster would have been the English equivalent, but nobody really wanted that.

>>28282364
Yeah. I think I liked the advanced battle the most desu.
https://youtu.be/UtnhJhMOg1E

>>28282529

He was somewhat monotone and kinda dull, but better than a lot of the dub's VAs, imo. The Anime VA was oddly better than the BW2 trailer one, Wayland was the latter however, so that's to be expected.

>>28282529
That would almost certainly be an improvement: not sure why they can't go that route. It's not like anyone's pleased with the dub's current status 100% regardless of where we all stand on it individually, so I don't see the harm in this.

>>28282523
I have the same impression. 4Kids did some stupid things at times, but it was clear they really cared about the Pokémon Series and gave it their all in efforts to make it the best they could (given it was them). TPCi treats it like another payday job for them, and just something to knock off to advertise the games, thus making profit. The dub has been so monotone and dull since the change, that it's hard to enjoy anything about it.

>>28282471
oops sorry my mistake there.

>>28282498
It's on a cancerous tumblr blog, but it's the only link i've found that has his voice clips in them.

http://pugbotapp.tumblr.com/post/93788502111/i-compiled-3-minutes-of-n-speaking

there's no way to describe it. It's just someone trying to hard to sound mysterious.

>>28282543
That's a pretty weak defense, sorry, not buying it.

>>28282560
Hence they replaced it with some crappy guitar riff synthesized crap Loeffler came up with during DP IIRC.

>>28282572
Oddly enough, the final intro 4Kids did: they always did a good job with OPs.

>>28282148

I thought Bauer's Dawn was one of the few bright spots in TCPI's dubbing.

>>28282698
Yep, I can't imagine Dawn with any other voice.
She also actually put some effort into her work.

>>28282698
Bauer's Dawn, Stevens' Iris, and Griffith's Cilan are honestly the only voices I've liked post-4Kids for main characters, I'd agree with you.

Clemont and Serena's dub VAs both make them sound too old, Bonnie's dub VA has a very nasally and fake delivery to many of her lines (I get that she does care about the role, however, so I credit her with that as opposed to a lot of the idiots working on TPCi's dub who don't really give a crap), and all the recasts were pretty much for the worse (I can't think of a single voice change I like that they did, desu).

>>28282560
That had a very real possibility of happening, since they replaced an old Rocket-dan insert song with Team Rocket's Rockin' earlier in the season.

>>28282633
It's someone trying to sound mysterious/edgy at the same time.

>>28282809
All of the voices for Serena, Clemont, and Bonnie sound out of place. Eureka actually sounds like a little girl, Serena doesn't sound like a 30 year old woman trying to sound young, and Citron doesn't sound like he's dead inside. Citron's VA is also doing a fairly good job in the Ace Attorney anime, but I know some people don't like it.

Sad thing is that some VA's in TCPI's roster are decent.

Marc Thompson and Dan Green have always been among my favourites in New York.

Erica Shroeder is a decent enough VA herself. Eileen Stevens and Jason Griffith as well. Seriously Griffith in Zetman and Cyborg 009 is damn amazing,

I bring up Bauer as well.

hell here's a fucking shocker, some of the worst VA's in the dub were good in other things.

Bill Rogers was in HXH and Street Fighter and was actually not half bad. Shocker right?

Sarah Natochenny believe it or not, voiced Sif in the Thor: Dark World IOS game and she was actually good, like a good voice match for Jamie Alexander.

a lot of these actors have worked for Media Blasters more recent dubs and give good enough performances.

a lot of it is miscasting and poor direction.

You move a lot of these VA's out to LA or Texas hell even Vancouver, you'd see such an improvement.

TCPI is most likely a toxic enviroment altogether. I can understand why most VA's living in NY do this show, it's practically job security.

it's sad but unfortunate.

while some of the VA's have done some shitty performances and things in the past, don't lump everyone in it with the rotten apples.

>>28282811
Pretty fucked up that TPCi/DuArt did that during Season 11 without 4Kids' permission to use it as at the time, 4Kids owned the rights to that, but then TPCi have always been dicks. I remember in Season 9's "King and Queen for a Day" they used Maddie Blaustein's "Gotta Dance" singing as Meowth without her permission when TAJ took back the dub, too, really shameless.

TPCi also recycled Eric Stuart's voices for Squirtle-Blastoise during Seasons 9-10 and Pete Zarustica (aka Oliver Wyman/4Kids Drew)'s voice for Glalie in Season 13, naturally, without either's permission.

>>28282809

Alyson Rosenfeld is an actress, I think could be capable of better things, she is in the dub for Psychic School Wars.

I haven't seen the movie yet but i am interested in seeing how they all do well.

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>implying any dub can ever reach levels of "WHAT IS A MAN?"

>>28282883
Bill Rogers needs to stay in LA and dump NYC, his Brock/Lucario voices fit Street Fighter characters more, so that comes as no surprise to me.

Surprised Natochenny sounds better as Sif than she ever did as Delia and Ash, too, though I'm not a fan of her or Rogers' shit attitudes, desu.

That said, I agree.

That said I'm sort of glad yet a bit disappointed in a sense that neither Kevin T. Collins and Jon Avner from the Berserk dub ever did voices in Pokemon.

Collins would have made a great N.

So does TCPi own everything of the 4kids dub? I just found out the other day that they rebranded the "Advanced" series as "Pokemon: The Series: Ruby and Sapphire". Pretty dumb change.

>>28272645
MAL needs to resign, i bet no one watches pokemon because of the dub being utter garbage. Serena's voice does NOT help either and clemont is cringey. Not to mention "blandito"

>>28282918
It's almost guaranteed Rosenfeld will do better in that. Heck, her Aly voice from the Arc-V dub of all things is better than her Bonnie take, TPCi really does curse any VA involved in its dubbing with weak performances...they must do this crap in one take or something, it's so bad.

>>28282965
True, but this is TPCi, the dubbers so cheap they took the license away from 4Kids to save money...they can't afford Kevin T. Collins. The most they ever shilled out for was Origins, and that dub is merely average fare.

>>28282977
Nowadays? They do, since around 2012, when 4K kicked the bucket. They also rebranded the "Johto" series as "Pokémon: The Series: Gold and Silver," which I also find idiotic.

Spanish intro comparison

latin spanish
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03W-4z-dJBc

spanish
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFzIABxRGOM

>>28283079
>Spanish
ONDA VITAL

>>28283066
So the os. Is that also rebranded as Pokemon the series: Red and Blue?

>>28282901
They didn't need permission, since they obtained rights to use the 4kids music as part of the deal.

4kids also retained their rights to use all of the music they composed for the Pokemon anime, so long as they didn't use any of the vocal songs. A non-vocal version of the Pokerap was used for the Foxbox Trivia bumpers.

>>28282981
It seems like TPCi have fucked up not only the English dub, but also the Latin American and Spanish dubs.

The day those idiots lose the license to dubbing Pokémon can't come soon enough, because they really only care about the profit margins.

>>28283149
It's still shameless, even if that's the case, TPCi has no respect for anyone but themselves.

That's cool regarding 4Kids, though, thanks for letting me know about that.

>>28283146
Yes, it's utterly retarded.

Retarded like their audience.

>>28283158
it happens all the time honestly with bad dubs. Try to make a translation out of a translation and the original message will be lost forever.

>>28282873
Agreed, and I think Citron's VA kicks ass as Phoenix Wright, myself.

>>28282307
Well, for the Japanese, it all stemmed from a man that didn't believe pokemon could have more meaning to start with. It will forever haunt the production for all time. The dub has since it's inception been afraid of being labeled as an anime, but at least 4kids made a better production out of it. After TPCI handed the reigns to literally who, they just never bothered. Even other dub companies that have to equally work with duct tape and toothpicks do a better job. The only thing that I have to explain this is that they're literally told "dub this kthxbai". 4kids didn't have to work with TPCI, they got the resources directly. Whether that gave them more free reign, I don't know. All I know is that in their desire to consolidate all things pokemon, they cheaped out on something that was working fine as it was. Is the anime just a coincidence for them, too? Directly being involved with the marketing department, I would think so. The anime was never important for any of them. 4kids was different because they could avoid all that junk. Sadly, that cannot happen again because TPCI insisted on pulling the reigns personally. They need someone that does their job well instead of just doing their job. If they are unwilling to do that, then I'm sorry to say that they shouldn't do a dub at all. I don't even care if it's being mandated by a Japanese executive. If you don't care, then why are you wasting everyone's time? That is bad business.

>>28283203
>Retarded because people like something

Really? Come on, now.

>>28283207
True, it amazes me that since 4K kicked the bucket, Pokémon and Yu-Gi-Oh's English dubs have actually gotten WORSE for some reason so far.

You would think this would've ended when they left, but no, we still get crappy dubs to this day.

>>28283146
"Pokemon the Series: The Beginning"
>>28282977
The reasoning for this is mostly just to organize things for season sets and Netflix. Instead of having to have "Pokemon Advance" "Pokemon Advance Battle" and "Pokemon Battle Frontier", they can just collectively call those seasons "Pokemon the Series: Ruby and Sapphire".

>>28283210
That was beautiful, and frankly, you raised a lot of good points that I agree with.

I'm not sure if this is just me, but I also noticed the repetition of the Series for some reason got more obvious when TPCi took over the dub: after Ash lost the Sinnoh League, in particular, to me it was clear he would never, ever win a League until the Japanese writers decided it was time for the games to end and thus, we should too.

It doesn't take an IQ of 186 to realize that TPCi is marketing the Pokemon anime to kids and blatantly ignoring the older fan base that's been with them for nearly 20 years.

>>28283323
The Beginning is better than G&S and R&S: The Series titles, I suppose, but I prefer when it was called "Indigo League" and then "Adventures in the Orange Islands" since those were more specific, desu. This is just vague to me...real shame TPCi decided to do this lame rebranding stuff, honestly, saps the creativity out of things to me.

>>28283354
It's a real betrayal of the older fans' trust, too, considering when they first took over the dub, TPCi's spokesman Lawrence Neves promised the following to fans when they took over the dub from 4Kids:

(1) Keeping the Japanese OPs and EDs

Did TPCi do this? No.

(2) Keeping all the original OST from Japan?

Did they do this? No.
Did they get even worse than 4Kids ever was later on about this? Yes.

(3) Faithful scripts

Did they do this? No.
Did they butcher Ash and TR's dialogue more than 4Kids did with awkward lines? Yes.

0/3 promises kept by them at this point, really, that's a clear sign TPCi don't give a shit about the older fans.

>XY119

I don't follow.

>>28283372
"The Beginning" is still divided into "Indigo League" and "Adventures in the Orange Islands", it's just a collective term for those two seasons. (for example, Netflix doesn't have the Orange Islands episodes, so it's just "Indigo League", but Pokemon.com has the entire thing categorized as "The Beginning")

>>28283372
What? They rebranded the older seasons, too? Well, it makes some sense in hindsight, but it also reeks of unoriginality, too. Not to mention that makes it inconsistent with the opening itself for the 3 4kids seasons of AG. That's like putting masking tape over it saying "fuck you"

>>28283476
Well, I can live with that, it's certainly not one of their major problems in handling the Series...at least, there's that.

>>28283457
I believe he/she meant XY121's dub, which is true for that, but Pokémon Wikia labeled the episode as XY119, so I can see where they got that from.

>>28283514
True, but what really pisses me off about TPCi is the fact they lied to all of us fans and actually made the dub worse than it's ever been at this point.

See >>28283448 for what I mean, I never forget what they promised on pokemon.com back then, and they lied on every account.

>>28283476
Oh, never mind if it's a collective umbrella term. It's still somewhat lazy, though.

>>28283576
Fans have just been calling them "the gen 1 seasons" for the last two decades. It's nice that there's finally an official term for them.

Granted, they finally came up with a term for Event Legendaries a few gens ago too, but nobody really uses it.

>>28282236
DP and the first season of BW was better than the BF dub

>>28283264
Yeah go figure. You know had it not been for One Piece 4kids might still be with us, that was what ruined them,

>>28283635
Eh, Brock and TR took a nosedive in DP's dub in both dialogue and voice acting, I'd disagree with that. Also, TR's dialogue and Ash's was less jarring in BF's than in DP's, Cathcart went mad when DuArt took over in Season 2 of DP and the dub was at its worst, translation/dialogue wise from Seasons 11-13 (and now 17-present rivals that).

BW's first season was probably the peak of the TPCi dub, though, but its second season was a step down, its third regressing to BF dub levels, and XY's dub is the worst the dub has ever been, desu.

>>28283448
Pokemon must the be only somewhat popular anime that doesn't have a professional dubbing studio behind it

>>28283670
4Kids should've avoided Sonic and One Piece, really: had it not been for those they may have not died out, really.

>>28283448

Jesus...

I can see issues arising for the first point.

And "Faithful scripts" to who exactly?

Did he ever get called on it?

>>28283696
Pretty much, and it's hurting the brands reputation as a result.

If they cast Cathcart or some hack as Detective Pikachu in the new Movie, I'm just going to laugh.

>>28283717

4kids got One Piece as part of a bulk of other Toei shows.

They didn't even want it. They wanted what they turned into "Magical DoReMi"

>>28283448
Did they really promise Japanese openings? I mean, I guess with anime like Naruto gaining popularity in the US they figured they would try it too. Would have been nice if they didn't lie about it.

>>28283629
I thought it was a coin flip between Indigo and Kanto. Yeah, I do realize we're no better, everything is either referred to by their individual story arcs or by the JP title name if speaking about the entire gen. (though I've never seen OS referred to as an entire collective since it wasn't just one gen) Ever since BW started splitting the production and renaming it while the plot was still in progress, we took on those names, too, but we'll still refer to the entire gen by it's region. Not exactly a snappy title and only the hardcore refer to the JP names. For what it is, it does it's job, and we'll still refer to them as what we want anyway.

>>28283761
Fans who saw the premiere of the current dub's Mastermind redub at San Diego Comic Con and on pokemon.com back in August 2006, IIRC, which as we can all see, wasn't the case at all.

In fact, TPCi totally raped Team Rocket's characters, made Ash talk in awkward slang, same with Clemont, and has protagonist spouting awkward lines like "Try, try," "Wow, wow, wow," and "Furshonista" along with "Cutier pie" in Bonnie's case, literally making up fake words for the TPCi dub.

Dogasu did with regards to TR.

>>28283836
Yes, but that lie was soon debunked when they showed their "Battle Frontier" intro a few days later.

They also promised faithful episode titles, too, which if "A Gaggle of Gadget Greatness" should tell you, TPCi also lied about.

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>>28283812
>Magical DoReMi
I still can't believe they picked that up. Im aware that One Piece isn't even kid-friendly neither, but this show still touched some deep subjects under that kawaii facade
>the big C
>I hate my mother
>my dad doesnt love me because he does NOT hit me
>pic related

Reminder that the anime went downhill after Sudo stepped down

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Remember when TRio got serious for a while during BW? James still sounded like a flamboyant gayboy while his japanese voice got into it...but then again even the former was using the same voice style anyway

>>28284134

I can't help but feel like there's some superstition behind the sudden changes.

Like, Team Rocket being serious will cause the end of the world. Because they went right back to the goofy version after the earthquake and tsunami.

>>28284100
>Sudo

You mean Shudo, right? Sudo did both DP AND BW, remember?

>>28284134
I liked BW's take on TRio, shame that didn't last, and I sure do. Cathcart's James is crap, imo, but his serious James take is a lot better than when he tries to be goofy/comedic with the character, though both are shit in XY-XYZ's dub.

>>28284134
Shinichiro Miki sounds more cool than flamboyant, he's great in the role though.

>>28284197
It's a shame they did, because serious TRio was the most interesting they were since...AG? TRio's goofy shit has lost its charm ages ago, really, but XY's blown it to a new level- I never laugh at anything they do these days.

BW effed up a lot of stuff, but TRio was probably the best part of it.

>>28284134
Remember when there were characters and pokemon (besides the obvious) that reappeared multiple regions after their introduction? They completely stopped doing that after BW, sadly.

>>28284210
Yeah, Miki is leagues ahead of Cathcart. I liked Stuart about as much as him for the dub, though, but sadly that didn't last past Season 8: he was both funny/flamboyant and also serious.

>>28284241
This. I'd like to see Misty again. She's hadn't made a proper appearance in a decade. Everyone else too yes even Iris too. I loved Chronicles since it showed that the Pokemon world doesn't revolve around Ash and other things are going on.

>>28284236
That's because, as (relatively) good as it was otherwise, XY had 0 character depth. The TRio was now only SUPER SILLY even more than before, Ash only cared about muh battles even more than before, the regional girl now only cared about winning da satoshi bowl even more than before. Fucking EVERYTHING was one-note as shit.

>>28284241
Yup. The only reference to anything older in XY was Dawn's Piplup, but only in the Japanese Version, TPCi predictably removed the reference made to it.

>>28284286
Well yeah. You know who I think could have also been a great James. Brian Drummond, he's dubbed over Miki numerous times and can do cool and flamboyant.

>>28284314
I'd be watching her reappearance subbed, however, if that happened: Knotz's Misty was total shit in the BW flashback episode and hearing Misty come back with THAT performance would just...suck.

>>28284325
Pretty accurate, and the League was terrible.

>>28284355
Drummond as James would be a welcome relief & pleasure to the ears after Cathcart, I'd love to hear that, he's also one of the best talents in Vancouver so that makes him more appealing to me in the part.

I'd like Stuart back ideally, but I'd have him do the James voice he did in Seasons 2-5, not the goofier AG one or the Ted Lewis' clone he did in Season 1 (that said, I even prefer those takes of his over Lewis' stiff portrayal and especially JCC).

>>28272262
I also miss 4Kids. This is when I knew TPCi just managed to become worse than them:

"Music Edit
Nearly all the background music in this movie has been replaced for the dub. In a movie that came out in the year 2014.


The Cocoon of Destruction and Diancie


Instead, we get a brand new soundtrack made just for the dub. It seems like the music was made specifically for the movie (the way it Mickey Mouses the action on-screen at certain parts is what leads me to that conclusion) but I've heard there's some stock TV stuff mixed in there as well, though I wouldn't know because I stopped watching the English dub of the TV series years ago. What I do know, however, is that the English composer didn't leave any moments of silence in there at all and made the movie wall-to-wall music.

It's insane to think that the English dub of a Japanese movie would actually replace the instrumental background music in the year 2014 . Think about it for a second. This is something that hasn't been done to a Pokémon movie since Pokémon 3 The Movie way back in 2001. How much of this movie's target audience was even alive back then? This is something that 4Kids - 4-freaking-Kids, ladies and gentlemen! - decided was too stupid to continue doing. And yet here we are."

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>>28271903

>MUH NOSTALIA

The dub has always sucked and so does Bruce Falconer.

>>28285161
Yup, muh "nostalia" indeed. Learn to spell before you criticize others mindlessly, buddy.

Bruce Faulconer was a part of FUNi DBZ, and no, the Pokémon dub was far better and actually kept more than two-thirds of the Japanese score at one point in the Anime Season dubs and kept all the Japanese music in the Movies for a long time.

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This whole thread have given me a new and strange appreciation for 4kids

Still boogles my mind that in 2016, we still have shit like music replacement, unfaithful scripts, and chap acting in dubs. But Pokemon, Digimon and YGO dubs continue this dumb trend.

>>28285223
Don't let it go too far. Pokemon was honestly the best of their dubs.

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>>28285221
Autist.

>>28285288
Says the troll who posted garbage of no value here in the first place: troll harder next time.

>>28285223
>>28285243
Same, though anyone could see even 4Kids wasn't as bad as TPCi is at this point.

>>28285234
Yup, and they're all losing popularity fast for that very reason. At least YGO has the courtesy to put up the damn subbed version, though, Pokémon and Digimon can't even be assed to do that little these days.

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>>28281444
I suppose. But I'm really going to miss clemont saying "THE FUTURE IS NOW THANKS TO SCIENCE!"

Shall we make a new thread?

>>28285733
He still says that in the Japanese Version, though.

>>28285872
Sure, if you want to do so.

>>28286134
Yes please!

>>28271903
>now
it always was. whatever was good about it is long gone now.

>>28286657
That makes it worse now, by your logic, though.

>>28275058

All of it. His scripts are probably the worst of the worst though. At least when 4Kids was doing the script, the dialogue was entertaining enough to listen to and some borderline adult humor slipping in every so often was a bonus. We don't get any of that now, dialogue is dry as fuck, all of Team Rocket became his bitch with how much he throws terrible rhymes and alliteration into their mouths along with some "hip" terms thrown in for the hell of it like Meowth's constant "dig it." James is no longer whimsically amusing and sounds like an 80 year old man and Meowth sounds like he's been chain smoking since his old voice actor...ess died. The anime being taken over by TCPI was literally the worst thing to ever happen to it. Not saying 4kids was particularly good with some of their practices, but it was a lot more watchable than this tripe. They really need to fire Cathcart and their dub music composers. They are absolute trash.

And this is why the sub has always been better since the TPCi takeover. Dub is literally unwatchable in it's current state.

>>28272782
I can tolerate the voices, personally. It's the 'guy banging on a toy synthesizer' music in XY that does me in.

>>28287802
I don't like the voices, but the dub's currently awful music score doesn't help my opinion of it, either, so I don't blame you.

>>28282873
sounds like Yuri Lowenthal

>>28284134
I actually thought they sounded marginally better in the dub when they were serious. I couldn't shake the weird feeling that came from Megumi Hayashibara making Jessie sound uncomfortably close to Rei.

The other recurring characters in that image got Marc Thompson and Dan Green, so it wasn't all bad.

>>28288409
It's a pity they can't even pull off serious TR scenes these days in the XY-XYZ dub, TPCi just pretty much gave up on any effort with this Saga. I do hope the Sun & Moon dub is better than the last 3 years have been, but it's clear the Pokémon dub will never regain the quality it once had under 4Kids those first 8 years, unless they decide to recast the dub again.