Friendly reminder that Ice/Dragon, Ice/Ground, Ice/Flying, and

Oh, and Ice/Flying and Ice/Grass suck balls anyway. So there's that.

GF really needs to do something with the relations between Ice and Water

A case could be made for
>Water resists Ice , and SE against it, or not
>Ice resists Water, and SE against it, or not
>Complete neutrality
That's 5 possibilities, and I'm not sure the one we have now is the best. They should at least make Ice resist water, it's not that out there and wuould be helpful a little.

>Water melts Ice though!
And put a glass of water in your freezer and it will freeze. Ice Pokemon are all about cold, it's not reaching to think that the water doesn't have much effect on them. Have Scald be an exception.

The problem is about making either SE against the other. You either make Ice more shit defensively, or even better offensively.

>>27560585
Ice resisting Water and maybe ground or flying would help a lot. Ditch its weakness to rock and that'd help a lot with how often they keep making bulky ice types.

>>27560585
>And put a glass of water in your freezer and it will freeze
Over a long period of time. Ice should in no way resist water that's fucking retarded. Neutrality is an option, but Water resisting Ice makes far more sense. Either way Ice is still shit.

>>27560481
>Only resistances and weaknesses matter

But that's wrong. Offensive types matter more for fast, frail Pokemon.

>>27560655
Ice floats
checkmate waterfags

In all seriousness though, why isn't water weak to poison?

>>27560690
And out of all the ice types, we have only a handful that are fast and frail.

If they want to push ice as the defensive stalling type, then they need to make it less easy to shatter.

>>27560481
>tfw Alolan Ninetales is Ice/Fairy, but regular Ninetales will remain pure Fire
FeelsBadMan

original ninetales should be fire/psychic desu

>>27560481
>implying anything that's part ice could possibly be good
Nothing would "benefit" from being part ice. Like Rock, being ice is exclusively a handicap. You might get ice stab, but despite that, being ice (or rock, unless you're Tyranitar) is nothing but a handicap. Grass is a close third.

>>27560749

I wouldn't say Rock is entirely bad to have. At least it protects you from priority bird.

>>27560707
Water dilutes poisons. Water is just great all-around, and there's a good reason for it.

Ice is one of my favorite types, but god I hate all the dumb things people suggest to try to make Ice better.

>make ice resist water
No. If we're being honest with ourselves Ice should be WEAK to Water. Be thankful it isn't.

Unless under special circumstances, water is always a higher temperature than ice, because it's just the liquid form of the same element. This means it will always make short work of ice by melting it. Don't be a fool.

>make Ice resists Grass, Bug, or Flying
The goal of making Ice more viable is not to, in the process, neuter other types that already have enough trouble as it is. They have their own problems, leave them alone.

>make water weak to ice
Yeah well that would've been nice. Thing is, going from resisting it to being weak to it makes zero sense. I even see WHY Water resists Ice. You can view it both ways.


A lot of people said it would've been nice if Ice resisted Fairy, but they decided not to do that. I think it should. But really I think the best thing for Ice would be for it to resist Ground. It makes a little sense, and Ground would be the most key resistance it could acquire.

It wouldn't be so much of a problem if Ice types' stats were a bit better..

>>27560655
We're talking about a game where the main Ice attack is a cold beam. "It takes time" is in no way a valid argument.

And it wouldn't be that out there compared to Fighting types resisting bugs, or Fairies resisting bugs or whatever. Water types wouldn't be ruined by having another, often frail, buch of Pokemon resistant to it, and Ice could use the help.

>>27560749
rock is pretty different from ice
granted rock has a bunch of shitty common weaknesses like ground/fighting/water but it also has a lot of relevant resists like fire/flying whereas ice only resists itself and is weak to a shit-ton of things

ice will never be buffed because it delivers the potentially most crippling status element

prove me wrong

>>27560798
The problem is that Gamefreak keeps making defensive Ice-types. More offensive Ice-types would help soothe part of the problem.

Or better yet make them resist dragons and get rid of Fairy's immunity to dragons.

>>27560798

Flying really doesn't have that much trouble. It's one of the best offensive types in the game right now.

>>27560788
>water dillutes poisons.
So if I get bit by a venomous snake I'll just drink lots of water to dilute the poison. Thanks anon.

>>27560773
>>27560809
Granted Rock isn't as shitty as Ice, but its without challenge the next shitty. THEN Grass.

>>27560837
It's not the water that's being fucked up by the venom you retard, it's your biological systems.

Regardless, nothing I said was wrong. Water dilutes poison.

>>27560481
>with no drawbacks whatsoever. (Except no STAB.)
wew

>>27560788
But anon, watery ecosystems and water sources also get extremely easily contaminated and spoiled by toxic waste.

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>It's a thread discussing an Ice type turns into Changing the Type Chart episode

EVERY FUCKING TIME

>>27560798
Ice just needs 3 resistences. Itself, Normal, and Dragon. GF needs to treat Ice like they do Electric and give most Ice-types high Speed and Sp/Attack. If they want to make a defensive Ice-type Pokemon it needs an ability that nullifies its weaknesses like Filter or Heat Proof

>>27560902
Yes, but extremely large sources of water will stil dilute shit. I guess it could go either way.

Water is still the best solvent though.

>>27560908
But that's literally the point of the thread. To speculate what could make the Ice type better i.e. change the type chart.

Which one of you GOnormies brought this dope?

>>27560802
Your argument, >put a glass of water in your freezer and it will freeze.

doesn't provide an argument for Ice resisting Water. If you put water in the freezer, that would equate to using an Ice attack on a Water type, rather than the other way around, because you're "attacking the water with cold." You're not "attacking the cold with water".

>>27560828
Yeah I take that back now. I don't know why I always think Flying is a poor offensive type when it isn't. Birds obviously can't do much to Ice so Flying would make a great resistance along with Ground. Maybe even better than it thematically.

Plus, slightly dampening Flying's offensive presence would give Bug and Grass an easier time.

>>27560918
I could see Normal because Ice is kinda hard, but it still breaks easily. You can break Ice more easily than you can break most things.

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>>27560921
>Water is still the best solvent though.
A CHALLENGER APEARS

>>27560902
This is why I've alawys said Water-types should be weak to Poison. But whenever its brought up anons go"water dilutes posion". It goes both ways water is easily contaminated. Water-type Pokemon like real life aquatic animals would not enjoy living/swimming in polluted water.

>>27560932
Eh, I didn't really make this thread for that. Although I honestly don't know where else I thought the conversation was going to carry us.

>>27560802
And were not talking about regular water either. Also if it's not an argument than neither is saying that putting water in a freezer will freeze it isn't either. Finally, unlike water and ice there is no preestablished way that bugs affect fairies or Fighting types.

>>27560707
Except that most Water type moves aren't making things float. They're extremely fast bursts of water which would start melting ice instantly.

>>27560481
Tell that to my team that is 5/6 dragon type. My Garchomp gets fucked up by anything that knows an ice move.

>>27560837
Actually, that may work in certain cases, like drug overdoses...

1. 50% physical defense boost under Hail.
2. Resists Flying.
3. Resists Fairy.
4. Better distribution of Ice moves. (>Fucking Pikachu gets Icicle Crash instead of actual Ice types)
5. More Hail weather abilities.
6. At least one more type, maybe Water, no longer suffers Hail damage. (This encourages Hail usage)
7. Make Freeze be a relevant status condition, not just a version of Sleep that's too hax to get any focus. Or just introduce a new Frostbite status, either way.
8. Stop handing out Ice moves like candy to Water types.

>>27561026
>being an edgey lance wannabe

>>27560937
Rock and Steel(Metal) are solid matter like Ice. That was my thinking in making Ice-types resist Normal. Flying could replace Normal as a type Ice resist, but I think Dragon-type definitely should be "not very effective" against Ice-type Pokemon.

Ice is now only weak to Fire and Steel. Now it's a good type.

>>27560481
What if they re-balance the type chart to give Ice more resistances?

>>27560690
Ice is already an excellent offensive type, and that has proven to provide very few benefits for Ice-type pokemon. It's usually better to throw Ice Beam or Ice Punch on your defensively stronger pokemon than it is to use an Ice type, even considering STAB. A good pokemon can take a hit.

The current metagames have developed around using and countering Steel types, and Ice has suffered as a result. Ice types not only lose to Steel types themselves (since Steel is SE on Ice and resists Ice attacks), but also are vulnerable to some of the most common Steel counters (Fire and Fighting-type attacks) without having Steel's numerous resistances there to make up for them. Let's not forget its additional weakness to Rock, which is a common type for coverage moves. No matter your metagame of choice, if you waste a slot on an Ice type, you're signing up for the headache of practically never having safe switch opportunities due to the high risk of practically everything have a counter to you, and having one less thing able to contribute defensively, in exchange for Ice attacks that are a bit stronger. Ice needs resistance and immunities.

-Resist Normal, Flying, Dragon
-Heals during Rain
-Defence Boost During Hail

>>27560825
>Or better yet make them resist dragons
By what logic?

A thing that pisses me off about Ice-types having so many weaknesses is that most don't make sense for most Ice-types. They're treated like Rock or Steel-types, who are all mostly either made of rock/metal, or are covered in a rock/metal armor.

But relatively few Ice-types are actually made of or covered in ice. More than half are just freezy animals, the same way more Fire, Water, or Electric-types are fiery animals, aquatic animals, and zappy animals, rather than literally made of fire, water, or electricity. And most of those types' weaknesses and resistances make a sort of elemental thematic sense, using the sort of logic you'll see how magic works in RPG's.

But the only weakness like that with Ice is Fire (hot vs cold). There's not thematic reason like that Ice would be weak to Earth or physical attacks. The weaknesses to Rock, Steel, and Fighting are just logical things assuming we're talking about attacking literal chunks of Ice, which makes the weaknesses weird for most Ice-types.

The whole thing would be better if it was treated less like "ice" and more like "cold".

>>27561111
ice pokemon dwell in icy mountains where dragons often do also

over time they have evolved to defend themselves against dragons both passively and actively, explaining supereffective and resistance

>needing to explain why your type resists fantasy type

>>27560819
Sunny Day, Flame Wheel, freezing undoing itself over time sometimes on the same turn it triggers, it having no guaranteed way to trigger

Freezing is nerfed in a lot of ways. If they'd at least make it last guaranteed twice as long as sleep on average, then there'd be something, but as it is, sleep, burn, and paralysis are more useful

>>27561134
>dragon pokemon dwell in icy mountains where ice pokemon often do also

>over time they have evolved to defend themselves against ice pokemon both passively and actively, explaining supereffective and resistance
Being near each other so evlution isn't a real explanation.

>>27561111
Ice-type Pokemon generate cold air around their bodies causing Dragon-type moves to weaken when the attack makes contact with the Ice-type mon. Dragons are like reptiles. Reptiles are coldblooded, they become sluggish and lethargic when its cold. Therefore Dragon-type moves weaken when expose to the cold. That's my logic anyway.

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>>27561063

>Avalugg under Hail.

Jesus.

Also, Frostbite should be the Ice equivalent of Burn, only it halves Special Attack instead of Attack. And for the love of god, limit the distribution of moves causing Frostbite to prevent another Scald situation.

>>27560937
Actually, ice fucks up ground because of permafrost and erosion, so Gamefreak already has an example of a long process being sped up to the benefit of ice. If anything, this makes water not being weak make even less sense

>>27561114
Every time we have one of these threads, I always make a suggestion like yours.

Every time, everyone is too autistic and ignores my posts. Instead, we'll have 60 posts about adding nonsense resistances to Ice.

Normal is a great type. Normal has one weakness and one immunity. Ice could be like Normal, only with better STAB.

>>27561089
Ice DOES NOT need resistances, it needs less weaknesses. That's it.

>>27561200

Halving special attack is good, but not enough. It's needs one more effect.

Maybe causing moves to consume twice as much PP, reflecting the loss of energy.

>>27561221
Never did get the weakness to fighting or steel. I mean yeah, I get it, fists/hard metal tools. But when I think of ice, that's not a thought that comes to mind. Hell, one could argue steel should be weak to ice by the same logic since ice bergs clearly are able to fuck up some steel ships

Just removing those two weaknesses would go a ways to buff ice defensively and nerf fighting and steel offensively

>>27561169
>isn't a real explanation.
yes it is.

I predicted your response because I'm a genius but that can easily explained by dragons being fucking dragons. they didn't evolve to resist ice because they're already good enough, being dragons

>>>>>>needing to explain why your type resists fantasy type

>>27561284
>yes it is.
No it's not. And "I'm already stronger than other things, I might as well make sure I get killed by the cold" also isn't valid.
>>27561195
This is a valid explanation.

>>27561221

You need to consider the consequences to the entire type chart.

Steel loss -> Fairy gain -> Fire gain, Dragon loss -> Ice loss.

>>27561303
>it's not valid because I said so
it's valid, deal with it retard.

>fairy resists and is supereffective against bug because fairies are often associated with bugs, especially with gossamer wings
>basically resistance by proximity
>the exact same thing as ice would have

>>27561321
>it's valid because I said so
It's not valid, deal with it retard.

>>27561309
Right now no one even uses Ice types AT ALL, so if Ice lost all weaknesses but Fire, then Steel, Rock, and Fighting really aren't losing jack shit in the practical sense.

>>27561324
>give explanation
>give comparison of existing type that exists for basically the same reason
>n-no you're wrong because [no reason specified]
kill yourself really

I mean did you even play pokemon before gen 1 was released? if so, you probably play pokemon go

>>27561341
>adding stutter talk to pretend you weren't already BTFO
I've obviously won here. Feel free to continue on your autism melt down.

>>27561341
>before gen 1
derp, before gen 2

basically, you are one of the following
>johtoddler or worse
>pokemon go-tier trash

>>27561349
>I can't argue anymore, so I guess I'll claim victory!
>I hope the people watching think I won
>Also, I post on reddit frequently
ok, retard

now that this guy is done talking, I think we can all agree that ice should resist dragon

>>27561367
>>Also, I post on reddit frequently
>They made me look stupid! I better call them reddit!
You're just embarrassing yourself now.

>>27561376
>good, he called me out on my reddit habit, now I can jump back in and pretend that him doing that makes me win even more
I thought you were done arguing

don't you have a pokemon go thread to be in?

>>27561367
>I think we can all agree that ice should resist dragon
Literal retardation.

Ice doesn't need your autistic resistances, it needs less weaknesses.

>>27561380
>If I keep listing things that I believe other people are against and saying that he's part of them, surely the combined hatred against those things will cause other people to take my side!

>>27561388
how many one-way type advantages are there, compared to two-way?

I bet the number is smaller than the number of reddit tabs you have open, and also smaller than the number of pokemon you have caught in pokemon go

>>27561271
Yeah if ice and steel were super effective to each other that'd be pretty neat.
It should be nuetral to fighting though, and resistant to bug and maybe grass.
Seriously what's a bug going to do to a glacier?

>27561399
(You)

I don't even own a smartphone, and I don't browse reddit either. Try again, autismo.

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>>27561428

>Nerfing two of the other worst types in the game just to buff Ice.

>>27561436
>lying on the internet
you can't even quote people

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>>27561428
Yeah let's make Bug and Grass even MORE shit! Great idea!

>27561448
No (You)s for (You) you sorry excuse for a troll.

>>27561445
I'm just going for thematically fitting here man.

>>27561457
I'm the troll? you're the one who asks for explanation then discounts any given, and fails to address the fact that there already exist type advantages with logic that's no stronger

and demand an explanation for a fantasy type advantage that already goes one way anyway

you probably don't even play pokemon and you're only in this thread causing trouble for people who actually do because you're mad someone said playing pokemon go doesn't count

>thinking anyone cares about the difference between a real (you) and a typed (you), beyond how stupid it makes you for doing it
now that's autism

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>>27561428

Remove yourself from the gene pool.

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>>27561480
How about you do that?

>>27561478
>being mad enough to write four paragraphs because someone called you a troll
wew lad

>>27561510
>someone addresses all of your troll arguments and thoroughly shuts you down
>only response is "wew lad"
ok, troll. you were supposed to stop arguing about 10 replies ago

>27561478
HAHAHA you think I'm the asshole who was arguing with you earlier?! That guy gave up. Here are my posts.

>>27561457
>>27561455
>>27561436
>>27561388
>>27561331
>>27561221
>>27560908

Now go to bed, Richard.

>>27561522
>shuts you down
wew lad

>>27561524
>still unable to quote because you're posting on a normiephone or some shit
>admitting to being a troll who just butted in on someone else's argument
who the fuck is richard? your pokemon go bud

>>27561537
Children your age aren't supposed to curse, lad.

Controversial opinion: make it resist Normal. Why? Same reason Normal glances off of Rock and Steel- it's just too hard.

>>27561546
>johtoddler talking down to his superiors
you're 18 at best

please come back when your brain has fully developed and you have become a man instead of some pokemon go playing college teen

>>27561578
Would that make Ice any more viable?

>ITT: type weaknesses and resistances need logical justifications
No.

Treat Ice as if it's cold, and make ice resist everything except dark, fire, ghost, psychic and bug. Why bug? Because absolute cold kills anything, though some bugs are able to survive at temperatures lower than anything else barring microbes. Exclude fire for obvious reasons, and dark/ghost/psychic because they are abstract and aren't associated with life.

Then it MIGHT be good.

>>27561600
.... you know, not really no. But it's hard coming up with resistances that don't just make other types suckier.

I just want a damn reason to use pretty Ice types dammit...

These Ice type chart threads get posted like two or more times every fucking week.

Every time, they attract the most autistic people on /vp/.

Fucking cancer.

>>27561605
I agree. Ice should resist Dragon, Water should resist Fire, Bug should resist Flying, and Grass should be supereffective against Dark.

And anyone who disagrees with me is from Reddit.

>>27561637
Because autistic people tend to get fixated, and thus get overly attached to some type even though it's not viable. Same reason people get mad at Smogon tiers because they consider it an insult that favorite pokemon isn't good.

>>27561653
>wanting balance is bad and is logically equivalent to getting mad at people who point out there is a lack of balance
They're opposite if anything. Ice should not be shit. No type should be shit (except maybe normal).

>>27561663
Why normal?

>>27561663
>Ice should not be shit.
Agreed, but 90% of the ideas for improving it in these threads are even more shit.

>>27561699
Because it's literally "there is nothing special about me: the type". Or sometimes "whatever type I should be doesn't exist: the type"

>>27561663
>>27561708
>>27561699
Normal isn't shit, though. It's better than Ice, Rock, or Grass.

>>27561729
I'm not saying it's shit, I'm saying it's probably the only type that would be fine being shit. Ice is kind of a unique/rare type, it definitely shouldn't be shit.

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>>27561063
I will never understand why they made hail so shitty compared to the other weather.
Rain, Sunlight and Sandstorm all benefit more than one type directly or indirectly and the abilities related to those weather are distributed on a wide variety of type.
Meanwhile hail benefit only ice and all of the hail related abilities are only on ice type. Also there is only 2 hail related abilities that aren't forecast and they aren't that good compared to other weather related abilities.

If all Weavile could do was Knock Off it wouldn't be OU.
Weavile is the only Ice-type done right. Fast, frail, hits hard. You didn't see people whining about Steel being a shit type because it only hit two types SE in gen V, that's because Steel Pokémon had amazing defenses. Ice needs to have more Pokémon like Weavile.

>>27560481
>Ice/Grass benifits
uhhhhh how?? only gains MORE weaknesses
>Ice/Flying
????? no????

best combination for Ice is Water. A speedy Ice/Water special attacker would do wonders in the meta. Especially with Scald.

>>27560585
Water is overpowered (or at least defensively it is one of the best types. I would hesitate for Ice to be super effective to water, because that does not fix ice's core issue: defensively it is a hindrance to whatever pokemon is unfortunate enough to receive the typing.

Ice should lose the rock weakness, and gain water resistance. Steel and fighting is bad enough, not to mention fire.

Now for the issue of rock: it is meant to be a defensive type, yet it is the worst defensive typing in the game (albeit only slightly worse than ice.)

Rock should lose the grass weakness, it doesn't really make much sense to begin with. Unfortunately, I can't think of a solid argument for losing any of it's other weaknesses, so we'd have to leave it at grass (which is the least of it's problems.

However, we can give it more resistances at the very least. Rock should resist bug and ice. Bug is already a good typing offensively, this wouldn't hurt it too much. Ditto for ice.

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>All this complaining about Ice being weak

Try being a Grassfag, then you'll understand true suffering

What we need is a move that charges on the first turn and freezes the opponent on the second. No damage.
Make a form of Hydration for hail. Could make a decent moveset out of Hail/Blizzard/Coverage/Rest or pair with a snow warning Pokemon.
Make more types immune to hail. Start with water, maybe adding in solid/sturdy style types like Rock and Steel; can't imagine a rock or metal being affected too badly by a hailstorm. As it stands, most ice types have some kind of hail ability, but running a hail team is a lot harder than sand as it only benefits ice types.
That's just a few things off the top of my head.

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>>27563968
Grass is not bad at all. It has really good resistances in water, ground, electric, and an OK resistance in grass. Poison and bug weaknesses aren't terrible, and ice is SE to everything anyway.

A lot of shit resists it, but you've got nowhere near the same right complain like rock/icefags do.

>>27564022
Fire, ice and flying are offensive powerhouses right now, and everyone has poison coverage for fairies. 7 types resist grass, 7, that's almost half the total types there are. And what DOES grass hit superffectively, rock, the type with most weaknesses, ground, which ice and water hit much stronger with better and more usable moves, and water, the only real benefit.

The worse part is how grass is meant to be a support role, and the best grass pokemon are not even close to being that. Except for tangrowth, that's the exception to the rule.

>>27564200
Grass is not anywhere near as bad off as ice, rock, or even dark. And the metagame changes, just because fire, flying, and poison are popular right now, doesn't mean they will always be.

Grass doesn't really need fixing. If something is part grass, it isn't a death sentence. Some of the best walls are part grass, and there are an abundance of good grass types that are top threats in all the tiers up (barring ubers, where anything that isn't fairy, steel, or dragon is gonna have a bad time).

Ice, rock, and dark are something that no pokemon wants to have. That is a problem. Grass is just meh.

>>27564255
>not wanting to be dark
I agree with the rest (although I still think grass is the worst typing, with the top grass pokemon being good even with the typing, not because of it), but why is dark shit? its weak to only two prominent types, has a utility inmunity and STAB and access to a bunch of good moves like knock off.

>>27560481
Why do fags get so mad at ice

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>>27564015
Hail ruins metal's day anon

>>27564276
Fighting and fairy weakness sucks ass, and so does bug really. Psychic immunity is not that good, dark resistance is utter garbage given that the best dark move that anything will have is crunch (80 BP). The only good resistance is ghost.

Offensively it's not so great either, partly because not many strong dark types moves even exist.

I would rate it as the 3rd weakest, maybe 4th weakest type (normal sucks too). Then 5th might be psychic, or possibly grass.

>>27560655
That's because your freezer isn't super cold, otherwise you wouldn't be able to put your hand in it to place the stuff in, shithead.
The colder, the faster it freezes. Jesus Christ.

>>27564363
You do realize knock off is 97.5 BP if the opponent has an item and payback is 100 BP if used on the second turn right? and come on, bug weaknesses is nothing of importance, and having any inmunity allows you potential swaps for free set ups.

>>27560655

Cryogonal
They are composed of ice crystals. They capture prey with chains of ice, freezing the prey at -148° F.
Pretty sure that -148 would freeze water pretty fucking quickly.
Also, a lot of ice moves have the capability of freezing the target, so their moves are obviously cold enough to freeze water.

>>27564394
Knock off is a good move regardless of whether or not it is a stab. And knock off is a hell of a lot better on a steel type than a dark type, more often than not.

Payback / assurance are pretty bad for the tradeoff, especially on a type like Dark who doesn't want to be going second given that is not good defensively.

Crunch is considered the best widely available dark type move, and it is a hell of a lot better than assurance.

>>27564462
I see your point with payback, that was a bad example. But the point still remains, free swaps in the form of a utility inmunity is always good, specially on speedy pokemon that seem to be the general rule of dark types with things like zoroark, weavile, houndoom and mandibuzz.

>>27560937
Not any of the anons you replied to, but I think it would make the most sense if I've resisted water. And I mean water keeps its ice resist while ice gains a water resist, because water can melt ice and ice (or the cold from it) can freeze water, so they should either both be SE against each other or NVE against each other.

>>27560798
A good way to fix both ice and bug would be to make ice resist fairy, ice be super effective against bug (bugs don't do very well in cold climate) but bug be super effective against fairy. Fairy would drop from the best type to a "meh" one, but then they could do something to fix it, not sure what myself.

Fairy resisting bug makes 0 sense. Fairies are delicate and feminine, they should be death scared of nasty bugs biting and buzzing onto them.

>>27560498
With that STAB?
Sounds pretty good to me.
In fact all of the ones in the OP have amazing offensive typings.

>>27560481
Whether an Ice typing is good or not depends mostly on the pokemon's stats
Basically you need high attack to make use of Ice Shard, or high speed, or both.
Hence why Weavile and Mamoswine are two of the best Ice types.

>>27561063
>>>27562223
>>27564015
Maybe you could make Dragon types resistant to hail.
It would make sense with their scales.

>>27560481
Unless the Pokemon is very fast and offensive.

>>27563966
>Bug
>Good offensively
Here's your (You)

>>27560585
>GF

I thought it was girlfriend. Then I realized that word could never be used here.

>>27560745

No

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>>27563966

>Bug is already a good typing offensively