>make a new pokémon >don't make it viable why do

If all pokemon were strong, no pokemon would be strong.

>>27340581
wouldn't that be kind of balanced?

Not everyone cares about competitive, get over it

Stay calm it will definitely evolve.

>>27340465
Why isn't it viable, time traveler?

I will straight up blow you if it doesn't evolve.

Have they released its stat block, abilities, and move pool yet? No? Then I guess we don't know how viable it is.

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>>27340608
>>27340616
>>27340608
>yfw evolves into a standard bug/flying

>>27340736
I will straight up blow you if it does.

>>27340465
I will evolve anon

>>27340865
Well, i am seriously fearing for the Wimpod guy

>>27340465
>make a game about collecting a variety of monsters reflective of ideas, cultures and organisms in the real world as an analogy for growing up an encountering the weird and wonderful aspects of life
>the monsters vary in strength as all things do and some are weak on purpose to reflect the ideas they're based on
>autistic 38 year old who's never so much as held a girl's hand gets upset because they all don't have identical stats
Ugh, stop.

>>27340465
Let's make every new Pokémon op and destroy the core concept of the game!

>>27340946
Thank you.

>People keep forgetting there's more than 1 tier

>>27340465
what is power creep

>>27340465

But let's be serious, bug/fairy isn't a great type. They don't cover each others weaknesses at all. You will still be able to easily kill it with fire/rock/flying thanks to bug, it will get wrecked by bullet punch now thanks to fairy, it will have no answers to steel/fire/poison pokemon, and the only attacks it can switch in on (dragon/fighting) are the types with the biggest movepools in the game, so even if you try to switch in on a close combat, they'll use stone edge, or if you try to switch in on dragon claw, they'll probably have fire blast.

Fairies usually aren't speedy either, so at most this is thing is just going to have high SP attack and then die most of the time before using it.

>>27340946
>projecting so accurately
>Ugh

>>27340465
>game isn't out yet
>don't make it viable
Are you from the future?

BC gamefreak gives zero fucks about smogon and barely cares about vcg. Their main concern is in game enjoyment bc that's what sells. That you somehow think they should cater to such a small niche is exceedingly arrogant and out of touch

>>27341026
Who gives a fuck. No Pokémon is without weakness. This fucking bug is no exception. Shut the fuck up.

>>27341074

Just saying it's going to probably be NU. Probably a good NU one that has a powerful moonblast and has a niche of stopping all of the grass types in the tier, but that's it

>>27341026
>But let's be serious, a pokemon whose design is based on a fairy and a bug should have a different type anyway because otherwise it would be weak against pokemon designed to be strong against it

>>27341043
>projecting
Nah, I just explained the point of the entire franchise and made fun of OP for being an idiot.

>>27340465
For the same reason Flame Burst and Ember arent as strong as Blast Burn

>>27341139
Moonblast doesnt have ubiquitous distribution.
And also might not remain the only Fairy move above 60 BP.

It might be stuck with Dazzling Gleam

>>27341139
Who cares

>>27340946
>Ugh

Go back to tumblr.

Everyone trying to say pokemon should be purposefully weak are retarded. A Pokemon doesn't even need great stats to be viable, a good movepool or ability is even enough.

I don't really see the point of making a pokemon weak just for the sake of diversity.

>>27341211
>expressive noises from the English language belong to websites I don't use
Go back to school, lad.

Pokemon are designed meticulousy to represent the ideas they are designed to represent. If it is meant to be a fiary bug that's what it is. Why on Earth would you stick a design contradicting ability or moveset onto a Pokemon purely to make it "viable" when the idea of competitive Pokemon itself is secondary to the idea behind the game itself and the designs of the Pokemon themselves?

If I was working in game freak's design team and was tasked with designing a hummingbird I'd probably come to the same conclusion as the designer here has and it surely wouldn't be some sort of expert battle Pokemon, it would be a Pokemon designed to convey the ideas I was asked to make it convey with respect to the research I had done in completing its design.

Your complaint is like asking why Coca Cola doesn't have 1400 grams of Protein in it when other consumables do. It's nonsense.

>>27340465
Almost every pokemon in gen 6 were usable in battle to some degree, even some pre-evos. I wouldn't count it out just yet this pokemon's only useful for gathering honey or just blocking added effects of moves it can't even take.

So far it has a typing that gives it 5 weaknesses, 5 resistances including a x4 resistance to fighting. So I don't think it'll be Aurorus-tier in terms of usability.

>>27341196

>who cares

Me and OP and probably some others. If you are so dickishly antipathetic about competitive viability, you probably shouldn't have even come in this thread about competitive viabilitiy

>>27340946
>autistic 38 year old who's never so much as held a girl's hand

>>27341276
>is like asking why Coca Cola doesn't have 1400 grams of Protein in it when other consumables do

Are you sure you're not projecting? Because those examples sound oddly specific. It would make sense if you were actually autist.

>>27341276
I think you're the one who needs to go back to school because you sound retarded.

I never mentioned anything about contradicting moves or abilities. My actual point is that there is no reason to make a weak mon if it has no other purpose in the game. Making a weak mon that can do exactly the same thing as different mons is just there to fill up space. I'm not asking for every pokemon to be garchomp, but what's the point in making a pokemon if it has nothing that sets it apart from other pokemon.

This is not even from only a competitive standpoint, just game balance in general.

Also, go back to tumblr.

>>27341375
How is an insult and an example "projecting"?
How is coca cola a specific example, it's a completely random one off the top of my head and it was an analogy, lad.
Are you sure you're not a 4chan drone who only knows how to communicate with buzzwords you don't quite understand?

>autistic
Ah. never mind, you are. I look forward to you calling me a fedora next.

Pokemon are designed with a concept to get across ideas.
Dunsparce is a rare, fat snake thing that jumps. It's a useless creature from Japanese folk tales (pretty sure they don't exist) - it's meant to be shit but rare.
Farfetch'd is a duck that's been hunted to near extinction because it's delicious. It's supposed to be shit but rare.
This thing is a hummingbird thing. Please show me examples of Hummingbirds being anything other than friendly little yolks that help pollinate flowers or emblematic of pretty and adorable little natural friends in sotrybooks and what not. Please go ahead.. Because that's what they are and that's what this is.

>>27341446
>calls me retarded
>posts nonsense
Mate, Pokemon are designed to represent things from the real world. Pokemon is a game franchise where children go on adventures exploring the weird and wonderful world and the monsters therein are representative of the ideas, creatures and what not one would encounter while adventuring. Pokemon themselves are essentially hyperbole for how the world might look through a child's eyes; everything strange and new is a "monster".
If you somehow never figured that out then you've got a monstrous learning disability.

Now either properly read the posts where I explained why a "weak" Pokemon exists (in a game that's about adventuring and not explicitly about battle mechanics) and stop shitposting just because you want Pokemon to be a different game series about battling.

And I reckon you're the one who needs to "go back to tumblr" since you seem dead sure that you know so much about it, mate.

>>27341549
>20 lines of text
autist

>>27341584
>demands an explanation despite there already being one
>gets a longer one spelling it out from them
>shitposts because that makes them le ebin winRAR
So you concede then, thanks. I don't need you to because I'm right - hence this Pokemon existing in the first place, but it's nice that you can admit you're wrong and also a completely worthless fucking idiot.

>>27341621
>demands an explanation
no, not even the same poster

>shitposts because that makes them le ebin winRAR
what the fuck?

>So you concede then, thanks. I don't need you to because I'm right
Legit question: how old are you?

>>27341644
You don't know the OG 4chan jokes and you ask how old I am mate? Fucking hell.
Plus, responding with a shitpost to an actual post is way worse if you're just some random arsehole.

>>27341677
are you joe merrick? you sound like him

>>27341696
No, I'm just someone who knows what they're talking about. I know this is rare on 4chan and rarer again for someone who never encounters human beings in real life, but believe it or not we exist and can form proper arguments and explanations at will.

>>27341549
I understand why they exist, I just don't think it's a good reason. You can make "strange" and "new" monsters that don't have (nearly) the same moveset, abilities and stats. If you actually want it to reflect real life then it would actually make more sense to make pokemon more diverse by changing their movesets/abilities/stats to show how different survival methods are.

If your point is that it's okay to have weak mons because that's good from a design philsophy, I'll still say that you can make pokemon have diffences in strengths, but that doesn't mean they should be useless in every other part of the game.

And you can still go back to tumblr

>>27341717
>rarer again for someone who never encounters human beings in real life

oh yeah, and you are the pro 4chaner?
go outside with your "human beings" and leave this place, you won't be missed joe

>>27341644
>no, not even the same poster

If you are going to butt your head in a random conversation, don't just shit post you retard.

>>27341735
Its primary role is to represent a part of the region's culture and it'll probably have some hold item 100% of the time tied to berry growing or honey gathering or something. It'll also definitely be on textiles and the like in game because, you know, parallels to real life.

And, again, never used tumblr in the first place.

>>27341762
>implications
Were you bullied so hard that you have some weird need to vent randomly at strangers from the safety of your own keyboard? That's pretty sad. Cheer up, I'm sure there's some mentally stunted freaks out there who would gladly spend time with you. And I'm not a pro - obviously, I don't make money from making excellent posts - I've just frequented this sight semi-regularly for a long time and know all the classic jokes they're all shit

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>doesn't care about competitive viability
>butt in on a thread clearly not for you since that is the case and antagonize for literally no reason

>>27341844
>expecting a reddit hugbox on 4chan

>>27341810
>Were you bullied so hard that you have some weird need to vent randomly at strangers from the safety of your own keyboard? That's pretty sad.

There you go man, another oddly specific statement (and not a projection at all)

>>27341869
>thinking 4chan is chaos, shitposting, and antagonism 24/7
Nigga I don't want a hugbox but you are literally wasting yours and everyone's time with this shit.

>>27340946
>>27341167
>>27341276
>>27341549
>>27341621
>>27341677
>>27341717
>>27341810
>one autist stumbles in and derails the entire thread beyond any hope of return
God fuck you /vp/. You fucking mongrels.

Better than goddamn fucking Luvdisc. Shit stats, shit design, no evolution. Total waste of space.

That being said I desperately want a shiny 6 IV luvdisc

>>27341924
alomomola when I was a kid

>>27341924
Luvdisc gave you heart scales, at least.

>>27341810
Maybe I didn't explain myself well enough, but if it has specific items that only that pokemon can get it's not useless. But there are pokemon that are weak in battle and don't serve any other purpose in the game (except for collecting). What I was trying to argue is that from a design point, pokemon are supposed to be unique. But they aren't really unique if they do the same thing as pokemon #199 battle wise, and don't have a purpose in any other way.

>>27341875
Mate, if you shitpost without any content besides projecting yourself what the fuck do you expect? Seriously, are you new in for the fresh summer vibes or some shit?

>>27341844
>thread asking why all pokemon aren't "competitively viable"
>gets answers explaining it
What's your problem? You don't like when questions are answered? Sorry, let me remedy this.

OMG you're so right! all the pokemon should be just random monsters who are all designed for battle and they should just drop the whole [entire idea behind the game] just to appease your random requests.

>>27341916
>calls responses to the thread topic that properly act as a proper answer to the OP "autistic"
>doesn't make any actual points
>complains that this is bad because it's not hugboxing your random autist needs
no.

>>27341941
See, you're still missing the point, though. Pokemon are purely there as analogues to actual things you'd encounter if you were travelling through the analogue of the region they're in. The battling is really just window-dressing.

They aren't there to fill a niche in the game, they're there to represent that "there are these sorts of bugs in this sort of place" and so on.

>>27341942
>another tl;dr answer

Maybe you are taking this too seriously man...
I'm having a great time triggering you tho

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>>27341942
I don't think I've ever seen anybody give this much effort towards long-winded autistic shit-flinging on a mongolian finger painting imageboard ever before. It's fucking scary to watch.

>>27341942
>literally can't make a point without some kind of attack attached to it
wew

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>>27341979
>tl;dr
>three separate, short responses
Posting less than at least two sentences in a discussion isn't contributing, there mate. And you haven't made any arguments at all. Maybe, just maybe, you should get out because shitposting is called shitposting for a reason.
I'm not being triggered anyway. I post these well-written things and they catch on with the quiet onlookers in the threads. I then pop back a week later and see other people mirroring my posts from before. It's fun.

>>27342004
>person ins a discussion is discussing properly- THE ABSOLUTE HORROR!
I know, right! I should be just posting pictures of lolis and using all the dank memes! I was so wrong! I forgot this was the self-gratification zone where everyone posts nonsense! oh wait...

>>>/b/

>>27342025
>complaining that shitposters are properly told to fuck off

>>27342004
that's because you haven't seen this >>27341549

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>>27342040
>/vp/ is for serious discussion

>>27341549
Uhm, Cutiefly is a Beefly, they steal shit from bees because they too lazy to get food themselves.

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>>27342040

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>>27342071
>giving proper responses in discussion is bad

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>>27342086
>there are serious discussions in /vp/

>>27342040
>I'm not being triggered anyway.
I don't believe you know the meaning of that buzzword

>>27340736
>bug/fairy
>evolves into bug/flying
haha no

>>27342119
>I exclusively shitpost so everyone else should as well
There are other boards for that, newfag

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>>27342136
>doesn't come to /vp/ to exclusively shitpost

>>27341974
And as I said before, I get that that's the point. I just don't see why you wouldn't want to give every pokemon a niche.

Why make a pokemon that no one wants to know more about. I really don't understand that design philosophy if you want you make your as interesting as possible. Yes I get it's supposed to mirror real life, but that is not a reason to make a pokemon uninteresting and useless.

It makes the game easier to create for gamefreak, that's the only good reason I can think of.

I guess you're content with not improving things, but I'm not.

>>27342136
>I'm a newfag so everyone else should as well

>>27342151
>>27342132
>>27342119
>>27342083
>>27342071
>>27342052
>>27342025
>>27342004
>>27341979
Great contribution to the thread guys, simply epic

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>>27341942
You know more pokemon could be made to not be a total shitshow in a fight and still keep most of it's intentional design integrity, right? Unless it's made to be canon pathetic, I don't see the problem in wishing something was better in battle and being a little bummed when it isn't. Bumping up some stat numbers by a few points isn't going to ruin the entire point of a mosquito.

>>27342165
Why don't you go outside or do community service or something? Anything instead of being this mad?

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>>27342165
Thanks i do my best

>>27342134
>surskit
Nothing is impossible with GF

>>27340465

Why the fuck would anyone play pokemon competitvely anyway? Is it autism?

Reasons for a Pokemon existing beyond "OU/competitive battling":

TGC
Merch
Anime
Spin off games usage
Show off new game features
Double/Triple/Rotation etc competitivity
Lower tier competitivity

Then there's always the possibility that older, weaker Pokemon might become viable in later gens thanks to cross-gen evos, Megas, new moves (or better access to old moves), new abilities, new items, or re-typing.

I've lost my interest in feeding the trolls now, you guys can just shitpost amongst yourselves- it stops being fun when you guys increase in numbers and all make the same nothing posts.

>>27342159
I can see where you're coming from, but that's just not what Pokemon does. For all any of us know, that thing is OP as fuck but I assume it's there for the new Lass-based class to use. They could be cleaner game-design wise and 'trim the fat' as far as excess to requirements 'mons, but Pokemon is a brand and those Cutiefly phone cases are going to sell bucket loads. I'm not too into PunPun fly anyway, so I won't worry too much about it otherwise.
You've given me a good back and forth in this ruined thread, anon, and I want you to know that your points are sound.

>>27342174
Hey, yeah, sure.

>>27341292
Basically what >>27341292 stated, this thing may have 5 weaknesses, all of which are only 2x, but so do pure grass types. Then it has 4 normal resists, 1 4x resist, and an immunity. If it gets an evolution, and I think it will, it'll probably be UU at worst if it's got a decent stat distro.

>>27342226
>Lower tier competitivity
I know for some to be strong, weak pokemon have to exist, but I will never not laugh at this consolation prize people give themselves when their "bro" sucks.

>>27342297
There's a reason we have a special Olympics, though.

>>27342231
Well thanks, whether or not we agree on with each other I can understand where you are coming from and will respect your opinion.

And whether or nor you're from tumblr, you seem alright

>>27341942
>>thread asking why all pokemon aren't "competitively viable"
>>gets answers explaining it

Like 70% of the posts aren't explaining shit. They are mostly shitposts like "WHY DO U CARE IF ITS COMPETITIVE" or "COMPETITIVE DISCUSSION? AUTISM!"

>>27342372
This thread was mostly "stop liking what I don't like" from the start.

>>27342372
>counter-points are bad because I don't like being told something contrary to my hot opinions
C'mon, lil Jimmy... Don't be like that

You don't even know if Cutiefly evolves or not. Also, Carbink and Hawlucha of all things have 500 BST.

>>27342425

Like I said, "why do you care, autism!" Isn't a counterpoint. You probably think saying "c'mon lil jimmy" is a counterpoint as well

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>4x rock weakness
>sneaky stone.jpg
>IT'S SHIT NU TRASH
Why don't you wait after the game is released to tell which pokemon is viable and which isn't.

>>27342445
You didn't make a point besides calling posts shit so I countered appropriately. Careful of being a hypocrite, now.

>>27342425
>Not everyone cares about competitive, get over it
Is not exactly an explanation.

>>27342469
Who are you quoting?
You could always read the thread to see the discussion that's already been had instead of making random shitposts.

>>27342459
OP here, what if I told you I have played the game?

>>27342318
Yeah, but we don't go around acting like some of the top athletes there could compete with the best of them in the regulars.

No but really, like I said I know why they need a tier to call themselves viable on, but I just have a little giggle when someone brings points up like "it wrecks in NU" or something when they jump to defend a something like that's supposed to mean it's not overall a D-grade pokemon

>>27342484
>>27340600

>>27342159
I get what you're saying, but being useless doesn't mean uninteresting, unless you mean in the long run. Unown are the definition of useless battle wise, but their lore made them pretty fucking interesting. Sure now not so much because they haven't expanded on that lore for a while, but again at the time it was pretty cool and interesting.

>>27342512
Yeah, the "in Smogon's ass-pull tier-lists this will be great in the shit tier" argument is stupid.
But battling isn't the primary focus of Pokemon and their designs.
I really like Luvdisc and I'd be happy to have more of that sort of stuff, personally.

>>27342519
So, you responded to the wrong comment then? Regardless, if you're going to make a post at least make a point.

>>27342579
I wouldn't. I want more good battle beasts, personally. You shouldn't need some circlejerk of a community to tell you what's good or not, it doesn't take long to figure that out yourself. Maybe I'm just a little salty because pangoro is kinda shitty, but I hate when a good looking mon is just unusable.

>>27342577
I know and I wouldn't call unown useless because they actually served a purpose in the game somehow, but imagine if cutiefly is going to be weak pokemon that doesn't serve any other role in the game except for just being there. Personally, I would call that a waste of space that could be used for a more interesting/stronger pokemon.

>>27342643
God, yeah. I used Pangoro in X and just had to drop him because he wasn't fun to play with. He might get fixed though, at least.
I think it's good to have a few things there that are near harmless for the sake of a region's character. A place where kids can play safely, but there are still things you can catch. It creates the atmosphere or a route that's a good place for a picnic or whatever. As long as there aren't 10 of them in the region it's ok. I'm not going to use every single Pokemon anyway.

>>27342579
I didn't respond to the wrong comment, you pointed out that "counterpoints are bad" like most of the thread WASN'T just shit like >>27340600 and I just said that basically going "stop liking what I don't like," isn't a counter point.

If you want me to say something about it, then battling AND trading were and are still the big 2 points of pokemon, of course people are going to care about arguably the other half of the games, and of course some cool looking pokemon are not going to be usable and that fact will bum some people out.

>>27342722
If you call maybe getting 10 extra points in attack "fixing" it.
Honestly, I love the thing, but fuck, the only thing really going for it is it's signature move and that's all but guaranteed getting passed around this gen.

I guess being one of the stronger knock off users and being able to scrappy through mega sableye helps, but good luck getting anything off before the thing dies.

>>27342725
Exploring and collecting are the major parts of Pokemon, battling is there because they're JRPGs. Trading is part of collecting and the social aspect of the game that is part of its core concept.
This thing might just be a version exclusive, it might just be for atmosphere, it might just be part of explaining regional fashion and it might be part of a side app berry garden thing like the Gen5 dream world thing... Who knows?

>>27342828
In doubles it might fit into some new strategy, though... And maybe it'll get some better moves. I don't see it ever being absolutely broken, but if Pachirisu and Rotom Fan can win worlds then there's always hope.

>>27342856
>battling is there because they're JRPGs
But it's still there, pokemon battling is an important part even in lore as a normal characteristic most pokeon sharing is loving to battle. When it's included in non jrpg spinoffs and even a fucking fighting game being made around the concept of pokemon battling, then I'd say it's pretty damn important and people obviously care about it. Even pokemon go, the most social aspects of the franchise at the forefront, includes and is planning on improving the battling. Saying "nobody cares about it," is just arrogant man.

>>27342134

Masquerain evo should turn into bug dragon

>>27342978
and mega turn into bug/ghost

>>27342940
I didn't say no one cares, though, so please leave it out.
Designs aren't centred around battling anyway. I get that people get bummed when they like something and it fades into obscurity because the competitive scene deem it "thrash", but Pokemon aren't designed with 'competitive viability' in mind.
Plus, in the right metagame, given the way 'metagames' work - in that one sort of approach wins most often and everyone copies it - it's entirely possible for any Pokemon to be part of a broken team. I've been annihilated by Minccinos and Spindas in the past and I've crushed people in Gen 6 with a Misdreavus and Mr Mime combo so anything's doable regardless.

>>27343001
I didn't say you did. Doesn't change that most of the thread did and that's what I'm getting at, since you wanted me to make a point so bad instead of just pointing it out.

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>>27342856
I'm not looking for broken, I just wanted it to not be dead weight 9/10 times. The way it is right now, it has next to no niche of it's own and is just a poor man's choice to the large majority of fighting pokemon, most of which can beat it in a straight up fight.

I don't really care that most aren't designed with battling in mind first before you jump down my throat about that too, but I'm just disappointed as fuck that something I like design-wise, doesn't match up with what I like gameplay-wise.
But seriously, look at this thing, it actually LOOKS like it was made to tear shit up.

>>27343153
I agree that Pangoro (as well as Malamar) should have been a made a little better since they're clearly designed as 'strong battling Pokemon'. Absolutely, that's what they communicate with their designs. There are a handful of other similar cases so that's a fine argument, I'm not going to attack you on that.