Did I miss anything?

>>25810575
Literally 10 reasons its 7th gen vs 4 reasons it could be 6.5. Yes 4, the strange souvenir does not fucking point to 6.5. I don't even know why anyone would believe that

>>25810575
I love how any Gen6.5 "proof" is nothing more than tin-hat talk. I can't wait for all the numerology as proof of it being 6.5

>>25810575
Hey, do you remember when they released the Azure Flute event for DPPt?
Yeah, me neither shut up.

Calling it now.
>Strange Souvenir means we'll get Hawaii region
>all that other shit means Zygarde will get a role in the Hawaii region
>you'll get to visit Kalos because S/M are like MHX.

>>25810738
Hey, do you remember when they didn't use Ice Burn and Freeze Shock?
Yeah me neither shut up.

>>25810833
He's talking about Floette, not Thousand Arrows/Waves, retard.

Besides, wasn't one of the thousand moves released as a zygarde event?

>>25810868
>Besides, wasn't one of the thousand moves released as a zygarde event?

No. And a Floette with a signature move, different design and different stats doesn't equate to an item

File: zygardeevent.png (45KB, 1392x575px) Image search: [Google]

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>>25810868
>Besides, wasn't one of the thousand moves released as a zygarde event

>c.uck
There's that word again.

>>25810575
>Did I miss anything?
Yes, you appear to have omitted any actual proof of anything.

>>25810575
>Strange Souvenir
It wouldn't be the first time Game Freak put a useless item into the game (Gold Leaf, Slowpoke Tail, etc.)

>Zygarde
Reshiram has blue eyes and Zekrom has red eyes. I guess that means Hoenn confirmed?

>Eternal Floette
They never released the Azure Flute either

>unreleased moves
There was also an unreleased ability in gen 3 (Cacophony), it doesn't mean anything.

>game origin value
Half the values there were unused, there's no reason why they can't leave the last two slots unused too.

>>25810575
Name literally anything that has been related to gen 6 in the SuMo release info. (And no, Azoth doesn't count because thats from the anime and you can't prove a connection to SuMo.)

If you can't list a single valid connection, your entire theory means dick.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGqhLcUzOwU

DUDE GEN 3.5 CONFIRMED LMAO

>>25810969
Are you paid for this? I get the feeling you're not but you do it anyway because you're just that pathetic

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>>25811034
>changing volume and the length / width
>DUDE UNUSED CRIES LMAO

>>25811065
What? Disproving retards? That's always fun

>>25810575
>the pokemon company never makes grand plans and event items that end up ultimately getting scrapped

>>25810968
This.

/thread.

>>25811067
Are you denying that gen 3 had unused cries that weren't based on anything else?

File: screenshot-rule34 paheal net 2016-03-10 19-07-31.png (145KB, 252x279px) Image search: [Google]

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The thing that I don't understand about the Eternal Floette thing is that maybe it could've just been in the code for the model needed in the cutscen with AZ. But then again I know like next to nothing when it comes to coded shit in video games.

1: What proof do you have to point that the souvenir is for 6.5?
2: Alright you are looking way too far into things, those are DNA colors not hints for sun and moon.
3: We still have one year to get an event with these moves
4: We still have this whole year to get her.
5: See No. 3
6: The same thing happened with Gen 5

4:

Forgot to remove the 4 on the bottom sorry.

>>25810798
>S/M are like MHX
I wish
>it all comes together

>>25810993
Azoth is in OR/AS too.

In the Magma/Aqua hideouts you can find a book that talks about the AZOTH project, which has to due with using Primal Kyogre/Groudon's power for something, I forgot the specifics.

Honestly I'm thinking that S/M are going to be Gen 7 games dedicated to the 20th anniversary, celebrating all of the mainline, especially highlighting Gen 6 due to how much stuff is left.

>>25811232
I literally know that about Azoth already, but the reveal of Magearna only links Magearna to the anime - just like every other mythical has had some completely unrelated storyline attached to it for the movies.

Azoth cannot be proven to have any actual ties to SuMo, which is why I specifically mentioned people shouldn't try to use it as proof.

Try again though, I want to see if you have anything of substance.

>>25811324
>just like every other mythical has had some completely unrelated storyline attached to it for the movies.
I don't think that those were actually talked about in the games.

The anime always has always had towns that aren't in the games, or mentioned anywhere. But for once it's a place that at least has the name talked about within the mainline.

Not saying it's a fantastic piece of evidence that means AZOTH is 100% attached to S/M, but it could mean something.

>if it is gen 7, it makes gen 6 the worst gen
>if it is gen 6, it makes gen 6 the one where GF went full jew

>>25811111

I'd say the same but not only does it possess a signature move that can be used in battle, it has stats completely different than other floette. It be the first time they actually tossed out a complete pokemon as 'unused data'.

>>25811498
Thank you for clearing that up for me kind anon. I had no clue about that.

>>25810575
Even if Sun & Moon are connected to sixth gen in these ways, why does that dictate that they aren't a new gen?

>>25810969
this

You forgot Magearna and the bird, which are literally two new pokemon.

New pokemon = new generation.

They have NEVER introduced new Pokemon which have their own slots in the national pokedex in the middle of a generation.

Christ.

It's a new gen whenever they add more entries to the PokeDex

>>25811728
anon I'm with you on the whole gen 6.5 is stupid thing but I think they did that for jirachi and deoxys

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>>25810575
Yes, all the hints at M-Charizards being SM box mascots

unfinished shit is not proof

>>25811942
but it is evidence

>>25811728
They split up the dex this time. Makes it easier to get people to buy games when they have half the dex. That's why XY only had 72 mons. I can't believe /vp/ is too dumb to see through this marketting ploy.

>>25810575
I'm betting that Sun and Moon is gonna be like Gold and Silver. Play through the new region like you would normally, and the entire post game takes place in Kalos

>>25811728
They have NEVER introduced new moves in the middle of a generation until ORAS

They have NEVER introduced new abilities in the middle of a generation until ORAS

Times are changing kiddo. From GF's perspective event Pokemon count as introducing Pokemon in the middle of a gen anyway.

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>>25811111
Quints checked.

>>25811728
>They have NEVER introduced new Pokemon which have their own slots in the national pokedex in the middle of a generation.

Are you dense?
Patterns ceased to be an argument since Masuda decided to "surprise people"

They had NEVER made two sequels instead of a third game before Gen 5

They had NEVER introduced less than 100 new pokemon in a gen before Gen 6

>>25811441
Why do you think that?
4chan memes?

>>25812011 (witnessed)
>They had NEVER introduced less than 100 new pokemon in a gen before Gen 6
That's because they saved half of them for the second half of the gen in SuMo.

>>25811829
>>25811829
This is not true. Or, at the very least extremely misleading.

Both pokémon had their data in Ruby and Sapphire. They were not obtainable via any non-hacked method in those games.

I'm on your side though, 6.5 is relentless faggotory.

>>25812047
That also explains why there's no all 100 stat mythical

>>25810575
Change the god damn "Gen 6.5" to "Gen 6" because "6.5" is just a giant label which no one can ever agree on what the definitions are, just like feminism.

>>25812011
They've also never made a game where you can fuck Pokemon. But I guess it will be a feature in SuMo because Masuda wants to surprise us, right?

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>>25812000
Trips checked.

>>25811829
Then why was I able to get Jirachi in my Ruby version?

Can someone explain the pentagon demo thing to me? Is it relevant to any other gen?

Inb4
>wanting to surprise us

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>>25812258
For the pentagon to work, XY needs to read Pokemon based on the game they came from. Each game is given a different value indicating a Pokemon's origin. XY take up values 24/25 and ORAS take up values 26/27. XY can read two more slots via 28 and 29. The fact that they left exactly two of these slots and no more or less suggests that Sun/Moon are supposed to use these slots. And there's also evidence they had Sun/Moon planned during XY's development because of the Souvenir NPC in XY.

>25812258
version IDs 24-29 light up the Pentagon in the preview. Hacking early on showed that values 30+ did not result in a pentagon.

xy were version IDs 24/25
asor was version IDs 26/27
?? was version IDs 28/29 (presumably sumo)

oras demo was a stripped down Alpha Sapphire, using the version ID of AS (which was 26)

>>25812318
Why is XY relevant anymore? All official battle formats require you to use ORAS anyways. And when SM come out they'll require SM.
Why does XY's particular programming for the pentagon even matter?

>>25812485
>Why is XY relevant anymore?

Because you can still obtain Pokemon from XY and Pokemon obtained from XY can be used in competitive ORAS battles.

>>25812503
Of course, but why would SM use the same system? It might, but it could very well not. I just don't see the relevance of it in the discussion.

>>25812561
>but why would SM use the same system?
Same reason XY and ORAS did. To determine if a Pokemon isn't from a previous gen for competitive rulesets.

>I just don't see the relevance of it in the discussion.
It's relevant because there 2 slots and we're getting 2 games.

>>25812581
Why couldn't SM have an alternate, or expanded system for determining whether Pokemon are eligible for competition? I don't see why you would assume that it will be the exact same.
Is ORAS the exact same? If so, why not use ORAS as the example and not XY? ORAS is more relevant for eligibility at this point in time.

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>>25810575
As of today, 6.5 rumor has officially been deconfirm.

>>25812318
>>25812469
And is there no possible chance that it's to read Pokemon of the first six gens from SM? Like GS could trade older Pokemon?

>>25812318
>The fact that they left exactly two of these slots and no more or less suggests that Sun/Moon are supposed to use these slots.
It doesn't suggest anything. All it means is that they were prepared to have a total of 6 games using the system. After all, this leaves them open to make 2 new gen games, 2 remakes, and then either new gen sequels (like B2W2), or a third version (leaving one slot empty).
Is it possible Sun and Moon will fill these slots? Sure. On the other hand, it's no secret that gen 6 has left a bad taste in people's mouths, so it's also possible they just decided to skip ahead and leave the slots empty.

>>25812631
>I don't see why you would assume that it will be the exact same.

Because they made exactly 2 extra slots. Yes it could have a different system. But it doesn't seem likely if they had plans for SM during XY.

>>25812705
> it's no secret that gen 6 has left a bad taste in people's mouths

lol fucking please. They still sold like hotcakes. And like I said, they were AWARE of SM plans during XY. They aren't going to suddenly change and go "whoop be better make this a new gen now." SM ARE the sequel games to XY. They're just going a step further than BW2 and letting them stand on their own.

>>25812850
Why do the two slots HAVE to be SM? That's a huge assumption. We have no way of knowing the planning and decisions behind SM. They could have very well had another gen 6 game or two planned and decided to focus on Sun and Moon instead.

>>25810575
>Serebii Joe and half of vp are trying to cuck

Stopped reading there. Use the word in the proper context and not autistically like some socially inept Mongloid.

>>25812850
>they were AWARE of SM plans during XY
Because of an insignificant NPC that hands out an item that has no confirmed link to SM? Sure.

>>25812900
>Why do the two slots HAVE to be SM?
Because they had plans for SM.

>We have no way of knowing the planning and decisions behind SM.
Yes we do. From the Souvenir NPC in XY. They clearly knew what they were doing.

They plan what games they're going to release well ahead of time.

Dude. Who says they won't add AZ Floette, and Zygarde with those moves later this year? And who says that souvenir has anything to do with 6.5?

>>25812954
Of course they did, that's not the point. The point is that there could have been other plans that got scrapped, delayed, or pushed aside for SM's development. To me, this means nothing and is just grasping at straws.

>>25812954
Give one goddamn reason the Strange Souvenir matters more than the Anville town train Cart. If you can't shut the fuck up about Strange Souvenir.

>>25810957

Cuck is only filtered if it's all caps. Probably because that's how the typical shitpost operates.

KEK is what it filters to.

>>25810575
>ORAS were shitty remakes

That's weird, seeing as how they're better than HGSS in every regard.

>New Pokemon
>Not a new gen

Get outta here 6.5 fags

>>25811065
who would ever need to be paid to disprove retards, it's fun and rewarding in its own way.

>>25812975
>The point is that there could have been other plans that got scrapped, delayed, or pushed aside for SM's development

Not likely. They don't just randomly scrap entire games. If they made reference to SM in XY they had plans for it.

>>25813024
>Give one goddamn reason the Strange Souvenir matters more than the Anville town train Cart.

The Strange Souvenir and the NPC associated with it makes direct reference to a new region "you'll see in due time" while the train thing doesn't.

>>25811829
All of the legionaries that werent reveled (hoopa,volcation) were in the code for X and Y. Deoxys and Jirachi data were in RS, the new robot fairy is not in any gen6 game, it's a gen7 pokemon

>>25813402
And how does that prove Sun and Moon are Gen 6?
How does a guy talking about a new region prove it's Gen 6?
Tell me right now, with substantial evidence to back up your claims. Not evidence of "Gen 6.5", evidence that proves a guy talking about a new region means that Sun and Moon are Gen 6.

File: triggerwarningtriggers.jpg (46KB, 620x720px) Image search: [Google]

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>mfw "gens" are just a social construct of the patriarchy

File: Gen_VII.jpg (267KB, 1284x1106px) Image search: [Google]

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Please see attached.

>>25813469
>And how does that prove Sun and Moon are Gen 6?

It doesn't. But it's still evidence. You're missing the point. The Souvenir guy being in XY means that GF didn't have Z or any bullshit planned.

>>25813763
he's gonna have to fix it later when he gets BTFO.

>>25813845
Keep acting like you have the high ground, it's hilarious

>>25813866
I don't need to act when I actually do have the high ground.

>>25813886
Yeah, keep acting like unused data means anything, it's adorable

>>25813897
Yeah, keep assuming wrong information just to support your flawed headcanon, it's hilarious.

>>25813925
>New Gen everytime new pokemon announced
>New Gen every 3-4 years
>New Gen everytime a new name is given to the games
>Gen Countdown
>Wrong
Now it's pathetic

>>25810933
Lands wrath has always been zygarde 50%s signature move, the one you catch in terminus cave has it, youre already on serebii, you can literally fucking check first.

>>25810933
Fuck i tagged wrong the wrong post

>>25812054
Exactly. The 100-stat pixie is Magearna. And the wireframe bird is Haotori

>>25813845

Let's go over the different factors people use as evidence to prove a new gen.

>new Pokemon

We have confirmation we're getting "at least 10" which was given in a joking manner, implying more.

>new region

Well, you guys are all seemingly in agreement that we're getting a new region.

>new mechanics

Each region only has a couple of new mechanics. All they have to do is add a few small things, rebalance attacks again, and that's covered.

>new graphics

All they have to do is touch the graphics up lightly, like they did between Platinum and B/W. B/W had a little more definition, a little more action, but largely the same look and feel. As far as sprites go, compare Pikachu's Pt sprite to B/W. (Protip: Filthy rat learned to shut its mouth.)


And what about the pentagon?

They aren't required to make the new games fully compatible backward just because they have the capacity, and until they confirm that they are/aren't, it's unreasonable to assume either way. However, even if they give SuMo IDs 28/29, that doesn't mean they have to be backwards compatible. Ways they could have partial compatibility:

-battling with compatible Pokemon/attacks/abilities
-trading with compatible Pokemon/attacks/abilities
-able to withdraw compatible Pokemon from Bank with any game, leaving anything new locked in the bank while you're accessing it with an older game

This would be slightly more functional than G/S/C's Time Machine, adding compatible battle functionality. Doesn't make it the same gen any more than the Time Machine makes G/S/C Gen 1/1.5.

What about the attacks/Floette?

Again, they don't have to release them. If they do, great. If not, well, that's their decision.

What about the Strange Souvenir?

Again, doesn't have to connect, and if it does, it doesn't have to be gen-relevant.

Just sayin'. You people are making a lot of assumptions. Until we know for sure, nothing has to be the way you assume it will be.

>>25811498
>I'd say the same but not only does it possess a signature move that can be used in battle, it has stats completely different than other floette. It be the first time they actually tossed out a complete pokemon as 'unused data'.
Most likely was intended to be battled with AZ in the parade but was deemed too challenging, because, honestly would that surprise anybody?

But, I dont doubt in the least that she has some ties to the AZOTH kingdom's resurrection.

>>25811795
Its a new gen whenever they had new Pokemon.
Except when they add a new form (Emerald)
Except when they add a new, unrelated form and new items (Platinum)
Except when they add new forms even if they have completely increased stats. And new moves (B2W2)
Except when they have new forms, abilities, and altered movepools and can change types (ORAS)
You can keep trying, but gamefreak isnt going to do everything the way you think they will and in fact, aims to do things the way you don't expect. And the concept of Generation never meant a thing to GameFreak anyway.

>>25813947
>>New Gen everytime new pokemon announced
Not anymore.

>>New Gen every 3-4 years
XY came out less than 3 years ago. 4 years + some months isn't a stretch.

>>New Gen everytime a new name is given to the games
Not anymore.

>>Gen Countdown
These are anniversary games. It makes sense for there to be a countdown. In fact, the entire trailer focused more on the history of the franchise than the game itself.

>>25813991
>rebalance attacks again, and that's covered.
But they won't if it's the same gen.

>They aren't required to make the new games fully compatible backward just because they have the capacity, and until they confirm that they are/aren't, it's unreasonable to assume either way.
No it's reasonable to assume they will be. The leftover data in XY is there for a reason.

>This would be slightly more functional than G/S/C's Time Machine, adding compatible battle functionality. Doesn't make it the same gen any more than the Time Machine makes G/S/C Gen 1/1.5.
No, because for battling to work mechanics have to be the same. And if mechanics are the same it's the same gen.

>You people are making a lot of assumptions.
You're making just as many you retard

>>25813991
>Doesn't make it the same gen any more than the Time Machine makes G/S/C Gen 1/1.5.
Gold/Silver were in completely updated graphics, proper color, and Crystal even had animations. They also added new moves, a female option in Crystal, had a new story and a hell of a lot of new stuff plus it was played on higher end hardware.

I guarantee you Sun/moon will play on Gen 6 engine and 3DS, not even n3ds exclusive even though they can and have done this before.

File: fulllumiose[1].jpg (48KB, 400x480px) Image search: [Google]

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If Sun/Moon look exactly like this (including the bottom screen) but in a new region then it's gen 6. no questions asked.

>but muh gen 2/5 looked the same as previous gens!
They didn't.

>>25814060
>Not anymore
Assuming SM is not a new gen then using that as evidence that new pokemon =/= new gen is circular reasoning

SM will come out a month after the three year mark, around the time all the previous gens came to a close

>Not anymore

Again, circular reasoning, it means nothing and makes your retardness much more apparent

VC Red and Blue are the anniversary games, the countdown of gens and years ending in SM 2016 is BLATANT new gen announcement

>But they won't of it's the same gen

Is circular reasoning all you are capable of?

>Leftover data is in XY for a reason

No it's not, as someone with a cursory knowledge of how games are made, I can tell that's just extra slots put in for insurance

>You admit you are making assumptions
>You try to claim our FACTS are assumptions too

>>25814060

Rebalancing attacks wasn't the only thing covered in that line, nice cherrypicking.

A lot can change in a few short years. Just because they added it doesn't mean they have to use it. From a programming standpoint, if it was possible I'd have to use it, I'd add a few compatible markers.

Fair enough. But the battling was a theoretical, not anything from the creators. Still not safe to assume it's possible yet.

And I'm only listing possibilities and pointing out flaws in the argument, not stating any of this is surely going to be the case. No assumptions there.

>>25814068

>graphics

Yep.

>color

Sure, goes with graphics.

>animations

Still in the graphics section.

>new moves

So did OR/AS, they're still Gen 6.

>female option

Still gets lumped into graphics because that's all it affects gameplay-wise.

>new story

So did OR/AS

>new stuff

So did OR/AS.

>higher-end hardware

Sure, sure. Except all but Crystal could be played completely on an original Game Boy. If the new games have New 3DS-compatible features but can be played on a regular 3DS, it's the same thing.

>not even n3ds exclusive

That'd be suicide. Not enough people have bought it.

>>25812011
>One pattern stops happening so it immediately disqualifies all other patterns

>>25814136
>Assuming SM is not a new gen then using that as evidence that new pokemon =/= new gen is circular reasoning

It's not circular reasoning when there's clear evidence they're still connected to XYORAS.

>SM will come out a month after the three year mark, around the time all the previous gens came to a close
Then looks like they'll have to break more patterns.

>Again, circular reasoning
Again, muh patterns

>VC Red and Blue are the anniversary games
Did you miss how the entire announcement trailer for SUN/MOON (not for VC Red/Blue) was showing off the history of the franchise? You're delusional if you think these aren't anniversary celebration titles. It greatly contrasts with the XY trailer where they actually showed GAMEPLAY instead of fapping over how the history of the franchise went.

>Is circular reasoning all you are capable of?
Is patterns all you are capable of?

>No it's not, as someone with a cursory knowledge of how games are made
I know how games are made. And they don't waste time making all this data for it not to be used. An unused item is one thing. But multiple unused moves, a souvenir, and pentagon slots that match exactly with new game announcements instead of a single Z version is another thing.

>You try to claim our FACTS are assumptions too
I am using facts. As evidence. Sorry pal.

>>25811829
Oh yeah I forgot how Deoxys and Jirachi weren't in Ruby and Sapphire version's data.
you're retarded

>>25814188
If we're going by data then mechanics are what matters.

Also stop misusing spoiler tags

>>25814194

Make us.

I don't even understand what the fuck Gen 6.5 is supposed to mean. If it's still Gen 6 isnt it just Gen 6? If it's a sequel that's Gen 7 then isn't it Gen 7? The fuck does 6.5 mean?

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>>25814226
6.5 is undated version of Pokémon X and Y with new Pokémon introduced.

>>25810575
There's also a thing about how magearna sort of looks like the statues outside of the pokeball factory, right by the gate I think it was, when it's all closed up. I haven't found images of them side by side to compare, but from what I remember they do look alike, but who knows if they're connected.

>>25814176
Your only evidence is unused data, that's not evidence

And lose sales?

It's not a pattern, it's a hard rule, also, that didn't refute anything

Them showing off the gens (not every game, THE GENS!) was a gen announcement, They announced it on the anniversary so early because it was the anniversary

Again, not refuting a goddamn thing

It takes TWO SECONDS to code how many slots, and programmers always code more than they need because it doesn't take up more data and "just in case" We've had unused abilities, unused items, and unused data up the asshole since the series began. IT. LITERALLY. MEANS. NOTHING.

You are using assumptions based on unused data and fan wankering theories as your evidence, when none of it means or proves anything other than how fucking desperate gen 6.5 fags are.

>>25812318
>And there's also evidence they had Sun/Moon planned during XY's development because of the Souvenir NPC in XY.
>the NPC that literally states it's from a new region

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>>25814226

>>25814256
So Gen 6?

>>25814274
>>the NPC that literally states it's from a new region

Yeah, that's how we know he's referring to SM. I don't get your point.

>>25814294
Yes.

>>25814300
>new region confirmed
>new region with new pokemon at that
>I-it's still totally gen 6 though guys!

>>25814309
>>I-it's still totally gen 6 though guys!

Yeah because if the mechanics are same and it can battle with XY and ORAS in gen 6.

You gen 7 fags really aren't paying attention are you?

>>25814325

>if

>if

>IF

Baseless speculation is all you can offer, they haven't stated you can battle backward at all. It's more likely that you won't be able to.

>>25814325
New Mechanics added every time new region, new pokemon, new game names, every three years

>N-Nuh man, the mechanics are definitely going to be the same, muh pentagans!

>>25814355
>>N-Nuh man, the mechanics are definitely going to be the same, muh pentagans!

Yup. Just you wait.

>>25814348
>Baseless speculation is all you can offer, they haven't stated you can battle backward at all.

Evidence points toward being able to with the pentagons and zygarde moves. Sorry bub.

>>25810575
Explain the two moves in the pic
Z1 is red and needs sunlight in the anime
Volcanion's event hints at South Kalos stuff
South Kalos in general

>>25811965
Exactly this.

>>25814411

The pentagons have already been explained, they're a programmer's safeguard. You literally have to TRY to be this retarded.

Zygarde's moves don't have to appear, and they could still be released as an event before SuMo.

Anyway if they start to add Pokémon like they added items, megaevolutions, abilities and whatever else in ORAS the concept of generations will die and we'll be stuck in gen 6 forever.

unused data?????? in a video game???? THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE!!!!

>>25814512
ESPECIALLY IN A POKEMON GAME
>Sweeps mountain of unused data from pokemon games under bed

>>25814512
Not when you get two Zygarde cores, one of which is red and needs sunlight, two exclusive moves for Zygarde related to the sun and the moon, hints at locations that you'll be able to explore in the future (like the waterfall thing), a train station we don't know about in the place people talk about these locations, sundials/moondials, a new event talking about a place we can't currently go to but we constantly hear about and the new games literally being called Sun and Moon.

I like how everyone has missed
http://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-video-games/pokemon-sun-and-pokemon-moon/
"Using Pokémon Bank, you'll be able to transfer Pokémon you've caught in the Nintendo 3DS Virtual Console versions of Pokémon Red, Pokémon Blue, and Pokémon Yellow into your copy of Pokémon Sun or Pokémon Moon. Pokémon from Pokémon Omega Ruby, Pokémon Alpha Sapphire, Pokémon X, and Pokémon Y can also be brought into Pokémon Sun and Pokémon Moon in the same way."

Pokemon will be transfered to SM from ORASXY the same way as from RBY, in other words ONE WAY, meaning SM can't trade with ORASXY which means it's not compatible which means it's not gen 6

>>25814594
It doesn't say SM can't trade with XY and ORAS. It just says that they want you to buy SM if you want to transfer your RGBY Pokémon. It doesn't specify anything else.

>>25814570
Okay I'll bite. Let's say this zygarde event you're talking about exists in sun and moon. Fuck it, let's say that you even have to import your event zygarde from X and Y through pokebank into sun and moon. Does this still make sun and moon gen 6.5? Absolutely not.

>>25814570

>two Zygarde cores

If it's only been introduced in the anime, it's irrelevant.

>two exclusive moves related to sun and moon

No, they hit the air and pin to the ground/hit the ground and prevent retreating.

>hints at locations

There's references to Kanto, as well. X/Y = Gen1

>other trash

Doesn't mean it's evidence for SuMo being Gen 6.

>>25814608
It literally says "You can transfer pokemon from ORASXY to SM the same way as RBY, which is one way" Why add a Gen 5 > 6 style transfer when you can just trade? Or use the bank normally? Why waste time and resources adding a feature that's useless? Unless IT'S NOT?

>>25814608

It's worded in a way that strongly implies that it's a one-way transfer. They weren't counting on someone as stupid as you being able to read and make faulty implications.

>>25814620
That's not what I said.

>>25814624
>the biggest Pokémon ad (aka the Pokémon anime) is irrelevant
I hope you realize why that makes no sense.

>There's references to Kanto, as well. X/Y = Gen1
You know why what you're saying is stupid, I don't need to explain it.

>trash
>Doesn't mean it's evidence for SuMo being Gen 6.
Epic.

>>25814640
>>25814643
ORAS does it as well. It doesn't matter.

>Why waste time and resources adding a feature that's useless?
Because it isn't? That's just how the bank works.

>>25814658

>>the biggest Pokémon ad (aka the Pokémon anime) is irrelevant
>I hope you realize why that makes no sense.

Pokemon getting trainer-based forms confirmed, holy shit.

The point is, you're making baseless speculation. You have zero proof that the Gen 6 games are compatible with SuMo for regular purposes, and zero proof that they're Gen 6. Opposed to you, everything is pointing toward Gen 7.

>>25814686
>Opposed to you, everything is pointing toward Gen 7.
It isn't. Everything is baseless speculation. Mine is less than yours though, since I'm not relying on fanterms.

>>25814696

Generation is a fan term. 6.5 just happens to be the worst one.

>>25813402
Games are scrapped all the time. Are you dense?

>>25814671
Ar-Are you responding to >>25814608 me? Because nothing you said has anything to do with what I said. Also "Visit the Pokémon Bank page for important details on the planned update to support Pokémon Sun and Pokémon Moon." They literally said right there that SM right now is not compatible with Bank as it is right now, and thus not compatible with ORASXY

>>25814723

The update could be to just add new data for the new Pokemon. Doesn't mean it won't be able to transfer backward, I'd actually really like that feature.

>>25814723
>>>25814671 (You)
>Ar-Are you responding to >>25814608 (You) me?
What?

>>25814743

Actually, the second reference was me. The first and third weren't. And I'm not even the guy you were talking to.

>>25814733
They literally said that they plan to use the same Pokemon cross gen transfer system for both RBY and ORASXY to get to SM. Why waste money making a transfer system that works with ORASXY when you can just Bank move and trade them to SM? That's wasted money.

>>25811957
>>25814416
Hence why S&M region will be based on Spain, the country that is conveniently directly south of France.

>>25813402
And we're suppose to never go to the place where the Cart from?

>>25814760
Or Italy.

>>25814754

I'm saying it'd be nice if they just added a compatibility checker for new stuff and made it so anything compatible could be drawn by any game, and in the meantime, make the Gen 1 transfer system similar to the Poke Transporter.

>>25810575
How poor are you retards that you would go this far just to validate your purchase decision over a $40 game?

>>25814325
You do remember that RBY could trade with GSC, right? GSC = Gen 1.5 confirmed I guess.

>>25815379
Trading does not equate to battling.

>>25815383
>new pokemon
>new region
>interacts with an older game but only if you use pokemon and moves that had been released then
How is this any different?

>>25815398
>How is this any different?

It's different because trading isn't reliant on mechanics like battling is. Time capsule trading is practically just transferring except it goes two ways. With battling it flat out doesn't work unless the mechanics are the same. Gen 1 can't calculate damage the same way Gen 2 does because of the different stats.

>>25815402
So no old moves get changed and it's good to go?
This is still all hypothetical anyway since battling hasn't been confirmed. Kinda pointless to even discuss until it is.

>>25810575
Every gen so far has given is a legendary trio besides the box legends, and a rounded 600 base stats legendary. So far we've gotten neither from gen Vi. Hard to believe they'd drop something like that now

>>25815423
And every gen before that gave us 100+ new pokemon.

>>25811898
Where in the world is moon fucking green? Hiroshima?

>>25811418
We literally can't know for sure until SuMo launch though, which is why we can't expect to be able to use it to prove a link to gen 6.

>>25814020
>And the concept of Generation never meant a thing to GameFreak anyway.
This. "Generation" is a fanmade term to categorize the games within the series, and to discern the remakes and the original

>>25815423
>>25815423
>>25815426
And it never happened that games within the same Gen weren't 100% compatible
>inb4 Plat Giratina formes and Kyurem
D/P are perfectly compatible with Pt, just like B2/W2 and B/W. If you battle a D/P cartridge using Pt and Giratina Origin, the Pokémon will appear in the latter cartridge with the standard sprite, but the stats would be different. Same with Kyurem in B/W.

Just face it, guys: GF is tearing apart every pattern we previously found in the series.

>>25815657
Except 100% compatible means 100% compatible, not 99% compatible and these two things are exempt. D/P and Pt were never 100% compatible and nothing you say will change that fact.

The Kalos and 6.5 lovers are just SO stupid. You have ALL the proofs to see that Kalos is over. There is a new generation. Accept it.

Kalos is over. Zygarde's chest? Nah.

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>there are people who seriously think E-Floette and the Zygarde forms will not get used in the games

>>25815751
Zygarde forms are literally not in gen 6 games, so you will be waiting for gen 7. Floette could be released but nothing suggests that its a given, and it could also be saved for gen 7, or completely ditched.

>>25810969
>I guess that means Hoenn confirmed
It did and looked what happened a gen later. Checkmate atheist.

>>25815780
>but nothing suggests that its a given
they didn't give her custom stats and a signature move for nothing

also gen6.8 gen 7.5 doesn't matter what you want to call it, it's clear that GF planned something different from the start just like B2W2, anyone who thinks that there was a Z version that was scrapped is straight up an idiot

>>25815813
>programming a fully functional thing and not using it is stupid
Azure flute, lock capsule, seal bag, pokestar studios props...

Who cares if it could potentially be used somewhere? The question is, will it be used? And literally nothing suggests anything one way or the other, so it is completely possible it will be ignored.

>>25815841
>still using azure flute as an argument
there's no such thing as a E-Floette event in XYORAS, it's not the same thing as Arceus, and as far as story goes AZ wouldn't just give to you the pokemon he searched for 3000 years cause i dunno lol, they most definitely planned AZ to return for the next games

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we have confirmation of two new Pokémon, we know there's a new location, and there's also the fact that Red and Blue are only supported by Bank with Sun and Moon.

How many games do you know from Pokémon that had new Pokémon that you couldn't trade over (forms don't count since they're still the same Pokémon), and how many games do you remember that just added a completely foreign location into the mix that wasn't the Battle Tower? And no, Black and White 2 don't count for that since it's the same region but different cities.

and since OP loves straw grasping lemme do it too
>guy in one of the hotels says the region he's from "will be found out in due time"
>some of the statues in Battle Areas are Suns and Moons
>The concept art showed new locations and neverbefore seen building designs
>Pikachu looks different again
>this year will mark the 3rd year of Gen 6, and gen 2 had the lowest amount of days and years from gen hopping (2 total from Japan's incarnation of GS to RS) so a new gen is very plausible
pic related, it's ge 6.5 proof

None of that is proof, you retard.

>>25815900
>cherry picking
Exactly what I expect from a 6.5 faglord.

>>25815900
>>25815841
>>25815813
remember when Bonsly was in Gen 3? And it was just a reskinned Sudowoodo?

>>25815934
It didn't have a dex number yet, you couldn't actually train and evolve it or trade it... It was literally just an ornament and a sneak peek, it wasn't able to interact with anything outside it's bingo sheet.

>>25815962
what i was saying was, was that bonsly was in gen 3 and wasn't used in gen 3 at all until next gen. and even then, it was just a reskinned sudowoodo, same stats and ability and typing, only a different name, cry, model, and animation set.
it's what we call foreshadowing, and i think that these "unused but are totally gonna be used later this gen" assets are gonna be like bonsly. used for gen 7

>>25815931
>memeing
>6.5
confirmed for not even reading

>>25810575
Your mind?

You win OP, I'll bite. I just don't want Zygarde to get cucked out of a game.

>>25815998
Oh, I read it. I read how you picked one specific example and ignored literally all the rest. You have to disprove all of them, not just one.

>>25815485
>green

Found the colourblind retard

>>25810575
In all seriousness though.
What actual evidence does gen7 have other than MUH NEW REGION?

Maybe just maybe, SM are gen7 but they release Z sometime this year still?

OPs evidence is indeed damning.

>>25817274
Other than "muh new region"? "muh new pokemon"
Other than that, marketing terms and "proving" that S/M can't be gen 6 with what we're saying by trying to debunk things with "muh pokedex" and "muh statements where i say you're wrong about things because u r retarded"

>>25817223
This.
They won't do that.
We just dont have all the info

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>>25817274
>but they release Z sometime this year still

>>25817274
It's not damning. It's damn stupid. Like you.

>>25817274
And is there literally ANY evidence pointing to gen 6 from the SuMo release info and spoilers? Nope. Who's being dumb now?

>>25817572
There's no evidence of anything there. Well, other than the fact that Zygarde has connections to the moon and the sun with Norse mythology which X/Y follows heavily.
that as well as 100%'s chest colors

>>25817607
>Zygarde connections to the Moon and Sun
But that has nothing to do with information released for SuMo. It's like saying this is a re-remake of HG/SS because they had sun and moon related intros.

>colours
Thats tenuous at best and is still gen 6 trying to link forward, not SuMo spoilers explicitly linking back.

On the other hand we have new pokemon, new region, specific language implying heavily that we are getting something brand new, and the clear disconnect from gen 6 with the names.

But of course you are just going to ignore all the ACTUAL evidence and keep up with the imagined evidence. Go ahead, I know you want to.

>>25810575
>Did I miss anything
>Half the fucking board is empty
Are you legitimately autistic?

>>25817257
yep, just a retard who didn't even read

>>25817703
Evidence doesn't mean hard evidence, obviously. We can only connect things to what's on display from before.
I guess if people are saying "new mons = new gen" and not "new gen = new mons", I can't exactly blame them. They probably have their piece of hard evidence for gen 7 then

>>25817711
You went off on some tangent about ">muh Floette must be release because nothing else can ever be true" and failed to actually refute the things that mattered. Literally cherry picking you moronic jizzrag.

>>25817744
I could say the same about 6.5 fags to be honest - their argument is both that new gen = new mons for gens 2-6, and that new mechanics/broken compatibility = new gen.

Except using their definition they have literally no idea whether it is gen 6, 6.5, 7, r something else entirely, because the games aren't released so they can't actually know any of the mechanics yet.

So in other words, 6.5 fags are either stupid or very very deluded, or are somehow ab;e to perfectly predict the future (in which case I want them to accurately reveal all the new pokemon so the rest of us have something to talk about.)

>>25817828
I was the one posting >>25812062
Don't bring other shit into what you were talking about. I'm not really in a mood where I'm gonna reply too heavily.

>>25817781
>cherrypicking
again, you're still using that worf and i don't think you actually know what it means

we were discussing about unreleased things and i was making that anon notice that you can't compare something like the Azure Flute to E-floette (also brcause Arceus was released in HGSS)
>because nothing else can ever be true
i don't even know what the fuck you're talking about

>>25817900
You cherry picked one answer and ignored the rest - explain Lock Capsule and the rest and I might actually forgive you for being an autistic fuckwad that clearly doesn't know that cherry picking is ignoring valid points in order to focus on only one and acting as though that one is enough to refute the rest.

And the part you quoted? That is literally how you sound. "E-Floette HAS to happen because they never just left a unreleased pokemon before" which is just a stupid argument in itself. It's like you can't understand that it doesn't have to happen just because you say it has to happen.

>>25810575
half of your little grid isn't even finished you asshat

Are people this autistic that they actually think Sun and moon aren't new generations

>>25817966
>items can be compared to pokemon
that's fucking stupid, it's not going to happen just because i said so, it's going to happen because prior events just like was talking about before but of course your lack of reading comprehension prevents you from coming with actual logical conclusions
remember when Bonsly, Arceus etc. where never released? yeah me neither because going with your stupid logic of "it never happened before but it could happen this time" then you mind as well join the gen 6.5 club

>>25818119
Fuck your logic is backwards. You are saying "this one piece of code that no-one should have ever seen is more important than this other piece of code no-one should have seen."

Really, they are under no obligation to actually utilise anything, regardless of patterns. You are making one whopper of an assumption based on a tiny portion of overall data, versus a proven list of neglected things that correlate well.

Besides, E-Floette is in a unique position where it is just a form, and not a Pokemon with an actual unique dex number. It's much closer to the unused Shellos data from the R/S beta than Arceus or Bonsly.

>>25810575
WHO CARES?

What difference does it make if Sun/Moon are gen 7 or still gen 6? You guys are literally arguing for the sake of arguing.

>>25818189
>they are under no obligation to actually utilise anything
well since i don't predict the future i can never be 101% sure but at least i provide some actual evidence to reinforce my arguments, there's nothing datamined in the gen 6 games that suggests Floette should've been given to you at some point but it was scrapped, they eventually released the M-Lati twins, the vivillon forms, the new Hoopa form and i'm fairly sure after Volcanion they're not going to stop there

That said the discussion is over because there's really nothing left to talk about except keep screaming the same things to each other over and over, i guess we'll just have to wait and see...

>>25818337
You realise the evidence you have presented is literally no more valid than anything I have presented, right?

And again, E-Floette might still be released, but NOTHING guarantees it. You could cite a million examples, and while that would be compelling, it wouldn't guarantee the million and first wouldn't be different.

>>25818389
your "evidence" iis only regarding random items not pokemon, forms, megas or whatever
Now if you want to compare E-floette to something never released there's the Arceus ??? form aaand... that's basically it i think, because anything from Shellos to Munna and Carracosta and the concepts for the gen 2 mons in RBY ended up making it into the games at some point

>>25818539
Shellos made it in with different forms though, which is fairly significant. And as I said, there is every chance it could still be released. But it doesn't mean it has to be released this gen.

>>25813763
>He wasn't around for the "Serebii Confirmed" meme.

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contributing

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ANOTHA ONE

>>25821195
Volcanion in South Kalos
Z1 needing sunlight

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AND ANOTHA ONE

>>25811955

Where's the proof that it's a split Dex? You're taking straight or of your ass

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>>25821252
Now we just need a Zygarde core to take energy from the moon in the anime and it's a done deal.

>>25821900
The Pokédex in XY is split in three parts. It wouldn't be hard to add another part.

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I'm convinced that this is the next gen because of the Direct. It was showing every gen in order by release date and then said "AND IN 2016" as if this is the next new adventure. That alone proves this is the next gen, I think. If this was a supposed Gen 6(6.5) game, then it wouldn't make sense to make the "countdown" like that.

There's never been two new games in the same gen, only a sequel (BW2), remakes (FRLG, HGSS, ORAS), and the "trio" game (Y, C, E, Pt).

>>25822246

Before you say "this is the sequel to XY", there's never been a game that introduced a new Pokemon either. Formes of already existing Pokemon (Like Giratina and Kyurem) and Megas don't count as "new" Pokemon.

>>25822246
>it wouldn't make sense to make the "countdown" like that
Anniversary

>pattern
Might get broken

>Yellow is the third version and I'm proud to be american
It's Red, Green and Blue.

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>>25822355

>Anniversary
Doesn't matter, they did this with all the other Directs as well.

>might get broken
Keyword here is MIGHT, you don't know but I don't know either. I'm just going by what we have observed. SM is only compatible with XYORAS through Bank, which should tell you something. It's like calling RBGY in the Virtual Console Gen 6(6.5) because it'll be able to transfer Pokémon from there to SM. XYORAS is no different.

>It's, Red, Green, and Blue

Okay I forgot about Green, gee sorry

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>>25813108
This is bait, but I'm honestly really impressed it's so high up in the thread and no one took it.

Props, anons

>>25822512
>SM is only compatible with XYORAS through Bank

Not confirmed.

>b-but the bank website says
It says nothing conclusive. I read it multiple times. The pentagon, zygarde moves, and souvenir hint that the games can communicate other than bank.

I have a feeling it's gonna tie in with Hoenn and Kalos, there's too many sinister overtones regarding things like Infinite Energy (aka the fucking lifeforce of pokemon, Devon's got to have a fucking horror show in a basement somewhere) to just sweep under the rug.

R-right?

>>25813414
They didn't do that shit with the megas, though, so what's stopping them from doing the same with new pokemon? All predictability went out the window with the death of the third version, anon.

>>25824680
I'm pretty sure one day we'll be surprised by a third version. Right when we'll start to think "well, yeah, this is the new pattern, third versions are never going to happen again". We won't even think about the chance of them doing a third version to surprise us.
And we'll get surprised by it.

>>25824699
That's exactly what I mean. We can't rely on previous game and previous patterns anymore. If gamefreak wants to add new pokemon mid-generation, then they can do as they damn well please.

>>25824716
Also, according to them they always did since the beginning with event Pokémon.

On Serebii:
"Masuda confirmed on the show, jokingly in response to Shoko Nakagawa's question about how many new Pokémon there are in the game, that there will be over 10 new Pokémon in the games"
>confirmed... that there will be over 10 new Pokémon
At least 10 new dex entries = new dex entries
New dex entries = New gen
6.5ers BTFO once and for all. Gen 7 100% irrefutably confirmed.
Before you try to bring up Smogon's definition of a new gen, remember that on Smogon's own website, they admit that one of the gens had no new battle mechanics, and the only true thing separating generations was new dex entries.
Any and all 6.5er posts from this point on should be considered trolling and reported.

>>25824742
11 new pokemon a new gen should not make

>>25824756
New dex entries = New gen. End of discussion.
I would also point out the "jokingly" part, indicating that he used such a small number to be intentionally vague, so as to not give away if there will be only 50 new pokemon, or 100 new pokemon, or pull a complete 180 and add 200+ new pokemon.

>>25824742
>implying they weren't just trolls from the start

>>25824786
Well, I could see how a retard would think that maybe this wasn't a new gen before. Being retarded isn't necessarily trolling. Now, though, even a deformed mongoloid could see that this is clearly gen 7, so the only people who claim to think it's not are obviously just pretending.

>>25824742
>>25824785
>>25824786
You're completely ignoring what people are saying though.

see >>25824680 >>25824716 >>25824727
All of this is true, while generations are just a fanterm with many and vague definitions.
I'm not saying SM won't be considered gen7 and won't have all of the stuff that generally gets added in a new gen (meaning there would be no confusion with the meaning of the fanterm, as it would remain as ambiguous as it's always been so far), but if you can't understand such a simple concept then you must be extremely stupid.

>>25824813
>All of this is true, while generations are just a fanterm with many and vague definitions.
Yes, "generation" is a fanterm.
Yes, many of them are vague definitions.
That's why the ones that point to this as being "6.5" are wrong. They're vague and poorly-thought out. I haven't seen a single definition that makes this 6.5 without making gen 2 gen 1.5, which would make this technically 5.5.
The only good definition that holds is that generations are distinguished by new pokedex entries.
The ONLY thing that holds as a complete and true difference between everything considered to be separate generations is dex entries.

>>25822246
It could be it's own gen, but continue off Kalos, sort of like Johto. There's really no way to be sure just yet because they've shown close to nothing. The "new pokemon" was a wire frame, we got a few concept arts, that's all. Considering they've already admitted they try to do what's "unexpected", we can't rely on patterns.

>>25824859
If it's set in mostly Kalos, I will consider this 6.5.

If it's set in a new region with only minor references, it will be 7.

>>25824873
So Firered/Leafgreen is gen 1.5, then? HGSS is 2.5? ORAS is 3.5?
No, you never once called those remakes .5 versions. Following your logic, you should. But don't even fucking try to pretend that you ever once called any of those games .5 gens.

>>25824885
Those are remakes, silly, a carbon-copy of a prior entry with only updates to mechanics/pokedexes/ect and a few minor added areas. Completely different.

>>25824859
No, it's not. Don't forget South Kalos is referred to as... well, South Kalos in XY. New gen also means a new region, if we just get a new part of a region we already visited then it's not a new region. And yes, Johto and Kanto are two different regions. And by the way, this is just one of the many examples.
They're breaking the pattern, this might happen.
And again, don't forget what events are to official sources.

>>25824873
>mostly
Why?

>>25824873
And I'll say again: There was not one single new dex entry in Yellow, Crystal, Emerald, Platinum, or B2W2. The GSC games INCLUDED KANTO and were direct sequels to the previous story. However, they are considered Gen 2. Why? Well, the only real thing that separates them from remakes or other sequels is that they had new dex entries.

>>25813836
how is that evidence in favour of gen 6.5? couldn't anybody just argue that it is evidence that it is gen 7 instead? It doesn't really support your claim

>>25824907
It's gamefreak, they can do whatever the fuck they want to do. Why is this so hard for you to grasp? They can do whatever they fucking want to do.

>>25824901
I meant more like what b2/w2 did, with an appended landmass to Unova.

>>25824907
You're literally retarded.
What you're saying would only make sense if Johto was considered a part of Kanto, and it isn't.

This is a troll thread right? There's no way someone can be genuinely arguing THIS hard over evidence THIS tenuous.

>>25824922
I'm having fun.

>>25824901
Except Firered and Leafgreen take place in the exact same unchanged region as Red and Blue. There are a couple things that are different, but the one thing that makes them Gen 3 games that holds true across every other gen separation is that they have new dex entries that were not in the previous games.

>>25824908
It's in favor of gen 6 because it shows GF had plans for SM during XY.

And if they had plans during XY it almost certainly means that they never had plans for Z.

And if they never had plans for Z, it doesn't make sense for them to put extra pentagon slots or Zygarde's extra moves in XY... unless they were planning on adding its forme and moves in some other later gen 6 game.

>>25824901
>>25824920
Virginia and West Virginia are different states, not two "parts" of one state.

>>25824919
>It's gamefreak, they can do whatever the fuck they want to do. Why is this so hard for you to grasp? They can do whatever they fucking want to do.
I didn't say they couldn't. They can easily do whatever they want to do. However, "generation" is not a term that Gamefreak uses. It's a fan term. And the only definiton that makes sense relates to new dex entries.

>>25824955
>And the only definiton that makes sense relates to new dex entries.

The only definition that makes sense is compatibility and the mechanics of the games. Otherwise they could do something like Z or Platinum but add one new Pokemon and it would count as a new gen according to that flawed definition.

>>25824955
Yeah, as of now. What if the game is Kalos/South Kalos with the same characters and locations, a la Black 2 and White 2?

Is that still gen 7, even if it has a few more pokemon in it?

>>25824946
Yes, and? We don't know what South Kalos is. It might be an additional part of Kalos, it might be a new region called like that. I'd expect it to be the same region judging by the name, but we don't actually know at the moment.

>>25824931
That's a completely different thing. It happened later, after what created a new gen by all possible definitions (Ruby and Sapphire) and before a new one happened.

>>25824971
Yes, it is.

>>25815423
>implying that would be a bad thing
I am tired of bullshit legendaries, I hope they retcon a bunch of them

>>25824955
>And the only definiton that makes sense relates to new dex entries.
No, that's the only definition you're willing to accept because you think what some guy writes on his website/Twiter acount should be the standard in the community.

>>25824980
Well, I think that's dumb.

We seem to have reached an impasse, and until more information is release, that's the end of that.

>>25823117

>not confirmed

Idiot, it literally says it right on the site
http://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-video-games/pokemon-sun-and-pokemon-moon/

>nothing conclusive
You read it multiple times but you either can't comprehend it or refuse to believe it. Its LITERALLY ON THE POKEMON WEBSITE. They said it themselves! You are fucking delusional if you say anything against this.


The pentagon, Zygarde moves, and Souvenir items literally mean nothing. Just scrapped ideas, its not like this was the first time something didn't make it to the final game.

>>25824980
Nope, that's just you trying to force your own definition. When someone thinks of a gen they also think of a new region introduced among other stuff.

>>25824968
>The only definition that makes sense is compatibility and the mechanics of the games.
Wrong. GSC are compatible with RBY. You can trade backwards across games.
As for mechanics, I assume you took that from Smogon. As I said before, smogon's own site admits that it doesn't hold up.
Here, read:
http://www.smogon.com/dp/articles/pokemon_dictionary#gens
>BW (Black and White)
>Black and White is the current generation of Pokemon and, while it introduced no new (well, known) game mechanincs, it brought with it 155 brand-spanking new Pokemon.

>>25824990
I don't even know what "some guy" you're talking about. I'm just tired of these troll threads popping up and refuse to believe anyone is this retarded. There are literally 0 good reasons to believe this is anything besides gen 7.

>>25825000
Then why are the remakes considered to be a part of the generation that they are released in and not the generation of the original game they remade? Region isn't a factor that holds up.

>>25821952
>anime
KEK

>>25825015
> GSC are compatible with RBY

But the mechanics are different. That's why I said AND MECHANICS. If the battle mechanics are different they can't battle. And GSC can't battle. So it's a new gen.

>muh smogon
It literally says in the same paragraph that BW has a new battle mechanic in team preview. And BW can't battle with DPPt. So it abides by the definition.

>>25825046
see >>25824973

>>25825046
Reintroduction of an old region =/= new region

>>25824997
It doesn't say anything about not being able to trade or battle though.

Protip: "can transfer via bank" does not equate to "can ONLY BE transferred via bank"

>>25824990

Well he's not wrong. Whenever a new dex entry was introduced, it marked next the gen

>>25825063
but OR/AS trailer said new world too
Yeah, it's a marketing thing to hype it up, just like with S/M

>>25825084
Whenever a new region was introduced, it marked a new gen
Whenever new battle mechanics were introduced, it marked the new gen
There's more to it than that and you know it.

>>25825084
That's because it's a pattern.
Hence why I'm saying it's new gen equals new mons, not the other way around.

>>25825072
It literally does
"Pokemon will be able to be transferred over to SM (obviously one-way) This same system will be used on ORASXY (the one way system)

>>25825105
ORAS did as well. It doesn't matter.

>>25825110
Did they say they were adding a one-way transfer system to ORAS? No they didn't, they just said you can use the bank with ORAS

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>>25825105
Where does it say one way? It just says you can use the bank

>>25825110
>>25825120
We don't have anything solid on Pokebank as of now but a theory that could indicate still gen 6. It's indicating towards gen 7 at the moment.

>>25825056
Okay, so at this point, it could go one of two ways. We know 100% for sure that there are new dex entries. IF it doesn't have new battle mechanics, then that will be the sole thing separating generations.
However, there is absolutely nothing indicating that this will be possible. Furthermore, this page (http://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-video-games/pokemon-sun-and-pokemon-moon/) strongly implies/almost flat-out says that you have to send pokemon from gen 6 to sun/moon through the bank. That removes compatibility, and it's super unlikely that you wouldn't be able to trade but you would be able to battle. So, yeah. It's extremely improbable that they will be able to battle.
Furthermore, people keep bringing up unused attacks and forms in gen 6 as some sort of "proof." Do you really think it's that implausible that gamefreak just left that shit in with no intent of making it usable? You really find it so hard to believe that they didn't get to take shit out of a game that was obviously rushed beyond all reason to hit a deadline? They had to move from 2D sprite art games to entirely 3D models. They created an entirely new game mechanic in Mega evolutions. They were only able to cram in 72 new dex entries, and if you ask anyone on this site, you'll get about 100 more reasons why X and Y were clearly unfinished. I find it far more likely that they just didn't take that shit out than that they planned on locking it for three years.

>>25825120
Anon, ORAS has stuff that doesn't exist in XY.

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>>25825135
Hmmm, doesn't say anything about one way here, except when referring to the VC games

>>25825072

>Protip: "can transfer via bank" does not equate to "can ONLY BE transferred via bank"

Why not? What sense does that make? They would have included that information if that was the case.
What is easier to do? Make the games not compatible through trading/battling or having to code all the requirements in order to trade/battle?

>>25824935
>It's in favor of gen 6 because it shows GF had plans for SM during XY
That's an assumption, a fair one, but an assumption.

>And if they had plans during XY it almost certainly means that they never had plans for Z
Again that is an assumption, they could be planning multiple games ahead of time simultaneously, at different stages of development. Do you really think that GameFreak isn't planning future generations? It's an easter egg, just like Bonsly, in my opinion, a tease.

>And if they never had plans for Z, it doesn't make sense for them to put extra pentagon slots or Zygarde's extra moves in XY... unless they were planning on adding its forme and moves in some other later gen 6 game.

Again that is another assumption, I could just as well assume that the extra pentagon slots are there for insurance. Lets say that for some reason Masuda is worried about the development of Gen 7 games so he says lets put an extra couple of pentagon slots in case we have to make x2y2 or z or something like that, then they just reuse assets and boom release gen 6 games to buy themselves some time. I could use all the 'evidence' that you've posted so far to prove this theory, but it would still be an assumption. You are using the 'evidence' to prove your theory instead of finding 'evidence' to develop a theory.

>>25825165
You mean, like what they did before with Gold and Silver?

>>25825063
What I'm saying is that those games do not have a new region, yet they are considered to be a new generation. Firered and Leafgreen are gen 3 and not gen 1, yet they do not have a new region.
You're basically telling me one of the parts of my argument in an attempt to refute it.

>>25825182
red/green/blue/yellow is gen 1, right?
gold/silver/crystal is gen 2, right?
ruby/sapphire/emerald is in gen 3, right?
So is fire red and leaf green gen 4? No, it's gen 3, you idiot

>>25825165
>Make the games not compatible through trading/battling or having to code all the requirements in order to trade/battle?

Let's rephrase the question:
"what's easier, reusing all of gen 6's assets and not focusing on changing any of the mechanics in favor of just adding some pokemon and a region in time for the anniversary or changing up all the mechanics and making new assets for a new gen?"

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>>25824935
>it shows GF had plans for SM during XY.
We have evidence showing GF had plans for SM during fucking RSE in the Regi's "OTH" pattern. Shut the fuck up until you know what you're talking about.

>>25825200
>new

>>25825212
I mean it's also easier for me not to wipe my ass after I take a shit but I still wipe it

>>25825178

They didn't have 721 Pokemon back then

>>25825182
but why does "new" region matter when mid-gen games have different regions anyway?

What meaningful difference is there between a mid-gen game having an old region remade or just a new region?

>>25825223
Seems like I though you were this guy >>25824885 sorry about that

>>25825228
They could patch it, too, though that is highly unlikely.

>>25825200
How old are you? How do you not understand what I'm saying?
Firered/leafgreen is Gen 3. That's what I'm saying.
It is Gen 3 because it has the Gen 3 National Dex.
That's what I'm fucking saying.
It's not gen 1 even though it DOESN'T HAVE A NEW REGION.
It's not gen 1.5 because nobody has ever even considered the possibility of .5 gens before all this trolling started.
Read half of a post before you fucking reply to it. You are a god damned moron.

>>25824946
The northern and southern United States aren't different parts. They're two parts of one country.

>>25825097

SM is not a remake tho...
It probably said new world for those that never played RSE before.

>>25825219
>a straw grasping coincidental mozart meme thread equates to a guy in the game literally telling you about a new region you'll see in due time while handing you a tiki from the hawaii inspired region

sure kiddo

>>25825235
I don't exactly get what you're trying to say to me, so I'll just explain my argument. Even if S/M are set in Kalos, they would still be gen 7 based on the community's categorization of generations because they have a different national dex.

>>25825135
>>25825152
>>25825156

It says a system will be implemented that will allow cross-gen transference of pokemon, and the SAME system will be used for ORASXY to CROSS GEN transfer pokemon. Can you not read?

>>25825267
"assumptions"

>>25825263
But those aren't defined parts of a country. They were at one point, but when they were, they weren't the same country.

>>25825263
>>25824946

yeah and how about california, baja california norte and baja california sur and how about north/south korea, or west germany and east germany, there are literally 1000 examples for either side, jesus

>>25825154
>Do you really think it's that implausible that gamefreak just left that shit in with no intent of making it usable?
Not when Zygarde's moves hint towards Sun and Moon and it also got new forms recently.
The only thing that might have been the case with is Eternal Floette.

>You really find it so hard to believe that they didn't get to take shit out of a game that was obviously rushed beyond all reason to hit a deadline?
SEGA is the only big and important company capable of doing that. Game Freak is actually competent. You might not realize that because the games tend to feel lacking, but it's clearly done on purpose.
Also, there's no way XY could be rushed. Game Freak got the 3DS development tools before anyone else so they could start to work on it earlier. And don't tell me you actually think B2W2 required more effort than early stage XY.

>They were only able to cram in 72 new dex entries
It's done one purpose. They wanted XY to focus on old Pokémon, which is why they're literally everywhere in Kalos and goes along all that gen1 pandering.

>you'll get about 100 more reasons why X and Y were clearly unfinished
The only Pokémon games that don't feel unfinished are RGBY and GSC. Maybe. All of the other games lack something the other games had and they would have had no problem keeping.

>I find it far more likely that they just didn't take that shit out than that they planned on locking it for three years.
Development is ahead than commercials. I hope you at least understand that.

>>25825182
FRLG came AFTER RS. RS introduced a new region, new Pokémon, new stuff. FRLG came later, got an old region back while keeping the new stuff from RS. RS made the new gen, FRLG is just part of it.

>>25825294

What's the assumption? SM is not a remake as far as we know..
They said new world for ORAS, like I said, most likely used for those that never played RSE before. If you never played RSE, its a new world. How does that not make sense?

>>25825326
The assumption is the latter part, obviously.

>>25825304
North/south korea are two different countries. East and West germany were once different places, not part of the same country. If the kaloses are clearly defined regions, it doesn't matter if they have the same name; they're different regions. If not, they're not. Either way, it's irrelevant, because generation doesn't matter in generation assignment.

>>25825342
dude I don't give a shit about whether it's a clearly defined region or not I am saying the argument you are having with the other anon is retarded because it is irrelevant

>>25825317
FRLG are a different generation from RBY because it has the same national dex as RSE. That is the argument I am making. I am astounded that this is so hard for you to get.

>>25825334

is it wrong?

>>25825255
>It's not gen 1 even though it DOESN'T HAVE A NEW REGION.
It's not gen1 because it ended when GS was released. It's not gen2 because it ended when RS was released. It's gen3, because it was the newest gen when FRLG came out, and FRLG didn't have ANY of the gen-defining traits at all.

>It is Gen 3 because it has the Gen 3 National Dex.
Again, that's just part of it. There's more to it than that.

>>25825279
>the community's categorization is having a new dex
No, that's just part of what the patter has been so far. It might change, it might stay the same, it might get completely destroyed. We don't know what will happen, but right now fans don't agree on the term (and you can see this by looking at our discussions) as we never needed to make it clear. The pattern has always been followed so far, so that's what it is.

>>25825363
I understood what you're trying to say. The thing is, it doesn't make any sense. FRLG didn't have anything that defines a new gen, so it's part of the gen of the gen-defining game that came right before it, as that was the current gen when it was released.

>>25825378

>There's more to it than that.

Its a pretty big part of it

>>25825378
>The pattern has always been followed so far, so that's what it is.

We're going by the pattern because its all we have at the moment. Yeah they said they were going to do something unexpected but they didn't say what. For all we know they're still following the same patterns and the only thing unexpected is that they might add a new feature in the games that we have never seen before.

>>25825431
You'd bet it is. Probably even slightly more than the new region. It doesn't matter how big it is though, as it's not the only thing.

>>25825448
Exactly. I'm glad you finally understand. I think it's more likely for SM to follow the generational pattern they've always followed, I just wanted to explain the concept because apparently some people don't get it.

>>25825378
>FRLG didn't have anything that defines a new gen
But it did. It makes so much more sense to say it's a new gen because of the national dex rather than to say "uhhhhh I guess it's a new gen cauuuuse it was released then?????"

>>25825637
>But it did.
Kanto isn't a new region. RS Pokémon aren't new Pokémon. RS is what made the new gen, FRLG and Emerald are what followed it, Diamond and Pearl are what created another new gen. What are you failing to understand exactly?

>>25825637
It was battle compatible with R/S/E, no problem here.

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>>25810575
>Did I miss anything?

Yes. A brain, sex, and not having autism.

>>25825744
says the one thinking gen 7 will happen ;)

>>25828641
this desu

>>25811728
yeah, but they didn't have the ease of patching games like they do now.

>>25828721
but then you remember OR/AS. Basically, I don't think they're gonna patch, just to move everyone to the new games.

>>25828721
>>25828727
They're keeping partial game updates as a big innovation for future games. And they'll only do it once, you know, so they can reintroduce it later on. And do it again.

>>25828641
>gen 7 won't happen
>Pokemon will forever be gen 6 no matter how many new Pokemon there are

>>25829105
Yeah, that's possible as wel.

>>25829105
There will be gen 7. Just not this year.

Haven't there been unused moves and items in every single game to a certain extent?

>>25831454
>a pokemon that just got new forms
>one of the forms needs the sun
>can learn sun-related and moon-related moves
>the new games are called sun and moon
oh, they're definitely unused.

>>25831622
The shiny dog trio unlock an event in HGSS