/svg/ - Shadowverse General

http://usamin.love/card/rhinoceroach/j_summon.wav

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Minna-san, ohayo!

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Luna!

>>167788549
The problem is that SV is a mechanically shallow game due to being a HS clone without the RNG. This just makes the powercreep that much more apparent since there's less options to deal with your opponent.

Then there's the fact that Cygames insists on games being short, so we get shit like Bahamut which absolutely kills any chance of traditional midrange / grinder decks from ever existing.

We're spiralling down into aggro with a fuckton of out-of-hand damage boys. Seatbelts on and hold on tight.

>>167789187
>>167789201
kys weebcucks

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The next Hearthstone expansion is Un'Goro Crater, this means

>DINOSAURS
>Titan Lore
>Weird shit all over the place
>Zelda references
>Ufos
>Prehistoric safari
>Silithids
>Old gods lore
>Tentacle and slime monsters
>DINOSAURS

Meanwhile the next Shadowverse expansion...

>anime girls
>I AM KAWAII UGU
>cow tits
>thick asses
>pandering to diverse degenerate fetishes

It's clear that this game would be long dead without the sexual pandering....

So empty....

>>167789187
>arisa gets off to this
Disgusting

>>167789274
You are in the wrong thread.

>>167789263
>so we get shit like Bahamut which absolutely kills any chance of traditional midrange / grinder decks from ever existing.
>Bahamut stops grinder decks from existing
What the fuck is wrong with you?

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>>167788893
>Unga
un'goro

>>167788549
>The only way to fix this is to have disproportionately powerful cards for higher curves.
You mean like Bahamut and Sahaquiel?
I see your concern, but Shadowverse doesn't seem to be going to that route. Control is the strongest it's ever been and aggro is mostly only played at ladder, you don't see much of it on tournaments.
The problem is that they seem to want to keep adding counters to cards instead of nerfing them, what will eventually bring us to the second main issue of Yu-Gi-Oh, besides the speed of the game: cards are useless unless they do something immediately, are unnaffected by everything and/or are a win condition by themselves if they survive.
Just see how many counters they introduced to Otohime this expansion just because she was a dominant card. It's ridiculous. Hungering Horde, Lucius, Breath of the Salamander, Cyclone Blade, Matriarch. It's not even worth playing the card anymore, even if Midrange decks leave Unplayable Tier.

>>167789187
need arisa roach doujin nipponland pls

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>>167789290
You already posted this before, and nobody gave a shit then. Stop it.

>>167789379
Bahamut is a hard cap to end the game similar to Satan. You will never have a deck that goes to turn 15 with Bahamut existing unless it's a control mirror where both players meme on each other with Bahamuts.

>>167784697
>aggro is the only cheap decks

most of aggro decks (and also tempo rune) are about as expensive as seraph and d-shift

http://www.strawpoll.me/12293083

>>167789520
>aggro is mostly played on ladder

Fuck tournaments though, probably like 1% play in tournaments. Saying something isn't used in tournament doesn't mean shit if you're still encountering it all over the place in ladder where real people play.

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I opened my first Tsubaki! Yay!!! I was right to be excited for pack day! And now I know why people hate the English dub. Who the fuck decided she needed a granny voice?
Also in that pack: this dude! Who I had no idea was a card until now. Though calling it a card might be a tad generous...

>>167788893
why are the art sites removed from this pastebin

aggro blood still is common in tournaments though

>>167789686
Aggro is good to climb fast people realize that and play aggro even with bad w

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73622
No concede
19/20

>>167789520
>cards are useless unless they do something immediately, are unnaffected by everything and/or are a win condition by themselves if they survive.
Why is that a problem? MTG cards above 3PP have had to pass the jace test and not just die to removal for 6 fucking years now, that hasn't stopped midrange decks from existing

>>167789758
Listen to Jeanne's english voice

>>167789520
>Just see how many counters they introduced to Otohime this expansion just because she was a dominant card.
Fucking this. Midrange sword only runs 1 of her now, if they even bother, since literally every class has multiple counters to her.

I remember being the first to defend Cygames when they (rightfully) nerfed Homecoming and Harvest Festival. But I think the popularity of the game has gotten to their heads where they think they can do no wrong and are content to just keep making counters or power creep the game.

>>167789634
when you Odin their Baha and then they Baha the Baha you used to Baha their Baha which you Odin which they end up Odining

>>167789837
MTG is not even remotely the same as SV to suggest a comparison.

If you can't see why midrange is largely dead this meta you're probably D0.

>>167789524
coco, mimi, literally who taking most of the pic's space (jeanne?), cuckgel with glasses?, turtle princess and her guard, vampy, veight and bloodkin, tia, isabelle who stole somebody's witch hat

>>167789852
>odining an odin
You always saha a luci into an odin

>>167790026
That's the girl on Dimension Shift, aka Daria.

>>167789972
>MTG is not even remotely the same as SV to suggest a comparison.
fuck off retard

>>167790026
Looks like dshift daria

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>>167789852
>mfw this actually happened to me the other day
Is there any reason why control wouldn't run Baha? Fuck, I even saw Baha in wolf roach the other day.

>>167790114
>>167790153
oh i see
and who is that creature near satan?

>>167790126
You first, cuck.

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Well that korean guys deck seems to work alright.

honestly I understand why cygames is not so keen about nerfs, you need to be careful with that shit

>>167790237
KILLA QUEER
BITES ZA DUSTO

>>167790026
Isabelle's hat is also from Daria, as seen on the Daria card

>>167790304
what's his deck?

>>167790332
Why?

they should just kill entire cards like in HS

>>167790332
>honestly I understand why cygames is not so keen about nerfs
It's because they're not a western company

>>167790302
You're not funny, or witty, what you do just comes off as annoying and retarded, for the lack of a better word.

>>167790332
>powercreep is better than nerfs

t. someones who has never played any other card game in their lives

>>167790181
>Is there any reason why control wouldn't run Baha?
Lack of vials to craft them?

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>>167790237

>>167790181
>Dump fairies
>Play free Baha
>3x roach for 18 damage and a huge body if he's still alive
Consider this meme stolen. Now I just need some wolves and Bahas

>>167790437
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C4HhJAHWEAEOPXg.jpg

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>>167790339

>>167790332
Of course, but there's a point where things need to be done. Look at roach. The deck has been nerfed already. But roach has been a fundamental part of every forest deck since the game has started, and it's only gotten better. Even PtP, a deck that's based around killing all of your own stuff, still runs roach. If you don't have roach, there is no point playing aggro. There is no viable strategy that forest has besides roach. And worse, there is no counterplay against roach besides hoping you have a ward. Roach extremely limits the creative space in forest, because every deck designed has to benefit from including roach, or somehow be better than decks that include it. That hasn't happened since the start of the game.

>>167790542
The guy who originally wrote it is really sad.

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>>167790181
thinking of it, baha is better than homecoming

baha wolfroach new meta!

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>>167788893
>pastebin changed for no reason whatsoever
Why do you faggots do that?
http://pastebin.com/SZNKYEMi

>>167790683
* there is no point playing forest.

>>167790607
White Wolf can only target Forest cards with its effect, you can't get zero cost Bahamuts that way.

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>>167789524

>>167790683
>Roach extremely limits the creative space in forest

The lack of other good win conditions is the limiting factor. Take roach out of the equation and people will just stop playing forest.

>>167790554
It's funny because this expansion actually enabled old card that were deemed unplayable, like homecoming(which was actually nerfed), to see play again.

>>167790821
awww

there goes the new meta

>>167790332
>keen
More like they don't give a fuck due to pride.

Can you imagine how the landscape would be if Homecoming never got nerfed, but instead everyone just got even earlier AoE to match?

>That deck that brought you a great winstreak yesterday, but can't seem to win for shit today.
What's her name, /svg/?

>>167789837
I don't know about MTG, but what I'm saying is that if they keep adding counters to cards instead of nerfing them, they will unintentionally add counters to almost every card in the game and we might reach YGO levels of card design.
At some point in YGO, Beelze was a good card and some people even made decks around it. Not too much time later, they released Silent Honor Ark, which countered Beelze, so people had to play around it. Eventually they released Castel, which can't be played around, and it killed Beelze completely. Nowadays, even the most reliable boss monsters in terms of raw power and survivability, like http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Super_Quantal_Mech_King_Great_Magnus have counters in the form of Kaijus, and are pretty much worthless if they require too many resources to bring out, because if they get Kaiju'd you simply lose.

>>167790554
>t. someones who has never played any other card game in their lives
Can you clarify what card games you've played? If the answer is exclusively "yugioh", fuck off back to /dng/
Power creep is troublesome; power seep is awful. You can't blame Cygames for being more comfortable with one than the other.

>>167790848
Having one badly designed, overpowered card to carry the class doesn't make the card not worthy of a nerf. Because again, if you don't nerf it, that means you have to make every new card equally overpowered to compete. I agree, if you nerf roach, forest will die. But forest needs to die and be reborn as something fair but still viable.

>>167790936
Seraph.

Aggro sword is great now

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>>167790026
>turtle princess
this meme needs to stop

>>167790542
>No argument
>Nothing but ad hom

I didn't expect anything and I'm still disappointed in you.

>>167790863
It's funny because you're wrong and homecoming is considered a meme and the best roach decks are considered aggro/tempo by Master players.

>>167791032
It's a pasta from a butthurt anon

>>167790683
It's a shame because forest has a lot of interesting cards that could make for a strong control deck. It's such a waste to see Guidance always used on roach or may when using it on Saha or Odin would be so strong.

>>167791010
>You can't blame Cygames for being more comfortable with one than the other.
I definitely can when everyone in Master is telling them there's a big problem with their game and the tournament landscape revolves around literally one deck.

>>167790936
Doesn't exist. I main Tempo Rune. Haven't lost a game since D0, and I'm Masters now.

>>167791010
>power seep
>literally making up his own words now

give me a single example of this "power seep"

i'll wait

>>167791028
it's literally what's said in the original legend

your waifu a turtle!

>>167791032
nobody cares what master players think when wolfroach and d-shift won jcg 1st season finals tourney

master players it's those guys who post stuff like *stupid deck* x wins of y games in masters

>>167791010
>Power creep is troublesome; power seep is awful
Power creep is awful as well, it eventually turns the game into a mess that plays completely differently from what it originally was meant to be.
Ideally they'd need to find the correct balance between nerfing cards and powercreeping them, what is not an easy thing to do, but just outright choosing one over the other is going to eventually kill the game.

>>167791010
What the fuck is power seep?

>>167791205
When you make yourself a tea and you want to drink it so fucking bad you ignore how hot it is and make a big-ass sip, which is more like a gulp, which ends up burning your tongue.
I guess you can say that it's a power sip

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>>167791345

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This is my wife, Jeanne. She's...well, social gatherings like this are a bit awkward for her. But please, don't think ill of her.

>>167791239
Master players are also tourney players, Anon.
Fun fact is that from DE to RoB, a lot of previous tournament contenders have wildly fluctuating rankings now due to the nature of Daria.

Apparently the decklists for the famitsu final 8 are out with 3 of the top 4 not using elf + daria combo

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>h-h-he banished my Seraph!!!! That's cheating!!!!!

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>>167791342
>>167791314
>>167791205
>>167791158
>>167791010
I like, no I LOVE the fact that nobody answered

>Can you clarify what card games you've played?

Literally none of you have played something other than HS, Shadowverse or Yugioh....

>>167791556
>O-odin don't counter seraph

>>167791579
you haven't told us what power seep is yet either faggot

>>167791579
I played The Elder Scrolls: Legends

>>167791579
I'm the dude asking just what you think power seep is and how it's any better than power creep.

Drop the attempted ad hom and answer the question.

>>167791556

I always keep playing for my 2nd Seraph because I can tutor that shit with Prism Priestess but there's no way to tutor Odin

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>>167791439
vampires know what power sip is, they really do!

>>167791475
i liquefied your waifu, and to add some insult to it, used her emblem for some time after liquefying the card :3

>>167791475
This is what the west thinks your waifu sounds like. What are you going to do about it?

http://usamin.love/card/jeanne_darc/e_summon.wav

>>167791013
The problem is not just roach, though. Forest's cards have to compete with roach as well as the good cards of every other class. Otherwise, forest would be roachless and would have no way to fight dshift, aggro blood, nep, midsword etc. You would have to nerf everything along with roach if you want any changes to roach to be meaningful.

If forest can only compete with these classes because of roach, they are going to need cards as powerful as roach or other classes are going to need to get weaker. Nerfing roach does not solve anything.

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>>166994458

Here you go senpai I did it as fast as possible

>>167791579
How is that even relevant?

>Hurr durr you haven't played mtg, so your opinion doesn't matter!!!!

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Master rank plays

>>167791579
Ok i'm one of the first master/legend player of Karnöffel.

>>167791579
Jokes on you. I still play hockey cards.

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Post the highest you've ever gotten /svg/

He has ancient elf next turn so he's trying to be fancy and squeeze in an extra point of damage.

>>167791734

sometimes you just gotta play something when you brick hard.

>>167791734
the last time when i used roach on turn 2 on empty board (except my goblin) in unranked the enemy surrendered :3

usually it means they kind of bricked and want to risk a cheap removal on roach before they bounce it back with ancient elf on turn 3

>>167791870
You dont do that vs Haven though

>>167791734
It's an extremely risky move to try and make 3/4 Ancient Elf because he had zero one drops in his hand. So he gambled and lost.
t: shitter from masters who got there by playing Forest

>>167791712
They need to nerf Roach and fix Forest in the next expansion. The problem is that they either nerf it now and we deal with meme Forest until the end of RoB or they nerf it alongside the next expansion and we deal with Roach. It's really a pain. Roach was a mistake from the start.

>>167790946
>I don't know about MTG, but what I'm saying is that if they keep adding counters to cards instead of nerfing them, they will unintentionally add counters to almost every card in the game and we might reach YGO levels of card design.
What I'm saying is that I doubt YGO levels of card design are something to realistically be afraid of in a game with a mana system, or in a game with SV levels of simplicity.
"if they require too many resources to bring out" - a SV card will only ever require two forms of resource payment to bring out, those being -1 card in hand and -N play points. Same as in MTG. And what we see in MTG is that when resources are measured like that, it's very simple to make a card that's viable despite the existence of counters, it just has to have a relevant fanfare or last words.
Otohime is the exception that proves the rule; she used to have an effect that was relevant even when people used counters and now no longer does. But tsubaki is still playable, tia is still playable, cuckgel is still playable, etc etc... one card being power creeped out of the meta is not a sign that all existing cards will eventually be power creeped out of the meta. I don't even understand why someone would think that unless they have PTSD from konami.

>>167791958
Well you could've had no scripture in hand.

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>>167791734
Have another tales from masters.

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Any advice for my dirt rune?

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>Aggro Sword evos an Aesthetic Knight he already attacked with
>Immediately concedes after realizing his mistake
Thanks guy, you made my shitty day just a little bit brighter

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>>167791712
This. Roach is a broken card by design in a broken class by design.

>Oh, we just killed tempo forest by introducing so much AoE. We're also going to kill PtP Forest with Bahamut. What do we do now that the class is dead?
>Let's give them two ways to tutor their most broken card.
>And make it so Gobu Mage costs 0PP for further synergy with Feena and Roach?
>BRILLIANT!

Bravo Cygames. Bravo.

master of canopies and forest gigas are better than runeblade summoner!

>>167791958
you should avoid it vs anybody with a 1-2pp removal - sword, dragon, haven, cshadow...

>>167791958
You're not supposed to do it versus any deck but sometimes you take a risk. Sometimes it doesn't work out

>>167792172

Yeah, stop playing dirt rune.

>>167792172
Add one satan.

>>167792237
No, it will work out decently vs anyone but Cshadow/Rune/Haven because they aggressively mulligan for their early removal

>>167791734
If he has nothing to play until turn 3 he bricked and already lost anyways unless he's playing wolfbolt then you're probably fucked.

>>167792045
>Implying Roach is ever getting nerfed
>Implying ANYTHING is getting nerfed from now on
No. Enjoy your powercreep though.

>>167792089
Not that guy, but I think the main difference from Otohime and all the other cards you mentioned is that she was considered a lot more oppressive, and thus had several counters dedicated mainly to countering her and only her.

>>167792218
Oh and let's make a card that can fetch a 0 cost Homecoming since we've nerfed it a while back to guarantee a ward free roach play.

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>>167791645
>>167791673
>>167791681
>>167791843
>>167791732
>>167791778
Im not even the same dude, is just hilarious how everyone dodged the question.

>Hurr durr you haven't played mtg, so your opinion doesn't matter!!!!

Yeah that's pretty much it.

Here's my resume:

>Of course, I have played MTG for several years, won 2 Grand Prix, attended and topped several Pro Tours
>I still play the current Standard format, using Mardu Vehicles and Delirium
>I even topped the last Pro Tour using Vehicles, unlicensed desintegration is breddy gud

>I also played Yugioh, I am not playing right now, waiting for the Zoodiac format to settle down and play again
>I won a YCS, also topped 2
>One of the formats I enjoyed the most and had the most success and tops was during Dragon Rulers format

>Also played the Pokemon TCG, currently not playing
>Won several tournaments, but nothing really big since my focus back then was in MTG

>HS, got legend several times, still on my way to get legend this month

>Shadowverse, master already
>Hoping they start making tournaments to play on

When you have seen so much shitty formats, unbalanced cards or reallllyyyyyyy bad games, you understand that Daria is basically nothing and that there's nothing wrong with format and that this game is still really healthy.

You just lack the vision and experience, you're drowning because you're kids, you don't even know how to swim.

That's why your opinions mean nothing, you have no expertise, no basis, nothing to compare

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>>167791717

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>>167788893
>>167788698
You basically can't.
* Up to 15 0 cost follower cards in a 40 card deck
* Up to 6 0 cost draw positive draws
* Up to 12 cheap neutral draw cards allowing it to fully utilize its pp on curve, have its spellboosts in hand to keep the combo going and have an obscene amount of removal allowing you to trade it for unprecedented value and tempo
* Up to 3 0 cost removal
* Up to 3 tech spellboost and get 1-4+ spellboosts to your whole hand while surrounded by the board of 0 cost followers resulting in getting fucked hard no matter what you do be it removal, trade or (trying) to face race
* Dhift hybrid means you're always facing lethal basically the entire game
* Removal cards out the ass so when you drop followers to force him to evolve, you just remove his repeatedly until he can't nut and you're still sitting on 2-3 if you want to. (you wont but still)
* Has up to 48 burn damage
* Numerous board clears which combo with many, many, many other cards allowing them to clear an entire board, fill their own board, and draw ~3-9 cards 3 to 4 times in a row thanks to the power of their draw engine
* Has ~12-18 cards that will get rid of the big bad cannot be targetted boogeyman without even needing to trade followers which you would think they'd be able to serve their purpose as a counter to rune/dragon but you'd be wrong. Plus it doesn't even matter anyway because rune will out-burn anyway
* Has the absolute easiest time removing Morde/Khawy/Elana/Seraph/etc. and even a resolve if Ben Brode forbid they're not dead yet

It's just too interconnected with a mechanic that's too good.

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>>167792336
Sword, blood, and especially forest can all punish it easily, too. Dragon probably wouldn't want to miss out on turn 2 ramp but it's not uncommon for them to have removal available at that point.

>>167792089
Otohime along with midrange sword got powercreeped out. There's a reason why "midrange sword" these days is more control or face - because they can't reasonably expect to build a board with all the AoE flying around nor can they even deal with Daria.
Basically, you're never going to see a card like Otohime, that is valued by generating followers, ever be relevant again except in hard aggro, which goes back to the point of SV and YGO devolving into aggro fuckfests.

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multiple choice poll
http://www.strawpoll.me/12298488

>>167792172
Prices is garbage, just play Gobu over it, it fits nicely and you don't need so many Sigils. I'd also drop one Bahamut for an Olivia. 3 Professor is too much. Ancient Alchemist/Calamitous can be dead sometimes, but 3 is not exactly bad. You can easily fit one PtP if you are not using Satan and I'd also advice to max out on Piercing Runes.

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>>167792481

>>167792218
>PtP Forest is dead

It is not. If you dont believe me come fight me with your bahamuts and see how well they counter it :^)

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>It was a small enough creature at first. But when granted new power by a witch, it began to swell, its carapace growing thicker...

a witch

it's all dorothy's fault!

also wtf is its evolved flavor text, is it some attempt of poetry

>...The creature's horn Its wicked horns to make a game of wreaking havoc.

Levi is a good boy
Perfectly balanced
Pierce is the problem

>>167792615
post dick

>>167792481
I know it's bait but two wrongs don't make a right.

>>167791681
>Drop the attempted ad hom and answer the question.
kys fedoratard
ad homs are perfectly fine outside of university debate club, the qualifications and character of a participant in a discussion are as important if not more so than the actual topic under discussion
I could explain why I oppose power seep more than power creep, and you could find flaws in my reasoning because yes I'm not perfect, and we could reasonably disagree. But I'm not going to, because reasoning is wasted on someone like you who goes crying to m-muh fallacies as soon as someone approaches the topic in a way you don't expect.

>>167792615
3841 1767 46% 42.5% 49.4%

>>167788503
Yeah, feel free to craft up to 2 golds that your deck uses that's still core to the leader.Core silvers are alright too though you'll have about 3/3 of 80% of the silvers in a month without crafting. Using Neutral core cards and leader core cards lets you get al ot of mileage early on. Think of it as an investment, you're paying vials now so you can get more packs and rupees later.

>>167792481
(You)

>>167792481
>When you have seen so much shitty formats, unbalanced cards or reallllyyyyyyy bad games, you understand that Daria is basically nothing and that there's nothing wrong with format and that this game is still really healthy.
>Terminal cancer exists so Aids is not really a problem

>>167792696
>Ad homs are fine when I cannot prove you wrong

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>>167792681
Homecoming also 1x in it

>>167792724
Because it is by far the hardest deck to play right now

>>167792615
The stats don't lie. And if anything, PtP only has not-dumpster-tier stats because Roach is still a menace in the deck.

>>167792654
>tfw this is the face of elf now
Not some cute little fairy, but a filthy roach.

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>>167789201
>Moon storm bun heals herself
>Moon value chip bun can only take 3 dmg per action
Who is next bun??? I'm thinking spell immune bun that gains stats on amulet destruction.

>>167792829
What makes it hard to play?

>>167792696
Kill yourself already, faggot.

>>167792876

To be fair, that's where ALOT of my loses came from, if not Tia grinding me out or getting out valued by altered fate.

Rarely was it due to the PtP itself.

>>167791717
Better late than never, I guess.

>>167792896
the moon is a scary place

>>167792876
This. Every elf deck is a roach deck. The only difference is whether you want go fast into face roach or an alternative win condition like ptp roach.
Even in DE half the time ptp decks just won with roach to face.

>>167792654
>it's all dorothy's fault!
it's actually ceridwen's fault, he's in the background of her art afterall

>>167792829
>hard to play
>this meme again

>>167789837
You can't swing tempo with them so you're basically just slowly dying as they trade for value into their win con. Look at necropolis queen, dragonbond mage, flame witch, etc.
Necropolis queen is a fucking 5 drop when reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

>>167792559
>Basically, you're never going to see a card like Otohime, that is valued by generating followers, ever be relevant again except in hard aggro
people were running zirnitra in saha ramp variants because it's the right type of tempo swing at the right time for certain matchups
you're extrapolating way too far from the fact that ONE card at ONE specific mana cost is unviable in ONE metagame
They will print more cards whose value is contained in printing bodies, and some of those cards will be viable. Hell, floral and cynthia are still viable, and their decks are hardly what I'd call hard aggro.

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>>167793046
The more you know.

DANCE OF DEATH WAS A MISTAKE

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>>167793046
now... that's a good catch!

>>167791475
Jesus Christ nobody can hold a wine glass in this party.
Bunch of savages

>>167793138
>people
You mean one master player and one guy who took it to a tournament and had it be a dead draw 99% of the time anyways?

>Hell, floral and cynthia are still viable, and their decks are hardly what I'd call hard aggro.
Floral is already being cut in favour of Amelia in midrange and control whereas Cynthia has stopped seeing play in Forest decks.

I'm not sure what experience you're talking from, but you sound woefully out of touch.

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>>167792481

>>167790683
You can combo/tempo forest but the problem is that you just can't get around that roach is an immeasurably powerful win con that's very flexible and playable much earlier than the others on top of being a gold anyone can buy.I think if we got amulet slots to support Titania's/pixie paradise/harvest and titania worked on petal fencers too it could swing back

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Just got memed 3 times in a row by earth PtP

What is going on, where are all the Darias?

>three themises AND three bahmuts

what the fuck am I supposed to do?

>>167793646
Have fun with all the interaction that is happening

>>167793646
just roach it bro

>>167793646
just roach bro

>>167793646
Roach them.

>>167790848
Well you can win with tempo, wolfbolt, rose queen, the problem is that you only have Liza to survive against the board clear menace with your little itty bitties. It doesn't help that archer's in a bad place and a 5 slot board is really hurting you.

>>167793646
Just themis it br-wait.

>>167793646
Play even more fair and interactive deck, DShift or seraph will do.

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>>167792896
Whatever it is I hope it's her.

>>167793753
>>167793754
HIIIIIIIIIROOOOOOOOOSHIIIIIIIIIIMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>167793081
how is it a meme? No deck you need to make as much decisions.

>>167793772
>Tempo
Rarely works in this meta.
>Wolfbolt
Dead before you play it.
>Rose
Dead before you play it.

The absurd AoE powercreep in RoB is the reason why classes like forest and sword have regressed to out of hand damage and burn - you can't expect to ever have a full board in this meta.

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_______!
_______!

I believe what cygames is going to do is they will power creep the off-meta decks until we have 30 or so Daria/otk roach decks and then basically your tech choices and who you get matched up against decides the match before it begins.

>>167793264
>Floral is already being cut in favour of Amelia in midrange and control whereas Cynthia has stopped seeing play in Forest decks.
I'm not "woefully out of touch" because I don't buy into your invented meta trends
Zirnitra was more than those two people you're thinking of, floral isn't being cut except by a vocal minority who probably had a jeno/amelia split for their 4 drops frm day fucking 1 of the expansion, and Cynthia has if anything been seeing MORE play as RoB goes on and people realize, hey, tempo forest isn't completely useless, maybe we shouldn't have abandoned it in droves for the new hotness
I know it's tempting to invent narratives of decay to make yourself feel special and insightful, but when you don't have data on your side don't be surprised when the future comes and your predictions are proven to be shite

>>167793963
___ ________

>>167790114
>daria is the girl on the dimension shift card
Of course.

>>167793975
Honest question, where are you seeing Cynthias?

>>167793975
>Floral Fencer
>not being cut in an expansion with shittons of board clear

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Give me ONE reason to not dust this in order to finish my Saha deck

>>167793963
T S U K O M E
S
U
K
O
M
E

>>167791712
You can't fix it because forest's mechanics are fundamentally unable to compete when centered around tokens it doesn't have the draw and board space to keep relevant unlike banner. It just doesn't have the cards or the space to do it.

>removing floral

IF you think that is better reroll your account

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>Petrify Atomeme
>Enemy Ceridwens immediately
>Summons a fucking 1/1 skelly

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>>167792550
elf cards cutest
elf master race
arisa best girl

>>167793975
>I don't buy into your invented meta trends
So tales from C0?

Seriously, I have no idea what the fuck you're talking about when you claim Cynthia is seeing more play. If anything she's been relegated down to a 1x tech at best compared to a mandatory 2x in every roach deck at th ebeginning of RoB.

Seriously, what rank are you?

>put healing to survive Daria's burn

>never draw the healing

>die anyway

I'm a little frustrated

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Are you done today anon?

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>>167794294
this

>>167794319
It's Odin syndrome anon.

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>>167793917
>you can't expect to ever have a full board in this meta

Iza, jinjouni

>>167794492
kys weebcuck

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>>167793975
>but when you don't have data on your side
These are considered the two strongest and most consistent variations of Roach compiled from multiple different sources such as twitter/gameAI/tournament lists and others.

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>>167794323
I haven't done my dailies for almost 5 days now.

>>167794294
>Elf Girl May
>Fairy sized
every time.

>>167794319
Veteran Alchemist?

>>167794492
that's why there's so many successful shadowcraft decks that aren't aggro right

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are Neph decks just memes or can I use one to climb the ladder?

I already got bored of playing roach, seraph and daria and I don't have the cash to make a dragon deck

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>>167794294
T H I S

>>167794294
May is not fairy sized! May is a big girl!

>>167794682
its ok, wins take forever doe so its a slow climb

>>167794682
If you're looking to climb ladder then they're just memes. You can't really deal with daria or roaches unless you draw very well on curve.

Nep is more of a counter to specific decks like Saha Dragon. Just play aggro shadow and unga your way up.

Shadow aggro is shit too though desu.

The problem with non aggro decks is not being aggro in this meta, although I've seen much more control than aggro lately.

>>167794810
No! She fits in your hand and the perfect size for an onahole!

>>167794294
Why do stupid fags always draw May as a fairy?

>>167794841
You mean just play aggro shadow and lose until you finally play a real aggro deck like bats?
I've had more success with Nep than aggro shadow in AA0.

>>167794890
Shadowaggro is quite literally shadowcrafts only viable deck.

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>>167794554
Gold is your life blood in this game. Do you hate the meta that much?

>>167794890
No point in playing aggro decks when you can play Daria instead.

>>167792218
To be fair, you can feena gobu:

All the other forest 2's
Asassin to recloak general, vanguard storm face, luminous board boost
Dwarf alchemist?
otk wildfang Dragonnewt, dragonnewt scholar, luxfang kits, Dragon tamer (aww yiss forte)
Lurching/shadow reaper/lesser mummy/deadly widow
Blood wolf, dark summoner, yurias
Snake princess/frog cleric

Dragon's the only one on the same level of bullshit but still.

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>>167794610
>>167794810
>>167794983
tinymay is cuter

>>167795059
I am not arguing with that. It is however still shit even for a "viable" deck.

>>167795074
aggro decks feel much more consistent

>>167794983
because she always hangs out with fairies

>Rune drops a flame destroyer for free on turn 6
>pixie magic it back into his hand turn 7

Man I don't even play fairies to win, I just play for moments like that.

Should I put gobu in my aggro blood deck?

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>>167795107
But I like her not so tiny as well.

>>167795182
>tfw you homecoming a daria board

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>>167795065
Not him, but yes. I'm not going to force myself to play something of awful quality that I don't like, Anon.

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>>167795235
>>167795107
i want to make May an adult!

>>167792654
Roach queen card when?
Roach queen leader when?
Bugcraft fucking when kikegames? Let me throw my money at you.

>>167795235
is it the same celebration when unica is eating her baguette under a decorated tree

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>>167794092
nice white room theorycrafting retard

>>167794308
>So tales from C0?
>Seriously, what rank are you?
Like I said, your invented meta trends. You can call me an AA trench shitter, you can say you're exclusively talking about trends in mid/high masters, but frankly I wouldn't believe you, given how infantile the way you talk about the game is

>a mandatory 2x in every roach deck at th ebeginning of RoB.
If you mean the absolute fucking beginning of RoB in December, sure, but Cynthia fell off hard once people realized the implications of gobu/feena and has only been increasing in prevalence since that very early point

>>167794550
Cynthia not being in the variations of roach that are currently most consistent against the meta is not even remotely the same thing as "Cynthia has stopped seeing play". "Floral is already being cut" is likewise a gross misrepresentation of csword's shifts over time.

>>167795178
>aggro decks feel much more consistent

How? One unica is enough to throw you off your early game and a ward with more than 2 health is literally game over unless you happen to draw your DoD. Plus you run out of steam by turn 5.
The biggest thing I don't like about aggro deck is that they feel like a coin toss each time i play them. You need a near perfect curve or you fail miserably.

>>167794554
I do dailies that dont involve ranked, outside of the free pack dailies.

I just replace that shit otherwise.

>>167795372
>Cynthia not being in the variations of roach that are currently most consistent against the meta is not even remotely the same thing as "Cynthia has stopped seeing play"

I haven't seen a Cynthia for two weeks now in AA1.
You're not fooling anyone, Anon.

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>forest misplays and does 19 damage when i have 20 hp
>leaves 3 roaches on board
>concedes after i clear them and heal 10 hp

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>>167795335
>>167795235

>>167795440
>One unica is enough to throw you off your early game and a ward with more than 2 health is literally game over unless you happen to draw your DoD

lolwhat

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>>167795065
I think it's just a bit of burnout, since I've basically been playing the same deck for almost a month now, and anxiety. If anything, what keeps me up at night is the idea of buying an alternate leader to freshen things up again, despite the fact that I'm still missing a lot of cards from all three packs.

>>167795492
I've seen 3 Cynthias today in AA0. Granted I think their pp was better used on playing fairies into roach but at least they've tried.

>>167795440
>>167795178

Roach technically is an aggro combo.

You could also tech cards so you're more defensive as well. Honestly, there's a lot of options just so long as you stick to the gameplan of roaching people successfully.

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Anyone want to play some Take Two?

21934

>>167795549
But its true.

Aggro decks are incredibly fucking fragile. If a player has two or more copies of a unica, low cost ward, or spells like blackened scripture/Kaleidoscope Glow, you're fucked.

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>>167795548
It's ok anon. This is a happy place.

>>167795549
You can't ignore Unica so you have to either waste your burn, spells like razory claw, to remove her, or trade 1-2 followers, which usually fucks up the pace of aggro decks.

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>>167791475
>he didn't 8-16 and max skill every Jeanne version in RoB
>he didn't 5* Jeanne and max her level while feeding her 99 pluses in Granblue
>he doesn't have 3 Animated Jeanne cards in SV

Your "wife" belongs to me now, until she finds a suitable suitor

>>167793138
It's really not. All the tempos have a fundamental flaw in this meta that bleed them. Plus,

Dragonnewt fist (dragon) deal 2 damage to a random enemy follower twice
Archer (forest) 1 damage to a random enemy follower per allied that comes into play
Elven Archery (forest) Deal 1 damage to a random enemy follower x times where x is the # of cards played this turn incl. this one
Yuel the Ancient (forest Evolve: at the end of your turn deal 1 damage to a random enemy follower 2 times
Fire chain (rune) deal 1 damage to a random enemy follower 1 time Spellboost: repeat 1 time
Will of the forest (forest) deal 1 damage to a random enemy follower x times where x is the number of cards in your hand
Elf tracker (forest) deal 1 damage to a random enemy follower 2 times

AoE
Hungering horde (Blood) 3 to unshielded, 3 to others with(?)
Devourer of Heavens (Haven) 1 to all enemy followers
Harnessed Glass (neutral) 1 to all enemy followers per attack
Necroelementalist (shadow) Last word: 1 to all enemy followers
Masked Butcher (blood) 1 to all enemy followers if vengeance is active
Forbidden Ritual (Haven) banish all with 2 def or less
Foul Tempest (Shadow) Deal 1 damage to each enemy follower. Necro(6) deal 3 instead
Demonflame Mage (rune) Evolve: deal 1 damage to all enemy followers
Noxious Dragon (dragon) 1 damage per discard
Deathmist dragon (dragon) 1 damage at the start of his turn
Flame witch (rune) deal 1 damage to all enemy followers with each spell cast
Ancient Lion Spirit (haven) Evolve: deal 2 damage to all enemy followers
Lucius (neutral 1 damage to followers that cost 2pp+
Noble fairy (forest) change def to 1
Winter's Caprice (rune) turn each follower into a snowman
Cyclone Blade (sword) damage where x is the selected enemy follower's attack
Swordwhip maid (sword) deal 1 damage to all enemy followers if an allied commander is in play
Spurned Witch (rune) deal 1 damage to all enemy followers
-

>>167795636
Roach is "tempo" or "combo" or whatever little technicalities people like to nitpick about.

Aggro decks generally mean aggro shadow and aggro bats. Bats was T1 for a moment but now isn't exactly because of what I said. Shadow was never T1 to begin with outside of maybe vanilla.

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>>167795830
>Only 3 animated Jeannes
disgusting.

>>167793138
Balor (shadow) last words: deal 3 damage to all enemy followers
Flood behemoth (blood) clash: deal 1 damage to all enemy followers
Breath of the Salamander (Dragon) Enhance (6) deal 2 to all enemy followers needs a valid target(?)
Themis (Haven) Destroy all followers
Alchemical Lore (rune) Deal 3 damage to all enemy followers
Bloodhungry Matriarch (blood) 2 damage to all enemy followers
Conflagration (dragon) deal 4 damage to all followers
Glacial Dragon (dragon) deal 1 damage to all other followers
Homecoming(forest) return all followers to the player's hands
Jeanne D'Arc (Haven) Deal 2 to all enemy followers
Revelation (blood) deal 8 damage to all followers
Anne, Belle of Mysteria (rune) deal 1 damage to all enemy followers per attack
Imperial Dragoon (dragon) discard your hand and deal x damage to all enemies where x is the # of discards
Mythril Golem (rune) deal 1 damage to all enemy followers. Spellboost: deal 1 more
Fafnir (dragon) deal to to all followers
Bahamut (Neutral) destroy all other followers and amulets

And shit like voices of resentment/Phantom howl + madam lich, and the usual shit like fattie wards

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99101

concede pls

>>167795372
I already posted the top forest decks agreed by master and tournament players for you. Even wolfbolt doesn't run Cynthia.

At this point, it boils down to your anecdotal claims that Cynthia is still seeing play vs what everyone else is building.

Sorry, but your theorycrafting is simply wrong.

>>167793963
I SEE YOUR WEAKNESS!

YOUR EVIL DEEDS END NOW!

>>167795985
You forgot Hungering Horde, the 3 PP Blood spell which deals 3 damage to the follower and all other copies of it on board.

>>167796045

thx babe

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When is this shit getting nerfed?

>7dmg for 4pp LMOA

>>167794109
You can get enough vials in a week to craft saha while still being able to otomeme and more importantly, you'll have her when kikegames prints a bucnh of tempo support cards next xpak. Expect a liza for all the tempo decks

>>167796045
hnnng what a pure and cute elf

>>167796081
You don't know the fucking meaning of anecdote. Seriously, what rank are you?

>>167795549
Think about how many rage quits shit like a 3/4 Ancient elf or Temple defender has caused for aggro.

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>>167796224
Whoops, it's was a two part post and i missed the first part. Boy, do i feel stupid now.

>>167795691
>>167795818
have you even played aggro decks? unica/wards force you to trade but usually it is not such a big deal. aggro trades and as long as it trades favorably it's ok to trade

if a couple of wards screwed aggro it wouldn't see any play whatsoever

anyway consistency and efficiency are different things, tempo rune may be more effective than most of aggro decks but it is also much lss consistent too i.e. it bricks more

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>WAHHH THE META IS SHIT
>I refuse to use any of the good decks and I will keep playing my meme decks
>Why I am losing?

Every

Single

Time

/svg/ is retarded

>>167794323
Win 5 ranked is too hard. I want to die.

>>167796332
>You don't know the fucking meaning of anecdote

please enlighten us

>>167796289
>7dmg for 4pp
It's 3pp. 11 damage and 4pp with Piercing Rune. :^)

>>167796410
>/svg/
Its mostly fags from /hsg/.

>>167795971
They should give more cooler cards like Jeanne to haven.

It's all a bunch of priests, tigers and birds.

>>167796224
>3

>>167796365
temple defender is barely better than just a 2/3 for 3pp, only pussies ragequit over a turn 3 temple defender, especially if they have evo

>>167794682
You're too slow for roach/daria and trying not to be weakens your nep

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Using morde with bahamut instead of against him for a change is pretty fun.

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>>167796441
I just did 7 for a pack full of bronzes

Not even worth it

>>167796289
2pp for levi, evolve, 4 dmg on follower
1pp for crimson sorcery, 3 damage
1pp for piercing rune, 4 dmg (2 to follower, 2 to face)
So it's actually 11 for 4pp

>>167796516
Heed their warnings, they've been down this road before.

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So this is the power of carrots csword, interesting.

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>>167796365

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>>167796524

>Birds aren't cool

YOU WILL PAY FOR DEFILING THE SKIES

>>167795985
More commonly:

>Blood
Hungering/Matriach/Revelation

>Haven
Themis/Lion

>Shadow
Foul Tempest/Balor

>Dragon
Conflageration/Salamander

>Rune
Calamitous Curse

>Forest
WotF/Homecoming

And then you have fuckery like value wards and Bahamut. This is a shit meta for aggro and tempo to be in and anyone who says otherwise is delusional.

>>167796551
>he doesn't understand

Aggro has to kill by turn 6 otherwise your chances of winning plummet. Especially against decks like Haven which can just heal back any of the damage that you've done to them.

>>167796551

Oh yea, then why is x3 Temple Defender better at stop roaches then Death's Breath?

Checkmate Atheists

Atheism:-9001
Haven:9001

>>167795864
>>167795985
Autism.

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Where the "Just themis" meme comes from?

>>167796332
This fucking guy.

>>167796551
Temple defender cucks Bats and Forest really hard since they don't have efficient ways to get around it. What the fuck are you going to do to an on curve temple defender as Bats? Razory claw it? Nope, because you just spent one on a Unica/Snake Priestess :^)

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Please rate me, how skilled I am?

>>167796407
You can't trade favorably with unica at that stage of the game and that's 2, possibly 4 less damage to face. Then your opponent is at like 3 hp and you resort to top decking because you've run out of steam. Any heal, any ward is game over. You might get lucky and draw your claw but you might now and this is what I hate about those fucking decks. There is absolutely no game plan other than go face and pray.

>>167796407
>>167796407
>if a couple of wards screwed aggro it wouldn't see any play whatsoever
And look how prevalent aggro is in master ranks
If a control deck curves out using removal or wards, they have won the game against an aggro deck. Tempo rune doesn't fall flat and die like that. Of course you can punish a control deck hard if they ever let up, but the tools in this game for relieving pressure are simply better than the tools for applying pressure, that's why they can dedicate fewer deck slots to hem and leave room for control wincons

>>167796886
mlg pro

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>Whip up Daria deck for dailies even though I hate Daria deck
>No Daria first 3 games
>3 Daria in first 3 turns in next game
Fuck this shit brick city deck.

I want to fill up Luna's tiny womb with my seed!

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>>167796680
>T6
>Have an 8/(7)12 Mainyu up expecting to white knight it next turn after I suck his evo crash dry
>Winter's caprice'd to a 1/1 snowman

>>167796407
>if a couple of wards screwed aggro it wouldn't see any play whatsoever
Wonder why Aggro sees 0 play in tournaments and is basically dead in Master?

This meta is literally
>Daria
>What deck can deal with Daria
The latter is control, btw.

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Let's say that

>thermis posting gets banned
>waifu posting gets banned
>sexual posting gets banned
>ironic/sarcastic posting gets banned
>meme posting gets banned
>daria complaining gets banned
>complaining about X deck gets banned

What would guys would even talk about?

>>167797214
Great weather we're having today, isn't it?

TWENTY FUCKING GAMES WITHOUT DRAWING CURATE WHEN I HAVE THREE IN THIS FUCKING DECK

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>>167797006
You don't even need the daria. That's how broken the deck is.

>>167797135

>>167796551
Show me another 2/3 ward for 3pp other than ancient elf. If you go first against it it's turn wasted unless you want your board dead.

>>167797214
>waifu posting gets banned
this kills the general

>>167797214
Complaining is okay butcrying//bitching/bbs is annoying

>>167794841
>You can't really deal with daria or roaches unless you draw very well on curve.
>svg actually thinks this
death's breath is insta game over for forest. nep normally beats daria unless they get a early daria

>>167796524
Priests are based and actually defend cities from demon hordes. Better a priest than an adventurer

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What's the cheapest dragon deck I can make?

>>167797384
go look at the stats m8

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>>167797214
We'd talk about how to make the biggest guy (and get away with it)

>>167797384
But m-muh homecoming!

>>167797384
>nep normally beats daria unless they get a early daria
Can you clarify what you mean by "a early daria", and also mention what rank you play at?

>>167797384
OTK Forest wins on turn 6 and if they're the more careful variation they can homecoming/bolt you and you have no way to heal back up to survive since Khawy does nothing in the matchup.

But you're obviously D0 if you seriously think Nep can stand up to Daria or Roach. Hint: If it could, it would be a t1 deck alongside them.

>>167796886
>Demonic strike and piercing rune in hand

>>167797446
Discard dragonewt, you only need 3 gold.

>>167797630
>OTK Forest wins on turn 6

if things go perfectly, maybe

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>>167797019
I call her mouth!

>>167797525
if they don't have a daria on turn 5 they normally lose. I'm halfway through AA3 and will be masters in a day or two. the problem with control shadow is beating other decks, not the best ones.
>>167797630
I never see people play that meme white wolf shit in there deck.
>But you're obviously D0 if you seriously think Nep can stand up to Daria or Roach. Hint: If it could, it would be a t1 deck alongside them.
By that logic sun satan and dirt rune are tier 1 because they beat darai and forest. you are the only D0 here

>>167797214
complaining about banning of course

>Crafted 2 Tsubaki for Sword
>literally missing half the deck
>lose with gammy sword
>bash aggro
>Only need to craft 2 Daria to complete Storm Rune

I will suffer with Sword, it won't be very fun but at least my conscious will be clear. No more Aggro bashing for me

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>>167797676
Can you link me a list famalamadingdong?

>>167797676
You need both altered fate and salamander

>>167797850
This is my fantasy, stay out of it. We're not sharing.

>>167797446
otk discard dragon
Budget storm or midrange dragon

Know what also really helps how expensive things are? POST YOUR LEGOS+GOLDS

Can I have a concede?
79991

>>167797384
>play death's breath
>no ward because you didn't have enough shadows because you didn't draw you Spartoi Soldier or played a version of Nep that doesn't run him,
>die
>play death's breath and have shadows
>triple piercing rune into fireball face into Dorothy
>die next turn to demonic strikes

The only time you win is when they let you win by bricking. I've been playing Nep lately because I was getting less and less Dorothy overall and the only time where I wasn't completely annihilated by turn 6 were when they bricked. They don't give a shit how many wards you play early game, it only gives them more targets for runes. Your only chance is Nephting their Dorothy and then taking control with morde but that means they've bricked if you're still alive.

>>167797384
>nep normally beats daria unless they get a early daria
If they don't summon Daria in the midgame they're probably bricking.

>>167797676
If you use altered fate with rites up After you t4 uriel, t5 feena, t6 rites+newts, does it stop at 9 cards or is it basically suicide?

>>167797874
>By that logic sun satan and dirt rune are tier 1 because they beat darai and forest.
Sun Satan has a fairly even matchup against both decks, actually. Just check the logs.

Funny how a deck built to counter the T1 decks doesn't even have a good winrate against them, huh?

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Can someone explain to me how her ability works?

>>167797630
I'm doing quite well against roach with a 2378 Nep deck, mainly because of early 3pp wards.
Dorothy is Dorothy though.

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>>167797995
Here

>>167797874
>if they don't have a daria on turn 5 they normally lose. I'm halfway through AA3 and will be masters in a day or two
ok, thank you for the context
i will however make the trivial point that T5 daria is not uncommon; the point of JustThemisBro is that it contests T5 daria in a way no other craft can

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>>167797931
Just search for them. There's a bunch of lists

>>167797384
What? Nep is awful against Daria. It has no answers against their early game and Death's Breath is just fodder for piercing runes and kaleidos. By the time you can even hope to get a Nep out you'll be within burn lethal.

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>>167797931
>>167797976
Correction, 6 golds.

There are other variations with feena but getting dragonewt isn't really an issue.

>>167798293
It works exactly how you'd expect. If you have Mary on board and play Dire Bond, your opponent takes 6 damage. If you play Ambling Wraith with Mary on board, they take 2 damage.

>neph is bad against daria

This thread is out of control

>>167798293
>Play mary
>Play dire bond
>They eat 6 face

>>167798457
We have more than enough information available via shadowlog

>>167798457
I want to live in this world where Nep is good against Dorothy, trust me

I don't use rites, just have trails for discard draw.

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What the hell was this?
Just met a midrange sword at AA3 running both Otohime and Stratagem.
He lost despite pulling this shit off 2 times in the match