/wfg/ - Warframe General

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>>167118175
no, you're fucking retarded

the difference between 99% crit and 100+% crit is as massive and noticeable as 99% status to 100+% status

anyone that regularly plays bauban that has any tips for someone that wants to get into baubanning?

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fun

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Guys what do you think of my Prism mirage build for LoR? Will you want me in your squad? btw I have 2.4k hours

what the orbiter needs is a gloryhole closet

>>167118335
Ah ok I see. I figured that it was rather recent.
didnt know it was just damage and multishot tho

>>167118540
we call that the transferrence chair

>>167118459

All bounce pads, all day.

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What is love ?
Also What is price ?

>>167118424
It's TQ what did you excpect.

>>167118424
No you dumb fucking retard. There is no mathematical breakpoint at 100% crit. The change from 99% to 100% is identical to the change from 98% to 99%.

The change from 99% status to 100% status isn't even significant, which just goes to show how little you know about the game. The 100% status is only a breakpoint on shotguns and nothing else.

>>167118482
I hope you have dispatch overdrive on a tboltace

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please help I'm still on the selection screen

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What's this about Banshee being "skipped again"?

Was there new info mined saying she wont be the next Prime?

>>167118535

Stop spamming this BS, TQ. He never said any of that.

>>167118459

Build range and duration and spam Bastille and Vortex.

>>167118782
just use wf builder

>>167118782
the fuck? left.

-88% multishot is unplayable on rifles.

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>>167118735
I have neither

>>167118782

>minus multishot
>can't decide

Anon you better be trolling.

>>167118847
no one genuinely knows what the next prime is, it might be banshee, or it might be mirage, mesa, zephyr, something like that.

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don't you fucking remind me about 99% vs 100% status

>>167118920
>>167118987
it's the opticor though, which only fires one beam

I want Saryn to pee acid on me!

>>167119059
shotgun status is divided per pellet anyway

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So /wfg/ what's your weaponfu/Framefu combo?
Like, lex prime obviously looks great with loki, Sancti Magistar with oberon, Mios with Saryn, Synoid simulor/kohm with mirage, ect.

Mines Vulkar Marelok with Mesa. Other frames can use it, it just feels Right on Mesa.

>>167119079
reducing multishot under one gives you a chance to NOT FIRE AT ALL

are there any summoner warframes? like a warframe that can summon things to fight for them?

>>167119138
>Vulkar Marelok
I know what you mean, but this really makes your neurons go

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>>167119116

>>167119276
Right, yeah. Vaykor.
These fucking infinite terms that sound familiar.

Thanks ScoutMcTartan, you really didn't have to.

>>167119138
Mesa Prime with AkVasto Prime

>>167119059
so drop your shitty slash mod and get it to 100

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Do I unequip everything, even sentinel, to get warframe affinity more quickly? Or does it not matter?

Want to use forma on my frames a little quicker

>>167119451
I need both for memes though

>>167119059
you could build it for 100% status,
you just decided not to. use all the goddamn dual stat mods. after you got 100% status, put the FUCKING MULTISHOT IN.

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>>167118782
>>167118898 (me)
>>167118920
>>167118987
>>167119079
>>167119173
I thought it could be saved by split chamber, but it could not

>aklex prime doesn't have the sweet slide/mag animations of the lex prime
it's like releasing a twin marelok that doesn't spin, what the fuck is DE doing

>>167119189

Atlas.

>>167119606
he did, I assume it's the one below the riven

>>167119584
>memes
adding 24% of your total base damage as slash really is a meme of the worst variety

>>167119772
it's not for adding to base damage

>>167119697

-Multishot gives a chance of using ammo (and charging up) but then not firing.

-88% takes up almost all of the +90% multishot chance from Split Chamber.

It would have to be a hell of a Riven to make Multishot loss worthwhile. I don't think it would ever be.

What did you guys get from todays sortie?
I just got back from my job and did the sortie and got a greater naramon lens, is this any good? its my third sortie

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>>167119059
you can replace incidary coat. with your riven 3 dual stat mods are alright too.

>>167119138
saryn + secura lecta + lanka
stunning large swathes of enemies and killing them with gas/electric procs so i can safely use my lanka at close range feels so good.

>>167119937

But it is, anon.

Sweeping Serration won't add to the damage done by your Slash procs, and the Boar will be biased towards Slash over Puncture with Slash less likely than Impact even with it.

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There's been a lot of confusion regarding redcrits. It's time to sort this out. Repeat after me:

REDCRITS ARE A MEME.
---------------------
Damage increase from crit = (1 + crit chance)(crit multiplier -1)
For example, a weapon with 10% crit chance and 2x multiplier has (1+.1)(2-1)=1.1x damage multiplier

Redcrit calculations functino exactly the same. The easiest way to think about redcrits is to use actual numbers. For example, let's say you have a weapon with 120% crit chance and 2x multiplier. Redcrits on this weapon will deal 3x damage (redcrit multiplier, taken from wiki). We'll assume you attack 100 times dealing 1 damage per hit. This means that in 100 hits, 20 of them will redcrit for 3 damage, and 80 of them will regular crit for 2 damage. Total damage is:

(20)(3) + (80)(2) = 60 + 160 = 220 damage
Compared to the base 100 damage, this is an increase of 2.2x.

Which you will notice is the EXACT SAME as if you just used the regular crit formula shown previously:
Damage increase from crit = (1 + crit chance)(crit multiplier -1)
= (1 + 1.2)(2-1) = 2.2X DAMAGE

In terms of overall DPS, redcrits function EXACTLY as regular crits. Redcrits are simply a way for crits to continue to scale past 100% crit chance. The scaling 100%+ is identical to the scaling from 0%-100%. The redcrit breakpoint is not a breakpoint at all. Redcrits don't make you magically deal more damage.

(I'm actually impressed DE managed to come up with such an elegant solution to make crits scale past 100%).

tl;dr - redcrits are a meme, being able to redcrit doesn't mean anything

>>167119937
I didn't say it was, I'm saying it's a complete waste even on weapons with high slash damage, let alone the boarp

what is your actual reason for wanting to use that slash damage mod? how much slash damage do you lose if you take it off? couldn't something better be put in that slot?

>>167120132
sheldon stop sperging out, literally no one cares.

>>167120029

Naramon is on of the good schools, it's an OK reward if you're still mid-game or so.

It's been a week since I got anything other than drop rarity boosters or Unairu lenses :(

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>>167119958
im debating with mine. i could push redcrits, while still having the chance to fire 3 bullets (with both multishot mods i have a multishot of 218%).

i mostly just dont want to reroll it.

>>167098242
I used to have a Riven that gave like 76% status chance, +heat damage, and +Damage, with -36% magazine capacity. It was a good Riven, but I ended up selling it because I already have a Zarr +damage +multishot Riven.

If it wasn't for the fact that the status chance Zarr riven needed 16 MR as opposed to my Damage+multishot Riven only needing 14, I would have totally held on to it to test this nonsense out myself.

>>167118702
But redcrits do more damage.

>>167120209
retards like >>167118424 clearly show people don't understand math on this general

>>167120227
The ability to redcrit is meaningless. That riven is worthless because of -multishot.

>>167120132
go read about crit level on the wiki tierqueer

>it's a BPNPC is autistic and desires attention episode
gr8 these are my favorites

>>167120301
need 101% to red crit

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>>167120339
The formulas I used, including the red crit formula and crit levels, were taken directly from the wiki, you dumb fucking retard.

>>167120301
see>>167120132

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>>167120468
>the wiki is often wrong!
>i took it from the wiki you fucking retard

>>167120468
no you didn't

thanks for the new filename to filter though

>>167120604
Wiki is often wrong, but for basic, specific shit like formulas you can trust it.

>>167120614
then tell me, where does the wiki contradict anything in most post?

>>167120704
for starters, the section entitled 'Red Crits'

>>167120132
>using wfbuilder logic
>ignoring the stacking effects of crit damage mods with redcrits
kill yourself, tier-fampai

>>167120604

>the wiki is only wrong when I say it is!
>all hail Professor TQ!

>>167120802
Redcrits function exactly the same in both the wiki and in >>167120132. How the fuck do you think redcrits work?

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A little help guys?

>>167119138
Chroma + Ack & Brunt, being the wild dragon warrior it was meant to be.

>>167121071
Zarr youreslef

>>167119189
Nekros.

>>167121071
seriously?
go on an excavation or exterminate its not even hard.

Also unrelated, why did no one tell me the twin kohmak are so fun

>>167119138
Mesa with Vasto and dex sybaris

>>167121071
Go to exterminate and kill. Lemme know if you need something else

>>167121221
>why did no one tell me the twin kohmak are so fun

Because nobody has the blueprints.

>>167121291
Why wouldn't they?
The hema though, now that's a bitch

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kek

oh wait, '''''''''''''''''''kek''''''''

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>Finding myself playing Banshee more than Ember P recently

Is this what it's like to cheat on your waifu?

>>167118651
I DEMAND ANSWERS!

Why didn't they just rebalance the existing weapon's base stats instead of introducing Riven mods? Why didn't they just make Riven mods in a special "augment" ninth spot and have it only give the non-damage stuff like reload speed and magazine?

>>167121640
Go become a dev then.

>>167121559
Hotdog

When do I get a gold potato?

>>167121707
Not looking to name my dog, friendo. Just saying that dogposting is the cure for TQ's autism.


>>167121761
Wait for the dev stream on some fridays.

>>167121682
Steve, get back to work and give me a raise you cocksucking cheapass faggot.

>>167121837
yes, I know

I wish I still needed to level dogs and cats so i could get wfg to name more of them

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>>167120837
actually, higher crit multipliers will lead to a SMALLER damage increase compared to regular crits. So I was slightly wrong: redcrits do not function the same as regular crits. They're even worse.

We'll take the previous example. 100 hits, 1 damage each, 120% crit chance, but now we'll increase the crit multiplier up to 5x. (Redcrit multiplier of 9x).
20 hits will redcrit for 9 damage = 180 damage.
80 hits will regular crit for 5 damage = 400 damage.
Total damage = 580, which is a 5.8x damage increase from the base of 100 damage.

Damage increase from crit = (1 + crit chance)(crit multiplier -1)
Calculated from the crit formula (which infinitely scales), the damage increase would be (1 + 1.2) (5 - 1) = 8.8x damage.

Notice that the redcrit damage numbers are LOWER than the regular crit numbers. This means that crit chance 100%+ scales WORSE than crit damage from 0%-100%. For higher crit multipliers, the difference only grows.

So redcrits are even worse than I thought.

>there are people who will disagree with these MATHEMATICALLY OBJECTIVE results

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>TQ literally doesn't understand how redcrits work

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>>167122263
>/wfg/ is a backyard filled with happy little anons
>all the little anons run around talking and playing make believe
>whenever a new anon comes over to play all the other anons make him go play with the OP toys in the corner for a while, then accept him into the group after a little bit of bullying
>one day little tq comes to the backyard
>the other kids dont think he is special, and for a while he is normal
>then he sees the OP toys
>little tq thinks for a moment, then starts eating grass, rocks, and small bugs
>little tq shits his pants, then takes them off and props them up with sticks
>little tq proclaims to the rest of the yard that he is now the creator of new toys and his toy is the best toy
>as he gibbers on, other little anons start telling him that he is wrong
>little tq ignores what the other kids say to him and uses his own toys as proof that his toys are best
>after seeing how little he cares for reason, the anons go about their buisness
>every once in a while little tq will throw his shit covered """"toys"""" up into the air and proclaim his superiority
>other anons start to throw rocks at little tq with mean words written on them
>little tq despises these little rocks, however can never tell where they come from
>little tq begins to argue at the little rocks
>more rocks are thrown
>more gibbering

>>167122386
It's literally how redcrits work, you dumb retard. I don't know how much clearer I can make it. How the fuck do you think redcrits work?

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>>167122386
im surprised TQ has the mental capacity to breathe let alone shitpost

Quick someone do a dogpost, it might shoo TQ away!

>>167122386

What exactly about his posting history would lead you to expect otherwise?

>>167122549

Or someone should do a plat giveaway.

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>Yellow Crit does damage
>Red Crit does More damage than Yellow Crit
>this is bad for some reason

Tfw too intelligent to understand how crits really work

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>there are people who argue with LITERAL MATH

I don't know how fucking retarded you have to be to think math is wrong. If someone told you 1 + 1 = 2 you'd shitpost him. It's mindboggling how willfully ignorant you are. It's not just retardation. It's a flat-out refusal to learn.

>>167122263
>Damage increase from crit = (1 + crit chance)(crit multiplier -1)
>Calculated from the crit formula (which infinitely scales), the damage increase would be (1 + 1.2) (5 - 1) = 8.8x damage.
>multiplying crit chance times crit damage
who taught you how to do this
they were wrong to teach you to do this
if you taught you to do this then you are wrong

>>167122263
SOMEHOW LESS IS MORE BELIEVE ME I DID THE MATH.

>>167122263
>Notice that the redcrit damage numbers are LOWER than the regular crit numbers
Then your fucking math is wrong.

>>167122830
>do wrong math
>why are people arguing with me!!!!!!

>>167122770
It's just our resident retard spewing misleading information.

>>167122830
See, I'd agree with you, but your equation is 1+1 and you somehow got -5.

>>167122263
>Notice that the redcrit damage numbers are LOWER than the regular crit numbers.
nigger of course you get diminishing returns for each additional % crit chance you add at each threshold, that's how the formula works - but you're disregarding entirely the multiplicative value of also adding crit mult and what it means to have a new minimum damage threshold on each shot

you think like a blind defender of the shit spewed out by wfbuilder

>>167122934
It's literally the crit formula for every single game that utilizes simple crit mechanics like Warframe. Just plug some numbers in and test, you'll very easily see it's correct.

>>167122976
>>167123015
My point isn't that redcrits do less damage. Of course 101% crit will deal more damage than 100% crit. My point is that redcrits actually SCALE worse than regular crits. The increase in damage from 100% to 101% is actually LESS than the increase in damage from 99% to 100%.

Redcrits aren't a mythical breakpoint that will suddenly increase your damage. If anything, redcrits are a softcap with diminishing returns.

best map to level up weapons/frames?

>>167123257
the grineer defense one that's super cramped and has the core on an elevator.

1) Base damage is effected by yellow crits
2) red crits are in addition to yellow crits and NEVER reduce their value
3) the only way to reduce the damage of a yellow crit is to remove base damage, and we are NOT changing base damage
4) base damage + yellow crits will always be LESS powerful than base damage + yellow crits + red crits

I dare you to argue with this tq. you not replying to this post will be your admission that you are wrong

>>167123246
gott's calc is in the OP, you use it and copypaste TTKs and DPS, thats what it was made for

>>167123198
>but you're disregarding entirely the multiplicative value of also adding crit mult and what it means to have a new minimum damage threshold on each shot
you seem to understand what I'm saying, yet you also continue to spout meaningless word diarrhea.

>>167123257
Akkad if you're pubbing, Berehynia if you want to recruit from chat, Hieracon if you want some cryotic but people act full retard in there for some reason.

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>>167123314
again, you completely miss my fucking point. See >>167123246

Redcrits SCALE worse than regular crits. A diminishing return occurs after 100% crit chance.

>TQ does wrong math
>Argues it like its a fact

I thought we reached the peak of his autism with the Saryn Scandal. Apparently we are only at the foothills.

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>alt tab back into game
>some guy says KEK IS MY NEW FAVORITE WORD
>dumdum has been kicked

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>>167123564
>here's my math
>NUH-UH IT'S WRONG
>what's wrong with it
>IT'S WRONG

if you retards don't understand middle-school level calculations you don't need to pretend you do

>>167123524
>A diminishing return occurs after 100% crit chance.
also no. The diminishing returns dip first at ~75%, and then again at ~175%

STOOOOOOOOOP

REPLYIIIIIIIIIIIIING

TO TIER QUEEEEEEEEEEEEER

YOU FUCKING SISSY FAAAAAAAAAGS

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>>167123524
It's still more damage you stupid faggot what's the big idea?

>>167123368
what precisely did I say that is meaningless? I pad my shit with rhetoric like everyone else here, perhaps you most of all, but what about the core of what I'm saying is incorrect? you're thinking from a very simple and limited point of view about some kind of gold standard "average DPS"

>>167123673
what's your math for this? A simple look at the crit formula will tell you you're wrong

where the fuck are the mods

>>167123719
Don't you mean stop replying to The Professor :^)

>>167123746
Mods drop from most enemies, and you can access your collection of mods from the bench parallel to the foundry.

>>167123735
>he multiplicative value of also adding crit mult
makes no fucking sense. I did take into account higher crit multipliers. At 2x multiplier, red crits scale the same as regular crits. Higher crit multipliers produce diminishing returns, and redcrits scale WORSE than regular crits.

>hat it means to have a new minimum damage threshold on each shot
Warframe is a game of averages.

>>167123246
Define "scaling". What the fuck do you mean by yellow crits "scaling"? Each iteration of red crit (i.e. final crit multiplier after crit chance of 100%, 200%, 300%, etc) adds slightly less than the amount equal to the crit multiplier of yellow crits, but the red crits increase linearly, never decelerating nor accelerating.

Tom Cruise
>posts Weapon list without incident, doesn't disturb the thread, doesn't hold wrong opinions or facts

TQ
>1+1=3 THIS IS A FACT YOU NEED TO DO LIQUID DYNAMICS TO PROVE ME WRONG WAIT STOP PROVING ME WRONG REEEEEEEEEEEEEE

also TQ
>"Why doesn't anyone like me?"

>>167123737
youve somehow linked in your head "diminishing returns" to a single point of data. you are the one who needs to produce math, and not some back of the napkin arithmetic. burden of proof is on you, and your single point of data at (100 damage, 120%, 5x) does not show diminishing returns. graph it with crit chance on the x and damage increase on the y.

inb4 "i compared it to yellow crits" doesnt mean jack. It is basic arithmetic that yellow crits do more damage than red

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should I bother rerolling

>>167122263
Redcrits still deal more damage than yellows, you mong. The multiplier is this: (crit level)(crit multiplier - 1) + 1, so from 1-100% crit chance with a weapon with a 2x crit multiplier gets crits that deal 2x damage, from 101-200% the crits get 3x damage, from 201-300% the crits get 4x and so on. Sure, the returns diminish somewhat as you scale into higher and higher crit levels, but it's still a very, very significant increase in damage, especially with weapons that have high crit multipliers or high base damage. Who cares about scalability when the returns only diminish significantly at unfeasibly high crit levels? Reaching red crits allows a very good DPS increase.

>>167123746
I have a theory.... TQ donates hotpockets to 4chan HQ so that the jannies and mods ignore him.

>>167124047
to be clear, (yellow-base) do more than (red-yellow-base)
my b

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>>167123973
>redcrits scale WORSE than regular crits
this is correct, but you're missing the point

>>167123567
Is kek really banned
then again, DE is the leaf menace

>>167123993
>>167124135
This is what I mean by scaling: The increase in damage from 100% to 101% (redcrit territory) is less than the increase in damage from 99% to 100%.

My entire point is that redcrits aren't this magical DPS fairy. People seem to think that redcrits gives them insane damage, when in reality they don't. Being able to redcrit does not mean anything.

>>167124047
I used real, concrete numbers because those are the easiest to understand. I'm no stat major, I don't even know how to make this graph you're talking about. Feel free to make it yourself. I will say, however, that I've done multiple calculations using various crit multipliers, and my results held true for each one. Barring obfuscating factors, it's simple pattern recognition, and these equations are simple enough I felt safe enough to extrapolate the results.

>>167124116
tfw not a single riven, war within gave me ogris one so its the same as nothing

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>>167124378
thanks bae for proving me right

>>167124519
>Feel free to make it yourself
yeah fuck off
I dont give two shits what numbers you use, but "diminishing returns" is a buzzword you picked up. In case you didnt know it is talking about more than a single point of data

>>167124678
see>>167124378

>>167124519
THEY DO GIVE YOU STRAIGHT UP MORE DAMAGE. THE JUMP FROM 0->100 IS PROPORTIONALLY MORE THAN 101->200 BUT THE EXTRA DAMAGE MULTIPLIERS ADDED BY THE 101->200 MARGIN IS STILL A LARGE AMOUNT OF EXTRA DPS. BEING ABLE TO REDCRIT MEANS THAT YOU'RE ABLE TO DEAL AN EXTRA TIER OF DAMAGE MORE THAN YELLOW.
>can't make a basic graph
THIS IS NOT THE KIND OF PERSON THAT I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE AS MY DOCTOR

>>167124047
If you have 0% crit chance, 4x crit multi, you have X damage where X is the base damage of the weapon.
If you bump that to 50% crit chance, you have 2.5X.
Going to 100%, you have 4X (easy to see, 100% chance with 4x crit damage is obviously a 4x multi).
Going to 150%, you have 5.5X.
200% is 7X.

What this means is the absolute increase is the same no matter what your existing crit chance is. However, from a relative standpoint, going from 1x to 2.5x is a 2.5 multiplier, going from 2.5x to 4x is only 1.6, 4 to 5.5 is only 1.375, you get the picture.
So after a certain amount, it becomes more efficient to try to boost your damage through other means, like raw base damage boost such as serration, or elementals, attack speed, etc.

>>167124656
but you don't fucking get it, that's the ONLY point you've made which is mathematically correct

so I'll stand by the assertion that you're a retard and that it IS worthwhile to break 100% crit chance in almost all cases, barring the opportunity cost of a significantly more advantageous mod

>>167124378
>>167124775
>skips from 101% to 201%
youre missing the whole point. "diminishing returns" problem relates to every number between 101% and 200%

>>167120862
Ok, faggot, here we go.

100 base damage.
50% Crit chance
2.0 Crit dmg.
Crit level 0.
Crit multiplier = ((crit level + 1) * critdmg) - crit level = (0+1)*2-0 = 2

DPS 100*(1+(50%)*(2-1))= 150

Increase the crit chance by 100. Go up a crit level.
Red crit chance is 50%,
Crit level 1.

Crit multiplier = ((crit level + 1) * critdmg) - crit level = (1+1)*2-1 = 3
DPS 200*(1+(50%)*(3-1))=400

if TQ's formula was right, damage would increase by the (crit dmg - 1) * base damage each tier (aka +100%), or 100 damage

However, we notice that going up a tier increases MORE than 100 damage.

QED TQ is a faggot and will probably get kicked out of med school for his autism.

>>167123293
Helene? I agree is the best for exp

>>167124783
>>167124814
No fucking shit it's good to go over 100% crit chance, captains Fucking Obvious. My point was never that redcrits deal LESS damage. My point is that redcrits are meaningless. There's no point in desperately trying to reach redcrit territory, because there's no advantage to being able to redcrit.

>>167123524
yeah but its red and Red is better than Yellow.

what are you color blind?

whith the inevitably powercreep what will happen when 300% crit exists, what colour will they be

>>167124971
>No fucking shit it's good to go over 100% crit chance
>there's no advantage to being able to redcrit

>>167125048
/thread

>>167125045
Purple

>>167124378
one mistake, the headshot crit multiplier values are off (10 -> 12, 24.4 -> 26.4, etc)

>>167125045
Those exist and they're red. Anything with a crit level over 1 (which is yellow) is red.

>>167125101
that's overshield damage

>>167124971
TQ why don't you look at tonkor with crit delay

>>167125048
>>167125092
you two demonstrate the starting ability to focus on two fragments on a sentence while completely ignoring the rest

>>167125045
Platinum

>>167125045
>>167125101
with melees you can long surpass 300% crit chance. still red.

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>do a pub with rad neo N3 relics to get nekros p systems
>no luck
>do a radshare
>drop it myself
>on way to extraction find an ayatan

feels good man

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>>167125171
this is the kind of shit I'm trying to prevent. People using absolutely garbage mods like Critical Delay in a desperate attempt to hit redcrit territory, when there's no reason to do so

>>167125172
he is pointing out that you contradict yourself in the same post. in order for that to work the middle parts must make both statements true, which it does not and cannot do.

you started a useless discussion and then when someone did the math you claim victory

if you dont want them focused on, dont post them. when will you learn how to post on 4chan?

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>>167124938
>DPS 200

>>167125172
Because those fragments are contradictory, professor. Red crits matter because they give you more fucking damage, and that's it.

>>167125306
>fire rate mattering on tonk-tonk

>>167125374
guaranteed crit with chance to red crit

>>167125306
>people use critical delay on the tonkor to get redcrits
Nobody does this. They use critical delay so they'll always crit. argon scope though

Fuck sorties. I've gotten 4x more Uncommon and "Rare" rewards than even 2k endo, let alone a fucking Riven. Fuck this shit.

>>167125306
critchance builds like that are bad because of the lack of elements, not because of "diminishing returns"

youre bad at teaching too

>>167125443
>relying on headshots with tonkor

no, bladed rounds is where it's at

>>167125443
this exactly, if you have a higher minimum damage per shot you can reduce the time to kill a given enemy up to a higher range to that of a single firing cycle (which is significant in a game like this), though at the comparative expense of a higher average damage output over time

>>167125437
there's a lot more wrong with what you did than you realize

>>167125484

I have 9 Rivens, started doing Sorties at the beginning of this year so not too bad.

>>167125172

Just like you do when you pull things out of context to try and make it look like you're right.

The key difference in this case is that they are right, while you aren't.

>>167125582
explain then

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>>167125484
>need endo
>get lens

>want a riven
>get lens

>need anything BUT a lens
>get lens

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Capped for posterity.

>>167124580
I had more but I gave them away because I was at the cap

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>>167124938
Your math is wrong. First of all, you're confusing damage with DPS and damage. Your first calculation is NOT 100 base damage, but rather 100 hits of 1 damage each (for a total of 150 damage, not 150 DPS).

Your redcrit formulas are then wrong. Again, you are confusing terms. What you actually mean is 100 hits of 1 damage each, with 150% crit chance of 2x multiplier, so 50% redcrit chance. Out of 100 hits (base damage 1):

50 redcrits to deal 3 damage each = 150 damage
50 regular crits to 2 damage each = 100 damage
= 250 damage

Which is a 100 damage increase from the formula, exactly as expected.

Basically, you're confusing terms, and that 400 "DPS" you got from redcrits is wrong.

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>mfw slowly getting to the burnout stage again
I only lasted like a month this time. Usually I play Warframe off and on for a few months at a time.

>>167124907
I took that to be implicit since the pattern was clear in small increments, just took the jump to an absurdly high number to demonstrate the cumulative difference once you reach another crit level ("double redcrits" or whatever you want to call them, crit level 3 in wiki terminology)

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>>167125793
Thank god I installed the TQ filter. Life is a lot more pleasant now.
I'm not sure what he means by red crits meaningless unless he's talking about the point in the game where status builds start to outscale crit builds, but at that point no shit any crit build is objectively weaker, not just red crit builds.
He'd probably be at least slightly more respected if he didn't sperg out every time somebody challenged his ideas.

Everyone shut up and someone make a giveaway

>>167118424
So that WAS TQ who splurged when I wanted to experiment with my Red Crit Aklex

What the hell is wrong with him

>crits deal more damage
>red crits deal twice the damage a normal crit does
really makes you think

>>167126196
>reducing a relatively complex mathematical argument to sophistry
confirmed for not passing middle school

What's a fresh tonkor build look like?
Primed cryo rounds?

>>167126294
TUMMY KISSU

>>167126172
Mental issues, among many many other things.

>>167126172
He doesn't like people having different ideas for builds than him or anyone doing anything slightly different than the way he does it repeatedly, resorting to shrieking and sperging out.
In short, autism. I don't mean that as in faggotry autism, I mean he LITERALLY has autism.

>>167126343
>fresh anything with damage 2.0

>>167126447
Not my fault I was born retarded and need to be spoonfed before committing to anything

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>>167125574
Alright, if you want to go for consistency, then reaching 100% crit chance is fine. I personally don't buy it, because in a game where you're firing hundreds of shots per mission, everything washes out to the average. But there's definitely an argument to be made for consistency.

However, in this case, what you're trying to do is reach 100% crit chance, NOT to redcrit.

My entire point is that redcrits aren't a magical DPS fairy. There's no point in being able to redcrit. There may be a point in hitting 100% crit chance for consistency, but crit scaling past 100% actually faces diminishing returns.

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>mfw waiting for kuva floods just to fight high level enemies
WHERE DA ENDGAME AT?

>>167126620
Is what you're trying to say that adding a mod to go into red crits instead of regular crits isn't as beneficial as adding a crit damage mod? In that case, you've got a point, but you've gone about it horribly.

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>>167126392
>>167126414
Thought so because when I asked him if he was TQ, thats' when the commotion stopped

Red Crit Aklex worked so I moved on to just pure damage re-roll which is gud

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>>167126560
I would recommend Serration, Split Chamber, Heavy Caliber, Point Strike, and whatever the other crit mod is. And if you're feeling especially adventurous throw in primed fast hands. But that's just my opinion.

>>167126625
fashion frame is the end game scrub

DE needs to just fucking rip off EVE Online's damage/health model for Damage 3.0

Health, Armor, and Shield all have their own values as different types of "life" and all have set resistances to certain types of damage.

Tech 2/advanced versions of Health, Armor and Shield have greater resistances against certain damage types.

This lets them completely rebalance level scaling, as well as all weapon and mod stats more easily than the current clusterfuck of a system.

>>167126620

>I personally don't buy it, because in a game where you're firing hundreds of shots per mission, everything washes out to the average.

Literally what.

If you always crit, you always do more damage.

This means that you do more damage on average as well.

And *we're* the ones who can't into math?

There's been a lot of confusion regarding whether TQ can understand anything about Warframe. It's time to sort this out. Repeat after me:

TQ fills these threads with nothing but bullshit and personal attacks. Any time he is right about anything it's purely accidental. Attempting to argue with him will cause him to post smug_anime_girl_.jpeg after smug_anime_girl_.jpeg and eventually devolve into him demanding screencaps, only for him to eventually declare that you're still wrong any way because he has OVER NINE HUNDRED THOUSAND ENDO which makes him the expert on everything.

And it also makes him the reincarnation of Rosa Parks and MLK because he has to put up with so many people saying "No, you're wrong, here's reams and reams of proof."

>>167126817
>heavy caliber
>split chamber
Isn't that just a 90% chance to shoot to the left and right of what I'm aiming at respectively
or does it not pattern its shots like the Kulstar (side by side split/triangular)?

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>>167126797
Ivaraposting time?

>>167126790
My point is people shouldn't desperately try to reach redcrit territory, especially not with garbage mods like Critical Delay. The popular opinion in Warframe is that reaching redcrit territory is a breakpoint. People talk about redcrits like it gives them a huge DPS boost. This is the illusion I'm trying to dissolve. I literally stated it outright in my first post >>167120132
>being able to redcrit doesn't mean anything

Not my fault retards can't understand math, and would rather lash out at me than attempt to understand.

>>167127017
RED CRITS DO LITERALLY GIVE YOU A HUGE DAMAGE BOOST, YOU FUCKING RETARD.

Watch out for HelmetPotato AKA /wfg/ Edgemaster.
He is a fucking degenerate and is responsible for the following attrocities:
* Encouraging DE to nerf Ash to make him more edgy
* Causing many players to go rip out their eyes upon seeing his frame colours
* Encouraging other children to use his edgy colour schemes
* Encouraging shitters to use frost on infested defence missions
* Posting edge on /wfg/
* Editing existing images from /wfg/ to be more edgy
* Posting gay shota and traps on the <#170664201122086912> channel on Discord
* Making Marc gay
* Bringing TQ to /wfg/
* The assassination of Wiawyr
He must be stopped!, Spread the word.

Why do people always quit at stage 5 of Akkad? I'm trying to farm affinity and 5 rounds isn't really cutting it

>we'll never meet a living orokin and discover they weren't actually cunts, the grineer are just shit

>>167126974
It's late and I have work tomorrow, I'm too tired to argue with a retard. It's obvious you skimmed the thread with no idea of what's going on, then picked out one sentence I wrote as the entire conclusion of what I was trying to prove. Stop. If you don't understand something, don't even try.

Abbreviated summary: >>167127017

>>167126990
The accuracy penalty on Tonkor is minimal and the shots spread out slightly which effectively increases the AOE of the blast. I've been running heavy cal on tonkor for ages with no issues hitting my targets.

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>>167127098
>literally ignoring math by multiple anons (not just me) OBJECTIVELY proving that redcrits do not, in fact, give you a huge damage boost

>>167127105
go away helmetpotato

>>167127141

>i'm tired of getting dogpiled for being wrong so i'll just skip out of this thread and hope it's died down and that people will forget all the other times i've been wrong so i can post in the next thread tomorrow as though none of this ever happened and everyone else was wrong all along

OK then.

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I hate this.

>>167127105
fuck off with your e celebs

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>ash is bad meme
apologize right now

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>people STILL giving free (you)s to TQ
you should all realize that's the only reason he even posts in the first place.

>>167127564
what the fjuk is that build

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Why is it so hard to color this motherfucker

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>>167127564

>>167127732
that left one is elegant as shit

>>167127564
>seeking shuriken in a FT build
>steel fiber
>rage on an invis frame

What frame should I get after first? Also, can mastery ranks be done at any time before max rank?

>>167127732
Second one looks good

Why has no one ever mentioned Helene before until this thread? This map is by far the best for affinity, fucking done with akkad unless I credits

why is new loka such a terrible syndicate
>hurr durr nature
>lives in a relay in space made by a super society that they hate
>begs the creatures she hates to do their dirty work, and insults them while theyre doing said work
>never actually set foot on earth

who the fuck would support these tards

>>167127564
Is this the channeled FT meme build or something that I've seen posted before?

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>>167127787
>using ash as an invis frame

>>167127770
>>167127823
Thanks I spent long idle hours trying to figure this deluxe skin out.

Left was hit random while I eat my food.

>>167127991
probably a simulacrum armor removal build used to test weapons.

>>167127942
This

Loka, veil, and Perrin are all shit

>dread without crit damage mods
>200 base damage
>400 crit damage
>600 redcrit damage

>dread with vital sense
>200 base damage
>880 crit damage

putting on argon scope/critical delay to get more redcrits does less than putting on a crit damage mod
hitting redcrits naturally without needing to put on extra mods is always good, more damage for free is never bad

>>167128054
actually I use it in sorties and kuva floods and often do better than teamates

don't knock it til you try it (unless you're TQ which you'll knock it anyway)

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Corpus raid focused on slaughtering shit tons of enemies when?

which is better, life strike or healing return

>>167128139
If I had the energy leftover after arguing with math-illiterate retards, I would screencap this godawful non-Invis Tank ash build using fucking Seeking Shuriken, but I'm too tired.

>>167128438
Well, we have grineer and infested raid content so I don't see why not
Maybe nef anyo's bossfight will get brushed up for it

>>167127732
One on the right is a bit too dark, doesn't pop out enough. I'd try adding a lighter purple or maybe some dark blues. The Lotus color scheme is a good one for that.

Right is good too but a little cliche.

>>167125048
That's not what he's saying you turboautist.
He's saying there's absolutely nothing special about redcrits.

>>167125171
>TQ why don't you look at tonkor with crit delay
Not him, but what about it? Crit delay is a shit mod on tonkor.

The only time guaranteed crits might be worth using a meme mod like critical delay or argon scope is on something where a non-crit is a total waste of time like a sniper or something.

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Don't roam around the forest looking for a fight, Tenno.

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>tfw no Lotus foot fetish porn to imagine rebecca fapping to it

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will there ever be another palette sale?

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>>167128572
sounds like you need a new hobby if being a retard arguing with other retards is that arduous for you

>>167126929

CCP utterly fucked up their own system in Dust 514 with only a few damage types to balance, do you really trust DE to get it right with way more variability?

>>167128735
Valentine's and St. Patrick's will be for free, maybe

>>167128682
>not getting off to the superior female specimen [DE]Danielle doing her sexy bardframe dance

>>167124938
What the fuck are you talking about?
In the second scenario, you have a 50% chance to deal 2x damage and a 50% chance to deal 3x damage, which is a 2.5 average multiplier. So the second one would be 250 DPS.

I don't know what the fuck is wrong with your "crit tiers" thing, but the way it works is if you have a 5x crit multi, that's 4x extra. So a yellow crit does (1+4)x, a red crit does (1+4+4)x, the next tier if it actually existed would be (1+4+4+4)x.

People paying anything worthwhile for Boltor or Penta rivens? Just unveiled a couple.

>>167126110
>I'm not sure what he means by red crits meaningless
What that means is that if you were to get +x% crit chance, it would have the same absolute effect on your damage regardless of whether you're in redcrit territory or not (unless you're so high you're going over 200%).

>>167128635
what if I'm looking for frogbutt

>>167128937
This is the gist of what I'm saying, but this is only true for 2x crit multiplier. If your multiplier is higher, redcrits actually has LESS effect on your damage compared to regular crits (diminishing returns). Note that for every crit weapon in the game you're going to have a higher multiplier than 2x with mods.

best place to farm vestian moss?>

>>167127098
>RED CRITS DO LITERALLY GIVE YOU A HUGE DAMAGE BOOST, YOU FUCKING RETARD
Getting x% additional crit chance has the same absolute effect on your DPS whether you're above or below 100% chance. Feel free to prove otherwise.

>>167127564
>SF
>Vitality
>With quick thinking too
>Unmaxed mods
kys

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>>167128974
Then you will find it

>>167128815
Shit514 is not EVE.

What variability? I'm saying they should cut down "health" archetypes to 6 total varieties:

Life, Armor, Shield, Fossil, Alloy, Proto

Each with a flat resistance percentage against various forms of damage, instead of the fucktarded way that armor scales infinitely right now. Hell, they could even easily make shielded units more threatening with the proposed system.

>>167129091
TQ you already replied once to me, never do it again

thx :)

>>167128438
t. Valkyr

>>167129062
No, it's true for any crit multiplier.

If you have a 10x crit multi, and 100 base damage, going from 50% crit chance to 60% brings you from 550 average to 640 average, so a 90 increase.
Going from 150% to 160% brings you from 1450 to 1540, which is the same 90 increase.

>>167129187
I'm not TQ. Stop disagreeing with math just because that faggot happens to be involved.
TQ could fucking say 2+2=4 and people would try to argue against it.

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>>167128635
You know, looking at this, all they'd have to do to prime her is add some short attachments that the energy skirt comes from, make the skirt brighter, boobs bigger, butt slightly bigger, and a Kopaka style helmet.

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>>167129270
well if you act like that faggot im going to think you're that faggot

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>have been getting fucked by anaysan sculptures from sorties literally everyday since their release

>>167129478
>act like that faggot
Using math is "acting like TQ"? How do you get through life?

>>167129549
by not acting like a faggot apparently

>>167129270
that's a 90 flat damage increase, but the overall damage multiplier is different (550 --> 640 is greater than (1450 --> 1540)

>>167129585
>Someone presents a completely rational argument with mathematical proof
>Other guy spergs out
>Somehow the first guy is at fault

>>167129549

>>167129270
>TQ could fucking say 2+2=4 and people would try to argue against it.

>>167122830
>If someone told you 1 + 1 = 2 you'd shitpost him.

>using the same argument as TQ isn't acting like TQ

>>167129585
shut up faggot
>>167129629
also a mega faggot

the poster after this one is surprisingly, also a faggot

>>167129620
Correct, you get diminishing returns from a relative standpoint. However, the same is true for almost every way of increasing damage (e.g. going from 0 to 100 multishot is a 2x multi, going from 100 to 200 is a 1.5x multi, etc), and it's true for every crit multiplier (going from 0% 2x to 100% 2x is a 2x, giong from 100% 2x to 200% 2x is 1.5x).

>>167129664
I didn't even see his post. But anyway, dismissing an argument because of who made it is an ad hominem and not an argument. Considering how retarded TQ is most of the time it's really not hard to find legitimate holes in his arguments, but this isn't one of them.

>>167118847
>>167119007
The superstitious tenno would tell you that based on their insane interpretation of coincidental contrivances so arcane they're worth 500 plat in a helmet... the next new Prime will be a female frame with a predominantly LIGHT color scheme which will be inverted into a dark Prime.

The problem with this is that most frames have a pretty balanced color scheme and this convention is completely up to their interpretation. Like, are Banshee, Zephyr, and Mirage considered dark or light color schemes by default? All include a significant amount of white, but also dark blue or purple.

Also I'm waiting for the so called conventions to be shattered by Equinox Prime getting its own solo chapter in the Prime saga due to "her" dual nature.

what does teir queer actually mean anyway?

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>>167129871
>equinox prime
>aspects are only in axi relics and each aspect is in a different relic as rares
>neuroptics/systems/chassis are in neo relics
>takes 10 nitain, 10,000 cryotic and 20 argon crystals to build the whole set

>>167130030
>one of the pieces needs a forma and 8k oxium

>>167129871
>first female frame for a cycle is equinox main bp
>needs night aspect prime and day aspect prime
>no way to get them
>you can purchase equinox prime through prime access
>second female frame is night aspect prime
>still no day aspect
>prime access is still equinox prime, but now with different armor bits
>first "male" frame is day aspect prime
>prime access changes armor bits again

It'd be like frost prime only 100x worse.

>>167129871
Didn't a dev already confirm that Equinox Prime would be tied to a quest? Or was that Mirage Prime?

>>167130030
>10 nitain total
You mean 10 nitain per aspect.

>>167129775
http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Critical_Hit#Red_Crits
red crit multiplier works a little differently, but it works exactly the way you describe if the crit multiplier is 2.0x

>>167129996
hes some lonely faggot who knows nothing except how to be an annoying drain on this thread and the people around him all day, incessantly shitposting about his stupid tier list and arguing with people who don't agree with him.

TL Note: tier = his tier list of frames, queer = he is a faggot

>>167130212
How is that different from what I said? If you have a 3x multi, your yellow crits are 3x and red crits are 5x. Going from 0% to 100% would be going from 1x damage to 3x, going from 100% to 200% would be 3x to 5x.

>>167130030
>takes 10 nitain

Step it up. Vauban took 20.

>>167130030
>each part takes 3.5k kuva and 20 mutagen samples

>>167129996
https://youtu.be/qR6sxFBm1P8

Is the corpus speargun going to be a meme like the javlok?

>>167130329
ahh sorry, you're right I had a brain fart

>>167130210
dear god i hope its equinox, it'd be a pain to get 10 parts from relics with prime tier resource requirements

Is bladed rounds supposed to get a popup in the UI like hydraulic crosshairs? I'm not seeing one

>Only one invasion

>>167131001
>tfw cannot hit TQ with wiimote

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>>167118482
you fucked up, the armor is a different number

What's the fastest way to hunt rare corpus crates?
I'm only missing the corpus part of the mantis and I don't feel like trading.

>>167131596
>175 base
>+45% with armored agility
what are you looking for here? people conspiring to post shooped impossible builds?

>>167128528

Life Strike.

Healing Return isn't even worth thinking about.

>>167131727
i'm actually just pointing out that the armor doesn't match the hp, shield or power

>>167130030
Honestly they could make Equinox absolute fucking hell with all the different pieces available.

I mean, I raid, so I ain't hurting for fieldron, and equinox has absolutely no connection with infested so I'm not worried about mutasamples or masses, but shit like Tellurium, Kuva, Oxium, Nitain, Argon, or just rampantly fucking high costs for shit like Cryotic and Polymer would make it a huge asspain.

i love you anons one and all but every day you disappoint me.

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>>167132017
it's ok, I'm used to disappointing others

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>>167132017
Well so does my mom, but I don't need two of those.

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>>167128635
I'll do what I want

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>>167131925
ur mr gay

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I regret falling for the Lex meme.

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Cool

>>167133082
is the opticor an actually used weapon?

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>>167133130
no

>>167133082
mildly jealous, but still no fire rate

>>167133130
you need about 5 or 6 forma to make it good, but upon achieving that you can bust it out up to T2 sorties or T3 if you get consistent headshots (wherein a nova slow or chroma damage bonus is applied).

>>167133493
>T2
>T3
does this have anything to do with old void?

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>>167133130
Guilty Pleasure but still situational
>>167133493
I added some firerate but my opticor will collect dust until they give it a secondary fire that shoots out a continuous beam like Ironman

So never

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>>167133493
headshots are fun

>>167131218

I so look forward to Equinox prime solely because it'll be hilarious watching all the PA goyim running around with no idea how she works.

>>167133913
I dont want equinox to ever become popular or itll be nerfed into oblivion

>>167134081

The only real worry is that they'll "revisit" her in anticipation of Prime Access and ruin her in the process, probably by dumbing her down. If they leave her alone, she'll just be dropped for Ember/Frost again as soon as the scrubs 30 her.

> Get spira riven
> Oh neat, I like spira.
> Roll
> Roll
> roll
> rollrollrollrollrollrolllrollroll
> Get bullshit on like 15+ rerolls
How the fuck does DE expect rivens to encourage players to use nonmeta weaps when you have to grind for literally for-fucking-ever with no hope of ever getting anything good to actually get something even remotely useful?

Like, there's nothing stopping me from using my kuva to keep rolling my tigris riven in hopes of gettting seeking fury+ multishot or damage or something, except for the prospect of getting a decent spira riven, but I have no way to influence the spira riven, so it just comes off feeling like wasted rolls.

Why hasn't DE implimented some way to influence the stats on rivens yet? Why the fuck is progression being so heavily tied to RNG like this? I mean even in WoW once you've got your latest tierset it's the same tierset as any other player in your class will be able to get, why the fuck are they locking the stats themselves behind an additional RNG wall? That's fucking lame.

>>167134509
Only shitters get bad rolls

>>167134509
rivens are purely a time/plat sink, nothing more

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J A V L O K riven boys

But it's a meme weapon right?

>>167134642
it's completely useless now that wukong can't throw it from his cloud

>>167126620
How is it that you get to med school when you literally have real life autism?

If you can, I'm moving to the States and getting a degree there.

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>>167134543
fuck you nigger pic related

>>167134564
thats fuckin gay. This could have been cool if it were a legit progression system for defunct weapons but instead its just more faggot nothing bullshit. thanks DE.

>>167134676
what was the point of of using it with wukong?

>>167134854
>progression system

Nah

The point of it was RNG since the start.

Just like most RPG loot systems

>>167134891
so you could wudong

>>167134891
Stealth multipliers.

>>167134950
gaaaaaaaaaaaaay

>>167134761
there is different kind of autism i think
i have myself a slight form of autism, i'm just bad with social things

Resource booster works with kuva, right? Guess I'll get a booster up for some rerollin' this weekend.

>>167134994
so it still work with stealth frames? i don't see the point of using javelok anyway, exept for people who find it fun

>>167135060
ye

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>>167133082

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What is your favorite non-cookie cutter/meta weapon?

I love the Latron Prime.

>>167131631
Trade, you Jewish faggot. All the parts are worth dirt since ships are pretty much nothing but loading screen enhancements.

>>167135326
I forgot

>>167135326
Karak Wraith

>>167135326
buzlok

>>167135460
Do you want a riven for it for free? Unrolled, I have no use for it and need to clear space. Post IGN if interested.

>>167131631
The same way one would hunt for syndicate medallions.

Put on Loot detector, Thiefs wit and animal instinct, take telos boltace to pop boxes. Whichever squares on your map don't disappear after slide attack and vacuum are the caches.

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>>167135326
twin rogga's fun.

>>167131631
Jv raids.

>>167135326

I really enjoyed using the Braton.

I have a Braton prime that I stuffed it with the dual status mods and it's okay.

>>167135023
Inability to understand or take in new information outside of your own experience.
Unable to communicate in simple terms.
God complex, this is forgivable but for you case it's over the limit.

Both of my parents are real life doctors and also taught at university and yes they did come across someone with these problems and all I can say is they have to push him so hard for him to finish the degree.

If getting in med school in the states is that easy I'm really thinking about this.

>>167135525
nha, unless it got less recoil, more flight speed, and a bit of damages
reroling riven is a pain in the ass
but thank you anyway

>>167135326
piggy prime

oink oink

>>167135326
I conceptually love the burston prime, but mostly for the syndicate aug. I love the idea of a prime weapon having the syndicate proc. Just does it for me.

Also I know that as far as snipers go Vectis prime is pretty meta, but snipers as a rule are not, and I'd really love a good -zoom -magsize riven to make the vectis more usable for me.

Also like the attica.

Spira, Ballistica and akvasto as well.

One of the few things that keep me playing?

Teabagging

This one shitter went down on a lvl 30-40 Corpus exterminate and I tea bagged him for 12 seconds straight after clearing the room. The sound of the impotent screech he made before disconnecting will sweeten my dreams tonight