/rlg/ - Roguelike General

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Ohayou gozaimasu, /rlg/!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Let's play our best today!

THREE POSTS EARLY
NEVER IN THE HISTORY OF /rlg/ HAD SUCH A HORRIBLE CRIME EVER BEEN COMMITTED

>>145698862
better than "ded thred ded genre"

Is a triple crossbow with speed brand even worth using if you're 8 levels away from mindelay?
Having to level crossbows to 26 is going to be crazy expensive, and I seem to be killing stuff with it just fine while my skill is at 18. Though that could also be because of Oka's Heroism and my gloves of archery (slaying+4 to all missiles).

Should I be using my vorpal arbalest and training defences instead?

I had a great time in the Discord today lads

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Useless, but satisfying.

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>>145698906
That's debatable.
But you know what's not debatable?
Pearl dragons.
They're the best.

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>>145699072

>>145699072
remember when you could ?vuln shadow dragons and polymorph them into pearl dragons?

/rlg/ remembers

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>>145699002
stop this nonsense

>>145699240
C E N T A U R
A
V
A
L
R
Y

For FTL

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>>145699172
Please do not fuck the dragons
they are very large
>>145699378
At least that one is not as obnoxious.

Why are moose so fucking pissed off in CDDA?

>>145699654
Because there are dead dudes trying to kill them.
Also moose are dicks like that.

>>145699654
it's mating season and all female moose are dead

>>145699654
I'm more wondering why my starting NPC immediately decided to run off on a genocide crusade against the local fauna.
He REALLY hates raccoons, apparently.

was reading through www.zangband.org/Docs/Version-History.aspx and apparently Cyberdemons (as well as many other assgutter monsters) were added by Topi Ylinen as a sort of "good luck and fuck you hahaha peaceeeeee" parting gift on his last update before retiring as maintainer.

There's a nice list in there of shit he added as a fuckyougoodbye. Well done, Topi, well done.

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>>145699172

>monsters summoned by amberite blood curses get to act before your next turn
jesus christ, next one I see I'm just gonna leave alive

Killing Dworkin summoned two uniques including another amberite
killing the new amberite summoned a couple of big breathers who immediately brought me down from 800hp to 200 *and* scared me enough that I missed my next turn
luckily I had enough speed on them that I could !heal and ?teleport level

>>145700021
was the final effect of the blood curse to paralyze you?

also I think maybe sometimes summons get firstmove but not certain...possibly only if you do a high energy action on your last turn?

>>145700021
that's why you always wear your "[M] before killing them

>>145700089
Brogue

it's one of the easiest roguelikes, a bit easier than DCSS, so you should be able to beat it within 20 tries. it's quite beautiful, too. nice little game.

>>145700139
I have an amulet of [M back in my house, I should really carry it around if I'm gonna be killing shit in the arena.

>>145700284
remember to dual-needle in the arena to oneshot the GWOP and literally everything

>>145700393
The oneshot chance goes down with monster level though, doesn't it?

I don't think it's a huge chance to trigger on GWOPs and shit.

>>145700501
>The oneshot chance goes down with monster level though, doesn't it?
Does it? I remember oneshotting a GWoP with a needle as an ARK back in the day as my first hit. I was level 50 though.

>>145699964
Favourite part of that page:
>Since new towns and quests can be added in the definition files (in lib/edit/) without having to recompile, hopefully the players of the new version will build their own quests and share them with all Zangband players!

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What's the best roguelike? The best one

>>145700645
Well yeah you *can* do it on your first hit, it's just not too likely.

>if ( randint1(randint1(r_ptr->level/7)+5) == 1

this is actually more likely than I thought though
looks like for a level 90 monster it's still a 19.5% chance to instakill

>>145701228

Yet to be programmed, anon.

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Not sure what I expected the cloning pits reward to be, but it wasn't something that poor. At least it wasn't boots, I guess.

>>145701282
wait i fucked up it's a 9.4% chance

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Neat early muts

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>>145701836
And then not much later

I'll probably still fuck this run up because
>CK

>>145701836
Tanky Ds are the best

>>145702276
>CK

wwwwwwwwww

>>145702276
>MR-
Omae wa mou shindeiru

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RIP little guy. I guess level 3 summoners don't belong in Tower:18.

>>145701582
And the chance to hit with one?

>>145702708
how were you only level 3

>>145701438
Oh good, +0.5 to your shooter multi, nice!

>>145702708
What game?

>>145703372
Demon.

>>145702708
Trying to do speedruns? You almost made it though. I bet getting monster detection as a relic upgrade will make speedruns/pacifist runs super easy

>>145703426
I thought it looked familiar. I couldn't get past the second or third floor. I didn't really understand what I was doing wrong. I tamed a bunch of dudes and the enemies just wiped me out like it was nothing.

I just ran into a mimic imitating a sewer entrance. I got the notifications about the drain when entering the level and everything. I didn't know they could do that.

>>145703697
Ya got the tabbitis, my lad.

>>145703886
Weapon.
Always Weapon.

>>145703886
I really hope this post isn't asking for advice.

>>145703886
Armor.
Always Armor.

>>145702716
if you're wielding just one it's 100% chance to hit

if dual wielding you have a 50-50 chance to get the guaranteed hit, and otherwise it just uses your normal accuracy vs the enemy's AC

>>145703886
Wands.
Always Wands.

>>145701438
The level 45 free power turned out to be invoke logrus, which is an okay (though expensive) unique killer. I'm not sure I want to know the other possibilities, as I think I got the dud prize.

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>>145703886
Neat

I'm so glad I 3 runed DCSS with a minotaur because now I can shittalk the game and everyone who plays it

>>145702920
Skipped floors as much as possible. Haste+Swiftness+Dash could outrun everything. Unfortunately, a bunch of enemies spawned with a Foul modifier, spammed Slow, and killed me.
>>145703691
Yeah, I think that relic will make speedruns more viable. Though I can get free monster detection by linking with Preta, Centaur, Akateko, etc.
>>145703697
I feel there are only a few builds in Demon a good player can reliably win with: mass stacking veils and pumping Vit, healing build with Mending, Soothe, and Draw Wounds and pumping Vit and Magic, dirty needle build with needle shot and lots of debuff inflicting passives, caster build with Vigor Siphon, Frost Ring, and SP boosting abilities, and buff build with Haste and Might (and Frost Ring if you want damage). This will change in the upcoming update that adds different relics (basically perks) to each class.

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First for Chei.

>>145704625


>int choices[] = {EFFECT_BOLT_WATER, EFFECT_BOLT_MANA, EFFECT_BALL_LITE,
EFFECT_BALL_DARK, EFFECT_BALL_CHAOS, EFFECT_BALL_WATER,
EFFECT_BALL_MANA, EFFECT_BREATHE_SOUND, EFFECT_BREATHE_SHARDS,
EFFECT_BREATHE_CHAOS, -1};

you could've had manastorm, anon

So, how exactly do the wander spawns work in CDDA.

And how do they work with static spawn?

I'm curious since I'm not interested in
>You made a noise
>Suddenly a billion zombies, they're coming forever
But I'm not interested in having a game where everywhere is depopulated after I pass through either.

Is there some happy medium?

>>145705262
I don't think that's mana storm, but maybe it is. If not, none of those look all that amazing (unless ball water is whirlpool, that's pretty good). You can get a lot of those (like I have breathe shards and sound already) from jewellery.

>>145705306
Also, is it worth it to dick about with the season length?

>>145703886
>just acquired weapon
>get runed double sword
>get slightly mad
>wield-ID it anyway
>wait, wasn't I carrying a shield two?
>learn double swords are one-handed weapons
I never use long blades so I never knew this. Thank you based acquirement for showing me the way.

>>145705854
>two
too

>>145705656
BALL_MANA is not mana storm.
BALL_LITE is starburst (awesome), and BALL_WATER is whirlpool (also awesome). I don't think Logrus is that bad though. How much damage does it do and how much does it cost?

Also rings are definitely device users for part of their damage so you will want to stop by Volcano and Dragon's Lair at some point.

>>145707040
The problem with logrus is that it's bad against non-uniques: It can randomly polymorph them and the heal to full every time it does.

>>145707040
211 damage for 30 mp. For comparison, shard ball is 180 for 22.

That said it works for killing all uniques that don't resist confusion, so it's not horrible. Useless against the serpent, of course.

https://github.com/crawl/crawl/commit/c8dcfc9153d0d7dbe658595ec5ddc689383c3901
>Monks now start with a choice of weapon
Basically at 0 apt you now have 3 points in your chosen weapon instead of 4 points in UC.

>>145707709
what does this mean for mumo

>>145707918
You get less unarmed skill than before, so it's even worse.

>>145708012
excellent

Does anyone remember offhand which file has the weapon skill tables in it for PCB?

>>145708710
the one you get by searching for 7000 in the github page

>>145707918
Nothing, since mumo is supposed to be played on 0.15

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Does it give me a stand when I use it?

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>>145698450
http://angband.oook.cz/competition.php

Angband competition just went up, this time it's for the latest vanilla Angband 4.0.3.

>Glass is an elf with a big mace and very poor luck.
The competition character starts the game with Deathwreaker (arguably the best weapon) equipped!

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Kind of cheesy since Cthulhu can be stunned by confusing lights.

>gamble scrolls for 2 acquirement and an *acquirement*
>read on dlvl 80
Two staves of healing, an amulet that activates for star ball (basically pcb disc of storms) and a worthless randart of pitch dark night. Acquirement is pretty good when you can't receive a cloak of freezing.

>>145711703
It might be kind of obvious but if you're strong enough you should climb a few floors down to improve your loot level.

Favorite roguelike /rlg/ doesn't have in OP/doesn't talk about?

>>145712554
Hoplite, I guess.

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Evidently mana storm is one of the spells you can learn, though it seems to be some sort of cheap plastic imitation that only does a fixed 225 damage.

>>145712554
Rogue Survivor, which recently went open source because someone decompiled the last closed source version from 2012.

The same person is also making their own new versions, although I suspect that his versions won't be developed in the same freewheeling style that I liked about the original.

>>145712952
>which recently went open source because someone decompiled the last closed source version from 2012
U wot

They translated decompiled block of unreadable crap into code that can be worked on?

Is it written in C# or something like that, with readable bytecode?

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>tfw too stupid to play mpa-pcb on windows

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What a fucking waste of an ego.

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first for unbrogue

>about to play PCB
>remember that there's no fun classes

That was a close one

>>145713985
phew lad

>>145713664
>he didn't read the pasta
there's a link to a compiled version in there

>>145714247
>Visually scanned the pasta
>Didn't see

Guess I'll play a Samurai for maximum seppuku, thanks.

>>145713985
>about to play PCB
>remember the game fucking sucks ass

That was a close one.

>about to play roguelikes
>remember life is a total waste of time anyway

>>145714548
>if you die in real life, you die in roguelikes!

>>145713363
Maybe it was made with a certain program?
I know stuff like rpgmaker has decompilers.

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>trunk, lair 5
>stairs are fugged
>go down escape hatch
>land in end vault

thanks devs

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please stop i want those

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this isn't bad for a cursed war pike.

plus i like how the monster blood stays on until you impale another

>>145713363

To be honest, while I liked rogue survivor, it was very simplistic. There's really no point in even attempting to decompile when you could re-program it all from scratch in > a month.

There have been many attempts to "re-make" the game, never goes anywhere though.

real life is a roguelite

>>145715832
Roguelife

>>145715806
Speaking of zambee roguelikes, does anyone remember the one where you have to right through an infested town and get to a bridge or safe zone?

>>145712952
>Rogue Survivor, which recently went open source
any sign of Roguedjack killing himself yet?

>>145716325
no sign at all

means it probably already happened

Are there any particular wheel sizes I should be looking for my deathmobile, or does it not matter that much?

>>145716518
>wheels : not enough
>wheels : enough
sorry I don't know CDDA at all, but every time I see a deathmobile screenshot, above kills me

>>145716518
Only total wheel area counts.
Go over optimum if you offroad much

>>145715832
>Real Life v2.0 was released 16 years ago
At v2.016 you'd think we'd have come a little farther than people arguing about gender inequality and body types. I was so fucking hyped for the Y2K pre-release event hoping the third World War would happen and instead we didn't get shit except for the people who deleted their account out of fear of PvP. Pussies.
Nuclear winter when? I wanna go innawoods with muh sks

so how does being a magic eater even work? how do you put wands or items into your 'slots'
'e'ating them doesn't work, it just takes a charge and satiates me

>>145713363
It's written in C#, but what happened was a fan decompiled the game and this brought the original author out of hiding just long enough to release the original source code and put it under GPL.

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I haven't read a single enchant armor scroll. Does this mean that sokoban zoo is gonna kill me?

>>145717418
Trying 'U'sing an ability.

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Which should I wield? Besides the demon whip which I keep to use against casters.

>>145717418
it's going to be U or m depending on stupid bullshit

>>145715925
I do! I remember there was like a followup part after you got over the bridge where you had to fight, like, giant ants or something. That was weird and I didn't play it much past the bridge.

I think it was called Zomband, but the original site seems to be dead.

>>145716518
there's some optimal amount based on the vehicle's weight but idk what it is

I wish there were more roguelikes like Elona where you could lose yourself for 500 hours.

I tried Elona but I truly could not get past the autism

>>145718378
>Get past the harvest time hurdle
>Don't know what to do next

>>145718378
DDA is probably the closest thing, but also replicates whatever you mean by "autism".

>>145717889
>inscribing notes on your gear

just use a .txt file bro

>>145718039
Morningstar you dunce

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Looks like pumping the shit out of charisma worked because I didn't get feared at all during that fight.

>>145718498
>pastebin tells me to get every skill first
>this requires no less than 5000 platinum coins
>which equates to 3000 of the same mission over and over
>my little girl pet is 20 times the warrior I am
>alt+f4
>still feel desire to play it

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>>145718674
T-thanks.

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I can take this off with a scroll of mundanity right? And the curse makes my actions disharmonious right?

>>145719092
>can
't

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>>145719092
I have this though and I think it's better and it doesn't have a curse.
right

>>145718039
the flail is shit unless you have no other source of rF/sInv, in which case use it only when those are relevant.

the demon whip is better than the morningstar.

What world preset can actually gen the "Trapped In A Lab" start reliably? I can't get any world to work with it.

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>>145719264
Into the home it goes I never sell artifacts.

>>145719264
Pretty sure you can. Mundanity removes everything about an item, including permanent curses.

>>145719449
there are more than 240 in the game though

I used to hoard artifacts in my home but then I started dumping the too-worthless-for-reforging ones into the musem instead

>>145719264
>>145719529

whoops, I misread this as "can take this off WITHOUT a scroll"

you can ?mundanity it for sure

>>145719532
Well it's not like you're going to find 240 artifacts every game. Hell, I doubt you'll find vorpal or ringil.

>>145719327
>the demon whip is better than the morningstar

Oh wow. Guess I'll use that then.

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>>145719435

>>145719670
no but I always fill my home up with shitty worthless artifacts and staffs that I'm never going to use

>>145719857
I think we all do.

>>145719092
>>145719270
they're both very good items
yes if you use ?Mundanity on the Harp of Apollo it will become a Harp with no abilities, and you will be able to remove it because that also means to curse. Daeron's healing is very nice, though so is Apollo's super short cooldown Clairvoyance during the "recall back and forth to Angband 98 looking for vaults" stage, if you're trying to grind out shit (mostly !*healing* which are most commonly found in vaults but while you're at it you get sweet items)

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+4 points of extra might. If only I had a bow slot.

>>145720041
cooldown doesn't matter much for that though

you can just stand next to the tavern in town and pay like 20 gold to rest, which fully recharges all your shit

>>145720148
It's nice when you can stay in the dungeon taking stairs and stuff, or when you're at your house and not the inn and just jamming out recalls. Also, lets you regain level knowledge (and lighting) in the case of destruction or mind-blanking or hits-to-shatter-earthquake. But it's definitely a luxury, not a necessity.

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post doings, playings
goals

>>145719435
Medium cities at medium distance. For example, defaults.
The "can't gen shit" usually happens when you pick no cities or huge cities.

The rest doesn't really matter.

>>145721002
>goals

1. whatever it's called when you get all races and classes in crawl
2. beat IVAN
3. beat vanilla Angband

>>145721002
Kill Zeus for me.

>>145721061

I keep getting failures at default size. Weird.

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Hall of Blades gank squad reporting in.

>>145720106
(+4) Xm is probably not as good as (+3) or even (+2) Xs, though obviously it depends on how much of each you have and if you really need to conserve arrows (i.e. not an archer)

Psycho-spear is a bolt spell right?

>>145722398
Yeah it hits multiple dudes in a line.
The damage type also does damage to invincible enemies for what its worth (don't think you're safe against a psycho-spear-er with 300HP and Invuln).

>>145718378
Elona is the only game where I actually, honestly had fun grinding my life away. Even those MMOs with their watered down social elements never really managed to catch my attention. Guess I'm a special kind of autismo.

Are gods even worth attempting to worship it in Halls of Mist? The only ego items I have give me some needed resists or stat boost and I don't really want to part with them

>>145722398
I don't THINK reflection stops psycho-spear

could e wrong though

>>145724351
You're right.

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Absolutely disgusting.

>>145724861
Why can't you ever cut a god's balls off with an ordinary +0 iron sickle?

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FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK
ITS HIM
HE'S BACK TO FUCK ME WITH HIS 10000 SPEED 10000 AC AND INFINITE RANGE TRACKING

>>145725319
Because it doesn't have sharpness.

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What a find.

>>145725331
Time to escape and leave the level?
How is maging in HoM?

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>A caustic shrike comes into view. x5

>12 M&F
>acquire weapon
>a cursed +0 demon blade of electrocution
lol skill transfer

>>145725717
Stable or beta?

>Accidentally quaff a curemut potion when you have really good muts

I'm going to commit sudoku now

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>>145725857
>scroll of disappointment

>>145726132
Nice upgrade from a +1 flail of crushing though.

>>145725331
>butt to attack

>>145725331
Can you raise it?

>>145726132
>most likely 3-4 rods and a staff
>diappointment

>>145726408
>wand of confusion
>wand of random effects
>wand of paralysis
>wand of polymorph
>wand of hasting (already had one)

>>145725717
Yea, I just teleported away. I had a cat warrior from a long ass time ago that didn't have teleport and got assguttered by him.

Mage is kinda meh because you end up having to leave every level mostly unexplored and unlooted since you'll quickly run out of MP (which doesn't regenerate!), and your devices and physical attacks can only get you so far. And when you do run out of MP you lose access to phase door and teleport spells which means you better prepare your anus if you can't find a staircase.

Warrior on the other hand can clear out entire floors easily thanks to their regenerating HP, but they have to rely on scrolls/staves for phase door/teleport.

>>145725894
It's version 1.3.2, I don't know what the latest stable release is. And I think they changed the classes around in the beta so I don't think the mage class works quite the same.

>>145726393
Raise it? Like a pet?

>>145726554
now you can go 2fast instead of 1fast

>>145725737
>zig floor with caustic shrikes, juggernauts, hell sentinels, tormentors, tzitzimitl and maybe a pair of panlords
That was a special kind of suffering

>>145726628
In 1.3, magic is approx. mana ray and win, super efficient spell that does a lot of damage. Get it in book 3, so be careful until then.

>>145726554
>He didn't acquire rods
2 fast is better than 1.

>>145726862
Is mana ray a beam? It costs 6 mana and only does 7d5 damage. The elemental spells can deal 7d5 damage for only 2 mana and have a chance to turn into a beam too.

>>145727116
It's a beam, and its damage scales with level in a way that is not apparent in the book.

>ring monsters can't get Warning
but why

>>145728013
Yeah, I think they have a couple of oversights. There were some spells it said I learned (ice bolt, detect treasure) but I they don't show up in my spell list.

Anyone try Vanilla Bagel? I hear good things

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>>145728732
>50¢ has been deposited in your account

>>145728732
No one here has, no.

>>145728732
>I hear good things
from who? reddit?

>>145728732
It looks nice and authentic but also costs $8 so fuck that

>>145728732
>paying money
fuck that desu

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>>145730490
>>145732112
/rlg/

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>Cata DDA
>let's try a lab challenge!
>Error: Couldn't find a lab
>It just dumps me in the goddamn woods with my extra points

>>145732347
https://github.com/CleverRaven/Cataclysm-DDA/pull/17212

whoops we broke it hehe xd

I'm not saying any particular game is worth paying for, but this aversion to paying less than 10$ for a game, after trying it for free and finding it to be sufficiently enjoyable, is stupid.

I will try this Vanilla Bagel game and report back.

>>145732347
Frankly, I'm impressed.

>>145732581
I'm starting another world so I can actually try the challenge.
But I'm keeping that world for a rainy day.

>>145732347
lel

>>145732537
>this aversion to paying less than 10$ for a game
it's chump change so buy it for me thanks

>>145732471
>we
Protip: the "PK" in the mod stands for author's name

>>145732319
I'm not even done with undergrad.

More generally, lots of good free roguelikes exist, and I have no obligation to subsidize a work that isn't genuinely superior.

>>145732319
Never pay money for any game.

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>>145732537
15 minutes of playing report:
There are villages that are not randomly generated. They have shops and quests. NPCs have dialog that is interesting enough for me to read and not skip.
There is an overworld that is at least slightly randomized.
The areas where you fight monsters ARE randomly generated.
So it's like ToME4 or PCB, with a non-random or slightly random overworld and random dungeons.

The few fights that I got into so far were very deadly (literally, had to restart). It seems like you have to use resources even for the first enemies you see, unless I wandered into high level areas like an idiot.

There was an NPC that offered to heal me at the cost of XP. You can spend XP on other things, even on temporarily boosting your attack accuracy.

There's some level up stat choices and bigger upgrades every 5 levels. Probably not an interesting decision once you figure out which stats and upgrades are the best.

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>>145735878
>There was an NPC that offered to heal me at the cost of XP
By this do you mean that you could be healed at the cost of being drained of some of your experience, or leveling up grants you with some points you can spend in this kind of stuff?

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Guys, I just nuked my house before the tutorial ended. What now?

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>>145725642
I found one of those one time. I didn't even know it was possible to find a maxed out one. Not sure if it's a bug or if it's intended, but damn is it nice finding two million dollary-doos.
>Spring, day 7
Is that really day 7 of the first year? Because hot damn what a find indeed.

>>145736448
Just screw around, you've already vanquished the worlds greatest evils.

>>145736564
Well shit.

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This one wreaks. I am afraid.

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I managed to survive my first fight! It seems like the first floor has easy enemies, and it also has huge spiders, which are stupidly strong. I always encounter a spider first. Bought and used a healing potion this time, allowing me to kill it instead of dying as usual, and not die from poison.

When you hit an enemy, it increases your movement delay. Meaning when you get into an extended fight you can't reposition or run away easily. The movement delay goes back to normal over time when not attacking.

Monsters drop meat that you can eat to recover health. Health does not regenerate for free. Meat rots quickly.

>>145736279
Drained of experience. Seems very expensive.

>>145735878
Please keep up the reports. I'm actually really interested in it but I'm insanely poor. Are the spells and abilities interesting?

>>145738035
Seems neat. That item looks interesting.

Does it seem like there's a lot of content? I'm not a fan of RLs that take just like half an hour to beat.

>>145738035
>When you hit an enemy, it increases your movement delay. Meaning when you get into an extended fight you can't reposition or run away easily.
Oh god it's like the anti-kiting in Circus Animals all over again.

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doing chip damage on a boss thats 50 levels above me

the fight took me 20 minutes but i finally got magic heart from him to evolve my foxbro
aside from that the goddamn drops were trash

now i just have to grind more to level my relationship and after that have to grind more because evolving your pet resets their level back to 1

ELONA?
MORE LIKE GRINDLONA

>>145738310
I don't even understand how people can play Elona. It seems like a giant clusterfuck to me.

>>145738367

the learning curve is pretty comparable to dwarf fortress
its real easy to break after you get past the curve

>>145738467
Yeah but even then I don't like the way it looks or plays. I suppose it's just not for me.

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>>145738310
>Grindlona

Yes

>>145738504
its understandable
the game is very crudely translated from japanese in some parts

>>145738564
itzpalt is so easy in elona+ now
i have so much trash rods from carpentry

>>145707918
Time for MuFi, anon.

>>145738310
Can't he instantly kill you?

>>145709941
Unfortunately no.
Dio has a good chance of dropping the stone mask that turns you into a Vampire.

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>>145739815
yeah his spells are nasty without proper resist gear
thankfully i got this baby on
i also have superb cold and magic resist for being a fairy

even so i can only tank about 3 spells before going down to critical health because hes 50 levels above me

>>145740231
Isn't it really easy to gain levels in E+ if you know what you're doing?
Is there a reason you're so low-leveled?

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Someone should add the dragon realm's spells to the pastebin. Does anyone know where the file that has them is called?

>>145740323
theres a difficulty modifier on elona+ that basically triples the rates which was added for people who dont like the grind

but im playing on the basic modifier with normal xp rates

levels really dont mean that much in elona
stats and gear are the bigger things to grind for

from what can understand from other people who play elona people try to maintain a low level (drinking potions of descent) so that the danger levels and the scaling dont reach to unmanageable values

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I am not confident that this game is worth my money and don't feel like risking it, so I'm going to refund it. Maybe someone else will try it. Steam has a no questions asked refund if you play less than 2 hours, if anyone wants to try it.

>>145738120
The abilities are not interesting, they're mostly passives. You can see them on the left. All classes have most of those abilities with a little variation. There are 3 classes that play like basic melee.

The Spirit class can possess creatures and take control of them.

Another class has a servant ally, the servant does most the killing while you hide behind him, didn't try it.

All classes have access to thrown weapons and bows.

>>145738127
No idea about the content sorry.

>>145738170
The movement speed and attack speed of all creatures and yourself varies a lot. It's not like in Crawl where 10 aut is a major breakpoint. You're faster than many enemies. The movement delay increase from attacking doesn't stop you from kiting, if you don't hit for many turns consecutively. The tutorial even encourages hitting, moving away, hitting, moving away, etc against enemies slower than you. The strongest enemies are fast though, can't be cheesed like this.

One weird thing is that if you move away from an enemy, there's a good chance that it will swing at the air where you used to stand.

>>145740656
it's all in race_dragon.c

>>145742347
Thanks.

>>145723423
Sacrificing an ego gives you a temporary blessing for some floors; giving an artefact is a permanent blessing. These stack.

And it's worthwhile when you have an ego/artefact that you'd get less mileage out of than from a blessing. This happens eventually.

>>145743584
and if you're a priest sacrificing torches gives the sacrifice-ego effect and saccing egos gives the artifact effect

>>145743584
Yea but you don't know what bonuses the god will give you until you make an ego sacrifice. Around what floor should I expect to see artifacts?

Is blind guardian the only /rlg/ approved roguelike music?

>>145744667
Don't worry, anon. It's shit in my opinion.

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>>145744008
What happens if you sac an artifact then?

>>145744693

>>145744750
probably the game calls you a retard for wasting an artifact

>cram
you know, I've always thought that cram rations and lembas were the same thing. But apparently
>cram is a biscuit-like food made by the Men of Esgaroth and Dale, which they share with the Dwarves of the Lonely Mountain.

>>145744884
Of course they're not the same thing, a single wafer of lembas gives more nutrition than an entire ration of cram.

>>145744979
yeah apparently tolkien just renamed hardtack. Still cool though.

haven't played dcss for a while

what happend to strength weight?
how does stat affect weapon damage now?

>all the death realm spells are just lame breaths
Such shit.

>>145745134
when will you learn, anon
There are tons of realms in PCB and they're all shit except for nature

>>145745238
I don't think dragons can get nature as their realm. They all look like trash except for melee.

>>145745130
only strength affects damage and only dex affects accuracy now

specifically damage is multiplied by 1 + (str-10)/39

>>145745130
Consult the learndb.

>>145745335
thx family

>>145745130
Strength for damage, dex for accuracy.

>>145745238
Armageddon, Chaos, Daemon are all great realms. Nature is just the best realm on hybrids.
>>145745327
Pretty much!

>>145745134
>reanimation breath
>vampirism breath
>genocide breath
doesn't sound lame to me
maybe a bit weird though

>>145745327
Yeah and the other thing is that there are tons of classes in PCB but they're all shit except monk/ninja/mauler/RK/psion.
And literally all monster classes are shit without any redeeming qualities.
most of the races are terrible, too. Only a handful are good.

PCB offers a lot of combos but most of those combos are "raceclass that can do thing slightly worse that another raceclass" or "raceclass that is outstandingly good at everything" or "raceclass that is seriously fucking awful and you're gonna grind 555 for weeks oh wait there's no more 555 well you're fucked".

PCB promises a lot but it's actually full of shit.

>>145745527
archer is actually pretty good too

>>145745596
oh yeah archer is pretty good once you get high slaying ammo of returning. Kind of a chore to play with the fact the shooting interface is clunky.

>>145745527
>all the PCB classes are shit except the ones I have had success with/seen others have success with

PCB might have an "illusion of choice/content" thing going on, but there's still a lot in there which is good.

>>145745689
Can't you just macro to target the nearest enemy and shoot?
Also a few different macros for different ammo types.
Isn't it the only way to tab in PCB?

>>145745527
You forgot to mention the fucking godawful and fun-sucking void that is exp penalties.

>>145745689
You've never played archer.

>>145745840
No he's right.

>>145745798
Yes. Sometimes it goes a little wonky and shoots in random directions though. Really aggravating.

>>145745689
You get high slaying ammo almost immediately.

>>145745768
>except the ones I have had success with/seen others have success with
Not really. I'm just pointing out the strongest ones, mostly monks of nature that can heal themselves so they aren't required to grind *healing* which if you think that's a good mechanic it's your problem and ninjas that can literally do 15 K damage to the serpent in a turn albeit once, or Maulers that can do 4 K elemental damage and more.
>>145745803
Yeah that's really part of the reason why I still think any race other than yeek/android is boring as hell to level.

>>145745527
>raceclass that is seriously fucking awful and you're gonna grind 555 for weeks
are you exaggerating or is this really the norm

>>145745887
No.
You never get seeker arrows of returning.
It just won't happen. You might get lucky and get 5 or 6 in 20 hours of play. Maybe.
You get stacks of unbranded seeker arrows and enchant them up and play careful as fuck around mana/disint/chaos AoE.
And once you understand the basics of macros and inscriptions you never shoot anything using the shooting interface- macros bypass it entirely.

>>145745962
You can't really talk shit about the race/class variety in the game when you have only played 5 classes, 2 races, and have never won.

>>145745985
It isn't the norm. That guy is just literally addicted to not actually playing PCB. All he is capable of doing is wilderness grind -> 555.

>>145745985
>are you exaggerating or is this really the norm
I'm exaggerating on the weeks part, but *healing* is a 90+ level drop that you do need against the serpent. It's not optional. You need it because of just how bullshit pants on the heads retarded the serpent is.
Back in the day you'd scour angband 90/99 or olympus 90/99 back when olympus was not depth 80 just to get a fucking potion to not die to the serpent on the first five turns. And it's not like you only need one *healing*.

>>145746109
>>145746105
listen bro I understand you like PCB but whiteknighting won't get you anywhere
if you have a problem with me we can talk about it but don't use me as a shield to cover the heap of manure that is PCB's fight against the serpent, which you need to kill to win the game.

>>145746245
>whiteknighting
I think you've gone off the deep end m80.

so do you need to grind to win or what

>>145746485
Yes. It's a *band, they're descended from the game which inspired Diablo. You need to grind in pretty much all of them.

>>145746485
You actually need to grind to play

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>dead in 3 turns
It's like Zeus all over again. I guess I'll try a monk of NATURE next with VIRTUES turned off since everyone is telling me the grind for healing is unreal. I don't really mind the idea of grinding but having your game ended late-game like this so easily is irritating. That or it's dependent on knowledge I don't really know I've never even fought this bitch before and I guess I should've pressed the eject button after she spammed the summons.
>thunderous farting

>>145746732
You stood your ground, though.

>>145746732
Play a Tonberry Monk for maximum fun.

>>145746732
>-314/1076

Man, PCB looks like a load of fucking bullshit

>>145746485
It really depends on your race-class choice. There are some combos that can win without grinding, just need to get to level 50 and then you can just steamroll through the endgame while healing yourself (again, monk of nature). It can take a while to get to level 50 if you're a high xp penalty race (again, yeek/tonberry) but once you do get there you don't need to rely on items and the fucking golfbags that lietrally every single other combo has to use to win.
Again, if you wanna play most combos you're gonna have the same exact endgame in 99% of the cases. You grind *healing* and wands of rockets so you can zap rockets at the serpent and quaff *healing* every odd turn and that's fucking stupid and boring.
>>145746732
What was the one that evoked ultimate magi, athena?
Most olympians are more than a hassle than the serpent and can be skipped.

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>>145746802
With negative h pees.

>>145746732
On my last character I actually didn't have to grind for healing at all.
That was in 4.0.2 though.

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>>145746732
>Ultimate magus
>Athena
>+23 speed
Fucking panic m80. RIP

>>145746869
Well he was fighting one of the most powerful enemies in the game and I spy a Keeper of Secrets and an Ultimate Magus there too.
He clearly underestimated unresistable damage.
It's best not to go to Mount Olympus at all if you can't handle them.

>>145746732
>not even hasted
It looks like you didnt even try

>>145746975
that's a good movie

>>145746976
Yeah but he still took like a 600 damage hit out of nowhere.

>>145747093
doesn't athena dispel?If not her the ultimate magi do that on top of a lot of more horrible stuff.

>>145746895
Yeah she summoned like 3 of those fuckers.
>>145746976
I don't even understand what happened, I managed to kill fucking KRONOS AND ATLAS and I get turned into a fine red mist by Athena.
>>145747093
My only source of haste is my rod of heroic speed and it has something like a 50+ percent chance of failure due to my trash device skill. Also Athena was the one to jump one me first to fuck me in my ass. Detection was out since I used it for the other floors. If that's not playing safe I don't know what is.

>>145747228
Kronos and Atlas are babies compared to some of the Olympians.
Hades is especially terrifying.
>My only source of haste is my rod of heroic speed and it has something like a 50+ percent chance of failure
Don't do that.
Bring a staff or potions.

>>145747198
It's hard to kill the magi too since they love to spam the shit out of blink and then annihilate you with a manastorm while you're coming out of a corridor.

>>145747228
>My only source of haste is my rod of heroic speed
What
What did you do to your stack of !speed?
>Detection was out
Then wait? Especially at that depth

>>145747228
>If that's not playing safe I don't know what is.
playing safe is evading olympus altogether
but one might say that since the serpent can summon zeus killing him might be the safest route
and since zeus summons the other olympians killing them would be even safer
but man
most of the olympians are fucking insane.

>>145747198
Really not out of nowhere. There are many decisions of various levels that could have avoided this.

>>145747345
Sounds like some gay bullshit.

>>145747375
Yeah, if he never started a game that wouldn't have happened, you're right.

>>145747375
>Really not
Not really*

>>145747352
I took the advice of one anon where he said to just spam the rod behind a wall or something to get it off and then go in for the fight. I didn't expect to get jumped on by Athena of all things and I fell like a total boss for killing Atlas who actually managed to be a little bit of trouble for me which was surprising to me with all the shit I was wearing.

>>145747426
Not the same meaning.

>>145747494
Not really.

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Oh yeah and I forgot to mention that I had VILYA
FUCKING VILYA
OR WHATEVER IT'S CALLED I HAD THE STUPID +3 ELVEN RING
FUCKING CASTERS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE SQUISH
FUCKING ATHENA IS A BRICK WALL WITH SUMMON SPAM
FUCK YOU!!!!

>>145747425
Not starting a game of *band has been my go-to strat for a while now.

>>145747616
Nice, that's been mine too.

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>>145747604
>FUCKING ATHENA IS A BRICK WALL WITH SUMMON SPAM
>FUCK YOU!!!!
Take a deep breath
and wonder what would have happened if you were fighting the serpent of chaos

Because that was a thing that would have happened eventually.

The best setup is to not play PCB.

>>145747705
Do you think the Serpent should be easier?
What's the point then?

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>>145747705
I HAD THAT COOL SWORD AND FUCKING KALADANDA
FUCKKKKER

I'm kind of surprised furyband never took off with us. I remember an anon playing it, and it looked even crazier than pcb.

>>145747762
It would be nice if bands had more of a spectrum of difficulty between things you can walk all over and "the <foo> breathes for all of the HP, bye-bye".

>>145747920
>"the <foo> breathes for all of the HP, bye-bye".
This is so painfully true.

>>145747857
It's at a pretty big disadvantage from being based off of ToME2.
It's also more of a SLEX, whilst PCB is more of SLASHEM if that makes any sense. Yes, I know ToME SX is a thing.

>>145747762
>Do you think the Serpent should be easier?
Not exactly.
The first thing would be to remove dispel monster entirely from the game because that's an objectively poorly thought out spell that fucks up with a lot of endgame buffs (I'm looking at you wraith form/demon lord form/ ultimate resistance) that would make the serpent fight not fair, but still not pants on head retarded since those buffs are really strong.
Another idea would be to make antisummoning amulet less rare.
Then make healing potions available somewhere. Keep !*healing* a rare drop, but at least give healing potions a probability to spawn in potion shops in groups of 5/10.

That in my opinion would make the game less grindy, more fun and at least have the endgame fight not be as fun as bashing your balls with a brick wall, down to simply "bashing your balls with your fists".

>>145748069
Note that you can add those potions to the shops and change their depth to make them more common super easily by just editing a text file. Not much, but its definitely something.

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>>145747846
It's gonna be okay anon.
It's gonna be okay.

>>145748150
Yeah, I remember a dude annoyed at how much it took to grind *healing* doing that some months ago.

>>145747857
I played a Jedi which was pretty fun but the window sizes were fucked on a bigger screen.
I could've probably tried tinkering with the .ini but I felt I'd rather play PCB instead.

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>anon will never ever stop being upset about poschengband

PosChengband? More like PozChengband.

Cause the game is AIDS.

>>145747857
It's pretty fun, but it's also pretty broken

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>>145748514
You got that right.

>>145748514
Anon you did this one already.

>>145748514
I still prefer "PozCumButt"

Grinder?
I hardly even know her.

Is turning off virtues /rlg/ approved?

>>145748665
Only if you're scum.

Rapier?
I hardly even know her.

>>145748637
You have to be some kind of weirdo to get cumbutt from chengband.

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>>145748638
Not an argument.

>>145748702
>>145709941

>>145748665
virtues are annoying at worst and useless at best.

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Heh.

>>145749091
>/rlg/ on morality

>>145749091
But without virtues you can't get "What a noble sacrifice!" on your splat screen so I don't get how anyone could play without them.

Tonberry monk of nature seems pretty solid. Any way to fill the *confusion weakness? At least with androids you can find Indra but not having confusion resistance seems pretty awful.

>>145750084
You'll still get resist when you find items with it but it's halved.
Confusion breath isn't very powerful though so mostly it's just going to be an annoyance.
Remember to carry enough !ccw

>>145750084
>ATATATATATATATA on a race with no blows
I dont like how you think

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>>145750084
>not doing the ultimate tonberry meme combo
I swear I'll kill Athena for what she's done.

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>>145698690
Missed you

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>>145750327
They get fuckhuge damage though and stunning.

>>145750327
>ATATATATATATATA on a race with no blows
The monk blows bonus synergizes with the tonberry race blows malus so you get around 1 blow/10 levels and a total of 7 blows at level 50.
http://angband.oook.cz/ladder-show.php?id=17076

>>145750401
ninjas are good but ultimately 0healing is a fucking pain in the ass

>>145750438
>and a total of 7 blows at level 50.
Not anymore, see >>145750408

>>145750516
Ah I see. Well 1 blow/10 levels still stands at least.

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>get sick of splatting Troll Wizards in ADoM
>roll up a Troll Beastfighter instead, because Troll Unarmed is the best
>head straight to Small Cave because this isn't a serious game and I just want to screw around seeing how far I can get before I die
>after killing stuff for a while, quaff ID my potions
>immediately realize one of them was exchange when what is possibly the most ideal switch possible(To->Le, Dx->To) happens
This started as a fun little thing, but now I'm Doctor Doom and I don't know how to use this newfound power responsibly.

What should I do?
>tfw you can't even read

>>145750810
Eat a librarian or sage of some sort to get the reading intrinsic.

>>145751009
Just like Gastronok.

In PCB, what has the highest impact on the damage you deal? Is it your level, proficiency or maybe stats?

>>145751283
Of those three, it's your stats usually.
Some race/classes have attacks that scale with their level though. So for monks/dragons and of course if you're casting it's level-based.

>>145751454
Cool. I'm rolling with an Ent Monk of Nature at the moment and wasn't sure what determines the unarmed damage

>>145751693
Just check (C)haracter and (M)elee to see the spreadsheet.

>>145745803
Not in my version :^)

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>>145752872
I tried that one you uploaded but it gives some error.
Is it not pre-compiled?

>>145750401
>>not doing the ultimate tonberry meme combo
you mean tonberry android?

>>145753104
There may be shit wrong with it, I've made multiple changes since then including fixing some things that blocked compilation on VS2010. If anyone's interested I can upload a new binary and/or the source.

>>145753429
I'd really appreciate it.

>>145753490
Ok, it will probably be a little while since I'm at work right now and that takes priority but I'll get one up this morning.

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>DDA
>find some rotten vegetables
>dehydrate them and suddenly they're fine to eat