Which is better

>>389945318
trick question?

>>389945318
at least ff xv is not always a straight tube

At least FFXV has gracious amounts of tits

I haven't seen any slammin legs in the game on the right

Gonna have to give to XV by a slight margin

XIII had a complete story at launch and no car-drive filler.

>>389945767
>complete story
NOTHING happens between roughly hours 2-20

>>389945793
Sounds like XV to me.

>>389945318
XV is better but they are both still shit compared to the previous FF games.

>>389945856
XIII has:
>better visuals
>better gameplay

XV has:
>best gameplay of the series
>one of the best soundtracks
>the best ending of the series

Story, characters, visuals, map, music of XV.

Setting, battle system, waifus off XIII.

>>389945318
13.

>>389945921
>best gameplay of the series
Wut.

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FF13 has Sazh
FFXV has Ignis

It's a pretty hard choice desu

Is FF becoming like that Zelda theory we have people suddenly praising the next-to-last installment of the series whilst the new one gains popularity?

>>389946104
Zelda theory has never worked.
There's just always been a loud minority of people bashing each of the games, then being shocked when a number of other folks don't share their meme opinions about specific titles.

>>389946028
Turn-based is a bad system

>>389945921
>best gameplay of the series

No that belongs to X-2, though I am loathe to complement that game for anything.

And while I do think that the ending is quite good, I feel like it didn't earn it. Going back to Insomnia feels like something that should have been a pretty big moment, the triumphant return and all that, but while it's "going back" to Insomnia for the cast for us it is the first time we've ever gone to it, and we've only access to a very small portion of it. A straight street with a detour through a subway.

It tries to hit you with the big feels with the camp scene and the afterlife imagery but although it did resonate with me I know that it bloody didn't set it all up well enough and I just hate its guts for that. Call me picky or something, I don't really care.

>>389946104
Not because Zelda is always good at the very least while FF has had nothing but utter garbage in the past 16 years.

>>389946250
Final Fantasy X is better than Dragon Quest VIII.

>>389946217
And a clunky realtime action combat with unreliable warps and suicidal AI teammates is any better?

>>389946317
That's arguable, but in any case it was the last good FF game. And the last actual FF, for that matter.

>>389946396
Yes. Any degree of Action combat and control is far superior to turn-based and XV's, while clunky, has enough nuance to put it head and heels over any of the other entries' gameplay.

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>>389946317
this is actually is a hard choice

>>389946601
>it was the last good FF game
true
> the last actual FF
ehhhhhhh
While the fanboy in me wants to agree, the realist in me understands that some of the complaints levied against it (ATB, no worldmap) are kind of valid.

>>389945318
Both are pretty decent.

>>389946601
I think XII was still on par with the rest of the series despite its issues.

XIII and XV could have been amazing but both are unfinished so they are only mid-tier.

>>389946601
That was 9 actually. X was a huge departure in so many ways. The airship was a fucking menu for christsake.

>>389945318
XV but honestly not by very much.

>>389945318
FFXV. It was way more ambitious and it didn't take 20 hours for things to finally get started, however it still has some glaring flaws.

>>389946865
>It didn't take 20 hours for things to finally get started
Come on anon it took maybe 10-15 before anything resemblance of a story came up in XV.

>>389945318
>FFXIII has Vanille, Fang, Serah and Lightning
>FFXV has Cindy, Aranea ,Iris and Lunafreya
i can't choose.

>>389946975
The only issues with XV's story are Chapters 5 or 6-9

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XV had better concepts, world & characters, but poorly executed & unfinished

13 was executed quite well overall & told a polished story, but the world & characters were boring

There is just way more potential for XV, people still get butthurt about Versus 13/XV 2013 E3 because they know the game can be way better than what we got, while the foundation for 13 was meh since the start

>>389945318
XIV

>>389947125
>& told a polished story
Chapters 3-8 had next to nothing happening

>>389945921
>best gameplay of the series
Nope
>one of the best soundtracks
Still wrong. No offense to Shimomura, but she should not have gotten full reign on this soundtrack. Even Nakano and Hamauzu was able to make a game fit with the melody and theme heavy sound signature that Uematsu set to the series.

Compare Somnus to Liberi Fatali in both elements and lyrics.
Liberi Fatali applies directly to all parts of the games overarching themes, even the anagram of Fithos Lusec Wecos Vinosec works. Whereas Somnus has three lines that applies to the story and then spins into what is audibly pleasing.

>the best ending of the series
Noctis and waifu are together in the afterlife and so many people thought that the boy band was dead that Tabata had to mention after the fact that they were still alive. I'm not saying it wasn't the best ending, because it certainly is the biggest attempt to animate the "after the fact". But XV tries to go straight for the payoff with absolutely no buildup. Much like the campfire scene. I wasn't emotionally invested. I don't think people would be wrong for saying it was cheap.

>>389947098
I honestly don't think the overall story of XV is bad, it's just incredibly rushed and chunks are in other pieces of media. It's a shame really.

>>389947054
You actually get more than an hour of XIII's female cast.

>>389947306
>Compare Somnus to Liberi Fatali in both elements and lyrics.
I certainly think Somnus is a far better song than Liberi Fatali.

>>389945318

XV is better but only because XIII is a low-tier game
That being said, XV had (and kinda still does) huge potential to all of it aspects, but for the most part underdelivered on most of them.

Thanks to meme-engine and meme-mentality to appease to western fags trying to stay relevant overseas.
worst thing is, it actually worked

>>389945318
XIII is not only the WORST FF game, but one of the worst games I've ever played

>>389947595
Both XIII and XV run on meme-engines.

>>389947523
I agree, while I love Liberi Fatali, Somnus was just a bit more emotional. The LACK of complexity in terms of instruments is what made it such a great track in my opinion.

also I don't give a shit about the lyrics for Somnus because I actually prefer the instrumental more.

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>>389945318
XV had the better villain if you ask me. So going with XV.

>>389945921
Even LR has better gameplay. Why are so many idiots blinded by XVs style over substance warp fest.
It has some of the worst balance in the series and the patches made it even worse

>>389947639
Good battle system though.

>>389947845
LR gameplay isn't that good and it's still fundamentally turn-based/ATB.

>>389947306
To be fair Somnus was written for Versus XIII which was basically a completely different game

XIII-2>LR>XV>XIII

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>>389947776
Wrong.

>>389947880
So?
I'd rather have that than XVs system. If you maek an ARPG at least fucking try to balance your game so you don't get through 90% of the content by using two buttons, warp strikes, regroup and if you want it really easy magic nukes.
It's the most style over substance shit ever, worse than Kingdom Hearts on easy.
If people really think this is amazing then it just shows how blind players are these days, FF is finished

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>>389947306
>Liberi Fatali applies directly to all parts of the games overarching themes, even the anagram of Fithos Lusec Wecos Vinosec works. Whereas Somnus has three lines that applies to the story and then spins into what is audibly pleasing.

I think this is more due to tracks like Somnus and Omnis Lacrima are made when the game was still Versus, and had a very different thing going on to XV.

And Shimomura didn't really have full reign on the OST. If she had, I'd say the OST as a whole would've been way more consistent, and in my opinion, straight up better.

if i was asked to choose between ff13 and a horse ramming his cock in my butt, i would choose the horse(no homo) anything is better than that game.

and come on, ff15 isn't that bad. if i was a fan that waited 10 years for ff15, yea, i would be disappointed. if you play the game casually hovewer, it is quite fun. it is like "8 chapter just walk around, chill" and "7 chapter, ok now complete the story". story telling is shit, game is rushed but still, if you just relax a bit it is a fun game to play.(unlike the final torture 13)

>>389948042
Any ARPG is better than any turn-based game and XV's system has enough nuance that it's by far a better game to play than any previous FF.
>>389948050
While it's true she had people arranging and orchestrating for her it's very clear that the melodies and whatnot are all hers. They all follow her style. She's still fundamentally the primary composer.

Go ahead and look up the credits for FFX and I believe it would be a similar picture.

>>389947317
The overall story of XV is all over the fucking place and nothing in it is explained in depth. Datalogs are one thing but at least they existed to get background information in the lore. You bounce between so many major objectives that it boggles the mind. Besides that, there are things that make no sense. How does Iris have the physical strength necessary to fight monsters that people trained from birth to fight struggle to deal with.

And the segment with her is so short that I wonder why they bothered to add it anyways.

More then that, there are so many themes
>Get royal arms
>get summons
>Get ring
>Get Luna

Luna's death scene in particular was nowhere near as impactful as they wanted it to be because her onscreen presence was... a bit thin to say the least. More then that it's the story of the entire game. Your father dying. Ignis going blind off screen. (Though they actually did the blind ally thing right so points for that. It actually did have emotional impact). What the fuck happened to Ravus

All this shit had to happen off screen. and had to be fixed off screen because the game is an unfinished mess with severe pacing issues. It gets worse because they don't sufficiently enough to build up Noctis as a character. So here you have some man who has literally everything given to him from cook, to bodyguard, to best friend, to being married to second prettiest bachelorette, and the strongest power in that world bitching about royal duty. It's maddening. Like you really have to try hard to empathize things like point of view when that tension is going on between him and Gladiolus and Gladiolus is justifiable pissed off. Like FUCK man.

I could type entire books about XV's story presentation problems.
and it'd still pale in comparison to the problems it has mechanically as a game through it's combat

>>389947523
Do you like it better than dragonsong?

>>389947306
You can tell that it wasn't 100% her OST and that Nomura left.
People can give Nomura all the shit they want, but he actually sits down and listens to every track together with Shimomura for hours and improve them until they both like them.
Most of the tracks up until 2014 are so clearly written during the V13 days.
A lot of other tracks are way too over the top or go through like 5 phases and sound like 3 different videogames

>>389947854
Smash X to win

Sure

>>389948198
It's really not. In fact because of the chaining system it's one of the least smash x to win. FF10 is the epitome of smash X to win. FF7 is bad for that shit too off the top of my head.

>>389948161
>any ARPG is better than any turn-based game
Dawn of Mana says hi

>>389948180
Fair enough points, anon.

>>389946250
FF Type 0 was fucking GOTY, and the "real FF15" as far as I'm concerned.

FF13 trilogy also was superb, and way better than the trash that was 15, 12, or any of the MMOs.

>>389947880
>LR gameplay isn't that good
I disagree but fine, that's a difference of opinion
>it's still fundamentally turn-based/ATB
Fuck no. The most you could say is that it's a melding of ATB and real-time combat leaning very heavily towards real time but it has pretty much no elements of turn-based combat. Even then, it's more like a real-time game with a stamina system.

>>389948180
>You can tell that it wasn't 100% her OST
Totally disagree, I hear her in every single fucking track of the game. What tracks don't sound like her?

>>389948305
Having played it I completely disagree with the Stamina system comparison. It felt way more restrictive than that

>>389945921
>one of the best soundtracks
Ha no

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>FF "objective opinions"
You're lucky that xv-kun isn't here

>>389948171
>Second prettiest bachelorette

Nigga that first better be Iris.

>>389948369
Where's he been lately?

>>389948356
Uematsu has some duds, dude. You just don't remember them.

Both have problems that just make them mediocre.
What i hated the most about XV that it has aboslutely no endgame/postgame content except for that platforming dungeon. No optional summons, just tons of reskin hunts etc.
And one "super boss" that is also just a reskin and just instakills you with a huge laser hitbox so you just end up doing the same 2-3 thins you did through the whole game because it works the best in every situation

I'd rather replay Lost Odyssey over both of them

>>389948374
A man who was given a choice between aranea and iris and chose iris is no man at all.

>>389948275
>ff10 is the epitome of smash X to win
You what? Out of every final fantasy there is the least X smashing
>Enemy resistances that different in approach by stats
>resistances that can be broken with abilities to circumvent the dynamic
>speed and evasion mattering as does resistances
>promotes cycling all non kimahri characters to solve different problems before you turn Kimahri into a fucking beast

Even shit like blind was useful in 10. Out of every final fantasy before it, it had the biggest emphasis on using all tools your party brought.
>Fight seymour
>have to cleanse zombie and/or apply shell to survive his big attack
>the entirety of dealing with jecht even if you overlevel the part because the blocks get stronger based on overkill damage

7 was indeed (mostly) smash X to win against everything but the weapons, but made up for this with it's materia preparation phase that could literally make or break you in any given fight and gets better the more you're aware of the options available per fight.

XV has none of this. Get around the enemy and land blindside-linkstrikes, use your techniques when you get meter. You sure as hell can make yourself look good by putting off killing things to dance around in the air, but the direct approach is the only approach you need. It doesn't hurt that you will never ever be in danger of dying because of the phoenix down grace period.

>>389948578
Most of my early to mid game enemies is the simon says bullshit where you swap to the character the game tells you to removing all strategy. The last game is hastega followed my smashing quick hit.

FF10 was a system built with puzzle bosses in mind like Yunalesca, then it proceeds to only have like 2 such bosses.

>>389948542
Those duds generally amount to individual songs. Even among soundtracks exclusively done by Shimomura there are problems. Comparing this to Parasite Eve and Legend of Mana is one thing. But it is completely crushed by her work on Luminous Arc 2.

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>>389948469
He was banned 5-6 times in two days and had all his posts deleted then he just went back to twitter. He showed up once here for one huge wall of text though.
https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&vertical=default&q=_bazztek&src=typd

>>389948575
Aranea wasn't really in the running for Bachelorette. Plus Iris is an S rank cute.

That being said I want to be drinking buddies with Aranea.

>>389948703
Cute is garbage. Cute is the girl you ignore when the beautiful girl walks over.

>>389948578
X is just a match game. There's no creativity, strategy, or fun in it.
>flying enemy, use Wakka
>flan, use Lulu
>dog, use Tidus
etc., it's just as mindless as VII and back but with extra button presses.
>>389948678
I haven't heard those soundtracks of hers but compared to the ones I know: SMRPG, KH series, Mario & Luigi, I think this is her 2nd best or best work depending on KH2.

>>389948345
It was restrictive sure, but undoubtedly real-time. There are no turns at all, you have full 3D movement even if it's slow, there's dodging and blocking. Literally everything happens in real time.

>>389948469
I spoke a couple of weeks ago with him on Gamefaqs before that I saw him shitting on Gematsu under the nickname Starscourge.

>>389948310
Not him, but the Apocalypsis tracks doesn't sound like anything I've ever heard from her.

Some of the field themes feels way too ambient too. Whilst not being bad, I've never actually thought for her to make those kind of tracks. Everything I've heard from her has always been super melodic. Also, it's kind of a meme, but the whole strings and piano thing is sorely missing in a lot of tracks as well. It might just be me, but listening to KH, legend of Mana, Mario RPG tracks, and even SF2 tracks, there's always this focus on central tunes, I guess. Something that's absent in a good number of XV's tracks.

>>389948856
>Not him, but the Apocalypsis tracks doesn't sound like anything I've ever heard from her.
It sounds perfectly in her style to me. What happened is she was asked, similar to Hollywood composers, to match a temp track (in this case, Dragonborn).

You know she's done this before, right?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17xoI7cnfCI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzVBqBosf5w

>>389948856
>>389948956
As for the ambient themes, in terms of melody they sound right up her alley. But I'm sure to necessitate the open-world feel they asked for the different variants in meter. For instance, Wanderlust goes from the tempoless flute+strings into that driving banjo+flute. The latter half is pure Shimomura.

I think most of XV's tracks that aren't in cutscenes have very, very clear tunes in them. Just as much as KH2.

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>>389947125
>told a polished story

>A pink haired soldier who is part of a genocidal campaign who has no internal strife or even emotions as to what she is doing is suddenly stunned at how shit her surprise birthday party by her sister. In other circumstances her sister apparently catches the aids of those the pink haired soldier had vowed to hunt mercilessly.

>In a change of "heart" she then turns to help her sister escape the genocidal campaign (without much hesitation at all) against her former employees and governing body while accompanying others who wish to escape the genocide.

>after 20 hours of corridors, perceived lesbianism, a chocobo, a naruto character, a whining shota fuccboi, a respectable black man, a rejected barbie doll, a monotone asexual adrogenous in nature pink haired toblerone locker and mums are tough the game ends by fighting a giant pokemons father/mother and then CRYSTALS

>>389948578
>FF VII
>materia being relevant in anyway
This is coming from a huge 7fag: materia is borderline useless.
You don't have to prepare for shit in that game. Literally all you need s cure + all and haste + all and you're set. Or simply a well equipped e. skill, if you know what you're doing.
Apart the weapons there is a total of 3 enemies during the story that might pose a threat: numberless (or whatever its name is in english, which gives you Odin, not really a story boss, but the first boss you encounter that can be toigh and needs proper materia), the second Don Corneo boss monster (the wutai one, hard because you're robbed of cure + all, not even a story boes either, as well) and lastly the only mandatory boss is the robot thing you fight before getting the submarine, bevazwe you can be unlucky with his grabs.
That's it. The rest of the bosses can easily be spammed with attack and limits so long as you can heal yourself.

The materia system could be used in creative and awesome ways, problem being you get the interesting stuff way too late and most of the game you're severely limited with your materia slots.

>>389948747
You probably only like Aranea for her two huge Dragoons.

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>go to tenebrae
>can't go in tenebrae
>go to altissia
>altissia's theme is not the music
>somnus
>literally when does it play
FFXV for the best soundtrack that is not in the game.

>>389949250
>>somnus
>>literally when does it play
Apparently you didn't play the game because there's an entire fucking area of the game where it constantly plays.

>>389948671
>puzzle bosses
Technically all bosses are puzzle bosses that you can solve, doubly so for your bonus bosses. There's always two approaches, the straightforward one and then alternative route.

You don't have to use any of the breaks, armor break included, but the game gives you the option to and rewards you for doing so. As does the entire overkill system. Allow me to explain with this anons post

>>389948771
>flying enemy,
Sleep, Slow, magic
>flan
Armour Break
>dog
magic, sleep, Riku

If at any point you've played through the game and thought to yourself "kimahri is useful" than you really never learned the system at all.

Anyways since we're here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5c6IqP8zh8
Song of Mana was done by her and is featured on memoria
She also did the soundtrack for live a live and has a special place for Megalomania, apparently.

Parasite Eve is fucking beautiful making heavy use of leitmotifs spinning from this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-rZINtPwzY
and this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_9_tcuxe6o

>>389948310
Not that guy, but Hellfire for example
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTQ2fwUOxe0
Imo the only great parts of it are the first 25 seconds and 3:54 - 4:15
Later parts even sound like Elder Scrolls meets Pirates of the Carribean. The track just goes through too many different phases, Magna Insomnia has the same problem
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YniJ8FVp3Lg
Not like Shimomura has one particular style to begin with, it's not like SF2, Mario RPG and P.E. sound like XV. XV just sounds a lot like KH in many places, which kinda makes sense considering where the game development started.

The bigger problem of the OST though is how it's used. Some tracks only play for a few seconds or tracks like Omnis play way too many times for every big enemy.

>>389949167
>you get the interesting stuff way too late and most of the game you're severely limited with your materia slots.
No arguing with that.

I remember I killed all of the weapons by making my max hp 7777 and having my death use phoenix. I cheesed sephiroth with knights of the round and mimic.

>>389949220
Nah, her overall look. I prefer a mature look to someone like Iris. Plus her personality is much more appealing.

>>389949335
>If at any point you've played through the game and thought to yourself "kimahri is useful" than you really never learned the system at all.
Kimahri can get endgame White Magic before Yuna and makes Yunalesca significantly easier.

>>389949596
Oh fuck me I mean to say *useless
God damn it. I've fucked up that entire post

>>389949578
Maybe if you're into that ara ara

>>389949335
I'm aware of the basics of the system, they just could have done a lot more with it. Same with the sphere grid, illusion of choice at its finest. Each character should have had a seperate grid that emphasized their class.

Honestly 13 makes debuffs and status effects more useful than X ever did and I genuinely prefer its combat system.

>>389949665
She has a personality other than "I sure do love you and my oniichaaann.

>>389949285
Oh yeah at the end for the last corridor, a little light for the main theme of the game.
People where sold a dream with those tracks not a game.

I liked Lost Odyssey a lot, at least it had some shit to do late in the game and optional super weapons etc. like some older FFs

>>389945921
>best gameplay of the series
literally end yourself

>>389949737
Nice backpedalling, kid.

>>389949781
>liking turn-based
u2friend

>>389945318
FF13 is my second favourite FF, FF15 I stopped playing after 5 hours. Make of that what you will.

>>389949794
Idiot, i was merely pretending all this time.

>>389949335
>If at any point you've played through the game and thought to yourself "kimahri is useful" than you really never learned the system at all.

Stop talking shit about my husband.

Kimahri can be basically anything you want him to be. He can be another mage, another hard hitter, but most importantly, he can learn Steal before you get Rikku. You can steal Lv 3 Keyspheres which are quite rare (during that portion of the game) in the Yenke and Biran fight as well.

If we talk about useless, anyone except Tidus, Wakka and Rikku are useless if you are pushing for the optional content. But if you play just the regular vanilla route, all of the characters are viable because all of them can go to each others sphere grids to nab whatever they want. The only difference is base stats and overdrives.

>>389949832
I'm so sorry to hear that babby's first FF was one of the worst

>>389949727
If you recall Iris turns into a famous demon hunter.

>>389949671
>illusion of choice
Maybe for end game when everybody is going to have everybody maxed
Illusion of choice is the crystarium system in XIII. You will go along this path and you will branch out to get the abilities. To not do so is stupid.

X had very real implications of every single bubble you took, doubly so for the master grid since NOT taking status nodes had the same effect of kneecapping you. In regards to debuffs, I would be inclined to debate this if you couldn't outright murder everything with magic. Or if there were more reliable ways to inflict status ailments.

In reference to utility abilities you either don't need them or can't choose how you use and in what order. Shity like inflicting undead and flinging a phoenix down is not an option available to you. Neither are the smaller things like blind. You can't even afflict the mindflayers with silence. Your actual status ailment pool is extremely small and even more situational and the overwhelming majority of them apply to you and NOT your enemies in all aspects, not just bosses.

>>389950135
No please stop... I meant to say useless...

>>389945318
15 is great. 13 is great. In some many different ways. It'd be wrong to compare them. 13 was more fun on recollection, because it was Incredibly complex, but 15 was more fun when I was playing, only realizing how shallow it was afterwards.

>>389950276
X's sphere grid straightened out is basically the same shit as the crystarium. It just looks more complicated than it is at least until people are done their section.

13 doesn't even have mind flayers dude. The debuffs and buffs etc are definitely more useful than they were in X in that game. Do you think I'm talking about 15? That's the most recent game with mind flayers.

>>389945921
>XIII has better gameplay
>XV has best gameplay of the series
??????

>>389950504
True, the original sphere grid is full of options you're going to take no matter what during your first playthrough. The expert grid is not. You can never deviate from your first 20 hours of crystarium filling everything up in order because you have more points than slots available.

Meanwhile in the first 20 hours of X you can take your points wherever you want them to go

But yes I thought you were talking about XV, sorry In reference to XIII I agree wholeheartedly about status ailments with some exceptions.

You certainly NEED to use them a lot more.

>>389950624
XIII was a step in the right direction.
XV IS the right direction

>>389946615
>Any degree of Action combat and control is far superior to turn-based and XV's, while clunky, has enough nuance to put it head and heels over any of the other entries' gameplay.
But XII isn't entirely turn based and LR is just plain better than XV.
Also
>spam items2win
>nuance

Is it weird that I get a Takeharu Ishimoto feel from XV's ost? As far as I know, they guy's not involved, or at least not credited anywhere, but there's this feel of him I can't shake from some of the tracks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_CsijQsYY4
>great solid battle theme
>never hear again after 12% of the game
Fucking why. WHY
WHY

>>389950847
I forgot Takeharu Ishimoto composed music for Final Fantasy.

Literally Crisis Core is one of my favorite soundtracks how the fuck am I so retarded I forgot him?

>>389950792
XII is more or less turn-based ATB with free movement

>>389948161
>Any ARPG is better than any turn-based game
Is this XV kun's new tactic?

>this assassin creed clue thing can't be that hard, right?
>four hours later
>fuck this shit, a shield isn't worth all that crap
>never did find the rainbow frogs either

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>>389945921
>best gameplay of the series

>>389950784
nigger, how does XIII have better gameplay if you think XV has the best gameplay? (you're wrong by the way, XV is dogshit)

>>389948578
>XV has none of this.
XV is literally hold O to win and heal as necessary.

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>>389950419
>13 was more fun on recollection, because it was Incredibly complex
>13
>Incredibly complex

Incredibly bad and obtrusive story telling doesn't mean complex

>>389951104
Isn't every single FF game like this?

>>389950984
>>389951029
How many times do I have to post "any ARPG is better than turn-based" in this thread for you fucking teenagers who don't know how to read

>>389951153
Not according to the well constructed arguments in this thread.

>>389951140
Not just talking about the story, anon.

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>>389951153
n-no!

>>389951140
He's talking about the combat. And he's not wrong in that regard. Because it was the most complex combat had been up to that point.

XIII is a better product than XV.

>>389951213
Then they're wrong, because literally every single final fantasy game boils down to attack while healing with the few occasional "immune to this" or "use this one specific tactic to win."

>>389951174
How many times do you have to say that for it to become true? The answer is that your statement will always be wrong.

And you still haven't explained how the fuck you can say XIII has better gameplay and then go on to say XV has the best gameplay when those are mutually exclusive statements.

>>389950938
>XII is more or less turn-based ATB with free movement
And much better than XV.

>>389951174
Are you literally retarded? How can you compare two things and say they both have better gameplay than the other?

>>389951292
XIII is better turn-based than they have ever done.

XV is better combat than they have ever done.
>>389951436
Because menus aren't gameplay.

>>389951218
>Not just talking about the story, anon.
the story is shit and stupid, nothing complex about it

and gameplay
>the gameplay consist of running down a corridor, smashing x between two paradigms until you stagger and wait for things to die

then what the fuck are you talking about then, anon.

>>389951523
>XIII is better turn-based than they have ever done.
>XV is better combat than they have ever done.
That's not what you said though. Maybe you should spend less time posting stupid shit on the internet and more time learning English. Retard.

>>389951153
Yes, but >>389948578 said XV wasn't.

>>389951290
∀x(x->smashattacktowin)
DoD: All games
X= final fantasy

>literally all final fantasies boil down to attack while healing with the few occasional "immune to this"
Final Fantasy 1 didn't deviate from smashing attack because of immunities
Final Fantasy XV gives you movement
Final Fantasy XIII has a break system

Therefore your statement is false.

>>389950938
12's system combined with 13's would be the best RPG battle system in existence.

>>389951639
Right so i move to win in XV, right? That's what i do. I don't smash. I move. That's how I win.

>>389951659
I'm not sure those two things can be combined unless you mean 13's combat and free movement combined with the ability to set gambits.

>>389951756
You didn't state that moving was a thing you also had to do. You stated that literally every final fantasy is smash attack and heal to win.
Besides this is just a joke anyways. I never took your argument seriously anon, lighten up.

>>389945318
13 becuase i still dont understand the clusterfuck combat mechanics that are in 15

>>389949069
This. I finished XIII but forced myself. It was turd from start to finish.

XV's plot was just lazy and cut up but you can see the original plans thtough the tidbits that survived and those were about to be the best Final Fantasy ever made.

Its really a shame because if the game didnt have such rough development, if FFXIV 1.0 wasnt such a failure, FFXV could've been the game to redefine the genre of JRPGs. The core concepts are unique and charming, the characterization is good, the lire is pretty fascinating, the artstyle is sublime.

Its really shitty because the game has a cool start and a powerful ending but there was absolutely no buildup to it so it loses momentum. Why was the platinum demo not a part of the game? Why was the romance between Luna and Noct so barebones and lukewarm? Why was there hours upon hours of nothing between story missions which were pretty stale and short anyways?
Why were the sidequests so repetitive and shitty? Why was I supposed to care in that photo about all the vast that got about 15 minutes of screentime each? Who yhe fuck even cared about Talcott? Why was Cor so absent from most of the game? Why was regis a 2 minute cutscene and a montage? He's a hyped character, the king, and the Noct's father.
Why was the Emperor and that professor you barely ever see so weak and lacking in presence?
Why do I need to watch a movie to give even the slightest bit of a damn about anything?
Why is an random old lady NPC supposed to close plot hole gaps that change alot about Ravus?
Why didnt we have flashbacks to Insomnia? I never even see a Kingsglaive other than Gladio.

I often say XV suffers from the Phantom Pain syndrome - a game with immense potential and story hidden underneath the surface, yet we are only exposed to tidbits of it, wondering where the actual game went.

>>389951659
12 understood one of the most important aspects of making a good combat system: a variety of useful and interesting options with no definitively best answers, something FF has struggled with since Tactics.

>>389946615
>Any degree of Action combat and control is far superior to turn-based
Stop posting any time

>>389951861
Imagine it
>free roaming combat
>with the ability to set more than one command
>by end game, setting up to 7 commands at once
>but controlling all characters at once

>>389951936
LR already has the best RPG battle system in existence.

>>389951936
13 did this well too. 12 still has katana spam in late games.

>>389952139
That game is so fucking good.

>>389952079
>but controlling all characters at once

>one person controlling 3 things all at the same time
I'm not ready to be turned into a potato from mental overload anon.

>>389952139
Fug, wrong reply
Meant >>389951659

The localization and shitty dub destroyed XIII. I preordered it when it first came out and hated the senseless story, the annoying characters, and the dull gameplay. But I recently replayed it in Japanese and holy shit it was like a different game entirely. So fucking much was lost in translation. The only real downside left was the insane grind the game forces you through, but fortunately PC and cheat engine solved that too.

Both games have their strengths and weaknesses. XIII is more complete, with a better story, but ultimately I enjoyed XV more.

>>389952143
>12 still has katana spam in late games.
Katana rules vanilla XII, but it is by no means the only good option in IZJS or Zodiac Age.

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I legit loved all recent FF games.
XII
XIII
XV
But if I was to pick one that would be XV

>>389952014
You too turn-based child

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>mfw memers STILL say xiii is the worst
>when games like ii, v, and ix exist

>>389951925
-the platinum demo was Noctis' coma after he was attacked by the snake fiend as a kid. This was not a necessary part of the story and so was cut
-Luna and Noct are bound by fate and Duty. They don't necessarily have to love each other, but they do like each other.
-there wasn't. If you skipped the optional stuff, you could go straight from story to story with no long breaks.
-they're the same as the hunts that has been prevalent since 12. But there are some that also builds the core cast of NPC's integral to the group.
-because you were supposed to spend time with them in the optional missions
-the cast likes him, and by extension, you were supposed to as well
-it retains his mystique as a mythical figure
-what he does is not important, only that he was a wise and noble King and Noctis' father
-he has no power, he's just a puppet ruler
-you don't. The movie ever hypes up the ring, which the game also does already
-because, like in real life, people aren't just going to explain their motivations to you in a convenient matter right before some world changing event. Sometimes they just do things and you just have to piece the clues together
-the flashbacks were a bad idea. I liked the idea of not having flashbacks because you can't flashback what you can't see. Also, the Kingsglaive guards the king. If the king dies, I'd assume so did all the Kingsglaive, since they wouldn't let the king die unless they did too. Also also, you could find Ulric's knife.

>>389952679
>V
>bad
>WORSE than XIII
what the fuck

>>389952216
What's different in the original language? I liked Sazh, Snow and Fang as they were. Lightning was ok, I disliked vanille and hope.

>>389952679
>V and IX
>among the worst
good bait

>>389952197
Nah, LR's combat is too easily exploitable. It stops being fun and starts being a seizure inducing number spam.

>>389952718
II is worse than xiii. This is straight up objective fact.
>get the ultima ability and it ends up being a disappointment that doesn't work because "life is like that sometimes"
No fuck you. II is ass.

>>389953187
You're the only one talking about II here, retard.

>>389953304
>retard.
Why you gotta be so rude.

>>389953407
because you're being retarded

>>389945318
>choose between a shit sandwich and diarrhea soup

>>389953485
Fair enough.

>>389945318
I liked the main party in XV at least.
XIII has more depth in gameplay technically, but in practice they're equally boring to play.

>>389952680
> If you cut additional parts that explore the characters more, you made a minimal story with characters no one cares about. The only way to remedy this is to create events that make characters explore themselves and go into exposition on their own in. The one time the characters show development in FFXV its forced af.
Also by that logic the Luna and Noct flashbacks arent important either. Its not consistent, its just half baked.
> How does this have anything to do with the romance being shit? I know their roles, its still bad romance.
>If you dont play the game its okay
Nice. Most of chapters 2-9 nothing important happens.
And FFXII gets ragged on for it among other things. And no, go collect a doll or a part for an NPC isnt enough to build relationships with the CORE CAST.
>See above. Also, now im supposed to do the side missions? Even thou you said if I go from story to story its okay?
>Being supposed to like someone and actually making me like him are different things and are part of why FFXV's story fails.
>No it doesnt, and he's not mythical, Noct and pals dont treat him as such.
> Thats your words. The story makes you think otherwise. Who even said he was wise?
> Irrelevant to the fact he IS an important character.
NO, it hypes up the whole idea of Insomnia's importance and the people that live in it, rather than just a backdrop in the world map.

> Yet that is exactly what happened, only it was delivered by a random NPC because Tabata wrote himself into a hole. You are being intentionally dense. That is not good storytelling. Real life isnt a good story to tell.
{ Fair enough about Kingsglaive. I meant flashbacks for Noctis. And the game does have flashbacks for characters that arent Noct. And those only help the story. You are not Noct, even if you play as him.

>>389952643

Imagine being such a brainlet you fear away from anything allowing a deeper level of strategy

>>389954815
Everything shouldve been in quote arrows, please excuse the messy post.

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>>389954890
>deeper level of strategy
Anon, not even that guy, but come on now

>>389954890
> deeper level of strategy

By fact you are not at a deeper level of strategy. You removed reflex and timing.

If you take chess and make it be played in real time or ATB it becomes a much harder game to play as you need to think of the quickest viable route that is also good instead of the optimally best one.

>>389945318
12

>>389954890
Planning and executing a strategy in real time can be just as complex but also add reflexes. I love turn based games, but don't act like the FF series is some tactically deep series.

>>389955156
So ATB is the deepest battle system?

>>389955156
Not who you're talking to but:
>You removed reflex and timing.
Lightning Returns has that

>timing
There is no timing in XV. Let's be realistic

>>389955253

I'm not talking about FF actually, just turn based. I like SRPGs and DRPGs. SRPGs are more complex and strategic than any ARPG

>>389955464
Lightning Returns is not turn based.

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>>389955464
>There is no timing in XV.

>>389955561
They can be. Something like disgaea is pretty much devoid of strategy though.

I like both action and turn based and it's ridiculous seeing them constantly have autistic slap fights.

>>389955702
True enough point.
XIII has reflex and timing as well.

>swap to sentinel for big attacks
>ravagaer to do big damage
>staying in healing stances the minimal amount of time necessary to heal

>>389955750
Parrying is reflexes, anon. Though I feel like we're going to get way off topic on this so I'll head this off by saying you're right.

>>389955762
>I like both action and turn based and it's ridiculous seeing them constantly have autistic slap fights.
That's what happens when you take 29 years of history and throw it out the door.

Dragon Quest doesn't seem to be afflicted with the same lunacy that made this decision at Square.

>>389955948
I've only played Dragon Quest VIII but that is not good turn-based gameplay.

I only got to the castle after the cave, because I was so sick of grinding for every single fucking dungeon. There's no strategy you just have to level up until you can auto-kill them

man this is clearly the best OST

listen to this shit it's so fucking enjoyable
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyXpRFZNOQY

>>389955948
Yeah I dunno man. They've been wanting to try mixing it more action since FF4. FF4 was almost an action game, they decided to go with ATB instead and turned the action shit into the mana series. FF has never been a series about tradition, it's a series about experimentation.

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>>389956056
Dragon Quest wasn't example of game depth. Just that it's stuck to what people expect from the series title pic related withstanding for VIII it generally was the typical RPG power curve.

you can beat the games without grinding though. I streamed all of dragon quest VIII with the condition of "no grinding" and killed everything up and including to the trials. Grinding has always been the tool for people who can't use the tools to beat the task at the recommended level. It's the ultimate difficulty slider.

>>389956198

>it's a series about experimentation.
Within limits
You're right that it's been leaning towards action with ATB. ATB was invented specifically to be able to lean towards action in a turn based style. It's also the reason people say X-2 is the best combat in the series.

But there are levels you go to experimentation and some places you don't go. Type-0, Crisis Core, and Dirge of Cerberus. Okay maybe not Dirge of Cerberus were games that deviated from the formula but relegated themselves to a spinoff. A spinoff has certain expectations. No matter how much I like World of Final Fantasy I would still throw a bitch fit if it was a mainline title. A main-line title has expectations. And for near 30 years those expectations were "turn-based esque". Even 12 was just ATB despite free movement and 13 went back to ATB. We departed with LR but that was a spinoff, and so was fine by people. But they jumped completely off the rails with XV.

XV has the most individual changes the series has seen in any one individual title since it's inception and holds the fewest elements recurrent in the series. Of course people are going to push back. Every game series that isn't dragon quest has done this at one point or another and this has been met with massive resistance from fans. This is why you make a new IP. If you're going to change everything, there's no reason to keep the series name.

>>389955402
Its definately one of the most challenging but it doesnt have reflex as a challenge, Also parry and counter mechanics are not common in ATBs.

>>389956725
With most series I agree but not with FF. I'm fine with them experimenting and in fact I encourage it. They've been poking around full action for quite some time, it was inevitable they'd try it eventually. I hope the next game is something totally new as well. Whether that's a new spin on atb, hard turn based, or a different flavour of action, any would be fine with me.

>>389957156
I hope not. The problem with being completely different is you remove association. A series lives and dies on association. If FFXVI is a grand strategy game the series will never recover.

>>389957387
If it's an rpg with classes magic that follows the X xra xaga naming convention and has summons and chocobos it'll be fine.

Why the fuck don't ATB games let you see the enemy's ATB gauge?

>>389957557
this, XV was fine because it had chocobos, it had magic, it had summons, it had crystals
same with XIII

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>>389952680
>XV's shitty hunts
>anywhere on the same level as XII's

>>389957387
You are just taking extremes. Besides, one of the most respected titles in the franchise is an SRPG.

As long as it stays and RPG ar its core and has similar thematics and recurring elements loke chocobos and summons, its a Final Fantasy.

There's a reason people call Bravely Defsult a "FF spin off". It has many 9f these elements and thematics, it feels like a branch of the PS1 games.

>>389958342
I dunno man. Hunts are hunts. The 12 ones the 13 ones and the 15 ones are all basically the same shit to me. Just an excuse for a fun fight.

>>389958360
>You are just taking extremes.
And you're saying turn-based to action and a removal of 90% of the spells in the series isn't an extreme?

>one of the most respected titles in the franchise is an SRPG.
And is a spinoff

Anyways people call BD a spinoff because it is. From spells down to items. But it was different enough to warrant it's own IP. As if they had some sort of self awareness or something.
And it's closer to FF3 and FF5 than it is to anything released on the PS1

>>389946069
That's some patrician taste right there.

XV is a lot better but the overall experience is still pretty bad thanks to the unfinished section starting Chapter 9.

>>389959493
>thanks to the unfinished game
FTFY

>>389959804
Whatever, that's just playing with words. What I meant is that I thoroughly enjoyed up until the end of Chapter 8 and if the game remained like that until the end, I wouldn't have as many complaints, but then again in that case the entire second half would have been a different game.

>>389958679
No, because tgose are just variations of the same core idea, close combat. TBC, ATB, and Action all portray the same thing with different mechanics.
The spells missing is a design choice not relates to the combat itself, and the important ones are all there. The elementals, debilitations, Stop... still there. Just different.

Grand Strategy is an entirely different thing. Might as well put Racing there too.

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>>389960395
>the important ones are all there.
Protect, shell, cure, gravity, earthquake, aero, tsunami, flare? You know, some of the ones the series invented

>turn based is a variation of action
What am I reading

>might as well put racing there too
Already happened. It was also a spinoff.

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>>389945318
XIII