cRPG renaissance

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You've forgotten to put the two Avernum remakes on there.

In your opinion, how much is worth the Arcanum IP?

>>389538130
>Most seem to disagree with AoD being good but it is.
I'll get around to playing it one of these days. Any tips for a first class?

>>389538360
It's very trial and error, but basically don't overstretch your skills.

for my first playthrough i joined the assassins with a focus on daggers/crossbows and sneaking/lockpicking, seemed to work pretty well.

>>389538130
The only bad game in this chart is Grimoire. Shadowrun: Returns and Tyranny were OK. The others are either great or good IMO.
PoE, W2, AoD, Torment and Tyranny generated pretty controversial range of opinions, but I personally enjoyed all of them.

>>389538508
I actually liked Tyranny, I'd put it in okay tier but that would require me to move a lot of stuff and I'm lazy.

Whats good about torment though?
I couldn't handle all that purple prose and the combat seemed really dull, dropped it after two hours.

>>389538130

Yeah, I would say that is accurate. Only Codex fags think Grimoire is enjoyable.

>>389538130
legend of grimrock is shit memed by people who never played real party based crawlers for nerd cred

>>389538621
>Whats good about torment though?
I personally enjoyed lore, because I like tabletop Numenera.
Some of the companions are pretty great (Erritis by Avellone and Rhin by hack fraud Rothfuss)
I though that choice and consequence were handled really well.
Combat aside from slow pacing was pretty nice IMO.
Story in general was quite enjoyable, though it suffers from pacing issues and falls flat at some moments.

>dropped it after two hours
That's understandable. It is quite a slow-starter. I would recommend giving it a second chance, though.

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Fixed

>>389539450

But it isn't a bad game and a good starting point for people who are interested in blobbers.

>>389539524

Wasteland 2 should be moved to shit tier.

>Grimoire sape posting died in a week

Man those threads were fun. They got me into better dungeon crawlers aswell.

>>389539889
nobody belived when it was released
and when it did everyone lost interest before Thale could release manual

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>mfw everyone forgetting that this released this year

>>389538508
I think the problem is people expected everything to be a 10/10 GOTY masterpiece for some reason.

>>389540161
How is it? I've yet to play Conquistador, so I've been putting this off until I get to that.

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>>389538130
For all the CRPG love I think SRPG/TRPG have gone through equally as a big resurgence without necessarily reliance on crowdfunding. Just from what I can remember right now

>Hard West
>Banner Saga
>Invisible Inc
>Children of Zodiarcs
>Hellenica
>Mordheim

There's more I can't remember.

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>>389540275
Pretty deep turn based combat focused on melee.
You can freely roam britain and decide wether to stay diplomatic or just fuck up all the factions you meet so it's pretty good in my opinion.
It released with tons of bugs so it's metacritic score is kinda shit, it's recent steam reviews are at 86% positive to compared to the 60%ish at launch.

It's a pretty good RPG hindered by a botched release.

>>389540450
Is XCOM a trpg?

and yea generally turn based strategy and RPGs have come back with lot's of AA projects, I like.

>grimoire in shit tier

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>>389540161
One of the worst games i've ever played

>>389540450
it's more like a return of the mid-budget market in general. for far too long i industry has tried to make this about AAAs and indie shovelware.

>>389538130
There's never been a better time for anyone to make a video game and actually make a living that way. Sure, this leads to a lot of shit but also to something like Underrail.

>apparently those shadowrun games are extremely linear and very short

how does either work with an rpg? makes no sense in my eyes

>>389540752
you need to play more games, paul

>>389541001
>apparently those shadowrun games are extremely linear and very short
That's true only for Returns. DF and HK had a decent amount of reactivity and average play-through is around 20 to 40 hours. They may feel quite restricting in big picture, but in return they're pretty focused experiences.

>>389538130
why is tyranny shit?

>>389541561
something something too many female soldiers something

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tfw no Dark Heresy crpg

>>389538130
>dragonfall
>great tier

nigga wat

>>389538130
the shadowrun games are garbage mobile shit

>>389538130
I'd switch PoE and Tranny but other than that seems britty gud.

>>389541561
Other than this >>389541608 memeing, it is very bland and devoid of personality with heavy combat focus but without much of an interesting aspect to that combat. Spell crafting is neat, but it is too easy to break and games doesn't give much of a challenge for it to feel justified.

In short it is way worse Icewind Dale, with all the same problems, but none of the charm.

>tfw still no underrail expansion.

Why must you work so slow stygg?

>>389539889
thats because anyone who actually bought it played it for around 20 hours, realized the theme park design had ended and the trainwreck began, then quit

>>389538508
>>389538621
Only act 1 was decent. Rest of it was awful

>>389538360
stay specialized when you first start. hybrids are viable, but you will only find frustration if you're a new player. hybrids are almost the most enjoyable and best way to get the most out of the experience. the assassin is likely the easiest for new players. also it's important to remember that there are many skill checks. scenes get resolved differently if you pass skill checks, but will still progress differently if you fail them

>>389541889
There's what, 3 people working on it?
And it takes place around the explorable underground sea, with usable jet ski and shit, plus adds high-level stuff for character development. Sounds like quite a lot of work.

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>>389541561
It's a massive pull of the rug after the first act in terms of your choices mattering because you get locked into a particular path for the rest of the game after it. It also has barely any enemy variety and never really capitalizes on "you're the judge and executor of the evil overlord" angle it should have.

I'd check out inquisitor instead. buggy and play on easy because combat is ass, but it lets you be as evil as you want and interrogate people as part of your job.

>>389538360
Play Dungeon Rats instead

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>cRPG renaissance
It's cool that dads and women have a game genre tailored for them. Very inclusive.

>>389542113
>>389541885
thanks.
this is the first crpg I've tried

>>389538130
The wave of nostalgia crested at ankle level.
They are all shit and are battling to be the least runny turd.

>>389542372
Then you can only go up.

Go on with pillars, it's very similair but objectively better than tyranny. Especially the white march expansion is great.

>>389542326
Is it a bad thing?
cRPG was almost a dead genre before so-called renaissance.

You can almost feel the edge emanating from OP's pic.

All Divinity and UnderRail have going for them is combat. That's it.

Fuck your Richard Stallman you fucking PC nerd virgin kissless incel faggot.

>>389542610
>Divinity
>edge
What the fuck are you even on about

>>389540554
>Get offer of sex as reward
>Receive groin infection
I guess there was a good reason all her suitors eventually bailed on her

>>389542521
I actually picked tyranny over pillers as my first.I'll probably get it after I play through the tyranny dlc thats coming out

>>389538360
Loremaster is pretty easy. Dump all combat stats and skills.
Remember one thing: no check is failed as long as you have points to spend

>>389542610
^^

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>>389542653
Some lessons just have to be learned through experience, I guess

>>389542092
He already have the the groundwork of the game setup already, it is literally just coming up with content. i'm replaying the game but man i don't want to progress too much before the expac arrives. Would be nice if he at least gave an estimated release

>>389542650
Pillars is objectively the best CRPG of the past decade. Now fuck off you fucking Gentoo-installing PC nerd.

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>>389542610
As much as Divinity was a lackluster outside of combat, I really appreciate that it took Ultima VII path and deviated from IE-formula. While I like new cRPG games, they require some innovation in order to continue their existence. A lot of them start to get pretty tedious to be honest.

>>389542717
Post one thing good about pillars that isnt world building

>>389538130
how the fuck is shadowrun: dragonfall great tier?
that game is as mediocre as they get.

>>389542610
>UnderRail have going for them is combat
Underrail has some of the funniest quests i've seen in crpgs in quite a while.
Certainly way better designed than any shit you can find in garbage like pillars of eternity.
Rape dungeon, entire Oculus quest chain, Gorsky drilling his way into his old base, Rathound King, there's lots of fun and crazy things in this game.

>>389542714
I was expecting it to hit in the summer. It really feels like stygg is being slow on purpose.

>>389538267
This was literally the first thing I thought when I saw the image. Doubted some on /v/ would even know avernum. I've seen maybe two threads about the series in the last 7 years.

why do people hate wasteland 2? outside of useless stats and content getting weaker as you go I thought it was pretty good.

>>389543101
Vogel has been making the same game again and again for the past 20 years. Literally in the case of the Exile series. Rating those kind of lost importance after a while.

>>389543101
Avernum aged like milk visually and remasters didn't really help with that at all. Hell i find something like Tales of Maj'Eal more appealing to look at than avernum games.

>>389543238
Release wasn't all that good, but everything is pretty much fixed in DC edition.

What's the next best step for a classic CRPG for someone who has only played DA:O?

>>389543609
Baldur's Gate 1/2 is perfect for the beginners.

Age of Railroad is shit get fucked

>>389543609

Try some of BioWare's older titles like KotOR, and Jade Empire. Play KotOR II only if you liked KotOR and want more.

BG 1 & 2 are decent, but I'd try Icewind Dale first to see if you like the system first (all three use AD&D 2nd edition in somewhat bastardized form, so you'll need to get used to things like negative armor class and THAC0). It is extremely important to make good use of spells and abilities in BG and IWD,

Neverwinter Nights 1 is also something that you might enjoy, and is more straightforward than BG and IWD, but lacks their charm. Uses 3rd edition D&D as its character system. It's a lot easier to make an unplayable character in 3e than it is with 2e, so be careful what feats and classes you take.

>>389543719
>>389543985
How do I play BG1? I've seen people on /v/ arguing about the enhanced edition being superior to original vanilla and vice versa.

>>389544092
The Enhanced Edition is basically better adapted for modern computers, but it adds some really, REALLY annoying companions with really obnoxious introductions. My recommendation would be to install the EE and then a mod that deletes them from the game. Or you can play without it and see them for yourself. Who knows, you might be the one person in a million that actually finds Neera charming. If not, you can always take their stuff, then get them killed or petrified or just tell them to fuck off.

Also, I tried looking for mods of the original BGs and had some trouble since a lot of the sites that hosted them have gone down the drain, while the EE mods are usually hosted in places that are still mantained.

>>389544092
The enhanced edition of BG1 is a much easier game than the original. They replaced the old engine and its rules with BG2's, but they haven't readjusted anything in the content. So it's kind of existing in limbo, where it doesn't work the way BG1 should, nor does it have content that fits the new system of BG2.

Installing the SCS mod makes the whole issue moot, but you probably don't want to play with that on your first run.

>divinity great
You tried op
Shit bait

>>389543238
It was meh when it was released. The DC version is solid though, and fixes 95% of my gripes with the game. That being said, energy weapons never found a good place and assault rifles are still too dominant.

>>389544092

As much as I'm tempted to sperg out about the Enhanced Edition... you may as well play it. Beamdog (the company that made the EE) made some questionable changes to characters and added some stuff that was unnecessary in the name of "progress", rather than retain the artistic integrity of the work. So, if that bothers you, pirate the EE. If it doesn't, buy the EE on Gog or something when it goes on sale. You get the original, non-enhanced edition as a freebie with the Gog version of the EE, so you can potentially play it in its original, unaltered state.

>>389544545
Where is Trilogy Mod for BG2 Enchanced Edition.

>>389538130
Pillars should take AoD's spot, and AoD be moved to the bottom. AoD is such trial-and-error garbage. There's no interesting characters, the combat mechanics are dreadful shit, and in general it's ugly as fuck. For all their mouth-running about RPGs, RPG Codex has yet to actual make something worth playing; closest they've got is the Underrail guy but he's his own force of nature.

>>389540161
i wanted to like it. the animations are just terrible though. it really is off putting and the gore is nonsensical
>slash someone with a sword
>you always chop their legs off
i hate that this is the reason i can't get into it

>>389538130
Grimrock 2 should be in great tier. Refined game mechanics, absolutely HUUGE and amazingly designed, interconnected game world, smart puzzles that utilize almost all of the game's mechanics.

Shadowrun games are trash.

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>>389545047

>>389545117
It's bad and you know it.

>>389544861
http://gibberlings3.net/forums/index.php?showforum=195

It's surprisingly accurate.

Actually one of the first charts I have ever seen on /v/ that seems relateable to me.

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>>389545165
you're reddit and you know it

>>389545047
I thought AoD was pretty decent, though it shouldn't be called RPG as it's more of a CYOA with stats. It's not bad, it's just different.

>>389545165
>looking up bad review for aod
>player has hundreds of hours in skyrim and fo4
this is you

>>389538130
>Divinity: Original Sin
Braindead Diablo-Clone
>Underrail
Stupid Meme-Game that should be said put in on sentence with Undertale
>Any Shadowrun Game, at all
Glorified Visual-Novel with a bit of "gameplay" that roughly resemlbes an RPG put into it, so it could be considered an actual game and not just a "novel", by some.
>Grimrock
Dungeon Crawler without any kind of story and massively simplified RPG-Elements
>Age of Decadence
"That game" that hipsters pretend to have played
>Pillars of Eternity
A good CRPG that should actually be at "good Tier" but isn't, because OP is forcibly trying to be edgy AF.
>Wasteland 2
Same as Pillars
>Tyranny
The best CRPG to have seen the light of day in recent years, should be considered Great Tier but is not, because of OP trying to be edgy. He is most likely in his teenage-angst years, shouting at his mom that it's "not just a phase"
>Torment: Tides of Numenera
The Pinnacle of RPG greatness and the best CRPG ever since Baldur's Gate 2 or Planescape Torment. For some unknown reason put in "shit tier" - by this point I guess OP is just trolling/baiting.
>Grimoire
Shit Tier indeed and should be forgotten ASAP

>>389545362
Fuck off retard

>>389545362
Well, these look like totally unbiased, objective opinions

>>389538465
>>389542036
>>389542691
Thanks for all the advice, anons! I've been looking forward to AoD for a while and wasn't sure how best to start.

Do you get to manage your village/tribe in Expedition: Vikings in terms of population, food, etc?

Trying to decide between Vikings and Dungeon Rats. XCOM 2 has left me wanting in terms or tactical gameplay and I can only play through xenonauts and openxcom so many times.

>>389538130
Can any of these modern ones go toe to toe with the classics? Like Planescape or the Fallouts?

>>389541001
Only Returns. It's still good enough for a playthrough if you get it for cheap.

>>389541830
Being playable on mobile doesn't make it bad, Kotor games are on mobile devices too.

>>389545362
>Braindead Diablo-Clone
shit bait
>>Pillars of Eternity
>A good CRPG that should actually be at "good Tier" but isn't, because OP is forcibly trying to be edgy AF.
shit gameplay, and what the fuck does that have to do with edgy?

if you like torment your opinion can safely be ignored, lmao

Holy shit those Tyranny DLC reviews.

>>389539524
>LoG2
>Ok
Kys

>>389540752

One of the worst opinions I've ever seen

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>>389545362
Typical Obsidrone post.

Tell us how good New Vegas is again shitlord.

>>389538130
Torment is good for Bloom alone and setting in general, shame game tanked so hard. I'd like to see more games in Numenera.

Did anyone bother with serpent in the staglands? I've played a few hours of it and don't hate it so far. Has an interesting skill system at least.

>>389547435
Numenera is a really shitty setting and system for videogame adaptation though. It just crumbles the moment it is left without competent GM, because so much of it is made with on the spot GM tampering in mind which you really can't do in videogames unless you go full online route.

>>389547908
I was recommended it in the last thread or two, so I'm actually reading the manual right now.
What type of character did you make?

>>389538130
Switch Tyranny and Underrail and it's pretty spot on.

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>>389541987
Act 1 in Torment? Because I'm playing it right now and the only thing driving me forward is the hope that it still has time to get b-better

>>389538130
Why is Dragonfall over Hong Kong?

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>>389538130
yeah it's pretty good

>>389548038
I've been putting the majority of my points into talking skills like linguist and philosopher and letting the story companions do all the fighting.

>>389538130
>dead, trash genre that shall remain irrelevant
Feels good

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>>389538130
>Grimoire not elder god tier
Sapes.

>>389548060
never obsidian cuck

>>389548221
Not OP but the pacing in Hong Kong was a bit odd. Way too much exposition in between missions, it could've been integrated into the game better.
The gameplay is improved however so I can see why you would consider Hong Kong to be better.

>>389539524
>Wasteland 2 is good, but Dragonfall is shit

Explain this

>>389548337 what do you play then? Skyrim? Fallout?

These are the only worthwhile RPGs.

>>389542326
I highly doubt the average weeb could clear Dragonfall's tutorial area without dying. They aren't hard games, but they have a lot more depth than other genres and choices that could really send you up shit creek.

>>389548559
There's no worthwhile rpg, they're all garbage and "people" defending them are fucking retarded

>>389545047
Back to the cuck shed son. AoD and UnderRail have been the only 2 cRPG's that have thoroughly hooked me since BG2 days. Bought AoD during last summer sale and spent 112h over 2 weeks almost 100%:ing the game, absolutely amazing game.

>There's no interesting characters
Theres nothing but interesting and humane characters featuring 500 shades of gray, the exact opposite of you generic fantasy RPG where you have a plethora of stereotypes set in stone.
>the combat mechanics are dreadful shit
As opposed to? It isnt great but the combat system functions, is challenging and extremely well balanced. There are things you simply cannot do if you dont play combat focused character (unless you know the game inside-out and exploit alchemy). The combat dynamics are interesting and it is a lot more in-depth than just dicerolling, infinitely better than the combat in FO1&2 for example.
>and in general it's ugly as fuck
reddit: the argument. Go back to playing cinematic console games. Dwarf fortress is great and it barely has a graphical interface.

Plus the writing is 10/10 and discovering the lore and secrets of the world playthrough by playthrough was enjoyable as fuck.

Why does the writing in PoE make me cringe?

>>389549296
>Bought AoD during last summer sale and spent 112h over 2 weeks almost 100%:ing the game, absolutely amazing game.
When has the amount of time a retard like you spent on a shit game ever mattered?

>>389549538
He is right though, AoD is a great game, ESPECIALLY the combat mechanics.

You probably got BTFO'd at the first fight and didn't bother, how the fuck can you judge the game?

>>389538267
>nigger
>fantasy setting

no thanks

>>389549538
drop the ad hominems, bring a couple of substantial arguments and someone might consider your 0/10 baits worthwhile.

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>>389538130
>thought that underrail is shitty rpgmaker-like uninspiring indie
>it's actually absolutely great game

>>389549640
>i-it's not shit it was probably too hard for you
If you found it even remotely challenging you should stop playing games and pick something more adapted for people with your condition

>>389549750
>muh ad hominems
Pot kettle

>>389549296
>As opposed to? It isnt great but the combat system functions, is challenging and extremely well balanced. There are things you simply cannot do if you dont play combat focused character (unless you know the game inside-out and exploit alchemy). The combat dynamics are interesting and it is a lot more in-depth than just dicerolling, infinitely better than the combat in FO1&2 for example.
Except AoD has a lot to do with dicerolls. Last I checked on my melee built character arena still was mostly around 50% chance to hit anything and similar or worse odds for the enemy, which means that I go for aimed shot to arm and depending on whether it succeeds and brings the enemy hit chance from something like 40% to 20% the whole thing either snowballs in my favor with the guy having close to 0% chance to hit me after a few rounds or I miss the 50% and the whole thing snowballs against me. God forbid I actually crit the arm and he has to pick up the soap, then the snowballing gets even faster.

Underrail combat was better in the area that it allowed for plenty of skills that were guaranteed success. It has tons of dodge perks with 100% chance of working for example. It also wasn't a cyoa everywhere outside of combat.

>>389549640
AoD is the closest thing there is to CYOA outside of VNs. I can see why a lot of people dislike its style, especially with ugly nwn tier graphics. Combat, while quite deep, feels wasted on such game, there are so much more it could have been in a more traditional rpg, pretty much the reason the devs made a dungeon crawler after AoD i guess.

>>389549902
I said that it was more in-depth than just dicerolling. Its not great but it does the job and didnt bore me to death at any point (unlike in aforementioned fallout games)... except certain few fights with shitloads of enemies. The most important thing to me was that combat didnt become trivial at any point unless you exclusively rushed weapon skill + block and knew where to get tons of money to immediately buy OP thc weapon and high end gear from Maadoran vendors.

>>389549813
How much of the game did you play then?

>>389550098
I agree to that, it is to much trial and error, but regardless the game has a pretty good story that is very reactive to the players actions, players need to roleplay their character to be successful and there is a lot of redeeming factors.

Most people just hate the games admittedly awful presentation and can't look past that.

>>389539524
>worst opinion confirmed

>>389550386
>How much of the game did you play then?
Never touched it

>>389550524
So don't fucking talk about it, especially regarding difficulty lmao

>>389550584
>So don't fucking talk about it
Fuck off mom

>>389538130
Dragonfall is the most overrated shit in this place.

>>389549296
>AoD and UnderRail
Sounds about right.

>>389548038
Put points in polymorph into wolf until you have a comfortable time transformed, one point in wolf claws, one in burst of life. Now have someone cast amplify on you and just have fun mowing everything down like and immortal vampiric beast.

>>389542326
It's always been a niche genre.

>>389548870
>depth
No, those games just don't explain what the fuck they can do.

>>389538130
>D:OS in great tier
It had a decent combat system, but even that god boring after a while, and the story was shit.

>>389544545
You can just ignore the new companions why would you need a mod?

>>389553998
I belive Shadowrun has tooltips for everything.
You can also pick a default class and just roll with it.

>>389554646
Because
>Get to Beregost
>OH HAI THERE CAN YOU HELP ME STOP ASKING QUESTIONS AND FUCKING HELP ME KILL THESE PEOPLE YOU DON'T KNOW FOR ME PLEASE NOW WHERE ARE WE GOING WAIT WHAT THE HELL DO YOU MEAN YOU DON'T WANT ME ALONG YOU FUCKING MONSTER?
>Get to Nashkel
>Hello there, we are bandits and are about to rob you, now hand over the OH WAIT, WHAT IS THAT? A MYSTERIOUS FIGURE HAS KILLED ALL OUR MEN FROM OUT OF SIGHT, CLOAKED IN SHADOWS? TRULY THIS HAS TO BE THE WORK OF BATMA- I MEAN, DORN, THE UNADULTERATED BADASS WITH WHOM WE'RE ABOUT TO HAVE 5 MINUTES OF EXPOSITION AND CONVERSATION TO PAINT HIM AS A TOTAL BADASS WHILE WE'RE COMPLETE COWARDS AND CHEATERS AND THEN DIE oh wait what do you mean you're not interested.

I'll be the first to say it's dumb as fuck to completely reject the EE because of the added content when you can just ignore it, but god damn those introductions are so ridiculously obnoxious. Only reasonable one is Rasaad, and he's sadly really bad as a companion. Sure, it's a minor thing, but when you get to them for the second or third time you're thankful to have them removed entirely.

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>>389553738
Niche yes, but that niche is large enough for all the kickstarted RPGs like Divinity, Pillars or Wasteland to get sequels.
Then you have great indie projects like UnderRail and AoD, and other smaller projects to look forward to like the New World or Copper Dreams.
Makes me positive that the RPG genre isn't fucked beyond redemption

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>>389538130
Dragonfall is criminally underrated. Such a fantastic game.

With today's patch and dlc Tyranny is fixing my most hated issue with the game. Now it's possible to stay loyal to Kyros instead of being railroaded into rebellion. Depending on how this goes I would probably move it to good.

>>389557242
According to the codex
>pledge your allegiance to Kyros no matter what you've done up to this point (so, for example, even if you've followed the Anarchist path, you can still proclaim that "everything I've done I've done for Kyros' Glory" and have his armies stand down in the ending slides).

He could be wrong, but going by the reports of the expansion being small and half-assed I doubt he is.

>>389557887
It was pretty annoying that after picking a side to resolve the tiers situation all the dialogue options made you sound like a loyal minion to one of the two retarded generals. The least I expect is new conversations throughout the entire game to make it clear I'm just doing as I see fit to enforce Kyros law. If all they do is add an extra line at Tunon's trial I will be mad.

>>389549747
This

>>389538130
Is torment that bad? I was hoping it would be much better but I haven't gotten a chance to play it.

>>389559965
It's not very good, main story is pretty okay, although starts really slow, but numenera just don't land itself for videogame adaptation, both setting and system.

>>389560707
honestly though, a slow start isn't exactly a bad thing

>>389560707
Numenera is generic fantasy shlock but with a ~sciency~ flare.

didn't really like age of decadence.