Is the dialogue wheel the death of the RPG?

Nah, not really. There are plenty of RPGs, namely JRPGs, that lack it. More freedom is always a good thing.

>>388426445
I don't think it's a cause, I think it's a symptom.

Even when it's a list its shit
>good guy option
>neutral option
>bad guy option (always retarded)
>goodbye

>>388426376
*the death of the WRPG

Alpha Protocol was proof that it could work well in an rpg game.
But it doesn't exactly add to how deep conversations can be and how involved the player is in them.

>>388427764
And JRPGs don't have dialogue choices, let alone a branching story, to begin with.

>>388427875
And most are better for it. Incredibly few WRPGs pull off branching stories and dialogue choices well.

>>388427875
Good

>>388426376
It's really only shit when the thing your character says only barely resembles what the option says

>>388426376
RPG doesn't really have much meaning anymore. It's essentially just a catchall term for character customization. And even then it barely applies since stuff like Witcher is still called an "RPG". It kinda sucks that AI technology will almost most likely never be able to replicate the experience and free form style of tabletop games like d&d and and have to follow a more linear style like Baldurs gate and the shadowrun games.

Jrpgs also are a completely different genre and not related at all to more traditional games.

>>388427983
>>388428017
So since every single game under sun now has talent trees and item progression through loot or crafting, what makes JRPGs RPGs if they don't have dialogue choices and a branching story?

>>388426376
it makes you play one-sided characters.

>full player agency
>player initiates any events with any characters in any order

>restricted player agency
>writer uses specific events with specific characters to convey a specific story/meaning/morals

can't have both

i wish for a full-on real openworld game with fully simulated npc AIs, not this dialogue tree bullshit.

>>388429525
Just play d&d you fucking nerd

>>388429693
but d&d and its combat system is gay

>>388426376
Dialogue choice before were the same amount of actual choices, they just removed the couple of "ask about" questions.

>>388426376
A clearly sign of consolization. Thanks Bioware and good luck.

>>388428163
The fuck are you on about? JRPGs rarely have Western-style skill trees and item crafting garbage.

>>388429525
>i want the game to generate assets on the fly based on my decisions

>>388429693
>play d&d
If your game requires human interaction interaction it's not a good game.

>>388430163
Please define JRPG for me then.

>>388426376
Not really.
I'd say the whole "abbreviated selection" is what the real issue is.
>Select 'pleasant'
>Character says "FUCK YOU NIGGER"
They're about as accurate as a blind, handless archer.

>>388428159
AI will get there before we die.

>>388430315
>Traditionally turned-based or gameplay derived from turn-based roots
>Linear story with little-to-none customization in terms of main character and party. Characters are generally actual characters and not customized self-inserts.
>Focus on item management with item shops and towns, more narrow gameplay progression.
>Fantasy settings instead of the realistic/tolkien shit in WRPGs.
It's a generalized label and games break away from these definitions all the time (e.g. SaGa), but there are definitely characteristics that help define them.

Dialogue options are overrated. The actual important part is the ability to make actionable choices.

I think Devil Survivor is the only RPG I've ever played where the choices felt significant and held up on replay (ie the game is fun enough to play multiple times and your choices actually make the runs unique in a meaningful way).

>>388430565
this. especially boiware games do this.

>>388430565
I definitely agree with this statement. In mass effect 1 you still had plenty of dialogue options because of the investigate option.

>>388431049
That is probably the worst genre definition for any genre i can imagine. These apply to tonnes of games that are nowhere near JRPG.

For instance my definition for an RPG is character progression through items and talents/abilities and a branching story affected by the players choices in dialogue and actions. Find me one game that ticks all those boxes and isn't an RPG. Any game that only has some of those elements is a "<GENRE> with RPG elements" and any game that has it all is a proper RPG.

>>388432351
>Find me one game that ticks all those boxes and isn't an RPG
E.Y.E: Divine Cybermancy.

>>388426376
It's not the cause od shitty dialogue systems, it's just a symptom like >>388427365 said
See Fallout 4 with the dialogue interface mod and you'll see what I mean

>>388432482
But it is. It was marketed and reviewed as an RPG. It's commonly accepted that EYE is an RPG.

>>388432351
Being turned-based/being derived from turn-based gameplay, a linear story with no character/party customization, a focus on item management through item shops, narrow gameplay progression, and non realistic/tolkien fantasy settings apply to "tonnes of games"?

>>388432629
I agree that it has a ton of RPG elements, but it's a FPS first and foremost.

>>388432872
Fallout 4

>>388432860
No genre is defined by the setting, that doesn't even make sense.

>>388433067
Fallout 4 has deathmatch multiplayer?

>>388433221
who gives a shit about multiplayer?

File: 1462813592863.png (2MB, 1782x996px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1782x996px

>>388433193
It's an element. WRPGs generally have realistic setting/Tolkien inspired settings.

You're generally not going to see settings like pic relate din a WRPG.

>>388427550
>bad guy option (always retarded)
This shit pisses me off. Why the fuck can't I be an intelligent villain in an RPG that lets me make moral choices?

>>388433448
>Who gives a shit about this element that proves my definition of RPG isn't perfectly accurate
Indeed.

>>388433607
No, seriously, who gives a shit about MP?

>>388434283
All the character progression is just a tool to give you more options in combat, unlike Fallout 4 which has charisma and all that jazz. How many RPGs have FPS battle royales?

>>388434702
>yes
>no (yes)
>snarky (yes)
>maybe (yes)

>>388434875
How does that relate to my post at all?

>>388431585
This.

Sengoku rance also has a lot of meaningful choices and most of them aren't just a text box which you have to choose from. For example choosing which country's to attack leads to different party members joining you and since your first playthrough is pretty restricted on time you can't conquer the whole map.