BOOSTFAGS WILL NEVER EVER BE ABLE TO DO SHIT LIKE THIS

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reality:

>>387337687
???
aside from this guy's shitty gameplay. there's a lot of cool stuff he pulled off that will never be allowed in boost games

>>387337419
>>387337687
Damn it's been a while since i've played the adventure games. I'm so used to the boost formula that I think this shit looks really good. If they could refine the controls and get some good level design going on, i think a new adventure-style game would be really good.
Boost to win was a mistake, the game kinda does play it self, i like controling the character myself.

>>387337687
All these years, I never understood why that drop at 6 seconds causes Sonic to float into the air instead of losing 1 life.

>>387338026
it's the first level of the game so they probably figured it would be too rough if they made it a death pit

>>387337687
>ign plays sonic adventure.webm

>>387337419
Shit like what?
Jump off the intended path?
You can do that shit in plenty of boost games.

>>387337419
>>387337973
Are fangames like Sonic Utopia any good?

>>387338026
>>387338118
I thought that floaty shit was only done in the demo version. I remember playing SA on a demo pack as a kid and floated out of nowhere sometimes, though after I bought the actual game and tried to recreate it, it didn't work.

>>387338401
>create your own path
>use knowledge of physics to advance to different routes
>use knowledge of moveset to skip huge areas
>get rewarded for doing so
show me one fucking boost game that allows this shit

Fuck I want SA3 so bad, everybody nag Iizuka on facebook for it.

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>>387337419
>>387338502

>>387338118
Sonic Adventure already shits out lives at you. Also, it would be better game design if they teach the player early on that pitfalls are bad and you should jump over them or speed through them with spindash.

>>387338498
1.Sonic Utopia is good
2. Sonic World is okay
3. Sonic Souls is mediocre and you need to unlock the fps in the .ini for it to even be playable.

>>387338502
Sonic Mania BTFO! Adventure was the only good Sonic

>>387338502
Cringe

>>387338596
this flaming piece of shit sucks so hard. Heroes was a far better adventure 3

>>387338498
no. Sonic Utopia sucks

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>>387338596
>adventure 3

>>387338596
You know, Sonic 06 wouldn't be so bad if they had a extra year of development time and didn't have to make a PS3 port while working on the game.

>>387338821
Heroes sucked ass, 06 was far better, at least 06 had a hubworld and didnt rely on threesome mechanics

>>387338596
>>387338965
Wasn't someone working on a better version of 06 for PC? I forgot what iwas called though.

>>387338645
Thanks for the recommendation anon. I always saw a few pictures of them but never really tried to get into it.

>>387338498
Sonic Utopia is basically a tech demo.

Can't we all agree that every single Sonic game has a shitty level design? It doesn't work in 3D, it doesn't work in 2D.

>>387339368
What's the difference between good level design and bad level design? Post examples.

wtf is a boostfag

>>387338502
It doesn't matter when the other two-thirds of the game is fucking garbage
Tack on a shit story and dumb cutscenes and you've got yourself a mediocre at best game

>>387337419
All of this is one of the reason and I can't see the following games as anything but major steps back.

>>387339368
Fuck off IGN

>>387339447
Someone with no standard and no desire to build any.

>>387339447
People who like good games and don't like shit ones because of nostalgia

>>387339163
bump for curiosity

what happened to that one guy that had the chart about adventure physics vs boost physics? Does he even post here anymore?

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>>387339592
But IGN liked Mania.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9h8eu5jf2F4

>>387337419
>>387337419
how many B presses is that

>>387339447
bias aside, its comparing gameplay of 3d sonic games. whereas games where sonic boosts like in sonic colors and generations, or where he doesnt like in the adventure titles.
"boostfag" being a name for someone who favors games with the boost feature.

There has never been a good sonic game.

>>387339762
This chart really pissed me off and only reminds me about how Sega shamelessly started to shit up Sonic games with crappy physics, both in 2D and 3D, until they allowed some goddamn fans to fix up their shit.

>>387339447
I think it's just something a bunch of fans of the shitty 3D sonic games came up with to accuse other fans of the shitty 3D sonic games of ruining sonic because they like the wrong shitty 3D sonic games
I think?
Basically if you're a functioning human bean it's worthless since there's no actual difference between these people

>>387339449
It matters because this is the kind of formula they should have improved on for Sonic.

>>387338502
>show me one fucking boost game that allows this shit
Unleashed.

>tfw love the characters but hate the gameplay
Anyone else feel the same way?

>>387337419
>I mean you are simply walking on terrain that is unintended to be walk-
>There is a fucking 1up

>>387340365
you got proof for that claim?

>>387340397
No.

I used to love Sonic. I grew up with the Sonic games. My first Sonic game was Sonic 1 for the SEGA genesis. At the time, I thought this game is hard and not really fun, but I like the character, so I'll keep playing. I then got Sonic 2&Mean Bean Machine, Sonic 3, etc. All of those games left me feeling hopeless and dissapointed. I loved the characters so much, but hated the actual gameplay. Then Sonic R came out, and I was like whoa. The controls were awkward, but it was then I realized that Sonic is really much cooler in 3D. Then the Sega Dreamcast came out and so did Sonic Adventure. I immediately fell in love with this game, the character designs, the music, the gameplay. It felt to me like the Sonic game I had always wished for had finally come into existence. Then SA2 came out, I loved the new characters, but unfortunately it stripped away the identity of what a Sonic Adventure game was supposed to be. Merging all of the stories together, removing the hubworld, putting tails in a mech...

As expected,the 3D games began to errode into unplayable garbage. Now at the age of 25, the people who liked classic sonic get a game called Sonic Mania. They mock, they laugh, they scold, they dance with joy, because all of them hated Sonic Adventure. They want to rub it in as much as they can, that they won, and that we will never ever get another Sonic Adventure as long as I live. As I watch the media going out of control, with fat sonic's little fat smug bastard's face being plastered everywhere, as if to mock me and torture my very soul, I begin to hate Sonic more and more. I realized that the era of Classic Sonic had returned and the age of Sonic Adventure would be forever lost. I wish Sonic had never existed.

I hate Sonic.

>>387340397
No.

>>387339425
Good level design: The first one or anyone with fluidity.
Bad level design: Sonic games where you can't go fast, has badly placed stoppers relying on the player's memory more than allowing a constant, seamless experience.

>>387340895
you're part of what's ruining the franchise. Having to memorize stuff or slow down is not bad level design. See Sonic 1

>>387337419
>There's an extra life up there

What the fuck?

>>387337687
How shit do you have to be? I played this game when I was 8 and even I wasn't this bad.

>>387341109
there's also one on the skyscraper parallel to the one OP went up. Sonic Team wanted to reward the player for doing stuff like this

>boostfags

It's just a run button anon. Pretty common in platformers.

>>387341226
>reward players
Lives are irrelevant so that's a pretty shit reward

>>387341409
what do you want? An unlockable character or something?

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>>387339762
found it

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>>387337419
>tails
>in a sonic level

????????????????????????????

>>387337419
same shit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FQ_Kcdtq3w

>>387337687

Did the original Sonic Adventure on Dreamcast run at 60fps?

I seem to remember it running at 30.

>>387338645
What about Green Hill Paradise?

>>387341903
>japanese voice actors
but really, this isn't. This is just breaking the game. The OP is taking a secondary intended route.
>>387342009
30 on the dreamcast.

>>387339163
>>387339757
Kingdom Valley? Xenia?

>>387341367
I thought Run button (Lost World) was different from the Boost Button.

Personally, I enjoyed the Run button.

>>387341903
wtf? why is so much of this game "on rails" like that? where's the open areas with free movement?

>>387338596
how the fuck can it be adventure 3 with no chao garden

>>387337973
What is the "boost formula"? I need some gameplay footage

>>387342789
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_sn-tzO5YU

>>387341009
Nothing to ruin there.

>>387339449
>he actually thinks that having a good story is important in a platformer, a genre based around gameplay
are you retarded? go play an rpg or a vn if you want story

>>387337419
>>387337687
>haha dumb boostfags you will never be able to skip a bunch of the games content so you don't actually have to play this awful game!

>>387343926
yeah pretty much. I wish I could skip all the garbage in the boost games

>>387342789
Here you go:
https://youtu.be/bdb3DQuHONk?t=511

>>387342878
>boost fags will defend this is some miracle of a way

>>387338892
Utopia is the future of Sonic as it is the perfect translation of classic sonic elements into 3d.

>>387344774
it's a fucking maze. It's shit.

>>387337419
why do people keep caring about sonic adventure 1? 2 is much much better. Adventure fags keep embarrassing themselves trying to salvage adventure 1

>>387341776
The right one is better though, also it's 90 degrees it's just over an amount time since sonic actually has momentum now.

>>387342878
man that's really lame. reminds me of sonic adventure 2 where if you stop on a circle ramp and then walk a little bit you instantly move at full sonic speed.

>>387337419
What fun do people get out of exploiting games like this?

>>387337973
>I think this shit looks really good.
Then actually try playing. All that stuff requires a lot of knowledge and you can't easily experiment without the game just shitting itself. The game even breaks when you don't try to fuck with it

Adventure requires you to either stick to the exact path or know exactly how to abuse it

>>387344881
The physics, you mong. It plays like a dream

>>387337419
>games so shit fag OP is bragging about being able to skip most of it

>>387345129
>exploiting
did you not see the 1 up? That shit was intended to be done by the devs
>>387345176
this is the sad truth. It is nice to be able to pull this stuff off after you've gotten good at the game though

>>387340480
Any speedrun of the game?

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Classic > Boost > Adventure
>>387344881
Have you even played it? It's not a maze at all.
>>387345032
Or you could try watching how the actual game plays instead of shitting at the fucking tutorial being easy.

>>387345583
just kill yourself

>>387341776
>People will defend the left one

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>3D sonic

do people actually like this, or was it all just stockholm syndrome at the time?

>>387347220
They're bad games, but they're really fun to play once you learn to master the jank.

>>387347197
it's the definitive way to play. Right makes more sense but left is better for control. If I push right, I want to go right. If I wanted to go up-right, I'd push the analog stick in that direction

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Will they put Eggmanland in Sonic Forces?
I think most sonic levels are just too short and easy.

>>387347357
Left is worse since the camera either won't keep up with the movement, or if it does, it's too fucking fast. You hold right to make a right turn, the camera swings left and now you're suddenly running in the opposite direction as you were initially.

>>387347458
give me five minutes to record some gameplay and prove you wrong

>>387347357
>play sonic 3
>spindash to the right
>press left
>sonic doesn't instantly go left with the same speed
Why the fuck does /v/ like these shitty ass games?

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>>387337419
wait. that building is solid? and your intended to be able to go there?

I have been miliseconds away from clearing the time attack on this stage. a shame I don't have it anymore.

>>387338596
>boost game

>>387347527
are you retarded? If you were to pull that shit in Sonic Adventure, the same thing would happen. We're talking about moving forward and then right. Not right and then left. You can't replicate this scenario in 2D

>>387347521
You don't have to.
https://youtu.be/NMGHwX7ojj8?t=4m31s
Here is a perfect example of how the camera can screw you over. You see a right turn, turn right and the camera swings around faster than you can react, so you're either going off the path, or turning around.

>>387341367
A run button that makes you invincible isn't "just a run button".

>>387347792
An actual run button would be a good addition though.

>>387347708
>Moving forwards and backwards has momentum but moving left and right has no momentum
This is so fucking stupid

>>387342878
Donkey Kong was the best part.

>>387347405
There's already an Eggmanland level mod for Generations. Ever so slightly alters the werehog parts to make it fully playable as Modern Sonic.

>>387347728
>here's an example
>2 hour clip

>>387348165
>4:31
Retard. It's linked to a specific time.

>>387340583

That's what you get for falling for a marketing ploy. Stop loving mascots/companies, and start loving individual games and game designers, you'll find a much more consistent stream of enoyable experiences than just trusting the promises of moneygrabbing studios.

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>>387347728
yes the camera can fuck you over but that's not to say it will happen every single time. In general, left is gonna be more useful than right.
>>387347912
I recorded this too to help you understand

>>387341009

Sonic 1 has pretty shit level design though, his point stills tands. Sonic 2 is when they started realizing death pits and tricking the player into going fast was shitty, and allowed for a more constant flow since you couldn't kinda realize when to go fast and when to slow down based on patterns instead of knowing the entire map layout, and S3&K took this even further. Mania is the perfection of that formula.

>>387339163
It was called "modding Sonic 06 levels into Generations."

>>387342878
>>387344421
Th-the levels after are more complex, and have actual platforming, especially the 2D ones.

>>387345176

This is the true. The game is really fun to play once you get the hang of the controls and know what the game wants you to do, but playing it for the first time is horrible and cryptic. It's like playing a fangame, everything just looks weird and you're not sure if you're supposed to be doing what you're doing, ESPECIALLY on the non-sonic stages.

It doesn't help that instead of just penalizing you, the game shits itself constantly when you accidently turn the wrong way.

>>387347357

That is retarded. It's basic game design to add momentum to a character's movement, especially in fucking 3D.

Also I'm pretty sure Sonic Adventure on the dreamcast was more like the right than the left, I feel like in DX he moves way jankier and life the pic on the left.

>>387342878
>>387344421
>>387345032
>>387349365
Can't you only do that if you level sonic up and unlock the majority of his abilities?

>>387348669

That video proves literally nothing since we don't have an adventure game with the other type of control to compare.

>>387349781
are you serious? What a pathetic excuse. You've got all the boostgames to compare to.

>>387349775
nope. You can do this from the very beginning.
>>387349602
this >>387348669 is from the Dreamcast version.
Having tight control like that is far better. As I said, if I wanted to go northeast, I'd push the analog stick in that direction. I shouldn't be forced into that direction everytime I wanna go right

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>>387338596
>Sonic 06 is more than a decade old now
I still remember obsessively listening to the games OST and ignoring everything else about it.

>>387350308

How is that an excuse? You can't compare Adventure to newer Sonic games, they control completely different. If you had an adventure-style game that controlled like the former, I'd like to see a comparison. You could compare it to other games though like N64 3D platformers. They control so much better than sonic adventure that it's not even up to debate, but they're not really about going fast, so it's an unfair comparison.

You might not like the boost games, but they work without shitting themselves completely when you go off the intended path, especially in generations with its multiple alternate routes that I'm still discovering all these years after having first played the game.

>>387350475

>tight controls

But that's bullshit, it feels like shit.

>>387350683
>they control differently
that's the point you dense fuck. The chart is comparing those two control styles

will there ever be a 3d sonic with an ost as good as adventure's?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INvSV8JY5VM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3-xEsQa0Ac
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPkEk2mvJgg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQOBYSrsbVc

>>387350831
okay, have fun with your cripple boost sonic where you slide around all the time

>>387348328
Starts at the beginning when you click play.

>>387347653
>doesn't have boost
>boost game
okay anon

>>387351459
>Phoneposters

>>387351596
I'm on my desktop friend.

I seriously don't understand the hate utopia gets just because of its level design. I mean I will agree that it's lacking in inventive gimmicks and enemies and traps are sparse,and there are too many wide open spaces but it's literally an UNFINISHED TEST LEVEL
It's literally just an open play area to test the mechanics of the game, not an actual finished level. Lange said it himself.
Other than that, and the camera that needs work the game just FEELS AMAZING. it controls like an absolute dream, like the Mario 64 of Sonic

>>387351596
i'm on my computer and it does the same thing

>>387342491
Because it was just that rushed. Doesn't change the fact that this is Adventure 3. It has the same overly sensitive controls and glitchy gameplay.

>>387350953

But they're different gameplay styles. One is an open level game with running segments, the other is a constantly-forward moving race to the finish. When going really fast, SA's control feel really janky unless the game is locking you in position, while boost sonic's game feel smooth. We don't know how smooth they'd feel in an open level game like Adventure because we haven't seen these in modern sonic games yet, so comparing them is pointless.

>>387351704
06 Sonic controls nothing like SA1 Sonic

It's really sad that SA1 has the best movement in 3D Sonic after nearly 20 fucking years. When the movement system itself is watered down enough from the classic games that it can't even handle loops or any remotely fancy geometry without scripted sequences that break if you do anything other than hold forward and watch the movie.

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>>387340583

>>387339056
>hubworld
>good

>>387351750
there's mods of Sonic Generations that bring back SA1 levels and it controls just like all the other boost garbage. Gameplay style doesn't change a damn thing

>>387351901
there is nothing inherently wrong with hub worlds

>>387352048
they were really shitty though. They just don't work in a sonic game because there's no point to them. In something like Mario Sunshine, they work because there's so much to do, but in Sonic there's nothing to do. Sonic Unleashed tried to fix this but then there just became no point to do anything as they rewarded you with pointless shit instead of useful stuff, i.e. the shines in Mario Sunshine

>>387352048
they're literally just padding

>>387341776
But you only need that right angle turn when going slow, which boost games allow. Right angle turns when going fast are just cancer, the biggest advantage of 3D sonic is you can see what is coming so why waste it.

>>387343830
It's not important, but clearly Sonic Team thought so by shoving awful cutscenes after every level.

I replayed Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 on emulator a few months ago, SA1 definitely felt the worse out of the two, not even my nostalgia could really make up for it's flaws. The sonic levels were mostly decent, but a bit lackluster and the controls and camera weren't always the greatest, every other character except maybe Tails was boring and needed more fleshing out.

I felt SA2 held up better by comparison, with a bit better controls, camera, and level design for the Sonic and Shadow stages, again kind of brought down by the weakness of the non Sonic/Shadow stages.

>>387352608
whoa buddy, the camera is way worse in 2 than 1

>>387352232
>>387352291
In Unleashed's case you could just go straight to the levels since all the hub worlds were small. They were there for people who like to explore, find goodies, and talk to NPCs.

>>387352807

I distinctly remember having more issues with the camera in 1 than in 2, though it was mostly in the hub world. For the actual stages I guess I didn't have too great an issue for either.

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Hell's Prisoners.

>>387352807
I actually only started playing 2 for the first time today, and camera is definitely better than in SA1. Which is not saying much, but still.

>>387352870
>you could just go straight to the levels
Making it pointless filler, just make a menu

> who like to explore, find goodies, and talk to NPCs.
There is fuck all to explore, none of what you can get is significant and no one has anything interesting or funny to say.

>>387352941
>>387353038
No, no, no, the camera is worse in 2 than 1. In 2, you have no control over the camera unless you're standing completely still, and even then once you move it resets. Maybe it's because I'm playing the Dreamcast versions...

>>387352990
>the lava level rises
>these guys burn to death in their cages

>>387353219

Maybe it is, it's been a few months, it's just that when I was playing SA1 I had several times in the overworld where it got stuck behind scenery, beyond that I think in the actual levels it was less of an issue.

>>387352990
deepest lore

>>387353259
Don't worry, anon, they can't dieso they suffer forever

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>>387353259
And the graves of the damned too.

>>387353181
There's plenty of hidden away areas that have collectibles. As for people having nothing interesting to say, that's merely your opinion. Plenty of NPCs had relevant information pertaining to optional sidequests. Also, just having a menu is dull as evidenced by the wii/ps2 version.

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>>387337419
Idc man I just want to play as a qt rabbit oc

>>387347220
dumb weeb.
get back to your cont/a/inment board.

>>387353527
>There's plenty of hidden away areas that have collectibles
There really isn't, especially because some of the areas were tiny. Oh you can go behind a hut and break box, so exciting

>that's merely your opinion
Seeing as your only example was they had side quests i can say it is the common one. These aren't memorable funny NPS, no one played this game wanting to see what they had to say next

>dull as evidenced by the wii/ps2 version.
But no one complained about that, or the level select in colors.

>>387353954
You prefer a boring point and click menu instead of a 3D world with actual interaction? I have to say the hub worlds in the dimps version were the weakest part of the game.

>>387341776
Wouldn't instant turns be more casual since you don't have to compensate at all

>>387337419
You can go directly to the helicopter part too. I used to do it all the time when I was a kid and only recently found out it was a well-known speedrun strat.

To get to the helicopter part you have to charge the light speed shoes, keep holding the button and use another button to spindash while you're still charged, then you release this one and jump and when you're close enough to the helicopter part you release the charge button.

>>387354513
I prefer an interface that makes it easy and convenient to access the game content that I enjoy playing, which usually doesn't include walking around mostly-empty hub areas

>>387337419
God damn that wall running is so cool

>>387341890
>ProAutism

Is Speed Highway the only stage where stuff like this can be done?

>>387337419
I'm too lazy to make webms fuck you
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SoECPSZE8Zw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pd7n67l8c5A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6fXe8WYDzE

>>387353639
>Idc man I just want to play as sonichu

>>387355608
How many times are we gonna have to explain this? Breaking the game is not the same thing as the OP. The OP was intended to be done by Sonic Team. This shit is just full on breaking the game and doing shit you're not supposed to be doing.

>>387355608
>advanced glitches that require hours of practice individually with exact precision are the same as cheesing through levels any way you think looks like a shortcut with the spindash and slopes

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>>387345176
I'm going to say this is not truth just because the other two guys are fags. What the fuck, Adventure is painfully easy and obvious to beat first time.

>>387355846
>>387355916
But with >>387337419 you also require a huge amount of work. The game bugs out at the slightest deviation from a set path so you have to know how to fuck with it in a very specific way to get a desirable result.

>was intended
really doesn't matter, if it can be done it can be done

>>387337419
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yn8mrzYYrUE

>>387356140

We're not saying it is hard, the game is piss easy, but it awkwardly breaks down and looks janky as fuck if you're not doing exactly what the game expects you to, and a lot of times you can't know what the game expects you to do so you take a turn that you think is the right way and you fall off the stange into a bottomless pit while the camera starts glitching

>>387356140
>Adventure is painfully easy and obvious to beat first time.
Where did I say it was hard to beat normally? I said OPs stuff is not easy to do.

The only hard part about the game is it breaks when you aren't even trying to do something weird.

>>387356212
No, it does matter. OP could have showed a clip of someone breaking Sonic Adventure, but he didn't

>>387356212
OP just posted the best of the best, you don't need to be that good, just replay levels enough to get all the emblems.

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I just want Chao, there were some really neat mechanics that went along with evolving them

>>387356585
>No, it does matter
It doesn't. Both have the desired effect, one was at best known about but possibly not even planned just found in testing. For the player this makes no difference

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>want to speedrun SA1 and SA2
>gravity is the only thing stopping me
if it wasnt so fucking difficult to fight that shit id be all over it

>>387356303
WOW clipping through objects, that's definitely the same thing as the OP

>>387338596
Never understood this argument. Yeah, 06 was clearly meant to be Adventure 3 in everything but name. So? One bad game doesn't mean they should kill the formula. Sonic 4 exists after all, and yet despite that we still got Mania.

>>387356740
So if I clip through all the walls does it count? I mean I'm getting there faster right??? I mean, that's the same thing as the OP.
That's you, retard.

>>387356740
>no difference
One takes meticulous retrying for every bit of every level, the other is learned in a way that is similar in most situations.

>>387356740
>not planned
didn't you see the 1up?

>>387342267
>>387348835
It wasn't called anything. It's being made by Gistix you fags

>>387356868
>So if I clip through all the walls does it count?
sure

> I mean, that's the same thing as the OP
Lost of experimenting with the game and how you can abuse certain aspects? Yes, you'd do better to make a real argument

>>387356918
>One takes meticulous retrying for every bit of every level
That is both. In adventure most experimenting just results in the game freaking out or death. It isn't like the classic games

>>387356950
Why does having a 1up mean it was planned? like I said it could just be found and they went neat a lets put a 1 up there, does that mean the path was now planned despite it not coming about through planning?

>>387338502
Unleashed. Day levels were fucking GOAT.

Theres nothing wrong with padding, it adds for a more interesting experience. I can't be the only one who is sick of nothing but boosting with only sonic as a playable character for like 8 years in a row.

>>387357374
It's not abusing the game you fucking retard. It's fucking intended. This is like saying that the Starlight Act 3 skip is abusing Sonic 1.

>>387357374
I never said it was like the classics, but it actually translates some old ideas to 3d unlike just changing the perspective with boostshit.
Plus, if you even took the time to read my whole post, you'd know I said the difference is that what you learn is still applicable in most situations across levels in adventure.
Now fuck off contrarian.

>>387357374
I believe it was planned as this isn't the only part in the game where something like this can be done. Matter of fact, getting the A rank on some of the stages requires you to do stuff like this

>>387357542
It is though, you are using the mechanics in a very specific way to take you far off the normal path in a way most don't consider possible.

>>387357703
>t what you learn is still applicable in most situations across levels in adventure.
That stipulation isn't important and I could just as well say what they used in unleashed is using mechanic used throughout.

>contrarian.
Says the guy defending adventure

>>387357817
>I believe
Well that's nice, so what about that proof all those bits were planned?

>>387357998
Man you are fucking retarded. These paths are intended. You literally have to do this shit to get the A rank in these stages.
Just fuck off back to your shitty boost threads

>>387357998
>contrarian.
>Says the guy defending adventure
>forgetting you're on /v/

>That stipulation isn't important
Why not? It'd just be speedrunning otherwise using game breaking glitches and clipping around so much.
At least try making a counterargument.

>>387358297
>they all are cause I say so
top tier argument

>>387358331
>forgetting you're on /v/
wow, le epic /v/ humour

>Why not?
Cause it makes no difference and you were wrong anyway

>It'd just be speedrunning otherwise
Speedrunning doesn't necessarily use glitches (though what they define as is not always clear), also for someone saying get a better counter argument speedrunning tho is a pretty bad attempt.

>>387358927
Where's your argument? Huh, smart guy? Where's your proof that this shit wasn't intended from the beginning?

I want to replay SADX and SA2 but I can't stand how the steam port looks at all. What mods can I use to get it to look like the Dreamcast version?

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>>387337419
Your autism knows no bounds.

https://www.reddit.com/r/SonicTheHedgehog/comments/6a8j1i/sonic_forces_boost_trash_rehash_why_not_make_it/

>>387337419
>tfw people are waking up to the merits of Sonic Adventure 1

Finally.

I still think Sonic Utopia's gameplay is perfect though.

>>387359016
>Where's your proof that this shit wasn't intended from the beginning?
See i was actually smarter and didn't make a claim that it wasn't, I just said we don't know if it was or wasn't and both ways are possible.

The point is either way the effect is the same.

>>387359274
https://youtu.be/8uNsTXIzgGI

>>387359327
>reddit
I wouldn't touch that place with a 10 yard stick. That chart has been posted around on /v/ for months

>>387359354
Tell me, what's your preferred style? Boost? Classic?

>>387359334
Utopia is a bit too ''car-like'' for my tastes. If it kept more momentum when turning it'd be amazing. Still, if there were some actual levels to play that weren't just Green Hill Zone but wide and flat, it could work really well. You just gotta design the levels to suit the gameplay.

>>387358927
>Cause it makes no difference and you were wrong anyway
>being this biased
>wow, le epic /v/ humour
>acting like I'm the only one who prefers adventure over boostshit when you're literally arguing with someone else at the same time
When I said speedrunning, I meant having to memorize very specific inputs at very specific times. There's a lot more breathing room in adventure so there isn't as much to get frustrated for and both the physics and the levels themselves support this.

>>387359410
That's the guy who made it. He's fucking delusional.

>>387337419
whaat, i never knew you could run up walls in SA

>>387340397
no

>>387338502
Literally any of them but Colors. Unleashed and Gens especially have glitches and abuses that let you basically teleport through the level.

>>387360191
>glitches and abuses
>get rewarded for doing so
pick one

>>387344053
>>387343926

BLOWN THE FUCK OUT

STAY HIDDEN FAGGOT

>>387360285
>beating level faster isn't being rewarded for it
Retard.

>>387359398
I wish BetterSADX changed sonic's model back to the DC version

>>387360285
The entire point of Sonic games is to beat the levels faster.

>>387360362
>>387360420
that's not really what I meant by a reward. I meant stuff like the 1up

>>387337419
>Boostfags
What?

>>387342878
great, now I can get S-ranks while jacking off to sonamy fics

>>387360490
>1-up
>reward
lol

>>387337419
That cute Adventurefag. Now watch this tard
https://youtu.be/2h23R_iyBIw

>>387360417
Here Anon:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xY3gmD08VRA

>>387361316
>everything is an on the rails hallway
wtf has sonic become?

>>387361478
So just like adventure?

>>387361316
>Boosting down linear, narrow path
>Essentially a long series of QTEs
The main reason people like these games is because it makes them feel like they're doing really tricky platforming, when they're just timing button presses well.
Breaking OoB isn't really that impressive since you just float down to the goal anyway. You can do that shit in any Adventure game. What's fun about those ones is that there is more freedom than that.

>>387361535
Haha nice one, buddy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MsY8r4GNtGU

>>387361535
If this was Adventure, you'd be able to jump off anywhere, to a faster route. This is intentional.
Boostshit forces you to stay on the paths, unless you can find some way to glitch out of the level.

>>387342878
>>donkey kong appears
This is a masterpiece

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>>387344774
>as it is the perfect translation of classic sonic elements into 3d.

>>387361676
>sonic advance is fun because you can jump over the gameplay and skip it
>generations is bad because you actually have to play the game.

>>387361884
You don't jump over the gameplay. You jump around the level, to different parts of the level. That IS the gameplay, you mongo.
Generations is bad because the level design is so restricted and taking various paths is just a matter of pressing buttons at the right timing. Besides, that example posted was an example of skipping the already simplistic gameplay of Generations, which was supposed to show how good it was, but now it's bad?

>>387361316
>2D
Ruined.

>>387361316
>Sonic flies into the abyss itself
>Wins
k

>>387361316
while it's not represented in your video, speed highway in generations is an excellent example of the disparity between the adventure series' mechanics vs the boost series. consider the part where sonic is running down the side of a skyscraper; in generations he's locked into lanes while in adventure he retains full movement options. it's this railroaded, roller coaster style of gameplay that makes the boost games so much less engaging for many fans.

>>387361590
>when they're just timing button presses well.
So every action game ever?

That's dumb dude. Boost isn't worse or better than Adventure, it's just different.

>>387362998
not my video

>>387337687
I can say this is how people play when they first pick up SA1. I watched my friend play it about a month ago and it was the most painful shit to watch and he struggled with the camera and shit. He ended up saying the game was shit and only made it up to Sky Chase with Sonic. But if you watch a Sonicfag play SA1 they'll make the game look great to play.

boost series wouldn't be so shit if there weren't 2d parts mixed with it, and I prefer the 2d gameplay style by itself.

>>387363010
What I mean is that there is barely any focus on actually controlling Sonic other than jumping, boosting and dodging/sliding. It's closer to those endless runner phone games than a genuine Sonic game.

>>387361316
>2D parts in an originally l 3D level
Fucking kill yourself, this is a prime example of why boost games fucking suck cock.

>>387363010
>Boost isn't worse or better than Adventure, it's just different.
>not realizing /v/ doesn't know the difference between opinion and fact
I like adventure more because of the freedom of playing with 3 dimensions instead of 2.

>>387338498
If you like Rush you might like Sonic vs Darkness https://youtu.be/1hOs3LpTpVM

one of the more obvious problems with boost2win is that it means the levels are more expensive on average, and shorter to compensate. they need to model all that shit you're flying past and can't "just not do it".

>>387362998
Well put.

>>387363010
obviously all video games can be boiled down to just timing button presses, but there's a lot more player-abstraction going on in sonic adventure that makes those commands and decisions more meaningful. interactions in the boost games are easier to boil down to button presses because the situations in which you engage with the game are usually very simple (press left or right to dodge the pillars, press a repeatedly to homing attack a chain of enemies, etc.). there are very few instances in the games that require a nuanced understanding of sonic's handling and mobility, and there's less opportunity for the player to make goals for themselves based on their understanding of the game's physics and controls. I understand that boost games are appealing for their fast pace and sense of speed, but they're honestly pretty shallow experiences.

>>387363760
also, before you go off on me, I don't intend to imply that a shallow game is inherently inferior to a more complex one. many of my favorite games have shallow mechanics.

Is there a ring in Flying Battery Zone?

>>387366709
Yes. I found one in Act 2.

Is any of the PS" games good or at least worth playing?

>>387367493
>PS"
Meant PS2

>>387367493
*PS2?
Heroes is better on GameCube and Xbox, but also on PC. Other than that? I don't think there are any worth checking out.

is this that doom clone made by diaperfurs

>>387339902
This all sounds like a mega spergfest to me. The only people still worried about sonic games probably wear diapers.

Do most modern 3D Sonic games play like temple runner? That's not to say Adventure was great, but I don't like being on rails for too long.

>>387368253
Most games post 06.

>>387368253
>I don't like being on rails for too long
Heroes gives you some degree of freedom, but there's always one main path and when you stray away you are ultimately lead back to it very quickly.
IIRC, a few stages offer 2 or 3 different paths from start to finish, but you're still pretty bound to rails once you picked which path to take

I just want a motherfucking Sonic Unleashed 2. With Australian outback, icy cold Russian mountains, an Amazonian jungle, a Mexican villa in Mexico, California's coastline, a rainy neon city in Tokyo, and more. More boosting, more Werehog level remixes, more perfect music, more actual good graphics and senses of speed. How fucking hard is it when the first one is the GOAT?

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>>387360720
>He doesn't jack off to superior Shadamy fanfics

>>387368912
>more boosting
Dropped. Next you'll say you want more 2D.

>>387369704
Sonic Unleashed is 80% 3D. It is also the only game to get the boost right since it has fast and fluid level design, rather than being some middling shitty 2D puzzle platformer like Sonic Colors and Sonic Generations.

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>>387348669
This shit works when you're making small movements like this, but it's a pain in the ass if you're going to make slight adjustments at high speed. Sonic Adventure 1-3 all had this problem, and it's why things like OP's webm were the best feeling moments because all that air movement wasn't fucked over by 1:1 input. For a game about speed and momentum, having momentum is a pretty good idea.

>>387370067
give me 5 minutes to record footage and prove you wrong

>>387369569
can I get a source on this pic?

>>387368912
>werehog
Just add Knux on steroids

>>387342878
Sonic Generations is shit, now let me see you beat any unleashed level with one hand, also
>playing on fucking Wii U of all things
disgusting

>>387370605
I heard that the WiiU controller is really good though

>>387370250
The Sonic Boom redesigns are lame. Feels to corporate and safe, Boom's setting is very boring as well. Sonic as a hulking, furry beast with claws and sharp teeth feels more natural. A Nega Sonic if you will.

>>387370672
It's alright. Its best strengths are the build quality and comfort. Still think the 360 controller is better utility all around though.

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>>387370067
>>387370143
Here's Sonic making a sharp right turn and a sharp left turn at full speed. That's from pushing the analog stick into the right direction. If you wanted to go up-right or up-left, you'd just push the analog stick in that direction. Why is this so hard for you guys to understand?
This style of control is far better because it allows for tight turns left and right with no restrictions. Boost games force you to move up-right or up-left when all you want to do is make a sharp right or a sharp left. Adventure games allow you to go up-right or up-left when you want to but also allow you to make sharp turns left and right.

>>387356346
this, you can say it's hard because it will randomly break and fuck you over if you don't guess what the game wants you to do right

>>387370031
I agree. 2D parts ruined the boost games.

>>387356713
they're more likely to be a thing in PSO2 then another sonic game

>>387339056
you can't be serious, 06 is like the phantom menace of video games, it fails on such a basic level in it's own medium that it can hardly be called such, it's at best, "an attempt" at it that really didn't try

>>387371636
Because it makes no sense for sonic to just instantly snap in a direction like he doesn't have any momentum at all.

>>387356849
Sonic 4 was shit too

>>387371925
Yes, the boost style of control makes more sense, but the adventure style is more useful

>>387337419
>>387337687
These both look like trash and zero fun, has there been a single good sonic game or are they all garbage

>>387372152
just leave. We all know you're just starting up drama for (you)s. If you don't like Sonic, there's no reason to be in a Sonic thread

>>387351459
it literally doesn't you retard

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>>387341776
>>387339762

Stop being such a nigger, this was literally posted this afternoon, and I'd bet anything you're a first year newfag who's trying to get (you)s by baiting other newfags who also just saw it earlier. Also very likely you're the faggot who posted it just earlier

>>387342441
in hub worlds? in werehog levels? duuh

>>387372478
The guy who made that chart is an actual autist, anon. See >>387359327
He's been spamming that shit for months now

>>387342441
It works best. Sonic gets the super fast gameplay that Sega has been marketing since the beginning. Then you get more exploration, more platforming, more secrets, more collecting, more interaction in hubs and night time. Sonic Unleashed is brilliantly set up.

>>387362054
>the gameplay is to skip the game
>skip as much of the level and overall content of the game as possible to win
>you are the best at that game if you literally never play it
wow

>>387372854
You're retarded. No, seriously, you're fucking retarded.

>>387372854
the gameplay is tied to the player's own choices when deciding how to move through the world, that itself is the content. nobody said anything about sequence breaking being better than following a level's natural flow, it's having the option to do so that's appealing.

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>>387372646

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>>387371636
The point isn't that you can't. The point is that it's a huge pain in the ass. There's no built in momentum or curve of movement, so you have to handle it all yourself. After passing a certain point in speed, it's no longer viable or enjoyable. If we want to talk about how useful it is, anybody going top speed is going to have to be a particular ass about how they move the analog stick in order to get that sensation of momentum, and if we're talking about a Sonic game, then that sensation of momentum is important.

Arguing that Adventure's 90 degree turns is useful is the same as arguing that Sonic 4's air control was useful. It's shite that can work but it breaks what you can do and the feeling of the game.

>>387373197
man are you retarded? You want the momentum? You want the curve of movement? Then move up-right. What the fuck is so hard about that? No one's forcing you to push the analog stick directly right or left and it's not hard to avoid doing it either, unless you're some kind of idiot that tips the stick over at every tap

It's useful when you need to make a sharp left or a sharp right. Something that would be nearly impossible in a boost game unless you were to stop completely and rotate Sonic

>>387337419
>>387337973
>>387343926
What's this memeing about boosts? I don't follow the sonic series too much, played the games when I was a kid, though.

>>387373554
Have a 360? Download the Sonic Unleashed and Generations demo. That's boost Sonic, effectively splitting the series into classic 2D - early 3D Adventure - 2D/3D Boost

>>387372152
all 3d sonic suck stay away

>>387373554
most 3D sonic games from unleashed onwards play very differently from their predecessors, they're more like interactive roller coasters with light 2D platforming segments slipped in than traditional action/adventure games

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>>387373417
The issue is that if you move up+right, that's all your getting: up+right. Sonic Adventure has no real momentum when it comes to inputs, so when you make that adjustment, you're changing your direction in just as sharp of an angle as you would at 90 degrees. The only possible way for a player to get that curve in their movement is to input enough changes in directions themselves to simulate it, and not only is that pants on head retarded, but it breaks all usefulness at high speed due to limiting your control to a certain range on the analog stick because otherwise you would smash into a wall.

>>387374251
Why do you care so much about this kind of momentum anyway? You can still curve easily by as you said, making enough changes in direction. Even at high speed this is still easy to pull off.

>>387348669
>>387341776
>>387337419
>>387371636
OH BOY YOU CAN LOSE CONTROL IN THESE GAMES WOW BOOSTFAGS WINS

>>387374775
what?

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>>387374251
wow yup, look at that curved movement. It was easy to pull off and actually felt really good, moving the analog stick to match the exact movements sonic was making on screen. At high speed too. I definitely prefer a control style where my input matches exactly what happens on screen as opposed to one that feels more like my input on ice

>>387374493
not him, but momentum-based movement can make for compelling platforming. I don't think the design of the boost games make much use of it though.

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>>387375302
>it felt real good
This is not a place for lies, anon.

This webm only goes further to illustrate the point. You move forward and try to do slight movement and you're limited to a small range on your analog stick. You make that wide turn to the right and in reality you can see four sharp angle turns that is nothing like an actual curve. The only movement in here that actually looks like a rounded turn in the one to the left, and the time you take to do it is beyond what you'd have to do in a system with proper momentum.

All in all
>Why do you care so much about this kind of momentum anyway?
Because Sonic's on the cover and the name of the game is Sonic Adventure

>>387370605
Generations isn't even on WiiU. He was obviously playing it on PC.

>>387337687
This webm shows that even a shit player can use some shortcuts. Far better design, even in this most ordinary and dull level, than any boost game.

>>387375759
Strip away the edge and repetition and I would say that Sonic Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog did pretty well to show what a 3D Sonic game with momentum to do, even if it was floaty as hell when it came to tight movements and had too many literal rails.

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>>387337687
how do you manage to be this bad at a game for kids

>>387375959
It did feel good, but really what's the big deal? Either way Sonic made the curve. Whether it was 4 sharp turns or one smooth turn, it's the same thing.
As for the time thing, I can record some Generations gameplay to compare times if you'd like

>>387337419
somebody redpill me on this boost vs non boost

>>387376430
Read this very thread, m8. Look for posts with webms and you can see the difference with your own blind eyes.

>>387376430
read the damn thread

>>387376430
It's more about level design than actually boosting
Boost games are like a 2d sonic game with the perspective shifted to sonic's back. It offers only a bit of the z and y axes and levels are narrow which makes it very constricted compared to previous 3d sonics. There's also the fact that there are many sections that are literally 2d.

Nonboost games didn't have any of this bringing them down and are better for it.

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>>387375959
>>387376294
Okay there it is, Sonic making a left curve in Generations, at full speed coming right off a boost. The first curve starts at 18 seconds game time and ends at 20. The second one begins at 30 and ends roughly at 32. The SA2 curves began at 1 and 8, and ended at 2 and 10 respectively. So...

>>387376294
Well personally, I don't think Sega has really captured Sonic movements in a 3D game properly yet, and I've never really defended Generations in any of my replies. I think that if you cleaned up Sonic Heroes and made the movement sharper, we'd be closer to the goalpost, but that's still a mess of a game in its own right and the movement that's actually there is Sonic-on-Ice.

But in any case, momentum in movement is what makes Sonic fun to play while speeding around. The classic Sonic games showcased this, and we know what it's like without it with the advent of Sonic 4 back in 2010. The Adventure series has been stuck in this same fidgety mess without momentum, reaching its apex in Sonic '06. Speeding around and experiencing this momentum is basically what defines Sonic, and you can't call Adventure a good game just because he made a turn while twitchy around in from one sharp angle to the next.

>>387337419

>there was a 1 up on the roof

Was finding this glitch a part of there plan?

>>387377178
I'm not defending any game, or calling anyone good because of the controls. All I'm saying is that the controls in the adventure games are better than those in the boost games, coming off the chart seen here >>387341776
I understand that momentum in a Sonic game is good but I feel that in 3D, the Adventure style just works better or at the least, feels better

>>387341132
8 year old you played the game repeatedly for months so you got good at it. Whoever made the video was probably playing it for the first time in months/years/ever.

>>387377418
1:1 control has its benefits, but it's not objectively better than momentum-based movement. they service different designs.

>>387341132
You were, you just don't remember it like that.

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>>387376430
>redpill
you belong in this thread >>387369907

>>387377141
inb4 everyone ignores this post and keeps pushing their own narrative

>>387377749
In terms of what we've seen with Sonic in 3D, I think the 1:1 style is better than the momentum-based style. Sonic is a hard series to make work in 3D. I think by sacrificing the momentum for tighter, sharper control, you get a better experience. Especially when platforming comes into play

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>>387377418
The issue is that each of these games has a different design dogma. 3D movement in Adventure is a fidgeting mess but Adventure also had a lot of traditional 3D platforming elements. It "feels good" when it comes to those situations, as it's the same kind of movement you'd expect in any other 3D platformer. The issue stems from speeding around, and Sonic Adventure doesn't have that, paving the way for the modern stigma of playing itself by padding out most of its running sequences and what not with boost pads that will adjust your movement. If you took any of these out, the game instantly becomes much harder to control, because those controls are built for vertical 3D platformer, not speed driven platforming courses.

When I say Sonic Heroes is closer to the mark, I say that because its momentum based design works for games based around speed. Again, there's the issue with seeing this as the design for most of the levels still have a lot of rails and boost pads and all that drivel, but it was much easier and decent control for moments of high speed that you did get to work with. This had the inverse problem where in moments where you had to move more sharply, the game was sluggish and floaty, but it better facilitated faster motion because this momentum frees up the analog stick, allowing a much wider range of subtler inputs.

The thing is, speeding through the course with momentum is what Sonic games are all about. It's the very core with what Yuji Naka wanted to do, looking at Mario and building his game off of speeding through it as fast as possible. When Sonic makes the jump to 3D, the games have to keep this in mind. As much as that tight 90-degree movement works for traditional 3D platformers like Mario, Sonic is all about moving forward, and as such, he needs a movement scheme that is based around momentum and better control at high speed.

>>387372006
Yes anon that was my point.

>BOOSTFAGS WILL NEVER EVER BE ABLE TO DO SHIT LIKE THIS
What, use a boost pad to do all of that stuff? Looks like SA is boostshit.

>>387378261
uh, have you never played Sonic Adventure 2?

3D Sonic games were a mistake and Sonicfags are just too desperate to argue that they aren't shit. I seriously hope you guys enjoy Mania as much as possible because it's going to be the last good Sonic game until Mania 2 eventually happens.

>>387378261
Sonic steering like a truck is not better control.

>>387378464
I've enjoyed every 3D Sonic game to date, despite how shitty they are. I'm completely alright with having more of them.

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>>387359274
>What mods can I use to get it to look like the Dreamcast version?
https://github.com/PiKeyAr/sadx_dreamcast/issues/151

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>>387378559
Of course not, anon
Sonic should steer like a car instead

>>387378261
As I said here >>387378192
I think sacrifices need to be made. I'd love to see a more true to form 3D interpretation of Sonic. But as it stands, I just see Adventure's control as being the best suited for 3D movement. I strongly disagree with the Heroes point too. Heroes is a very slippery game all around. Making sharp movements at a slow speed or a high speed, is tough.
So far, every instance of a 3D Sonic game utilizing momentum like this has failed to do it right. So as it stands, I see Adventure's 1:1 style as being the only one to work in a 3D Sonic game. Even if it's not what Sonic's about

>>387377390
its not a glitch if its intended anon, theres a ton of secret 1ups in adventure from being crazy with jumps

>>387337419
What? Play a bad game?

>>387378192
I enjoy the adventure games, but I'd kill for a 3D sonic that properly designed levels around overcoming obstacles by controlling momentum like the 3D games. I think it's possible, too. Super Monkey Ball, for example, is based around the same general principles and has some extremely precise platforming to boot.

>>387337419
Man, does that WEBM make Sonic Adventure look like a fully functional game. Fuck you Sega, fuck you and your incompetent employees.

>>387378737
This is essentially what Generations is. Sonic even fucking drifts for fuck's sake.
I agree that Sonic should have some car like elements, like a gas pedal of some sort that replaces boosting. Gives you more speed, but doesn't make you invincible.

>>387378853
me too

>>387378721
t. arin hanson

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>MY POO TASTES BETTER THAN YOUR POO

>>387378721
>the ocean bouncing up and down because Sega couldn't figure out how to do a wave on the GameCube
Sad

Why is it only on /v/ you'll find Adventure apologists? Yeah, that one thing you did in the webm is cool anon, too bad a majority of the game is janky shit. If I got good at playing janky shit I sure as hell would make it look good. This is why Mario won the 3D platforming war and Sonic is in the dirt stuck in 2D.

>>387345583
>boost>adventure

Go fucking off yourself you dick dribble gobble cock goblin nigger

>>387379305
>Yeah, that one thing you did in the webm is cool anon
The entire Sonic story is full of shit like that, watch a speedrun.
>b-but, those tricks are hard
They're ez as fuck, anyone can do them. My favorite is spindashing up the hill with all the springs on the first level.

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>>387378774
That's the issue though. As I've said, they're good controls, but they're not good Sonic controls. They've worked in the past for other 3D Platformers, but those ones aren't about speed. I also didn't mean that Heroes was necessarily good, as I already conceded above that it was sluggish and basically Sonic-on-Ice. Still, looking to momentum and what it did right is more important to reaching a decent 3D Sonic game, rather than settling for "It's a good game even if it's a bad Sonic game," especially when those games have had hosts of other problems that weren't tied to momentum at all.

There's a video out there that basically covers what >>387378925 said about mechanics that can help Sonic, like giving him a gas pedal type movement system to free up subtler inputs during momentum. Some points get a bit weird, but if you've got the time, it's got some good ideas.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1XOpPoh0K8

>>387379453
Why would I bother learning any of these tricks when SA1 and SA2 are fundamentally flawed in terms of game design? If you're going to get good at a game at least don't get good at a shitty game.

>>387379602
>Why would I bother learning any of these tricks when SA1 and SA2 are fundamentally flawed in terms of game design?
Because they're the only fun 3D official sonic games?

>>387361316
>clipping through buildings
>abyss that lacks draw distance
>2D sections
0/10 you're fake news

>>387379519
I like these sort of videos a lot, because it's clear that they care about the games they're talking to and know their shit.
Even if their opinions on how to make it better may differ, the arguments are usually pretty solid. I would love for another take on Sonic R. A racing game with minor platforming elements would be fucking amazing if it had good controls.

>>387379519
Oh I've watched this before. Interesting video. I don't have anything against the idea of momentum based 3D Sonic, it just hasn't worked yet. I still think the 1:1 works for speed though. SA2 has a lot of really fast sections. I think maybe Sonic Team should take a cue from the Sonic racing games and try to convert that style of movement to regular Sonic games

>>387371925
>makes no sense
It makes Sonic special. He isn't a car, let him have something unique from being on foot.

>>387379519
Where do people get this weird idea that Sonic is speed first platforming second? Sonic's always been a platformer with a character whose gimmick is going fast, but even in the old school 2d games there have always been various platforming segments and elements that slow you down. As far as I'm concerned all this focus on how "Sonic needs to always be going fast at all times" is seriously hurting the games' level design.

>>387379990
this too. Look I think a momentum based Sonic game can work. But the 1:1 is perfectly fine for 3D Sonic gameplay.
Why fix something that's not broken, right?

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>>387379702
>all we got is shit, so you should just settle with shit, ok?

>>387340895
sonic 1 has some of the worst designed levels tho

>>387379990
>Sonic needs to always be going fast at all times
I disagree with this, but I do think speed is one of the three corners of the Sonic triangle. The other two being platforming and I guess branching routes.
Speed is what made Sonic popular. It was very much a cooler, faster Mario. That's what it was marketed as. Whenever you saw a Sonic commercial, you saw him whoosh through loops and down hills really, really fast. I guess they just never got to move away from that and onto more interesting and developed platforming.
Look at games like Generation. It was supposed to be a ''back to its roots'' game and it did the opposite of a classic Sonic game. Instead of rewarding players with speedy segments for playing well through the platforming and memorizing the levels, they just give you a boost button and remove most of the platforming in favour of QTE-like mini-challenges.

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Why are people still arguing about boost vs adventure when the objectively best modern sonic title holds the throne?

>>387380416
>Boostshit combined with gimmicks
It's barely even a Sonic game at this point.

>>387379990
There's another video out there that covered this fact of how much Sonic games slowed down after the first level, but anyone can go back to Labyrinth Zone or Lava Reef Zone and get pissed off by experiencing that fact. Still, there's better zones like Sandopolis, Hill Top, and Carnival Night that handle both puzzle platforming and speed, and it's definitely ones like that people should think about when it comes to making a Sonic game. Forgoing platforming in favor of speed is what gets us Boost Games, and forgoing speed in favor of platforming is what gets us the Adventure games. Balancing the two is what the franchise needs, as choosing one over the other makes something that has its own positives, but just not 100% there. You either end up with something that requires no thought or something that lacks the speed and momentum that Sonic is known for.

>>387380515
It'd be good if it stopped reusing level setpieces every single act, and if its level design was less modular.
Wii limitations, but still.