Whats the most honest fighting game that people still play?

>>387211651
Honest fighting games are old news, grandpa. People want constant 50/50s and shitty gimmicks

>>387211651
Fantasy Strike.

Except the free weekend is just over.

>>387211651
KoF 14

Maybe SF5? There's really no such thing, and if there was people wouldn't play it because it would be boring as shit.

Every game needs some dumb shit in it to keep things interesting. You just don't want it to reach anime or ST vega levels of dumb.

>>387213443
I bet it has 300 people tops.

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skullgirls

>>387213652(Oyu)
THIS

>>387211651
>honest

I see that a lot. The fucks it even mean?

>>387213652

Not using the Robo Fortune Gundam color is fucking sickening

>>387213652
>mfw the only thing I ever backed was SkullGirls and it was really fun and had great potential
>mfw I realized the netplay was absolute horseshit
>mfw the game got progressively shittier overtime as they tried to appeal to the FGC rejects who want to pretend they're good at fighting games by reading a guide off the internet
>mfw the developers spent years trying to fix "Issues" the game had like the combo system because of scrubs complaining and kept making the game worse and worse, and then they just gave up
>mfw 99% of the fans for SkullGirls probably have spent less than a day playing the game and just like it because they're THICC fags or have a hard on for Peacock

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>>387214364
>mfw your first statement is the only true one
>mfw it's a webm of a good game that you hate and spread lies for some reason

>>387214529
>>387213652
I really hate the aesthetics of this game. No idea what people see in it.

>>387213949
Boring.

>>387211651
Fantasy strike

>>387214529
Skullgirls had horrible netplay issues for several years after it came out on steam. Just searching up lag issues on skull girls brings up tons of results with varying different solutions. It basically had horrible rollback issues randomly, you'd be playing one match just fine and then next game suddenly every 3 seconds you'd have a huge rollback and sound effects would keep repeating, and it was completely unplayable and ear rapey.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Skullgirls/comments/1hq5gg/i_keep_getting_some_matches_with_rollback_on/
http://steamcommunity.com/app/245170/discussions/0/846963081242156368/

To claim this is a lie is either a blantant lie on your end, or you simply weren't around back when the game was released and you refuse to believe it's true.

Point 3 would take ages to explain from a game design perspective so I won't bother.

Point 4 is another point you would definitely know if you've played the game since beta. They've changed the combo system a ton by trying to limit how it works to prevent infinites/touch of deaths by constantly making more restrictions, such as early changes such as making lp and clp count as the same thing to nerfing assists in combos to nerfing tag in combos to eventually straight up adding a limit bar that prevents how much you can actually combo, since they refused to change how linking moves worked in general or making it so not everything is +3000 on hit.

Point 5 is obviously hard to prove and a bit of an exaggeration, but you can definitely tell Skullgirls fans don't play the game as much as other fighting game players. According to Steamspy, Skull Girls has an average playtime of 10:08, while SFV has 69:46 and GGxrd has 35:42.

http://steamspy.com/app/245170
http://steamspy.com/app/310950
http://steamspy.com/app/520440

So no, I'm not lying. I loved Skull Girls when it came out and I think it's shit now and it threw away all of its potential.

>>387215291
>Skullgirls has way more owners than both SFV and GG combined
>Median playtime is 3 hours

More than 400 thousand people only put about one afternoon into this game, jesus christ. No wonder there's so many SG secondaries.

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>>387215291
Skullgirls netcode today makes up for whatever it had before

You don't make fighitng games, understand them or play them competently so your perspective is shit

The combo system was improved and made the game better

Waifushitters being most of the playerbase is no surprise but the game's gameplay has many fans which is why there's pic related and tournament scenes

>>387215795
>Skullgirls netcode today makes up for whatever it had before
When they were releasing the game one of their major selling points was how they were using GGPO and how good the netcode was going to be. This was one of the first of many major disappointment for me and many other people. Is it better now? Sure, but it took them years to fix and the netcode they have now should have been implemented ages ago, and isn't even anything special.

>You don't make fighitng games, understand them or play them competently so your perspective is shit
Wow let's see what we have here
>You don't make it so you can't critique it!
You should be able to tell how terribly flawed this sort of thinking is, you can make a million examples to prove that. You probably aren't game designer yourself, does that mean any critique you have about games is invalid? If you're not a mechanic, does that mean you can't complain if your car breaks down every hour? If you're not a cook, does that mean you can't complain if you order a meal and it's got cockroaches in it?

>You don't ... understand [Fighting games] or play them competently so your perspective is shit
Well now that's just projecting. I'm a big fan of fighting games which is why I backed Skull Girls in the first place. I'm actually one of the best players in my country for a few fighters and the top player in my country for a bunch of obscure anime fighters (Although that's mostly because I don't live in the US or Japan). I doubt you'd believe me unless if I beat you in Skull Girls (Which I don't even play anymore), but your claims have just as much power as mine here, which is to say none.

>The combo system was improved and made the game better
Obviously this is subjective, but what's not subjective is the fact that it took them over 3 years of constant changes to get it to where it is now, which was extremely annoying, as every 2 weeks you'd have to practice new combos or drop all of them in game.

>>387211651
sf2 is one of the only honest fighting games in existence, and even that had option select bullshit.
Nobody plays it cause you have few options, small roster, and any given matchup plays out very similarly every time.

>>387215795
The game was a lot more popular in its early days as far as I know. Even though Twitch is way more popular in the present Skull Girls got way more constant viewers back in the early days and it even got a ton of attention at FGC's and EVO. Now the only time it gets any attention is when there's a fighting game event going on and the main stream goes over to Skull Girls, then the moment the main stream goes off of it it becomes ignored once more.

>>387216574
>sf2 is one of the only honest fighting games in existence
Sagat.jpg

No fighting game is "honest".

"Honesty" in FGC's terms is an utopia that doesn't exist

>>387216574
theres nothing honest about it, fucking blockstring infinites, random stun and damage, wonky ass throws, crazy oppressive tier list throughout the versions

"honesty" is a laughable ideal to strive for in a fighting game anyways

Fantasy Strike is SFII distilled, and is already the most honest fighting game, despite being in pre-alpha short of Divekick.

>>387215795
>Old SG
>Someone gets hit, gets combo'd and dies in 5 seconds, keeping the action fast paced and very Marvel like
>New SG
>Someone gets hit, gets stuck in a mixup vortex that lasts a million years as the defending player has to read a 20/20/20/20/20 mixup to try and get out

One of the worst things about new SG is that learning pressure/mixups to reset is like 80% of the game now. Before when you could touch of death neutral game was way more important , now it's about doing pseudo touch of deaths where you do 2-4 resets on someone to essentially kill them in one combo or else your damage is going to be complete garbage.

>>387216968
resets are way more interesting and engaging than touch of death and there's in no way less neutral because of it, there is in fact objectively more

>>387216440
>GGPO netcode isn't anything special
It shits all over japanese netcode
skip to 4:48
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYCW0Dfixv4

>Top player in obscure anime games in a no name country
>Doesn't play Skullgirls and was probably horrible at it back then too
I'm not going to take your biased criticism that seriously

>This is subjective
The system is still the same, it's just more strict
>every 2 weeks
Exaggeration.

>>387216613
>The game was a lot more popular in its early days as far as I know.
The tournament entrant numbers are bigger than what it was than before.

>>387216968
>Old SG combos kills in 5 seconds
lol
https://youtu.be/o2c6Ku3uyc8
https://youtu.be/CPlnzXxigKE

>>387217176
Per game there is the potential for more since there's the chance someone will escape and survive, but because games were so much faster it meant over 10 minutes of play time there would be way more neutral game involved. Same thing with engagement. Before if I got hit I knew in a few seconds my next character would come out and I could continue playing. Now I have to stare at my character as their health slowly gets chipped down and mash/hold whatever I'm reading in hopes it works, that's not very engaging in the long run.

>>387217269
GGPO isn't anything special because tons of games are already using it. SFV is a horrendous example and lots of japanese games, especially obscure ones have horrible netcode. GGPO isn't anything special, it's just a standard at this point. If Skull Girls had proper netplay when it came out it would definitely be special as GGPO was relatively new, but today it's expected, not something amazing and special.

>I'm not going to take your biased criticism that seriously
Where's my bias? I said I liked skull girls back when it came out and now I don't think it's a good game. I didn't even tell you what my favorite games were or anything, the most I did was say SFV and GGXRD players have more average playtime. Your projection is going completely crazy at this point. If you want to pretend I'm bad/inexperienced/unfamiliar with fighting games as a defense mechanism for Skull Girls that's just childish. I can call you a shit player over the internet too but that's not going to prove anything.

>The system is still the same, it's just more strict
The combo system is definitely very different than it was before. The addition of the limit bar is very obvious and notable change to the combo system, as it adds a completely new rule to how you combo.

>2 weeks is an exaggeration
"Every 2 weeks" is misleading and an exaggeration, but changes happening in less than 2 weeks occasionally was not.

>>387217769
>Per game there is the potential for more since there's the chance someone will escape and survive, but because games were so much faster it meant over 10 minutes of play time there would be way more neutral game involved. Same thing with engagement. Before if I got hit I knew in a few seconds my next character would come out and I could continue playing. Now I have to stare at my character as their health slowly gets chipped down and mash/hold whatever I'm reading in hopes it works, that's not very engaging in the long run.
hmm never thought of it that way, interesting. i dont quite yet agree but its something to consider for sure

Super Smash Brothers for the Nintendo 64

>>387217269
>Person doesn't like a game and stops playing it
>You're not allowed to critique it because you don't play it anymore!

Retard logic. What do you expect? For them to torture themselves and keep playing something they don't like just to prove some one over the internet wrong?

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- "Honest" is a term perpetrated by people that think they can block well but can't
- Skullgirls is ass
- Play Vampire Savior or Samurai Shodown 5 Special

>>387214529
Took me like 6 watched to realize what happened. That was pretty sexy

>>387218205
all those games are shit

>>387218205
>vampire savior

he said honest, not your infinites, retarded gayfish unblockables, and qbee homing airdash shenanigans

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Is parry an honest mechanic? It requires good timing and sometimes good reads, but at the same time it seems a bit overpowered

>t. Only have about 400 hours in FGs, aka scrub

>>387217769
>I got hit I knew in a few seconds my next character would come out and I could continue playing.
Old SG - combos were longer that killed every time.
New SG - resets are often, and you actually have chances to get out of them, and if you get hit too many times, you trigger undizzy

>stare at my character
You should be staring at your enemy's combo so you can guess your defense at every reset point that you know

>GGPO isn't anything special, it's just a standard at this point.
I fucking wish

>Where's my bias?
>I said I liked skull girls back when it came out
>I don't even play Skull Girls any more

>limit bar
Why do you think you can critique it when you don't even know what it's called?

>>387218193
He doesn't play it and it's a different game now. When he did play it, he didn't fully understand it anyways. Idiots can go ahead and critique but it will be dumb, ignorant critique.

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>>387218485
But I never said Vampire Savior was honest.

>>387218576
At first glance, Parry is a great equalizer. In application though, it's VERY easy to parry a slower characters normals or specials, like Hugo in Third Strike, and punish with a quick normal/cancel into special/super. This creates a divide in the characters where they can all parry, but few get the most benefit from it.

>>387218620
>Somebody's opinion of a game changing overtime is bias
If anything that's literally the opposite of bias because his opinion changed, stop being retarded.

>Why do you think you can critique it when you don't even know what it's called?
In other fighters the same mechanic is called limit. The fact that you think this is enough of a reason to dismiss someone calling your favorite fighter not perfect shows how retarded you are.

>>387218576
The game has to built around it.

The universal parries in Soul Calibur are great!

The universal parries in 3rd strike destroy a bunch of play styles entirely.

>>387218576
At high level play it makes characters like Remy obsolete due to skilled players nullifying his ranged attacks.

Also strips the game down to the point where it is good normals that make the character like Yun, Ken and Chun Li.

>>387218620
>When you can't figure out how to argue so you point out nuances in how the other person says things as reasons to dismiss their argument
This is how you argue like a child, I think the only way to have a weaker argument is to just start name calling.

>>387218205
VampSave blows dicks..
t. vampire Savior player.

>>387219003
Who do you play anyway? I fucking hate Bulleta holy shit.

>>387218813
The game changed. His bias is for the old game and not for the new

The first time this mechanic was in a game was in MvC2 and it was called Undizzy and the game we're talking about doesn't call it anything else like limit.

>>387215795
>You don't make fighitng games, understand them or play them competently so your perspective is shit
you heard him, nobody is allowed to criticize anything ever again. if you dislike anything, you are wrong.

>>387219054
Gallon, Jedah.

>>387216440
>>387219195
>nobody is allowed to criticize anything
Go criticize a rocket's design, something you know nothing about to a rocket scientist and see how he cares about your opinion

>>387213598
I can still get in a match there faster than sfv though. And the best part is: When I get in a match I can actually enjoy it because in KOF I'm not watching a laggy ass powerpoint presentation like in Steeet Fighter.

>>387213949
It's supposed to mean something along the lines of straightforward. The most honest a game could get is dive kick but imagine only 1 character was playable and there were no abilities / gague.

>>387214718
Aesthetic doesn't mean art style.

>>387219116
You clearly have no idea what bias means. Someone liking something over another thing is not bias. Favoring something over another for illogical or unfair reasons such as unrelated matters is bias. (Protip: Going against your opinion is not unfair or illogical) Saying you like Old SG more than new SG because of the combo system is not bias. Saying you like old SG more than the new SG because someone you don't like joined the development team is bias.

>>387219423
If the rocket explodes and clearly doesn't work properly then damn right I'm allowed to criticize it. SG netplay made the game unplayable and it was a problem that anyone could recognize. Once again, I don't know anything about architecture but if the house I paid for falls down I can definitely complain about it. If the game I bought advertised amazing netcode and the netcode is shit I can complain about it even though I don't know how to program netcode.

>>387216968
My nibba. I didn't want to enter this Skullgirls stuff but you're honestly just fucking wrong. If that's how it originally was (which it wasn't) the game was created by MikeZ. The Mvc2 guy. Mvc2 is exactly like how you described it in "new SG". Old SG as you put it is more of UMvC3. The game was made to cater to Marvel 2 fans, by your logic they fixed the game.

>>387219423
>Be an astronaut who uses the rocket, aka someone who uses the product in question
>It clearly has a flaw that I can recognize, like a potential fire hazard or safety concern
>I'm not allowed to tell the rocket scientist because I don't make rockets

Don't be retarded. You wouldn't be able to complain about a huge amount of things in your life with your logic, whether it be food, your belongs, your car, your computer, etc.

>>387219708
Skull Girls is nothing like MvC 2, if anything it's more like MvC3 even today if MvC3 didn't have X factor. Just because MikeZ made it doesn't mean it's going to be a perfectly replica of MvC2, just look at Sirloin and his works even after his work with capcom.

>>387215291
As someone who hasn't played or followed Skullgirls at all I'l like to see point 3 explained.

>>387219850
Have you ever played Mvc3? If you can't kill someone off of a single combo you could very easily lose the match. Xfactor or none that's how it goes. Skullgirls is far from that. And I know just because it's made by a well known Mvc2 player doesn't mean it's like that but when it's made by a guy who said it's heavily inspired by Mvc2 you can't tell me it's not like that. Also, the game came out before base Mvc3.

>>387219850
Mvc2 is just combo, reset, combo, reset, combo, reset, incoming. Skullgirls is the game.

>>387211651
Super Smash Brothers: Melee, foremulation through Dolphin.If you disagree I want you to give me a good reason.

>>387219574
>Saying you like Old SG more than new SG because of the combo system is not bias.
It is when you're only choosing one or the other based on LIES you, yourself made up like
>Old SG combos killed faster
>Old SG combos allowed for more neutral somehow

>>387219574
>>387219719
>me can see obvious flaws
Wow, you're very useful to the rocket scientist. Good job at missing the whole point.

>>387214718
you mean artstyle. the general aesthetic (and even music) is pretty damn good.

>>387220052
What's your point? You can lose in Skull Girls if you don't kill someone after you open them up because it's also a very momentum heavy game, the same as MvC3. I'm not claiming Skull Girls is copying Marvel 3 so I don't know why you think pointing out how it came out first is relevant (Which isn't actually true by the way)
>>387220106
MvC2 has way different neutral game than Skull Girls, even if you don't include characters with flight, and MvC2 is definitely nowhere near as reset heavy as Skull Girls, for one thing it's actually normal for players to actually want to end their combo in a way that doesn't kill their opponent or directly open them up because you can't carry people to the floor/wall without even trying.

>>387220267
You're really amazing you know that?

>>387220431
If your whole point is "You're not allowed to criticize if it's not constructive or offers a solution" then that's not part of the issue at all. If I think there is a safety or health hazard in something I'm using then I should tell the producer even if I don't know how to fix it so they can. Not only that but I'm allowed to vocally complain about it so others know about the issue as well. Once again, I don't know how to make a car, but if I know a car line has faulty breaks I have every right to complain about it because it risks my life and others.

>>387220616
GEE, if I didn't know any better, I'd start to think that you haven't played or watched ANY version of the Marvel vs Capcom series. Hmm. Just so you know, momentum is a general term in EVERY FIGHTER. And you can't seriously make the claim that neutral isn't the same in Skullgirls and Mvc2. That's just the stupidest thing I've read when people talk about the two games.

what about DOA?

>>387220861
>Just so you know, momentum is a general term in EVERY FIGHTER.
I don't know what gave you the impression that I thought it was specific to a certain fighter, if anything I thought I implied the opposite.

>nd you can't seriously make the claim that neutral isn't the same in Skullgirls and Mvc2. That's just the stupidest thing I've read when people talk about the two games.
But it totally is, if you're misunderstanding me and think I mean that the definition of neutral is different between the two games then yeah that would be dumb, but what I mean is that what you do in neutral game between the two games is completely different, and I would believe it'd be ridiculous to refute that, simply because movement is very different.

>>387220616
The issue here is you don't understand new SG's combo system at all and you're remembering and describing old SG's systems wrong.
It's okay, you don't play the game anymore. Go ahead and shit on it with your wrong statements. Nobody's stopping you in this anonymous board, but you will be corrected.

>>387221114
Okay since you don't understand how neutral is preformed in both games, since you haven't played / seen one of them, I'll break it down.

SG: Throw out assists while applying pressure waiting for an opening. Once you are finally able to get that opening you convert it into a combo. After that combo you go for a reset where you either fail the reset and return to neutral, get hit and begin getting combo'd until the enemy has to go for that reset, or get the reset and do the rest of the combo.

MvC2: Throw out assists while applying pressure waiting for an opening. Once you are finally able to get that opening you convert it into a combo. After that combo you go for a reset where you either... I think you understand. Unless your definition of neutral game is completely different from everyone else's.

What I'm not getting here is the assertion that old SG ever had ToDs.
I played SG at launch too, and the game was all around slower, combos were obnoxiously long since the IPS wasn't as picky, meaning EZ loops for basically everyone, but scaling was very strong on those long ass combos and they rarely killed outside of maybe some 1v3 scenarios, hence why better players started using a more reset heavy style/ They found they could kill faster this way, and quite reliably with how dirty and creative this game lets you get with your mix ups. It was in response to this player trend that undizzy was added in the first place.

>>387220026
I'll try to explain it as carefully as I can.

Basically there are two ways to learn how to play any game. By playing it yourself or learning through others, such as by watching video replays, reading guides, etc. While you could potentially learn everything by playing yourself and in theory learn everything through others, you're usually expected to do a little bit of both. For fighters, it tends to be a lot of self-learning and a bit of learning through others, but it can depend on the game. Essentially the complaint is that a larger portion than usual can be learned through guides, which can be considered a negative. Some examples of learning things through guides in fighting games usually include things like combos, blockstrings, matchups, etc.

>>387221185
Can you give me a specific example of where I described something wrong or what I don't understand about the new combo system? I hope you're not just thinking about me not using the name they gave it in game or about how you disagree with me saying the old system was better because it allowed for more neutral, I already described why in an earlier post.

>>387212073
50/50 aren't at all dishonest. Even just googling the detention tells you that most consider it playing outside the games "rules"

>>387221386
You talk exactly like someone who watched some twitch streams and thinks he knows everything. You can describe neutral game in a way that makes EVERY fighter sound the same, but anyone who actually plays the games would know otherwise. If you think you can approach Skull Girls neutral with a similar mindset to Marvel then that's fine, but to say they play out the same is completely wrong, the simple fact that movement is completely different in both of the games means that neutral is totally different. Just look at how much more air mobility you have in MvC2 compared to Skull Girls, whether it be because of better jumping or because you're playing a character with flight, do you not think that would change how neutral game is played in even the slightest? Because on a competitive level even very small changes to mobility can completely change the way neutral game works. (And the difference between MvC2 flight and Painwheel flight is definitely nowhere near small)

>>387219445
We already had tons and tons of fighting games from the mid 80s with honest mechanics and perfect balance, since there usually only was one character to pick from.

>>387221386
This is the perfect example of /v/ posting on fighting games. "I clearly don't know what I'm saying but I'll try to make it sound convincing while claiming you haven't played any fighting games". Did you ever consider the possibility that MikeZ wouldn't want to make his game a clone of one of the least balanced fighters from over a decade ago due to some characters having ridiculous mobility?

>>387221579
I'm kind of surprised that by the end, SG never got a character with an 8-way air dash. With how nutty characters got with just double jumps and normal ass airdashes got in SG, I can only imagine how fucking crazy someone with straight up Magneto movement would be.

>>387221579
So your argument is "you can fly in one so it's different". So not only have you never responded to the fact that you have probably never played a single Marvel game EVER but with that argument you invalidated your prior one saying that SG is more similar to Mvc3 if anything. Mvc3 has LOADS more air mobility and a different approach to combat. Yet now that I show how both games are played you're going to say that it's not the same at all? Are you trying to bait people or something? I never said the game was copy and paste my argument is that the game was made to cater to Mvc2 fans (as MikeZ has stated) not to say everything was copy paste down to a T.

>>387220149
Slight RNG elements like Peach's turnips pulls and asymmetrical blastzones.

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>>387221415
Mostly everything you said in this post >>387216968 is wrong
You said yourself that you haven't played the new SG so you don't know that you die so much faster because of emphasize of resets (dodging damage scaling) and frame skip (the game is literally running faster)

>>387221742
Please point out where I said it was a clone in any way. I simply stated the core game play was the same. Never did I ever mention anything such as balance, characters, art style, or anything of the sorts. Also, insulting people isn't an argument.

>>387221919
>>387222017
>Not recognizing what a rhetorical question is

>>387222137
>not going to mention devaluing your original point
I guess I won my argument for the day. Maybe you'll win yours with some other Anon in this thread.

>>387222247
I concede, you are clearly a master at arguments on the internet.

>>387222784
It's honorable to give up. It's a good thing you did that half way into the argument. Have a great day youngling

>>387221976
I would disagree though, there was definitely a time where combos killed very quickly, since there was little scaling outside of maybe the last 10% of someone's life bar, and usually people would build enough meter to just kill 2 supers at the end. There was definitely a weird time between early beta and now where combos took ages though, like after they made crouching attacks usually count as the same as a standing one in combos. I will admit though that I didn't know about frame skipping, that's new to me.

>>387221921
randomness is a bigger factor in ST than Melee, and ST is THE honest game

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>>387211651
What does "honest" have to do with the concept of fighting or martial arts anyway? You are literally getting beaten into submission my shit you wern't ready for/ aware of. That's how martial arts work.

>>387211651
Honest is a meme for people who can't handle mixups or setplay.

>>387224810
b-b-b-but it's gotta be "FAIR"

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>>387226112
Fighting isn't fair. I sometimes wonder if videogames are for anons that couldn't handle the variables that come from real life competition. Like, if there is not some tried and tested method for 100% certain execution they throw their toys out the pram and blame everyone else, ao thry just never took part in sports or martial arts.

>>387217769
this was a nice read,anon.

I honestly think the game wasn't very good from the beginning,and this comes from some one that played it in multiple different occasions after every update to see if the game would one day be interesting to me.

Just out of curiosity,how would you fix the game?

>>387212646
>everything is unpunishable
>some characters just get shit on cause they don't have unpunishable

>>387227268
why would you pay for entertainment that consists you being a punching bag for someone?

even if you didn't have to pay, what fun is in being beat on?

I honestly think that a fighting game that is too honest is boring.

I think it's perfectly fine for each character to have their own dumb gimmicks or 'dishonest' moves, it makes them all a bit more unique.

>>387228075
>everything is unpunishable
False.
>some characters just get shit on cause they don't have unpunishable
False and also contradicts the first point.

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>>387228163
>even if you didn't have to pay, what fun is in being beat on?
>why is being an athlete and learning to get better at combat sports fun??

Oh right... board of normies, shit i forgot.

>>387228293
everything is super safe in FS what are you on about
and then some characters cant punish at all
like that painter bitch has a sweep that you can never reach with anyone
what the fuck

>>387228395
>why is being an athlete and learning to get better at combat sports fun??
really, why?
i dont want to get better i want to play the game in my free time and relax

>getting better at fighting via getting punched in the face
you should be worlds fucking champion then

>>387228397
>pokes are unpunishable
>this is bad

What sort of crazy games do you play where every poke is punishable?

>>387211651
It's weird, I was playing super street fighter 2 turbo on the switch, and the colour of the background charactera were changed to red, and the bottom star looked more like Americas flag.

>>387228476
>spams unpunishable positive poke
>you can only block and try to walk away
>only counter is either shoto from a bit farther away cause if you jump you just get fucked by aa
fuck that

also that archer chick is an absolute cancer shoto bullshit with not one or two but three fucking projectile abilities that you can just spam forever and chip? what the fuck do you do against that?

>>387228369
Even though this tier list is garbage what are your problems with tekken 7
Having the time of my life with it so far

>>387228578
>only counter is either shoto from a bit farther away cause if you jump you just get fucked by aa

She doesn't have a good anti-air, and if she's poking she wouldn't be able to use it to counter a jumpin anyway.

Also, literally everyone has tools to deal with it. Setsuki can demon flip, DeGrey can dandystep->kick or pilebunker even maybe, Midori can counter, rook can armor through, shotos have reversals...

You are a retard who is slamming his face into a wall and complaining about how it hurts.

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>>387228468
>getting better at fighting via getting punched in the face

Honestly? Probably would make most people better desu. Too many faggots around that have never been hit in their fucking life and don't know what a vunerable little bitch they are till they realise it by force. Yeah actually, some people could do with a beating. It might make them either toughen the fuck up or stop being whiny little bitches on the internet. Only little faggots more afraid of the IDEA of getting into a competitive fight, than the actual temporary pain and shock that it actually involves will try to refute this.

>>387228578
>also that archer chick is an absolute cancer shoto bullshit with not one or two but three fucking projectile abilities that you can just spam forever and chip? what the fuck do you do against that?

Depends on the character, but she's a hard zoner, you are supposed to deal with it, possibly taking a 1-2 damage on the way in.

>>387228709

this. tekken 7 is at least as good or better than tekken 5

>>387228883
Ooff, thats a hard one for me to call, especially if you mean the rebalancing and improving of fighters in the DRO version... Certainly the best SINCE that one, maybe equel too. I like 7 better for how much better Kazuya is (jumping kick all day mofos) so i might lean more towards 7.

>>387228871
fuck zoning, im not dealing with it
its ridiculous enough in mainstream fighting games but this is just over the top

>>387228806
you sound like a fucking nutjob mate
i doubt many people play games for whatever reason you play games

>>387229063
Okay, pick Geiger, use gears to cancel out the fireballs (she can literally not do anything about this), and then timewalk to her once you get super. You can 100% punish jumping arrows with it on reaction, and standing arrows on prediction.

SFV is surprisingly honest tbqh

>>387228369
Accurate

>>387229269
It's surprisingly gay, too tbqh

>>387228369
>MKII in low tier
WHAT THE FUCK

>>387229269

It's honestly a giant piece of unfun repetitious shit when's dudley fuuuuuck.

>>387229230
she has more than one shot though?..

i mean nice advice and i'd try it if the game was available
unless its going to be free im not going back though (and its gonna die anyway unless its free so)

>>387219508
>>387214718
Art style is indeed ugly, but the entire movie reel feel to it and the 1920s WELP, THAT'S WRAP! thing behind everything is just annoying and unappealing as well.

>>387229269
>fishing with your character's one good normal to v-trigger into 40% combo
>completely ineffective zoning
>honest

>>387229403
She can only have 1 horizontal fireball on the screen at a time.

Her raining arrows don't reach full screen.

She may shoot a charge arrow or you may get an unlucky clash with a falling arrow and be forced to jump, and then you can even do air B to control when you fall to ensure you don't fall on something.

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>>387229035
also tekken looks fucking slick

>b-but graphics dont matter
the main reason i can't stand street fighter since 4 is because of how fucking retarded the clay dinguses look

>>387229527
>Her raining arrows don't reach full screen.
dont have to


but seriously, can you not agree that shotos are the most boring part of fighting games and the most annoying?

>>387229157
Im not talking about games anymore, im talking about people who don't into a full contact sport. Im talking about too many weak bitches.

>>387229597
Nah, getting past their objective course and baiting the shoryuken is satisfying as fuck.

Hitting Dragon Midori's dive-grab just so it ducks under the air arrows but right over/behind the ground arrow makes me hard every time.

>>387229659
good for you then
/sp/ is the other way

>>387229530
yeah SF looks disgusting

>>387211651

Isn't Guile broken as shit in sf2? Only character that had any chance against him was sim.

>>387229763
>objective course
Obstacle course. Fuck.

>>387229915
Depends on which SFII. By ST he was fairly reeled in (but then ST had O.Sagat).

>>387211651
>It's another "/v/ scrubs try to discuss fighting games and show how little they know about them" episode.

>>387229834
>normies

>>387229763
well i guess i just disagree then

remember that killer instinct tournament fight where the guy just spammed projectiles all round?
not fun to look at

>>387230056
Okay, sure, when there's no way around them, to the point where in a tournament setting a pro will just stand and take it for multiple seconds (I'm assuming this was Jago with instinct, yeah?), it's bad, but FS DOES have ways around them. There's a pretty nice spot between "impossible to beat" and "may as well not exist", which is what it's going for.

Jaina's zoning is the best in the game and you can still weave between her stuff. If it was easy, it wouldn't be as satisfying.

>>387230267
but why are you allowed an easy ability that is really hard to counter?
shouldnt risk reward be balanced instead of this?

>>387228369
move up tekken 7 move down skullgirls, then list is perfecto

>>387212073
This. I went into fighting games thinking people were into level competition fields and sportsmanship, but the FGC at large likes cheesy bullshit. See: Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom 3

>>387230447
Because you playing a zoner. It's what you do. You Zone. DeGrey has easy 4-5 damage combos (on CH). Setsuki/Valerie has easy mobility/mixups. Rook/Midori has easy grapples and good defense.

They are archetypes. Everyone has some cheap shit that he's supposed to do, and it's up to you to find what tools your character has to get around that cheap shit, and then your opponent needs to adjust to get around your get around, etc.

If they didn't do this, you'd end up with bland characters. Like SFV

>>387230706
Technically every game is even as long as the option of mirror matching exists.

>>387230812
>why have low risk high reward
>because
i dont get it

>>387230864
>>387230706
Huh, didn't want to send it yet.

Anyway, yes, current fighting game generation is infested with faggots who would rather practice combos and unblockable setups than play against another human being, and mistake this for being skilled at fighting games, so much so that some 10 year old with basic as fuck fundamentals could make it in MvC3.

>>387230864
"Technically". In my perfect FGC world, games would be SFV except with more defensive options and throw loops wouldn't be as disgustingly viable. In reality, everyone that's trying to play to win will immediately gravitate towards a zoner that won't give the opponent a chance to throw a normal out or someone with a basically infinite combo

>>387230920
It's only low risk, high reward when your opponent is on the other end of the screen.

The moment he is next to you, suddenly all your options with Jaina are Extremely High Risk, mediocre reward.

This is what it means to be a hard zoner. This is her archetype.

>>387231086
i hate that

>>387231086
yea but you start on the opposite sides of the screen by default
so you always have an advantage

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Doesn't get more honest than this. Balance be damned

Kof 98

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_8-jNtkf_8

>>387231216
Well, I guess play Tekken or SFV then? Or play characters who can mitigate it easily.
>>387231163
You start at a range where you can jump in on her with a good read.

>>387231885
>You start at a range where you can jump in on her with a good read.
>jump back jumping fireball on reaction

>>387232058
>jump back jumping fireball on reaction
Awesome, at that distance you can walk under both of her jumping fireballs, and most characters have a move with long enough range to punish.

I did say you need a read.

>>387232264
>you can walk under
you are still in the air and you get hit in the face with it
what part of "on reaction" you didnt get?

>>387232443
That means she has to wait to see what you do (which, if you immediately jumped, was the correct choice). That in itself, is a commitment.

Basically, the mixup at start is something like this:
Jaina can...
- fireball (beats you walking forward, loses to jump in)
- jump fireball (beats jumping in, loses to walk forward)
- wait out (has to react to what you do).

What your options are depends on character, but you always have some options that beat out each of Jaina's (to varying degrees; some can get 2-3 damage+mixup from a good read, some only get getting in close).

The point is, you need to evaluate and predict what your opponent is going to do, and what you need to do yourself in order to beat that move. This is the heart and core of fighting games, it's what elevates them above just mashing buttons at each other.

>>387233524
i want to tell you to go fuck yourself but i cant, youre right, i just didnt get enough time in the game
probably wouldn't have the patience though to beat those things

>>387233851
There's some matchup guides in the making on the official forums, if you want to take a shortcut, you can always check those/ask for help there, but it's basically guaranteed you'll have to adjust mid game.

If Jaina can get her zoning on, she's often infuriating. Were you playing Rook? He really suffers unless you know exactly how to use his tools.

>>387229448
yeah, I imagine that cunt inspector gadget shouting it all out.

What a cunt he is, eh?

>>387211651
What does it mean for a fighting game to be honest?

>>387234129
well the free period ended so unless its going to be f2p im not getting in

i tried everyone, liked the fat dragon guy the best and the default blue guy