Which one is better?

Skyrim is at least a decent hiking simulator. Oblivion is awful in every possible aspect.

>>386772162
Vanilla Skyrim>Vanilla Oblivion
Modded Oblivion>Modded Skyrim

Oblivion had critical flaws with the leveling system and scaling but those can be fixed. However, you cannot fix the bland stealth archer simulator that is Skyrim.

>>386772162
Basically what this guy says OP>>386772390
Both are fucking shit but Oblivion's flaws can be fixed with mods.
The only thing Skyrim has over Oblivion is much better world where locations feel like part of the world not Daggerfall tier dungeon entrances in planes of jack shit and forests.
But that can be fixed with mod too.

>want to replay Oblivion
>remember all the caves and aylied ruins are pointless to even explore as theyre all the same and have no decent loot inside

at least rimjob has that chance for a word wall to make you go and look. dragonborn is a shit story compared to the champion of cyrodiil/new sheogorath though

>>386772615
kinda glazing over everything else in oblivion there just so you can be wrong and feel justified

>>386773060
elaborate because i have no idea what you said

>>386772965
Install Oblivion Oscuro Overhaul and Duke Patricks Combat Archery
Add to that Unique Landscape series.
And whatever sex mods you want
and whatever else flavour stuff you want but OOO is must since it fixes the issue you mentioned.
Also adds new uniques n shit all over the world.

>>386773443
nevermind i misread your post lol

>>386772390
have you played a stealth archer in oblivion, it's even more broken

>>386773575
>install some fucking overhaul
>it makes you unequip everything you wear when going to bed because muh realism
>you can't complete this side quest where you need to go to sleep with a special necklace

>>386772390
spbp

Skyrim doesn't have equivalents to Deadly Reflex+Unnecessary Violence and Lop-ears elves.

i actually like oblivion more vanilla and think skyrim has better mods to offer to make the game better, i enjoy the colors music and environments in oblivion and i never level up

Obscuros overhaul is absolute garbage trash.

>>386773979
What the fuck are you on about.
None of those do that shit.
OOO basicaly fixes whatever issue that anon had and Dukes stuff makes combat much faster.

>>386774135
You are wrong.
Not a single mod can fix Skyrim floaty combat.

>>386772162
Oblivion had better side/faction quests.
Skyrim had a better everything else and had solid side/faction quests.

INB4
Wahhh someone could become the Archmage without casting a spell.
Quit worrying about how other people play the game autist.

Both feel awkward as fuck. I've never understood why this series got so popular.

>>386772162
I like Oblivion more - especially for it's more heartlands and hell aesthetic, but Skyrim is probably the better game.

>>386774249
>playing a TES game for its combat

>>386772615
>>386772390

the main quest is unfixable in both games but Skyrim has a better combat to work with despite the lack of attributes and skill types

Skyrim also has many more weapon mods than Oblivion which lacks anything as elaborate as throwing weapons and localized damage.

>>386774143
>OOO basicaly fixes whatever issue that anon had

OOO does not overhaul the dungeons nor adds unique loot.

honestly what sucks the most about oblivion is that the high tier stuff isn't even really that good, or looks good anyway. Sure if you fix the levelling maybe overpowered stuff will stay overpowered and relevant, but it will still look like shit and be pulled from a really small variety of items.

>>386773575
>Duke Patricks Combat Archery
>removed from nexus
>now it's on a 3rd party site
>Create an account or sign in to download this
nope

>>386772615
what exactly are those unfixable flaws in skyrim?

>>386775020
because you were too young back then.

>>386777417

It's not even that good really, it makes the amount of pull you need to fully charge a bow ridiculous and makes actual fast shooting impossible, the arrows make a ridiculously short curve into the ground and they're still overpowered doing up to 5-6 times as much damage as they should. You'll enjoy it if you like plotting shots like fucking mortar fire instead of actual archery.

Duke Patricks' melee combat mod, forget the whole name, is actually much better but it's still far from satisfying or completely remedial to the static wet paddle situation, but it does encourage you to use your movement and gain inertia to strike harder, and to dodge and flank, it's too bad the AI can't be convinced to be smarter and timed blocking still does fuckall.

Honestly, for all the pomp, Oblivion modders have spent much, much more time making houses and slutty dresses for anime loli waifus over the years than making the game more fun and complex, or filling it with new, quality items, or pushing the gameplay and mechanics to their limit despite having much more to work with than Skyrim, and that's why anyone who says Oblivion has better mods is a delusional chucklefuck. You look at the nexus and there is only around 30 mods for Oblivion that really have a focus on fixing the games' shortcomings or expanding it without veering off into some faggot's own fanfiction idea.

>>386772162
morrowind>oblivion>skyrim

this is coming from someone who played morrowind late

>>386777212
Except OOO adds unique loot

>>386778813
whoa check out this contrarian

>>386777561
no classes
no stat points
floaty combat
Why the fuck I even type that this has been discussed dozen of times

>>386776915
Except it doesnt have better combat
It's still floaty no matter what mods you use.
Something Oblivion mods can fix.

>>386780180
>It's still floaty no matter what mods you use.

that's oblivion

and no, no mods can make Oblivion's combat anything like what Wildcat and Ultimate Combat make Skyrims.

>>386772162
Vanilla Skyrim is better. Modded Skyrim is also better.

Oblivion has better quests. That's it.

The leveling system is terrible, enemy scaling system is terrible, and the graphics are terrible even for the time. The combat is more clunky and stale than Skyrim's. The voice acting is worse than Skyrim's.

I love Oblivion, mainly becasue it is my first TES game, but only shills and contrarians believe it is better than Skyrim.

>>386780332
>he never played with Deadly Combat and Unnecessary Violence
Oh it shows that you have not experienced those mods combined together.
But Skyrim, there is not a single mod that changes combat for better.
You can make it a tad bit better with Wildcat. TK Dodge and No auto aim attack mod but it's still floaty shit.

>>386780654

>flashy weeaboo summersault combat
>good

>>386780913
great argument there or lack of it

>>386772162
Skryim has the better gameplay, graphics and leveling system.

Oblivion had better quests, spell making and the best expansion DLC for a single player game of all time.

I will still lean towards Skyrim though. Better world overall in addition to the other positives. Oblivion's cartoon graphics really hurt the game overall imo. It is hard to get past its other flaws because of it. TES shouldn't ever look cartoony. Even Morrowind looked better visually because of this. TES is not that kind of franchise.

>>386781034

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=117fuWIi7Wg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sVXVIbFi6k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uB85jBGN0M

"not floaty shit"

>>386781223
Compared to Skyrim, nope.

>>386781283

how many layers of cognitive dissonance does one have to be to believe this anons

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9e0T6i8Vkw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3pKL6Ch1aU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQpx4IwN0Yw

>>386781632
Well I stand corrected all I thought about Ultimate Combat how shit it is, but now I see this 3.0 version and it's actually not bad.
Do weapons also deal damage to multiple enemies or just one enemy like it is in vanilla.
By that I mean when you slash and you have few enemies in front of you.

>>386780005
>contrarian
it's more just not being underage

>>386781890
>Do weapons also deal damage to multiple enemies or just one enemy like it is in vanilla.

there's a perk that makes it so that your swings deliver damage across the entire arc

>>386781969
That was in vanilla for 2handed weapons.
But I would like all weapons do that.

>>386774892
I love both games but this is accurate.

>>386781935
>calls someone else underage while only including the three most popular games in a series in his ebin rankings list

>>386782054

i'm not exactly sure which mod adds it but i'm pretty sure it's one of them, there's a huge variety

https://youtu.be/Mc9c7gPl0M8?list=PLTg8cwSFmyGxISeHy1CnHvdRNJJKG48NK

>>386782353
I really like that Ultimate Combat 3.0
It basicaly does what I talked bout with a friend long time ago.
Making weapons be more part of the game not just animation like Dark Messiah does it.
I see it has Locational Damage, does it work with Wildcat then?

>>386772390
Literally the opposite, faggot. The fuck is wrong with you?
The leveling system is what makes Oblivion unique. Are you one of those easy mode faggots that need to have a leveling mod to simplify it for you? kys.

I only see people shitting ong both games here nowdays. Am I now the only one left who thinks they are both amazing games?

>>386783789
you enjoy video games, anon, not many of us do it nowdays

>>386783789
>Am I now the only one left who thinks they are both amazing games?

you probably haven't played them enough to realize the wasted potential and poorly thought-out implementation, and the mediocrity of the whole thing compared to other games.

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>>386784546

>I played and enjoyed this game for 250 hours before I realized it was irredeemable garbage

I'm not even disagreeing that Skyrim and Oblivion both have some glaring issues, but it's not like it's weird or wrong that people enjoy them. They're easy to enjoy, kind of like a hamburger.

They aren't the pinnacle of cuisine, but they're still pretty tasty if you aren't being a pretentious twat.

>>386772162
Oblivion by fucking miles

>>386780635
>and the graphics are terrible even for the time.
t. someone not born at that time

>nu-/v/ has convinced itself skyrim is a good game
In a few years you'll all be praising fallout 4
What a fucking absolute joke

>>386784942

>look at Oblivion environments
>hey not bad
>look at a character model
>jesus christ what the fuck

It was very visually impressive in some ways, but the fucking animations and character models are shit regardless.

>>386780098
>no stat points
>no classes
this didn't affect character building in the game

>>386785053

MAYBE it's because it isn't new and shiny and the angry shitposters have moved on to other topics leaving just the people who enjoyed it all along behind to have a civil discussion about something they like?

>nu-/v/

Fuck off, queer. Probably born after 1995 and haven't been here longer than 5 years.

The Shivering Isles expansion for Oblivion was easily my favorite thing Bethesda has done

>>386785191
I've been here for six years you fucking queer

Oblivion. No contest.

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>oblivion
>better quests
>better art and aesthetic
>better music
>better characters
>better towns
>better main story
>better random encounters
>better magic
>better joinable factions
>skyrim
>worse everything
Yeah this is really fucking hard to choose.

>>386782602
Not him, but just because it's unique doesn't mean it's better. It's fucking tedious spamming spells or swimming for fucking minutes just to get a reasonable build going, honestly, nothing good about it.

>>386784756

>They aren't the pinnacle of cuisine, but they're still pretty tasty if you aren't being a pretentious twat.

they're like Burger King, sure, it's a burger for when you really really want a burger after not having had anything in weeks, but if you could get Wendy's or some kind of traditional local chain you just recoil in disgust at the thought of the paper bags, the meat that very clearly has something gluing it together, the cheese that doesn't taste like anything at all and doesn't melt no matter how hot it gets, and the lettuce and tomatos that look like they were harvested years too early. It literally only looks good when you're too awestruck at the promo pic to look at the actual product.

>>386785075

the environment quickly loses it's luster when you realize that in context, everything is treated as busy cities and vast wilderness, and then you walk two minutes across a little creek and come across a medieval themed condo and that's that, or you exit a settlement, take a right turn and find some "unknown, mysterious ruin" a few yards away from the road.

Okay, Skyrim's cities were worse, but holy fuck, the caves and the ruins and the forts and dungeons were at least well hidden and not placed literally next to the roads like touristic stops. It makes me mad to see more abandoned imperial forts than occupied, functioning ones(if they actually exist in this fucking game), or ayleid ruins and caves spewing monsters on a supposedly very frequented road.

>>386785075
Character models in skyrim are even worse without mods.
All the elves are so horrendously ugly and fucked not even mods have fixed the problem.

>>386772162
Oblivion solely because the quests are great. I haven't touched it in years but I can probably remember the plotlines of dozens of quests. I played skyrim like 2 years ago and I can maybe remember 5. Mods can't fix that.

>no character journal in skyrim

>>386772162
Skyrim is the only game I've ever pre-ordered.

Oblivion was the first TES game I ever played.

Oblivion has far more interesting writing to me, as well as a more intruiging main quest.
The side quests are also compelling and can often lead to the most enjoyable plot twists/outcomes in the game, including loot and companions.
Races felt unbalanced but that only matters early game.

Skyrim has more fluid combat, with desireable perks that aren't horribly difficult to obtain.
The shouts are a unique way to give melee combat more avenues of attack, but are far too useful.
Characters, towns, and setpieces are for the most part bland and forgettable.
Snowy mountains get boring, really quickly.

Overall, I had far more fun with Oblivion than Skyrim, and I have played all of the DLC for both.

Never forget the Pale Prince of the arena...R.I.P.

>>386786047
Nice reddit reaction images there mate
I could really identify with all the wacky faces xDD

>>386786113
I feel like this is bait but /v/ has had those threads for probably a lot longer than you've posted here

if u dont think skyrim is the best game ever kys

>>386786047
i don't understand how people can say they love daggerfall and hate skyrim
they're equally bland

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>>386786212
Yeah these faces are so funny lol what's that guy's problem

>>386776915
>Skyrim also has many more weapon mods than Oblivion which lacks anything as elaborate as throwing weapons and localized damage.
....What ? No. Oblivion has those things plus far more mods that actually make combat better.

>>386786312
no one said that, shitposter, but it's objectively less shit than oblivion

>>386786364
It's just a contrarian acting like they've played an old game

>>386776915
>Skyrim also has many more weapon mods than Oblivion which lacks anything as elaborate
The absolute irony

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>>386780635
>and the graphics are terrible even for the time.
The graphics were fine.

>>386786549
>>386786386
>....What ? No. Oblivion has those things plus far more mods that actually make combat better.

find me a spear mod that works with mounted combat, a mod with explosive and sticky trap grenades, javelins and axes, a mod that has different magical enchantments and soul gem arrows as well as torch-extinguishing and climbing rope arrows and a mod that allows me to grip two handed swords with only one hand by pressing a hotkey mid-combat as well as select only thrust attacks that have different effects.

>>386786687
Oh I thought you were talking about enchantments like rings of water-walking and stuff

>>386786687
I could, in fact. But that would take a bit of effort and since you're just an ignorant retard it's not worth it.

Literally all of those mods for Skyrim were inspired by their Oblivion counterparts.

And like I said, Oblivion has far more mods that actually tangibly make combat better.

>>386786771

you can get that too in Skyrim, i think there's literally nothing in Oblivion and Morrowind that hasn't been replicated to some extent in Skyrim by now, even if it requires some MCM fuckery like Worlds' Dawn.

>>386786862
>I could, in fact. But that would take a bit of effort and since you're just an ignorant retard it's not worth it.

so you just like talking shit with no evidence, do you

>>386772162
I was never able to decide, I think they're both great. Oblivion, probably, because custom spells and Shivering Isles was better than Skyrim expansions.

>>386786902
>you can get that too in Skyrim
Not in the base game
The enchantment system doesn't support multiple enchantments like Oblivion had either.

>>386780098
>no classes
so fucking what? There's a point past which leveling up only makes the game harder. That's effectively a soft-cap in the sense that you're locked on progression unless you seek hard mode. That's when you stop leveling and your character's final stats are it's ""class"".

>no stat points
fair enough. There are no stat points. However, there's the skill tree which kind of acts as a stat atribute system : You can put X amount of points into Conjuration and get some perks along the way. It's the exact same thing but more "combat ability" oriented stat points and less "the character itself" oriented stat points.

TL/DR: just a different design philosophy behind the stat points implementation. One which has more impact on gameplay, even.

>floaty combat
As opposed to what? Combat has always been shit on TES.

>This has been discussed dozen of times
So what, /v/ is a hivemind ? Fuck off to reddit.

>>386786902
>there's literally nothing in Oblivion and Morrowind that hasn't been replicated to some extent in Skyrim by now
good gameplay? skyrim is fucked on the most fundamental levels and no amount of mods can make it good.

>>386772162
Skyrim solely due to how generic Cyrodiil looks in Oblivion

>>386787075
Previous games had both skills and stats, one does not replace the other.

>>386787029
You can have multiple enchantments in skyrim though?

>>386786902
>so you just like talking shit with no evidence, do you
What an ironic thing to say.

Why would you assume I was wrong when you know you have no idea what you're talking about?

I'm confused as to why you're shitposting so hard.

>>386787029
>Not in the base game

we're talking mods though, you can get an effect + an attribute and a power with some scripts, a few mods do it.

>>386787082
>good gameplay? skyrim is fucked on the most fundamental levels and no amount of mods can make it good.

the most wrong thing about Skyrim is, as usual, the main quest, and let's be honest, Oblivion's is still worse because at least the Civil War creates more autistic arguments and made people more interested than the Oblivion crisis.

>>386786371
kill yourself you meme parrot. You don't even know what you're saying. You think you do, but you don't.

>>386787218
You can put two enchantments on the same item if you have the level 100 perk in enchanting

>>386786902
Can you jump while attacking? Can you attack underwater? Can you jump on water?

>>386787269
They both had bad main quests but Oblivion had significantly better sidequests and guilds.

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>>386787292
Hahaaa yeah maybe I'm not too good at this yet lol
I'm trying!

>>386787269
Civil war wasn't even the main quest of Skyrim what do you mean

>>386787478
Come on man did you have a shit day at work or something?

>>386786047
daggerfall is fucking terrible though.

>>386787250
>Why would you assume I was wrong when you know you have no idea what you're talking about?

burden of proof you nigger

>>386787210
http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Skill_Perks

This is something you stumble upon and won't even realize during normal gameplay. Skyrim's is better as you choose what you want.

>>386787618
Just not a fan of normalizing reddit meme faces on here

>>386787707
>Skyrim's is better as you choose what you want.
Which is why it's so fucking shallow.

>>386787654
I mean, yeah. It's on you. It's really clear you have no idea and you're literally just shitposting. No one is going to help you but yourself at this point.

>>386787721
But they originated here. We don't have to constantly get grey hairs over whatever that shit side does dude.

>>386787210
the whole point of the skill/perks/stat/attribute shit in rpgs is for players to craft and build their characters however they want, and Skyrim's system doesn't restrict that.

>>386787861
Trollface originated here but no one should post it seriously here anymore

>>386786364
Daggerfalls combat is clunky and boring, but it has some top notch lore compared to Skyrim and Oblivion.

>>386787803
So you want character stats because you prefer to control and fine-tune your character, but then Skyrim's perk system is literally 'you get exactly what you want' but its bad? That's not consitent, anon..

>>386772162
They're both pretty bad.
Skyrim at least isn't as bland and has waifu potential.

>>386787938
Trollface went a lot farther than reddit.

how anyone can prefer skyrim's shitty quests to oblivion's quests is beyond me.

>>386787813

I described mods that exist in skyrim, every single one that is among the top downloaded ones, while you haven't mentioned anything. Honestly, your exaggerated smug demeanor just comes off as dragging this on while you desperately look for oblivion ones to backup your claim after you realized i wasn't going to back down.

>>386788004
Daggerfall has the best combat system in the series you fucking pleb.

>>386788105
the guilds are better in Oblivion too

>>386788115
>I described mods that exist in skyrim
That are incidentally inspired by Oblivion mods. Yet you, who have not modded Oblivion, say they don't exist.

You're ignorant, and shitposting.

>>386788169
the guild quest lines are far, far better in oblivion indeed. the dark brotherhood in skyrim is fucking embarrassing.

>>386787934
>>386788027
>do whatever you want
This is the very reason Bethesda has never made a good RPG but it's only gotten worse as they dumbed things down and removed mechanics. At the very least with classes you were more focused towards a specific kind of character and if you tried to do things outside of your skill set you would be less effective. With the removal of classes there's no reason not to just minmax the most useful skills and ignore everything else making every single playthrough the same unless you go out of your way to choose skills you know aren't useful.

>>386788235
>That are incidentally inspired by Oblivion mods. Yet you, who have not modded Oblivion, say they don't exist.

then name them, and explain how they do anything like what they accomplish in Skyrim.

burden of proof.

>>386788335
see>>386786862

>>386788432

circular logic, oh woe, what will i ever do to recover.

>>386788613
>circular
Wow you really are a retard, my stance hasn't changed.

>>386788734

you claim you're right because you said you're right before.

your stance is "i'm a massive fucking faggot wasting someone elses' time"

>>386788259
>the dark brotherhood in skyrim is fucking embarrassing.

Are you kidding? The story was great. It's about a woman destroying her little family when she tries to keep control over it. It's a solid tragedy.

>>386788836
>you claim you're right
Uh no, I claimed you're ignorant and you still are.

>>386789043

and you can't even prove that ad hominem because you still refuse to post a single link.

do you have brain problems?

>>386788846
>i love the dark brotherhood that's why i sabotaged our best assassin on his most important job them sold out the entire brotherhood to the imperials

>>386789195
>ad hominem
Imagine choosing to be this ignorant.

>>386789247

come on anon, your parents raised you better than this.

Currently playing through morrowind right now. Personal thoughts:

>Morrowind has the most freedom out of the modern elder scrolls games and it is great how open it is and the alternate ways you can handle quests. However, the questlines themselves can be a bit generic and repetitive without much focus, the dungeons are small and many times pointless, and the NPCs unique personalities are few and far between. That, and the game can be a bit easy to break and exploit once you know what you are doing.

>Oblivion is a huge leap in tech, gives more character to the NPCs and more definite stories to the different factions and misc. quests. However, in the process it makes a lot of the quests have less options on how to tackle them, has a lot of fluff dungeons that are overly long and don't go anywhere, and dumbs down some of the basic mechanics from Morrowind.

>Skyrim has a interesting setting, decent visuals, and the biggest modding scene of all 3 games. However, it further dumbs down everything to where it isn't even a RPG anymore, removes key things that have been series staples and forcing people to mod them back in, and has fairly forgettable storylines and a disappointing main story.

I don't think any of the 3 games are bad by any stretch, but I think Oblivion is the best in-between of some of the more hardcore elements of Morrowind and the casual side of Skyrim and has some fairly memorable quests.

Morrowind is great for its pure freedom and ability to fuck around any way you like, but also has some mechanics that are either broken (Stealth is so fucked in this game and is easy to pull off) or aggravating (NPC AI for escorting is worse then Dead Rising).

Skyrim is great for modding and has some good action, but is the most boring of the three and casualizes it too far to the point of the series no longer being a true RPG and guaranteeing future titles will be even more dumbed down.

>>386789960
Thanks for the in depth analysis, anon. This makes me want to go and try Morrowind.

>>386789215
At least it's better than the Thieves' Guild
>I spent my entire life working on this poison so I could get my revenge
>I only made a single dose
>I fired it at the first person who walked into the room without confirming my target for the shot I spent literal decades planning
>It's fine though because it's actually just sleeping medicine

>>386793108
People liked spears? I thought they were hot garbage in Morrowind.

>>386793108
He's right. Perks are the devil.

>>386772162
I prefer Oblivions main story and ability to craft spells but Skyrims mechanics were a lot better.

I enjoyed both though, who cares just play video games.

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Oblivion is better vanilla or modded

>>386793392
No, perks are great.

>>386793392
Perks a great if done right, like in Fallout

>>386781223
>Even Skyrim now has poise, yet dark souls does not

Is this true?

>>386781223
>>386781632
the melee in both is pretty much the same dodge mashing shit.

>>386793253
That is not the point here. The point is that it is really dumb for such games to not have a weapon type that they absolutely should be having in these games. The lack of spears in these games would be as obvious as swords or bows being omitted. It makes zero sense for Bethesda to not only remove spears but not even bring them back in Skyrim.

Axes, swords, maces, bows and spears are virtually mandatory weapons in games like this. Nobody is ever asking them to put an exotic weapon in the game here that isn't in much games like say a kusari gama. I shouldn't even have to explain this to a pleb like you who might just be baiting anyways.

>>386793392
Some level of 'perks' can be neat. One of the very few things that Oblivion added substantively over Morrowind were the ability ranks and the new tricks you could do with them if you went from Apprentice to Journeyman or whatever, like the flips for acrobats at higher level and so on. Sure, it needed refinement, but fundamentally that was a good idea.

Skyrim's perks came from that, but rather than new shit you could do they tended to merely add +5% to what you were already doing.
Also, and what to me really was the main problem, was that the fuckers went and removed Attributes for some absolutely retarded reason.

>>386793253

Spears were one of the best weapons in the game since they let you get the first hit every time if you had a high enough skill level due to their reach, and you could just poke at chasing enemies with impunity.

Two types of posters ITT
>oblivion is better
>no argument
>skyrim is better
>but just on most aspects, it's still inferior on some and both aren't much diferent on mediocrity
Oblivion fags as always, obnoxious sub-humans.

>>386795013
>stats
>spellmaking
>classes
>not better

>>386795146
>still no argument

>>386795224
how is that not an argument
skyrim is missing basic features from previous games

>>386795265
it's not an argument because you didn't explain how it's a bad/good thing, you just used the "they removed a mechanic so it's inherently bad"

>>386795426
tell me why removing stats is a good change
tell me why removing spellmaking is a good change
tell me why removing classes is a good change

>>386795146

>stats

there are stats they're just not as many

>spellmaking

only legitimate complaint, but it was more or less traded for crafting

>classes

haven't been relevant or useful since morrowind and even then they were little more than a springboard so you weren't as fucked if you stuck strictly to your chosen skills at the start

Does anyone believe Oblivion is the best in the series, if so, why?

>>386795492
1. it wasn't good or bad, it simply didn't matter, you think it's bad? probably nostalgia googles, skyrim replaced stats with skills, it did it right on its own rule and gameplay style.
2. another irrelevant change, since oblivion even spellmaking was just a shorcut option, you could just use regular spells if so, skyrim however did it wrong not on removing spell making but removing dedicated spell button, if anything i would remove spell making to oblivion and add it to skyrim
3. Right choice, it locked you and the gameplay you would use most if not all of the game, skyrim gave you freedom of building what you wanted right at the start barely with no penalties, and having a nice title on your character window doesn't make the game better either.
And, if you can't conjeture your own arguments that means you are just saying that something is bad because you disliked it, you're giving no substance on what you stand and you will not be taken seriously as a result.

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>>386780635
>graphics are terrible even for the time

Are you fucking 12? Oblivion was absolutely stunning when it came out

>tfw leaving the sewers for the first time and seeing Cyrodiil
Shit makes me emotional just thinking about it.

>>386796837
>Oblivion was absolutely stunning when it came out

in 2006? fuck no, you just didn't know a lot of videogames or were a console peasant.

>>386796837
you're not wrong, it was THE SHIT when it came out, however it aged worse than morrowind graphic wise, i can still to this day boot morrowind and play it normally, but i can't get back to oblivion and not feel unsettled by the korean elves and dog orcs.

Oblivion has best quests of the big 3.
You can't deny it

>>386796307
Not the same guy, but if you change an existing system for a new one, which in an of itself may be all right, you should be able to justify it. What benefits did the removal of stats bring?

You've reduced complexity where there wasn't all that much to begin with, reduced player agency on what sort of character they'd like to build and did away with a measuring stick by which you could do checks against the player's character for roleplaying options in dialogue. These are all costs, so what did they afford for a better experience for the player?

Same goes for spell making, you reduce the player's ability to do what he wants, for little gain but some ideal of making a fucking single player game balanced.

As for classes, I believe that is entirely an outcome of gutting stats. But again, it is pointless simplification, and one that isn't even proper streamlining of an experience, but getting rid of anything that could make a playstyle unique or interesting.
Pre-set classes created a neat starting point and a skill package to start you out with, but there wasn't really more to them to begin with. If you created an archer but wanted to re-train as a martial artist monk, it's entirely possible but costs you, just like it should. Plus you could always create your own class. As is, you can no longer do that, you're locked into having to be a vague faggot who can pick up any weapon or spell and be great with them.

>>386797696
Side quests. The main story is shit. And while the factions themselves were far too few compared to how many there should have been, and each a fuckton less interesting than it should have been, quest per quest they too are probably better.

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>>386772162
>Which one is better?
the one jerk I off to the most

>>386798326
>>386798326
Main Story wasn't great, but all the guilds are better than Skyrim, and quests on average are better than Morrowind

>>386772162
They both suck.

>>386798526

it's easy to have good quests when you only have like 4 joinable factions

>>386798636
I'd rather have quality over quantity. That argument is void and idiotic

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Oblivion is pretty rad my dudes, currently doing a playthrough.

>>386798962

not every quest in Oblivion is the dark brotherhood one, there are plenty of filler, boring ones.

it's a false equivalence that you can't have quality PLUS quantity, because the sheer scale of Morrowind's interconnected paths showed that was within their abilities.

besides, a game set in the Imperial province without an Imperial legion quest? what the fuck is up with that?

>>386798017
this is what i was looking for, i agree on the most part, i personally liked the attributes back on oblivion making it more RPG like though and added some of that feel of complexity, but ultimately ended up being comformed with skyrim's skill since, as i said, even if it was simplified, it was not a bad system, it still worked as it should except for magic wich didn't escalate.
I also didn't use spellmaking back then, using what i needed was still retardedly easy but because of the spell hotkey, i liked what skyrim did however by bringing back magic on each hand and the concentrated casting thing, however because of casting time, buffing yourself becomes a chore, i would have liked spell making on skyrim because of that reason.
As for classes, lets be honest, as for TES games which aren't multiplayer, classes means nothing, you're just yourself and some npcs if you want, but ultimately classes added nothing other than a kick start at the beggining, that's true eventually however being a really meaningless label on top of you.