Useless Party Members thread

>>386570359
Yusuke's not useless, what are you talking about? He does great damage with his baton pass power up attacks, and accuracy buffs are great on bosses.

>>386570359

he's hot though

>>386570359
>yusuke
>usless

Funny shit.
He's 10x more useful than Ryuji (which is the worst party member in the game).
Morgana is a fag that is only good for out of combat healing.
Ann is decent but has shit gun.
Haru is top tier.
Makoto is great.

"He does good against irrelevant mobs when you have to do extra shit like baton passes"

Lmfao

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>>386570359
He completely outclasses Ryuji until Charge, which is pretty late in the game.

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Any party member that dies with your equips is shit tier.

>>386570764
>the gut who gets charge, god hand and attack boost is useless

Damage control

>>386570845
You can get his equipment back tho senpai

>>386570784
>bosses
>irrelevant mobs

>>386570845
Go to his room

>>386570359
wtf yusuke is my best party member

>>386570873
That's super late in the game, faggot. For about 70 or so hours, Yusuke is fantastic.

Ken and the dog

>>386570873
He has 0 utility and the protag is the damage dealer, always.

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>>386570918
>it's true

That's actually pretty neat, never knew about this.

>>386570764

Ryuji is your only tarukaja until you synth a persona with one yourself

>>386570873
>garbage until late game where damage from your party members no longer matter

>>386570801
wtf I'm in love with Akechi now

>>386570873
Ryuji doesn't get God Hand unless you're a shitter, too high a level

>>386570961
>>386571065
DAMAGE CONTROL. I had Ryuji with all those skills at the Casino dungeon and used him for 3 dungeons.

>>386570916
You dumb fuck the palace bosses don't get critics so he's useless when Ryuji can buff and deal higher damage.

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>>386571290
>I had Ryuji with all those skills at the Casino dungeon
Are you actually trying to tell me you were lvl 75 at the casino dungeon?

>not having an MC with Personas so otherworldly powerful you are at liberty to pick whatever team members you choose because they're just flavour at this point

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this guy/girl

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>>386570359
>Not using every party member equally

>>386570801
>implying female ryuji wouldnt have gigantic titties

>>386570801
>female Ryuji
OH NO MY HEART

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>>386570359
Yusuke carried me through my 1st playthrough. You can pretty much use whoever you want in this game.

>>386570359
Yusuke is better than ryuji until ryuji gets charge

>>386571179
>Ryuji is your only tarukaja until you synth a persona with one yourself

Who cares. Only auto-tarukaja is sort of useful on your trash mob cleanup persona. Tarukaja is only sort of relevant vs bosses and even then it doesn't really cut down the amount of turns it takes to kill said boss by much.

>>386571409
Yes, abused flu season

>>386570801
>He completely outclasses
He has a shit health pool, he doesn't tank damage as well as Ryuji, and even though he's certainly faster with a higher accuracy, Ryuji still seems to hit pretty frequently.

Also, even though Ryuji's magic stat isn't as good, he still gets shock and elec boost, and gets weapons that add to that as well, whereas Yusuke always has shit magic output, making him only good for physical attacks, which he isn't even the best at compared to Ryuji or even Haru.

Plus Matarukaja is always better than Masukukaja.

Yusuke is a good dude, and a fun guy, but the most shit party member in the game. Kanji at least had some unique attacks and abilities in the last game that helped him stand out.

>>386570764
>makoto
>good
>only good move is Marakuja and a shitty frey spell
>0 good melee attacks

>>386570801
Those are all fucking terrible.

>>386571694
>Kanji at least had some unique attacks and abilities in the last game that helped him stand out.
Kanji is 100% better than Chie in the original release, but they become about the same in golden

>>386571664

It's still very fucking notable as it's the only party member attack buff their is besides your protag

And you're definitely going to get some use out of it in every boss battle you have it for

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>>386570359
>implying
His baton pass attacks do ridiculous damage
They outdamage All-out Attacks on singular enemies, even

>>386571290
>DAMAGE CONTROL. I had Ryuji with all those skills at the Casino dungeon and used him for 3 dungeons.

Why the fuck were you grinding that much? I had literally beated everything there was to beat in the game at sub lv70.
Before you try and bullshit your way out by mentioning Mishima or some shit, he was one of the first confidants I maxed out.

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what about forehead girl? too late to get all her confidant skill on my 1st playthrough.

sorry, girl im not interested in gardening. also her dub voice ticks me off all the time

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>>386571682
What the fuck? So you were literally like 20-30 levels overleveled, and you're saying that WE'RE on damage control? Listen here, bitchboy. 99% of people didn't do that, since there's literally no fucking reason to, and it removes any semblance of challenge from the game. That's not the norm. What were you even thinking when you made that argument, it makes no sense...

Yusuke has great physical skills and his damage output is way above average

>>386571838
Flu season.

I wanted higher level demons early as possible and i didn't have enough cash to fuse constantly.

>>386571419
>>not having an MC with Personas so otherworldly powerful you are at liberty to pick whatever team members you choose because they're just flavour at this point

Allies with healing are very nice to have, this is partially what makes Ryuji so shit.
Ann, Makoto and Morgana have healing spells and Haru has the most utility. This leaves Ryuji and Yusuke and Yusuke is a far better party member though most of the game.

>>386571694
>Plus Matarukaja is always better than Masukukaja.
Other way around. Tarukaja is nice to have but sukukuja should always be up against bosses.

>>386571731
>>0 good melee attacks
So much shit doesn't block Nuclear or is straight up weak to it, you don't need phys on her. Her stats and the gear that she gets that amps up her stats are so powerful, that her standard melee is fine as a free attack, especially because she has a high chance to crit on top of the fact that gear she get also amplifies this.

Her SP pool is solid, so she's good for doing triple duty as defense buffer, healer, and Atomic Flare girl. On top of that, she is pretty fucking resilient compared to the other two people with heals and buffs, whereas they may as well be made of paper. She's only weak to Psy, which is uncommon, while they're weak to all sorts of shit.

Makoto is a bad character, but you have to admit at how totally OP she is to being incredibly crucial to a party.

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>>386572051
Obviously that's not what most people did you fucking autist. Why would you try to present your situation as normal?

>>386571998
>Listen here, bitchboy. 99% of people didn't do that, since

That's a lie. Loads of people abused the reaper since he was literally free XP. People who play persona or SMT always end up overleveled at the end anyways, ain't my fault Atlus gave me an early opportunity to raise my levels in tens by minutes. Besides the point Ryuji is factually better member than Yusuke with all their skills.

>>386571818
>It's still very fucking notable as it's the only party member attack buff their is besides your protag

Again, who cares. The other characters are just straight up better. I couldn't care less about beating the boss 1-2 turns faster or whatever.

>>386570801
ryuji best girl

i like how akechi is exactly the same but with a skirt

>>386572315
>doubles your damage
>beating a boss 1-2 turns faster
you're a fucking moron.

>>386572180
>sukukuja should always be up against bosses.
No, you should be using debilitate on bosses, then Matarukaja on yourself to amp up the hits even more.

With the boss's attack and accuracy down, you don't have to worry about getting hit.

Debilitate is a much more useful in terms of cost effectiveness, and you can get it pretty early.

>>386571731
Makoto has some of the most retard OP equipment in the game and the demons needed to make it are oddly lower leveled than the other party members.

Not to mention her element is one of the most common enemy weaknesses.

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>>386572296
>Ryuji is a better party member!
Yeah, but only in the endgame
>No, he's good in the midgame too, all you have to do is break the game
Literally you right now

>>386571694
>he doesn't tank damage as well as Ryuji
>Yosuke getting hit in the first place

>and even though he's certainly faster with a higher accuracy, Ryuji still seems to hit pretty frequently

Not in my 2nd playthrough. Used Ryuji instead of Yusuke all playthrough and he would miss AOE phys stuff like a mofo.

>shock boost/magic dmg
>using magic for anything else than hitting weaknesses

>Ma-kaja
Yusuke gets his 10 levels earlier. + using the Sukunda+Sukukaja cheese is so much dumb fun.
Yeah, I dunno. But hey, anything works in this game. I think the Baton Pass thing is Yusuke is OP for most of the early game.

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>>386571694
>Plus Matarukaja is always better than Masukukaja.

>>386572315

You don't sound too convinced of your own point

probably because it is idiotic

>>386571960
Absurdly powerful, reflect in general cheeses some bosses and her gun skills have stupidly high crit.

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Yusuke is great.
I think the only party member I didn't use all that often was Ann, not that she isn't useful but she's just not as useful as everybody else.

>>386572437
what equipment is this

>>386572630
Not him and I've already kinda forgotten but she gets +10 to all stats weapons and all that ridiculous shit (I think she has one more that's not stat related)

Ryuji, Ann, Makoto is the best party you can make. Anything else isn't optimal.

>>386570529
Theres no reason to even baton pass half the time though. Haru just fucks everything over late game and Ann destroys everything early game

>>386572610

She is just 'alright' for most of the game, but she is the shit vs most if not all bosses. Late game especially.

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>retards trying to tell me ryuji isn't shit

Why are babies that played this game on the lowest difficulty while also grinding out of their asses even posting ITT?

>>386572315
>character enables you to kill a boss 1 or 2 turns faster
>What a shitty character, right guys?

How can a person be this retarded?

>>386572740
That's just not true. The baton passing damage buff really adds up, and if you stack it with Yusuke's baton pass attack skill, it does massive damage.

>>386572464
Persona 5 was already broken as soon as you maxed confidents, it doesn't matter. Yusuke only good for useless mobs while Ryuji is good for shit that matters.

>>386572795
Played on hard, Ryuji is better than Yusuke

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>>386570764
Both Ryuji and Yusuke are good, however Ryuji has the upper hand of getting multi hit moves, which in the end are much better than Yusuke's. Plus he learns Tarukaja so that makes him better.

Ann is your strongest magic user. And yeah, I agree on the last two. Makoto is good but doesn't excel at anything, although she gets one of the best, if not best weapon in the game.

>>386572714

This was my Yalda/Twins team. No brainer.

>>386572630
For knuckles you can use either one that gives high crit chance or another one that gives her high chance of dealing any status effect

Her weapon is a +10 to all her stats

Not even joker gets something like this. +5 to all stats is the best he can get

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>>386572795
>personababby trying to brag about difficulty

Easiest Persona after IS

>>386572878
Makoto is great as a defensive buffer/ healer and she's much better than Mona simply because she can take more hits.

>>386572750
Yeah, I mainly used Ann for her charm and sleep skills in Momentos when I felt like gaining extra damage.

The entire point of Persona starting from 3 is that it doesn't make a lick of difference who your party is since the protagonist is inherently several times superior than everyone else, meaning every single factor other than him is automatically superfluous. No matter who you bring, the protagonist is gonna pull 90% of the weight anyway.

>>386572630
She has two ultimate melee weapons from level 70~ demons. Everyone else gets theirs from 80+ stuff. She also has the best gun in the game.

Plus a lower level 200 attack fist with medium crit at level 45~

>>386572750
she's good for dealing with bosses just for tarunda alone, plus she can fill a secondary healer role if you need one

>>386572750
Ann is the highest damage dealer besides MC

>>386572534
>You don't sound too convinced of your own point

I am, but utility will always trump damage. You trying to tell me that Ryuji gets to buff allies attacks (when the protag can do this if you really wanted to) means fuck all. Seriously it's fucking irrelevant. You'd much rather have any of the women over Ryuji and Morgana is also better. That leaves Yusuke which is by far better through most of the game.

You're trying to tell me that the reason to use Ryuji over any other character is that he gets tarukaja somewhat early. For real? Fuck off.

>>386572869
What kind of bizarre mental gymnastics are you even doing right now? Grinding to lvl 99 is VASTLY more broken than maxing some confidants. Also, most people don't want to go out of their way to break a game, retard.

>>386571694
>ryuji have average magic and physical
>yusuke have op pyhsical and lack magic damage
>imo its better to have a more focused role character
>also magic is only used for weakness and most of the time damage is dealt with physical skills + crits
>also baton pass moves + counter skills
> also cool katana animations

yusuke ftw

>>386572878
>although she gets one of the best, if not best weapon in the game.
although the best weapon in the game is pretty useless when her shit is already medicore

good thing the game is easy enough to let an all rounder like her to have a use

Why don't people just realize there isn't a bad party lineup in this game?

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>>386572870
>Played on hard, Ryuji is better than Yusuke
>only hard

persona 5 is retard easy. it has interesting systems and shit which you don't even need to use on the lower difficulties. you thinking that ryuji is good tells me precisely how shit you are.

>>386573390
Around the time people stop calling Ryuji a cuck if the MC fucks Ann since he lowkey ships Ann and Joker?

>>386570359

Yusuke isn't as good as Ryuji late, but he's much more usable than Morgana at any point.

>>386573136
That was her exact role in my posse.

>>386573197
Pretty much, but i'd argue it's not exactly valuable outside boss fights, since knocking down mobs should be your primary goal when traversing dungeons.

>>386573398
Thinking Yusuke is better than Ryuji tells me precisely how shit at the game you are senpai. I bet you played on easy

>>386573519
Morgana is pretty useless I think most of us can agree on that. Makoto completely outclassed him

>>386573390
>Why don't people just realize there isn't a bad party lineup in this game?

You can manage with any party, but even implying that Ryuji isn't amongst the weakest party members is the game is downright delusional. It doesn't matter if you think Yusuke or Ryuji is the worst because both are on the lower end.

Makoto and Haru are the best in the game, that leaves a single filler role which can be anyone.

>>386572926
ryuji, ann, morgana for me

>>386573248
The confidents already made the game easy. Is that hard to understand? It doesn't matter of it gets easier since it was never hard to begin with all these new mechanics.

You say that but at the end of the majority of people maxed the strength confident to get level 90+ demons anyways either at shido's or mementos depths. Don't know why you're trying to pretend most people finish this with some level 60/70 demon

>>386573320
now that I think about it

Makoto's place in the party is stuck being a healbot/defence buff bot and occasionally attacking

because physical is king

>>386573659
Ann does more damage than Haru :^)

>>386573558
>his counter to someone telling him that he only played on hard is to accuse said person to play on easy

Why are people this mentally ill allowed on the internet?

>>386573320
>when her shit is already medicore
Nigger what. She has the best element in the game and her and Haru have crits which is critical to dealing with bosses.

>>386571140
Of course you didn't, idiot, you actually have to play games to know all of their contents.

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>>386571960
ONE SHOT KILL is high tier with high crit. Triple Down can come close to Satanael or Vishnu Riot Gun if all connect on a single target, aka bosses.

Haru is also for breeding and running a cafe shop with your kids.

>>386573778
I'm literally mimicking what he's been saying

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>>386573204
>Matarukaja
>charge
>swift strike

There is literally no reason to use Yusuke over Ryuji. I'd say you could use both, but there's no reason to use him over Haru, Makoto, or even Ann either. You can't crit bosses, so his unique skills are garbage, he learns the stronger magic spells way later in favor of tons of useless physical attacks, and he's overall incredibly lackluster. Counterstriker is kind of cool, but that's about it.

>>386573390
Doesn't mean there's not an optimal one.

>>386573692

I'd only use Morg if I was 90+ in the twins fight. I tried doing Sukunda+Sukukaja shenanigans at 50/60 and it would not make any difference. I'd still miss and the twins would hit everything.

Makoto has BS equipment that makes her nearly as fast as Morg, takes more hits AND has Marakukaja that's more consistent.

>>386571065
>the protag is the damage dealer, always.
Really?
I could never get him to hit as hard as Yusuke or Ryuji.
I mean, he did do acceptable damage but the main use I found for the MC was his bullshit versatility because whycan'tIholdallthesepersonas

>>386573774
Haru has
>reflect skills
>psy
>gun attack
>gun attack with high crit
>Amrita Shower
>Heat Riser

>>386573943
>You can't crit bosses
???

>>386573943
>charge
>lv75 ryuji

Unless you're shit or grind you should already have beaten the game by that point.

>>386574063
One word. Yoshitsune

>>386574063
>I could never get him to hit as hard as Yusuke or Ryuji.

The fuck? You have absolute control over your stats and skills.

>>386573650
can you tell me why? been using him as my main healer, his garu skills and miracle punch are good in my opinion.

though i swapped him often with makoto as back up

>>386573943

>tfw you were level 61 when you reached Yalda

I even grinded for Personas at times. Played it on Hard, too.

I didn't even know Ryuji got Charge until I was looking into Wardens strats for NG+.

>>386574070
You can crit sub bosses, like confidant bosses, or any mini bosses in palaces, but not any actual bosses.

>>386574219
What kind of shitty opinion is this? I did everything my first playthrough(max all confidants without a guide since it's easy as hell cheesing with fortune), and Ryuji was consistently better the entire way through. The fact that he gets charge over the samurai character doesn't make any sense, but it's icing on the top of his top 3 party member cake.

Was the game balanced around you brewing a shit ton of coffee and curry towards the end? It was stupidly long between rest rooms in the final 3 dungeons and I kept being completely out of SP between the longer rest rooms gaps, even with everyone have SP recovery gear..

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>>386572083
Anon if you go to the church on Sunday and buy Tae medicine, you never need to run Makoto or Morgana as healers. I used Haru, Yusuke, and Ryuji/Ann/Morgana (critical punch). Ryuji has nice buff, Ann hits as hard as Mitsuru, and Morgana saves me SP. I prefer Yusuke speed buff over attack buff as it helps Haru/Joker land hard phys crit hits. Makoto warmed benches.

>>386574357

He dies really fucking easily to even non-weak hits, Miracle Punch is inconsistent, and his competition for his main niche as a healer is usually agreed to be the best character in the game.

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>all the party members in P5 are good

lets talk about something worth the discourse lmao

>>386574357
As the snobs above said she gets a ridiculous weapon that does plus 10 to all stats. My reason for using her though was she can take more hits than Morgana, can buff defense for the entire party, and she gets the same level of heals as Morgana.

>>386574479

Although not a traditional Palace boss, you can crit the final Okumura robot.

>>386574321
99 strength Yoshitsune. Godlike japanese general

>>386574219
Personafags have no right to use git gus arguments

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>>386574357
Most like the defence buff that Makoto gives and since she gets similar healing skills around the same time as Morgana most people ditch the cat.
Around the time Morgana gets Salvation he's a lot better.
But honestly, after you get the ability to swap members in the middle of battle you have no excuse for not saying "I used whoever I needed at the time".

>>386574560
Anons above I meant.

>>386574483
Rank up Takemi and buy her SP restoring equipment. I had four myself, and usually had them equipped until a boss.

>>386574451
I played on hard too, and didn't try to grind, but I ended up pretty high from frequent trips to mementos, since I was trying to max all confidants.

>>386574479
>Ryuji was consistently better the entire way through

He's amongst the bottom 3 in the game, if you're that adamant about using trash then go right ahead.
Just like Ryuji you're a simpleminded retard that thinks that damage is everything.

Play a real Chen Macaroni Tensile games lads.

>>386574506
Medicine cost much money. 4000 yen for 200 hp to all alies or what?

>>386574067
the problem im having with her is not having enough slot for her variety of skills. i ended deleting her tetrakarn and makarakn to get hid psy and gun boost passive

can anyone suggest her optimal build

>>386574650
>Personafags have no right to use git gus arguments

Considering most SMT games boil down to trial and error or abusing buffs/debuffs I honestly don't think you should be talking.
Even one of the more well-liked games like Nocturne fall into this.

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>>386574747
>this idiot doesn't know how OP swift strike is
>this numbnuts prefers maybe dodging over guaranteed damage
>this baka prefers useless gimmick skills over surviving everything and even having respectable magic damage
>this shitter probably played on safety

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>>386573774
Ann does 50-75 more damage than Haru on average against super bosses. That's with mind charged and Blazing Hell each turn sucking SP. Triple Down can out damage Ann without a mind charge setup or SP cost, but Triple Down connecting all is rare outside of critical party buffing. Ann is more consistent, at a cost.

On Merciless the critical rate is passively higher BTW, which makes Haru gun skills game breaking to a degree.

>>386574945
>can anyone suggest her optimal build

Doesn't really matter. One thing you need to remember though is that using spells for damage is pretty pointless since they're basically only used for weaknesses. So those skills that passively increase her psy damage are useless.

>>386574661

Had everyone using them, generally MC was the only one who didn't run out of SP in the long stretches. Suppose it doesn't help that I had a very magic focused team.

>>386575031
They are both really good desu

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>tfw Haru is the only PC where choosing her skills at level ups is a relatively difficult choice.

It was a pleasant surprise and was kinda bummed out that the others didn't offer similar choices.

>>386574947
In SMT apocalypse enemies would slap your shit if you tried to over buff.

>>386574961
>still desperately trying to live in his bubble of shit

Like I said, if you adamantly want to stick to the idea that Ryuji is the best character in the game then by all means. Why should I waste time trying to convince a close-minded retard?

>>386574947
>Considering most SMT games boil down to trial and error or abusing buffs/debuffs I honestly don't think you should be talking.

Except Persona has the same shit on top of random bullshit like confident buffs, navigator buffs and all out attacks, boss and enemies being less punishing, members slapping alignments out of you for free and no cost as well as them dying for you or taking hits that should kill them but they still stand. I can go on and on, shit is far more easier than a standard SMT game.

So will be get a Golden/FES edition that explains who set up the encounter between the MC and Shido?

Kinda not looking forward to the prospect of replaying everything again, the Casino and Boat dungeons were tedious as fuck.

>>386573058
I find that for the important stuff, it really matters what your team can do.

Having a good team that can deal damage, and buff where needed for the twins or for Yaldo will make or break the fight in many situations. I like to set up the protag in those occasions so that he primarily does recovery, and buffing / debuffing, with the occasional charged up hit, whereas I have Ryuji or Ann to deal major damage, and Makoto to do some additional management.

>>386575217
>In SMT apocalypse enemies would slap your shit if you tried to over buff.

My point still remains, the SMT are not really difficult for the right reasons and it's more about understanding what to abuse.

>>386574945
either go full guns(recommended) or full psy

triple down
psiodyne
snipe(or psy boost)
cripple(or psy amp)
tetrakarn
makarakarn
amrita shower
either the missing amp skill you passed on, or mapsiodyne

>>386574830
I play on Hard and my supply is 15-20 of the 200HP party heals. Since healing in battle is rare, that supply is enough for up to 2 palaces. The benched members heal after battle, Futaba recovers benched members SP anyway.

The church Sunday items trivialize even needing dedicated heal members on bosses.

>>386575424
Your not wrong. Fucking YHVH still took me 5 hours to beat though.

>>386575291
You have no argument, pal. I've already stated why Ryuji is considered good, why not post why it is you think Yusuke is good? I'm sure it'll be easy to pick apart, and expose your low IQ.

>>386573058
The fact that the protag getting KO'd = instant game over balances that out though, I think. The games are still easy but not for the reason you're talking about here.

>>386574961
I think underestimating Swift Strike is a large reason people don't know how useful Ryuji is for a large portion of the game. Swift Strike's description is misleading but its damage on average is statistically close to Agneyastra's and he learns it very early. Yusukefags missed out hard

>>386575217

EO pulls that shit, annoys the fuck out of me. Don't give enemies secret uber attacks that activate when you buff, balance your buffs.

>>386575591
Swift strike is the strongest non MC exclusive multihit physical skill, and you get it extremely early. There's no reason not to use it all the way til endgame.

>>386575408
Nah. These games are basically designed so that you could conceivably go up against the hardest bosses with just the protagonist. The team is still largely superfluous after a certain point in the game because the protagonist vastly outclasses the entire rest of the team in every single way. If you want, you could have the other characters cast buffs, if only to maximize the protagonist's damage potential.

>>386575332
>Except Persona has the same shit on top of random bullshit like confident buffs, navigator buffs and all out attacks, boss and enemies being less punishing, members slapping alignments out of you for free and no cost as well as them dying for you or taking hits that should kill them but they still stand. I can go on and on, shit is far more easier than a standard SMT game.

I don't see how any of this matters. You deluding yourself into thinking you're hardcore for thinking that persona is pathetic at worst, hilarious at best.
Each game is fairly straightforward as soon as you figure out how to break the games. In some cases there is some trial and error or just RNG that fuck you, but really these games are not difficult.

>>386575591
I would agree with you if Ryuji wouldn't whiff it in some way or another 50% of the time.

>>386570359
ryuji seems more gay than yusuke to me

>>386575682
I saw some numbers that put Agneyastra barely ahead if you average the number of hits they'll both get on average. But ether way it's fucking ridiculous that Ryuji gets such a powerful skill so early

>>386575862
well ofc cuz he sucks dick unlike yusuke lol

>>386575547
>You have no argument, pal. I've already stated why Ryuji is considered good, why not post why it is you think Yusuke is good? I'm sure it'll be easy to pick apart, and expose your low IQ.

Read the thread, I have already stated it over and over. If you don't like to read then that's another notch you can add to your list of stupidity.
Besides I have already said that they're amongst the weakest characters and Ryuji is only not shit by the very end (if you powerlevel at that). I don't care about trash. Now go slurp some more Ryuji cock.

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>>386575924
>ryuji gets swift strike extremely early
>Ryuji is only not shit by the very end(if you powerlevel at that)

You're making this too easy.

>>386575636
My favorite is yhvh who max debuffs you when you try to buff to max. Fuckin bitch

>>386575862
Anon it's confirmed that Mishima is the gayest character to exist in the Persona series

>>386575729
>I don't see how any of this matters.

Because your clearly disregarding mechanics that makes one franchise significantly easier than the other, it's just petty damage control at this point. I don't care what you think of SMT, shit is objectively less harder to abuse than Persona.

>>386575760
Just go buy that auto-sukakaja accessory for him if it's happening so much to you and then watch Swift Strike decimate most battles for half the game

>>386575217
That just means that you go +/- 3 instead of +/- 4

>>386574219
He gets charge at Level 63 numbnuts, which is still early enough for at least the majority of the final phase, where it actually matters.

Yusuke doesn't get anything really worthwhile at that time.

Really, Yusuke is only really useful the moment you get him because at that point his phys skills are better than Ryuji, and ice attacks actually matter. But the moment Ryuji gets Swift Strike, which is at level 32, Yusuke is immediately outclassed and loses any benefit he has, especially since his ice shit is now worthless, and is the most defended skill in the entire game. Doesn't help that he never gets any boost or amps, whereas Ryuji does.

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>>386576029
Gayer than these queers?

>Not wiping out every encounter with the protagonist the moment the battle starts

What are you people doing?

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>>386576107
Or, I could just use literally anyone else with mah broken SP patch and switch in Ryuji after he gets Charge which is after I beat the game OOOPS

>>386576029
everyone seems gay though even that politician.

maybe because joker is very charming

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>>386572740
>Theres no reason to even baton pass half the time though
Are you for real?

>>386576508
Swift Strike will do more damage than anyone else's hit-all for most of the game though

>>386576316
not possible early game unless you have sp healing item or time making coffee.

otherwise joker will run out of mana easily and you have to go back because you cant switch out joker

>>386575353
>Spoiler.
We already know that anon, it was Yaldy.
Because he rigged the game but games are pointless if you play against only yourself.

>>386576951
Yeah, but people are bringing up Charge. By that point, Ryuji will be completely unnecessary. Same with everyone else.

>>386570359
if you cant control party member directly as in P3, i wonder who is the worst.

>>386577020
Yeah, I'm sure most people just leave their party members behind and solo everything with the protagonist endgame.

Are you an idiot? There's still the best three choices for your party members, and Ryuji is easily top 3(along with Makoto and Haru).

>>386577020
People are bringing up Swift Strike, which Ryuji gets at Level 32. Yusuke is completely worthless after that, because Swift Strike is the best, most consistent physical all strike.

>>386577119
You could always go find out by turning your party members' auto mode on.

>>386576838

That's probably true, but I only used phys during boss battles, where Yusuke excels pre 60.

I prioritized hitting weaknesses via magic; knocking down opponents is still the best way to advance since it leaves you with options (stacking $$$, recruitment or just all out their ass)

But if you want to steam roll through the game, AOE phys like Swift Strike is good too, I guess? I just don't see how it's better.

>>386577270
Joker can use it too, though. And with potentially higher efficiency since he gets access to passive skills that Ryuji can't.

>>386577586
Most people don't try to solo the whole game.

>>386577224
The main point is that by that point, it doesn't really matter what team you use. The protagonist can potentially do twice the damage of anyone else, so the others are basically just extras. Whether Ryuji can eke out a little more damage than the other party members isn't that relevant when Joker drops niggers left and right anyway.

>>386577660
Even if only for the challenge, why not?

>>386577463
Yeah you're right. Hitting weaknesses and doing all-out attacks is the best. If we're talking about that though then Ryuji and Yusuke are both just weakness hitters for different elements and both of their Mag stats are mediocre to other characters. Ryuji can hit elec weaknesses for knockdowns when necessary and deal more damage than anyone else when there isn't a weakness

>>386577586
The argument is for Ryuji or Yusuke.

Joker could outclass any party member, so you may as well just say bench everyone.

>>386577757
What do you mean why not? You get four party members, most people choose to make use of them. Saying "But Joker can do it better" is irrelevant because there's only one Joker, he can't fill every slot.

>>386577270
Level 32 is the point where Yusuke's usefulness explodes and leaves Ryuji way behind until he learns charge.

This is because at level 32 you can fuse and subsequently itemize Ame-no-Uzume, which yields a +5str sword for Yusuke that, unless you plan to use the standard attack regularly, is for all purposes his best weapon in the game.

Combine with an Atlas Ankhlet and that's a +15 str bonus by level 32. This is very good by itself but gets pretty fucking silly when you throw in Baton Passes and Rising Slash / Deadly Fury.

Yes, with Atlas Ankhlet Ryuji is great at crowd control, but Yusuke's DPS is literally unmatched for most of the game if you can get baton passes reliably.

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Why is she so shit? Navarre and his brother are easily my favorite in Apocalypse.

>>386578015
Gaston was worse. At least Asahi doesn't steal your turns.

>>386577926
Well, basically, my argument is that after a certain point, the differences are negligible. Let's say that Joker's a $100 bill and the others float somewhere between $45~$55. As long as you have that $100, a difference of up to $10 isn't really that massive.

>beat the game on merciless
>used ryuji all the time
>didn't even get to learn charge

>>386576989

The way it was asked and the MC reacted made it seem like he didn't know.

Also, it's never really shown that he can do that sort of direct influence, especially given he would have been in the velvet room the whole time.

>>386578130
Meant God Hand.

>>386577949
No, I mean people want to feel good about soloing a game that has that as an option.
It's not about Joker can do it better, it's more those strange folk that want to make the game harder by going it alone.
But since it is an option, why not?

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>>386570359
Should've just named this "Useless party members in Persona" thread.

>>386572740
did you play on babby mode or are you just in denial

>>386578130
I legit didn't even get to Charge. Played on Hard, though.

>>386578236
>But since it is an option, why not?
Because they don't feel like it? What point are you even trying to make?

>>386570359

If you didnt find a use for just about everyone, you stat padded or didnt play it on a hard enough difficulty.

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>>386572740
>Theres no reason to even baton pass half the time

>>386577902
I guess that's fair.

>>386577954
Ame-No-Uzume's sword is a very interesting point I haven't heard brought up before. I think it's something most people would never notice or use without looking up an itemization list but it's still a good point.

I think the baton pass Yusuke strats are a little embellished though. If you can already knock down the enemies then you might as well just all-out attack them for free. If it's a boss battle then you can't reliably get baton passes for most of the game without using weak attaks like Lucky/Miracle Punch which is messing up the idea of DPS here since you're losing DPS by using those attacks over a stronger attack. I can't imagine the DPS would be more than everyone including Ryuji just using their strongest moves

>>386578195
Yaldy is a tricky one but his influence is felt throughout the game really.
He's an absolute tyrant, his tyranny extends to the whims of destiny to forcing Joker and Shido to meet.
Joker becoming the Wild Card was probably selected before his coming to Tokyo and Yaldy has a flare for the dramatic. Why not make Shido a personal enemy of the next Guest.

Of course, this is me grasping at straws but it fits Yaldy's M.O.

>>386578371
You don't have to do it, you get no real rewards for doing it, but some people might find it fun and challenging. So, given that it is an option, wy not do it for fun?

>>386578732
Ok, go for it. I'm not sure why you're going into a thread about party members only to suggest not using any though.

>>386578108
I'd say once Gaston gets Gungnir he becomes very useful in boss fights at least because of his Phys pierce, it's a somewhat fair trade. Then again at the point of the game you should've awakened and Toki has her sneak attack buff.

>>386570801
Why change the girls too?

>>386578840
Gaston even with pierce still takes your turns, the douchebag. Toki's a better option in every scenario since she can insta-kill some mobs and does what Gaston would, for free.

I usually went with Isabeau though, for the free heals and Luster Candies.

>>386578506
>I can't imagine the DPS would be more than everyone including Ryuji just using their strongest moves
I'll say that in my testing, if you Baton Pass a character with the same STR stat, and use either Deadly Fury (Severe, but gets stronger with Baton pass) or Brave Blade (Colossal), Brave Blade will still out-damage Deadly Fury, and on top of that it has generally better damage output on the regular. The same should be said for any baton pass attack.

Something to consider as well is that even though some attacks will be classified under the same damage scale (light, severe, colossal, etc.), some attacks will still have better yields than others.

For example Brave Blade is fairly weaker than God's hand, though it does Crit more, though that doesn't mean that God's Hand doesn't have great crits, overall making God's hand much better. Likewise, even though it's classified as Light, Swift Strike still does great damage for it's class on individual hits, and still guarantees multiple.

>>386578506

Not him, but I used Yusuke's Baton-specific skills to pretty much insta-kill anything that I couldn't knock down with what I had/knew. In an encounter with more than 2 demons I could always baton pass at least once, so that strat was virtually almost always available. It would also enable me to All out attack as well since the enemy that wouldn't get knocked down was gone.

Prioritizing having every enemy knocked down is key, imo. It's way more reliable and versatile.

>>386578943
Going with Isabeau is probably best anyway because her AI's decisions are usually all good and ideally you want her to be a high level for the final fight since she needs to help out the Samurai team.

>>386578839
I'm a glutton for punishment.

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>>386579081
>some attacks will be classified under the same damage scale (light, severe, colossal, etc.), some attacks will still have better yields than others

It triggered me to no end when I realized this. Even moreso when I found out that damage also scales with character level, in addition to Persona stats.

>>386578015
I resurrected Asahi as my goddess on massacre :^)

>>386579081
Very interesting to hear Baton Passed Deadly Fury vs Brave Blade comparisons. That's something I was curious about testing. It's kind of frustrating how difficult to find actual test data people have done with this game. Everyone just keeps spreading around rumors about how mechanics work. Futaba's luck stat being a prime example

>>386579707
Atlus really needs to start showing the numbers for these things.

>>386579707
Some stuff is easy to test, especially since you can fuse a lot of abilities yourself, but Yusuke also gets those abilities, so it's really plain for anyone to see, and a little bit disappointing. I was hoping it would at least be on par, but Baton Pass attacks don't come close to the next highest level of attack, making them on lony good in the moment, which is very brief in most cases.

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>>386576314
Only of them is a faggot, and it's not the one who looks like an MC

How many times do you guys baton pass per battle? Most fights end before the opening instrumental portion of the battle theme is over.

>>386580090
99% of the time never, the only major time I got to use it was with the Okumura fight.

Baton pass + Deadly Fury does more damage than AoA

>>386580090
At least once every time an enemy group has 2 or more weaknesses.

>>386580090
As much as I can to stop the enemy getting more turns and deal crazy amounts of damage to them where possible.

>>386579081
Yeah this was something I took a look at when I was playing through the game and it was disappointing.

I thought Yusuke getting Deadly Fury before Brave Blade was weird since it sounded like Deadly Fury would've generally been more useful with Baton Pass but it turned out it wasn't the case. If I'm not mistaken I think Haru was the only character in the game with a move set that had a couple of different options and made you think about which moves should or shouldn't be replaced.

>>386578506
Its actually pretty easy to get, since ine of the strength confidant requests is for an Ame-no-Uzume and you unlock itemization at around the same time you are suposed to do this (Futaba's palace).

He's not omnipotent, as I said Ryuji with Atlas is better at crowd control, but just the fact that you can get a +15 in his most relevant stat is already amazing when no other party member can achieve this other than Makoto at the endgame and Futaba's luck at the Casino.

And let me tell you, there's no comparison between an All Out Attack and a Rising Slash / Deadly Fury from Yusuke, specially against bosses and harder enemies where an all out can do around 100-150 damage and Yusuke will do straight up 700 (and I break the 999 barrier when properly Tarukaja-ed). The only reason why you would do an All Out Attack in that situation would be to spread damage around or because you can knock the enemy down yet again before their turn comes around.

Also, some bosses its hard to get Baton Passes, but others not so much. Even then Ryuji / MC with Tarukaja + Yusuke + Makoto + Anne / Haru (if you decide to skip Ryuji) is the formation best suited to deal damage for most of the game, so you don't really need to pick one.

Ryuji also has a very big problem for most of the playthrough, that although he is excellent at crowd Control with Swift Strike, he is stuck with gucking Assault Dive as a aingle target damage skill until he learns Megaton Raid at lvl 53.

That is just not OK.

>>386571496
I want to use Kawakami

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>>386570359
If you wanna talk about useless talk about Morgana, who is fucking shit outside the early game.
I literally only used him to fight enemies and mid bosses who were weak to garu skills.

>>386573514
Wait, does he?

>>386570359
if any p5 party member is useless its ann or morganna

>>386581487
i ditched lucky punch in favor of Wind amp + boost which does respectable damage

Salvation is still a pointless skill though

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>>386581678
>ann
>useless

>>386581678
Ann is the highest damage dealer in the game and she can debuff attack, she's far from useless. Morgana I agree though.

>>386581519
Yeah, notice how he reacts negatively to Joker saying Ann is just.. okay.
Aside from usual guy talk, exactly why do you think he asks what your type is with Ann specifically in the room, then to try and turn the question on Ann.

>>386581487
please you don't even need him for that you get garu pretty early too

>>386581487
He's good until you get Makoto's OP equipment. His main strength early/mid game is fishing for crits alongside suplementary healing and garu damage, not the other way around.

>>386581678
Ann's the most OP party member in the end game next to Joker himself + Dekaja for the handful of bosses who bother to buff themselves.

>>386581678
Anne is not useless, the game is just unkind to her kind of character since SP management is such a big part of the game.

>>386581891
>SP management
>You can make coffee, curry, get those placenta drinks from vending machines and there's the SP Adhesive you can get from Takemi

>>386581754
>Heals party and cures ailments!
>Just in time for the final boss, who uses ailments a lot!
>But wait they're all unique ailments that salvation can't cure
>The one non-unique ailment still only targets one party member and could easily get slapped off for free.
What were they thinking?

>>386581995
Once you get the SP gear and get Kawakami to make you coffee, the game is trivial altogether, least of all because Anne because viable.

>>386582079
You shouldn't be over level 65-66 while facing Yalda to begin with, let alone 75.

Salvation is solely for people who over-prepare for the twins and want to use morg for some reason.

>>386582079
Ailments in general are pretty under-utilized by the enemy in P5

Elder God tier
>Ryuji with Charge

God tier
>Makoto
>Haru with gun build
>Yusuke after Baton Pass

Good tier
>Ann

Shit tier
>Morgana

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>>386581487
He's the best Treasure Demon recruiter though.

>>386582674
I hope you're not forgetting that Ann gets Concentrate, anon.

>>386579081
But the thing is that, for the time Yusuke is at his most useful (Yusuke lvl 23 - Ryuji lvl 63) you don't have access to Brave Blade or God's Hand.

Therefore the skill that actually has to be compared to Deadly Fury is Ryuji's Assault Dive and later his Megaton Raid.

Also the basis of the strategy is making sure Yusuke does bot have as much Str as the other physical attackers in your party, but to boost it as much as humanely possible.

This for Tusuke means a +15 boost, +17 if you are willing to give up some defense. No other character can accumulate a boost so big other than Makoto at the endgame, which is a huge part of why this strategy works so well in carrying you all the way up to the Ark and even the Shido boss fight.

>>386582459

The irony there is that Morgana doesn't even get his ultimate Persona until 12/23, after the last day you can challenge the twins. So using him for the twins is a bad idea.

Also the twins don't really use ailments much from what i've seen.

>>386581678
I never used her much late game but you are a pleb, Ann is far from fucking useless, she has the highest mag damage and learns Concentrate.

>>386581995
That is literally what SP management is about, try getting through Palaces without those things.

>>386571797

>About the same

Nope, Kanji's damage output is still higher, Kanji is also entirely consistent with his damage whereas Chie has a huge nearly 20 level spot where she has one of the shittiest phys moves and never gets anything better.

>>386582932
The ultimate elemental attacks that the twins use inflict freezes/shocks/burns more often than the normal ones. It's not THAT bad (although one time a freeze cost me the fight) but it's the only point in the game where morg's salvation can be useful (assuming you didn't grind or abuse the Reaper like a scrublord and use Salvation at the Casino or something)

>>386571419
That's why Persona 3 not letting you control your party was a better game design for Persona, but mongos had to complain because God forbid they lose.

>mind slice made shadows confuse 80% of the time until the Casino palace
>baton pass power up physical attack
>evade shit a bunch of times

Yusuke was useful as hell.
Worse is Morgana due to shitty defense and being weak to Zio, that elemental attack that is the most used by shadows.

Haru is mediocre until you reach level 75 or 76 that is when she is great due to the stacking gun powerups.

Makoto was a beast, more with that gun or weapon of boosting 10 in all stats.
Ryuji is great, but his last 2 physical attacks weren't that great for me, it usually missed. Whatever was that physical attack that hits 3 or 4 times every shadow was better. Or the other one that in ambush gets a huge powerup for knockdowns.
Barely used Ann after the 2nd palace. Always had Joker with agi persona

>>386571409
Is not that hard if you beat the Reaper. I was around lv69 when i defeated the reaper, but the experience made me jump to lv75, but that was in december.
I was at lv51 at Haru father's palace because strenght rank10. Using Joker alone with Rangda was enough to level up fast

>>386583806
>Is not that hard if you beat the Reaper

I think the anon was implying that being that over leveled at that point of the game is really dumb/sad.

Game is beatable with 0 grind, even on Hard.

>>386583696
>tacticshitter

>>386583696
Yeah, it's real fun when my dumbass AI Yukari Diarahans fucking Nyx on the final form because I got unlucky with RNG.

Fuck uncontrollable AI party members. PERIOD.

>>386581817
I don't know. Because Ann brought it up, asked him, and then he wanted to save face? I didn't really think about it too hard.

>>386584703
Anon, that only happens when she's Charmed, and when a character's Charmed, they're out of your control either way unless you heal them.

>>386570764
>Fucking swift strike
>Bad beat with that OP status effect
>Tarukaja
>Charge
>God hand
>B-but my Rising Slash
am i being memed here? Why i should bother with the twink boy when i can destroy everything with Baton pass + Swift strike?

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>>386584817
When he asks in the bath he asks Joker specifically what he thinks of Ann, saying anything but that she's hot annoys Ryuji.
There's also some Momentos banter that hints towards it.

>>386584703
That's just because she got charmed though. The real issue is when, even on heal/support, she refuses to use Mediarahan and only heals one party member even though nobody will survive the next turn without healing. Had to make MC the healer during Nyx because of that bullshit.

>>386583696
I'd rather have more control and harder enemies than less control and weaker/dumber enemies to compensate. Especially if the AI all around is dumb as bricks.

Something I'd like to see is a team of wild cards where I can control what personas they use, while acting independently. Basically modern SMT gameplay with no direct control. Mite b cool 2 c.

>>386585224
That'd be too broken. The games are already broken as fuck under the current system due to how easy it is to make the protagonist completely overpowered.

>>386585224
So you want to play the older Persona? They're not going to make everyone wild cards again in a mainline game.
The best you get is that everyone in Persona Q2 gets sub persona again.

>>386585329
It seems the same as being able to recruit demons and stuff though.

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Cool demon design but I usually never bothered with him.

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>>386585006
This one?

>>386572795
>Matarukaja
>God's hand
>added with debilitate

He's arguably the hardest striker along with Yusuke, so.

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So, who did Hermes better P2, 3 or 5?
my money goes on 3.

>>386585834
I used him along with Gale, he had some pretty great animations.

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Why didn't Yusuke get Freeze Boost? Ann got Burn Boost and even Ryuji got Shock Boost, it's not fair damnit.

>>386585834
Yeah. Magic is just obviously the way to go in DDS since the game puts such a huge focus on the press turn system, both offensively and defensively. Rolant and Heat can't compete until late game.

>>386585893
Yeah, there are a couple more too, if I can ever find them.

>>386585329
Why would it be broken? It would be less engaging than the current SMT, and the Persona devs could easily balance stuff out accordingly.

>>386585531
I don't think making the posse wild card users again is that 'out there', specifically because it's been done before.

>>386570359
Why did you post the only member who should unarguably never leave your party?

>>386585993
He's not an ice mage. He's a physical fighter with ice coverage for downing ice-weak enemies.
For all intents and purposes if you ever cared about SP on him, you may as well just leave him with Bufu and Mabufu. His Magic Stat isn't anything to write home about so the damage is secondary to the knockdown

>>386586045
considering I can't use him late game makes me sad. I had high hopes for him to replace what Heat does for me but no he goes off and sacrifices himself.

>>386571998
The only reasonable abuse of Flu-Reaper is on NG+ to fuse Satanael and higher personas without draining your nip life savings.

>>386586098
Another anon mentioned it before about how OP Personas have become.
You would have to weaken the MC to increase the power of the group proportionately.
Could you imagine a game where everyone is shitting out Charge+ Hassou Tobi every turn?

I mean shit would be fun as fuck but lets be real. Every boss near the end of the game would become Phys Repel out of necessity.

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>>386570359
Do joke members count

>>386586409
i'm sure you can just make it so every party member can only have Personas of their card, then make MC a dedicated card instead of The Fool

>>386586217
Well you could still play as him until the end if you tell Heat to fuck off at some point in the series

>>386586541
Did you mean in the end? That's what I assumed but I got Heat with me in the Sun.

>>386571960
The vegetables are the best consumables in the game and she does fantastic crit Gun damage, plus some -Karns are handy in certain situations.

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>>386586217
>tfw no more "Come on, your ass is mine!" in DDS2
>Agni sounds like a total wimp now

DDS2 was a mistake.

>>386586540
Only having the Persona of your Arcana would be redunts.
Most Arcana are themed to specific elements and attacks so switching would provide nothing.

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>>386570359

>>386586075
Well, I'm looking forward to them if you do.

>>386586409
I agree, and I think that's an easy issue to solve. Hell, keep the Hasou Tobi/full rpl persona shenanigans in, but make them NG+ only.

Persona having a new director moving forward might bring some good and healthy changes along with it.

>>386586639
There's 2 dialogue choices you need to make in DDS1 and 1 dialogue choice in DDS2 where you have to say the nice thing to Heat or else you get Roland all the way. If you tell Heat to fuck off in any of the choices then he won't come back in the Sun

>>386586706
I can never find a downloadable voice clip for that line
>>386586898
Yeah, I never told him to fuck off.

>>386586165
Ryuji isn't a mage either, yet they still gave him both Elec boost and Shock boost. Seems weird they'd do that for one physical fighter and not the other. And yeah, his low magic stat is exactly why he should've just gotten Freeze boost instead since the magic dmg was secondary for him.

>>386584703
also remember mitsuru spaming marin karin

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Quick, tell me which characters to use in my party at around level 60!

>>386587129
Different types of fighters though. Yusuke is damage, Ryuji is tank.
If you're using Yusuke's Bufu for anything other than knockdown then you're wasting your time. Trying to rely on freeze as a strategy is just playing roulette.

>>386587384
Haru, Makoto, Yusuke, swap Yusuke for Ryuji and Haru for Ann when they get Charge and Concentrate, respectively.

>>386587384
Makoto, Ryuji, Yusuke.

Makoto just healsluts and Maraku's. Ryuji and Yusuke just hit shit heavily and the MC is the MC.

You could always go Haru, Ann, Makoto for the waifu mage squad.

>>386587384
im saving this

>>386587384
Any party combination is good but I mostly stuck to Yusuke+Ryuji+Makoto since they all had good attacking skills and a supporting skill.
Now Ann is a magic powerhouse and Haru is great at getting crits.
Only bring Morgana if you really want a designated healer.