>Breath of the Wild saved the Zelda series from going stale

God I hope so. Paper Mario was one of my favorite RPG series.

>>386557121
not if miyamoto has anything to say in the matter

>>386557121
Breath of the Wild didnt save Zelda, Skyward Sword was the exception, not the rule

>>386557121
Tanabe doesn't understand why people like the first two paper mario games, and he seems to actively hate the fanbase, so probably not.

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>>386557121
>Thinking there will be another title

>>386557121
After the failure of Color Splash I would hope they rethink their approach to Paper Mario.

>>386557121
Considering that Super Paper Mario was already a big change from the first two games before Sticker Syndrome occurred, I'd say they've settled into a "throw everything else at the wall and see what sticks" attitude. Which is sad, really. The only hope is the Chain Chomp partner in the E3 screenshots for Sticker Star showing that they are still thinking about it in the back of their minds.

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>>386557121
>Mario Odyssey is going back the open gameplay 64/Sunshine

I got a chance to try the game. This is flat out wrong. It played nothing like any previous 3D Mario. The momentum is all wrong. Instead, I envision the final product being similar to 3D Land and World. Mediocre platformers, but this one has an enemy transformation gimmick and the "production values" of Galaxy.

Fuck Nintendo. They don't make games for fans. They make games for themselves.

>>386557121
TTYD is an overrated pile of backtracking through the most boring level designs in the series history.

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>>386557121
>Splatoon
>just decent
But I hope Nintendo buys Platinum so we get more action games. They're one of the best developers I think

>>386557121
>arm is anything but a simplistic borefest

W E W L A D

will nintenegros ever learn?

>>386557813
Kinda sad. Color splash was actually pretty good if not for the pointless battle system.

>>386558940
Cry deeper. With more meaning.

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>>386557121
Mario & Luigi is their premier Mario RPG series now, anon. That's actually literally the reason they ruined Paper Mario: They thought it was redundant to have more than one active Mario RPG spinoff franchise so they choose M&L over PM and made the latter into their experimental gimmick franchise.

>>386558940
>I got a chance to try the game. This is flat out wrong.
Guess how I know you're just talking out of your fucking ass?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27SWKUt_Cus

>>386559278
>game was actually pretty good if not for the gameplay

>>386559549
But this series isn't the same thing.

>>386559595
Well yeah. Writing, level design, music. Pretty much everything but the battles and lack of NPC design variety.

>>386559626
I know, it's fucking retarded, but that's their reasoning:

http://kotaku.com/the-paper-mario-game-not-everyone-wants-1783142383

>When I asked Tabata back at E3 whether we should think of the new Paper Mario as an RPG, she said: “This game is an action-adventure.” She then explained what many Paper Mario fans have already deduced. “I’m sure you’re aware that, at Nintendo, we also have another series called the Mario & Luigi RPG series,” she said. “And so since we already have that established Mario & Luigi RPG series, in order to differentiate these two series that we have running concurrently, we’ve tried to focus more on the non-RPG elements for the Paper Mario games.”

>>386559626
To Nintendo they are the same thing.

>>386557618
Yes it did. Skyward Sword, Twilight Princess, and to a lesser extent Wind Waker were all following a tired formula of trying to be OoT that was getting really stale really quick before BotW came out.

>>386557593
Miyamoto seems to be stepping back a bit and letting the younger guys take over. I doubt he would've let Mario Odyssey happen since its so out there with new stuff. The Switch reveal conference, for example was hosted by a guy we'd never seen before.

>>386559278
>Color splash was actually pretty good
no it wasn't

>>386559738
How the hell does a company understand their own products less than the customers?

>>386559943
It was. Aside from the points I mentioned.

Mind you, they're big points.

>>386559550
>posts video proving my point

The guy even said:

>I don't think we'll ever get back to n64 levels of insane movement

>>386559903
i seriously hope you're not talking about koizumi

>>386559991
>How the hell does a company understand their own products less than the customers?

Welcome to Nintendo.

>>386557618
considering botw is going to become the highest selling game in the series, yes it did.

I can't tell if this is a joke thread or not.

Nintendo's word can't be trusted, so we shouldn't assume anything about games that haven't been released.

Splatoon and arms are subpar at best.

And BotW was some weird open world physics game with the Zelda theme attached, not an actual Zelda game.
It prevented the Zelda series from going stale in the same way you prevent a loaf of bread from going stale by baking your own loaf and then shoving it in the container from the old loaf.

Paper Mario is a dead series. And honestly I'd rather them let it stay dead than attempt to revive it.

>>386560150
Its not like SM64 was literally a tech demo anyways

>>386560342
The only joke here is you dude.

>>386559595

The out of battle gameplay was the best in the series. The game has over 30 different locations and most of them kick the ass of any TTYD level design.

>>386557121
Best you can hope for is HD remakes of the first two. Not that either of them really need it, they both still look good.

>>386557813
>I would hope they rethink their approach to Paper Mario.

Tanabe already said they've felt they've done enough with the current formula. The next Paper Mario game won't be like SS/CS.

Intelligent Systems is not Nintendo. They'll likely continue to fuck shit up.

>but Miyamoto

Simply made an already bad situation worse.

>>386560342
>food analogy

It's never too late to abort yourself, you mouthbreathing condom malfunction.

>>386560838
It's been 3 games, it's about time they return to the original gameplay

>>386559813
I'm surprised by how dull WW is. Sail here, sail there, feed the fish, clear this very linear dungeon... i mean, i'm not hating it, but I'm surprised after I've witnessed so many praise the series as a whole for all these years. Usually SS is the only one getting shit talked

>>386561248
WW looks bad now since BotW took just about everything it wanted to do and perfected it.

>>386560715
Paper Mario on the N64 has some pretty blurry sprites unlike TTYD which visuals' are much more timeless. The first game could definitely benefit from an remake with new sprites and models.

>>386561248
Before SS, WW was the one shit talked a lot.

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>>386557121
>Nintendo's in the process of unfucking their shit up,
excuse me

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>>386557121
>go back from original gameplay to its original gameplay

>>386561892
What are you talking about?

>>386561248
It's like Majora's Mask in that it's a game about immersing yourself in the mood and atmosphere the game is trying to build. If you break it down to a list of objectives like you just did it can be pretty boring

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>>386560150
What about the part where he still claims the movement is far superior to that of 3d world and Galaxy? I mean... like the entirety of it?

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>>386561678
What the fuck were they thinking?

>>386561678
Reminder the right is designs for Bowsers minions
Weve yet to see official SS remake designs

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>>386561892
are you trying to imply that Sticker Star and Sticker Star 2 have SMRPG/PM64/TTYD combat gameplay?

>>386561678
>left
>massive fucking faggot
>right
>quiet closeted homosexual

both suck dick

>>386562623
>Bowser's minions
>bean trooper
>bean lakitu
nani

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>>386562623
can't tell if you're joking or not

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>>386557121
>going back the open gameplay 64/Sunshine
And it's trash, reminder those are the two Mario games with the least amount of platforming.

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>>386562769
>talking shit about SSS designs besides overworld Bowser sprites

>>>/a/

>>386562315
Yeah, i realize that. But that's how the game feels to ne right now, procedural. Now I'm still getting a hang of the world of course, i unlocked the teleporting ability only recently so things are getting better, but the first impressions were frustrating, and usually with Zelda games starting out it's the best part imo

>>386562975
Then it clearly isn't the one for you.

WW's first half is actually much better than its second half aside from the ending which is amazing.

>>386557813
Colour Splash didnt fail

>>386559943
it was honestly fine

>>386559813
Skyward Sword and Twilight Princess were only a bad trend to plebs who dont also play the 2D games where the only stale one was Phantom Hourglass

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>>386562850
>64
>least amount of platforming

>>386563226
fuck off, apologist.

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>>386559943

Yeah it was, Color Splash is easily in the top 3 Paper Mario games.

>>386559595
Same problem as Super Paper Mario. While the gameplay is tedious, everything else is great. Even if the series is being limited into having to use only mainline characters and enemies, IS still does its best to make it interesting. Especially the writers.

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>zelda game that tried to appeal to skyrim babies
>not stale

>>386563226
>it was honestly fine
i don't think that making battles pointless in a game where battles are supposed to be the core of the gameplay is fine.
but that's me.

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>>386563249
>Run up a hill
>Press A behind a Bob Omb three times

>Platforming
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfZxJZMgZ54

>>386563367
apologise

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>>386557121
It will be a Kingdom Hearts-style romp through classic Nintiddy game worlds in paper form.
Combat will be a beat-em up style with commands to give your companions.
The gimmick this time around will be a multiplayer mode where you can play with one joycon and give the other to a friend to control your party member in combat bits

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>>386563226
>>386563415
>there is a CS apologist
>he actually exists
>he breathes the same air as we do and eats the same food
>he could be a friend, a relative, a co-worker

>>386561678
alphadream is not nintendo

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>>386563510
>battles
>core of Paper Mario gameplay

>>386563415
That's reasonable when the series only has 2 good games.

>>386563510
battles arent pointless, you deed them to increase your paint capacity, which is needed for puzzles and pulling off attacks

it's not the best, but it is definitely not comparable to Sticker Star at all

Having replayed TTYD... yeah. Color Splash is the best game in the series.

People go on and on about the combat, but here's the thing guys... PM's combat was never that good, especially not in TTYD. It is very easily abused. I find Sticker Star and CS's focus on improving the overworld design to be a HUGE improvement over what TTYD did.

>>386563597
I enjoyed watching a walkthrough of this game because of the writing

>>386563597
>a
Ive seen at least two other people defend it before I commented in the thread. I'm not the guy who always posts the CS images

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>>386563642
ok

>>386563714
I'm pretty sure what everyone's upset over CS is the shitty combat, above everything else, by far

>>386562780
He's talking about the extra gamemode. No idea why he thinks that has different designs though.

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I'd actually be fine if they went back to the Super Paper Mario style of things. Besides some flaws here and there it was a really solid game.

>>386562927
I just want AlphaDream to make a new IP again and be as goofy as they want without being blatantly off model or restricted by brand norms

>>386563545
> taking the very first world as an example

wew

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>>386563642
>battles
>not the core of Paper Mario gameplay

is this what they call bait nowadays?

there's a reason why people got butt-bummed over Super Paper Mario, there's a reason why SS and CS got so much backlash, and it's because SPM changed the combat too much and SS and CS made the combat UTTER GARBAGE

>>386563226
I neither played the 2D games nor think that TP or SS were a "bad trend" both were good and entertaining and fun to play.

>>386562329
How insulting to Galaxy to put it alongside 3d land and 3d World. No respect.

I firmly believe this was just made to hype up Odyssey to nostalgiafags.

>>386564030
>Platformer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qHba5iM1Zw

>>386562329
>>386564241
Galaxies are more of a middle ground between 64/sunshine and 3DL/W. Dropping them in the same category as the latter is disingenuous.

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>>386557121
don't forged fire emblem being a mainline nintendo franchise, generating lots of money and putting gay characters making nintendo a progressive company for all family, helping gay parents and gay, bisexual and transgender kids.

>>386561248
Wind Waker is trash, my dude. Only faggots and women like the game. It's commits the cardinal sin of entertainment: the game is boring as fuck. No tension. Enemies are piss easy even in the last dungeon.

What a fucking joke. WW works as a kid's game. Especially with those toddler asthetics.

>>386557593
Miyamoto had next to nothing to say about BOTW, so I hope they continue to tell him to fuck off.

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>>386565484
He still has some say in a some stuff like Pikmin and Star Fox.

>>386564409
Worst level, though... Shitty AI for enemies, too.

>>386565972
>Platformer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KJTAI1ws34

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>>386565765
Reminder that Miyamoto said he gad no more plans to make another F-Zero game because he couldn't think of any controller gimmicks to use in it and that it'd just play just GX.

>>386559549
Mario & Luigi RPG is one of the best Nintendo series, but the fact Paper Mario was changed because of it is sad.

>>386563920
Super Paper Mario was cool, I agree, but the game world felt dead and empty, that's the biggest flaw I see in it, and the reason why I couldn't like it.

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>>386563642
>>386563683
I feel like I have to categorize and lay out some genre definitions.
RPGs are games where you play a role in a story, where your role in that story is an integral part of the gaming experience.

Traditionally, Table Top RPGs and their Western RPG descendants focus on the player choosing their role in the story and having the world react in some ways to those choices.

JRPGs, by comparison, limit the choices the player can make but instead improve upon the writing and since the 'campaign' is now more linear, it can feature improved writing and such since it does not need to account for several player choices.

In both of these genres, nearly all of the systems are to help facilitate the story that the player if experiencing. Leveling systems exist to create a controlled sense of progression so that players don't start off as gods. Combat systems are, similarly, meant to be an abstract of conflict that don't overshadow the story in the mid-term or long-term.

The first two Paper Mario games understood this dynamic very well. They were essentially JRPGs that incorporated certain 'feelings' from Mario platformers into their movement and combat while creating a sort of fan-fictiony world built around Mario-franchise creatures.

The story was always the most important aspect because the combat in JRPGs and even many WRPGs was never meant to be entertaining on their own. The combat in these games is mostly exciting and fun as a representation of your actions within the story. They are a tangible expression of combat versus the purely visual/audio style a visual novel might employ.

Hence, the reason that Sticker Star and Color Splash and Paper Jam and even Super fail to match up to the first two is because they misunderstood that the gameplay is never the focus in an RPG. Turn-based RPG combat is entirely meant to simply be an abstract of a more exciting plot or story concept that a player can tangibly play with.

>>386566151
>that it'd just play just GX.
This is what he said about Paper Mario when Sticker Star was turning out to be similar to TTYD, that 'it played just like the one on GC'.
He can't be trusted with anything other than Pikmin.

>>386564045
Super was garbage because it put in shittier platforming in an RPG spin off of the grandfather of all platforming titles that had gotten the feel and mechanics of that genre down to a science.

Again, the benefit of the Paper Mario combat was that it took a lot of 'feeling' hints from platformers (a focus on timing and, in engaging a fight, positioning) but it was mostly to abstract the general form of combat with enemies in a story-oriented game. RPGs are mostly just Visual Novels with tangible mechanics to give the player a way to engage with the story itself (the ability to walk around and engage with individual NPCs, turn-based combat, exploration elements).
There are games that do immersion, combat and exploration all better but they don't have a focus on story generally and so RPGs as a game genre use those mechanics to give a tangible abstraction of those aspects of a story,

>>386566151
>>386566351
What's wrong with a series keeping the same gameplay? Even as much as BOTW changed about Zelda, the core controls and gameplay remains unchanged.

>>386566283
>redditspacing
argument discarded

>>386566574
Miyamoto also said that because the Mario and Luigi series had similar gameplay to Paper Mario that it was redundant to have Paper Mario keep the same gameplay.

>>386557593
I think the complete failure of Star Fox Zero has made them realize that you shouldn't listen to Miyamoto for story and branding advice.

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>>386566663
Glad I'm not the only who does this.

>>386566687
Except the anime short was really well received, and the vast majority of complaints pretty clearly came from people who didn't play the game.

>>386566684
I don't think he understands how RPGs work, because they play completely differently.

>>386566903
Well if everyone that was complaining bought the game, then Nintendo wouldn't have had an issue with sales, now would they? I'm pretty sure all the reviews slammed it, too.

>>386557121
paper mario 1 & 2 remake ports for 3DS and switch. Thats the only thing i need

>>386566903
The short was well received because it wasn't just Starfox 64 with some twists. That's part of why nobody gave the Game a chance.

Yes, I know it's meant to sync up with Corneria in the game. It's a matter of presentation and scale.

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>>386567094
https://www.polygon.com/2016/4/20/11466308/not-a-review-star-fox-zero

>>386566569
Super's platforming was revolving around the 3D flipping, and that was well executed. If you wanna talk shit about it, explain what's bad about it. And reminder that the Mimi chapters (mansion and rubees factory) were godlike

>>386566663
Can someone explain to me what redditspacing is?
I just do that because I've found it's easier to look at and read

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>>386566684
Reminder that when they first showed Miyamoto Super Mario 64, he spent the first half hour climbing up and down the same tree, and the only reason he stopped is because they reminded him to try the rest of the game.

>>386567240
You mean BotW right?
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2017/03/shigeru_miyamoto_spent_a_lot_of_time_climbing_trees_in_zelda_breath_of_the_wild

>>386567225
Paragraphs were invented by Reddit, didn't you know?

>>386557593
Mario Odyssey actually has plenty of original and non-standard Mario characters in it. And it's a main flagship title.
Surely that gives some leeway for spin-offs like Paper Mario to go off the rails some again.

>>386567403
Miyamoto hasn't been involved with mainline Mario since Galaxy which was in 2007.

>>386559064
Your opinion is wrong

>>386567296
Oh, right. Regardless, I think he's lost it. A lot of this looks similar to the onset of dementia.

>>386567208
Super had good parts. I actually liked the story even if the Arc zones were sort of nonsensical a lot of the time.
The 3D flipping was okay for some puzzles but I found it rendered a lot of zones to be really empty. It negated a lot of the combat too, which itself as a straight platformer was weak compared to just a normal Mario game.

That's the issue: While the combat in the original Paper Mario games were just turn based with some platforming aspects thrown in, it served as an interesting space for using the companions and experiencing our progression. The little mini-games in combat just made it not boring to go through battles, it didn't actually make the battles really fun on their own.

In a platformer, you're good if you're good and a lot of the things Super does is extract really basic abilities into the Pixels which does two fairly annoying things. First, it means you have to fuck around with a menu if you want to use a basic ability (vs the companion abilities in the first two which were often tied to single zones and had a handful of non-essential uses outside of their origin zone). And second, it forces you to have to unlock incredibly mundane mechanics just to generate a sense of progression in the platformer. It took an okay platformer and turned it into a not-very-good Metroidvania where you have to unlock the most basic abilities for exploration.

>>386567373
I did not know

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Sticker Star was too much of a success for Nintendo to considering dropping the nu-Paper Mario formula.

>>386567586
>>386567296
I actually did the same as soon as i started the game, i knew climbing was a big deal so when i got out of the cave i ignored the old man for a while and started climbing hills and trees to test my limits and enjoy the view

>>386567782
I think it was a success because nobody could gave predicted just how bad it was. Even I fell for their tricks.

I mean, Skyward Sword was a success, and they dropped that formula off a fucking cliff.

>>386565765
>that shitty excuse for cutting the shiekah tablet from the Wii U.

The real reason is because it made the Switch version inferior to the Wii U version.

>>386567948
Skyward Sword actually didn't sell that well, Breath of the Wild has already surpassed it in sales.

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>>386566663
>paragraphs
>REDDIT SPACING LMAO
Please

>>386558940
I played it and you're wrong

>>386567948
Tons of elements from Breath of the Wild got their start in SS.

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>>386568167
>A single sentence is a paragraph

>>386567938
Yes but you also said you were climbing hills and trees. Miyamoto just climbed the same tree over and over again.

>>386568301
Yeah. So is one word. Why am I replying to a redditspacer though?fuckingredditspacing

>>386563226
>Skyward Sword and Twilight Princess were only a bad trend to plebs who dont also play the 2D games where the only stale one was Phantom Hourglass

completely accurate desu

>>386568301
you're retarded

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>>386568431
Why do I hate reddit again?

>>386568421
The interviewer speaks clearly of multiple trees around the starting area, come on now

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>>Breath of the Wild saved the Zelda series from going stale

>>386559550
>Zed-L
A
FUCKING
LEAF

>>386564078
WTF
HOW DID NINTENDO ALLOW IT

>>386568630
I mean, it changed it up more than any other installment did. We'll have to see the next installment to get a sense of whether it's going to go stale or not.

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>>386568758
>it changed it up more than any other installment did.
t. pleb

Stop with the paragraph autism pls

>>386564078
>>386568736
Are we sure the name isn't something the US localization came up with? Reminds me of Splatoon 2's American translation that used that weird pun for teenage squids that was in no other version

>>386568758
Well it returned to the original Zelda games while picking and improving on a lot of the open-world mechanics that have become common place

>>386557121
BOTW was Skyrim with a Zelda skin and we have yet to see Metroid Prime 4 so don't make claims yet

Odyssey looks fucking fantastic but the lack of a hub world concerns me

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>>386567692
> I found it rendered a lot of zones to be really empty.
that was the point of the 3D flipping, everything was 2D and the world made sense that way, and when you 3D flipped you'd see things you're not supposed to

>the combat
in SPM you can avoid the combat but doing it is so fast and seamless that it's pointless to avoid it (considering you're rewarded for it), unless you don't like facing a specific enemy, but it's also fast and seamless to avoid them

meanwhile, SS and CS combat is the exact opposite of rewarding, while also locking you in place and taking too long for something that isn't fun (because of various reasons, ranging from losing stickers that you'll have to collect again in the overworld, to losing stickers that you want to save up for mandatory bosses, and so on) and that doesn't reward you properly (coins and shitty stickers? c'mon now, IS)

>the platforming
SPM is not a straight platformer, the same ways it's not a Paper Mario game, it's its own thing

the Pixls really were annoying overall, probably the worst part of the game, but they were still quick to swap around (quicker than any other PM game to swap partners, didn't you have to pause to switch them in the previous games? in SPM you can drop down a sub menu during the regular game), but their designs and powers were lackluster (though nothing will ever be as lackluster as SS/CS Toads)

they should just have called the game something else and made new characters and NOBODY would have complained about it at all, however if they did that to SS and CS, NOBODY would even talk about them because the core gameplay, the combat, is so fucking bad

in SS, what do you do besides the shitty combat? move around and use obvious stickers in obvious places to proceed, and in CS you use a fire extinguisher to put out fire, if you really do that and think "wow this is amazing!", then I believe your standards are the lowest possible

>>386568975
Implying Skyrim was good

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>>386568975
>Odyssey looks fucking fantastic
Literally 3D World v2.

>>386568906
I meant out of the 3D games.

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>>386569196
I thought the main complaint about 3D World was the limited movement. Doesn't more movement options and the ability to overcome obstacles in creativecwsys like this prove that it's less like 3D World and more like 64 and Sunshine?

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>>386569196

If the platforming shown in that web.m isn't what you'd want to be able to do in a 3D Mario then you should kindly fuck off.

>>386568758
I mean yeah, it changed it. Not necessarily improved.
But I mean Zelda has/had been stale since Wind Waker. That's sort of what happens when you keep reusing the same core gameplay mechanics and plot. Zelda was so stale that idiots at E3 were happy just to get a "realistic" aesthetic in Twilight Princess, because the series had nothing else to offer.
also BotW feels like a tech demo for 15 year old tech, but that's another discussion entirely

>>386566684
That's a good argument. I'd just wish they had thrown M&L under the bus instead, the series is stale as fuck.

>>386569409
nah he's whining about the floating blocks and shit being all there is for level design

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>>386569409
>More like Sunshine
I seriously hope not.

>>386569409
>creativecwsys
Creative ways*
I don't know what the fuck happened.

>>386569479
They had that in 64, though. A good portion of Bob-Omb Battlefield was just floating in mid-air.

>>386568994
I agree it made sense but mechanically it still hurt any sense of interest. Mind you I actually liked Super but I just found certain things to be offputting after a while.

>combat
I completely agree with you.
SS and CS misunderstood what the turnbased combat was and actually made it worse than how it was previously by doing two things.
First, resource management for the most BASIC attacks, along with the actual process of choosing attacks, made combat tedious and largely more stressful than strategic.

SECONDLY, and this is the big one, with no leveling or sense of progression, there is NO, and I repeat, NO reason to engage in combat at all.

Super, like you said, let you skip around bits you didnt care for. You dont get as much of the same option in CS and SS AND the enemies are boring AND there is no story to contextualize your combat. So it's just a 3D world game but with boring and stressful turnbased combat instead of fun platforming.

>platforming
I also agree with you here for the most part. I enjoyed some of the puzzles and if they gave me the option to hotswap between pixls, as well as giving them more lines and personality during story beats, I'd have liked them more.

That was one of my issues, the pixls had no presence in the story the same way party members did before. I liked some of the puzzles with some of them and how they let me swap between the other three protagonists without worrying too much about abilities.

Super was flawed but I take back what I said about it being garbage. It tried new things that it thought were inventive and I can't fault a game for at least trying.

I can imagine a really great scenario where we get Super 2 and it polishes up a lot of things.
Platforming with the perspective shift becomes more akin to TTYD where there were new but more navigateable challenges on the Z-axis.
Combat becomes more inventive with using pixls for more creative things than single-purpose puzzles.

It could be good.

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>>386562850
>>386563545
>>386564409
>>386566103
>>386565972

>>386569480
outskilled kid

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Every Paper Mario thread deserves this picture.

>>386567560
It's based in fact.
So much of that game is just going back and forth through some of the blandest level designs in the series. Fun themes and backgrounds didn't do enough to make up for the bland layout.

>>386569480

Whoever designed THIS and the insta-kill river you can only get to with Yoshi and wait for a billion years for the ferries should be fucking fired.

>>386569464
Say that to fucking Dream Team

>>386567225
Some dumbass new way to disregard someone by tangentially linking them to something seen as distasteful.

pm64
>we've created some quaint sprites for our game. since they're in a 3d environment, they just so happen to look like paper!
ttyd
>we'll use layered sprites to create fluid movement for our 2d characters in 3d environment
color splash
>yeah just give them a white outline and 2 frames per second. the choppy movement just screams DUDE PAPER LMAO, fans will love it

>>386569881
Whoever though releasing a sequel to 64 with half the stages and throwing in 240 blue coins to make up for it should be fired as well.

>>386569771
Miyamoto's reasoning for plain Toads doesn't make sense. The idea of understanding a character's function from their design alone makes sense for w platformer when you have only a split second to react at some points, but it has no place in an RPG where the world should be built upon unique and believable characters.

These threads make me hate Miyamoto so fucking much.

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>>386569674
you know what is the worst part, by far of all this stuff?

Sticker Star and Color Splash have wonderful music and visuals, and you can see that the writing isn't bad, they were just forced by Miyamoto to cut all the characters and shove only NSMB stuff around, so you get a couple godlike parts COMPLETELY RUINED by the rest of the game which they had nailed perfectly in the first games anyways, if they had just copy and pasted the badge system nobody would complain (except Miyamoto, again, who complained that SS was too much like TTYD)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvpyLWf5X8Y

>>386569771
RIP, series

If by "original gameplay", you mean "turn-based RPG" then nah, fuck that. Mario & Luigi has long since expanded on the Mario RPG gameplay to the point where it makes Paper Mario's not only redundant, but look like shit in comparison.
If anything, it should drop the RPG battle system entirely and try to make Super Paper Mario's puzzle platforming more engaging while keeping the fun imaginative settings that made the originals so charming.

>>386569706
>Platformer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iko0PsZO3xU
>Platformer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARKLb6PLJWc
>Platformer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmh-ZKcjoH4
>Platformer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyBMf6-DaqI

>>386569771
>that big purple mole with a crown
>chain chomp partner
jesus christ, thankfully we have Miyamoto to save us from such horrors! imagine, we almost got that on Sticker Star, phew!

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>>386570202

Yeah, blue coins were a ballbuster, so much so, that I restarted my file back then, I only needed like 3 but couldn't fucking find them, and did not collect a SINGLE blue coin until I had all the other shines, and used a guide that came in the Nintendo magazine to collect those things, I finally made it and only got a "congratulations" screen.

End me, at least Galaxy gave us Luigi to play as, although I DO love Sunshine, and I think it still has tight as shit controls.

>>386570271
I actually disagree that the music was good. I mean, it IS good music, but it's missing that twangy electronic sound that was solidified as the series' musical style up until SS. So to that effect, the music in the games only stands to further distance the games from the series for me.

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>>386569771
if Miyamoto designed a fighting game:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WRHi9oyMXqE


>KSabot
>1 month ago
>those gloves have too much personality


>people might get the wrong idea and care

wow, even youtube comments can be good sometimes

>>386570310

To be honest considering LoZ:BOTW being open world, I think a good direction to take Paper Mario would be the Ocarina of Time LoZ formula.

I think Paper Mario could be very good as an action adventure game.

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>>386570498
>I actually disagree that the music was good.

>>386570675
Read the rest of my post, retard.

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>>386570472
>at least Galaxy gave us Luigi to play as
That honestly wasn't much better, the Green Stars from Galaxy 2 are a much better idea of post game content.

>>386570498
I liked most of the music in the game, even if it wasn't on par with the previous games

also, this:
https://youtu.be/za89tQbn_3w?t=385
was too fucking good, SPECIALLY for being this shitstain of a game

>>386570783

Well, maybe I consider unlocking characters that are not just pallete swaps (Luigi at least has different physics than Mario) a great reward, best example is Viewtiful Joe 1, you can unlock 3 other fucking characters, each with their own playstyle, and some of them are hidden behind some pretty hard modes, so that's another great reason to challenge the game.

But I agree, green stars and more characters not only are challenging but also add good replay value IMO.

>>386566663
>seriously using a redditboard to type his posts
get out of here you filth

ttyd has shit music

>>386571012

And bad level design.

>>386567098
>paper mario 1 on a handheld
this is all I've ever wanted since the DS

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>>386570803
Whenever I see shit like the Crumpled status, I die a little inside. The paper was always meant to be just a quirky art style. The characters were never meant to know that they were paper. Even most of the jokes in both SS and CS boil down to a paper pun or "I'M TOTALLY LAPER GUYS! GET IT?".

I think the best way to explain the shift between games is that it turned from Paper MARIO into PAPER Mario.

>>386571012
all i remember is the spooky glitz pitz music and being scared shitless during the pig village chapter

>>386570989
It's definitely better than doing a 100% run of Sunshine, I did it last year and some of the levels that they put in that game are mind boggling in how they got approved.
The Pachinko Machine and Poison River in particular.

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>>386557121
>Breath of the Wild saved the Zelda series from going stale
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Said no one fucking ever. The zelda series never got stale. Just the devs behind it sucked. Just like how odyssey is going to suck, Prime 4 is going to be a mess thatll make federation and star fox zero look good, and Splatoon and Arms are glorified shovelware. Fucking kek. Nintendo was only good N64 and prior.

The only reason I don't fully hate on Miyamoto nowadays is because of Pikmin. If he fucks up Pikmin 4, I'm done with him.

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>>386571727
When is Pikmin 4 even coming out.

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>>386563683
Yeah man, and why have every NPC look different when they call all just be the same identical Toad?

I love a lot of Nintendo franchises and I'm liking the Switch and new IPs, but for me they're in the worst way right now.

>Zelda has had a couple of weak games, then BotW totally jumped ship from the franchise and I hated it
>ARMS looks decent but light on content, Pokken too
>I'm not paying £20 a year for (poor) online when that comes in, so I expect to sell Splatoon 2 before Christmas
>So far they're releasing games for the Switch in franchises I'm less fond of (Kirby and Yoshi) while neglecting my favourites (any of the strategy franchises) as they tend to do with franchises from time to time
>Mario Odyssey looks 50/50 right now

>>386558940
>Fuck Nintendo. They don't make games for fans. They make games for themselves.
Why did reading this sentence make me laugh so hard?

FUCKING DEVS MAKING GAMES THAT THEY WANT TO MAKE AAAARGGHH

>>386572701
That isnt what he meant you single digit IQ manlet. He means they intentionally make games with low budgets and the base amount of gameplay cause they're riding off brand along now. It's like throwing Mario's face on a can of Spaghetti Os and letting that be the sailing feature. It's precisely what they did with Botw.

>>386572861
>It's precisely what they did with Botw.

How does the game provide hours and hours of content "riding off brand" with "base amount of gameplay" ?

>>386563683
>Color Splash is the best game in the series.
>PM's combat was never that good, especially not in TTYD.
> I find Sticker Star and CS's focus on improving the overworld design to be a HUGE improvement over what TTYD did.

how can someone be so completely wrong on literally everything? this is almost as shit taste as that guy saying Hidrocity Zone act 2 music is bad

>>386571798
one day

>>386573127
Botw doesn't have hours of content. It has hours of walking. It takes the worse parts of the Elder Scroll games and doesn't add anything else to it. Because Nintendo threw away all the past features of the older zelda games, Botw isn't even in the same genre as the previous console zeldas. It's a different game in the same way Hyrule Warriors is.

They took a game with wide fields and bloom filter out the ass and added Zelda to it. They knew they could give the lowest amount of effort into making a zelda game cause fans will eat it up. And they did. 10/10, zelda does it again! Who NEEDS dungeons, stories, or anything that has made Zelda the top series it was in the past. Who NEEDS gameplay when you can just wander around and play with physics until you get bored, turn off the game, then turn it back on and play some more with it while telling yourself that it's fun when in reality you're doing it cause it's the only thing special in your otherwise dull life. That's zelda in 2017.

>>386573332
Look at his name. He's being ironic, aka shitposting.

>>386561248
Protip: All the Wind Waker love comes from people who had it as their first Zelda.

I mean it's a straight up fucking unfinished game. It's missing two dungeons, and the devs had to pad it with Triforce hunting.

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>>386573479
This.

>>386573479
>Botw doesn't have hours of content. It has hours of walking.
Oh man, i had 90 hours of fake fun. Nintendo tricked me again

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>>386573528
who's Cody? am I missing a joke here?

>>386573559
I like WW, even if it is heavily flawed, and it was my 4th Zelda game, and I even enjoyed the Triforce hunting because I like traveling around the game's overworld while being fully powered (just like the Prime games' relic collecting)

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>>386557121
The problem is that it isn't just Miyamoto. Nintendo execs have generally decided that having Mario & Luigi and Paper Mario both be RPG series that even shared similar mechanics is redundant, which is why Paper Mario has taken the gimmicky spinoff route since Super Paper Mario.

Either the Mario & Luigi series would need to fall off or botch the remake of Superstar Saga, which is very unlikely given their consistent modest successes, or someone would have to get the big-time rare opportunity to wheel it back after Sticker Star's "this is just thousand year door on 3DS" controversy that Miyamoto stirred.

>>386566663

I hope you get cancer you fucking nigger

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>>386573752
Cody is /ourguy/

>>386563545
>A
Ah, we didn't play the same game.

>>386570271
You can say the same about Starfox.
People have been waiting 20 years for a sequel proper, and instead we get a fourth fucking remake.

All anybody wanted was Starfox 64 with new stages and a different story.

>>386572330
>then BotW totally jumped ship from the franchise and I hated it

What the fuck did you want?

>>386565067
I mean, it's also a fun series with generally high quality across the board (sans shadow dragon but that one's still decent even if it's a low point)

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>>386574042
And here's Cody absolutely destroying Nintendo's most cancerous fan base.

>>386573559
WW was nowhere near my first Zelda, but it's still near the top of my personal list

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>>386573730
You werent having fun. You thought you were having fun because Nintendo fed you another console zelda and Nintendo is the only company you pray to by giving them money. You don't believe in playing anything else, and if you do, it's only until the God given developer Nintendo makes a new game for you to drop money on cause nintendo can never do wrong. You use the excuse that they use to make good games, so they can't make bad ones, while questioning why they took the best parts of zelda out, why your weapons have to break, wondering why you have to look for story, and then going further with thinking why the dungeons are gone, why the shrines are just that, why ganon was so easy, why was the ending rushed, why is the main menu look like it was designed in Power point, why the music is just pianos, why the only reward for exploration is either korok seeds or shrines, why a lot of the stable items are gone, why is the game always lagging, why why why. You ask this, but you repress it in your head cause you think Nintendo can ever do anything wrong and it's the only thing important in your life that if you were to give any flaw to this zelda game, it would be like saying you're a disgrace yourself as the one thing you have enjoyed in your lifetime has been reduced to trash.

Don't feel bad. It has happened to a lot of old franchises we all use to love. It was bound to be zelda's time.

>>386557121
Literally the only thing that would make me but a switch.
But it won't happen, M&L is the designated rpg series now.

>>386568256
Yes, but that didn't mean SS had to suck.

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>M&L and Paper Mario have they own charm but similar gameplay
>completely fuck up Paper Mario because of this
>"People want a real Paper Mario? Fuck it, just put Paper Mario in M&L"
>shove Toad shit into it anyways

>>386574431
I pirated BotW, faggot

>>386569409
Not to mention that Odyssey is actually Mario 64 style where the individual worlds are full of platforming puzzles and challenges that end up qualifying as levels on their own

you can't please anybody anymore

>>386574325
Not him but some good combat and level design would be a start. Not that this is BotW's fault, this is the crutch of all 3D Zeldas.

>>386574662
Who cares? You still gave Nintendo the time of your day to play their game. You're still delusional thinking it's a good game.

>>386574728
>this is the crutch of all 3D Zeldas.
Fucking untrue. You just can't do open world and level design at the same time. They dont work.

Aonuma literally said during the reveal of Botw that you can't come to any location from any direction you want. This throws any kind of level design out the window. All the previous zeldas had god tier level design and 3D was a good thing to happen to the zelda series. Unfortunately, something happened after ocarina where the team just suddenly lost their mojo and decided to pad the game with shit like oceans and story-locked wolf sections.

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>>386574431
>this level of effortposting

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>>386557121
>they bring paper mario back to its roots
>the characters still have the white outlines
>all the side characters are still toads
>the music is still nu-tendo jazz/saxophone meme shit

>>386575072
>"nu-tendo jazz/saxophone meme shit"
I hope someone throttles you in your sleep.

>>386575072
>>all the side characters are still toads
That's the only bad thing you listed

>>386575189
if I hear another fucking jazz/ sax shit in a mario game....

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>>386575130
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjkGGMxyxiA

>>386573752
got any sauce for that goodness?

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>>386574940
>All the previous zeldas had god tier level design
Sounds like you're just underage.

>>386575072
>the characters still have the white outlines
Honestly, I wouldn't mind a proper Paper Mario RPG maintaining the paper look. If there's one thing the recent PM games have had, it's good aesthetics, it's just they also shove paper gags in your face like it's going out of style. If the characters have nothing besides their visual flatness and the opening of walls to be called "Paper", the name does seem a bit of a misnomer.

>>386557618
It fixed a lot of gameplay issues that the Zelda formula had and feels a lot better because it doesnt follow the formula

>>386574431
The only negative thing I actually thought while playing BotW was "this breaking weapon mechanic sucks", I was fine with the rest, but good job trying to shove your frustations with the game down everyone's throat.

>>386574940
Except that was a lie, ironically, you can't approach any "level" other than Hyrule Castle from any direction, which is coincidentally the best design the game has to offer.
Divine Beasts are approached via cutscene and a minigame, and are completely separate from the game world. Why are they so poorly designed? Where are the enemies? Why are they all reliant on the same puzzle gimmick? Why are there blinking red dots? Why is a force ghost talking to me?
Compared to BotW, sure, previous iterations had fantastic level design. I wouldn't say it was god-tier, they certainly had room for improvement, but this level of regression is unheard of.

Also the combat sucks. We get it, you popularized Z Targeting, overhaul the fucking combat instead of adding QTE prompts. FFXV's cinematic combat has more action, input and timing than fucking Zelda.

>>386575379
go to bed Mark Brown

>>386558940
>They don't make games for fans. They make games for themselves.
That was incredibly obvious from their laziness regarding 2D Mario.

>>386575585
Not an argument.

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>>386575254
I like
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-h55eVAJmM
better

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>>386575379
nice try faggot

>saying underage when he doesn't know the first thing about level design so includes a streamlined pic of the functional walkthrough of the dungeon

Also your pic would actually have a lot of optional branches considering there's rooms and keys you dont have to get to complete the dungeon. There goes your narrative.

>>386572701
Well yes, if a game developer doesn't make games that customers want to play, then customers won't buy those games. Video games are a business, after all.

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>>386575559
Verticality, Interaction, optional solutions, no loading times, cross-room puzzles/out of box thinking, no padding (braindead enemies like in other Zelda dungeons or slow puzzles).

The hate the four beasts in BotW is literally a proof for me most "hardcore gamers" actually have no clue about game design.

Those dungeons were absolutely amazing. And the main reason they are so short compared to old Zelda dungeons is because they don't insult your intellect. There are actually optional ways to beat them, you can rush and skip things, barely any mini cutscenes or loading times, no gaes every meter, no pushing cubes, no carrying things around for minutes.

They are everything people wanted and people hate them.

>>386575559
>the last dungeon cant be approached from just anywhere, despite the moment you get in, you can skip everything and go straight to the boss

Hyrule castle was a good point to why open world sucks for a zelda game. Whats the point of level design when you can just skip everything? Thats why there isnt any in Botw. The fact Nintendo got away with a barebones world and you guys sucking the dick of it is proof of this.

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>>386575379
>>386575670
>3D fags
OH GEE DID A DOOR CLOSE BEHIND ME? DOY!

>>386575670
>considering there's rooms and keys you dont have to get to complete the dungeon.
I know for a fact that you have never played a 3D Zelda because this is absolutely never the case, the only time I can think where this is true is in Link's Awakening where there are 8 locked doors but there are 9 keys in the dungeon.

The Shadow Temple is a straight line in terms of progression, you get a key and then use it to unlock the next door and so forth. The only dungeon in OoT where you can collect keys out of order is the Forest Temple but even there you are still always gated behind a single locked door which makes the progression incredibly linear.

Your entire post is why OoTtoddlers should be disregarded.

>>386557618
Twilight Princess sucked too.

BotW is essentially Wind Waker but not held back by system limitations that required the huge map to be mostly water.

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>>386575834

>>386575848
People like you are also radically oversimplifying dungeons by simply looking at the linearity of door-to-door, key-per-door design. Everything inbetween is being grossly ignored and misunderestimated.

By that logic all the puzzles, challenge rooms and otherwise of games like Link to the Past don't matter either.

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>>386575631
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0M_zZRn-yo

>>386575807
>Whats the point of level design when you can just skip everything?
Uhhh , to explore. If you mean in game "rewards" you have the (second) last memory, ancient arrows, royal weapons, fights with Lynels (which are their own reward), the king's diary (one of the best pieces of writing in any Nintendo game), a Talus.. that's what I can rememb er off the top of my head

>>386564241
Galaxy 2 is just 3D World with gravity mechanics

>>386575994
lttp is a really poor example, being the poorest of the 2d games

>>386575778
>The hate the four beasts in BotW is literally a proof for me most "hardcore gamers" actually have no clue about game design.
Oh man, thats rich, a fucking Botw drone trying to school someone on game design.

Alright, little faggot. Since you think you know game design, answer this: as a game developer, you are asked to design one area in Botw. You are told that people will get to it from any direction, and so you need to design it with that in mind. No one direction can be considered wrong, and you'll have to adapt a design so that someone can't easily solve something being able to do what they want (funny how that works for a game about muh freedoms). Then you realize they already did this in the game, and it makes the task of going through the area moot. The labyrinths are a good example of what happens when you let open world dictate your design.

Why can't I just walk to the final boss and beat him as soon as I start the game? Shit game, too fucking linear.

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>>386575254
>>386575631
>>386576038
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkizz-EzmPA

>>386575848
>I know for a fact that you have never played a 3D Zelda because this is absolutely never the case
Except I have played them all and you're being a delusional faggot trying to defend Botw. Every dungeon in the past zelda games have option keys and rooms.

>>386575928
twilight princess was amazing you're just a hipster

>>386576104
I agree that the Labyrinths being so easy to cheese was a mistake. That has nothing to dowith my post though

>>386575414
That's because it wasn't called Paper Mario originally, it was Mario Story.

It's supposed to specifically be a pop-up book aesthetic, not LOL PAPER EVERYTHING

>>386575807
I hated BotW what are you even talking about. I hated SS and TP and WE too. 3D LoZ is bottom of the barrel 3D Action-Adventure, and evidently always will be.

I think 3D-world is a better game than galaxy

>>386575130
old paper mario music was better than anything in CS/Sticker Star
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTBNuKyGKnk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3djsFOGrxw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-lmaPnnD4g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqovxRr_JD8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2tbSZecN9c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POgfM1vuHbk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=to6cVeHBxnU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dq-FeJ0scXQ
the only memorable song from CS/SS was that one song at the beginning with the xylophones in sticker star

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>>386576202
>TFW Gust Garden Galaxy is so good it's become the main theme for 3D Mario
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gHxPLhnFCg

>>386576250
And yet Thousand Year Door expanded, even if not significantly, on the paper concept/gag because they opted to actually make use of the name. I know it was originally Mario Story, and that it was meant to be a direct successor to Super Mario RPG at one point too, but now everyone associates Paper Mario with.. well, paper.

As much as I hate the fact that the game world is now cardboard and all, simply throwing out every ounce of paper factors is a bit much.

>>386575414
The paper thing always seemed like more of an excuse to use sprites on a console, also it helped to reinforce the idea that it was just a story being told from a book, they weren't LITERALLY peices of paper walking around, it was more of a figurative thing

Besides the multiple outline thing is just obnoxious and the papercraft backgrounds are boring and ruin any immersion you might have in this RPG

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>>386576041
>exploration as a feature

Protip: no one cares about exploration unless you're one of those faggots who rather play a rock climbing simulator rather than play a zelda game. Considering most screenshots and discussions around botw's greatness have been everyone sucking the dick of exploration and freedom, I'm 99% sure that all the Botw dickriders are playing Botw solely cause it's not a game. Also, those rewards you listed are just checklists of achievements. They offer no tangible function in the game. It's no different from Minecraft. You CAN beat the game and beat the end boss, or you can wander around forever trying to make your own adventure cause Botw delivers none of it. It's a game made suited exactly for the autistic fanbase of Nintendo.

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>>386575958
Where are you getting these maps from? You have me thinking it did an injustice to the Shadow Temple now.

Moonlit Grotto is pretty weak, tho it does have the island item hunt/puzzle beforehand.

>>386576396
Come on, dude. The paper shit is obnoxious. I agree with this guy completely. >>386571316

>>386557121
>Breath of the Wild get stale after 50-60 sanctuaries.
>valid
>nobody but retards care
>nobody but retards care

>>386576380
Not just 3D Mario, the Mario franchise as a whole
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAGy1ZZp2ik

>>386569229
then you're a turbo pleb who doesnt recognize the better half of the series

>>386576041
Oh shit, i didn't know the king also had a diary, i only found the two from Zelda. But then again i still have to find those royal recipes i was asked to find

>>386576458
>The strongest arrows offer no tangible function
>Royal weapons offer no tangible function
>enemies arren't a tangible function
What?

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>>386576461
>You have me thinking it did an injustice to the Shadow Temple now.
All these graphs are showing is how rigid progression is in terms of item/puzzle gating, it's not trying to show the layout of the dungeon as much it is a flow chart.

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>Breath of the Wild saved the Zelda series from going stale
>Mario Odyssey is going back the open gameplay 64/Sunshine
>Metroid is back in full force
>new IPs like Splatoon and ARMS are decent
And then there's pikmin

Past Zelda's were simpler.

>Get to new dungeon
>Find new tool
>Fight boss with new tool
>Repeat

BotW actually makes you think

>>386576219
It's everything to do with it.

>>386576719
Designed by the people that killed the Yoshi's Island sequels.

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>>386576530
What's Nintendo's best OST and why is it MK8?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pa21uDOkwyM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsPjwC9DlUE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1kKtcNYbr8

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>>386576292
BoTW is literally the best action-adventure game ever made.
>b-but muh Okami
It's trash

>>386576643
All breakable, all optional.

>>386576818
>the labyrinths having an open ceiling has something to do with Divine Beasts being incredible achievements of level design
Huh?

>>386576795
>BotW actually makes you think
I guarantee if most of the casuals who played Botw were given a past zelda game, they'll complain it's too hard.

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>>386576856
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HX2EezTHTK4

>>386576461
A Youtuber named Mark Brown is going through the Zelda games to show the progression of keys, switches and doors in each dungeon.

>>386576986
The Divine Beasts are not incredible achievements of level design.

>>386576925
You said they have no tangible function. Now they do but it doesn't count? Keep moving those goalposts

>>386576719
>a spinoff game is a problem
are you a Metroid fan?

>>386576795
lol.

>>386577101
See >>386575778

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>>386577072
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M816Wz-5gUM
>That slap bass at the beginning

>>386577164
The hookshot has a function in Zelda. Botw has no item like that. The paraglide is the only functional item in the game and thats optional too if you cheese getting off the plateau

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>>386576856
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTEMsmLoEA4

>>386577262
Again, the Divine Beasts are not incredible achievements of level design.

>>386577383
Not an argument.

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>>386577370
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-0Ke_0SSuA

>>386577243
>a spinoff game is a problem
>are you a Metroid fan?
No, I'm a Chibi robo fan that saw what "spinoff games" can do to a franchise

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>>386577289
>segways into the SNES Mario Kart theme
god bless

>>386577301
The hookshot's function is to launch you to arbitrarily placed points . You can do that in Botw with stasis launching, or gliding updrafts, just to literally anywhere you want.
>thats optional too if you cheese getting off the plateau
Literally not possible, you need to get it or the game always voids you back to the plateau.

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>>386576864
>Shitty action
>Open-ended adventure in an unoriginal setting with no characters or context
It's not even a good puzzle game.

>>386577370
https://youtu.be/EA2TfyDkoqg

>>386577723
The hookshot also served the function of completing the game (unless you're a pleb glitch runner). That's what I meant by function. Nothing else in Botw matters except the paraglide. Having a weapon is imperative, too, anything that can help you damage Ganon.

>>386560342
You haven't even played any of those games, have you? Because only one out of the three is actually subpar.

>>386571012
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFsm1x0fQQU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tx6h2lDw4I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Avn4S_vRfr0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcLcNnJSNjI
Nah you have shit taste

>>386560179
He probably is.

While Koizumi has been around for more than 20 years at Nintendo, I don't think I have ever seen him doing PR before that, so it's not like that Anon was completely wrong with "a guy we'd never seen before".

>>386577836
Better action than Okami, better world than Okami.

>>386577016
BotW is the most difficult Zelda game in terms of actual gameplay, unless you're talking about how hard it is to get over how unsatisfying older Zelda's were, then I could understand you.

>>386577301
I'm trying to figure out how you got through the entire game without using the Sheikah Slate.

>>386577995
he has!

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>>386578179
Who ever mentioned Okami?

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>>386578238
>BotW is the most difficult Zelda game in terms of actual gameplay
Hell to the fuck no is it difficult. You can literally skip everything in this game. The most difficult part is keeping yourself from going to sleep. In that respect, yes it is a difficult game...TO PLAY.

>>386578179
What the fuck are you even on about? I've never played Okami. Well, never beat it, anyway.
>This game is shit which means mine is good
No.

>>386578238
>BotW is the most difficult Zelda game in terms of actual gameplay
Zelda 2 would like a word with you. Then after that, Skyward Sword.

>>386578272
That's just you disagreeing with open ended design, it's nothing specific to BotW nor is it new to the Zelda series (you can beat Zelda 1 without getting the sword).

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Hello, I'm Zelda on the CD-I, and I'm a better and harder game than Botw.

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>>386578426
I'm not even the guy you were talking to, I just wanted to know where this obsession with Okami came from.

>>386563597
Colour splash is top 3 though, it's better than super paper mario and sticker star for sure.

>>386578272
>>386578320
Dat samefag. I know it's your diogenesKC.

Facts about Okami: the dungeons are trash, the combat is trash and locks you into a shitty arena instead of existing in the world, the intro and cutscenes are the slowest in any game, the art style looks like putrid vomit, the puzzles are nonexistent, the exploration is nonexistent. Fuck off to your circlejerk nu-board and get out of my Zelda thread

>>386576585
I played the 2D games, but the 3D games are often treated as a separate entity.

>>386578574
>botwfags now have to shit on better games to try to make theirs look good

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>>386578574
I've never played Okami and BotW is my GOTY, what in the actual fuck are you going on about?
>nu-board
You have to be 18+ to post here.

>>386578553
But Super Paper Mario was different while being fun in its own regard
Color Splash isn't.

>>386571012
Had great boss music

>>386577878
>The hookshot is good because you need it to explore and progress
>linear game design is good

But why, why are you against non-linear game design?

>>386562850
Fuck outta here underage faggot.

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>>386578238
>Damage = Difficulty
Enemies are slow and have like 3 moves that they telegraph long enough for you to leave the room, cook some minute rice, eat it, come back and get hit but realize you made an elixir right off the plateau that gives you a gorillion hearts and the game autosaved before you decided to, for whatever reason given combat is completely optional, initiate a fight. Larger enemies, I.E. "Minibosses", can't even attack you as you sprint around them or gallop on horseback.

This is why you've probably heard people call it Breath of No Man's Grasslands. Shit is an exploration game in a sterile safe space that also looks and plays like your overbearing mother developed it hoping it wouldn't make you cry or challenge you.

>>386578727
Replace linear with "progression" and you'll realize thats good game design

>>386578727
Ignore that dumbass, he thinks a game is good because the developers say "use this restrictive item here!" like a hookshot instead of being seamless and well designed like Botw's tools.

>>386578574
Okay I know this is falseflagging now

>>386567225
Ignore that guy. Reddit spacing is when you start a new paragraph with the same subject as the last. People find it annoying.

Because it looks stupid.

Sounds stupid too.

But the term is often misused by idiots.

>>386578705
Seriously, the hate Super Paper Mario got was undeserved.
It was no Paper Mario, but it was at least a fun game.
Everything since has been irredeemable garbage.