What's the overall best Zelda game?

File: 1490072041620.gif (345KB, 500x292px) Image search: [Google]

345KB, 500x292px

In terms of substance, ludonarrative, creativity, atmosphere, and unique gameplay mechanics? Majora's Mask.

In terms of the best dungeons? Ocarina of Time.

In terms of everything else, Breath of the Wild.

Kass > Sidon

>>384997676
Ocarina of Time/Majora's Mask objectively speaking

>>384997676
Skyrim

>>384997676
ALttP is the best Zelda game.

>>384997676

Ocarina of Time, followed by Breath of the Wild and Twilight Princess.

>>384997676
Majora's Mask = Okami > Ocarina of Time = Breath of the Wild > Wind Waker = Twilight Princess > Skyward Sword

Oracle Games > Zelda 2 > Link to the Past > Zelda 1 > shit > rest

>>384997676
>>384997676
Probably Breath of the Wild, but I'll always have soft spots for Link to the Past and Wind Waker.

Anyone saying Majora's Mask needs to neck themselves.

>>384998006
>okami
People like that bloated mess with an even worse companion than Fi?

>>384997749
Twilight Princess had the best dungeons don't kid yourself

File: 1492048517796.jpg (7KB, 167x144px) Image search: [Google]

7KB, 167x144px

>>384998051
Gee anon you should just outright admit you have shit taste.

>>384998106
>Muh masks
>Muh 3 days
>Muh 4 dungeons that totally aren't shit, I swear!

Objectively, probably anything in the run of games from ALttP to the Oracles is a fair contender. Subjectively, Twilight Princess is my personal take on the formula with a balance of dungeons to overworld that I personally find ideal.

>>384998006
>he doesn't like Link's Awakening

File: 1494221142981.png (44KB, 864x576px) Image search: [Google]

44KB, 864x576px

>>384998172
>Implying the mask system, 3-day system, and dungeons aren't absolutely god-tier.
>Implying Stone Tower Temple isn't the best dungeon in the entire series.
>Implying termina isn't the second best world in all of zelda.

>>384998250
Are there people who unironically enjoy Link's Awakening when the Oracle games are better in every single way?

>>384998280

Not that anon but let's be honest here, MM is largely praised for its darker tone, experimental nature, and sidequesting system. No one really praises MM for its dungeons, which are...better than WW's or BotW's, at least.

>>384997676
>Perfection tier
OoT, Majora's Mask, A Link to the Past
>Great tier
Wind Waker, A Link Between Worlds, Link's Awakening/DX
>Good tier
Oracles games, Breath of the Wild, Zelda 1 and 2, Phantom Hourglass, Spirit Tracks
>"Yeah, that happened"
Skyward Sword, Twilight Princess, Hyrule Warriors, Four Swords games, Triforce Heroes, Link's Crossbow Training

>>384998280
The 3 day system is just an excuse to pad the length. Stone Tower is mid tier as fuck. Flipping the dungeon doesn't change as much as it should. 3/5 of Termina is boring as fuck. Suggesting it's better than OoT, LttP, TP, and BotW is retarded as fuck.

>>384998391
>Hating Hyrule Warriors.

>>384998481
It's not a Zelda game in the traditional sense, so yeah, it happened

>>384998379
The dungeons all take advantage of the unique mask system and are all fun to navigate and all have great atmospheres. They're also more creative than most zelda dungeons. Also, are you seriously saying that people don't praise the mask system, when Zora swimming is the most fun swimming of any zelda game and Goron rolling is the most fun exploration system of any zelda game?

>>384998423
>The 3 day system is just an excuse to pad the length.
Are you just talking out of your ass? The complexities that the 3-day system added to the game, such as having dynamic sidequests and a constantly moving world, were a lot more than "padding."

>>384998519
Then why the hate for TP?

>>384998391
>LA above Oracle games

>>384998481
>Hating the most repetitive, derivative, lazy, and unfun iteration of an extremely shallow genre.
Who wouldn't?

>>384998006
>OoT=BotW
just no, BotW shares a place between TP and SS

>>384998563
LA is the superior game

>>384998523
>such as having dynamic sidequests

Yeah, having to do the Kafei/Anju quest twice with minimal alteration to 100% the game sure is dynamic

You fucks were nowhere to be seen before 2008, and I'll never forget it.

>>384998391
>WW above BOTW, TP and Oracle
WW babies need to be slaughtered and rounded up

Why is OOT wanked so hard?

>>384998563
>Who wouldn't?

Someone who's wanted a proper Zelda fanservice title for years.

>>384998580
It's better than TP I'll confidently say that. It's also better than wind waker

Ocarina.

>>384997749
In terms of "hey, look at how big this world is but everything else is shallow as a puddle", Breath of the Wild

File: 150912920.jpg (350KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

350KB, 1920x1080px

Fuck you.

>>384998006
>Okami
>good
lol play it again

terrible puzzles
endless amounts of talking
shit dungeons
padded out the ass with filler

Okami is in the same tier as Wind Waker and TP.

>>384998656
His only mistake was putting MM above.

>>384998660
Still the best dungeons in the series.

>>384998701
>better than Wind Waker
I suggest you to replay WW as soon as possible

File: 1479422973985.jpg (51KB, 1024x576px) Image search: [Google]

51KB, 1024x576px

>>384998006
>Oracles as best 2D Zelda

>>384998523

Masks kind of fall under sidequesting but sure I guess. I mostly only used Bunny Hood and the transformation masks though, with the others being largely situational like Great Fairy's, Stone or Giant's. And the only dungeons I'd say were of any note personally were Great Bay and Stone Tower, but I love Zora Link and the dungeon flipping of Stone Tower is aesthetically cool as fuck. Woodfall is pretty basic "first dungeon" stuff while I generally found Snowhead tedious outside of Goht admittedly being a top tier biss fight. When you've only got 4 dungeons and half of them are just whatever, kind of hard to put the game on a pedestal for that explicit reason.

>>384998785
>not putting MM aside OoT as the best Zeldas of all time

>>384998391
>>Perfection tier
ALttP, ALBW, Oot, BotW, Tri Force Heroes

>>Great tier
Zelda II, Link's Awakening/DX, MM

>>Good tier
Zelda I, Four Swords games, Oracle games

>>"Yeah, that happened"
SS, WW, TP

>>384998796
BotW is essentially an improved WW in most areas, but WW has charm and actual dungeons.

>>384998848
>Putting OoT next to its special needs younger brother.

You meant to say LttP.

File: mr-miyamototableflippingface.jpg (30KB, 530x291px) Image search: [Google]

30KB, 530x291px

>>384998849
>Triforce Heroes, BotW
>perfection
kek

>>384998660
First off as far as 3D Zeldas go, it is the one with the least flaws. Period.

Second, oh I don't know it kinda sorta maybe completely redefined and revolutionized 3D game design? It was so, so blatantly far ahead of everything else at the time that it was embarrassing for the competition.

Third, it's overall just a fantastic game with almost nothing that gets in the way of enjoying it. They don't force you to collect 8 triforce pieces. there isn't a 5+ minute long unskippable cutscene or tutorial every single moment. It's just a better game than anything else.

>>384998864
pretty much this

>>384998953
OoT still holds up pretty damn well to this day with barely any flaws rather than shitty FPS, that's why

>>384998796

Not that anon but I did replay WW when it went to WiiU's greatest hits line and holy shit, it's the worst 3D Zelda bar none and one of the overall shoddiest Zeldas period. Its pacing is jank, its dungeons are jank, and almost everything actually good going for it like grottos, overworld exploration and the use of enemy weapons BotW did better, and I don't even like BotW. Only thing WW has going for it at this point is being one of the best standalone stories in the series but by no means is it one of the better designed Zeldas objectively.

>>384999005
Which is fixed in the 3D version.

>3D
OoT>MM>BotW>WW=TP>>>literal dogshit>>>>SS

>2D
Zelda 1>Seasons>Link Between Worlds>Link's Awakening>Four Sword Adventures>LttP>Ages>Minish Cap=Spirit Tracks>Triforce Heroes>Zelda 2>>>>>Phantom Hourglass

>>384999042
3D ruined the lighting and atmosphere, and has the censored imagery and music though.

so really the original N64 version is still the only version.

>>384999176
>People are autistic enough to sacrifice better framerate and controls because of different colors and textures.

>>384999176

As a Shadow Temple fag AND someone with an original, uncensored N64 copy, calm down with that business. Yeah, the atmosphere took a hit but the 3DS version has its merits too. It's a trade-off, not a universal downgrade. Both versions exist.

File: 03a.jpg (9KB, 261x194px) Image search: [Google]

9KB, 261x194px

>>384998098

>>384998864
>charm
Nostalgia
>actual dungeons
Just as short and simple as the ones in BOTW

>>384999361

>Just as short and simple as the ones in BOTW

That's an insult to the physics puzzles in BotW. They were puzzles at all.

>>384999361
The visual style and tone are still unique to the series and make the setting of the game one that feels good to be in regardless of some tedious sections

I don't consider anything in BotW to be a real dungeon. They're certainly something, but they're not dungeons.

>>384998379
MM is probably the only truly 4 dimensional game out there.

>>384999448
That's true. The puzzles are actually harder

>>384999548
I would rather have it be fun to play than having a different skin desu

>>384999836
>I would rather have it be fun to play than having a different skin desu

I never said they were bad. BotW's Hyrule Castle in particular is something I want to see more of, but I enjoy the traditional Zelda dungeon and it's something we didn't get in BotW. It was still in WW despite the obvious step down from OoT.

>>384999709
>MM is the only game to ever use time as a mechanic ever!

>>384999709

>4 dimensional

?

They are all good, solid 7/10 games, except BOTW which gets a 6/10 for all the recycled content

>>385000136
>OoT
>7/10

>>384997676
the 2d ones

Somehow i've made it to the age of 28 without ever playing a single Zelda game but i must confess that the BOTW shilling has got me interested in the series.
I own a PC and a 3ds, can anyone recommend the best order to play them in and if any are not worth playing? I don't have enough time to put 50+ hours into a game that's mediocre.
Was going to start with Ocarina of Time obviously

Majora's Mask.

Also BOTW was shit. A Zelda game with one real dungeon. What the fuck.

File: Screen-Shot-2016-12-06-at-194907.png (441KB, 615x409px) Image search: [Google]

441KB, 615x409px

Why can't /v/ get over BotW? Why do the kiddies on this board foam at the mouth simply because BotW is now regarded as one of best games of all time? Why can't /v/ accept that BotW is a new milestone in game design? Are they really that surprised given Nintendo's track history of developing some of the most genre-defining and influencial games ever made? I just don't understand. Can anyone explain this desperate, rage-filled hate towards BotW and open denial of it's excellence? It's baffling.

File: 1497601063913.jpg (311KB, 996x1500px) Image search: [Google]

311KB, 996x1500px

>>384997864
Excellent choice

>>385000343
No Zelda game is 50 hours. BOTW is the only game of notable length, and it's just open world padding and can be skipped. Most are 25-30 hours.

To answer your question, the n64 games are far and away the best, and also probably the best starting off point. Which you play first is up to you as they are similar mechanically and compliment each other fairly well.

>>385000343

Play Ocarina of Time and A Link to the Past.

If you like OoT, play the 3D Zeldas in chronological order until you get tired of it, at which point skip ahead to BotW when the formula grows old.

If you like ALttP, play Link's Awakening, the Oracles, Minish Cap and A Link Between Worlds. If you need more or want something a bit more challenging, play the NES Zeldas. Still want more after that? Play the Four Swords/DS titles, I guess.

>>385000369
But why is it a milestone in game design? What has it done that previous open world games haven't?

>>385000343
I'd recommend completely skipping Skyward Sword and Phantom Hourglass. Those aren't just bad Zelda games, they're outright terrible games period.

Zelda 2 should probably only be played as a curiosity later on.

as for the order, you can play the 3D ones in release order, though TP is full of unskippable tutorial filler bullshit that eats up the playtime.

2D I'd recommend LttP and Link Between Worlds>Link's Awakening>either the Oracles (Seasons is better) or Zelda 1

>>385000478
Ok cheers anon

>>385000369
Not that i hated it, i just am tired of the bloated open world genre and thought it took away from the core Zelda mechanics tremendously.

>>385000478

>Which you play first is up to you

Nah, he should start with OoT. MM is doable but it's one of the very few Zeldas that actually wasn't initially designed to be someone's first entry in the series - that game assumes you've already played OoT, not to mention is a sequel. It should be played second.

>>385000369
My problem with BotW is it's a mediocre game through and through and has done nothing to redefine game design.

Ocarina of Time redefined game design. When I first played Ocarina of Time it was like being given a vision of the future. BotW didn't even come close, I've been dealing with mediocre open world shit for the past 7 years because that's the major trend in game design, and BotW is just more mediocre open world shit.

The only other game I've played in my life that even came close to impressing me as much as Ocarina did was when Resident Evil 4 released, yet another game that was so far ahead of the curve it blew away every other release at the time.

>>385000580
>bloated open world genre
>implying 95% of all games ever released aren't linear, heavily scripted trash.

>>385000547
Freedom of exploration, player agency, systems of interactivity and world building. The game excels in marrying these concepts.

>>385000547
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2017-06-05-how-will-the-legend-of-zelda-breath-of-the-wild-change-the-open-world-paradigm

>>385000679
see >>385000707

>>385000352
>Also BOTW was shit. A Zelda game with one real dungeon. What the fuck.
>Also the game with only 1 good dungeon is the best in the series.

>>385000679
>My problem with BotW is it's a mediocre game through and through and has done nothing to redefine game design
It's embarrassing how so many people on this board understand absolutely fuck-all about game design.

>>385000707
>>385000764
>>385000697

None of this is nearly as unique and miraculous as you seem to think. It's about as unique and miraculous as The Last of Us. Which is to say, not at all, all shit we've seen before.

>>385000858
if you say so

>>385000858
The gaming industry is past the point of games being able revolutionize and redefine it. All they can be asked to do is take ideas we've already seen an execute them really well.

Breath of the Wild > Twilight Princess > Ocarina of Time > Majora's Mask > Wind Waker > Skyward Sword
Link to the Past > Oracle of Seasons > Oracle of Ages > Link's Awakening > A Link Between Worlds > Zelda 1 > Triforce Heroes > Phantom Hourglass > Spirit Tracks
>>384997749
>ludonarrative
I guess someone that would say something like that
Twilight Princess has the best dungeons, Breath of the Wild has the best unique gameplay mechanics and substance, Link's Awakening has the best "ludonarrative", the original has the creativity, Wind Waker has the best atmosphere. Majora's Mask is the most mediocre game in the series.

>>385001018
I can't think of any open world game that comes even remotely close to BotW's ridiculous attention to detail. It also has easily the best and most bug-free physics engine of any game to date.

>>385001018
Well don't expect me to be impressed and call a game a revolutionary masterpiece when it isn't then.

Besides I didn't even feel it was executed really well. It's definitely the best 3D Zelda that isn't on the N64 but that's not saying much.
I don't really require a game to be innovative to love it, Mega Man X didn't invent walljumping but it perfected it so much that it put every other platformer to shame. BotW really didn't do that for open world gameplay. The biggest praise I have for its design goes to the tutorial, which is fantastic.

>>385001154
>PH above ST.

ST is good tier.

>>385001185
shittiest taste, the tutorial is the most boring part

>>385000858
You sound salty.

>>385001232
All of the Zelda games are good tier. There is not a single bad Zelda game. Phantom Hourglass is just slightly better than Spirit Tracks.

>>384999263
OoT doesn't need a framerate better than 20 FPS (not to mention, it's a stable 20 FPS). It's a fucking slow paced action adventure. All about the atmosphere baby, and 3DS ruined it.

>>385001232

Not that anon but ST is weird. It has great dungeons but the shittiest overworld ever. Game's either really fun or a painful slog depending entirely on what part of the game you're interacting with.

>>385001309
But ST has good dungeons, music, and items and the cutest Zelda.

>>385000478
>>385000528
>>385000559
>>385000623
Cheers anons, i'm pretty sure there are a few zeldas in a 2nd hand store near me. Fingers crossed i'll be on it tonight

>>385001245
Sadly it was the most exciting part. The game just drops you in Zelda 1 style and allows you to pretty organically find out about the mechanics.

You get the binoculars and mark the distance and see how fucking huge the map is and immediately perk up with excitement at how the game is going to expand the mechanics and get excited to see what you can discover out there.

And that's where the disappointment comes for me. You get the 3 fucking puzzle powers, and that's it, the game just uses those. And there's really nothing to discover because all of Link's progression is tied to Shrines and Great Fairies and Korok Seeds. Exploration is only enjoyable if you never know what's around the corner.
Knowing there's only a scant few ways to actually make Link stronger and increase his abilities leaves you less exploring with a sense of wonder and more diligently working at finding the few things that matter. It's a shame, the base mechanics could work if they actually bothered putting something behind them.
It's ironic that the game with the best quest tracker in the series has the least reason to interact with NPCs ever.

>>385001390
The train design is dumb and takes away the core idea of Zelda (open world exploration). Phantom Hourglass is at least still open. Therefore, it is the worst Zelda game to me.

>>385001520
But Phantom Hourglass has worse visuals, worse music, and worse gameplay and level design.

Like, it is literally an inferior game in every aspect. B-BUT MUH OPEN WORLD

Which zelda has the best music?

>>385001520
After BotW, I realized that no Zelda besides 1 and Wind Waker can really claim to be open world.

>>385001628
Majora hands down. I'd say Majora's Mask is probably Koji Kondo's best score period.

I still think Ocarina of Time is the best. Had this charm I haven't seen since. I've yet to play BoTW yet as I'm waiting for a revisioned version of the Switch because my friends all scratched their shit with the docks.

OoT 3D on the 3DS is probably the only game I think utilized the 3D the best.

>>385001628
LttP
Honorable mention to WW

>>385001460
>muh LttP/OoT item progression
oh fuck off already, this point has been debated to death that I'm sick of it. All I'll say is not everyone likes that formula, I always found it repetitive and bland and never understood the appeal as it makes the puzzles obvious as shit like "gee, I just got this boomerang, I sure wonder if this puzzle requires me to use it!".

>>385001674
>The game that recycles most of OoT's music has the best music


That's flat out disrespectful.

>>385001759
It's not even just the item progression.

Where are the heart pieces? Where's the bottles? Where's the capacity upgrades?
WHERE IS ANY INCENTIVE TO DO THE SIDEQUESTS AND INTERACT WITH NPCS AT ALL?

When the only way to make Link stronger involves finding shrines or upgrading armor at the Great Fairy, it makes the game feel devoid of content.

You can say what you want about the 'find an item in a dungeon, use it, repeat' formula, but outside the dungeons OoT clearly has much more going on.

>>385001669

>and Wind Waker

And even that's only an illusion. You can only freely explore the sea after Tower of the Gods because KoRL will gate you off in some form or fashion constantly before that, and once he stops gating you the islands start gating you off if you reach them with without the right item. WW adheres much closer to the ALttP formula than it lets on but the freedom of sea exploration in the back half of the game makes it seem (operative word right there) otherwise. So sincerely, it's just Zelda 1 and BotW with WW at a distant third, beyond the aesthetics it's only marginally more open than fucking TP.

>>385002014
I consider WW openworld mainly due to its lack of loading screens on the map which no game besides BotW has done.

>>385001901
>Where are the heart pieces?
prey at a statue altar
>Where's the bottles?
acquired by making elixirs
>Where's the capacity upgrades?
talk to Hestu
>WHERE IS ANY INCENTIVE TO DO THE SIDEQUESTS AND INTERACT WITH NPCS AT ALL?
what kind of incentive are you looking for?

>>385001901

>WHERE IS ANY INCENTIVE TO DO THE SIDEQUESTS AND INTERACT WITH NPCS AT ALL?

This. Too much of BotW feels like it banks on tapping into latent wanderlust to appeal to people. You don't go out and explore because there's something to do, you do it because all of that shit is just there to be explored. Personally, fuck that philosophy. I like having a reason to go somewhere, and when BotW does attempt to incentivize something it does so rather weakly. I get wanting to go back to the sense of exploration the first game made its name on but even Zelda 1 did a better job of rewarding the player with interesting places and secrets. BotW just gets dull after a while if you don't give in to the wanderlust.

>>385002273
that's what the story quests are for

>>384998250
It's like these people weren't even born during the nineties

>>385002170
Shrine Orbs are garbage and tie 90% of Link's health progression to tediously doing shrines. Something that used to be split between exploring the world and finding secrets or solving puzzles, doing well in minigames, and doing missions for NPCs. It was much better before.

The discardable bottles of drink you get that you get infinite slots for don't fucking count and you know it. Getting extra bottles always felt hugely helpful in the original games.

Carrying more shields and swords and bows is fine, but you start with infinite arrow capacity, infinite rupee capacity, infinite healing item capacity, and literally have infinite bombs at all times.

And I'm looking for the kind of incentive where the game actually rewards you for doing shit and bothering to help the characters. You know, like every 3D Zelda before BotW.

>>385001669
All of the games are open world except Spirit Tracks. They just have linear open worlds, not completely free open worlds. Just because you have to unlock parts of the world doesn't mean you have to say the game isn't open world.

>>384997676
Personally I havent played BotW but I've always been partial to Majora's Mask.

>>385002273
In BotW, the very act of exploration itself is just supposed to be what is special about exploration, not the joy of discovering something new.
And that's the big problem with it.

>>385002098

True, but that comes at the expense of a large, featureless ocean dotted with busywork and all points of interest that would be connected in your average Zelda being sequenced out by sizable stretches of sailing. Again, the sense of openness is there but it all comes at a cost. Could blame the hardware I suppose, they did good on a technical level if that was the end goal at least.

>all these people saying 'open world'
reminder that Ocarina of Time was considered a revelation in open world gaming when it was released.

>>384998325
Yeah me, I enjoy all three of them the same.

>>385002408
There's also heart containers from bosses, but I get your point. However, BotW gave rupees more value and made those harder to find, so I feel in many ways those (along with other treasures) basically replace heart pieces' importance in past games.

I always hated the way bottles worked in zelda games, I honestly found it unnecessarily annoying, but each to their own I guess. That said, BotW's cooking system is imbalanced due to "hearty" foods.

I don't see the problem with having infinite capacity for those pickups, much like the bottles thing I just found it annoying that past zelda games had a limit on those for no particular reason other than to turn it into a contrived reward for later.

You always get a reward for doing a sidequest, though (usually in the form of rupees but in some cases you may get armor or weaponry)

>>385002576

And considering it's one of the few Zeldas that allow for legitimate sequence breaking in its dungeons in the back 2/3rds it remains one of the series' higher standards for open progression. Maybe not as high as Zelda 1, ALBW or BotW but it's up there.

>>384998325
Oracle of Ages is awful.

It's Seasons>Awakening>Ages

>>385002759
What's the difference?

>>385002850
I actually played through both last year having never played Ages (me and my brother got once each, I got Seasons)

Literally everything about it is worse than Seasons. The items you get aren't as fun, the dungeons are worse, the overworld is a chore to navigate, the music is much worse for some reason, and the time travel gimmick is way less interesting and very poorly integrated into the game compared to the seasons gimmick.

It's such a downgrade I can't believe they released both side by side and that Seasons isn't some sort of dramatically improved sequel.

breath of the wild and it's not even close

>b-but botw isn't even that good anon!

yeah that should tell you a lot about this trash series

Breath of the Wild needed 8 traditional dungeons to make sense, because there's not much else out there to find.

>>385003329

Zelda 1 did the same thing but without all the needless space and actually decent dungeons so nah. BotW is all spectacle. Also, play Zelda II if you don't like Zelda.

>>385003481
Everytime.

BotW has more content and sidequests than any other Zelda game.

And it wraps all of that up in a masterclass of overworld design, founded upon an engine with intricately connectes gameplay systems.

>>385004119
yet the sidequests have the least purpose ever considering how limited the progression in the game is.

>>385004183
What do you mean "progression"? Are you talking story progression? You're not going to get linear structured gates of storytelling in game based on complete freedom.

Are you talking player progression? Then yes there is plenty. I played the game again in Master Mode and couldn't believe how underpowered I was at the start of the game. All my stamina gone, my awesome array of armour, my top tier weapon cache, my champion abilities and even my rune upgrades. There's plenty of player progression.