>Translation leaves the honorifics intact Why is this allowed?

The target audience likes it.

>>383429893
Because when localizations change too much people bitch about the game being butchered.

It's a game about being in japan, it's not like the honorifics don't make sense.

>>383429893
The alternative to honorifics in English would be to call her Mrs. Kirijo.

You tell me which one sounds less awkward.

Because it's a game about Japanese culture. Honorifics play a part in the writing and character interactions.

>Translation changes the honorifics and wether somebody addresses a character by first or last name
Why is this allowed?

Let's be honest, if you're playing Persona, you understand honorific meanings anyway.

>>383429893
Shows how the japanese hierarchy works.

If I ever hear someone say "Teach!" again I'm gonna lose it.

It's okay if they keep the japanese voices, but they shouldn't use them in the dub.

>>383429893

They don't even romanize it correctly. Japanese N adopts an M sound when it precedes P, so it would be romanized as sempai. (think Gumpei Yokoi)

But yeah, Atlus localizations have always been shit. Stop giving your money to this company.

>>383430241
Its very jarring when anime translates honorifics and you get teenagers calling each other "mr"

>>383430142
>Because when localizations change too much people bitch about the game being butchered.

But Atlus translations are never literally accurate. They change tons of shit for arbitrary reasons. Have you played any Persona game ever?

>>383429893
What are you talking about anon-chan?

>>383431049
Pretty much.

Hence why they keep the honorifics. It's not like it couldn't be translated, same with stuff like nakama being translated to friends or family depending on the context.

It just turns out that trying to localize honorifics as titles (since that's really our only equivalent) makes conversations really fucking weird, since Mr. and Mrs. aren't things we use in regular speech between classmates unless we're mocking them.

>>383430241
It'd be ms

>>383431049
They could change it to "sir," and have every character sound like Peppermint Patty.

>>383431016
>They don't even romanize it correctly. Japanese N adopts an M sound when it precedes P, so it would be romanized as sempai. (think Gumpei Yokoi)

Nah I'm against this. Pronunciation shouldn't bother proper romaji. Might as well turn Rs into Ls depending on the region. Also technically it's like sen-mpai.

>>383429893
Just a reminder that the game takes place in Japan, rather than say Antarctica.

>>383429893
It's the easy way out.

It would've been more difficult to localize them to a respectable degree, though.

>>383430241
That's necessarily. Senpai isn't Mr or Mrs. They'd need to localize the dialogue in such a way that she's showing some respect to Mitsuru, or maybe refers to her as a student council member (right? It's been years since I've played) occasionally.

>>383431573
>every character sound like Peppermint Patty.
hot

>>383430047
I hate it.

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>>383431508
That sounds fucking demeaning, being called "miss" by someone literally one grade lower than you but just as popular.

>>383431573
Charlie Brown Persona when?

>>383429893
It takes place in Japan
does it bother you when the characters say that their language is Japanese?

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>>383429893
I will never understand why people like that game or what the point of socializing was.

>>383431861
Why did Charlie Brown grow up to be Krillin?

>>383431786
Somewhat, they actually need to localize the dialogue to show that she's showing respect to her elder-classmen - being student council had nothing to do with it.

Like you said, it's significantly easier to just leave in the honorifics, especially since anyone actually playing an anime game about highschool and demons is already going to know what they all mean.

>>383430047
Weebs need to be gassed.

>>383431974
They both fail at every moment in their waking life on an almost trans-dimensional level, only doing well when it comes to chicks.

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>>383431961
Holy shit

>>383431860
KUYASHI

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>>383429893
>Translation tries to localize the honorifics
>Absolutely butchers the text because the English equivalents are actually equivalent
Just leave them in or completely remove them. Don't do things halfheartedly and try to localize them.

Honestly though, I don't care if they're left in. For example, if I read a translation of a French novel and they don't translate some French words that don't translate well I'm not gonna be offended. You just look up the word (either on the internet or in the index/notes of the book) and improve your vocabulary or you guess at the meaning from context clues and continue reading. This is fucking elementary school shit.

Not vidya, but I'm still fucking mad at the official Overlord translation. Fucking "Mr. Momoon," really? Why even include a fucking joke if the joke doesn't translate outside of honorifics in the slightest? It just makes the reader scratch their head since it makes no fucking sense.

>>383430241
Why not just say Mitsuru? -san is just the default level of respect, so wouldn't the English equivalent be putting nothing there?

>>383432294
Because the dialog says senpai

>>383432209
KUYOSHI

>>383432343
Fuck me, no idea why I thought it said -san. If she's showing her respect, how about removing the honorific while making the rest of line more polite than normal.

>>383431860
HE HATES IT

>>383432525
Yeah, why not just rewrite all of the fucking dialog instead of leaving in a few innocuous honorifics.

They could have just taken all of them out because I'm pretty sure the game makes no references or jokes based around honorifics if my memory serves me. The game never puts emphasis on the social hierarchies much either. Game would have probably sounded fine without them.

>>383432525
>If she's showing her respect, how about removing the honorific while making the rest of line more polite than normal.
Then you'd be altering the translation of the rest of the kanji in the sentence just to fit the honorific. There's no real good or clean way to do Japanese-to-English.

>>383432294
I don't think you looked at the picture.

You're right, anytime someone was called -san, it's about the same level of respect as referring to someone by their actual name instead of using dude/yo/hey/etc.

But Yukari called her Senpai, and the equivalent of that in English would be to call her either "Mrs." or "Elder-classman Mitsuru", which are just really fucking awkward.

Again, it's not that we CAN'T translate it to something effective, it's just that leaving it as it makes it less awkward.

>>383429893
When P-3 came out, fansubs were the way to watch anime for people and those were made by unprofessional kids who didn't know shit about proper translation.
But they did the damage and Atlus knew that the anime audience wanted shitty translations, as that's what they were used to.

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>character says "ara ara"
>subs translate it as "my my" or "oh my"

>>383431961
to get social links to make your pokemon stronger

>>383432525
>Change entire sentence, potentially changing characterization
>Leave in one word that doesn't translate properly without looking goofy but everyone playing will get it anyways, and leave everything else the same.

This is not a difficult choice.

>>383432645
>>383432434
>>383431860
ZA WA

>>383432937
What would be a better translation, O MY language meister?

>>383432937
What does it mean weeb-sensei

>>383432701
>why not just rewrite all of the fucking dialog
Well, a competent translator shouldn't have any problem in doing this when the point is to make the reading as fluid and natural sounding to foreigners as possible. Its like part of their fucking job.
I mean its no big deal with a game like Persona because anyone who plays it will be most likely already familiars with the honorifics, but that shit wouldn't fly in a profesionally translated book or movie.

>>383432525
>If she's showing her respect, how about removing the honorific while making the rest of line more polite than normal.

Yukari's only being polite as a formality, she doesn't feel such a deep level of respect for Mitsuru that she would string together an overly polite sentence like Fuuka would. If Mitsuru was in her class, she'd drop the Sempai and use the same tone, while someone like Fuuka may still use Sempai because that's how she is. Changing the whole sentence to be more polite would introduce characterization to Yukari that wasn't initially there, and would make it seem very out of place from then on.

In this case, it IS about the equivalent of calling her Mrs. Kijiro, but that can be easily misconstrued as calling Mitsuru out for being nosy.

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>>383429893
Japanese culture is just weird, OP. Some of the friendship stuff can't be adequated translated.

I mean, here's what a fully-translated typical Japanese conversation would look like, using characters from Saved by the Bell:

Zack: See you later, lil' Miss Kapowski
Kelly: W-wait, Mr. Morris! Y-you can call me...Kelly, if you want. No! Wait! Forget I said anything!
Zack: No, it's fine...Kelly. But uh, if I'm gonna call you that, you can stop calling me Mr Morris.
Kelly: O-Oh, y-yeah...Zack...

I mean, it's just fucking retarded. Leaving the honorifics at least masks it behind "WooOooOo weird chink shit" mysticism

>>383433276
>>383433432
I don't know I'm just complaining for (you)s

>>383433573
Baka desu.

>>383433535
I am genuinely embarrassed to admit I'd watch that version of Saved by the Bell.

>>383433662
I'm genuinely embarrassed to have written it tbqh senpai

I'd watch it as well though, I hope there's a quirky 90s j-drama like it somewhere

>>383429893
I want to breed Yukari-chan.

>>383433201
SHIKASHI

>>383429893
I like it in the text as it can be important but it sounds so stupid when they use honorifics in the dub.

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>>383433535
I hate it when they do the "you can call me by my first name" thing. I understand that Japan is different than my country, but I refuse to believe it's such a big deal among classmates.

Anyone have that screencap of someone having difficulties trying to romance the girls on P4 in easy mode?

>>383433446
A competent translator wouldn't fucking have to. Any worker performing any type of function knows that you want to work "smarter, not harder." And any writer (including a translator) worth half a squirt of shit knows that you have to "know your audience."

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If your translation needs to be rushed, then all I've gotta say is drop the fucking honorifics if you're going to have a english speaker say the line.

Give me

JPN audio with good flowing english text with honorifics intact since I'll be hearing them anyways.

English dub with good flowing text, no fucking honorifics no matter what. I don't care if it changes personalities and tone slightly, I'm sure you can get it close enough. If I cared about accuracy, I'd be playing in Japanese.

Seriously, you're dubbing shit, you probably don't have time or money to properly direct all your actors, and you probably only have 3-4 decent actors who could remotely make an honorific sound natural while the rest might as well be off the street. Get rid of the honorifics, make it easy for your actors, and make it so my ears don't bleed.

>>383433535
To be entirely honest, it's not so much that it's weird chink shit - I mean, it is, but names in English don't have the same meaning that names in most other languages do.

To most non-english speaking cultures, a name is pretty damn important and people are often referred to by their last name primarily, as a representative of their clan. A first name is only really used by those who get to know you on an individual level, because first and foremost you're a representative of your clan/family and that's how everyone primarily sees you.

In most English speaking cultures, you're an individual and your name means jackshit very little other than being essentially a person whistle that only you can hear, and can and often is changed on a whim, like the person who changed their name to Romanceo Sir Tasty Maxibillion.

It's translating from a culture that places a vast importance of names throughout generations into a culture that places a literal money value on names (some places you can get it changed at $150 a pop) that makes the honorific changes so difficult.

>>383434451
Which "most" non-english speaking cultures are we talking about here? What are your sources?

>>383434451
>To most non-english speaking cultures, a name is pretty damn important and people are often referred to by their last name primarily,
No culture based in romance languages do this.

>>383434189
By all means, refuse to believe all you want but that's how japanese society works.

>>383434189
It is. In a lot of asian countries, first names are an individuality thing and often and usually only used by people you're VERY close to.

In the japanese culture, calling someone by their first name is like holding hands.

Yes, holding hands is like kissing, and kissing is like having sex.

Asians dicks are too small to actually have sex, so that's kinda where the analogy stops.

>>383431016
All Ns do this in every language, actually. So it literally doesn't matter because senpai would still be pronounced sempai.

America's biggest mistake was not making Japan's official language English after WW2.

>literal translation
>complains
>sense-for-sense translation
>complains

>>383429893
FES or Portable?

>>383434975
No, the biggest mistake is not to surrender to the Greatest Japan Empire

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>>383434625
>>383434647
I guess it makes sense why so many elevens kill themselves.

And no, sex is not as lewd as handholding, even in Japan.

>>383434145
This.
I don't mind reading it, but I just can't take english VAs using terms like "senpai" seriously for some reason.

>>383434647
>In a lot of asian countries, first names are an individuality thing and often and usually only used by people you're VERY close to.

I don't know about "a lot" of other Asian nations, but you can address people in Japanese however the fuck you want. Unless you're in a formal working environment, it's not going to matter. Honorifics aren't even a component of Japanese grammar, they're completely optional and just happen to see widespread usage.

>>383435182
What would you rather they use?

The only proper way to translate Senpai is "Elderclass Man", or "Senior", though the later is EXTRA fucking weird.

>>383435182
for what reason mr. reddit?

>>383435263
Says the person who's never actually stepped foot into Japan.

>>383429893
Leave it in, it gives people that have a basic understanding of japanese culture more information than if it was just localized out. Yeah it sounds cringy in VO dialogue, but i'd rather have it than not.

>>383434618
I think it's what people did a century ago.

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because this is what happens when you fags get your autistic way
you get half-assed vain attempts at translating culture

>>383430142

>It's a game about being in japan, it's not like the honorifics don't make sense.

This. It's cultural. There's really no local word that makes sense.

I mean, what are the other options? Miss? Ma'am? Sir? Nothing else fits right.

>>383435182
Nice blogpost.

>>383431653
>Might as well turn Rs into Ls depending on the region.

I don't think you understand Japanese phonemes very well, Anon. There is neither an R nor an L phoneme in Japanese. The closest equivalent phoneme in English would be a D.

>>383434314
But you don't see oficially translated manga leaving the honorifics. Even localized light novels don't leave them.
Why should japanese games translations be held to a lower standard? rewriting shit is part of the job and leaving honorifics because its "easier" sounds incredibly lazy.

>>383435449
Mrs. works for girls though can come off as snide, while Mr. works for guys but can come off as mocking.

Elder Classman is the proper translation for it, but that sounds a fuck of a lot weirder than Senpai.

>>383435524
u wot m8

>>383435159
Mosiac censor that filth you devient.

>>383435313
If you are not going to use honorifics, just don't use anything. Just translate it how western people talk. You call your classmates by their name and that's it.

You have to know your audience. People who buy Persona want the weeb experience, so the best option is japanese audio and subtitles with honorifics.

>>383435630
>Mrs. works for girls though can come off as snide
That's "ms.". "Mrs." is for married women.

>>383431242
Lol Atlus USA leaves way more intact than most companies, I bet you read that misinformed P5 translation rant page and think you know shit

>>383431242
there you go

>>383435627
Senpai's really the only one that doesn't translate well, all the others are fine.

San doesn't really need to be translated,
Sama gets turned into a Mr. or Mrs.
Kun and Chan get translated by having the speaker talk to them cutely or softly.
Tan or Bo essentially means they get to speak in a baby voice
Sensei just means Teacher or someone of a much higher standard (Dr., etc.).

Senpai is really fucking weird because it lets lower grade students / club members refer to higher grade students / club members with a bit of extra respect, and not only is there just no equivalent in english that sounds remotely natural, but students just don't fucking do that if you're not in Japan.

Light novels try to get away with it by letting the kids use "Teach" or "Boss" which is really fucking weird and has ended up with several butchered characterizations. Several manga's have decided to just drop it entirely which is ok but definitely doesn't show the amount of respect the kids would normally have for their seniors. Using the word is definitely awkward, but at least it doesn't mess with personalities.

>>383429893
thats how they speak in japan OP-san.

>>383436113
Bring back "thou," it's the only way

>>383429893
>company is jv with japs company
>they keep refering me with anon-san in email and in spoken
>i start referring them with -san too to avoid possible social landmine
It's not a big deal anyway.

>>383436113
I'm not a translation expert or anything, but I feel like most of the time the relationship among characters can be understood without the need of using "senpai".
Specially in anime and manga where the characters expressions and mannerism are usually enough to convey the respect/admiration they have for their "senpai".

>>383436736
>Specially in anime and manga where the characters expressions and mannerism are usually enough to convey the respect/admiration they have for their "senpai".

Eh, Yukari doesn't have any additional respect for Mitsuru, but she still calls her Senpai out of formality.

It shows Yukari still applies herself to properness most of the time, even if it's not heartfelt.

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>>383432152

>>383429893
They should leave them in the text but not have english voice actors say it.

>>383436991
>It shows Yukari still applies herself to properness most of the time, even if it's not heartfelt
Well, this can be understood without the need to use senpai too.
I mean in the game she constantly shit talks Junpei and isn't specially formal to the MC. But she then speaks more formally with Mitsuru. I think that alone is already enough to convey the difference in treatment without using senpai.

>>383429893
Cause the game takes place in Japan and thats their culture with the honorifics.

Even the English dub of Lucky Star they still do honorifics.

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>Translation causes an important plot point to be drastically changed that wouldn't even be necessary if it didn't change shit in the first place
Why is THIS allowed?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIgmvyHhc6w
>tfw /v/ actually plays with subs instead of dubs

>Oh, Upperclassman Mitsuru. Why are you here?

>>383430047
I don't. It's fucking stupid. When has someone ever referred to another as -San, -senpai, etc. in the English language?

if they take out honorifics, they would have to put in a translator's note every time every character addresses another to indicate an implicit level of respect indicated by the original text.

Either way it sounds forced and dumb, so I'd prefer the forced and dumb way we've been doing for years.

>>383437437
>But she then speaks more formally with Mitsuru. I think that alone is already enough to convey the difference in treatment without using senpai.

She doesn't though, and that's actually part of the problem here.

She speaks a little more formally to her in the dub and localized sub, but in the original japanese she speaks to Mitsuru the same as she speaks to MC, except she uses senpai occasionally - the basically thinks of herself as Mitsuru's equal but isn't above being polite and the normal customs. They altered her tone towards Mitsuru to make up for the senpai thing, except they kept in the senpai shit anyways - it would have made much more sense to just keep the senpai and not change her relationship with Mitsuru.

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>>383435159
source?

>>383437871
See
>>383437742
for what happens when you take out -senpai

>>383431049
I'ts very jarring that these characters have foreign names like Yukari. Couldn't they have named her Sarah?

>>383437946
Yeah, or you don't do that and you just have characters act respectfully towards each other if they have to.

>>383438390
there's no easy way in english to convey acting respectfully.

>>383438368
>You will immediately cease and not continue to access the site if you are under the age of 18.

>>383429893
because you can't translate them and they're important for how japanese people communicate with each other, and the target audience understands them anyway.

>>383438285
If that's the case, then the other students wouldn't always refer to her by her first name, they'd think up some funky nicknames.

Shouldn't Junpei be calling her S-Dog?

>Game has a fantastic English dub
>Can't discuss it because r/anime has infected /a/ into believing dubs cannot be good

>>383438390
Yes, because Yukari curtseying towards Mitsuru every time she comes into the room would make a lot more sense.

>>383438941
How would you work that in the translation without literally going "*curtseys*"

>>383438850
Exactly. Let's get rid of all the parts that are jarring about a foreign culture. That is the point of localization after all. Mitsuru should be Mitchelle

I tried playing the portable version of this, but it feels so soulless when you can't see character models during s links

I know the FES version doesn't have FeMC and you can't control your party which blows, but what else is missing compared to the portable version.

Not being able to walk around or see models just leaves the game feeling too shallow compared to P4

>>383438886
>discussing games on /a/

I mean I know /v/'s fucking shit but /a/'s a whole different level.

And everyone knows P3 has a great dub.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6ubavZNi9I&

There's just a few faggots who go "HONORIFICS? NOT IN MY WEEB GAEM" and shit up everything.

The translated language is English so we understand it, but they're really talking in Japanese. See P5 establish that with Ann having to translate english phrases even though they all speak english.

Same for games like MGS3, they're basically conversing in russian but the language we hear and read it as is English.

>>383429893
But thats good

>>383438981
You don't, which is why the honorifics are left in.

>>383432124
Yes, but that's beside the point

>>383439082
Portable has some quality of life shit like Skill Cards letting you give specific skills to your personas and one extra secret boss
The lack of party control is a big problem for most people but proper models and cutscenes really make FES feel better

>>383438173
Highschool DxD. It's pretty fun. 3rd season is not that good though.

>>383439082
P3P
>FeMC
>>>Theodore
>>>New Social Links (ones with the actual members of SEES, if that's more your thing)
>Controllable Party Members
>>>Improved Enemy AI to make up for having more control over your party's strategy
>>>MC only wields 1-Handed Swords, since you don't have to make him broken to beat the game anymore
>Extra difficulty modes

FES
>The Answer
>>>Absolute Shit, just watch on Youtube
>Animated Cutscenes and Models


Honestly, outside of the animated cutscenes and a few instances of models interacting (like hugging Yukari) P3P is the better game. The models weren't much to look at, and you can get around everywhere quicker with P3P's menu system anyways. You won't be missing too much if you go with FES, but I wouldn't.

Oh, and FeMC is actually very different - she's an entirely different character.

>>383439413
the party control thing always felt overblown to me

I mean yeah a lot of people prefer to micromanage but most of the time the AI would do roughly what was most useful in a given situation for me if I even put the smallest effort into using the AI routine presets allowed to me

I mean I did see the MARIN FUCKING KARIN sometimes when all I wanted Mitsuru to do was blast someone with Bufu but never when I was in danger of dying

>>383432645
kek

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>>383439039
>Mitsuru should be Mitchelle
Well, like you said, even then it's still a bit jarring. I mean, she's a fucking brunette/red head who's popular - that's just not fucking possible.

Mitchelle should definitely be localized as a blonde.

Actually, translation changes some honorifics. Most of them are correct, but you sometimes see discrepancies when playing undub.

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>>383439673
>Improved Enemy AI to make up for having more control over your party's strategy

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>>383429893
>tfw based Over-Time, Geki/Hikari Senshi, and RTA/Excite don't add honorifics

J-PIZZLE DANCED CRAZY

>>383429893
PLAY WEEB GAME, WIN WEEB PRIZES

WHY IS THIS ALLOWED?!?!?!?!?!?! I JUST CANT FIGURE IT OUT!

>>383429893
cause they cant be properly represented in english

>>383439876
Nows there's a localization that the OP can get behind

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>>383439839
I mean you already said it, so I won't touch that.

But overall, the enemy AI in P3 and FES is absolute balls in ass retarded, and it had to be because you didn't have full control over everything.

Enemy AI (and stats of course) in P3P picked up a fair bit (since you now have total control and are completely to blame for failing anything) to the point where several bosses can actually be challenging, which makes the battle system not a total bore.

>>383437871
Because they're in japan.
Dub served for translating, not changing culture.

>>383440163
i absolutely walked over p3p, where was the challenge boost

>>383440163
Not him, but I actually did not notice/analyzed enemy AI when playing both FES and P3P and I still found P3P to be much, much easier than FES. Not because of party control, either. You earn more experience, coupled with the skill cards and other gameplay improvements. Direct control irrelevant, actually.

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>>383439839
>controlling the game always felt overblown to me

Don't mind me, just posting your favorite game, try not to cum just by looking at it.

Don't worry, I know you don't have any control over that.

>>383440283
>>383440327

Did you guys actually play Maniac mode, or did you just plop in Hard mode and grind for a bit?

>>383440497
That's not FFXII

>>383429893

>Translation westernizes name order and changes honorifics to different ones

Why is this allowed?

>>383440283
>>383440327
And don't fucking say you did Normal mode, AKA Baby's first Persona, and complain about the fucking difficulty.

>>383437641
Explain.

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>>383437641
>Translation is absolute shit but doesn't affect the overall game in the slightest because the original game is absolute shit.
Why is THIS allowed?

>>383440905
>not playing Hard on Nocturne for your first playthrough
>trying to hype up Maniac as something special

>>383440903
It didn't?

Mitsuru's her first name. Kirijo is her last name. It's written in a different order in English.

Yukari also referred to her as Senpai in the original (Actually she called her Mitsuru Senpai, which was REALLY fucking weird, but whatever, Yukari's always been a bitch)

>>383429893
>he wants the translation to LEAVE OUT CONTENT just because there's no equivalent for it in his native language

>>383441149
It's not, it just has much better enemy AI than anything in P3 or FES.

Everyone knows Nocturne's hard is ok.

>>383437742
>Oh, Mitsuru. Why are you here?

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The real question for the P3 translation is why the fuck does Junpei call Yukari 'Yuka-tan' in the English dub but 'Yukaricchi' in Japanese? Like, just 'Yuka' or something sure, because he's using a nickname for her, but why add the -tan? That's not only not an English nicknaming convention nor is it the nickname he even uses in Japanese. What the fuck?

>>383441336
>Why are you so disrespectful, Yukari?

>>383441336
>why do you completely ignore social rules when you're talking to the student council president who's also your upperclassman, yukari

>>383440668
I had just beaten FES Hard, with plenty of struggles, so I just played Maniac. I've beaten P3P twice on Maniac, never played any other difficulty. I fucking hate that you can't carry over stuff to a new Maniac playthrough, I really wanted a "perfect" save file.

>>383437641
Are you talking about the car thing? It was explained away easily enough.

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>Translation keeps hero as Yuusha and Demon king as Mao

Is there any reason for this?

>>383441314
enemies hit harder and shit costs more, big whoop

>>383441238
She never adressed Mitsuru by her first name in Japanese, it's always Kirijo-Senpai, same thing with Yosuke in P4 he never uses honorfics with the girls(except for Rise-chan) he always calls them Amagi and Satonaka.

>>383437871
every day senpai

>>383441362
Yukaricchi is a play on words that doesn't translate to english at all.

Yuka-tan is about the equivalent amount of respect that Junpei was showing her by fucking up her name.

>>383441362
The -tan part is supposed to be apart of the pun on "yucatan" as in the Yucatan Peninsula. Its supposed to not only be cute, but clever in a way the japanese version is not.

>>383438285
When did I imply that names should be changed? Do you honestly think that teenagers that view themselves as equal caling each other "mr" and "miss" sounds good?

>>383432294
>>383432872
Then you localize it the way you would show that kind of respect in English. ie, primarily though tone because we're not a bunch of autistic japs who need every single social stratification snd hierarchy constantly reinforced through language.

>>383441678

Why not throw it in? it's not like they aren't leaving random bits of japanese around anyways.

>>383441563
Japanese Voice Actress calls her Mitsuru-Senpai.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHOuaUy85Dk

>>383440006
>implying all weeb games keep the honorifics

>>383441820
Because it's Japanese that you won't get at all if you don't speak Japanese.

>>383435627
My official translated light novels leave in honorifics.

>>383440668
Is there any reason to play JRPGs on harder difficulties? Does it actually do anything substantial other than change damage or health values? I say this as someone who doesn't play a lot of JRPGs and finished FES and P3P on normal, but playing through on harder difficulties just sounds like a chore to me. Part of the reason I enjoy the Persona games is that the combat is exploitable enough to breeze through normal difficulties without having to grind at all.

>>383441362
This whole thread is about dub fags autisim, FYI the title of Lord or Sir doesn't translate into every language on earth since it's pretty much sn English thing, so when translating you leave lord and sir as is, it's a social title no need to get autistic about it, i've watched American movies subbed all my life and not once did i see both titles "localized".

>>383441401
>Suck my hairy balls, Misturu chan

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here you go
fuck humble bundle

if you take one reply to the post as courtesy to others

Honorifics and titles are an important part of Japanese culture, and it carries over into their work. Conversations would make less sense if they're excluded.

I'm bothered when Atlus USA uses them wrong, though.

>>383441764
Why?

Yukari doesn't show her any additional respect outside of calling her Senpai.

How do you show that kind of respect outside of titles? It's practically Yukari showing more that she's not above regular conduct, which is different in Japan than it is over here.

>>383441707
Wait is it really? I've never even heard of the Yucatan Peninsula is.

>>383441982
I mean, thanks, but what?

Also someone go for Kero Blaster, it's made by the cave story dude.

>>383442090
not worth making a new thread about

>>383441481
>Because this was made for americans Michelle, societal rules don't apply here as they would confuse our audience. Now, where did I left my hamburger

>>383441939
Depends on the JRPG.

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>>383442082
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yucat%C3%A1n_Peninsula

Has anybody made a hack of FES yet so you can control your party.

That would be the best version of P3 by far.

>>383441982
thanks senpai, got galciv3 since that will probably be the only way I get it

I'm fine with honorific suffixes being left in, but the one thing that always seems awkward to me is when 'senpai' is used as the object, as in "He is my senpai." Would it be that hard to change it to "He is my senior." or something?

>>383429893
Context

>>383441880

But san, sama and chan is okay because you watched some anime before?

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>>383441982
Got Kero Blaster. Thank you very much anon.

>>383442340
It's easily understandable. It's not some obscure pun.

>>383442276
>Would it be that hard to change it to "He is my senior." or something?

No, for all the bickering we do about senpai as honorifics, there's literally no fucking reason not to localize it as senior when it's not immediately attached to a name. It's the same as the fucks who leave in "Ore" when they could just use "My" or even fucking "I".

>>383442180
I don't doubt it exists, but is there confirmation that that was the joke they were going for with that nickname? It seems pretty obtuse a reference to me, and I played the English dub too long ago to remember if he ever references it in-game.

>>383431860
Then you're not the target audience

>>383442409
Oh man, not him but you will not regret that.

>>383442409
>>383441982
Wait, shit, no I didn't I got Armello. It's very late at night I'm sorry.

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So, what's wrong with localizing senpai as "senior"? I doesn't sounds bad.

>>383442420

There's barely any difference, it's just a way to say someone's name.

>>383442530
>>383442545
I'm morally obligated not to redeem that key, so I just bought a copy. This better be as ebin as you say it is.

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>>383442594
>I know you said you don't really know much about my career as Risette, Senior,

God I wonder why

>>383442594
>Oh, Mitsuru-senpai. Why are you here?

Doesn't imply any level of familiarity (outside of Yukari using her first name).

>Oh, Senior Mitsuru. Why are you here?

Implies Yukari has no familiarity with Mitsuru.

It changes the tone of their relationship a fair bit.

>>383442936
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ej2AtlVNvjM

>>383442992
>I know you said you don't really know much about my career as Risette

>>383442992
but you are literally calling him senior, just in another language.

>>383443049
>Oh, Senior Mitsuru
Also just something no self-respecting English speaker would ever say in any normal situation.

>>383443274
In Japan there's a very high level of respect that you're supposed to show to your seniors.

No one in any other country gives a fuck, so the meaning is lost if we just use "Senior".

It's not a matter of translating the word, it's about translating the culture, which just isn't easy with some sort of editor's note (and that's just fucking cancer) so they just leave in the original.

>>383443274
>>383443267
But it has different connotations here. Rise is using it as her strange form of affection, so she can slowly gain control over Narukami's penis.

Give me an example of dialogue that loses it's meaning once you leave out the honorific or it can't be rewritten in a way that leaves in the meaning.

All of these problems would be solved if jap games had a "honorifics on/off" option

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>>383442594
>>383442992
>>383443049
>>383443314
>AY YI YI, I HOPE SENIOR MITSURU NOTICES ME!

Honorifics help with the characterisation

>>383441563
>>383443049
As far as Yukari calling Mitsuru by her first name in English goes, using someone's last name at LEAST in America often either conveys a sense of superiority or unfamiliarity. Principals, drill sergeants, management- they might be the ones to regularly refer to someone's family name.

If Yukari's supposed to just refer to her with token politeness without meaning any kind of indirect power play, in localized context she'd be more likely just to use her given name unless expressly asked otherwise.

>>383443438
>No one in any other country gives a fuck, so the meaning is lost if we just use "Senior".
You could argue that the meaning would be lost too if someone who isn't familiar with japanaese culture reads senpai too. Why even leave it if the culture you're translating for isn't going to get it either way?

>>383441982
Took sherlock. Thanks

>>383429893
I don't see the issue considering the game is set in Japan.

>>383444032
>You could argue that the meaning would be lost too if someone who isn't familiar with japanaese culture reads senpai too

No you couldn't, because this is a personal game we're talking about - anyone playing this is already weeb as fuck and would understand senpai perfectly, while calling her "Senior" or "Miss" would just sound awkward to weebs and normies.

>>383444032
>posting on a Chinese frog farming board about the plight of the normal man watching a Miyazaki film about Jesus making pacts with demons

Whatever target audience you're concerned about, Atlas gives even less fucks about.

>>383443807
Not necessarily since there's still spoken honorifics in the dialogue.

That said, I think they're fine being in there, you get used to it after a couple hours. In fact, I think they should've gone even further and had them use last names where the Japanese do as well. Might've helped show the group getting closer together over time and made Yukari and Mitsuru's big moment more meaningful. Instead of just changing from calling her 'Mitsuru-senpai' to 'Mitsuru', rather than from 'Kirijo-senpai'. I'm sure calling people by their family names isn't so far-fetched to western territories, especially when they've kept straight up non-English words like -senpai and -coon and shit.

>>383444449
You are right. The game should be played in Japanese for maximum authenticity and not translated!

>>383444945
>I'm sure calling people by their family names isn't so far-fetched to western territories

It's definitely fucking weird and you usually only do that if you're being disrespectful, mocking them, or as a nickname. Calling someone by their family name in western territories, especially if you're not familiar with them, is very different than calling them by their family name in Japan.

That said, I think you're absolutely right and they should have just gone full bore with it and had everyone use the last names just like in Japan, and then gone with the "They're speaking Japanese, you're just hearing it in english" type narrative, which would definitely help to ease everyone into it.

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>>383441543
Maybe that's actually their names?

>>383445990
I'm from South America and in my school it was very common to call each other by our last name if we weren't familiar with each other.

>>383446519
>South America
>Western

I mean, technically you're over here, but your culture is very different from North America or Europe's.

I've convinced myself they kept it in P3 since everyone is talking to and addressing their senpais/kouhais, but fuck me was it super-jarring the first time I heard it.

>>383446660
Fair enough.

>>383430047
I don't recall there being much demand for it.

>>383444945
I'm in the US and generally you don't call people by their last name unless you're on super-friendly terms with them or you're being super formal/speaking in a superior position. The usual exception is when a last name is super easy to remember and kind of sticks as a nickname.

>>383443787
It doesn't lose meaning, but it loses levels of familiarity and respect. I could honestly care less, but I think the reason they kept it in is because the average high schooler over there keeps to societal norms and addresses their upper/underclassmen properly.

>>383444945
Yeah, you don't call people by their last names unless you're being extraordinarily formal (and that requires using a title such as Mr., Sir, or Dr.), using a nickname cause their regular name sucks, or you're being extremely informal and probably impolite. The whole name thing doesn't translate very well to US or Euro culture.

>>383445990
>>383446865
>>383447465
Sure, it's definitely not common, I just meant that if they were to just use family names in the same places they were used in the Japanese version, it wouldn't be so far-fetched for English speakers to understand the usage or it wouldn't weird them out. Like, what is the contextual difference between saying 'Akihiko-senpai' as opposed to 'Sanada-senpai' to the average English speaker? Not much, because the senpai part is still there, it's obviously a different culture than ours. I don't think it makes it any more familiar to English speakers to use given names as opposed to what they use in the original writing since they're already throwing in a bunch of Japanese culture-specific words anyway. Like the other anon said, they should've just gone full bore instead of half baking it in a bunch of different places.

>>383440186
then why doesn't every japanese game do it, smartypants? I'll tell you why, because persona 3-5 are tailored for the ultra shiteating weebs

>>383448823
Because they westernized the localization hard.

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>>383448823
Because when Persona's localized instead of just dubbed, we get fucking Mark.

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I didn't mind them at all and I see why they left them in. If your game is heavy on Japanese culture, you may as well go for it.

The real problem with honorifics in Persona is that they aren't consistent. Sure, most of the time you'll get Japanese ones, but occasionally you'll see a Mr./Mrs. thrown in there too.

>>383449634
Black Mark looks better though.

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>>383450610
And his dancing?

I like it.

The game is set in Japan.

If the game was set in america, then they should get rid of it.

>>383429893
They should always be included, as should TL notes. There should be an option to toggle them on/off if you don't like them.

>>383450938
Not crazy enough.

>>383430142
they don't make sense because they're not english words. do you even know what translation means?

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>>383451206
Localized Mark is definitely best Mark.

Test

>>383444705
>>383444943
I know that this isn't the most common case, but I didn't actually know shit about honorifics when I played Persona 3 for the first time.
I meant it just took a quick google search, but not everyone who plays the games is a familiar with japanese culture. Do the other SMT games have the honorifics intact too?

>>383451874
Depends. Most MegaTen doesn't really need honorifics because of the whole "the world is ending" thing.

>>383441401
>Oh, Miss Kirijo.

>>383452229
Yeah, usually honorifics go out the window when your upper classman had just been disemboweled.

>>383452614
>Don't fucking backtalk me, Yukari.

>>383446032
Maybe, but what about when the hero actually has a name, like Yoshihiko?

>>383453139
>Yoshihiko

That's another name for a sex doll, so that's bound to be changed.

>>383435449
You could just leave it at the name, knowing Mitsuro is an upper-classman isn't exactly important to the story.

>>383454647
It's as easy as establishing she's a senior/third year and having the characters treat her with respect throughout the game until they open up a bit more.

>>383453719
Japanese is quite a limited language, so honorifics and keigo make a lot of sense, they allow you to instantly understand the relationships between characters.

In English however, these things aren't remotely needed, because you can express the same concepts through natural dialogue. But hey, actually translating something is far beyond the realm of your average localisation monkey intern.

>>383456005
Care to give us an example, anon?