Why is it so much better than Dark Souls 3?

Because it is actually challenging, and full of interesting characters and areas. It also doesn't hold your hand through everything giving you a bonfire every five feet.

>contrarian /v/ unironically liking 2 over 3 since it got popular and good reviews
I called this a year ago, hipsters.

>>383108456
It's not

>>383108632
As much as I like ds2 I don't think it should be praised for it's bonfire placement. At least not in the original, don't know about sots

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>>383108456
I personally like the back stabs and general animations you're character would go into in Dark Souls 2 than in any Souls game

>>383108456
Today I will tell them that it is still the shittiest in the entire franchise.

>>383108456

Dark Souls 2 is harder - but usually for the wrong reasons as hit boxes, enemy copy paste, etc.
Dark Souls 2 is more fun - the reason is the crazy fashion and the multiplayer.
Dark Souls 2 scenarios are so clean and plain that make it fun to play in PvP, while Dark Souls 3 scenarios are meant to be better in single-player and visually in general.

But Dark Souls 3 is a better game. Better enemies, better scenarios, more thought into it. But I love all souls games anyway.

It came out before the series wore out its welcome and became mind-numbingly boring.

Thats not really much to say in its favor but at least I finished it.

It added variety and diversity, something Dark Souls 1 sorely lacked, especially if you played Demon's Souls first. Dark Souls 3 made me hate 1 even more. Despite it's blaring issues, I think it was headed into a good direction, just a troubled development once again, fucked with it.

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I refuse to buy SOTFS. No fucking way am I buying Dark Souls 2 again for a fucking graphics update and revamped enemies. I'm told it's the superior version of 2 but the original release was so boring and bland I can't see myself ever booting it up again.

>>383111383
It's barely even a graphics update outside of the half-assed lighting implementation here and there.

>>383108456

dark souls 3 just feels...bland

its not a bad game, but it's not very interesting. name one interesting boss other than nameless king.

>>383111698
You could say the bosses are more interesting than 2, no? Most have some kind of gimmick but they're all varied enough to not be stale on a single playthrough. I'll take that over Dude In Armor Boss #12 to be honest.

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>>383108456
This is a sort of societal personality disorder

>>383108632

I dont remember having any challenge whatsoever in 2. Meanwhile 3 kept kicking my ass

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>>383108456
Just how bad is this game? Is it even worth playing, be honest please. I LOVED Bloodborne but have been playing Dark Souls in bursts, I think Tomb Of Giants was the longest Ive stopped playing (like 2 months)

>>383108456
One thing for me personally.

When I get bored of an area or route I'm taking this one and the previous 2 always give me plenty of other areas to try instead.
3 never had enough options for me unless you rush to the catacombs which mean taking the same route every damn time unless I feel like going to the late game early. Too bad dancer is a boring boss that early because of how safe you need to be.

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>>383112791
Imagine if some Chinese or Korean no-name studio tried to create a DS game and thought that it can impress you through sheer quantity but no actual quality - the result would be something like DS2.

>>383113378
More like imagine if From made a game.
All their shit is pretty awful in one way or another.
I'm just glad they learned how a controller works in that one.

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>>383112791
It's not bad it's just very bland and forgettable. Outside the DLC, which is actually pretty good, the whole game just feels like it's not even a real Souls game. Feels like playing Lords of the Fallen or The Surge. Has those elements you'd expect from a Souls game but not really implementing it in an interesting way. Honestly you should have gotten it while it was on sale for like 8 bucks if you were interested. I'd pay 8 bucks for DS2.

Were new games NPC invasions any better than the ones in the DLC? Never did all of 3 or bb but I remember the jester and that fucking coward in the tower so damn much.

>>383108456
I don't manage to get back to it after playing 3, but maybe I need to burn myself out of 3 first.

I don't have sotfs though, I bought the base game + DLCs like a fool and now I don't really want to spend even 10-15 sheckels for sotfs on sale.

>>383108456
I liked dual wielding.

Does SotFS have actually interesting encounters or are the enemy replacements just a bunch of bullshit? I've been itching for some Souls and DS2 is like the red headed step child I keep locked in the attic.

I'm really tempted to get SoTFS on the humble monthly but so far I've only seen talks about vanilla DS2.

>>383112730
Trolling or super gud. For most players Forest of Fallen Giants by itself was more challenging than a few hours of DS3

i legit forgot i own dark souls 3
didn't get too far, but the level design seemed fucked and super linear with a shitload of enemies. you were rewarded by skipping enemies to get from point A to point B

>>383108620
fpbp

>>383114578
there are some really bland and boring areas (too many) but some are fine, and boss fights are usually high points

to be honest after my first run it feels like "gee I sure hope I'll get to the next boss quickly so it stops being boring"

>>383114565
Do it, some of the enemy placements don't make sense lore-wise. but other than that it's better in almost every way. You have to find the DLC items though, you don't just get them dropped into your inventory like vanilla

>>383114367
Some make more sense like Heide Knights actually being in Heide but then you get completely retarded shit like the Executioner Chariot horse running around in Drangleic Castle and things that didn't get addressed like Grave Wardens still being in Earthen Peak.

Did somebody ever ask them why did they scrap bonfire ascetics for 3?

It was a pretty interesting item

>>383108456
Well let's see... I played DS2.

SotFS is fucking nuts in comparison.

>Iron Keep becomes Iron Clown Car. Like shit, there's 20 or so alonne knights alone in the first half before the smelter demon. Oh, by the way, not one, but two red phantom invasions at the entrance.

>Lost Bastille, more like Lost BLASTille. Black powder kegs everywhere now from what I remembered. Seriously, might as well have a sunshades head equip so I can slow walk away from the explosions caused by every one of those suicidal enemies. And I'm not talking about the mummies you find past Ruin Sentinels.

>Earthen Peak, home of pyromancers that give you kisses of death, and hulking giants that know hexes.

>The Gutter... somehow very pleasant I had a wonderful time down there. Except that one dark room with that spider... thing... that I couldn't fully see... and pussied out by spamming arrows until it died. No.

>Shaded Woods, now with 50% less lions, replaced by untargetable fake ghosts.

>>383114862
Might be because it could game the system too easily like 2's means of getting into Drangleic castle, use 4, kill Rotten 4 times, and skip the others.

>>383115184
>The gutter
>Spider thing

Isn't that the giant ant (which is in the base game and is harmless)?

For any anon wondering, DaS2: SOTFS is actually a pretty good game and deserves to be played.
Its lengthy as fuck, i think i clocked DaS (with dlc) at 18-20 hours and DaS2: SOTFS at 200 hours.
Hit boxes are shit, im not going to testify against that because they are.
Most weapons, armor and (maybe) magic in the entire souls franchise.
Level design isnt the best but there are heaps of places. it looks like they focused on quantity > quality
fight the same boss as many times are you want at the cost of it getting permanently stronger
BB>DaS>(only by alittle) DaS2:SOTFS=DaS3>DeS>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vanilla DaS2
oh, and a reminder for people who are pissed about the graphics downgrade, all you have to do to fix it is set your brightness down as low as possible. it improves the atmosphere and everything x100

>>383115404
It is in the base game, but I don't know about harmless. But it looked big, scary and unknowable. I killed it no question the moment I saw the fucker move. Both times.

>>383108456
Because it has perfected the DS1 combat formula that relied on properly timed, single dodges with long recovery frames instead of retarded dodge spam with almost zero recovery frames of DS3. Because it actually added to the combat system by fixing poise, making it non OP, but still viable in both PvP and PvE instead of just throwing it away entirely. Because it had non-streamlined dual wield mechanics where you could combine individual weapons together and make such fun builds as sword+spear or rapier+dagger. Because the covenants were actually fun and had meaningful rewards. Because the bosses were actually challenging due to different mechanics other than their ability to spam attacks that, in turn, gets countered by your ability to roll-spam in DS3. Because insta-chugging did ruin both boss fights and PvP as you had to specifically set up or wait for a proper chug moment against aggressive bosses like Alonne, Dragonslayer or Raime. Because the game had actually functional armor and going heavily armored was a viable choice. Because NG+ cycles added unique fantoms with unique loot and modifications to both regular enemies placement and boss fights, instead of just adding the +1/2/3 ring variants and calling it a day. Because of a shitload of other important reasons I'm too lazy to name.

Overall, DS3 was such a step down compared to 2, it really shows that these games were made by different people.

Is the Scholar of First Sin an expansion or is it the base game with DLC?

>>383114720
>>383115417
Finally some insight for SoTFS
Thanks

>>383115608
I shat my pants too but I had died so many times before in the game that I just slowly walked up to test the waters then swinged at it until it dropped, expecting it to either drop something or clear a path
apparently its only purpose is to fart at you to cure poison

>>383115683
on xbox and ps3, its just base game with dlc's
on xbox one, ps4 and pc, its updated base game with different enemy placements, i think they fixed some annoying stuff, nicer graphics and all dlc

>>383115791
The poison cure farts also verrrry slightly degrade equipment.

>>383115683
Base game plus DLC and some minor changes here and there.
It's basically a cashgrab "redux" version (or whatever people would call that shit these days) or update that other companies would churn out for free.

>>383115734
Dragon Keep also goes from lame to breddy gool in vanilla->scholar

>>383116183
>that other companies would churn out for free
Actually, there aren't too many of those left nowadays

>>383115880
>>383116183
Ah, I see thinks.

>>383108658
Yeah I'm sure no one likes the game for what it is, they're all shills

>>383111383
>>383111618
Sotfs has a much much better framerate on consoles

Oh shit I just remember I never got to kill the ancient dragon
I brought my best fire resist shield and various gear but his fire breath would still remove all my stamina (and health)

So I tried killing Vendrick with all giant souls except the dragon's and it was sluggishly slow and unrewarding

>>383115675
Let me just add to this and say that hitboxes aren't a valid complaint anymore and haven't been for a while since they fixed them up. Also, people complaining about groups of enemies are playing Dark Souls 2 like Dark Souls 1, you can't just expect to down every enemy doing one thing for the entire game. They give you many tools to deal with this through the entire game and you're only limiting yourself.

>>383108658
>got popular and good reviews
What are you implying? The game always had those, right from day one. The whining about "muh downgrade" came from an extremely vocal, yet irrelevant minority which had no overall impact on the game's popularity, as shown by Steam and critic ratings as well as sale numbers. DS2 was always good in the eyes of the majority of the DS playerbase, the only ones who didn't like it were Miyazaki cultists, but who gives a fuck about what they think?

>>383115608
Fuckin pussy

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>>383108456
How many years are we going to have these stupid souls vs threads?

>>383116513
>respec
>+9 or +10 gyrm greatshield
>switch to two-handing it before every fire attack
>never take damage from its fire

The meme that 2 is better than 3 is over guys! You can stop pretending now! This meme has been going on since 3s release and to be frank, it's dead now.

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>>383116819
>>383116947
Its like these threads dont go away, every day it is always the same picture and same text.

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A lot of the hate comes from those of us who were here when it first came out.
The base game felt like a massive step down in every way from both Demon's Souls and Dark Souls at the time. Not to mention how graphically it looked like a completely different game than the trailers. Should have saved the webm showing the differences.
Even though the DLCs redeemed it in my eyes, the aftertaste of the taint at the beginning can never fully go away. Some major flaws just couldn't be fixed either.

Can we at least agree that 2/Scholar is the hardest Souls game by a good margin? even including BB and DS it still kicked my ass the most.

They fucked up in 3 by not including the batshit insane amount of armor and weapons in 2. Heide knight set is my favorite armor across all three games.

Also Maldron the Assassin is a piece of shit, but fucking hilarious at how effective they made him.

Maybe someone can help but iv'e just gotten the dlc for dark souls 3 and i need to get to the cathedral of the deep but only like the first 4 bonfires are open to me. Do i seriously need to replay the game until the cathedral to get to the painting?

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>>383108456
Well its certainly at least better than one of the easiest games in the history of gaming franchises. Seriously each area following the "chosen hunter" and his excessively buffed weapons from assorted game locations as he fights brainless enemies has been less engaging than the last. Aside from the handholding, the game's only consistency is providing you with absolutely retarded, unchallenging mobs and allowing you to run through all of them without any combative motivation thoughout the entire game. All to make the difficult feel easy, to make action seem inert.

Perhaps the die was cast when From Software voted to make the game a PS4 exclusive; they made sure the series would never be mistaken for a work of art that meant anything to anybody. just ridiculously profitable cross-promotion for the souls series. Bloodborne might be anti-Christian (or not), but it’s certainly the anti-Final Fantasy 7 in its refusal of challenge, skill and excitement. No one wants to face that fact. Now, thankfully, they no longer have to.

>a-at least the Dark Souls games were good though
"No!"
The enemies were easy; the bosses were unfairly hard. As I played, I noticed that every time a enemy went for an attack, he spent an unrealistic amount of time telegraphing an attack.
I began marking on the back of an envelope every second the enemy stretched his arm back. I stopped only after I had marked the envelope a several dozen times. I was incredulous. Miyazaki's mind is so governed by outdated game design philosophies that he has no other style of challenge. Later I read a lavish, loving review of Dark Souls by the same Kevin-V from Gamespot. He wrote something to the effect of, "If these kids are playing Bloodborne at 11 or 12, then when they get older they will go on to actually contract bloodborne herpes." And he was quite right. He was not being ironic. When you play "Bloodborne" you are, in fact, trained to catch herpes.

>>383117468
It's the hardest on your first playthrough. Once you realise you shouldn't treat it like Dark Souls 1 and just top yourself up with life gems at every opportunity the game becomes very easy outside of dlc/amana.

>>383117295
Maybe this contributes to why I love the game so much, I barely looked up info on the game, I just knew that it was coming out and that I was getting it day one since I loved DaS1 so much.

I need to get it off my chest. I think the Lothric Knights are the most difficult enemies in any Souls game.

>>383117474
It's all fun and games until the npc invader starts chunking acid urns to break your equipment, fishing for backstabs, running away to hide behind enemies and heal, and use disguises to get the jump on you.

>>383117608
I think the ADP stat made it harder for me, at least for early game. Enemies can clip my rolls very easily unlike 1 & 3 so I can't just spam dodge.

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>>383117596
Copy paste.

>>383117681
I also tried to avoid info, at least when it came out.
Months earlier I did see the trailers and fight with candles to play the beta though.

>>383117728
Do you not know how to strafe around and backstab?

>>383108456
Bone fist

>>383108456
- healing actually requires good timing or you die instead of just the heal being canceled out by another hit like in 3

- stamina requires constant management compared to 3 where you can spam all day and panic roll your way to victory in anything that isn't end game or DLC

- 5 paths that can be opened from the start and continue their respective branches till the DLCs unlike 3 where its one big log from start to end

>>383117981
You can't just hug them and backstab, they will constantly shield bash.

>>383117728
2H weapon, mash R1, you'll destroy them 9/10 times with anything that's bigger than a dagger

DS2 combat
>sink 10 points into ADP
>time your rolls and position yourself carefully to avoid taking damage

DS3 combat
>spam roll + R1 until your stamina meter runs out, wait 2 seconds for it to replenish, repeat

Gee I wonder

>>383117728
I actually found heide knights much harder.

>>383118015
I don't care if going full dragon body and power stancing the bone first was stupid.
It was fun. Especially when starting a fight with transforming and breathing fire as a war cry instead of bowing.

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>>383118159
>>time your rolls and position yourself carefully to avoid taking damage

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>>383118210
>That one with the spear on Heide's Tower

>>383117728

Elder ghrus are the most bullshit enemy in the game.

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>>383118159
Low tier bait. Are you DaS2 sympathizers even trying?

>playing DS3, kinda enjoying it but it's pretty boring
>get to the giant poison swamp

Yeah fuck this. Literally nobody enjoy this kind of level, why do they insist on putting one in every game

>>383117756
(not him) I can relate first thing I really noticed about dark souls 2 was how imperfect the dodge was even when you tried simply using it move your hitbox out attack range. Using it for repositioning rather than using it's iframes to roll through an attack. Even then I'd still get hit because of how wild the attacking hitbox was.
>>383117728
I would say they're about on par with the skeleton beasts in DaS1 and equally avoidable. For me the hardest enemy to fight on a sl1 was the painted guardians because of the sheer variety of attacks and moves they have at their disposal.

so is basically the difference between DaS2 and all the other games is that DaS2 is slower and more deliberate while the rest is fast murder shit to avoid damage

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>>383108456
Darksouls 2 is ass
Bloodborne=DaS1>DaS3
If anyone says otherwise they're just trolling for the sake of it.

>>383118267
>no rebuttal

>>383118329
>no rebuttal

Cuhhhhrazy DS3 babies everyone

>>383118267
I don't see how that statement is wrong.

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>>383117295
>looked like a completely different game

It WAS a completely different game

>>383118139
That's why you strafe around right after they attack.

>>383118376
Counterpoint:
DeS = BB > DaS > DaS3 > DaS2

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>>383118409
>>383118436
It must suck to know that DaShit2 was your first souls huh m8

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>>383118349
HUE HUE HUE HUE HUE

>>383108632
>everything giving you a bonfire every five feet.
this is a shitty meme
>kill Dragonslayer Armor
>get bonfire
>walk into next zone
>bonfire at the very start of it
>OMG BONFIRE EVERY FIVE FEET EVEN THOUGH THERE WAS LITERALLY NOT A SINGLE ENEMY BETWEEN THOSE TWO BONFIRES CASUALIZED CASUALIZED CASUALIZED

>>383118507
You still haven't said anything on how that statement is wrong

>>383118458
What's that top map? A beta Gutter that was left unfinished in the files?

>>383118473
Agreeable, let me just fix one thing.
Des = BB > DaS > DaS3 >>>>>>>>>>>> DaS2

>>383117728
Correct answer for hardest enemy is >>383096814

It's also the absolute most bullshit and unfair enemy in the series.

i played dark souls 2 a few days ago after having played a lot of dark souls 3 and i was viscerally shocked by when i realised that i was using weapon moves for their properties (eg step forwards, thrusts in tight corridors, strike/thrust damage types etc) rather than just pressing r1 for stunlocking and dps

rolling 4 times and being out of stamina is just fundamentally good and the bosses of the game being designed around this is also good, at least it gets rid of the style over substance 90 attack combo anime shit that makes people mistakenly believe dark souls 3 bosses are good on any level

>>383118507
It was actually the fourth souls game I played, still better than DS3

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>>383118571
yes
It's how it was originally planned to look according to the concept art.

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>>383118159
>literally every souls game is roll r1 spam
back to r3dd1t you go
pls dont come back

Power stance

>>383118721
>DS3 plays the same as DS1

Yeah fuck off, you're fully in denial if you don't think R1 spam isnt a problem in DS3

>>383118579
>>383118473
I don't get how you place DeS so high I liked it too and generally had great experience with it but it was not nearly as cohesive with it's world, story and game play elements as DaS. Even though is was better in some particular instances there's no better example of seemless and coherent integration of all of a games elements than DaS (and BB for that matter)

>>383117295
Anyone who liked Das2 is a SotFS newfag who came after 2014. If any of you thought das3 was bad on release, then boy oh boy, you didn't see das2 vanilla release.

>yfw you realize DS2 was originally developed for gen 8
>but then came sony with a contract for an exclusive
>DS2 project was shafted and completely butchered just to rush it out on last gen consoles
>yfw DS2 is shit because of Bloodborne

>>383118836
I wonder how many people here know the pain I felt when I played vanilla DaS2 after playing the beta.

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>>383118929
>tfw bloodborne's influence ruined dark souls 2 and 3

>>383112302
'unique' bosses are typically shit tier though. DS2 had a few like the rotten and covetous demon, but still had a few exceptions to the rule like the chariot.

DS3 was alright for bosses, but testicle tree, aldric, wolnir were all terrible, and it's big armored dudes like gundyr and the second half of nameless that end up being great

>>383118683
I'm sorry what are these good DaS2 bosses you're talking about? I can't think of one that took me 2 attempts to clear besides that scorpion bitch.

>dark souls 2
>better than anything
lmao

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>>383114783
>Grave Wardens still being in Earthen Peak.

>yfw you find out that EP once connected to the Undead Crypt and when it didn't anymore they couldn't be arsed to replace the Wardens

>>383118472
>after they attack
>after
That implies that they stop.

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>>383118818
Not him
It actually plays VERY similar, once you've done endurance enough in DaS1 you could practically roll for decades. So dont even try that "Muh Rollin argument".
Also
>>>/r/eddit

>>383119038
i didn't say dark souls 2 had good bosses i said dark souls 3 has bad bosses that use very obvious aesthetic tricks to make your think they're good

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Are you ready to admit that this is the best game in the series, /v/?

>>383119231
fair enough

>>383117728
It was bullshit to put them so early into the game, that's for certain.

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>>383119231
>Dark Souls 3 has bad bosses
>bad
>bosses
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKuAWchxPo8

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>>383118458
those houses stacked on top of each other make no fucking sense to me

>>383119257
It's my favorite, I still feel it has some of the best level design and lore, but it's damn clunky now. If they did a remaster/remake with updated controls it would be indisputable.

>>383119162
>I sink all my points into endurance and using the dark wood and Havel ring

And even then it's not as bad as DS3

>>383119316
this is a multiple enemy encounted big dude in armor boss that has like 3 basic moves except it can be stunlocked to death lol

it just has a lot of production values poured into it to hide how shit it is, kind of like how deacons of the deep is just praying magus but with more money spent on it so it's more flashy

>b-but muh first phase that ends in like 20 seconds!!! i like getting hit from off camera!!! only when miyizaki does it though!!!

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>instantly remember all DS2 areas
>takes 5 minutes to even remember a single DS3 area
>have beaten both games a similar number of times

There's absolutely nothing memorable about DS3. It's the most bland shit, "hey guys remember DS1!?!?" while DS2 felt like a separate experience from 1.

More weapons and armor, which both looked really good.

POWER STANCE. You'll be hard pressed to find a game that does dual wielding this well.

Viability, almost all weapons are meta for pvp while there's maybe 5 or 6 usable weapons in DS3.

Magic and Faith builds are viable in DS2.

DS2 characters are more memorable and have more personality, and aren't just copy sated from DS1

DS2's major flaws are ADP and soul memory, which really should have been fixed with SOTFS.

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>>383119397
>I sink all my points
That is so non sense, you could run havels ring with decent endurance and still roll like a madman, you faggot.

>>383119382
that winged tipped spear though
>2h r2 is a trotting step forward and actually using the appropriate length of the spear
was one of my first weapons in game and just feel in love with that thing. It's damage is always disappointing though.

I've concluded that none of the dark souls games are all that good. I started off with little knowledge of the games, and in DS1 and 2, I had my shield up, moving carefully, and getting fucked about the average amount of times. Then, around the mid-point of DS2, it all hit me just how poor the games are, and how logic for other games doesn't apply. I used to try to shield block attacks from bosses, but no. The optimal strategy is to roll at them, using the iframes to get under them and then roll away using the iframes to make your escape. Two-handing and running around in circles leads to victory, not planning or strategy.

Once I figured that out, and was disappointed at just how SUCCESSFUL it was to play this way, the whole thing became a waste of time.

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>>383119541
The only memorable thing about DaS2 is how bad it was on release and how bad it is currently.

Give me your favorite powerstance combo to use for a new run.

>>383119535
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6BMVgkz4Fs
I could grab any boss fight from DaS3, the atmosphere and theme (Music) alone would overshadow the entirety of DaS2's Playthrough.

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>>383116819
Until retards recognize that DS2 was overall the right direction the series should be taken mechanically and only had minor, easily fixable flaws in this regard. Otherwise we'll continue to get "lol just iframe through everything YOLO" mechanics and idiots who think DS1 "backstab everything in sight" was acceptable while complaining about actually creative uses of mobs.

>>383119541
DS2 simultaneously had a lot more going for it and a lot more working against it. More interesting levels at the expense of feeling connected, more complex environments/hazards at the expense of just being annoying, etc. In general it was like they took DS1 and said "how can we complicate every fucking inch of this design" which obviously had tradeoffs.
imo it ended up a worse game, but it's pretty easy to see why people would enjoy it if they could look past all that.

>>383119885
>game literally has a stat to increase roll iframes

>>383119578
you're an idiot iframes have been a part of games forever and
higher level play in almost any game just shatters any sense of immersion or coherence. Once it's all laid bare and you're skilled enough to no longer fear failure it's a different game and it's no different in that regard than anything else. This is just the first game that's pushed you to that point and you resent it for opening your eyes to what games really are.

>>383111383
>I'm told it's the superior version of 2
Most of the areas just add way more enemies and it's even harder to run through areas. You are basically forced to clear out the Alonne Knights at Iron Keep on the way to Smelter Demon every single time since there's like ten that chase you if you run past them, it's a nightmare.

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>>383119231
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rk6mzf240Ew

>>383118370
DaS2 is faster than DaS1 bust slower than most everything else. It's probably the most appropriate speed of all the games.

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>>383119885
>saving thumbnails
>calling other people retards

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>>383119885
>Until retards recognize that DS2 was overall the right direction
Your casual asses are the reason why DaS3 immediately got warping in the beginning of the game.

>>383119578
>iframes were always a crutch for combat design
>iframes were always a mistake
>there's no hope of a ds4 where you are -actually dodging- the attacks with rolls because it would alienate the playerbase

There's a reason the first correction everyone makes to their playstyle is to stop rolling too early; it doesn't make intuitive sense to leave beginning a roll as a swing connects with your character.
But it's 'good game design', I'm sure.

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>>383119231

>>383115683
It's a rereleased cashgrab.

>>383120079

>This is just the first game that's pushed you to that point and you resent it for opening your eyes to what games really are.

Nah. I could list a million games, and none of them would suffer from the same problem. I get that you like the games, and you feel the need to..defend their honour, or something, but "Higher-level play" in the souls series is empty as hell, and honestly, the game was a lot better before I "gut gud".

>>383120079
>iframes have been a part of games forever

Most games don't specifically have rolling iframes that let you past your opponent's telegraphed attacks for free like Souls does. If they lacked this or specifically forced you to craft your build around them (like DaS2 motioned towards, but all you faggots hated that) then the series would be much better.

>>383120089
actually this is legitimately the most perfect example you could have provided

how is dodging a teleport attack any different mechanically from dodging a normal delayed attack from a regular boss? i understand that teleporting is different aesthetically from just swinging a weapon but how is it different in terms of how you play the fight?

this is what i mean when i say dark souls 3 tricks players into thinking its good, people genuinely think, that in a game where most of the bosses are dodging specifically timed attacks, that dodging a specifically timed attack (but with a different sort of animation) is unique because its presented differently. dark souls 3 brainlets genuinely cannot understand this, they think the dark souls 3 fights are better than dark souls 2 fights literally because they had more money spent on making the same shit look different

>>383120231

This. It's not about "not getting hit". it's about "making sure you DO get hit, but it happens during iframes".

Ironically, most players who need to 'git gud', are actually being persuaded to get worse.

>>383118543
Road of sacrifice
>Bonfire at the start of the level
>Fight from the top of my head 11 weak enemies, cross a bridge and get a bonfire that is 40-60 seconds away from the first one
>Now at the anri bonfire, you stand above the swamp, walk through it avoiding the enemys in the forrest part because it seems smart and vind an other bonfire that is 20 SECONDS away from the last.
>Kill the 2 dudes and go down the stairs, an other bonfire that is like 20 seconds away from the last AGAIN.
>If you kill sage thats an other bonfire.
This area could have done with the first bonfire and the one at Farron keep and it would have been fine.
I could make a list like this of: Undead settlement, Cathedral, DragonPeak, Highwal and Lake.

>>383120231
>there is no hope of a ds4 where you are -actually dodging-
There is hope of a ds4 period. There is hope of them releasing an action game that has no i frames.

>>383120401
>>383120231

Don't forget that you get more of them at 30fps, making it beneficial to gimp yourself

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>>383120416
>how is dodging a teleport attack any different mechanically from dodging a normal delayed attack from a regular boss
>this is what i mean when i say dark souls 3 tricks players into thinking its good
Keep telling yourself that DaS2Cuck
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlPGu5hxRSI

>>383120401
no one's forcing you to roll spam. You still have to learn a bosses attacks and know what it's telegraphing to roll effectively which requires a significant learning investment on the player's behalf.

>>383120006
Which is one of the single best decisions it made and was only flawed because it didn't directly inform you what effect it had. If anything it should have made the scaling ramp down slower and given you more incentive to pump more points into the stat.

>>383120231
This guy gets it.

>>383120198
Because not being exactly like DS1, as opposed to every other Souls game, is just that cancerous, right? I mean, I'm not even opposed to having a section of the game where you can't warp, as designing the game to be more open is great, but having to find the 'secret' bonfire right next to the other one in Quelaag's Lair to warp to it is fucking stupid.

>>383120625
nice argument, how is press b not to take damage different from press b not to take damage?

even lothric's magic attacks are like this, it's not a projectile that you have to get out of the way of, it tracks you to the last possible second and curves in mid air making it functionally identical (but aesthetically different, which is all dark souls 3 defenders seem to care about, except on the one game that wasn't made by miyizaki) from any other attack; it hits you at x point so you press b slightly before x like every other thing for the past 20 hours

>>383120767

>Which is one of the single best decisions it made

Level ADP to win

>>383114569
You just mean DSP right? Not him but me and everyone I've discussed this with agrees the whole game is ez pz

>>383113953
Yeah I probably shouldve, but I spent my remainder on Winter Assualt cos I wanted to play the Guard against my mate

>>383120859
Which should of course be a viable option if you want to, but otherwise iframes shouldn't just be used as a crutch be default.

>>383120906
DSP only completed it because lightning spam

>>383121026
>Which should of course be a viable option if you want to

Could have just made the engine not rely on the player using invincibility to succeed.

I used the area right before the Vordt boss fight with all the Lothric Knights to grind to one million souls on my very first playthrough.

I'm now an expert on Lothric Knights. Ask me anything about them.

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>>383120767
DaS2
>Get warping
>Taken for granted
Sorry but casual DaS2Cucks ARE the reason for half of DaS3's problems. Hidetaka Miyazaki was afraid the babies would cry over having to actually walk and explore.

>>383121031
dsp is not the worst gamer in the world I would go so far he's average. But he just has such a huge egotist he has issues accepting and learning from his failures.

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>>383121248

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>>383108456
>Wake up before work
>get on /v/
>See this thread
Does this shit ever go away, Dark souls 2 is fucking ass, stop posting it already.

>>383108456
For the life of me I can't tell which is better, I don't know how ppl can even claim things of the sort.

>>383121192
do you get constant roll buffering from the shield bash attacks

>>383121198
>He says this even though Das2 has the most area's and secrets
>Das1 arguably punishes exploring because you cant warp
OH MAN, you are the king of mental gymnastics

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>>383108456
I still don't to this day get why Dark Souls 3 is so overrated on /v/. It's a great game but it's easily the worst pvp in the series.

Anyways, my favorites are probably DaS 2

>>383121248
He definitely has some kind of learning disability and I'm not even trying to talk shit. He refuses to learn from trial and error, and plain ass common sense. I'd say hes below average

The real issue with 2 taking into account how much content was added with the DLCs is the gameplay. The animations and the feeling behind the movement and attacks isn't equal to the rest of the series. It feels clunky and doesn't allow you to aim your attacks in any direction without locking on.

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>>383121506
>Das1 arguably punishes exploring
You didn't play it for shit, you could warp to 10 different bonfires 50% into the game.
Das2 has the most area's and secrets
>secrets
Too many actually, its no longer unique once I've opened a wall for the 20th time on my first playthrough.
>Das2 has the most area's
what good are the areas when they have shit level design.
C A S U A L
A
S
U
A
L

>>383119885
>terrible, TERRIBLE animations
>awful sound design
>generic art direction
>so many weapons but most of them have the same fucking moveset and playstyle
>the base game has two good bosses with the rest being middling to straight up bad
>life gems
>a stat that not only affects roll distance, but never tells you it does this and has no visual indicator that your roll is getting better
>level design takes a fucking nose dive after forest of fallen giants
>so many builds but they all play the same
>soul memory
>agape ring is not a fucking solution to soul memory no matter how many times you say it is
>bad NPCs with stories that go fucking no where with no actual closure to a single questline
>mob enemy placement that can be handled by funneling them every single fucking encounter
>great shields still make the game into easy mode
>shields in general are actually even better then they were in DaS1 and DeS
>"stop using lock on for everything" says the straight sword/greatsword user despite the fact most weapons have an awful time when used unlocked due to how sluggish and inaccurate attack aiming is in DaS2
These are only some of the problems I have the game and they aren't things I can ignore. I agree Dark Souls should be slow and methodical but I think you're a fool for thinking DaS2 does a good job of putting the series in that direction since defensive play is still worse than dropping your shield and dual wielding
any fast weapon that isn't a dagger.
You can still backstab everything in sight.
You can still dodge everything to win.
Everything that was a problem in daS1 and DeS is a problem in DaS2 but made worse, and I don't know how you can ignore that.

>>383121810
>bad NPCs with stories that go fucking no where with no actual closure to a single questline
I dont think there was one NPC that even had a side quest for you. other then grabbing the key for the giant blacksmith.

>>383121687
Not him, but whats shit about the level design? The only argument I've ever seen is
>"WELL IN DARK SOULS 1 IT LOOPS AROUND ISN'T THAT COOL? DON'T YOU REMEMBER IT BLOWING YOUR MIND WHEN YOU SHOWED UP BACK IN FIRELINK?"
I just want to know, genuinely since 2 is my favorite

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no

>>383121623
I would not say that just take like a second to think about what average looks like in real life. The sort semi-sentient walmart shoppers ABC watching hobbyless things you dismiss as practically non-people. I don't think he's down to that level. I was reading god emperor of dune recently and a quote of Leto's II stuck me as being particularly applicable to phil. "Thinking you know something becomes the most perfect barrier to learning..."

>>383114668
fuck off reddit

>>383116659
you didnt read his post very well

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>>383122018
this always irritated me. the fucking npcs never move from their spot once they're there. especially when you get the titty girl back 10 feet from her blacksmith dad and she never bothers to find out if it's him or not

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>>383108456
What? Only casual scum that doesn't like any difficulty may like it.

>>383121687
>you could warp to 10 different bonfires 50% into the game.
So instead of letting you explore in the better half of the game it lets you explore in the more linear part of the game.
>>secrets
Yes a lot of them, and moste of them arent in walls, many of the boneshards are in sneaky places, you have the tree in the first DLC, torching the windmill, the abyss covenant, lighting all the torches in the gutter and more.
>Shit level design
Some area's, especially the DLC are really wel desgined. Forrest of Fallen giants, everything behind the shaded woods, the covenant areas, everything behind Huntsmans cops and honestly the gutter.

>>383121927
>whats shit about the level design
Iron Keep second bonfire location, thats just one Im trying to remember more.
>Drangleic Castle

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>>383122324
>So instead of letting you explore in the better half of the game it lets you explore in the more linear part of the game.
Lord vessal was a reward most people didn't take advantage of it like they do now, that was the only way to leave anor londo either way you fucking idiot.

>>383121902
There was that assassination dude in Aldia's Keep, Lucatiel, Bernard the Dream Stalker, the two guys who kill each other in Tseldora and (if you stretch your imagination and the definition of "quest) the guy in the Bastille who infuses your weapons after finding the dull ember (which doesn't even count as quest in SotFS) and the dude in Iron Keep who randomly lets you enter the dragon covenant after bringing the petrified egg - something that's only vaguely implied and makes no sense no matter how you look at it.

>>383121927
Let me explain why I disliked DaS2's level design by comparing it to DeS
DeS: Start in front of a large castle gate, head up and around through barracks over battlements and etc just to get through, cross a bridge path to get to the castle town, work your way through that to the castle proper, go to the throne room, done. Solid level, thematically. Everything made sense but there were still plenty of surprises.
DaS2: Start in some dead valley, end up in a town that seems to exist without purpose, travel a hundred miles in an eyeblink to some forest or something, suddenly you're in a castle ruins or something, get picked up and moved to a jail or something, take an elevator to some lava castle etc etc etc.
Basically it gave me whiplash how fucking unfocused it was. It's hard to be surprised or enjoy a design when they essentially just threw nonsense at you

>>383121902
Theres quite a few of them, but like I said none of them have a satisfying conclusion except for Vengarl, which is a stretch because all you have to do is kill his body really.
>Lucatiel give you her stuff and then she just fucks off, her brother invades you but you never see what became of her
>Benhart somehow ends up in a giant's memory and gives you hist stuff and fucks off, you can summon him later leading people to think he is on the same quest as you but it's not really backed up by anything concrete because you can also summon Vengarl to the final boss
>the blacksmith and his daughter never interate despite being 9 feet apart from eachother for no good reason
>Gilligan says he's being chased by people he made a bad deal with but nothing ever happens with him
>Cale just forgets who he is after you complete the game, he has no actual reason for anyone to care who he is
>Saulden the crestfallen warrior just sits on his ass for the entirety of the game
There are so many more that go the same way but I can't be bothered to keep naming them.
>>383122018 does a good job at illustrating the issue in fewer words than I did.

>>383122536
>that was the only way to leave anor londo
what?

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>>383108456
Do you even like Souls games?

>>383122412
>second bonfire
You mean behind the optional boss? Whats bad about it? I think its kind of cool they changed it up, an optional bonfire behind an optional boss you have to earn. Not like he was hard anyway

>Dranglwic castle
I don't see a problem here either. This definitely isn't enough to warrent the statement that "DaS2 has shit level design"

>>383122536
>uses mental gymnastics to think up sone bs reason
>Doesnt address my other valid points
>Calls me and idiot
You are a funny man you, I almost took you seriously, you are joking right?

>>383112730
>this one player keeps kicking my ass!

>>383122412
Are you just copying what you see in other posts?

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>>383122616
This how you know these people never started with the first installment.
>This thread

>>383122636
Not him but Drangleinc Castle is a series of bland grey corridors with uninteresting enemy placement featuring nothing but foes you've fought before but in greater numbers with the only interesing bit being vendricks poo poo pee pee pool filled with goodies you have to strip down to get.

>>383122558
The castle in the forrest makes sense though, even more so when you get the ashen mist heart and explore the giants' memories and the lore gets expanded on a bit. Then a bird takes you to another location from there later on, nothing too out of whack for Dark Souls. I feel like the way you're explaining it, you just want 2 to sound bad. You don't have to like the game you know

>>383108456
>worst game is better than best game
no

>>383108456
It's not. Every souls game is better than the last, with the exception proving the rule being Bloodborne which is better than 3.

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>>383122728
>>383122728
>Are you just copying what you see in other posts
>Other people use the same example
>"STOP DOIUNG THAT"

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Dark Souls 3 has the best atmosphere, gameplay, and story. It blows all the others out of the water when you look at the whole thing. It's a better game honestly.

>>383121927

Just compare Anor Londo with Drangleic Castle:

DC:
> unimpressive throne room
> random mask room which is there just for the hell of it and is probably one of the most obvious traps ever
> room with acid-puking dragon statues on wheels for some reason
> random Narshandra portrait room
> storage rooms here and there
> random "broom closet" with sublime bone dust
> an empty room with a mirror in it that is hanging too high for normal humans but has doorways that are too low for the larger characters to walk through
> another single-seat throne room/audience room thing because well, you have to meet Nashandra SOMEWHERE, I guess
> treasury which has all the gold neatly shoved into the corners
> room with the Executioner Chariot horse running around - don't ask why
> beyond retarded sideroom with a one meter drop in front of the door
> long as fuck elevator that only leads to the king's gimp room (no, that chained dude has no real lore or justification - just something weird for weirdness sake)
> there are a couple of doorways to the Throne of Want that are actually too small for Vendrick and Nashandra to fit through without crawling on their knees
>tons of visual glitches and level design issues
>holy fucking shit, King's Passage

AL:
> living rooms
> bed rooms
> small church
> small forge
> trophy room with dragon/wyvern/wyrm/whatever-they-are-called-at-the-moment heads for obvious reasons
> elevators, stairs and doors of different sizes for humans and large characters
> painting of the PWoA has its own large room, making it look important and draws attention
> crypt below the main building
worst thing here is the titanite demon who has no way to get into or out that room and the left archer being able to shoot at you through a solid wall

>>383122941
You misunderstand, I didn't dislike the game, I just didn't find the level design interesting because none of it made sense together. Start in Majula and walk two steps one way and you're at some sunken tower ruins, walk two steps another way and there's a pirate ship, walk another way and it's some other thing, but none of it felt lived in or connected or real. It felt like levels haphazardly lumped together, not like a world.

>>383120502
Don't forget about the bonfire between the catacombs and Irithyll.

>>383122802
What are you talking about? You can easily leave Anor Londo without the Lord Vessel, just go back to where you were first dropped off and you'll be taken back to the end of Sen's Fortress.

>>383122987
You can't possibly be saying DeS is the worst of the series

>>383122636
Im talking about the bonfire where you have to jump into a tiny pit in the floor which shouldn't even be like that for any reason.

>>383123129
I love how you guys are comparing Das2 with Das1 even though this thread is about Das2 and Das3

>>383123225
Oh, that. Yeah I don't really know, its dumb but its not that big a deal. I'll give you that one

>>383123289
Well because 3 is obviously the worst. Before I trigger anyone, I don't mean its bad.

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>>383123048
ds2 fans just hate it as a revenge because of the hate that ds2 got from ds1 and des fans(for being a bad souls game)

>>383123289
Makes more sense to compare the two worst games than the worst and best.

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>>383108456
What did you mean by this?

>>383123476
>Das3 is the best even though it has the worst level design, the least content and the worst balance.
I honestly think all the games are equally
>Das1 has the best level and world design and also the best lore.
>Das2 has the most content and best build balance and PVP, it also has BY FAR the best dlc wich has level desgin equal to Das1
>Das3 has the best bosses and combat
I like Das2 the most because I love how replayable it is.

>>383123368
pretty sure dark souls 2 fans hate it because it's a bad game that gets a lot of the same stuff as dark souls 2 wrong yet got nowhere near as much of a backlash

also it doesn't have any of the redeeming aspects of dark souls 2 such as build diversity, good pvp, powerstancing, actual stamina management etc

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>>383123817
Drangleic Castle was full of expertly designed rooms and areas.

>kill 4 bosses to open shrine of winter to circumvent a pile of rubble

holy shit terrible game my immersion is completely shattered

>kill 4 bosses plus dancer to drop a ladder to lothric castle

wlel thats just miyizaki's vision

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>>383113953
i paid 10$

>>383123883
>Das2 has BY FAR the best dlc wich has level desgin equal to Das1
What are you talking about? Half of the level design in DaS2's DLC is garbage.
Anyways I just don't see why people like DaS1 and 2, I had an extremely more enjoyable experience with DeS and DaS3. DaS1 is extremely overrated and didn't live up to expectations after everything I'd heard, plus I had more glitch related problems in DaS1 than any other game, and DaS2 gave me hell with the bullshit adaptability stat and so many enemy ganks.

>hear people talk about how deep and amazing souls games are
>there's a woman who "sells stones" on a hill surrounded by mountains, surrounded by poison

ehh

is the surge any good?

>>383123154
But that's not even a criticism of the level design, which is largely fine, but a take on the world design, which most people agree could have been better. Seriously, Lost Bastille is as good as almost anything in DaS1.

>>383125040
Minus the elevator at the start that makes no fucking sense or the mandatory bonfire warp from the area past the gargoyles.

>>383124753
>Shulva has well spaced enemies and bonfires, it also has many switch puzzels and maze like area's
>Brume is very vertical, turning on the power to start the elevators opens up new places in older area's
>The frozen city (forgot the name but its honestly the worst) has wide open spaces and actually gets harder ones you have stopped the blizzard

they're both bad games

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PVE
DS3 > DS1 > > DS2


PVP
>soul memory
>no password matching
>no team brawls

DS3 > DS2 > DS1


DS2Baby i'm sorry

>>383124908
God no. I had so many issues with that game.
>Severe lack of enemy variety
>The progression system funnels you into an HP/tank build due to the extreme enemy damage output (i.e literally everything will one shot you unless you slot as many HP upgrades as you can)
>Any attempt at making something else viable is apparently offensive to the devs as rather than fix the balance they went full retard and nerfed other builds in the latest patch
>Your damage output and movement options are garbage so expect every encounter to be a chore
>The blocking/parrying systems are the worst ever seen in a soulslike
>Lack of weapon variety
>Most weapons are useless
>Level design is sometimes really good and other times unbelievably shit
>Bosses range from semi-interesting to just irritating
>Non-existent lore, barebones plot
fwiw I never finished it, I got close to the last boss and said fuck it. I also got it for free but I still wish I hadn't wasted my time.

>>383108632
>challenging
>every single fucking boss comes down to circling onto their back and stabbing because of shitty ai
>there are 3 final bosses who can be defeated without going back to the bonfire easily
>their fights aren't even close to being as memorable as Gwyn or Soul of Cinder
>the only thing that redeems the game is the DLC with actual decent content

I'm slowly beginning to enjoy sotfs. Once you're out of the first couple of shitty areas it begins to pick up. At their core though, BB and DS3 feel mechanically better than their predecessors and that's mainly due the feedback. You can roll into smaller enemies to stun them which prevents you from being gangraped in a corner, and all enemy hits on you are noted. In DS2 you roll through an attack and a chunk of health is taken off but you may never even notice it.

I never played the DLC which everyone seems to rave about. It never looked that special to me though. I hear there's a tablet in Majula that tells you how to access it but I haven't seen it. Still, looking forward to playing it.

>>383125040
You're right but I think they feed into each other. It's easier to look past poor level design choices when it feels like it makes sense anyway.

>Walk from a giant dark cave after falling underneath the map in a watery vortex somewhere above the known world which has it's own entire world with forceful fireflies and people who literally melt into houses
>enter a coastal town consisting of a mansion with no bed, a shop, a blacksmith room that has a chest containing a bow for some reason, and a literal cat house
>go down a tunnel then turn left to go into a precarious cave which emerges you looking out over a giant cliff a few kilometres away from previous town
>continue upwards and ascend approximately 20 metres total to cross a bridge that brings you into a canyon on top of a bottomless river void
>skeleton room
>emerge from the skeleton room into a mining area with no houses aside from an underground poison hut containing a drunken gyrm with a fetish for wheels and deals, a room that exists to have a bonfire in it that somehow inexplicably crosses a pool of poison, and a windmill that is taller than anor londo
>climb up the windmill and take a magical elevator into the sky to emerge in a giant lava filled mountainous region that most exist in some alternate plane of reality
>climb down into a room containing a bonfire and a tree man who explodes from a bonfire to give you cryptic nonsense while you somehow don't spontaneously combust from the heat of the lava surrounding you both
>literally teleport back to the first coastal town
What

>>383122150
>and she never bothers to find out if it's him or not

Did you not get that that's the point?

>>383125359
>Stale as fuck meta with basicly only 1 viable build
>Best pvp
Yeah Das2 has the best pvp its basicly a fact

>>383125359
das3 has the worst pvp by far though

invasions are boring gankfests and 1v1 pvp is crippled by cheap high i-frame rolls, mechanical simplicity, little build variety and reverting to the old hit detection they used for dark souls 1 in a game which is twice as fast

>>383125543
Exactly. I'm not saying it's bad per se, but this is exactly why I didn't like it. Just nonsense that seemed to try its best to remind me that just some maps strung together in a video game and not a thought-out world.

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>>383125543
>"TIEM IZ CONVEYORLUTED IN DRAINAGELICK XD!"

>>383122150
She's fucking hallowing you dumbshit. She doesn't remember how to do anything other than look for stones and sell them, because that's what she's done her whole life.

Plus Lenigrast or w/e his name is looks like a rotten zombie.

>>383118037
*3 paths.
And even that's stretching it a bit

>>383108456
The shitty poise completely ruined that game for me

>>383125156
What you listed were the good half of the DLCs, the other half was shit.
Dragon's Sactum sucked, Cave of the Dead sucked, Iron Passage sucked, Memory of the Old Iron King sucked, and Frigid Outskirts sucked.

>>383125359
>DaS3 PvE
>Roll around like a retard and mash R1s into the enemy as they go swinging wildly off into the distance.

>DaS3 PvP
>Two or three viable builds at most. Everything else is garbage.

>>383108456
DaS2 is the Fallout 4 of Dark Souls. Follows one of the best games ever with one of the all time worst.

>>383125359
Dark Souls 2 PVP
>soul memory
>no password matching
>no team brawls
>bullshit lag
>Dark Souls 2 PvP is definitely

Dark Souls 2 is extremely sluggish and chunky. Animations and movement, especially the rolling, are slow and clumsy feeling. Your character takes a while to react to input and there is a lot of starting and ending frames to actions. There is none of the dynamic and energy that a good duel in Dark Souls 3 had. It's very slow and methodical, no matter how you build or what weapons you use. Dark Souls 2 in comparison is two people walking around each other taking turns to swing, block and dodge, and even duels between the best players look boring, sluggish and slow.

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>>383126619
Successful bait post. This is what soulsfags actually believe.

>>383108456
No it's still shit even if it did improve upon the original DaS2.

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I have never played a single Dark Souls game in my entire life and I got somewhat interested in the series after watching a friend play 3. Since I only have a ps3 and a toaster of a computer, should I get DS 1 or 2?

>>383128612
1

>>383127531
not hard to improve shit now innit

>play DS3
>bonfire just after you kill vordt
>take three steps
>cutscene
>bonfire right next to you
>go to the next room
>bonfire

what shit is this?

>>383110432
>the only reason a game is fun is because fashion and multiplayer
????
what did he mean by this??

>>383111698
ds2 is way more bland than ds3 whatchu talkin about.
I was actually shocked about how creative they got with it. Have you made it past the undead settlement? I thought it was bland too until then.

I only really liked it for build variety, and the covenants. PvP and Coop was pretty good too.

But it was ugly as hell and had terrible level design, most bosses were boring and some covenants were downright terrible.

DS3 is mostly improved but build variety seems small, covenants are boring and online is the worst.

>>383129190
>>play DS2
>>go through a narrow corridor
>>Get into a Shit boss fight
>>just plop in a "Primal Bonfire" in a big empty room to clunkily dump you back into Majula.

"the worst game ever made."

>>383108456
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mc4k_iiivH0

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>>383130256
Dark Souls 2 definitely had some interesting ideas, but it suffered from a total lack of direction. It ended up having a massive amount of areas and bosses compared to the other games in the series, but very few that actually stood out. The areas were generally short, flat, linear and disconnected, made up primarily of hallways and box-shaped rooms. Most of the bosses could have passed for beefed up enemies, sporting a meagre few attacks and lacking any interesting gimmicks.

Dark Souls 3 brought back what I had come to expect from Souls level design. The areas had a excellent sense of scale and use of vertical space. They felt like interconnected parts of an organic world, rather than the "video gamey" hallways we got with Dark Souls 2. I really appreciated that it took a page from Bloodborne, and divided every single bossfight into phases, with attacks and patterns that varied throughout. It made every boss feel unique and purposeful.

I also appreciated that they listened to fans and removed soul memory from the matchmaking process. By matching players by Soul Level AND by the level of their weapon, the game managed to weed out twinks without removing the ability of players to plan their character build and aim for a specific invasion or co-op range. The return of the full red eye orb was also very much appreciated.

While Dark Souls 3 had less content than Dark Souls 2, it felt like a much more focussed experience. A return to form after a misstep for the series.

>>383130256
Primal bonfires exist only to facilitate the "no bonfire run" because in many areas you cannot backtrack, like you can't go back to the Gutter from Black Gulch without warping.

Otherwise you'd just have to homeward bone to Things Betwixt after every Lord Soul boss.

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Why is the "GREAT SOUL EMBRACED" sound so fucking loud and obnoxious?

>>383130539
DS2 had less missteps than DS3, weight and roll speeds/lengths still mathered, poise was fixed and did what it was supposed to, you had 5 area to go from the start, stamina was a valuable resource you had to level to become an R1 mashing machine.

DS3 just gives all these things besides poise by default, every char is a fast rolling ninja with 15 iframes and a billion stamina points.
It is an extremely dumbed down RPG.

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shira's set looks nice with purple hair

DS1>>>>DS2>>>>DS3

Nobody agrees with me

>>383130256
>>383130539
I am in Drangleic castle right now.
Ds2 feels like a chore.

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>>383108456
kys, troll
DS3 is best From game now. DS1 can't even compete. While DS2 wasn't even dark souls game. That was some shitty chinese souls totally irrelevant in series.

>>383131749
DS1 > DS2 >>> DS3

>>383131749
DS2 has more elements from DS1 than DS3 has, it is infinitely more of a dark souls game than Roll Souls 3: Infinite stamina edition.

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DS3 never had a chance, it has too much BB in it.

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Fuck I'm really on the fence here, since it's 10 euros on psn. I thought vanilla ds2 was fine albeit really fucking long and I also don't like the idea of rebuying a game. Is the dlc worth it though?

Dark Souls 3 is NeoGaf babby's first Dark Souls.

>>383128612
Ds 1 on ps3 because the port is shit, or Ds2 on pc (if you can git gud and get used to the keyboard controls) because higherframe rate and more players for online

>>383132140
based

>>383130256
>This post
How is it so wrong

>>383132746
the game is relatively brief without it. I've enjoyed all so the souls games so far but I think the scholar of the first sin edition is what you should probably go for if you've played the first game (and maybe des) enough to enjoy a little more of a challenge. It's worth it but there will some frustration with the changes at first particularly the ADP stat. I would venture there's not a bad game in the franchise like mgs people just like different ones more for different reasons.

>>383132746
Bitch the DLC in 2 is some of the best parts of the entire souls series.

>>383133029
>Ds 1 on ps3 because the port is shit
1. It was fixed 30 min after release
2. The port being shit means that it runs like it did on consoles.

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>>383133029
Dark Souls 1 was fine on PS3. The exception to the rule was that swamp shithole that even on the PC is still not able to hold proper framerate, even with the custom fanmade patch. The issue is the infinite spawning little bugs and LODs not fading properly, so the entire area is loaded, including the other parts that have their infinite loading mosquitoes enemy scripts. It's fine for a console and there's this knee jerk revisionism history, Dark Souls 3 on PS4 and X1 runs at the same below 30FPS benchmark Dark Souls 1 ran on PS3/360.

>>383133225
>>383133201
Aight I caved in and bought it. What build should I go for? I'm always going full guts mode STR, I wanna try something new

I was gifted DS2 and 3, but not 1.
Knowing that the Prepare to Die edition will go on its usual 5$ sale in months since now and there are no cheap keys, would it be okay if I started the series now with 2?

>>383133549
Das1 is only playble in pc with a controller and installing mods to fix it. The port is just horrible.

>>383133463
Just do whatever you feel like. DS2 has the best build variety in the series.

>>383108456
It wasn't. But it had a atmosphere like DaS1 which DaS3 does not have. DaS3 couldn't maintain atmosphere imo at its pacing of gameplay the way BB could with its setting and focus on it.

DaS2 would be better if it had more bosses. DaS3 has alot of decent bosses and some great DaS2 has like 3 decent bosses and 2 great ones and everything else is pure trash.

>>383133691
>DaS2 would be better if it had more bosses
You mean had more good bosses right? There was almost too many damn boss fights in that game.

>>383133463
try the explorer, they have the highest starting ADP stat so you won't have as hard of a time. Also their armor is kinda cute. You'll have a while to figure out what you want to do with it while you're alternating putting points str and dex to meet the weapon requirements. If you like heavy hitting long reach weapons polearms would probably be the most natrual move for you.

>>383133765
I'm sorry i fucked up yes anon if it had better bosses is what i meant.
>Most bosses in Souls series
>Largest percentage that are shit.

Its pretty pathetic also there are like 2 good main game ones so before the DLC that is even worse.

>>383132265
Sad thing is that lothric is one dot too long because there isnt an area between undead village and road of sacrifice

>>383133791
Sounds good. I miss playing with halberds in DeS so I might go for that

>>383108456

The world is poorly designed, the feel of movement and combat is floaty and the magnetic lock-on enemy stuff ruins the game.

DS3 and Bloodborne are better games

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>>383134168
I loved DS1. Got DS2 day 1 because of the good reviews, played about 20h, didn't finish it, never touched it again. Biggest disappointment of the year and the moment I learned my lesson not to trust the majority of gaming journalists.

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>>383108632
none of the characters are interesting except for the fucker with the fake sword and the fucker who's just a head. Also there ARE bonfires every 2 feet wtf are you smoking? DaS2 is only challenging because of garbage hitboxes and enemies who's faces are magnetized to yours and you can't pull individually. The game also feels like you're walking through molasses with every movement. Every other Souls game feels a lot better to play. I really wanted to like DaS2, but it just did so much wrong.

>>383125359
>ds3 babby cant handle ds1 and ds2
it's ok being clinically retarded, mizayaki designed dark souls 3 pvp just for you

1 > 3 > 2 in individual respects
But i would rather replay 2 because 3 is exceptionally boring

>>383134472
>DS2Defender
Dark Souls 2 is utter trash

I didn't like DaS2 because it was my 3rd Souls game after DeS and DaS1 and it just did not deliver. I was afraid DaS1 wouldn't be as good as DeS, but I was proven wrong. I was iffy on DaS2 when I saw the initial footage, but thought "naaah I can trust them now." boy was I wrong. I remember sliding down a cliff in the tutorial area and seeing the trophy "WELCOME TO DARK SOULS!" pop up and it just put me in a sour mood. then I get to the house with all the old bitches and they laugh at me and tell me I am going to die and lose my souls over and over like some kinda meta self aware joke. It really rubbed me the wrong way.

>>383134731
Incorrect, dark souls 2 and 3 are UTTER TRASH, but at least das2 had salvagable pvp, while das3 is shit in every way shape or form. Now crawl back to the shithole you came from.

>>383134364
h-he's fast!

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>>383134731
It's not a bad game, it's just miles away from Dark Souls 1 and Dark Souls 3. The level design is mostly shit narrow corridors "go from A to B", the world is way less connected than in any other Souls game, the enemy placement is super generic and there are a ton of straight up unfair passages and bosses.

>>383134823
kek

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>>383108456
Because Dark Souls 3's world design is linear and boring as fuck which makes repeat playthroughs mind-numbingly tedious.The only choices you can make when progressing is whether you kill Dancer early, clearing the Cathedral of the Deep before or after Abyss Watchers and whether you kill Aldrich or Yhorm first. That's literally it.

Meanwhile Dark Souls 2 offers four paths to choose from at Majula right off the bat. Granted, those paths are individually pretty linear compared to Dark Souls 1's interconnected world, but it's more that can be said than DaS3 where you can only go ONE way with a handful of small detours.
.
Also the PvP was better too.

>>383108456
I enjoyed ds2 way more than ds3.
Probably because of PvP and build variety. I liked that small little things, mechanics that ds2 provided. Like zoning, Butcher's Knife infinities attacking moves you forward so you can continue attacking forever untill your opponent or your stamina bar dies, or Murakumo supers next move after one strong or 2 light attacks is faster (including parries). All those shit was gimmicky but usable, unlike ds3 where magic is literally garbage.
Never cared much about PvE since it's just same old trial and error shit I've seen 2 games before. Story is cool though.

>>383132746
I got it a couple of days ago. I think I played through vanilla 3 times. So far it's ok, there's a couple things that take some getting used to. At Lost Bastille and I'm still mostly using the starting gear aside from fire longsword and a shield, yet I'm level 40+ already. I think it will overall be worth it for the DLC I never played.

>>383135378
Oh and also backstep iframes. I miss those swag dodges more than anything.

>>383108456
>Why is it so much better than Dark Souls 3?

Because it was doing it's own thing instead of MEMBER DARK SOULS 1? MEMBER PAINTED WORLD? MEMBER ANOR LONDO? MEMBER FUCKING EVERYTHING?

That and the gameplay is ripped from Bloodborne without the Bloodborne style hunter dodge.
The much faster gameplay just doesn't mesh well with the slower Dark Souls mechanics, so to offset this they casualized rolling so fucking hard.

Dark Souls 2 improved on everything from 1 except for the access to Multiplayer items and interconnectivity of zones between each other.
Dark Souls 3 tracked backwards over a lot of progress and injected too much of Bloodborne into it.


2 is the best Souls games and, generally, the only retards that parrot that Youtube faggot disagree

Would you recommend Dark Souls 3 to a person who loved the first Dark Souls and Bloodborne, but hated Dark Souls 2?

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>>383135378
>All those shit was gimmicky but usable, unlike ds3 where magic is literally garbage.

Oh God, thread reaching new levels of absurd.

>>383135026
Where is that webm from? Is the "best content in the entire series" DLC I've heard so much about?

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>>383135751
yes. especially with the DLCs.

>>383135752
>940
>mfw
>killed a dude while he was standing still
wow magic sure is usable :^)
now try doing the same shit with faith build and you won't even be able to do that

>>383135752
>using a complete shitter in your example
>940 HP
>dude was still bowing
>>>vg/dsg/
also constant backstepping is a waste of time and will get you killed against anyone with a brain or outside of /dsg/

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>>383135668
>Because it was doing it's own thing instead of MEMBER DARK SOULS 1?

Just fucking DS1 imitation

>Oh God, thread reaching new levels of absurd.

>>383108456
I agree with you anon, Dark Souls 3 is just so fucking bland and uninteresting, literally every single thing in the game has already been done better in DaS 1, DeS or BB.
BB=DaS1>DeS>DaS2>DaS3

>>383136016

>A series has re-occurring enemies
>this is a big deal


3 brought rehashing a previous entry in the series to new levels

>>383108456
I recently finished Lords of the Fallen. DS2 will feel like a masterpiece.

>>383123289
>challenges someone to prove DaS(s)2 has bad LD
>they do it by comparing it to a good level to highlight the flaws
"No stop doing that you're proving me wrong"

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>>383136016
Why das2 was such disappointment compared to the das3 and bloodborne?
It's like developers stopped caring

Is Demon's Souls still worth playing after finishing most Souls games and Bloodborne? How atmospheric is it? Were there many different and beautiful locations?

>>383130539
This

>>383136784
You can finish it in 20 hours. It's short and sweet though a couple of bosses were really difficult for me (maneaters took probably 30 tries). Really consistent throughout and just a plain fun game.

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>>383135752
wow you really showed that 10 vig guy who clearly has never played pvp in his life who's boss
G A R B A G E
A
R
B
A
G
E

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>>383111383
If you haven't played SotFS you haven't actually played DS2

>>383108456
Cuz you're brain damaged faggot?

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>>383136752
Dark Souls 3 was even more disappointing to me, at least 2 did some interesting new things, had actual build and weapon variety, combat wasn't ruined, and it wasn't completely linear. The expansions were also actually good.

>>383108456
>DS2 to be the worst in the series, the level and world design to be horrible also, boss designs and battles to be boring for the most part.

DS3>DS2

>>383136016
this one is right. ds2 feels like a fan game

DS3 >> BB >>> DS >>> DeS >>>>>>>>>>>>> PISS >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SHIT>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> DS2

It's not, though. IMO 3 is the best of the series.

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>>383138843
>Great
BB, DES, DS, DSIII

>Meh
DSII, Lords of the Fallen

>>383133549
>Knowing that the Prepare to Die edition will go on its usual 5$ sale in months
lol, there will NEVER be another Dark Souls 1 sale on steam ever again. If you want to buy DS1 on Steam for a fair price you'll have to wait for a Humble Bundle sale

>>383138843
Heh, how cute, DS3 babby is mad!

>>383121506
>He says this even though Das2 has the most area's
das2 is literally quantity over quality
> and secrets
and yet no secret as good as ash lake or painted world or dragon shrine...
the only secret area being the abyss which, outside of the boss, sucks ass.

It's not really. They're both competing for second to last place.
Namco was a mistake

>>383124247
>kill 4 bosses plus dancer to drop a ladder to lothric castle
you had to kill all lords of cinder anyway, and you can actually just fight dancer at the very beginning.

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>>383111383
You're missing out on perhaps the most early game builds and weapons in the series. DLC are also decently woven into the story and they're straight sequels to the Artorias of the Abyss DLC.

Also Vendrick becomes the best character in Souls, period, but that's just me.

>>383124845
>das2

>>383128612
>Since I only have a ps3
go in order then
Start with Demon's Souls, then Dark Souls, the Dark Souls 2

des2 when

>>383108456
because the challenging parts are all about wierd janky bullshit just like DS1, whereas DS3 is just about dodge timings. It actually feels like an adventure instead of a videogame.