>high end raids from the two biggest MMOs out there >literal

>>382775914
>no skill whatsoever
lol

>think it's a clusterfuck because you don't have required skills of multitasking and situational awareness
>whine about how there's no skill involved

Your prototypical shitter, everyone.

>MMOs
>Skill
Choose one

kill helya prenerf then faggot

>>382775914
>emerald nightmare
>high end raid

Get out.

>>382775914
>Shinryu
>high end raid
LOL
O
L

>>382775914
en was fucking garbage made me unsub

>>382778662
That EN was a complete snoozefest because everyone already outgeared it before it came out caused me to unsub.

>>382778662
Had more fun with mythic en than I did mythic nh

>>382775914
>LFR Emerald nightmare
Lmao

Tomb is actually one of the best raids I've played

>>382776295
WEBM related had 0 skill and was a tideover raid for nighthold. Which turned out to also be terrible so you just wasted 6 months of your life on a big pile of grindy shit :^)

>FF14
>one of the biggest MMOs
literally runescape is bigger, more popular, more content, higher quality.

Just whip out Excel fag, makes shit 10x easier

Man grindy korean mmos make more money than ff14 it's sad LOL

>>382780745
Grindy korean MMOs probably make more money than pretty much all MMOs. Blade and Soul failed on that regard though.

>>382776295
>>382776183

These.

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>>382779541
And also more dead

>>382775914
Second half of that webm isn't even a raid, it's the current main story boss.

>>382779541
i love runescape but it probably isn't bigger
that said runescape has had an unprecedented surge in popularity lately with the rise of oldschool runescape, so "literally runescape is bigger" is a pretty poor insult at this point. Runescape has become extremely successful again.

>>382775914
>raids
>mandatory last boss

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>people keep playing rollercoasters
>sandbox mmos will never be popular

>>382782190
runescape is very popular and also one of the very few well done sandbox games in existence

>No skill involved

wew, back to LFR subhuman

>>382782190
Runescape is one of the best sandbox out there. Try it

>>382775914
>those graphics
lmao

>>382782230
>>382782503
Oh yes, runescape, the game where
>market and price is controlled by developers
>best player-to-world interaction is building your own house in your own pocket dimension
>player vs player conflict is separated in its own zone
It actually has good PvE content, but that doesn't make it a sandbox
Not being a roller coaster doesn't mean it is a sandbox

>>382775914
>MMOs were a mistake.
MMOs were a happy accident for the few who made their millions before facebook came and face raped the internet social market.
Now people don't need to kill 5 bears for bear asses just to chat with others and the genre is slowly bleeding out because the new generation has other internet cancers to waste their lives on so the existing MMOs have to dumb shit down and give free items just to stay afloat with an ageing generation who were unlucky enough to get hooked on this specific type of e-cocaine.

The Free2Play bubble didn't help either.

>>382782678
you have an extremely twisted definition of sandbox games if you don't think Runescape is a sandbox game. Just because you can't build a fucking obnoxious castle out in the wildlands that everyone has to see or kill some dude you meet on the road doesn't mean the games not a sandbox you fucking idiot. Go play BDO.

>>382775914

I agree OP.

I really don't think there's room for another MMO with bar abilities, zergfest raids, etc. How many times do you want to do the same thing with a different skin on it?

I'm totally burned out, perhaps because I'm an old man by /v/ standards (29), but I'm looking for something that gets away from the regular MMO combat if I'm going to pay for it.

>>382775914

>high end raid
>final boss fight

I guess so if you cant beat it

>>382782678
>I never played Runescape, the post
Kys

>>382782190
I wish Mabinogi wasn't dead or that I had someone to play with me because I never played it

>>382775914
>No skill involved
Kid, if you were be in that raid you would die in a second.

>>382782914
>what is Ultima Online
>what is EVE Online
>what is Haven & Hearth

Runecucks should stay on their general on /vg/ and stop shoving their game as something it isn't

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>mmo fags whine that mmos are too easy
>"hardcore" mmo comes out
>everyone quits because it's too hard
MMO players are the shittiest group of people I've ever had the displeasure of dealing with.

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What the HECK is his problem?

>>382783221
>Ultima Online
Dead
>EVE Online
Nice fucking spreadsheet simulator """game"""
>Haven & Hearth
literal fucking garbage since they changed the graphics
good to see you do indeed have awful fucking taste

>>382783292
The environment is why I stopped playing Wildstar, everything is really ugly and makes my eyes hurt.

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>D1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UbniAjavwMo
>D2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s013grY4zRo
>D3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEsqGOHo0nI
>D4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ua_X6HEllEo

Overall 7/10, a pretty good raid.
Can't wait to see the savage mode.

>>382783458
It's literally ratchet and clank, the mmo. It looks fucking disgusting.

>>382783292
Everyone left because of the bad optimization

>>382775914
>Shinryu
>high end raid
It's literally just a story boss.

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>>382783408
>HnH devs pumping more content faster than jagex can ruin their game
>EVE is an actual fun game that people don't play because of a bad meme that got popular
That's fine mate. You don't have to actually like good sandbox games. But don't say stupid shit like "Runescape is a good sandbox game". I think it is a fine PvE focused MMO, has an ok PVP system, but you should give autism spaceships a try to see how free a game can be, HnH is very good even after the graphics update if you take out the bots.

>UO is actually dead and fuck my life

>>382783814
>story boss is harder than both ex primals
The absolute madman.

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>>382775914
(you)

>>382783309
he should go back to dungeoneering

>>382783309
I want to pet him so bad!

>>382783789
mmo players don't actually give that much of a shit about optimization, just look at black desert. Runs like shit and has tons of people playing it. No. People quit because it was too hard. They wiped on the first vet dungeon, called it over tuned, and left. But before they did they made a post about how the crypt keeper's jokes every time you die was hurting their feelings.

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Are you guys enjoying the newest raid?

>>382784278
see
>>382783652

>>382782678
It sounds like you've never played runescape, or at least only played it once many years ago.
Most of that shit is outdated/wrong.

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>>382782678
You quit shortly after the GE got introduced and the wildy got gutted, didn't you?

>>382784497
>Click on the map to up your skills
>Do this 10 hours per day
Literally every Runescape stream

>>382784278
What's the ilvl requirement?

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>>382775914
>don't stand in the fire
>win

Great stuff.

>>382784713
>watching streamers
Cancer.

If you want more exciting combat or less grinding, try RS3.

>>382784713
Sounds a lot like EVE, huh.

>>382775914
Normal Modes of the Raid and 2 beginner Trails do not count as High end raids in FFXIV

>>382784497
And yet people just tell me how wrong I am but won't explain why that is not the case anymore, because Runescape was like that when I stopped playing.

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>>382775914
It's only a clusterfuck to the untrained eye.

>>382780940
How is blade and soul?

>>382784981
Because, at least on RS3
>The trade limits on the G.E. were removed years ago, and jew clans are a thing again
>There have been several world events, as well as other examples of player/world interactions
>the wilderness revival means that if you're an edgy 12 year old there's plenty of people to kill in the wildy now that it has some of the best xp rates, and bounty hunter worlds are a thing and darkscape was a thing

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>>382776183
He is right mmo are fucking low skilled trash games only made for brainlets every wow boss boils down to DONT STAND IN THE FIRE

>>382785296
this is keeping in mind the main focus of runescape is the fact that it's the only MMORPG that's actually an RPG and also the PvM, at least on RS3

>>382785157
Pretty much a cheap version of TERA.

>>382784739
>>382785387
And yet the majority of players can't even do that. MMO players are the absolute bottom of the barrel.

>>382783652

>Can't wait to see the savage mode.

A hint: Neo Exdeath's theme is in the music files.

Also,

>D#

It's V# or O#, don't be retarded. You don't call Gordias floors G#, do you?

>>382780745
Reminder that candy crush makes more in a year than Sony Nintendo and Microsoft's gaming divisions combined.

>>382785920
Got a link to that?

How do you make raids if not through mechanics like this, though?

The only alternative I can think of is a Secret World-esque mystery solving extravaganza, but that would have to have some randomization to it or it would be a breeze for everyone after the first group.

>>382785154
That's not really fair towards GW2, seeing how Tequatl is a world boss and there's no limit on how many players can participate in killing him. There are actual 10 player raids in the game now.

>>382784726
Its like 295 or something

>>382787478
I wasn't shitting on GW2, it's my most played MMO.
What I meant is it's not a clusterfuck if you can tell what you're doing.

>>382785920
Link Neo Exdeath theme fag

It can't be V# because every round will likely have the Letterscape V# format. O# makes more sense

Also he's doing it for free today, what a buttblasted bitch.

>>382784278
>Coil 1
>mini-dungeons with boss fights

>Gordias
>Boss fights with token trash

>Deltascape
>4 trial fights fuck off

>>382790184
Turn 1 was a mini-dungeon,
T2,4, and 5 were all just bosses.
And T3 was a joke that they've never repeated because it's pointless.

>play weeb sword unfolding job in Omega
>the AST somehow manages to pull an arrow before every pull and sticks it on me
I have a feeling i'm being patronized

>>382790472
I had fun with the jumping puzzle. I would not play it again though.

>>382783309
He would've wind up as mobage trash that would get shut down in a year.

Dungeon 3 never ever ;_;

>>382784278
>it's the tournament arc

I tried playing Tree of Savior recently and I thought it was absolute shit.

Guess I'm burned out on MMOs.

>>382775914
I wish I could stay interested in FFXIV. I love everything about the game but the combat makes me fall asleep by the time I hit 30 on a job im just so tired

>>382785387
>>382785664
lol. Go ahead and try ToS on *normal* and come back to say that again

>>382790472
T2 was a boss rush dungeon. 4 didn't even have a boss

>>382775914
I think you mostly mean "MMOs with PvE focus were a mistake".
When PvE is mostly there to gear you up for PvP, then it's a good MMO.

>>382782190
BDO and EVE are pretty popular though.

>>382791758
ToS on normal is completely retard proof
>Hide behind pillar
>Press button when bar is full
>Kill adds dont stand in water
>Dont stand in the circles
>Dont stand in circles, stack for arrow
>No mechanics
>Dont race mix, jump in the whole when you are a bomb
>Run away from boss, no mechanics
>Stand in fires on purpose
90% of these dont even kill you if you ignore

Do I have to wait for the weekend to do synched Second Coil? There aren't enough people it seems.

>>382791930
Play a real PvP game instead of a MMO.

>>382775914

Shinryu has a few shitter filters, though.

>proximity AoEs that you can't entirely escape from; fucked if the healers don't make sure that everybody is ready for them
>relatively strict DPS check add phase
>don't play tank, but given that the tanks went down in phase 2 and the boss started nailing me instead, I'm guessing that there's a rough tank buster somewhere in there

Shinryu tends to be a wipe fest. I don't blame the players who find themselves in there on a roulette and promptly leave after the first wipe.

>>382792121
Make a PF and say you're new.
Hopefully people are still looking for bonus runs.

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>memorizing scripted fights with an AI
>skill
???

>>382791930
Nah after getting a taste of gearing up in PVP for PVP in Warhammer Online I'm never going back.

Let me blow your mind.

If you're not familiar with a game, it looks like a clusterfuck.

>>382792350
You still have to execute.

>>382792229
don't forget, if the tank thinks he's a dps, the big add will ravage your dps and healers with Death Sentence, and if the tank pulls everything to the same place as people on the 3rd set of bomb you'll be cleaved by 400 aoes

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>>382775914
>Shinryu
>High end raid

It's just the last available story fight.

And i refuse to call 8-mans raids.

>>382792229
>proximity AoEs that you can't entirely escape from; fucked if the healers don't make sure that everybody is ready for them
Which? I can't think of anything I couldn't dodge. I only did it once though.

>>382792374
>WAR was the greatest MMO of all time
>They rushed it out the door to compete with WotLK and killed it
T1 sieges and T2 murderball is literally the most fun in an MMO I have ever had.

Not to mention all the hidden shit out the in world to discover for your Tome. Hell all MMOs should flat out copy the Tome.

>>382783789
THIS

I loved the game, but optimization issues were unbearable

Am I the olny one who likes omega gear sets?

>>382779364
>WEBM related had 0 skill and was a tideover raid for nighthold. Which turned out to also be terrible so you just wasted 6 months of your life on a big pile of grindy shit :^)
Spotted the LFR shitter

>>382793368
Yes they're awful. I don't want to look like a Samurai.

>"le PVE in MMOs is so easy XDXD just dont stand in fire and you win XDXD"
>t. LFR/normal raiding scrub who doesn't even know what WarcraftLogs.com is, let alone parses well on it

From a purely individual point of view, high-end raiding isn't the toughest thing in the world if you do your research and can execute, but difficulty comes from 20 people simultaneously performing at a near-perfect level while flawlessly performing fight mechanics and thinking/reacting on the fly.
As much as raiding (and video games in general) is NOT a sport, you can compare it to a team sport in these ways. Sure, you might be able to stand alone on your local basketball court and sink 3-point shots all day long, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be that simple in a challenging game.

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this is the face of a psychotic serial killer, lets be real.

>>382794439
I'm sure final boss of the final tier will be Alpha and Omega.

>tfw omega gear makes you look like a dildo
I apologize for complaining about 15 flavors of steampunk during Alexander

>>382792350
guitar hero is nothing but memorizing scripted button presses yet people can't complete through the fire and flames on hardest difficulty

>>382775914
EN was trash, cent was a better boss, that said, there were still mechanics in the last fight despite how bad it looked.

>>382775914
GW2 did raids done right. The dps check is not as tight but the mechanics, execution and spatial awareness is marginally more complex than any shit here.

Most of this shit have no environmental mechanics just spam your rotation.

>>382783292
We quit because of the terrible server performance, number of bugs, MALGRAVE FUCKING TRAIL (and all of the other godshite trials), and generally because it wasn't very fun at the end of the day.

>>382775914
>All that unnecessary shit on the xiv UI
It hurts

>>382783925
>Tfw Shinryu/Ex primals are so easy that the actual boss you fight is your dumbass party

>>382795263
Agree, if only they would have been in game earlier

>>382795513
The only unnecessary things on the xiv one is the journal list that you shouldn't have open and the enormous chat window because this person must play on a Gameboy.

>>382794208
This guy gets it.

MMOs raiding are fundamentally high end team sports. With more complexity than pracitcally any other sport or competitive activity. I have more respect for a well known raider than any other professional athlete.

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>wildstar has the best raids of any current mmo
>it's ded

>>382786057
Sure but that doesn't mean the Candy Crush movie is gonna be any good

>>382795935
I couldn't find any class that was fun.

>>382783652
>D2
Perfect.

>>382796038
They're all fun for different reasons.

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/334166-Regarding-Balance-Adjustments-in-4.01-and-4.05?p=4263080#post4263080
are you ready to get out of the shed fellow scholars?

>>382795914
>I have more respect for a well known raider than any other professional athlete
Then you are an idiot.

>>382796209
Nah, there's no way they would nerf AST at this point, only buff it more, so there's no need for SCH.

>>382792094
Then explain how I keep getting people who die within seconds of the fight starting?

>>382793368
DRG and NIN sets look alright. I'm not too fond of the rest.

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So is the entire plot for omega gonna be Greatest Warrior: Final Fantasy edition?

>>382785920
when the fuck will we ever get golbez and the four fiends. Don't get me wrong I loved calcabrina but the fact the fight is a fuckin joke not even remotely comparable to original really makes me salty, oh ya it also transitions into the shitty hw boss music instead of a redone fiv boss theme so fuck you

>>382796209
Thankfully SCH's problem is purely a number thing, meaning it can be fixed. Take MCH though, for example, and no amount of number changes will make up for the lack of usable combat skills you get.

They make them easy so that people don't get demoralized and quit the game because they can't get their item fix. It's all about keeping those subs.

>>382796421
Because you have DPS with sub 900 ilevel and thusly shit HP?

We Yolo ran through normal last week and our DPS were eating meatballs off the first boss and walking away fine.

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>>382775914
>>382785387
>oversimplify game mechanics as argument
i can do that too!
pic related is you and the rest of /v/ tbqh

>>382797348
Oh that explains it, your group was overgeared as fuck and ignored all the mechanics.

>>382795815
So the same as playing DF Susano EX

I thought you fags say SCH healing got cucked but I saw one pull 7k hps in Susan EX

>>382797676
Anon everyone who plays the game casually is overgeared for Normal.

Even if you have never set foot in a single mythic raid you should be 905-910+ before this raid tier came out.

Titanforging, your weapon, and legendaries inflate ilevel so much its ridiculous.

>>382798054
Do you mean "endlessly playing mythic+ for the free raid gear?"

>>382794208

>As much as raiding (and video games in general) is NOT a sport

This autistic aversion to calling vidya sports is so retarded.

"Sporting" is a challenging activity that you do for fun. That's why football, hunting, canoeing, and chess are all considered sports. Sports can be cooperative or competitive, physical or mental, with any number of participants. The presence of a challenge with fun being the primary end goal is what defines a sport.

The only reason to exclude videogames from this category is that the term "sport" has some prestige around it, and there seems to be this desperate effort among some people to do anything that they can to make sure that games aren't treated as anything more than toys for ten year olds, because they're scared of being branded as losers or some stupid shit. It's the same mentality that leads people to attempt to dismiss the artistic elements of games. Look at your own wording.

>As much as raiding (and video games in general) is NOT a sport

AKA

>Look! I'm showing that I don't believe that there's anything of merit here! Please please please don't see me as a loser!

Fucking pathetic signalling going on there.

>>382798169
Mythic+ gives dogshit gear outside the weekly chest.

Even +15's give you shit on par with ToS Normal.

>>382797956
Their healing didn't get worse, their dps did. They just actually have to think about shielding and use some of their 17 million mp free heals instead of deploying crit adlo and then letting Eos do everything while they play pretend

>>382797956
It got cucked because they can't face roll it anymore. They're too use to being lazy ass hats.

>>382798382
Sports cannot have luck elements.

RNG on damage numbers prohibits some games from being sports. FGs can be sports tho. LoL cannot.

>>382783909
>shilling eve online

is there anything actually good to do in that game? I played that game for years and I have yet to have an inkling of fun. All the """"fun""" things take hours to do and are over crowded as shit.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8PbJwplkmE
>mfw
God damn I am glad that they're finally acknowledging that there's other good songs in V's soundtrack than Battle on the Big Bridge.

>>382783789
I don't see this mentioned often enough. This was literally the most unoptimized piece of shit game I've ever seen. Literally their UI "addons" would cause a slideshow.

>>382798783

>Sports cannot have luck elements.

Because the waters are so predictable, right? The gun can't malfunction? There can't be a hole in the ground that you couldn't possibly see? You can't have some shit going on with your body that you don't know about?

That's a really weak excuse. Almost ever sport has a strong element of luck. Overcoming poor luck is a skill.

>>382798890
>Battle on the Big Bridge

So seeing how you fight fucking ExDeath for O4, it's a given we'll be going up against Greg at some point, right?

>>382799351
They reused Greg's big keep mechanics in a solo duty, so it's unlikely unless they revamp his fight, which even more unlikely

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>>382785387
>FPS are fucking low skilled trash games all matches boiled down to PUT THE GUY IN YOUR CROSSHAIRS

>plataformers are fucking low skilled trash games all the levels boil down to DONT FALL OFF THE PLATAFORMS

>action games are fucking low skilled trash games all the fights boil down to PRESS X TO WIN

>fighting games are fucking low skilled trash games all matches boil down to DO YOUR COMBO

see I can shit post too

>>382799526
Slashy AoE and dragon heads are common to katana using NPCs in general.

>>382799294
>The gun can't malfunction
Nigger guns dont break due to luck

>>382785664
>Be caster
>Try to cast a spell
>Take 2.5 seconds to cast your quickest
>Try to cast the followup of that spell
>Area suddenly appears on you
>Fuck, it's halfway there, I might have enough time to cast and get out
>No, you havent
Doing magic in this game takes way too long, I blame that

I raided in WoW from the early days of Molten Core until we killed Arthas in Icecrown and I had a lot of fun with it throughout the years.

I don't feel like playing it again but I can confidently say I've not enjoyed a video game more.
The game itself was fun but the social aspect was important too.

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the MOST IMPORTANT part of the patch

now I can actually get some wins in

>>382799940
TWO POINT FIVE makes casting harder.

>>382799940
That's one of the reasons I switched to SAM from BLM in SB. Tired of having to learn the entire fight in and out to avoid getting cucked by aoe circles over and over. Bonuses being that I don't need end of expansion levels of stats to make the class feel great.

>>382800236
Cool. I'll still be botting them.

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>Tam-Tara Deepcroft hard
Will there be quests like this?
That was just the right amount of spooky.

>>382776295
>practically everyone can do these
yeah they're real fucking challenging man

literally the only thing that matters is levels and equipments. if it was skill you could do it at half the required level.

>>382800131
The social aspect was the only thing keeping me going when grinding against retarded bosses and respawning trash.
Once people started leaving WoW and they introduced heroic raids as a button press I was done.

>>382775914
>Shinryu
>high end raid
Fun fight though

>>382800397
There's Deep Dungeon

>>382799940
>hurr I'm gonna be a fucking retard and put deeps over staying alive
No, blame yourself.

>>382800236
GET FUCKED SHITTERS

>>382799294
Yes, and a lightning could split you in half. Happened many times in soccer. That doesnt mean storms are a rng element on soccer.

LOL has rng as part of the game itself. As in every fucking hit you do RNG is involved.

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>>382795914
>more complexity

it's memorizing a fucking dance routine you goddamn neckbeard lmao, there's little to no variability involved

how is that anything like fucking sports?

>>382799735
But youre wrong

How do you make skill-based MMO gameplay?

Remember, having the slow toolbar and cooldown based gameplay of WoW and all its clones is to compensate for lag for people across the world.

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>>382800397
She's not dead yet.

>>382800397
Will there be more spooky dungeons like this? I thought I remembered one or two, but that one's probably the best chain of quests for spooky.

Also, this NnR01wRDDl8

>>382795914
goddamn what a faggot

I bet you got swirlied in high school

>>382800531
>Memorize ice skating performance. How is that a fucking sport?

>>382800614
>>382800397
I meant this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnR01wRDDl8

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>it was just straight up exdeath

are they out of ideas?

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>>382775914
>EN
>High end raid
>Shinryu
>HIGH END RAID

>>382800594
That shit was so stupid. Same with the Sultana not being dead.

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>>382800696
>it was just straight up exdeath
Literally nothing wrong with that. Best FF villain hands down.

>>382800760
Edda did die though.
She got necromanced.

>>382800594
She is dead. Nybeth revived her after she fell.

>>382800554
Truthfully the simplified no-collision gameplay in WoW and FFXIV is only necessary for field zones, and zone combat is increasingly irrelevant in these games. Not to mention in SB on most servers they instanced the fuckers into having like 30 people anyways, so they were about as populated as Destiny.

>>382799940
it acutally takes 2 seconds, if you startmoving in the last .5 seconds of a cast, it will complete anyways

>>382800630
its not, and neither is playing videogames nerd

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>>382775914
I played WoW for a solid 3 years or so when I was in my twenties. The last expansion I played was Lich King. I only ever maxed out on character, my main, an undead shadow priest.

I have to say, in retrospect, for the amount of money I paid. It was definitely not worth it. But I still had fun playing with my friends and doing PUGs and all that shit. At this point in my life even though I have more money I wouldn't pay for a sub MMO on principle. But the gameplay is really shit so it's not an issue for me; I just don't play them

If they make a really good MMO someday, I'll be torn. But sub games are seriously some bullshit. At $15/mo a year of a game is $180. Like holy shit. And it doesn't even matter if you're logged in either.

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>>382800760
If you thought anyone who 'died' in 2.5 was actually dead than I don't know what to tell you

>>382801302
I thought the writers would be better than the Blizzard ones.

>>382800236
Jokes on you my plan was to autorun into the enemy team over and over to get them battle highs so they can win faster

This does nothing to change my plans

>>382800696
>Calibrina fight
>has the music
it's like the ultimate fanservice mmo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ra2LLKa0Fsk

>>382800526

>moving the goalposts
>trying to use one rare occurrence to make it sound as if all unpredictable occurrence are equally uncommon and can't be considered an inherent part of the activity; completely dishonest

If anything, videogames are far less random than athletic sports. Randomization algorithms are one of the big challenges of computer science; as things stand, we can't get close to creating anything as random as an uncontrolled environment (such as barreling down a river).

>>382775914
Shinryu in FFXIV wrecks people left and right since it's a litmus test of all the major boss mechanics from the past four years of development. Even now it keeps people from beating the main story, since they suck and lack skill and basic abilities like spatial awareness.

But hey, keep on cherry picking for low-tier bait. Here's your (you) to screencap for your epic maymay folder

>>382776295
>Have these numbers.
>Don't stand in the circle.
>Press the button and aim it at the thing with too much health or the thing with not enough health.
Skill and situational awareness, apparently.

>>382801702
>sports
>put the ball in the goal
>1 point

>videogames
>put the ball in the goal
>from 0.8 to 1 point depending on how the fuck the rng goes

If the game is based on rng mechanics, its not a sport.

STOP IDLING NEAR MSQ NPCS YOU FUCKS

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>>382775914
Easiest way to troll FFXIV spergs:

>casually suggest that the game would be infinitely better as a single player experience, akin to FFXII

Because it would be. Literally no one who wishes to be a fully-functioning, non-loser human being in society has time for MMOs

>>382796428
DRG armor is always great

>>382793368
I wanted an onmyouji set for casters instead I got shogun armor

>>382775914
>>literal clusterfucks with no skill involved whatsoever

Link your cutting edge for gul'dan please.

Oh, that's right. Thought so.

>>382802809

Your body, the bodies of your opponents, the environment (i.e. the wind), and a near infinite number of other factors are the damn RNG, and are far more severe than anything that might be present in FFXIV. The laws of physics are the laws of physical sports.

You must realize how flimsy the ground that you're standing on is if you're trying to use hyperbole to make a point about what's standard (a point that was fabricated from nothing to begin with). Why do you keep trying to push it?

So is every post with "MMO" in it the stealth FF14 thread?

Also
>lost a Wind-up Exdeath with a 94 roll
fuck you

>tfw sch used to be the shitter carry healer
>tfw in SB the worse your party is the worse you will perform as a SCH

Out of all of the changes this one hurts the most. Just casting broil and healing with ogcds i STILL OoM. Its my favorite healer so I'm not jumping off like the bandwagoners but I fail how to do intense healing and dpsing while keeping my resources. If I have to res and lucid is on cd its

O V E R
V
E
R

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>>382775914
>>382785387
>>382776407


>no skill involved whatsoever
go ahead and post your glad titles and mythic Aotc. oh wait...

>>382803809
>are far more severe than anything that might be present in FFXIV.
Have you seen how ridiculous the DPS variation from direct hit, crit, and AST card pulls is

>>382800696
>Omega is just re-using characters from old FFs because he has no imagination
Is it an allegory for Yoshida?

>>382803809
>Your body, the bodies of your opponents are rng
No, pretty sure they trained and they know their limits and expected results.

Imagine if for every point in basket they give you from 70% to 100% points according to a machine. No one would play that shit.

>>382804286
>muh glad titles
step one: roll the FOTM class
step two: roll the FOMT comp
step three: download a bunch of mods for callouts
Congratulations you're now a gladiator

>>382800531
>it's memorizing a fucking dance routine you goddamn neckbeard lmao

Memorizing how a mechanic works isn't the same as executing it every time. There is variance in both mechanics and how players deal with them.

E.g. Star augur Etraeus signature mechanic is marking progressively larger portions of your raid with pairs of marks that need to be moved on top of each other, touching any non matching mark is an instant wipe. The way you deal with the mechanic is the same (you move to a matching player if you get marked) but how you actually execute that, especially when it is overlapping with other mechanics, depends on the player's situational awareness.

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I'm glad I kept this image over the years.

>MMO PVE
>skill

lmaaaaooooo

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>>382800696
>next batch of deltascape bosses will be from other SE games
>after that we get to fight bosses from other companies
>secret boss after omega will be yoshida himself and before every major aoe or tankbuster he will say "please look forward to it"

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>Get targeted by dice and SEAS PART FOR WE ALONE
So I just accept death or can I actually do something

>>382805263
>dev fight
No lie I would be hyped
>Soken with the AoEs
>Koji fox's localization so bad it stuns you
>phase change is Matsuda going fucking nuts

>>382805131
spoken like someone who has never been above 2k in 3v3. lmao

>>382805263
Bosses from other SE titles would be awesome.

>The Conqueror from Last Remnant
>Lezard or Loki from Valkyrie Profile
>Dauragon C. FUCKING Mikado from The Bouncer

>>382805513
Pop your anti-knockback (you did bring surecast right) or gapcloser if you're a melee class

>>382775914
>>382776183
>people who play the game 24/7 have still yet to finish the raid on hardest difficulty
>no skill involved
lol

>Xavius
>High End

Nice bait

>>382805819
Ah surecast, I was bringing rescue to pull people in that had no chance of making it

>>382804862

>No, pretty sure they trained and they know their limits and expected results.

If this were the case, no professional athlete would ever get injured doing basic shit. Injuries are routine occurrences for athletes, even before you take into account things like the two players moving in an UNLUCKY manner.

From hyperbole to trying to ignore injuries to ignoring every point that I've made about shit like the river and the wind. Face it, your premise for denying vidya as sports has no grounds.

>>382801221
>But sub games are seriously some bullshit. At $15/mo a year of a game is $180
4u
I'm no longer sub because the game is boring as shit now, but when it was still new to me, I easily invested enough hours to make $15 worth it. Not sure why you're acting like it's objectively not worth the money for anyone.

does secret world legends have raids?

>>382805513
stand with the tank, sus has no cleaves except the first phase

that way you're still lining it up straught for everyone and other people can come quick enough

>>382801221

Subs >>> FTP
FTP = P2W
Subs allow devs to continuously maintain and develop the game without locking progression behind additional paywalls that can easily add up to more than a subscription fee.

>>382796612
I was this upset when the bombing mission music didn't start playing over Guard Scorpion.

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>>382796612
>fight the four fiends like you fight Brawler, Blaster, Swindler and Vortexer
>their Brute Justice is Geryon

>>382775914
>800000 and 500000 damage ticks
>DPS casually tanks them
Modern WoW is really disgusting.

>>382807478
>arbitrary number and arbitrary number
Who cares?

>>382806164
Except the rng/luck is not in the rules itself. Sure, a disgrace can happen (eg lightning bolt on a soccer match) or an injured athlete. But no sport is rigged by a rng simulator from a machine giving random amounts of points to the teams.

While luck/disgraces can happen, they are not part of the sport itself. They just happen and you cant do nothing about it. Meanwhile RNG IS PART OF CERTAIN VIDEOGAMES.

Games with rng damage numbers cannot be sport.

>>382807601
Anything that isn't "that guy", you disgusting WoWdrone.

Raiding was only put into MMOs to give a minority of 'hardcore' players something to do. It was never supposed to be the core gameplay.

>>382807673
don't play WoW and you didn't make an argument. Are you tacitly admitting that you have no real argument?

>>382805672
There's a reason WoW pvp didn't take off as a huge esport, it's because it's trash.2k isn't hard to get, moron.

>>382808363
>idiot can't tell the difference between opinions and arguments
Why are you trying so hard to fit? Just do us a favor and go back to reddit.

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>>382805863
>grinding
>skill
MMORPGs are just ego massagers for people who are actually bad at video-games. It's like being proud of swimming in a pool of shit - just because you're one of the few idiots willing to do it, doesn't means you're special in any positive way.

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>>382808812
>ask why something matters
>fuck you drone
>why does it matter
>fuck you reddit
I mean, if you don't have any actual reason you can give me you can just say. Calling me names only makes clear that you don't have a reason while also making you look like a faggot.
see chart

>>382808968
>shit analogy
never change /v/

>>382808093
It's something you can only find in MMOs, co-op in other games doesn't approach the scale of raiding. What would you rather have the core gameplay be? "The leveling-experience" isn't a thing anymore.

>>382809098
Is more than obvious why retardedly high numbers are disgusting, you retarded memer.

>>382808968
>grinding
>WoW
Please explain to me the grinding involved in Mythic raiding

>>382809125
Yeah, I know. Swimming in shit is a more pleasant experience than playing MMORPGs.

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>>382809192
>the reason is obvious but I won't tell you
>also u r dum
see
> Calling me names only makes clear that you don't have a reason while also making you look like a faggot.
It's kind of pathetic. It's obvious to everyone when someone just resorts to calling someone names over and over without ever making an argument. You could have just not responded if you couldn't come up with some reason.

>"high-end"
>posts a normal fight from wow and a story fight from XIV, both of which are designed for casual players to be able to clear after a few tries with a PUG

????

>>382809390
You type like an idiot and still play WoW, so why bother? At best I'm going to get a "I was just pretending to be retarded".

BTW, this is my last (you) to your "keep asking why like a 8yo".

>>382809550
>designed for casual players to be able to clear after a few tries with a PUG
Isn't that [current year] MMORPG "high-end"?

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>>382809570
>ur so dumb I don't need reasons
alright

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>>382798890
>just finished my four job fiesta
>hear about raid being ffv themed
>mfw this music
ffv has some really good tracks
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s0QI9xSqHmQ
such a good game, glad its getting some love

STOP DDOSING US BLIZZARD

GODDAMN FUCKING JEWS

>>382809550
Shinryu is harder than Lakshmi ex

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(((ddos))) attacks are not real. SE is just cheap.

Are we getting ddos again?
I got kicked out of my raid

>>382809192
I have to agree with this. Just fucking scale the numbers down so it doesn't clutter the damn screen. I don't need the game giving me 968734978 on my screen constantly just to tell me I'm a "super badass". Just keep the numbers low and concise.

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>>382775914
>Xavius
Xavius was a fucking joke after Cenarius, that fight was one of the few in EN worth mentioning. You're welcome to look at ToV, just about any mythic Nighthold boss, or even better anything new brought to the table with Tomb, and I'm sure you'll rethink your opinion. WoW is absolute shit, but its raids are still very enjoyable for the most part.
Someone please save me from this game.

>>382800594
>>382800662
Holy shit
Guess it's time to start potd

>>382809125
it's usually a food analogy so i was pleased to read this.

>>382810369
I'm pretty sure "shit" counts as food when we are talking about modern MMO players.

>>382809208
>grind raidfinder raids for titanforged
>grind raidfinder raids for legendaries
>grind normal raids for titanforged
>grind normal raids for legendaries
>grind heroic raids for titanforged
>grind heroic raids for legendaries
>grind mythic dungeons for legendaries
>grind shitty daily quests for artifact power
>grind rep for loot boxes

>>382798054
I got AotC Guldan and ended last tier with 907 ilvl.

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wtf i love 4 eared cats now

MMOs are ded

No more golden age 2004-2008

>>382811072
>AotC
Heroic is just old normal. They literally sell runs for heroic current content for near trivial amounts of gold.

>>382810509
roasted

>>382811323
I've realized something. I enjoy seeing this shit on other PC, but not mine.

>>382809208
>grind levels
>grind reps to buy items to go into dungeons
>grind dungeons to do raid
>grind raids to do raid on hard
>grind raid on hard to do raid on mythic
mind you i don't know shit about legion but the same shit as every other expansion since they added this bullshit of hard modes

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>>382810263
So much shit that could go wrong in Nighthold.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIs-LTos3GI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgbORMIpBwk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rYNrx7N_E4


Just cause your guild to collapse, then you're free.

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>>382811323
Who doesn't?

>>382808754
the reason being esports is a trash meme perpetuated by teenagers who only play cheap FPS games and babbys first free to play MOBA

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>Get this secret rare card
>Nigga got 14th fucking stacks of vulnerability on the Catastrophe fight

>>382791758
but he's fucking right dude
>raid leader explains every phase of the boss to retards who can't read a dungeon guide or watch a video beforehand
>marks safe spots and danger spots with those lights
>makes sure retards have GTFO and DBM
>retards still die even after several tries
there's nothing more anyone can do

>>382783292
>Wildstar
>Hard

It was tedious as fuck and had a high entry barrier.

>>382811323
Can't believe this dude does art for Last Embryo

>>382812334
>dude

>>382812292
>It was tedious as fuck
Just like FFXIV and WoW.

The Shinryu fight is literally a story fight, it's not a raid.

>>382812456
yes, and? Want me to say dudette?

>>382811323
Cringe.

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>>382775914
>no skill whatsoever

>>382811695
I've been playing with this core of players since WoTLK, I couldn't do this to them. We've even had meetups, I'm sure my raid leader would come to my house to make sure I haven't killed myself he's done it before.

>>382783292
There's a difference between "hard" and "tedious".

PvP is Hard. Because players are smart. Players learn. Players adapt and come up with new techniques. Players have theory of mind, so they know that you know things.

PvE, in any game, cannot be hard for this reason. Raids in WoW, FFXIV, WS, etc, ALL just boil down to trial and error. Like Monster Hunter, Dark Souls, etc. You walk in, get killed, learn from it, and try again. Over and over until you learn the choreography of the fight. Then you move on to the next fight.

Forever. That is tedious. Even the dumbest retard can eventually learn to dodge when they see this tell or that particle effect.

>>382812750
chick is usually used in place of dude when talking about females

>>382812292
How was it tedious? Wildstar is the most fun mmo I've played, nothing in ffxiv or wow has matched it's group content.

>>382812876
I still meet IRL some of the people I used to play during vanilla, TBC and WotLK. Just quit the game, paying a month subscription and a yearly expansion for a chat room is retarded, Anon.

>>382812886
>pvpfag
Your opinion couldn't be any more worthless.

>>382795043
Guitar hero is also about coordination and the memorization is HARD. Remembering thousands of button presses in sequence is HARD. Remembering to dodge when the boss yells their warning line, or to not stand in the red danger ring signifying damage on the ground, is not the same thing and you know it.

In Guitar Hero, you have to remember a lot, sure, but you also have to train up your hand-eye coordination and your reading speed to be able to keep up with the notes flying by and translate that into hand movements.

WASD + Mouse and just running around mashing your usual 12345 combo is not the same level of skill.

>>382813176
>hating on pvp
pleb

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>>382812886
>WoW pvp players are smart

>>382792025
BDO is hardly a sandbox senpai

>>382813264
top pvp players in WoW are also all capable of clearing any difficulty of endgame content

top end pve players in WoW are not also top end pvp players vice versa

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>>382813046
The attunement process. It's bad enough getting a guild together with the right gear and right consumables to show up on time. Then you add in a process that everyone in the group has to do just to enter and it's a disaster.

>>382813245
I don't hate on player vs player concept, I hate mmo pvp and the people who play it.

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>>382812876
Then just tell them you're not interested in spending that much time in the game anymore, if you've played wow with them for nearly 10 years they will understand.

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>>382813176
Go ahead and prove it.
Surely you can refute my point, casual baby.

>>382813264
They used to be:
https://youtu.be/Gy8UZR72o9c

That guy, in a tournament, monitored two enemy players at the same time, predicting their reactions and positioning himself and using his abilities to the fullest to get a 1v2 kill when virtually everyone else would've died.

Last time I tried WoW, at Legion launch, pvp was slow and boring, and there were so few dynamic abilities left in the game that it was just people spamming their PvE rotations on eachother.

Nonetheless, WoW PvPers are, and will always be, smarter than WoW PvErs. Just because people are harder opponents than AI.

>>382812867
>Write macro for you highest dps rotation
>Mash 1 as you look around and make sure you're not standing in the bad
>Mash 1 at the adds as they show up

?????

The first tier was pretty damn underwhelming.

Also, how to deal with ice in O4? I get frozen no matter what I do.

>>382813498
But muh hardcore mmo where you have to prove you are true hardcore no-life meganerd by doing tedious tasks until you can do stuff that's almost fun.

Muh casuals get out REEEE.

>>382813473
>top pvp players in WoW are also all capable of clearing pve content for retards, "gurl gamerz" and housewives
Whoa, now these are l33t skillz!

>>382813585
>WoW PvPers are, and will always be, smarter than WoW PvErs
See above.

You fags are literally proud of "wining" the special Olympics.

>>382775914
Melee have it easy as fuck in legion

BREAKING NEWS

>>382813498
>I didn't really play this part of the game but I'll repeat what I've heard
Attunement wasn't tedious.
>b-but look at this pic
The only parts of attunement that couldn't be done quickly was the rep grind, the dungeons and the world bosses. Combined that's not even a week.

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>>382813712
>You fags are literally proud of "wining" the special Olympics.
Who said we were proud?
You're assuming. You're not responding to any argument I'm making. Instead you have a strawman in your head that you're attacking while quoting me.
Pathetic.

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Even a shitpost thread gets into an actual dosified FFXIV discussion

This is truly the best MMORPG of our time

>>382775914
>w-w-why do bosses have add phases

>>382813707
>WHAAAA I HAVE TO PLAY THE GAME
Eventually they listened to people like you and practically removed attunement as well as adding an item that skips what little of it was left.

>>382810139
>>382810550

Neo Exdeath is pretty much confirmed for Savage-exclusive phase of V4 already thanks to datamining.

Eliminating both Exdeath and Shinryu, who were canidates for V8 and V11, this early in the game makes for MORE speculation fodder though, not less, because they were both pretty much a given to show up and now the table has been shaken up.

Here's some options we're looking at now:

>The next tier is based on a different game than FFV

>One of the next tiers has boss fights against heroes(FFV party?) rather than villains, as per Omega's ponderings

>The boss of the next tier is Necrophobe, with Gilgamesh making an appearance as in the FFV battle, possibly being a boss himself earlier in the tier

Yes I fucking copypasted this from the other thread that got deleted, fuck off mods we will discuss FF14 on /v/ whether you like it or not.

>>382813874
>Who said we were proud?
Anyone saying the play MMOs for the PvP. They've been the laughingstock of /v/ (and most places that aren't a MMORPG circlejerk) since forever.

>>382813498
Too bad the lengthy attunement was only to mask the complete lack of content and updates.

>>382775914
what the hell is wrong with that ui

>>382814014
>>The next tier is based on a different game than FFV
Wasn't this obvious from the start?

>>382814140
>WE WANT ANOTHER RAID
>ok but have you finished the ones already in the game?
>NO BUT WE WANT ANOTHER ONE REEEEEEE
I hate mmo players so goddamn much.

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>>382811695
HOLY SHIT I'M GLAD I LEFT WHEN I DID

>>382813886
It's fun to see WoWfags and XIVfags team up to BTFO shitposters.

>>382814338
To be fair, the current MMO playerbase are "give me welfare gear to jump straight into the last released content" WoW players.

>gear progression in pvp
Why do mmos keep doing this?

>>382814482
>gear affects minigames too
It should be obvious.

>>382813886
I think it's more that actual FFXIV threads can be randomly taken down so these are better places for talking about the game. More stable.

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>>382814380
The best part, it's not even hard to avoid those mechanics but if one person brainfarts a mechanic and it's almost certainly a wipe.

If you've ever hated a guy in your guild for being bad at mechanics in the past, it got even worse here.

>>382809208
b8

>>382814593
I've been posting on daily thread, they are up 24/7 and i've seen one getting deleted

it has been like this for the past 40 days

XIV is unstoppable

>>382800436
>what is a dps check

>>382811516
>AotC

Meant Cutting Edge, my bad. But yeah, some people in my raid were at like 919 while me and a few others around 905-907. And I was in atleast 90% of the raids and 100% on all bosses I needed loot from.

>>382814482
FF14 just did away with this

based FF14

>everyone has fixed stats
>rewards are purely cosmetic
>can gain large amounts of pve experience by playing pvp
it's fucking perfect

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>>382814721
Just as keikaku.

>>382814482
Yeah, let's hear your amazing idea what else are they supposed to do, retard. Please DO try to make it not sound retarded.

Oh, you can't say anything? Then fuck off.

>>382814721
>I've been posting on daily thread, they are up 24/7 and i've seen one getting deleted
make one now

they'll get deleted until around 2-3am Euro time

>>382814846
to be fair you didn't let him reply you shut him down.

>>382814014
Neo Shinryu would be possible.

>>382814801
>tab target pvp
No thanks.
>>382814846
I don't need to come up with any ideas, other games already have. Stats are normalized, gear is just cosmetic. Pets n shit.
Having pvp gear with stats needs to fucking die. There no worse feeling than when you out play someone but lose because their gear is just better and vise versa.

>>382814894
here's one:

>>382814003

>>382814801
>can gain large amounts of pve experience by playing pvp
they just adjusted the amount though
hell knows if they nerfed it, everyone's playing Omega

Was Frontlines nerfed for EXP? Im getting mixed answers

>>382775914
>shinryu is highend raiding
Nigger kill yourself.

>>382815146
>>382815162
yes, it was nerfed, but not by much

at lvl 69 I was getting 800k before no matter what and now I get 600k for a loss. Still 800k for a win

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>DUDE SAMURAI LMAO
*makes every raid armor look like SAM*

>>382796612
Doesn't it play the ff3 boss remix music?

I can't actually check, but I'm pretty sure.

Not that it's any better but I really liked that one.

>>382815162
You now get less exp when you lose. Winning nets you the same exp as before.

>>382815162
Win is same as before, loss is loss.

>>382815280
>>382815305
>>382815328
thanks thats not that bad