Why hasn't the stylish action genre surpassed this yet?

it has

cause platinum games likes their dial a combo slomo dodge bullshit and kamiya is a hack

>>382701713
with?
dont you dare say nier

DMC3>Bayo=DMC4>Ninja Gaiden Black> Bayo2>DMC1>>>DMC2>>>>>>a tripfags turd>>>DmC

Prove me wrong

>>382702151
I never understood the appeal of combos or attacks that just look different and don't have any real tactical value.

Basically a beat em up needs
*a launcher
*a basic combo that comes out fast
*a high reward high risk combo with a big pay off on the last hit
*a combo with really good aoe for hitting multiple guys
*a small gap closer
*a big gap closer
*a big burst attack
*a charge up
*a projectile, maybe a fast and a slow one
*air variants of the above

Having 5+ moves redudant versions of each of the above doesn't add much and chews through the budget.

>>382702919
You're not wrong. I'd put MGR above Bayonetta 2 though.

>>382702996
exactly why Platinum's games will never touch DMC desu. Each devil arm feels unique (for a given character)

>>382702919
>Prove me wrong

Okay

>Bayo 1 has the worst QTE's implementation of all time

This is a list of QTEs that will cause instant death or lose of health if failed:

>Chapter 1: Verse 8 - Beloved, when he throws you (Up + A)

>Chapter 2: Verse 10 - Fortitude Fight (X)

>Chapter 3: Verse 6 - Falling Building (X).
>After Verse 12 - running across broken bridge (A)

>Chapter 8: Verse 2 - I believe a car wants to kill you and you want to be on your bike (A). >Verse 4 - Driving upward to finish the verse (Up + A)

>Chapter 9: Verse 4 - Chased by a giant LEGO ball, by the end of the trial (A)

>Chapter 12: Verse 2 - Getting back onto the plane (several A's)

>Chapter 15: Verse 3 - Fight Jeanne. When her Phase 2 is over, she'll jump onto a rocket and ride it towards you (Up + A). Once you both are about to leave the rocket (Up + A again)

>Chapter 16: Verse 10 - First time entering the elevator area (Right + A)

>Epilogue: Verse 2 - Riding as Jeanne, by the end of the trial (several A's).
>Verse 3 - (Up + A)

>>382703485
and this alone makes Bayonetta's combat the worst ever created
congrats

>>382702919
>prove me wrong
Ninja Gaiden Black not being first is proof enough.

>>382701526
Revengence is much more stylish than this.

>>382703231
The first DMC does something better than any beat em up ever: exploring. Seriously the only thing that even comes closer to competing with it is Onimusha.

But in pure combat Plantium blows DMC away because how 'cool' attacks feel is also related to graphics. The trailing and particle effects add a lot.

Personally I thought all devil arms in 3 were just clones of each other. I got bored of them in like 2 minutes. I think 3 is a boring game. The enemies lack aggression and have so much HP that it turns it into a slog. The environments in that game fucking SUCKED. Like you spent 1/3 of the game in that shitty grey tower. It also had some really shitty bosses like the horse. The game felt like it was all down hill once Cerebus died.

IMO the best beat em ups are the first DMC, Onimusha, and Ninja Gaiden 1&2. DMC1+Onimusha have the best exploring. Ninja Gaiden has the best combat, it had the most aggressive enemies and the violence really adds a lot to the feeling of intesnity.
--
What I am saying is that the reason we don't have beat em ups anymore is because they reached their capicity for development long ago. There's nothing left to improve. All you could do with DMC5 is give you a few more redudent moves.

It had good combat at the cost of everything else.

DMC4 is just a BP simulator. Granted. That's not really a bad thing though.

>>382704310
>But in pure combat Plantium blows DMC away because how 'cool' attacks feel
And they don't feel at all, you're probably think that Musou combat or Monster Hunter clones are really some good shit
>I think 3 is a boring game
Sad shit taste

>>382703936
How can you be stylish with barely any combos? I still love MGR tho

>>382704310
>Personally I thought all devil arms in 3 were just clones of each other. I got bored of them in like 2 minutes.

Some meaningless opinion

Go enjoy your QTE cinematic fest

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>>382701526
It managed to be even worse and more incomplete then 3

At this rate DMC5 is gonna be a start screen and a ranking system.

>>382702919
Correct

Because nothing in the genre has been released since 4SE

>>382703485

RE4 confirmed worst game of all time

>>382703485
Joke's on you, that shit is intentional to fuck with people going for pure platinums

Kamiys hates you and wants you to suffer

>>382704841
>At this rate DMC5 is gonna be a start screen and a ranking system.
It won't even be that

>>382705019
2028 will be the year of CUHRAYZEE I think. DMC5 + MGR's directors new game

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>>382701526
>surpassed

It didn't even beat DMC3:SE.

>>382705182
>Kamiys hates you and wants you to suffer
So he's like making shit games for people with shit taste? Good riddance!

DMC5 at TGS this year my dudes

>>382705360
>+ MGR's
It'll be shit game then, sadly

>>382704528
Nah. If you don't see Platinum as a direct upgrade to every DMC except for 1 you're a nitpicking whiny little faggot.

In terms of number of weapons, attacks, enemies, basically everything that can be quantified it's a direct improvement. In terms of visuals it's also an upgrade because DMC was made in a time when particle effects were incredible undeveloped.

You can nitpick about how there was a boss you didn't like or too many QTE but when it comes to the meat and bones Plantium wins.

There is an exception for DMC1 preciously because it of how good it does exploring. Also because it has the most memorable environmental art in the genre. That is a huge part of what makes a game good.

>>382705494
Just like DMC5!

>>382705607
I like having all of my options available at all times, not having to offset through bloated strings to finally arrive at the move I want.

ergo, DMC beats Platinum

You mean the 3D brawler genre?

>>382705607

no platinum games are dumbed down flashy games.

its like comparing virtua fighter to dead or alive.

vf being dmc and platinum being doa. doa is flashy but you literally just mash it out. vf can be flashy but you need skill

>>382705607
>when it comes to the meat and bones Plantium wins.
I don't see any reason to argue with you, you're just a dumb fanboy with no knowledge what makes good combat actually good
Hope you'll change that "musou-tier combat is good" garbage shit taste someday

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>>382705607
>Platinum as a direct upgrade to every DMC except for 1

Imagine actually having taste this shit. Just try.

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>>382705607
Platinum has only made one great action game so far and it's only great because of everything besides the gameplay. Platinum is bottom of the barrel

>>382702919
DMC4 is the superior in terms of mechanic depth and variety. Unless you count DMC3 with style switching mod & weapon switcher mod.

>>382705981
No. Stylish action.

>>382706056
You really didn't say anything. Explain how platniums are dumbed down.

In terms of difficulty I found them higher than the dmc games.

>>382706101
You haven't given an argument. You're throwing out ad-hominens.

>>382706213

it is, but 3 with or without style switcher is a better game

>>382706226
Is that like 4DOF Beat-'em-up?

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>>382706101
>Hope you'll change that "musou-tier combat is good" garbage shit taste someday

If i was trying to defend DMC i would probably not want to bring the word "musou" into the discussion. Just saying.

>>382706226
This is literally a marketing word made by capcom. It would be like if people called Magic the Gathering a "First Person Thinker" (an equally stupid and cringey term invented by a marketing deparment).

3D brawlers is the non-idiot word.

>>382706518
Stylish action.

>>382706421
The styles are hardly a very signficant thing. It's one fucking button. From what I remember most of their effects are gimmicks anyway. I sort of forget styles even exiseted since I never found a use for them.

>>382706342

combo strings go on forever and dont have much variety so mashing and dodging will get you through the game. to pull of shit like that in dmc you have to put more effort.

platinum games are, like the other guy said, musou games with slightly more difficulty

>>382706421
this. I prefer commitment over style switching.

Although if DMC5 is being made I hope they expand the styles well enough but integrate some of the old style moves namely dashing and wall running into the core movesets.

>>382706518
The truth is the best term is "Character Action" Game" but apparently this term was coined by some LP e-celebs so it triggers people

>>382706626

no styles are a huge part of the game. each style switches up what the button does and completely changes playstyle.

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>>382701526
Platinum and Capcom have the means to do it but they won't for some reason.

Pic unrelated.

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>yfw dmc5 is announced and has miyazaki as director

>>382704310
>platinum game better than DMC
Only on nu /v/

>>382706834
Bloodborne is not stylish action no matter what anybody says. Fuck off

>>382706834
If it doesnt have Itsuno it'll be shit.

Why doesn't someone just make a bloody palace simulator with an easy plot, a variety of enemies and unlockable weapons at certain floors? Like, the point of the game is to reach the top like in persona 3. Except cuhrayzee.

>>382706667
>combo strings go on forever and dont have much variety so mashing and dodging will get you through the game. to pull of shit like that in dmc you have to put more effort.

You CAN just mash out attacks in DMC and than hit the dodge button. What are you even on?

>>382706720
The point of a name is to for it to be easy to figure out. It should describe the mechanical rules.

3D brawler or 3D beat-em-up immediently tells people everything they need to know. It even aknowledges the historical roots in things like Final Fight and Golden Axe.

The other terms are stupid because they do not describe what the genre is about. Imagine if 3rd person shooters were called "Character shooters". It completly misses the point of the mechanics.

>>382706770
>no styles are a huge part of the game

You could literally never press the button and the game would be almost just as easy. That's a sign it's pretty gimmicky.

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>>382706834
I would honestly prefer DmC2.

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>>382701526
I don't think Ive met a not-autistic DMC fan ever in my life

The only one I personally know goes into an autistic denial/ rage and refuses to talk to me if I in any way imply that DMC4 isn't a perfect game and the pinnacle of action games in general, or if I try to talk about anything flawed with the game (or the series) in general

And after playing all the games myself (including DmCDE) I can pretty safely say that the fanbase has no basis or right on reality to be even close to the level of obnoxious "hardcore" anime shits that they are.

They always claim about how "deep" the combat of (especially DMC4) is, while not realizing that absolutely any game can provide you with endless "depth" in the expense of good design (which DMC4 is not riddled with)

The enemies are factually made to be wailed on without any challenge for the sole reason that ADHD kids would think they are executing mechanically super "deep" and though moves, when there really is no other way to play unless you go out of your way to be purposefully bad; the "depth" is so easily accessible because the enemies don't put up a fight to even try to counter you pulling off the repetitive "cool" juggles for example that you can see in the endless reposted webms here

The only enemies in DMC4 that are actually hard to pull consistent "style" on are some of the bosses, because you need to get their pattern down by heart to know exactly how to not get hit while maximizing your style points, something regular enemies never force you to do.

tl;dr: Mainly DMC4 fans are the cancer killing hack and slash and they definitely killed traditional DMC, because now it must be about pulling "cool" shit off with no challenge instead of fighting actually well made enemies with real strategy and tactics involved. Its not a refined genre for performers, now its just a circlejerk sandbox for autistic children wanting pretty flashing colors and fireworks.

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>>382707225
>People actually want the same room over and over if it means zero backtracking.
You people don't even know what your criticisms mean anymore.

>>382707623
You claim that your friend is the autistic one but it seems like you have some sort of hateboner for DMC4 and claim only the most hardcore games can satisfy you. You're just as bad, really, with the whole elitism approach.

>>382707638
Not the guy you're responding to but I think he just wants to distil the best part of the game out, because lets face it, all the other parts in DMC games are pretty shit.

>>382707476
Not that anon but you're a fucking idiot. Not for your opinion but for how little you understand the mechanics you're talking about. Also not everyone plays on easy/normal.

>>382707623
I've played all of them and would agree with this.

Once Beat em Ups went 3D they threw out of semblance of challenge.

These kids think that executing some long combo on stream on glorified punching bags is "skill" (combos which are gimmicks since doing the basic moves is just as effective).

Part of the problem is that defensive actions is as simple as "oh the enemy changed it's stance! It's probably going to attack. Mash that dodge button" It's even worst when the dodge can be canceled into things.

They are fun games but these are not high-skill games. The Ninja Gaiden beat em ups are a bit harder but they are not totally nuts either.

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>>382701526
>DMC5 NEVER EVER because Capcom is broke and livin off the monhun monies and the e-sports bux
>platinum was the only ones stringing it along but they now live off of licensed game to licensed game and now their future is unclear
>Team Ninja apparently wants Ninja Gaiden 'to be in the the shadows for a while' because vanilla 3 and the zombie spinoff were that bad
>God of Was is the best selling hack n slash series ever, but now they've turned it into a TLOU clone because 'lol who care about action games, it's all about cinematic experiences nowadays'
>everyone else is trying to just make Souls clones (and bad ones at that)
>post yfw this genre is dead

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>>382707909
>because lets face it, all the other parts in DMC games are pretty shit.
Those are some very strong opinions you have there, sir. I also disagree with them so heavily that I wish you would die.

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>>382707623

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>>382707795
>nd claim only the most hardcore games can satisfy you.

more like only well designed games can satisfy me since im not a retard who is easily impressed by games telling me how awesome I am and how cool it totally is when I juggle an opponent for 20 seconds. When I want to juggle people I play fighting games. When I want to fight enemies and cool bosses, I play hack and slash. DMC4 is a singleplayer 3d fighting game for retards and actual autists

>>382707978
the styles are so badly designed as a mechanic that its completely acceptable if someone shits on them regardless of their arguments on the topic

Ninja gaiden can handle wallruns and multiple attack buttons without fucking mapping them all to one face button and then telling you to switch the function of that button by pressing the DPAD first

>>382706720
>the best term is "Character Action" Game"
ahahahahahahaha

>this term was coined by some LP e-celebs
It was actually first used by the guys who made Crash Bandicoot, and it actually applies to that game because it's a mascot platformer so the "character" part is actually relevant.

Just call them action games ffs. Maybe, maybe "brawlers" is okay too. Anything else is autistic and retarded. And before anyone says the usual "durr hurr but any game where you do actions is an 'action game'" every other type of game that the phrase "action game" could be applied to has a more specific and descriptive genre name. Games like this are the only ones where the unifying element is the combat (aka action) but are different enough in other ways that there's no better way to accurately and succinctly describe them.

>>382708236
>more like only well designed games can satisfy me
Again, you are self-entitled to the point of elitism. There are no games that can live up to your expectations and there probably never will be.

>>382708065
Don't wish for my death anon-kun~

I just find the puzzle solving, platforming and story not be my cup of tea, I'd rather just have the awesome combat in arenas where my camera is always cooperative.

>>382708419
Except, you know, literally DMC1. You don't even need to jump to other franchises for examples.

is DmC that bad? I just wanna slash people fast and in style fuck the story and the characters with good graphics

>>382708236

all the styles combined have more options then ninja gaiden and theres too many to map to a traditional controller.

>>382707978
There are two things that tell me you're not very qualified to talk about this.

The first is you are not giving a counter arguement or refuting my points, which means either you have no arguement or you suck at articulating.

The second is that you actually think there is any real difference between DMC 3's difficulty settings. Making you take a more damage and giving the enemy more HP is nothing. Once you memorize the bosse's pattern and figure out how to keep enemies on the defensive so they rarely attack all the difficulties do is make the game more tedious.

This annon has it right. >>382707623

These are not games that take very much skill. They don't even have real difficulty curves, where each new stage makes the last one seem like a joke. DMC3's curve flatlines at Cerebus

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>>382708419
>There are no games that can live up to your expectations and there probably never will be.

According to what? Your retarded non-argument?

In the genre of hack and slash, I like DMC1, DMC3 and Ninja Gaiden (particularly the first one, second one had its merits). Nothing that came after these games except MAYBE, MAYBE god hand if you can look past its gigantic flaws (and if you even consider it to be a part of what can be described as "hack and slash) has been nearly as well designed and good, only pandering to the lol wow epic QTE flashing colors long combos crowd. Back in the day hack and slash was about the relationship between the player and the enemy, not about some cross eyed gook putting naruto songs in the background of their combo videos

>>382708065
I just want stylish combos, I couldn't give a fuck about going through corridors and shit. Fuck you nigger.

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>>382708685
>all the styles combined have more options then ninja gaiden

LMAO

>>382708720

>he doesnt know theres a metric shit ton of dmc 3 and ninja gaiden combo vids

>>382708236
This guy gets it.

>>382708658
If you don't hate the character and graphics, as I did, it's actually a good combat system. The main problem is that you will be forced to do incredibly boring platforming (good news it's really easy so it gets over with quick).

Scoring Auteists don't like it because the combo counter is too generous and Dante-lovers don't like it because of the character. To their credit the game is fucking easy but so is every DMC.

>>382708960
Nobody's saying otherwise. What that anon is trying to say is that doing combos isn't the point of those games. It's about having an actual fight with an enemy that is doing it's best to kill you and using the variety of tools at your disposal to outmaneuver and destroy them. It's about on-the-fly tactical decision making, not finding the most impressive way to juggle a punching bag that can't fight back.

>>382709062
>so is every DMC.
you take that back right now

>>382708936
Keep posting

>>382709062
>but so is every DMC.
1 is considered the hardest game in the series. I don't care what you think about the rest. But that's almost universally considered by damn near everyone.

>>382709218

but dmc4 had more aggressive enemies then 3. its one of the things dmc4 did better. fighting frosts, blitzes, and angelos are more agressive and tougher then anything in dmc3

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>>382708960
>he doesnt know theres a metric shit ton of dmc 3

there is, and it was the start of the downfall of the series. However, it still had elements of gothic horror and clever/ varied bosses+ a decent balance of aggressive and gimmicky enemies. Also 2 weapons at a time and one style had its uniqueness in giving a loadout system to a game of this genre, while DMC4's basic controls and systems are just an overbloated, badly designed piece of shit with every meaningful and possibly even fun change/update going to Nero, the as a whole dumbed down beginner character (the EX system, the idea of grappling)

>and ninja gaiden

"combos" let alone combo videos in ninja gaiden have nothing in common with the DMC equivalent and are 100% of the time impressive because the player is playing at a nigh impossibly good level, iframing and predicting everything that will happen while mercilessly killing the actually challenging horde of enemies coming at them. DMC combo videos are gooks performing finger gymnastics to juggle a training mode dummy in the air for as long as possible with the odd royalguard clip thrown in

i really wanna get into dmc 3 again i loved it as a kid but fuck man I cant
the controls on my xbone controller are wrong as fuck
the resolution is low as shit
guess ill just go straight to 4

>>382709360
>>382709527
I agree. 1 is the hardest. It is also my favorite. Not only is the most challenging but it has the best enviromental graphics and really cool exploring.

However it is not a hard game. If you want a challenge go play the Punisher or Violent Storm and try to beat those on a single credit. If you can do that it's a bigger accomplishment than beating every Platnium and Capcom 3D beat em up combined.

>>382707623
You mainly talk about DMC4 and treat the entire series like progressive refinements when DMC, DMC2 and DMC3 are all mechanically different

>>382709916
which punisher?
ill take u in on that

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>>382703834
it is though, you need glasses anon

>>382709916

1 CCíng a game is hard. But why not do the same with DMC1 and I'd say it's pretty damn hard. No yellow orbs. Restart from beginning if you die, no saves. Similar no 1 ccing

>>382709620
> DMC combo videos are gooks performing finger gymnastics to juggle a training mode dummy in the air for as long as possible with the odd royalguard clip thrown in

Exactly. These are not high skills feats. It's like showing off your "combos" in Guilty Gear on a fucking training mode instead of using them against a very clever player that will fight back.

That's why Ninja Gaiden is the better game. The enemies fight back. DMC3 the only guys of any challenge are the bosses (and the DMC1 guys above mook level)

>>382710020
For the arcade, by capcom.

Some advice. Use the roll aggressivily, it's not a defensive tool like in DMC.

Also you'll have a blast. That game is awesome.

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>>382709946
I mainly talk about DMC4 because its the only one that I have a true beef with since clowns like OP seem to be under the assumption that its what DMC is about (and sadly what CAPCOM probably believes because of them)

DMC4 fans are the equivalent of bronies (who would have guessed since its the first DMC with a decent steam release) and they have completely overtaken what used to be a respectable hack and slash series. It has become a dumbed down joke with practically nothing that people loved from the original, but its fine right? As long as "durr it has moor mecanics" (then why arent the autists playing ninja gaiden, the actually technical hack and slash? because its offensive. Its actually hard and isnt the feels good brony experience that DMC4 offers, truly satisfying the autist climate in a way that only anime can)

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I think God Hand is the only great 3D Beat Up Em. Devil May Cry's enemies from 3 and on are well-designed art-wise but strictly punching bags. Ninja Gaiden 2 has it's retarded delimb mechanic that limits the viability of combos to a mere handful of moves per weapon and is so unbalanced it's fucking crazy (the Lunar 360UT is cheating and you know it).

I think the problem is that devs focus on stylish combos over beating the shit out of everyone in a brutal slog to the finish. Tell me when a new beat em up game comes out that can match the Punisher in quality.

>>382702919
DmC is objectively better than DMC 2

>>382710609

i can agree with this

>>382710609
not that anon but i legitimately feel like they offer the same "quality" respective to their time, and thus are both visually impressive trash. dmc2 introduced some neat mechanic and animations but was awful in every other regard, much like donte offered little more than impressive facial cap and environments. however, dmc2 arguably has the best dante attire and so i consider it superior on that alone.

>>382710198
Think about all the 'easy' parts in DMC. All that walking, the puzzle solving, the backtracking, the loading screens, the cutscenes you can't skip

Arcade games are DESIGNED to be 1 credited so they have zero filler. Dmc is designed around having a save system so you only do the boring shit once.

Apart from that. Even if you did do a no continue run of DMC1 it would probably still be easier. The last boss of violent storm is fucking nuts. He's easily the hardest beat em up boss ever. To give you an idea he has an attack which hits the entire screen and he can use this on any frame where he is not stunned. This thing takes off 75% of your health. The only way to avoid it is to time your invulnerability attack and the timing is harder than doing a parry/perfect dodge/royal guard that Bayo or DMC would have. The lower his health is the more he uses this thing. And did I mention he can do this attack WHENEVER he isn't in a stun frame and.

>>382702919
DMC3 was awesome.
DMC4 had an even better Dante but was unfinished as fuck.
Capcom decided to throw more characters onto the mess instead of actually finishing the game.
It isn't even stupidly well optimized anymore.

>>382710609
There is no disputing that

BUT

DMC2 actually has a decent OST while DmC is shit from start to finish

>>382704310
3's devil arm's don't overlap in any meaningful way. Cerberus and Nevan are completely different from the rest. Rebellion is your standard sword, Agni and Rudra's moveset meanwhile emphasizes crowd control as opposed to the high impact style of Rebellion. You could make the case that Beowulf and Rebellion have *some* overlap but once you take into account the Swordmaster moveset that doesn't really play anymore. Then the devs went out of their way to create Lucifer in DMC5 which is another paradigm shift.

For Bayonetta, on the other hand, the differences between different weapons are largely cosmetic.

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>>382710589
>Ninja Gaiden 2 has it's retarded delimb mechanic that limits the viability of combos to a mere handful of moves per weapon and is so unbalanced it's fucking crazy (the Lunar 360UT is cheating and you know it).

What the fuck does this even mean? So what you are saying is that you're one of those faggots that just spams the same moves over and over because you're not good enough to actually use your moveset or prioritize fun over just brute force progressing through a game. And somehow this is worth noting for Ninja Gaiden but not for the """""""only great"""""""" which is literally the poster child for this phenomenon. Am i right?

>>382708572
That's objectively wrong though because DMC3 is a direct upgrade in every department except for exploration but really if you want to explore shit go play Myst.

>>382702919
DMC3=DMC4>NGB>MGR>DMC2>Bayo>DMC1>Bayo2>DmC

Bayo starting out slow then getting faster later on didn't make it a good game for me, Kamiya is pretty good at starting out new games but once he's gone out of the picture the series just sort of evolves into something greater and i think that's why Bayo2 turned out so bad and is probably one of the worst projects he's worked on in my opinion

Kamiya being bad at making games is most likely why scalebound got cancelled

>>382711645
>Things DMC3 babies say

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>>382701526
Excuse me?

>>382711836
More enemies, better bosses, more responsive controls, more combo options, better graphics. Somehow this is worse.

>>382711961
Game's too short. Not enough enemy variety. Too many setpieces. Cutting mechanic is fun on paper, dull in execution. Good game overall.

>>382712425
Are you talking about DmC? Fairly sure you're talking about DmC.

>>382706667
>combo strings go on forever and dont have much variety so mashing and dodging will get you through the game. to pull of shit like that in dmc you have to put more effort.
there's literally no reason to take any of your posts seriously at this point. this is pure fanboy delusion

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>>382702919
>DMC2 over anything
>DmC that low

>>382712425
Dmc3's enemies were fucking punching bags. Dmc1 enemies at least fought back. I don't care how many enemies you have if they don't challenge me.

Also Dmc1 is actually the better looking game graphically. That castle was damn beautiful and each room was totally unique as opposed to the horrible grey rooms you kept going through in dmc3.

By better controls you actually mean "I can cancel into dodges which makes the game even easier".

And as for bosses. dmc3 had tons of shit ones like that horse. dmc1 every boss was a challenge. While in dmc3 the only ones that require any effort are virgil and cerebus.

>>382711267
I fucked around with the different devil arms and couldn't even notice a real distinction in their speed/reach/dps/burst other than beowulf. The whip from Bayo incontrast is very easy to distinguish.

>>382710198
To add it to in 3D beat em ups defensive play revolves around a dodge/block button which solves all your problems. 2D beat em ups you need to anticipate things and out position/crowd control everything. You don't have 'no get hit' button other than your suicide attack which costs HP. Some games did have blocking moves but the timing was so hard you couldn't do it reliable except on slow attacks. You had rolls sometimes but those were really for offensive use.

The only spammable moves with i-frames were throws which you needed to set up and multiple enemies.

>>382706421

for that reason DMC3 is easier overall I find.

>get to first dante mission in 4
>nero babby controls made you complacent and you immediately start losing S-ranks on a DMD run

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>>382712425
>More enemies

More absolute shit enemies do you mean? One third of the roster is reskins of the same enemy each with it's own attack instead it being one enemy with a decent moveset. Another third are fucking chess pieces repurposed from their boss encounter to be regular enemies because the game was pushed out the door before being finished. The fact that you would list the enemies as a plus for DMC3 shows how much of a hopeless baby you are.

>better bosses

Only Vergil stands out, all the others are either in line with thee DMC1 in terms of quality or are throwaway garbage tier like Gigapede, Leviathan heart, Arkham and the joke character which i forgot the name of.

>more responsive controls

Padding your list already?

>more combo options

Yes

>better graphics

No shit, it's a sequel. Too bad the art design is inferior to take advantage of said graphics.

>>382713326
>and the joke character which i forgot the name of.
Jester

>>382713398
That's it. It's hard not to call him Joker, in fact i think he even calls himself that during one of the fights.

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>>382701526
>All the insane shit you can pull with Dante style changes
>Nero's revs and charge shots on bosses for shits and giggles

I fucking love this game.

>>382701526
Because DMC5SE isnt out yet.

I would honestly vastly prefer Dragon's Dogma 2 over DMC5. There is a lot more untapped potential in that franchise,

>>382711267
>For Bayonetta, on the other hand, the differences between different weapons are largely cosmetic.
Kusheldra
Shuraba
scarborough fair
rodin
black onyx
odette
Durga

The rest overlap, I would say, but maybe my memory is failing me.

>>382714564
I still have to play DD one day.

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Why are NGfags to salty? Every single DMC or even Bayo thread I see the same guy shitposting the same things with the same images.

I know your series is even more dead than the other two but get some dignity.

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Tell me /v/ is there still hope for DMC5 ?

>>382715134
There's 3 well established forces in the genre. NG, Platinium, and DMC.

It only makes sense they would be compared.

>>382715384
That's fair, but it just seems like they can't ever resist.

Maybe in ten years when NG is an aging skeleton that can't even be played outside of emulators because there are so few consoles left in circulation and it never got any re-releases, they'll lighten up.

>>382715765
You're the one that seems to have a stick up your ass.

>>382715134
Must be mad because Team Ninja will keep rehashing their fapbait and never make a Ninja Gaiden game that doesn't suck ass.

Can't believe Black or the Sigma games haven't got a "Remaster" release.

>>382702919
>there are people that get that booty blasted to think DMC is actually bad

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>>382715895
Well, I just hope they enjoy Nioh.

It's a little funny that almost this exact situation happened for them. >>382706834

You ever wonder why you want a new DMC so badly?

like wouldn't it just be fine to get a new idea or something?
why do you want the exact same thing with a different anime story and new weapons.
Thats basically DLC.

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>>382701526
It was surpassed before it was released.

>>382716417
That's kind of the problem with the genre. There's nothing to expand upon. Bayonetta already raises the number of weapons and moves to such huge levels adding any more wouldn't even be noticed.

I think they need to go back to DMC1 and remember how to do exploring and RE style puzzles.

>>382716417
I like the plot and characters.

Also consistency with game elements.

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>>382716741
>There will never be another game like God Hand

Fucking hell

Anima: Gate of Memories is good

>>382716846
>I like the plot and characters.
There are people who don't mash through cutscenes in these games?
Reminder - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8qG4AlK1qk

>>382716967
Literally 10/10 scene.

>>382716754
>There's nothing to expand upon.
Better enemies with better AI and better movesets, better stages with more variety, multiplayer, different ways to use meter and different meters, maybe power-ups?

>>382716967
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDLuXNpUF7w

>>382705321
:(

>>382717427
Still better than Bayo 2.

>>382717368
>Better enemies with better AI
That's just saying make it harder. It's not evolving the genre

>movesets
The amount of moves in something like Bayo is so large you could cut half of them and it would still feel bloated.

>better stages with more variety
Such as?

>different ways to use meter and different meters, maybe power-ups?
These are extremly minor things. I'm talking evolve the genre.

>>382708289
Arr you idiots just too young to remember that beat ups exist or something? It's a genre that perfectly describes every single game ITT.
>Games like this are the only ones where the unifying element is the combat (aka action)
lol

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>No interesting enemy match ups, 90% of fights are against a single enemy type.
>Pitiful enemy variation. Mostly just recolors.
>Difficulty balancing all over the place. Warrior ToV in swamp area is against the harmless bone scorpions and bugs, while the Acolyte version is much tougher.
>Long range combat is a fucking atrocity
>Godawful bosses. Tunnel worm, two dragons that need to be two-shotted with the gravity spell otherwise its the worst fight in the game, Genshin pathetically stalks you if you hold block and he lunges setting him up for an incredibly easy counterattack, final boss can't hit you in one spot of his own arena
>Long move list... but you never willingly fight on or underwater, most moves are completely useless compared to OP moves. Viable move list is smaller than DMC4's.
>Constant slowdowns when something remotely interesting happens.
>Beginner's traps all over the place. Enemies spawn behind you, or lunge out from behind corners.
>Increasing the difficulty only adds a few more enemies (now in a brand new color!) per encounter. Fighting tactics needed to win are exactly the same in each encounter. The spider-dude fight on Warrior has 3 dudes, but has 9 dudes on Mentor. It's 'the same, but more tedious'. Would have been better to mix the water demons in with the spider-dudes, or be harassed by flying enemies during the fight.
>Attack and grabbing animations are four times longer than they should be and the camera freaks out during them. For example: in NGB the DS's charge attacks are respectively a less than 1 second decapitation lunge and a modest flurry of strikes. In NG2 even the level 1 charge takes four seconds, while the UT takes SIX. You can play this game and read War and Peace during the animations and be done with the book before the game ends.
>Content that should have been on the disk (alternate costumes, mission mode) are paid DLC

NGB was great. Why is NG2 such a crushing disappointment? It's a 3/10.

>>382717958
>That's just saying make it harder. It's not evolving the genre
Sure.

>The amount of moves in something like Bayo is so large you could cut half of them and it would still feel bloated.
I mean enemy movesets.

>Such as?
Stage hazards and traps, variety in enemy placement, better platforming for when you inevitably have to do it.

>These are extremly minor things. I'm talking evolve the genre.
Well, I was mainly taking inspiration in fighting games there, where it's a major difference between one game and the other.

But yeah, I didn't take "expand" the genre as in "evolve it to make it different", I took it as "make what we have better". I mean, exploring and RE style puzzles aren't it either, because if I wanted exploring and puzzles the last thing I would do is boot up an action game.

>>382713057
>speed/reach/dps/burst
You're oversimplifying things if that's how you look at it. Movesets are critical. For example, cerberus on average is faster than rebellion with a shorter range for a lot of its melee attacks. However it has a slow but punishing aerial-multi-hit rush attack and a several defensive barrier moves. Nevan, which is one of the most effective weapons, forgoes melee moves for the most part in exchange for an AOE moveset. These weapons are radically different.

Anyways, on speed there are clear differences but dps is balanced more or less across the board. I'm not sure where you're getting range from since Nevan surpasses all other weapons in that department.

>>382718992
Minor differences like that are not noticble to me when the game was so easy. Like you can just mash out the basic combo and it's almost as effective as the more advanced type of playing. When the game is like that little details do not matter.

As far as I was considered dante has 3 moves: a basic attack, a launcher, a gap closer and 50 different reskins of these things. The minor variants differences don't matter to me when I can beat the enemies while barely staying awake.

I think DMC1 felt like it had had more meaningful moves because I actually needed to learn each move in order to succeed. That would be my pick for deepest combat in the DMC franchise.

>>382718858
More enemies moves would be nice but there's a fatal problem that nearly all 3D beat em ups have. Every move is countered the same, by pressing the dodge button.

If you want more meaningful enemy attacks you need more defensive options (roll, block, parry, some variations on them)

Stage hazards is a good idea. I think you either need stage hazards or exploring. The environment in DMC past 1 is esssentially just an arena with nothing to interact with. Drop some fire from sky, get mooks throwing barrels, either that or make me search the room for a dildo to shove in a marble statue's ass completing a puzzle.

>>382702919
Bayo 2 is better than Bayo 1, that's about it. Everything else is right.

>>382720697
>If you want more meaningful enemy attacks you need more defensive options (roll, block, parry, some variations on them)
Sure, go with that, and again I suggest looking at fighting games for inspiration. You need attacks that you need to block either high or low for example and a way to throw/throw-tech to beat blocking, plus some way of using resources to do a better block and a way of using resources to get out of being comboed by enemies (like a burst or a combo breaker for example).

There's literally no better combat than NG2's

>>382720932
>Game balanced around Witch Time and Umbran Climax
>Can't launch enemies without one of those two things
>Infinitely dodging bosses forcing you to use Witch Time
>Side scrolling bosses that remove any need for movement and reduce it to Witch Time -> Dodge
>Wicked Weaves nerfed
>Combo points reworked
You are an absolute pleb if you think Bayo 2 is better.

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>>382720932

>>382721341
Golden Axe Beast Rider had high/low. The trouble is that because beat em ups use a zoomed out camera it was difficult to read so they had this lame color coding where every attack from the enemy was covered in blue/red shit.

Need something easy to read. An alternative is to just have 2 forms of defense, a block and parry. The parry is harder but rewards better.

As for throwing. Ninja Gaiden had it so enemies could throw you if you blocked for too long. Old 2d beat em ups had throws and even had enemies with ai that made them love to block.

For a get out of combat there are several things: slow motion is a popular gimmick, you could bring back the suicide attacks (instant start up, aoe, knockdown+invunability frames but it costs hp). SoR3 let you do a suicide attack with no HP cost on a cooldown. Another option is auto-dodging like Viewitful Joe that costs your meter.

Another thing is to add more of those ultimate attacks that just nuke the whole screen and give you invunability time (ninpo magic).

>>382721937
Why did Bayo 2 get so much praise then? Cuz it was a WiiU exclusive?

>>382722475
Reviewers don't know what made the first game's combat good nor does your typical gamer who just wants to button mash.
Bayonetta 2 got rid of a lot of the dumb Kamiya stuff in the first game like QTEs and mini games but at the same it gutted the depth of the combat and the thing is if you ask someone why they prefer Bayonetta 2 they will tell you it's because of the aforementioned stuff being removed and even if they say the combat is better they'll just make some baseless comment without substance like 'it's more fluid'.

Fuck your debate. I want to be sure we get dmc5 or dd2.
Is there any, even a tiny bit of hope left in capcom to save us. I wonder.

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>>382723243
>Is there any, even a tiny bit of hope left in capcom to save us.
No, action games are dead.

>>382721937
Half of his argument is based around scoring, something only aspies care about.

The rest seems to be a mild balancing issue with Bayo's meter.

Not a single word about whether he thinks the environments look better in 1 or 2 which really calls into question this guy's mental state.

>>382723573
>Yoshesque
>Guy
You also conveniently ignored that combat is now entirely balanced Witch Time and Umbran Climax which severely hinders the amount of freedom you have. You literally cannot combo enemies without one of the two things.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMz6SpKQO4I

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>>382702919
>Bayonetta that high
>DMC2 better than DmC

>>382723749
And how is this a bad thing? Because it's a different style?

Viewtiful Joe was based heavily around slow motion too. To the point where if you didn't have slow-mow it wasn't worth attacking anything.

And again the fact that this guy spent hundreds of words talking about the game and never once went into aesthetics should disqualify him immediately.

>>382724446
It's inherently more limited and reduces every fight to Dodge -> Witch Time -> Combo -> Repeat. The Lumen Sage fights on high difficulties are appallingly bad, he will dodge every single thing you throw at him unless you're in Witch Time.

I can't think of any other action game that goes about combat this way and in this genre being this limited is not a positive and who the hell cares about aesthetics? DMC3 and God Hand look awful but people still make content for them this day meanwhile most high level Bayo players dropped Bayo 2 a week after its release.

>>382724446
Aesthetics fade into the background after a playthrough or two, not worth talking about

>>382723573
>Half of his argument is based around scoring, something only aspies care about.
Scoring and doing combos to look stylish is the whole point of this genre. Without it all you have is playing to beat the game, which in most of these games is trivial.

>>382724446
>Cares about gameplay instead of graphics
>Somehow this means he is wrong instead of you
Who the fuck cares if the game is prettier if it's not as fun to play?

>>382724858
All you are telling me is that you are defective in some part of your brain.

>>382724696
Like I said Viewtiful Joe is even more slow-mo focused. Slow mow quadriples all damage, gives you all sorts of crowd control improvements, and the possibility of auto-dodging. It's not even worth hitting an attack button outside of slow mo.

>DMC3 and God Hand look awful but people still make content for them this day meanwhile most high level Bayo players dropped Bayo 2 a week after its release.

The types of people you are talking about are autistic losers. In fact these people are so wretched their disapproval of B2 would be interpreted as an endorsement. These cripples that try to take the game into turn into some sort of combo contest are preciously what harmed the genre. Enemies that actually hit back and can't be comboed endlessly need to be annexed so these tards can play with their punching bags and post the stuff to youtube. These are probably people that would stop playing the game entirly if they removed that combo meter from the upper right hand side of the screen. In other words they are not concerned with the whole game (as evidenced by them not caring about aestetics) but with a micro part of it.

The games are supposed to be about being a super-powered bad-ass fighting demons and angels not about mashing buttons to get e-fame or make a number go up a few more digits.

>>382726414
>Enemies that actually hit back and can't be comboed endlessly
The first Bayonetta already had this and God Hand does for that matter as well. Bayonetta 2 offered solutions to problems that never existed.

I have never played VJ so I can't commend on it but from my understanding it's a 2D beat 'em up which is going to be fundamentally different from a game like Bayonetta.

>>382726414
Nah I'm telling you that I play games more than once, and none of what you rant about even makes sense because if you want aggressive enemies Bayonetta 1 is better because of Non Stop Infinite Climax

>>382725419
>Scoring and doing combos to look stylish is the whole point of this genre

Imagine if the combo meter was removed entirly. And there were no level rankings at the end. Your telling me that you would see no "point" in the games.

Which shows that you are missing 99% of the game for some shitty micro aspect where you make a number go up.


>Without it all you have is playing to beat the game, which in most of these games is trivial.

Hense the games need to be made brutally hard.

>Who the fuck cares if the game is prettier if it's not as fun to play?
Merely looking at good art is a major part of having fun. Put it this way. Imagine if we gutted the graphics for Bayo and replaced it with wire-frames. Let's say we color coded them very well so it was easy to read. In fact it would be even easier to read with no particle effects.

Are you telling me this game would be fun at all?

>>382726414
>Muh aesthetics
>Liking the gameplay makes you autistic
>Gameplay is a micro part of an action game

Off yourself, your fucking retard.

>>382726414
Viewtiful Joe lets you trigger slow mo with a button press, it's not limited to a dodge so it doesn't make combat feel as repetitive.

>>382726818
You're illiterate. I'm telling you the combo meter is a micro part of the game and it is. If the combo tracker and the level rankings were removed than very little would be gone.

It feels like a lot to you because you're putting your stake in that one tiny part.

In contrast if you were to gut the graphics and replace them with n64 graphics or wire frames the game would be boarderline unplayable to anyone with any real taste.

>>382727264
>anyone with any real taste
What you mean you? Do people with real taste avoid pre gen 6 games like the plague?

>>382727264
>the game would be boarderline unplayable
No it wouldn't, in fact it would probably play better to due more power being directed to maintaining a consistent 60 FPS.

>>382726685
>Merely looking at good art is a major part of having fun. Put it this way. Imagine if we gutted the graphics for Bayo and replaced it with wire-frames. Let's say we color coded them very well so it was easy to read. In fact it would be even easier to read with no particle effects.
>Are you telling me this game would be fun at all?
Considering that in a lot of competitive games players reduce graphics to shit tier to have an advantage in visibility and yet still have fun, I'd say that maybe it would still be just as fun.

>>382728015
Oh wow. You're a laugh. How about we do this. Next Bayo will have n64 graphics. That will gurantee 60 fps and free up like 90% of the budget. In fact it will be so cheap Platinum could probably make 3 of these a year.

Fuck aestetics man.

>>382727669
Are you telling me you would enjoy Bayo with wire frame or n64 graphics?

>>382728451
If the animations were kept in check sure. Are you saying you're incapable of enjoying N64/PS1 games because of their graphics?

>>382728451
>Fuck aestetics man.
I never said that but gameplay should always take precedent over aesthetics unless the gameplay is somehow intertwined with the aesthetics.

Bayonetta 2 is all style with little substance and therefore makes for a poor action game compared to the first Bayonetta, NGB, God Hand or DMC 3/4.

>DMC3 Final Boss
>Brother vs brother the single greatest duel in video game history

>DMC4 final boss
>Some faggot no one even remembers with awful mechanics

How did they fuck up so hard after 3?

>>382728939
Nero was a mistake

>>382704841
>press X to SSS

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>>382728939
>the single greatest duel in video game history
Azel is not in DMC3.

>>382728432
You're talking about people that play games for prize money, not fun. You're also confusing winning with fun.

Yes lowing the graphical settings will increase the chance you win. However it ends up making the part of fun associated with looking at pretty things dead in the water.
>>382728547
It has to do with degrees. If you would seriously take ps1 graphics +60 fps over ps4 graphics+30fps youre priorities are downright wretched.

>>382706672
>namely dashing and wall running into the core movesets.

DMC2?

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>>382729182
Performance > graphic fidelity, ESPECIALLY for an action game.

>>382729182
>It has to do with degrees
Backpedalling, eh? If the comparison between Bayo 1 and Bayo 2 was wireframes vs gorgeous vistas then maybe it'd be worth talking about, but in reality it's just a minor upgrade.
>If you would seriously take ps1 graphics +60 fps over ps4 graphics+30fps youre priorities are downright wretched.
That's because you're an autistic muh aesthetics fag who deliberately refuses to understand the perspective of others. 60 FPS enhances a large number of things including game feel, which is far more important than some pretty looking environments to me because I play games multiple times and those kinds of things become boring quickly.

>>382707356
>DMC
>dodge button

..what

>>382729706
It has 3 of those

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>>382729706
>He doesn't play with Trickster

>>382730218
Even without Trickster, you have a dedicated dodge button.

Hitting X/A in DMC3 and 4 isn't a jump, it's a vertically upwards dodge.

>>382729672
Frame rate adds very little once you get past 30, escpially for how much extra processing power it takes. If you've ever fucked around with emulators or worked with actual 3D assets this is apparent. Game companies are aware of this too which is why when they are faced with the limited power of consoles one of the first things they get is frame-rate.

As another piece of evidence 2D beat em ups had terrible framerates and were still awesome. Take something like Golden Axe Revenge of Death adder. Which would you do to improve it? Raise the frame rate or improve it's graphics.

I think the better environments B2 put it above B1 mostly because B2 had a much greater pallette of colors. I think the difference in combat is just that a difference, not very much better or worst.

There's repetitive combat but there is also repetitive environments and both of those are negative.

>>382715134
>Why are NGfags to salty? Every single DMC or even Bayo thread I see the same guy shitposting the same things with the same images.

And you literally get triggered every time. It's fucking hilarious how you let everyone know just how triggered you are every time. Yeah it's NGfags that are salty..

>>382730565
Good point, jumping in DMC has a hilarious amount of i-frames.

>>382711961

Only time this game was remotely fun/challenging was against Armstrong and the Sam DLC

>>382730785
>Frame rate adds very little once you get past 30
It reduces input delay significantly, which is a massive deal for anything requiring timing. It's very, very noticable when you play a game as well.
>As another piece of evidence 2D beat em ups had terrible framerates
No they didn't? Pretty much all Capcom and Konami beat em ups (besides Vendetta maybe, been a while since I played it) run at a smooth 60 FPS and are responsive as hell. Double Dragon games have shit framerates and they're very clunky.
>Which would you do to improve it? Raise the frame rate or improve it's graphics.
Make it a fun game for starters. You want a better example? Super Double Dragon. Game's very clunky and would play much better if it was 60 FPS while sacrificing graphics. For evidence of that you can play Advance which has very similar mechanics but doesn't run like utter shit.
>There's repetitive combat but there is also repetitive environments and both of those are negative.
Sure, the question is which is more important though.

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>382718840
Am i glad i read the black text first. Saved me the trouble reading what i can only guess is a desperate attention bait wall of green text memery

>>382716417
i wish there were more games like DMC, platinum games are cool but they just dont feel the same

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>>382721368
But there is, it's called Razor's Edge

>>382703231
Each weapon in Bayonyetta is different they just share basic attacks like high time and stinger.
>>382702996
Imo both bayonetta and doc don't have enough moves.
>>382701526
We need officials controllers that have more face button for more moves for better combos.

>>382730785
Also just booted up Revenge of Death Adder again, it runs at 60 fps so what are you talking about?

should I buy Soul Calibur or God Hand?
VERY important question

>>382701526
it isn't worth doing when you can invest a tenth of the budget instead for a generic open world FPS that will say more because it's more popular

>>382732357
For the single player experience? God Hand of course.

I meant Soul Calibur II

>>382704841
How was 3 incomplete in any way?

>>382732898
You serious?

You could see it in the art, level design and the way the game progressed not to mention the chess board pieces trying to pad enemy variety.

The only way this game would not feel incomplete is if you haven't played the first and seen how much detail went into those things.

>>382732357
>>382732524
They're two completely different styles of games, I don't really get the comparison, but God Hand will have a stronger single-player experience obviously. SC2 is bretty gud though, I'd recommend it if you have people to play it with.

>>382727264
the combat meter is what seperates good players from bad ones you retard, in DMC you get more orbs by switching weapons and doing different combos instead of holding down triangle like a monkey. same applies to bayo

>>382733375
>level design
Only somewhat tangential but is there an action game with worse level design than DMC3? The Leviathan chapter in particular is awful.

>>382733593
I completely ignore the combo meters. They are a distraction, if there was a way to turn it off I would. What goes on in the actual game world is far more interesting than some little number in the top right corner of the screen which has no real connection to anything else.

The reason to do different combos and weapons is to see different animations and experience different play styles. How would someone like you act in the pre-DMC beat em ups? "Oh wow why would I ever play as Mike Hagger instead of Cody? There's no combo meter for switching characters?"

People that obsess over some micro part of the game (the number up in the corner) are autestic losers. In short if you believe removing the combo meter would signficantly change the game you're mentally defective.

The only use I see for them is if you are someone who has no other games to play and you need to milk your old games by trying to Platinum them instead of moving onto new experiences.

>>382734736
Let's ignore the combo meter since that is the least of Bayo 2's problems and watch this video. Do you not see why the way they designed the game around Witch Time is a problem?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7jipey9Evw

>>382734736
Combo meters no but scoring systems do add a lot of depth to games and more importantly structure your play through objective performance metrics. Obviously it's not important in casual play but when you get to a point of basic competency they're a good addition.

>>382734162
DMC4

>>382731665
Razor's Edge is janky as fuck

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I like Momiji in Razor's Edge a lot and mostly play her. It's currently my favorite action games and would love to see a NG4 with the same amount of content. The one thing I do hate about it are the campaign bosses. The ones in trails are more enjoyable rather than ignoring.

I recently got into Sigma 2 and really like the weapons that aren't available for Ryu in Razor's Edge.

Why do most autists that play these games think they're experts in game design

>>382734736
getting better at the game>higher ranks>more currency to upgrade your shit, the style meter is an essential part of the game that would dumb it down if it were removed

>>382735948
It's especially hilarious when they obviously have no idea what they're talking about like that 30 fps guy earlier seemingly thinking that character animations are the same as game framerate lel

>>382735762
Nice buzzword. You wanna be specific or do you not have anything to say?

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>>382701526
>Devil Mashers Cry
>surpassed

there is no lower than bottom

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>>382735918
>I like Momiji in Razor's Edge

Good lad

Yes the best thing about Sigma 2 is that it has the biggest weapon variety in the franchise.

Razor's Edge adds some moves from the missing weapons to a different one like the Tonfa's "Flower Garland Drop" being a Katana move.

>>382735918
Why do these people leave the tutorial button prompts on? Jesus, do they know there's an options screen?

>>382736072
But getting good requires multiple playthroughs which means you'll upgrade everything, and you can't even spend those extra orbs on items.

>>382735948
>You need to be an expert on a subject to be able to appreciate it and criticize it

Why do underages still think it's okay to post on this board?

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>>382735529
fuck you, DMC 4 was good

>>382737815
nah the levels were dog shit and they made you redo them

Rank the DMC games, I've only played the first one

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>>382738139
>DMC1>DMC3>DMC4>DmC>DMC2

>>382701526
Dmc3 is better

>>382738139
3 > 4 > 1 > my dick size > DmC > the new zelda > 2

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>There are people out there who think that platinum style games haven't gotten better as they've made more of them
Wew fucking lad.

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>>382738681
>3 of the 4 best were during the 6th gen
Really makes you think.

>>382738681
Agreed, TMNT and Transformers are their masterpieces

>>382707623
Platforming, puzzles, and non combat segments of platinum style games have always been the worse bits. They trimmed the fat in their later action games.

>>382738871
>The licensing stuff they give to B team to fund A team's projects means that the company is bad
No matter how much you spin this will never be a valid argument.

>>382737250
>getting good requires multiple playthroughs
it varies from person to person, halfway through you should have a decent grasp on the mechanics and killing enemies with no problems

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>>382735918
>I recently got into Sigma 2 and really like the weapons that aren't available for Ryu in Razor's Edge.

Yeah, there's literally only one reason why NG2 is my favorite. Wish these were in RE

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>>382738681
They literally haven't.

MGR was lightning in a bottle (hurr) everything else is mediocre to shit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=na5i80ihzwc

>>382738978
>most of their games for the past 4 years have been crap
>not a valid argument
It's not like they've released masterpieces either, Bayo 2 was alright and Nier was pretty good but that's it.

>>382739640
>>382739582
>MGR, Bayo 1, Bayo 2, Vanquish, Nier A, Wonderful 101
I honestly never say this but you are honestly a bunch of nostalgic faggots. DMC is still good be the genre's only gone up since they left Capcom.

>>382739785
Most of those are their older games, how the fuck did they get better if they're putting out less good games and more shit?

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>>382739785
>Bayo 2
>Nier A

>Good action games

>>382739582
when was this track used? first time i ever hear it

>>382739785
>MGR
Great

>Bayo 1
Mediocre and that's being generous

>Bayo 2
Trash

>Vanquis
Turbo trash

>Nier A
Toddler tier

>Wonderful 101
404 Opinion can't be found

>>382739785

Not trying to be a contrarian. I'm a big fan of action games but I just don't dig Platinum's formula very much. MGR is, for me, the best of the bunch but it's still nowhere near as good as DMC or Ninja Gaiden.

Vanquish and Wonderful 101 really don't fall into the genre we're talking about.

>>382740006
It's the Jack the Ripper track, so after he gets that ability. Don't remember when exactly, i think during the encounter with the rocket soldiers while escaping Denver.

>>382740052
>hating on good games while praising the most buttonmashy game Platinum ever made

>>382740487

Not that anon but it's all subjective, obviously. Bayonetta just doesn't...feel good to play. It's hard to explain. It's very floaty, not terribly difficult (and the few things that are hard are hard in an unfun way) and has a pretty shitty sense of progression.

The games are arcadey in a bad way. I also personally dislike Platinum's intense need to interrupt games with separate genres of gameplay and their weird propensity to make backtracking to fights mandatory.

If you're going to grade us on fights, integrate them into the flow of the level. It's a stupid system that, once again, completely ruins the pacing of a level.

>>382740487
MGR is not great because of the gameplay, but the other games have nothing BUT the gameplay (not counting ass game)

Also if you are gonna list Ass Automata don't complain about mashing.

>>382740901
>I also personally dislike Platinum's intense need to interrupt games with separate genres of gameplay
That's Kamiya for you, calling it arcadey is doing a disservice to the arcades though. If anything arcades were all about cutting out the fluff and making a focused experience, fuck Kamiya and his stupid gimmicks desu.

>>382740934

Yeah, MGR gets a lot right in tone in terms of the story and music. It has fun with both how over the top they can make Raiden and the weird humor Metal Gear games tend to have.

I'll give Bayo tone too. They let Bayonetta be a real character and enjoy herself a lot which is fun. The sexual stuff never feels exploitative to me because it makes perfect sense for her as a character.

>>382741098

I mean the main gameplay feels arcadey. I agree with the whole separating the wheat from the chaff thing.

You'd think for a game that's already 5-6 hours long they'd remove the unnecessary stuff to make replays more fun.

Fuck that pre-boss rocket sequence. That fight is arguably the most fun I had in the game but I can't stand to replay the mission for that fucking sequence.

>>382740934
>MGR is not great because of the gameplay
Then it's not a good action game.

>>382741354

I'd agree. It's a great game but it's not a great action game.

>>382741354
Then Platinum has literally never made a good action game. Happy?

It's not the highlight but it's not bad either.

>>382741354
>>382741614

Also forgot to mention that MGR does have some excellent actual high tier action game bosses, while all the other games are bottom of the barrel in that regard.

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>>382741614
>Then Platinum has literally never made a good action game.
But that's wrong.

>>382741614
>bayonetta is a **bad** game

>/v/ hates platinum now
I swear this board just legitimately gets worse by the day.

>>382702996
But Bayonetta has all of these things.

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>>382716904
>Capcom will never give Platinum the rights to make God Hand 2 on next-gen or even a proper God Hand remake
It hurts, it hurts a lot

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Honestly at this point I just want Devil May Cry to die.
Capcom has shown us time and time again that they no longer give a shit about this series. Better to let it die than try to give its corpse CPR.

Threatening reminder that DMC5 IS in the works, Itsuno is directing it, and it'll get announced at TGS
If not, then at the playstation thing

>>382745258
They haven't played bayonetta.

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Will he make it into MvCI?

>>382735918
Why could Team Ninja keep the roll animation in subsequent games?

>>382749358
Rip yipes

>>382749227
It's one of my favorite games of all time. It has literally all of those.

>>382749774
It's one of mine too but what I think what they meant is every weapon has the things anon mentioned.

How come everything feels like a damage sponge in Bayonetta 2?
Rosa has 3x damage and playing rosa felt like playing bayonetta in the first game

>>382749358
no, all capcom characters are ripped from umvc3

>>382751934
because kamiya is a hack

>>382702535
NieR: Automata

>>382751934
>How come everything feels like a damage sponge in Bayonetta 2?
Because the developers fucked up and decided to nerf the shit out of Bayonetta's damage compared to the first game, which was a huge mistake. Certain weapons, like Rakshasa and Undine, were fucking killed because of this.

>>382752261
Kamiya didn't have much to do with 2 aside from okaying certain parts of it.

>>382706125

is that casey neistat?

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I believe

>>382752552
Everything takes ages to die as bayo/jeanne and I don't feel like using Rosa just so I wouldn't have to go through a snorefest because of that shit. Fuck.

>>382752882
You need to use Umbran Climax, it's balanced around that.