Why did stealth games die?

Too hard for normies.

>>382406713
They didn't die, they just became harder to find

not enough epic action and explosions

>>382406713
I love the cutscenes from those games.

They're probably the most atmospheric cutscenes I've ever seen in a vidya.

>>382406713
Because normies. Instant gratification. No skill required. (((Narrative))) over gameplay.

Gaming should return to its elitist roots, where normie """gamers""" are ridiculed and abused because they can't "git gud". Then chased out of gaming.

>>382407179
Garrett is edgy done right
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTXAYNRtBac

>>382407050
i get it
because STEALTH

LOL
that was smart anon
have a (you)

Posting in this thread before it inevitably gets tainted by underage retards shitting on Thief just for the sake of being contrarian.

why do you hate the third one?

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>first person stealth

Splinter Cell and Hitman will ALWAYS be the more recognised titles

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>>382406713
I think they died as a result of more action oriented games getting more and more popular, so devs just didn't want to make stealth games?

Pure speculation on my part though.

>>382408348
That doesn't make them better.

Hitman 2016
Deus Ex
Dishonored
Styk

All these games are steath and have new games out recently

Faggot

>>382407927
We're too old now.

It's not about being contrarian anymore, they literally have never played them. People who say Splinter Cell and Hitman are better weren't playing games when Thief came out.

They're too spoiled to go back to anything pre-2000. They also will never give credit to an old game, they'll give it to the oldest one they played.

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>>382408576
Wull stealth was on life support for a short period, but it's been crawling back into popularity in the last decade.

Man that feels kinda weird to say.

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>>382406713
But they didn't die though. I mean check out pic related. Easily beats Thief or Splinter Cell.

>>382408576
aragami is pretty new too
seems like a bit of a tenchu clone but you can play it in co-op too

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>>382408576
>Styk
stick

>>382408348
I would argue that stealth games MUST be in first person. The entire idea of stealth is a sense of vulnerability, that you're not a destruction machine but a weak element in a fluid hostile system full of partolling guards, spinning security cameras and shifting shadows. Once you place the game in 3rd person, you give the player full view and easy control of their environment. Even such simple thing as leaning to the side to peek through the open door or a corner dissappears in third person where all you need to do is wiggle the camera.

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>>382408774
Shit, that one went under my radar.

>>382406713
Small fan base

>>382408164
The beginning of the end, only considered good now because 4 was so very bad that it made 3 look good.

>>382408576
is styx actually any good or is it a meme game that /v/ likes to say is good just for the sake of being contrarian?

>>382406713
They're difficult and fairly niche.

Both devs and players moved onto new genres as the market expanded.

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>>382408930
I thought it was kind of dull personally.

>>382408846
Too bad the point of Hitman is that you need to see your character model blend in with the crowd when he wears suits since the entire game is based around hiding in the open

>>382408824
Yeah I spelt it wrong like a dumb fuck

>>382408846
This is a good reason. Like fighting games, risk-heavy stealth games place a lot of pressure and responsibility on the player and may be viewed as inaccessible because of it.

>>382406713
normies got bored

>>382408912
what about 3 though is so bad?

>>382409042
A small icon in the corner of a screen would suffice and first person would actually improve tension now you cann't instantly gauge the reaction of enemies

>>382406713
Stealth games are always inherently about making choices. Firefighting your way through a level is possible in most Stealth games, it's just that it would almost certainly beat the purpose of the game.

The issue with modern "stealth" games is that they make it too easy/rewarding to run&gun your way past a level. The two most modern Splinter Cell games are great examples of this.

It's not that Stealth is dead, it's just that most gamers are less interested in ghosting their way through a stealtj game.

What's the most difficult stealth game? What's most difficult stealth level?

>>382406713
They require alot of trial and error and thinking.

>>382409406
When it comes to classic Thieves, probably Return to the Cathedral and Thieves Guild for original, Casing the Joint, Bank, and Kidnap for Metal Age

Stealth was always niche aside from MGS's success but you're just going to greentext MGS and stealth now that I've mentioned it.

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They didn't.

>>382410328
It could be worse.

>>382410431
This. If you strip the game of the Metal Gear branding, and all of the controversy revolving around it. It's probably up there in the top 10 stealth games.

>>382406713
much like their protagonists, they fell under the radar

>>382411185
agreed.
shite metal gear, fucking amazing brilliant video game/stealth game

>>382407927
I honestly don't know why would someone do that. They are old by today's standards, but they're genuinely good games that are still as fun today as I remember them. They're something really cool.

>>382408782
I played Aragami and it was interesting and enjoyable, but pretty rough (the archer boss can go fuck itself, though), there's still a good amount of room for improvement. I'd be interested in seeing how they could polish it in a sequel

There was a thread praising fucking SC Blacklist a few hours ago.

We are truly in hell.

>>382406713
because the granpappy of stealth went to shit and abandoned stealth for run and gun, Snake Eater was as good as it got and ever will be

>>382411585
Blacklist is unironically good though.

>>382411737
Oh boy, a retard.

>>382411185
Not at all, when you do those things it becomes a clunky narrow TPS with retarded AI. MGS3 was slightly challenging int he right way, but everything past the first three are gimmick festivals

Dishonored 2 literally came out last year to pretty solid reviews, anon, and it's getting an expansion later this year.

Which is better, The Sword or Life of the Party?

>>382411836
But it's good.

>>382412120
The Sword

>>382412000
>clunky
Are you on crack? Phantom Pain has some of the smoothest controls in a TPS. Also congratulations on your trips.

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>>382408576
>tfw Disney killed Deus Ex
If only you could see what they've done to your name, Walt.

>>382408576
Except for Styx, all these games have stealth elements in them, but they are NOT stealth games with Deus Ex being the worst offender.

>>382412297
Compared to real smoothness like Thief or Tenchu series MGS is painfully exploitable with its mess of redundant items, backtracking, and completely fucked up pacing

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>>382411185
It's baby shit even compared to the new Hitman because of all the stuff you can't do. Namely it doesn't have a single good "level" so stealthing consists of THAT'S AN ENEMY SNIPER, BOSS and side-saddling through enemy encampents consisting of two-three soldiers and a couple of tactically placed boxes.
Fucking Far Cry 3/4 are better "Stealth" games, if only because the A.I. is half decent on higher difficulties and the world/outpost design is superior. MGSV is fluid and controls so well, it's a waste.
>mfw the Code Talker mansion

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I actually really liked Invisible Inc, it made turn-based stealth work
But I wish it had a non-indie game budget, it could be so much more

>>382412430
How the hell is Hitman not a stealth game?

>>382412871
Plus the setting, plot, and banter are all dogshit non-existent.
>just biege deserts
>plot is more mgs "deep" shit pulled straight from Hideo's half ass
>communication and character moments between Big Boss and the Diamond Dogs are literally nothing because Boss doesn't speak and all the cutscenes are just melodrama "SKULL FACE RUINED EVERYTHING" shit

>>382408576

This, plus the dozens of first and third person games that include stealth sections or stealth elements.

It's like asking why Westerns died. They didn't. They come out at a steady pace, and elements of the Western have been appropriated by tons of films in various genres. You only FEEL like they've slowed down because you're looking backwards at a compressed list of highlights from years of output.

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>>382413160
>2004
>It's an Big Boss filler episode
>ELEVEN YEARS LATER
>Metal Gear is now entirely about Cold War Jesus and his Oedipus complex
>mfw

Jesus fuck, Kojima. At least Lucas had the gonads to show Anakin going nuclear, even if it was just as nonsensical.

>>382413160
It's funny to think that Thief games have better atmosphere and more poignant plots than MGS5 despite not having multimillion dollar cutscenes and Hollywood actors doing the voices.

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Immersive Sims just don't sell.
They require too much effort to get invested in for most people these days.
Thief 2 was the last game LGS made and they had so little time and money they had to copy paste an entire level.

>>382413805
That's too bad, they are great and cRPGs aren't really made for stealth characters.

>>382413087
Not him, but I never really considered Hitman to be a stealth game, at least not one in the traditional sense. Its more like a puzzle game in a way.

>>382407050

Pretty funny

>>382407576
old garrett yes

new one no

>>382406713
Games like Thief perfected stealth so early on. They mastered what the mechanics of stealth should be, making it hard to find a way to elaborate on the genre. Stealth games today are more like their earlier counterparts than any other genre.

Viktoria, are you prepared to give Mr. Garrett his... c̫̖̗̗ô̶̆̀m̼͍͔̻̞̆̾ͭͪp͈̝͎̮̯͇ͬ̓ͤ̓̆ͩ̿͡é͓̬͉̣̩n̥͓̠͍̼s̸̗̼̘̺ͮ̏̇a̫̭̹̫ͭ̄͛ͤ̀́͝t͍i̖͇̳̱̯̝ȏ̴̖͇͔͍̗̈̒͋ͨnͭ̒ͩ̏?̩̭ͧ̽

>>382406713
refining and improving the mechanics of the stealth genre have become too difficult and too expensive for developers, and the market has started to react poorly to the same old games that the genre has been pushing out for the last decade. So, in turn, the market has reacted, saying "people don't like stealth games anymore, and we dont want to try to revolutionize the genre, so we wont make stealth games anymore"

>>382408576
>hitman
Peaked with hitman 2, and was slowly watered down after that.
>deus ex
It has as much stealth as MGS 1, it didnt evolved since 1990's.
>dishonored
read above... you can even fit crysis under this cryteria, even FUCKING SKYRIM...
>whatever you wrote there
Google gives me nothing, so this must be a good stealth game...

>>382414406
>THICC WOOD
Goodsie woodsie.

>>382415275
>Peaked with hitman 2, and was slowly watered down after that.
But Blood Money had best stealth and AI, Silent Assassin made no sense, I wish they would make a remake of it.

>>382406713
genres only die when fans of the genre become lazy and stop making the games they want to play

>>382415275
He meant Styx: Master of Shadows.

>>382415514
Its a similar formula that you see in thief with the light gem.
>how long you are exposed to light
>how much bright you become
This triggers a detection, a remark or whatever in different situations, sometimes is speed, sometimes is keep yourself in the shadows.
A good example to test this is the embassy level in silent assasin, it gives you guards all over the place, and the target to walk arround, try to be in front of the spetz nats and close enough to notice you for more than 10 seconds and see what happens.
You can walk past him, and like 70% of the times wont start a firefight, with guards you need to do retarded stuff to rise the bar.
>leestrictid eeria, leef inmididly

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>>382415350

>>382406713
>styx
>stealth bastard
>hitman
>thief
>mark of the ninja
>invisible inc

>>382415569
>thief 3 was a flop, and there people thought that the stealth genre was going to be absorbed into other games and became normal
>never happens
>the dark mod appears
>eidos: hmmm, looks like we can leech the thief name at least once more
>then, the "reboot" when you cant jump and shit.
>flops because its a piece of shit
So, after 12 years.
>thief 1 and 2 has a big amount of fan missions
>thief 3 became playable, and even has a few fan missions
>the dark mod has enough missions to keep you entretained for a while.
>the stealth mechanic became a standard, but most games still fuck it up after 20 years of being exposed to it, and how it works.
Cant remember the combination, but there was a pack of mods for oblivion that gives you "thief tools" and tweak the AI to be like in the original thief, so theres that too. The genre is not dead, but its not as popular as story driven action packed interactive (barely) exprience, needs patience, and logic, but most of all, needs people with better attention span than what is rule this days.

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>>382406713
They didn't die.
When gaming became mainstream and not just a loser hobby for losers, development of video games saw a rise too.
Good stealth games became drowned out by all the garbage game companies push out.
Afew well known are Dishonored, Deus Ex, and maybe the new Thief.

>>382408846

Meh.

A third-person game gives you more spacial awareness than in real life because you can see behind your character, but a first-person game gives you much less spacial awareness than real life because you're experiencing the virtual world through a narrow rectangular tunnel and therefore you don't have a good sense of how hidden you are. Some games literally have a HUD indicator to tell you whether you're hidden or not, but that's not really fun.

>>382417250
I'll be your honey-maker

>>382418268
You bring up a good point.

The spatial awareness in first person mode is absurd.

Man, I miss old Thief.
There was just something satisfying about a heist gone right.
I miss stealth games where you needed to actual prepare for the job with limited but multiple choices for resources.
Finding the right balance in your kit was just as important as being able to sneak around in the shadows.

Now it's just "WELP. THEY FOUND ME. TIME TO TRANSFORM INTO A BIG SHADOWY REPTILE MONSTER OR WHATEVER THE FUCK WHO CARES ANYMORE AND THEN MURDER EVERY LAST WITNESS SO IT'S LIKE I WAS NEVER HERE LOL"

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Hey.
You played my newest game, Rakash? No?
Best genuine fuckin' stealth gameplay you're gonna get outta these pansy game devs for a long while.
Hope you liked Deadpool though. 'Cause that's my fuckin' humor now.

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>>382407050

>>382406713
>stealth games
>dead

Wooot?

What about Assassin's Creed games?
Or the Far Cry franchise?
Shadow of Mordor?
Ghost Recon Wildlands?
Dishonored 1-2?
Escape from Tarkov?
Watch dogs 1-2?
Etc, etc...

The genre is at an all time high, since devs give you multiple ways to play games now. And there is always a stealthy way to play.

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>>382418907

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>>382418907
I'm dying.

>>382407495
>(((Narrative)))
It all makes sense now
People who like "narrative" stories are also the type of people that like to pull the liberal card of silencing the opposition.
While those who favor gameplay are more likely to have a worldview that is in favor of meritocracy.

In other worlds
Gameplay = redpilled
Narrative = SEIZE THE MEANS OF PRODUCTION!!!

>>382408930
It's an ok game, doesn't try a anything new but what it does it does ok. It doesn't excell in anything compared to Thief.

Why do we have this thread every day?

>>382420134
We never have this thread, last time we had it it died in ten minutes.

>>382406713
a bunch of boneheaded decisions by square-enix (who owns most of the stealth IPs) made the industry think there isn't a market anymore for stealth games, which is wrong. We only just want good games, no episodic, drm-ridden augmented pre-ordering casual fests

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>>382408348
>the later, more casual titles will be more recognized
woah, really?

>>382420245
Every time I've gotten home from work this week I've seen this fucking thread

>>382420134
because stealth is the best vidya genre

the styx series is absolutely fantastic, so if you haven't tried them yet, go do it.

Daily reminder that resetting every time you get detected and repeating your actions until you get a perfect score is the more casual and less fun way to play stealth games. Accepting your fate and fighting/running until you can return to stealth and actually living with your mistakes results in a massively more enjoyable and engaging experience, and gives the stealth far more tension.

Do any games besides Thief have legitimately weak protagonists? Whats the point of going stealth in Dude Sex or Dishonoured when my guy has robot hands or magic powers?

>>382420683
Yeah, I hate this.

>>382406713
Wat about assassin creed anon xD???
How did u forget the best game of this century lol :)

>>382420668
>actually living with your mistakes
only the old Splinter Cells punished you for getting detected faggot. Even in Thief you can bunnyhop to your escape easily
>>382420683
because Dishonored and Deus Ex are about choices. They're immersive sims. Thief is a strictly stealth games.

I actually tried making a small stealth game once, still got the project on my hard drive. The idea was that you were a young boy who's health was crippled by a disease, abandoned at a young age you were forced to pickpocket and steal to survive. Due to your crippled health you wouldn't have any way to really fight back against any guards, if you got caught that was it, you're probably gonna die unless you run. The game was set to be mission based in a hub world, the hub world idea was so that I could expand the game at any moment and players could just keep playing. It also gave way to not be stuck within one type of environment and would allow the game to be somewhat fresh with what could be done. Due to this the ways you could flee would've have to be immense, I gave the player a way to climb any surface, this would obviously be limited to certain materials in the beginning allowing the player to unlock more ways as he progressed in the game. You would have all kind of weird gadgets that allowed you to find ways to escape or control the environment.

But the best thing was the AI, in a stealth game the AI is the most important aspect of the game, it needs to be good damn good. The AI wasn't dumb and wouldn't just forget you because you left the room, he wouldn't just search the area where you went missing, he would keep searching, and if you didn't run far enough away he would find you. I wanted the AI to kick your ass if you made a mistake, but give the players the tools to escape.

But no one gave a fuck so I stopped working on it, and now it just sits on my hard drive collecting dust.

>>382420683
>Do any games besides Thief have legitimately weak protagonists?
yes, you fag. Styx is a goblin that goes down in one hit and he NEEDS to use stealth in order to survive.

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>>382408576
>Dishonored

>>382412430
Deus Ex is an RPG

>>382420960

>But no one gave a fuck so I stopped working on it

>no one

Stop lying Anon, it was you that didn't give a fuck. If you had you'd have kept working on it.

>>382408930
I thought it as a decent stealth game, but I got really bored of it, so I never finished it

>>382421346
Nope I kept posting progress in the "how's your game" threads and literally no one gave a fuck as I kept posting for well over a year. And at that point I just gave up, I couldn't take it anymore.

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>>382406713
Shadow Tactics came out just last year and it's awesome.

>>382413941
Well you're retarded, it's a different kind of stealth game but it's a stealth game. You have to avoid detection do the same sort of activities, infiltrate secretly and kill stealthily. The only difference instead of hiding in shadows, you're hiding in plain sight.

The idea that hitman is "more of a puzzle game" fits just as much into a shadows stealth game where you "just figure out the combinations to do to get from point A to B without alerting people"

>>382421816
this is a puzzle game

>>382421884
And Thief is an FPS.

>>382408930
I only played the first part. It's a game with an amazing idea, long levels with many paths (you'll have to look up and down) to take that actually forces you to be stealthy. The bad part is that Cyanide is a small studio, so the later part of the game reuses previously played levels, but if you like stealth, you'll love as much as I did.

jesus christ I looked it up and Mark of the Ninja came out 5 fucking years ago
where did the time go?

>>382421952
only if you shoot arrows