Dark Souls is the least "Souls"

>>382234870
>It's the only game that lets you level up at any bonfire without having to go to a central hub.
Why was this changed? What were they thinking?

>>382234974
I literally do not have a clue. It just adds on a mandatory two loading screens and dislogue every time you want to level up.

Interesting observation 2bh OP

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>>382234870
Feeling same OP. I would rather explore dark and tight corridors of castles to find sweet loot while I can avoid cleverly laid traps with observation and logic instead of rushing throughout magically illuminated large arena after large arena and end up in a bullshit trap that I can't forsee because welcum 2 dork souls xDD
>>382235213
Dark souls 2 is the worst offender because instead of demon's souls where you select leveling and NPC talks in the background while you select which stats to level up, in DS2 you first listen to bitch, because you don't want to skip some dialog accidentally in your first playthrough and then she opens up the menu and then you select level up and THEN SHE KEEPS FUCKING TALKING BECAUSE MUH DEMON'S SOULS REFERENCE XDDD then you fucking level up on top of the TWO FUCKING LOADING SCREENS and if I remember correctly there was a bug that actually delayed the menu to open up in regular DS 2. Thank god I didn't play it on xbox 360/ps 3.
The reason why they don't want you to level up whenever you want is pretty clear since the death mechanics and corpse run and I like that aspect for making death meaningful but for fucks sake why do you force me to load the game two times to level up and continue playing it?

Fast travel and leveling/upgrading anywhere isn't what Souls is about. As for a sense of dread, how about having to run through entire levels in DeS to get to the boss, every time you die to the boss? I know lots of places have shortcuts, but look at 1-2, 4-1, or 4-2.

You're basically describing all the reasons it's a better implementations of the same concepts.

Having fast travel instantly was what I hated most about 2 and 3. It made it so the map designers could be lazy shits.

Woah... Really makes you think...

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>>382234870
You will never again experience the dread of being stuck cursed in the depths and the joy of beating that area after so much bullshit.
Many people hate depths and blighttown but they are the two areas that give the game the feeling of making an actual journey and it's made all the more impresive when you realized blighttown was on the bottom of the Anor londo giant wall, truly making you feel like you're but a fly in the land of gods

>>382234870

You're retarded and/or autistic.

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>Be DS2 fanboy
>Try to villainize DS3 to make it the black sheep instead of your favorite title
>Shit its not working
>DS1 IS THE BLACK SHEEP
>NO BB IS THE BLACK SHEEP
>DEMONS WAS ALWAYS THE BLACK SHEP
>BAWWWWWWWWWWW STOP HATING MY FAVORITE GAME

>>382237236
>>382237763
>>382237850
>and it's better for it.

lrn2read

>>382238125
>Reading that tl;dr mess

You will get a skim at best.

is it worth it to buy a ps4 just to play bloodborne

>>382238367
If you can get a cheap one I guess

>>382237850
DS2 is objectively the best in the series though, if you're a real fan who plays the games multiple times

>>382238619
>no true scotsman

>>382237681
Yeah, the realisation of the scope of the enviroment was really something in DaS1. And the cherry on top of it is when you discover Ash Lake.

>>382238619
>objectively
Opinion discarded

>>382234870
Nah DeS has the same feeling because you dont get any checkpoints until you beat the whole area and boss so just exploring would often wear you down only to find that fog wall and turn back hoping you can find a shortcut if you are too weak. Level based is superiior to all but das1 pre-lord-vessel because it has their older level design from past games.

Wanna know why you are forced to a hub everytime in all the other games?
Because it makes you think more about available npcs to spend souls on rather than always just pumping stats.DaS1 leveling at the bonfire was a mistake for most players because they dont do anything else even though the hub gets plenty of NPCs

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>>382234870
It's also the only game with world design that loops into itself frequently. Bloodborne only actually does this once from what I can remember (forest cave to beginning). Individual levels in BB have tons of shortcuts and the world design is built into each other but you are rarely given the option to travel through levels in a non linear fashion.

I kinda like going to cute girls to level up.

>>382238619
I always feel a weird sense of dread when I think there are people who actually think this and aren't just fucking around.

You're free to like what you like, and hold your own opinions, but to miss the point of a series of games this badly is just baffling to me. Dark Souls 2 was an utter fucking failure at everything that made Demons and Dark Souls memorable.

>>382234870
>It's the only game that actually instilled a sense of dread due to the lack of fast travel
>It's the only game that has both varied environments and atmospheres
Ahahahahahaha

>>382234870
I would agree with statement since it is the only game without "souls" in the title.

>>382240817
>but to miss the point of a series of games this badly is just baffling to me. Dark Souls 2 was an utter fucking failure at everything that made Demons and Dark Souls memorable.
Meh not really.
Souls is just souped on Evergrace with other aspects from their past games all crammed into one, they are all pretty meh unless your a raving fanboy. Just VERY simplistic Action games with light RPG elements that can largely be ignored. If you want an RPG other games are miles ahead and the same goes for action. Its too bad other game can't into level design nearly as good.

The character creator is kinda neat I guess.

>>382241076
I couldn't have asked for a more spectacular confirmation of what I just said. Case rested

>>382240817
This, the recent resurgence of das2 apologists is disturbing. Have you fuckers played that game? Felt how it feels just to fucking move, roll, or swing your weapon? Walked through the same fucking boxes of repeating textures with 0 details, filled with enemies that don't fit in geographically? I dont get how anyone can legit say its the best, or even better than das3. Das3 may be uninspired as shit, but at least it got fucking rolling right. It gets even worse when these insuffrable faggots never even argue for the actually good parts of 2. They just say that the bad parts were actually good and that if you disagree youre either a nostalgiafag or a sonybro.

>You will never go back to those original Demons Souls threads on /v/
If you weren't there for them just die. You missed the apex.

>>382240817
>>382241076
>>382241251
Like pottery

>>382240817
this isn't me but I often defend das2 just for (You)s its so easy.

Earning fast travel was a major improvement which I'm disappointed the sequels abandoned. Actually scampering around the valleys and ramparts made the game more immersive.

Also, the addition of more bonfires to warp to that came with the post-AotA patches was a mistake. Fewer warp locations with more walking was better.

>>382241580
>The fucking tense atmosphere just wondering if you should press forward in the hopes of a bonfire or return to save your souls
>The delicate balancing around the estus system
These were some of the MAJOR improvement Dark Souls had over Demons and they through it the fuck away.

>>382241580
At least fast travel from the get go in DS2 was desinged with the hub leading to multiple places at the start, DS3 doesn't need it at all except to go back to level up at the hub

>>382241251
>muh games are soo good other people cant think they are only mediocre, they must be trolls or butthurt
I know From better than that, their programmers are trash tier and BB has DaS3/BB has all the same issues DeS has on fucking PS3.

Shit souls combat isnt even very interesting compared to an actual action game with combos and air.
I guess my honeymoon [phase ended before most because I thought they were all fantastic until I stepped back and compared them to all the other games out there.

The first one was fantastic because its novelty and the second managed to be the same but completely new while adding awesome features and fixing the awful shit. Every other sequel proceeded to take 1 step forward and 2 back. They got worse each game aside from BB which is unique enough to stand on its own.

>>382241929
>DaS1
>completely new
>BB
>unique enough

You are literally retarded.

>>382241929
>with combos and air.
Yeah, because juggling a punching bag with arbitrary attacks sure is fun and deep. What set Dark Souls apart in the first place is that when you start the game and go into the Undead Burg you kill the enemies in one god damned hit. It's about overcoming the enemy's defenses and being surgical with your strikes instead of the mindless wailing you get in other action games.

>>382234974
Miyazaki wanted a levelup waifu in das as well, but probably didn't because of time.

>>382240767
>but you are rarely given the option to travel through levels in a non linear fashion.
You're never given the option, at least for mandatory bosses/areas. You have to do them all in the same order.

>>382242094
DeS and DaS are completely different games outside basic mechanics, you progress and travel the world in vastly different ways.

BB is the only non sequel so I still enjoy it despite how much it feels like it has less in favor of making sure what is there us actually good unlike DaS2/3 which just did what the past games did only worse.

>he cant handle an opinion

>>382239672
>Hub is better because players are dumb

>>382242417
Its a retarded opinion my man

>Demon's Souls
>medieval fantasy rpg with shields and armor and magic
>Dark Souls
>medieval fantasy rpg with shields and armor
>Bloodborne
>victorian lovecraft rpg without shileds and without armor and with guns.

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>>382241331
>the recent resurgence of das2 apologists is disturbing
Or you know, people that just have different opinions.It's not my favorite Souls game but DaS2 (especially with all the dlc) is pretty great.
>Felt how it feels just to fucking move, roll, or swing your weapon?
Swinging is slower which personally I think is fine. I'll give that it does feel weird to move (feels like it was made with wasd movement in mind), but I got over it pretty quickly.
>Walked through the same fucking boxes of repeating textures with 0 details, filled with enemies that don't fit in geographically?
I don't have a problem with enemies, but the game did mange to look worse than DeS and DaS. I guess that's the trade off for lighting/shadows and 60fps.
>or even better than das3
DaS3 is my least favorite Souls game. It's linear in both world design and how the game expects you to play it. Magic outside of a very select number of spells is unusable and the game just expects you to have light armor and a fast weapon (long sword). I'm not saying that you can't use other weapons/armor but the game becomes significantly more challenging when you do. I don't feel is the same with any of the previous Souls games and I probably played through every build on all of the other Souls games.

>>382240817
>to miss the point of a series of games
maybe you're the one missing the point? Do you only play each game once? DS2 has so much variety, the best pvp (both technically and balance wise), the most weapon and moveset variety, it has the most covenents, one for every play style. It was really designed for the hardcore dark souls player, as it caters to them in all sorts of ways

I understand if you just casually play each game once and then move on to the next AAA flavor of the month or whatever, you wouldn't see half the stuff in the game that makes it so good

>>382241331
Its bait. They are just bored and are baiting for (You)s
Many people expected a new game announced at e3 to shitpost around and since that didn't happen we have to shitpost by defending the clearly worst entry.

Its the same reason Metroid threads had so many other M defenders for a while.

>>382243090
One (You) for you but not anymore. You are greedy.

>>382237681
It's really cool. You venture to the depths and blighttown, suffer through it, you come out back stronger and at the end of blighttown there's a shortcut back to firelink shrine. You're back into where you started, back into the open but much stronger from the hardships you fought through.

Another game that does that is Super Metroid.

>>382242773
DeS and DaS are quite different, Des is more like Blackswordsmen/Golden Arc berserk(Dark fantasy), while Das is more like Fantasia Berserk(High Fantasy).

>>382243374
Sure. But the argument is that das1 and demon's are more different from each other than fucking Bloodborne.

>>382242912
I can at least accept someone liking 2 more than 3. Like I said, 3 is completely uninspired, and imo filled with more wasted potential than even 2. 2 has some really fun stuff like powerstancing and more varied magic. But what fun is powerstancing if every boss is bland and forgettable? What is the value in having such great build variety when nothing you fight is interesting

>>382237681
I want a proper new souls game with a huge map and without teleporting from bonfires.
PLEASE

>>382243525
No its not. I was saying DaS1 actually added new ideas to the core game while 2 and 3 only fucked shit up, while BB was unique so still bretty gud.
Learn to read.

Seriously I literally said
>They got worse each game aside from BB which is unique enough to stand on its own.

>>382243882
>DaS1
>completely new
>BB
>unique enough

DaS1 was essentially a remake of Demon's with many recurring things because they had to make it new to not step on any rights issues.

>>382234974
Probably because of referencing DeS. At least it's the impression the Herald in 2 gave me, even one of her animations resembles one of the Maiden's.

>>382234870
>the only game that lets you level up at any bonfire without having to go to a central hub.
It's funny because people tend to talk about this as one of Souls' defining features when only DaS does it. And a shame too, because it was perfect for that game and the other Dark Souls should have followed suit.

>>382243993
And so is BB.

Lets see
>DeS
>decent combat
>unique setting
>level based progression
>light RPG thats largely useless
>completely unique system to unlock secrets

DaS
>DeS
>decent combat
>unique setting
>world based progression with shortcuts and warps
>light RPG thats largely useless
>completely unique system to unlock secrets

BB>DeS
>decent combat
>unique setting
>world based progression with shortcuts and warps
>light RPG thats largely useless
>completely unique system to unlock secrets

If you ignore the setting they are all the same functionally. I dont use shields in DaS and somehow BB is slower than surge so pretending muh fast combat is magically better doesnt work. They are all about the same in combat, with DeS and BB being the "easiest" yet also most punishing.

>>382244321
Is anyone else seeing this retard? Am I falling for bait here.
literally everything is saying is wrong.

>>382238619
>No true Scotsman
Oh boy, here we go again with the DaS2 defense force.

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>>382243592
I guess it comes down to why you play the Souls games.
I like being rewarded for exploring in a game that also has enjoyable combat.
Other people are fine just running through the levels to get to the bosses, different strokes for different folks.

>>382241331
>Felt how it feels just to fucking move, roll, or swing your weapon?
swinging your weapon is fine
rolling only feels bad if you don't put any points in adaptability (common DS2 newbie mistake)
moving has awful per axis deadzones, but it's not worth discarding the whole game over, it's not like From Software games have ever been about fluidity of controls. Just look at King's Field, it's slow and clunky as fuck but it's still an awesome series. You're kinda missing the point if you let a minor control problem ruin the whole game for you.

>>382244674
>but it's not worth discarding the whole game over
Yeah, it kind of is. If your game doesn't control well it is a bad game.

>>382234870
damn, never thought of it that way

>>382242912
>Or you know, people that just have different opinions

You have to admit that since DaS3's release a lot more people started defending 2 than before. He's not exactly wrong.

>>382244837
actually, most of Dark Souls strengths are unrelated to basic controls

>>382244674
>early game is artificially difficult until you pump a gorillion stats into ADP
>your character is either going to be weak as fuck because you didn't level anything else and don't have any stamina, HP, or stats to use the weapons you like
>or you'll have all that, but repeatedly get hit by "shockwaves" every time you fight something because you didn't level ADP yet
>game literally only becomes playable at the halfway point and beyond
>but not really because even once you mitigate "shockwaves" with high ADP, the hitboxes are still the worst they've ever been in the entire series so the "shockwaves" hit you anyway
epic

>>382238367
You also get p5 and some weebshit

>>382245104
But it does have the basic controls down. It's a prerequisite.

>>382241331
>Das3 may be uninspired as shit, but at least it got fucking rolling right.

are you baiting with this comment

das3 rolling is the worst in the franchise since it has the most iframes and lowest stamina consumption

also swinging weapons in das3 is shit since everything is so fast, there's no weight to anything

>>382237681
>when you realized blighttown was on the bottom of the Anor londo giant wall
I love Ash Lake precisely because of that. You think that you are at the bottom, but then you find The Great Hollow and surreal Ash Lake.

>>382238367
Just BB?
Not really. Maybe if you can get them real cheap, but a console for a single game is a waste.

>>382245229
das3 was low quality meme tier trash. After people raged against das2 they had to play it safe and throw in every reference they could to the first game. Felt like a randy pitchford game

>>382237850
There are no ds2 fanboys it's all shitposting

>this debate again
new Matthewmatosis video on this very topic was on point as fuck.

>>382234870
Maiden in Black was great but I'm sick of From copying her over and over. Leveling at bonfires is better than leveling at NPCs, but if they REALLY want to keep the NPCs at the very least they could do something new. Hell they should probably rethink leveling altogether while they're at it, it felt so pointless in BB, basically only acts as a difficulty slider.

>>382244674
I've played Demons Souls countless times, Dark Souls 1 at least 12, Bloodborne a bunch, and done 3-4 solid playthroughs of 3.

I played through 2 once and SoTF once and a half. Shit game.

>>382245734
>I played through 2 once
so you admit you haven't tried most of the builds, weapons, covenants, etc. So posting from a position of ignorance. Got it.

>>382245861
It doesn't matter how much replayability the game has if it doesn't have some fucking playability in the first place.

>>382245861
No, I haven't. Why the fuck would I when the story was retarded and the world a total bore to play through? And really, i played through it 2 and a half times, which was physically painful by the way. The gameplay doesn't make these games good, it's serviceable and decent.

I'm not going to play that shit in every conceivable way when every other game in the series left a much, much better impression the first playthrough.

>>382245657
Who's that and why do you keep citing him every time someone talks against Dark Souls 2?

>>382245672
The thing is that in DeS the Maiden worked because the game's level based progression works with it, you do your section of the level, best the boss, reach the Archstone, and back to the Nexus, and then you have all these services at your disposal. They work together and enhance each other as a result.

In Dark Souls the levels are a whole unit, there's no returning to the hub constantly, instead, you're forced to manually warp back for no reason and level up/stock up there, and then warp back. It's a cut in the action instead of a part of it, and it feels super tacked on, and like it doesn't belong there, it's not an organic part of the gameplay.

>>382245861
Following your logic you shouldn't speak about the other games either if you haven't tried every build possible.

>>382245178
P5 IS weebshit

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I fucking love these threads. It's always 10 people explaining everything that's either broken or wrong in DaS2 and 2 people telling them they didn't play it right or enough to have a correct opinion.

>>382246302
Ignore him, he thinks everyone sucks off youtube ecelebs.

>>382245202
This. If your game doesnt at least function properly, it sours the entire experience. This is the baseline. There are a ton of other issue I have with das2, and ones that I even feel much more strongly about, such as the lackluster bosses and abysmal level and world design. But das2 just straight up fails the basics of being a good game.

>>382245229
Got rolling right as in it doesnt feel like complete ass just to press the button. Talking about responsiveness and animations here, not iframes, which I admit in das3 are fucking absurd.

Also
>cherrypick one sentence from a post
>wtf this whole post is bait
Sick, my dude

Dark Souls feels more like an actual adventure than the other games, which is why I like it the most.

Too true, Dark Souls ended up being the odd one despite the fact that it was thought to be an exemplar used to measure the other games.

>>382246992
It's really ironic, because in their attempt to 'defend' 2, they only make people warier of it. 2 is not the worst thing ever but these people act like it's a misunderstood victim that didn't actually do anything wrong.

>>382247736
This, the argument is never about what 2 did right, its about presenting 2s massive flaws as positives

>>382242242
was gonna be Prisila, at least thats what ive heard

>>382249262
I thought she was just supposed to be a companion. She has sitting animations for the bonfires and all that.

Goes to show that sometimes running out of time is a good thing.

>>382234870
>It's the only game that actually instilled a sense of dread due to the lack of fast travel
DeS gave me that dread since you were in it for the long haul when you entered a level most of the time. Not every level had a shortcut. Dying in Shrine of Storms-2 fucking sucked.

>>382234974

Because From is literally incompetent. Miyazaki had two truly good games in him for a dark fantasy revival and that was it. BB takes too many pointless steps back to not make me question their basic competence and DaS2 and 3 go without saying.

>>382241331
SOFTS newfags who came after 2014 that think it's the best.

>>382240817
>to miss the point of a series of games this badly is just baffling to me. Dark Souls 2 was an utter fucking failure at everything that made Demons and Dark Souls memorable.
That fits DaS3 more than it does DaS2 and everyone knows it but refuses to admit it.

>>382234974
Because you can't teleport at the start like all the other games? It was much better that way.

>>382242242
Then I feel sad that he didn't understand how the level up systems in DeS and DaS worked perfectly for the games they were in. They shouldn't have been mixed

>>382250765
It wasn't that bad, you just had to roll past the skeletons in the hallways. It is a pretty long section, though.

>>382252157
I can't say anything since I haven't played DaS3, and I'm too burned out to want to play it anyway.

>>382253667
>run past reaper and infinite enemies
>run along a cliff dodging spears and skellies
>enter cave of laser face enemies and run down narrow paths
>more cliff, more spear dodging, gold skellies
>even more laser faces and a reaper
>forgot to equip your thieve's ring
>get rekd by old hero
>repeat
Oh lawd

>>382255001
>forgot to equip your thieve's ring
>get rekd by old hero
>Not being always a ghost to avoid fucking up the tendency
>Implying
I rolled for days and I managed just fine, you can too.

>>382245137
Do you people really suck this much at DS2? You dont have to dump a single point into ADP and still come out on top.

Im building a pyromancer atm and Im level 73(no grinding of BA) and i've only died like 6 times, one of which was a me pressing B instead of A and I backstepped off a ledge.

Dodge rolling is super easy.

>>382256626
thief ring has literally zero to do with being a phantom-it's enemy aggro distance

Did Backstepping ever become useful in any game?

>>382247736
Hey man, 2 might not be the best in the series, but it's the most fun to mess around with and I love me some Fume Knight.

Let me just equip 2 cestus for some sweet double fisting action.

>>382258780
Thief Ring reduces aggro range and also muffles your footsteps which comes into play in the Old Hero bossfight.

>>382258954
That's perfectly fine, but I prefer Alonne myself. Also Vanquisher > Bone Fist > Caestus

>>382259031
>Not always being a ghost to avoid fucking up the tendency
This statement makes no sense in the context of the thief ring. That's what I was talking about.

>>382259796
I said that because, since you said not having the Thief's Ring right before Old Hero, I thought you meant you'd be fucked then, when you arrive at the boss, and not before, due to the lack of muffled footsteps, which if you were a phantom, would be a non-issue.

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>>382234870
I hate it, honestly. The only game DaS is better than is DaS2, and that's because DaS2 shit the bed in gameplay. The interconnected world of DaS1 doesn't mean shit to me, especially when it goes bad halfway through. And I don't mind the leveling waifus, like you said, they're a staple.

I get the feeling a lot of people dick ride the first dark souls. I would say it's probably because it was a lot of people's first souls game, but it was my first souls game too, and I still found Demon's Souls vastly superior when I finally got around to it. DaS1 was good, but DeS, BB, and DaS3 are straight up better video games because of how coherently they were developed.

>>382260165
Now, for further clarification in case the thread gets archived now, the "fucking up the tendency now" bit is because in normal gameplay you're pretty much always going to be a phantom because having the wrong tendency makes you miss out on a lot of things, and that extra bit of life isn't worth the risk.
That makes it all fit together, imo.