So we all agree that this is the worst 3D Zelda, right? Please

That's now Skyward Sword.

>inb4 BotW lol XDDD

>>382143150
Best 2D: LttP
Best 3D: MM or this

>>382143373
Patrician Taste right here

>>382143150
It's probably the worst if you play it on Wii. But that's not the only version.

The real worst 3D Zelda is Ocarina of Time take off your nostalgia goggles you know it's true

>>382143150

I was 15 when this came out,

Not my favorite Zelda but I think the GC/Wii U version is the best way to play it.

Got it for Wii day one though

HD edition on Wiiu makes it the best 3D zelda

>>382143150
Skyward Sword is worst 3d.
>BOTW > OOT/TP> MM > WW > SS

>>382143809
>OOT
>better than WW
(You)

>>382143809
I think you accidently switched MM and WW up, friendo.

>>382143873

it definitely is

>>382143715
Definitely not.

>>382143150
No, the worst by far is skyward sword.

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>>382143150
The HD re-release fixed the main problem I had with it, which was the dificulty.

It's alright, but I also miss that this game was the one to remove the magic bar and the spells.

>>382143905

No, he mixed up WW and SS. Not that there's really any point in comparing two shitty games.

>>382143150
I agree, TP on Wii is so much worst than the GC or Wii U version that it is considered the worst 3D Zelda.

>>382143150
Best 2D - Oracle of Ages
Best 3D - Wind Waker

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>>382145084
My Nigger
Oracle games were god fucking tier.

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>>382143150
The only good thing about TP was the dungeons, which pretty pretty fantastic

Everything between the dungeons was pretty ass
>atrocious character design
>forgettable characters
>schizophrenic plot
>empty, lifeless cities
>no memorable sidequests
>surprisingly bad music (the production alone was such a massive step back from WW)

>>382145558

>schizophrenic plot

t. doesnt know how to read and was shocked that ganon showed up

Yes, a thousand times yes, OP. It is not bad, per se, but it wallows in the tired, old Zelda formula from ALttP.

OoT was a transition into 3D, MM was a nice departure from the formula, WW was a bit of a departure, but still took it safe. TP was the least experimental, most bland, written by committee bullshit. It was the 3edgy5me brand of "dark" unlike MM's genuine dark tone. In MM if you fail, the fucking moon falls and everyone dies. The people are trying to cope or are in denial about their fate. In TP, some douche in black makes some vague threats and no one is really in danger.

The world and items were designed with quantity over quality as a priority. The overworld is unnecessarily huge. Especially before you get teleporting or your horse, it is fucking mind-numbing rolling across these empty fields. We thought OoT's Hyrule Field was ridiculously big, TP's is that five times over.

The items are too numerous, clunky, and useless. Half the shit you use just because you need to, then you never use them ever. Things like the spinner or ball and chain. They're too inefficient to use as regular transportation or weapon. Running around and swinging your sword are more efficient. SS reduced the number of items and made them for more effective, even outside of necessary instances.

I feel fucking bad for kids for whom these were their first Zelda games. They're getting the neutered versions. We got a slight improvement with each successive game until OoT, a spike in awesomeness with MM, a huge dip into the valley of mediocrity with WW and TP, and SS was a crawl towards being great again. I don't understand the hate for Skyward Sword. It was just as hand-holding as WW and TP. The partner is just as annoying as those games' respective partners. It is, however, condensed like MM. Still quite big environments without loads of meaningless, empty bullshit.

>>382143150
Half the game was amazing, and the other half was the wolf.

>>382145860
>Still quite big environments without loads of meaningless, empty bullshit
The entire world was emptier than OOT.

>>382145860
How about you take those nostalgia goggles off, grampa. OoT aged like milk.

>>382145672
Ganon was so obviously shoehorned into the story at a later stage in development

Why else would they completely alter Zant's character out of nowhere?

>>382146784

READ

THE

DIALOGUE

he was mentioned before even the halfway point of the game

>>382145860
What do you think of botw?

>>382146863
You didn't answer the question, retard. Why else would they turn Zant into a loony tune out of fucking nowhere? It was just amateurish storytelling. The polar opposite of what I would expect from the Zelda series.

TP felt like a game that nobody actually wanted to make. They were just doing whatever they thought would make fans happy after all the Wind Waker bitching. The result was inconsistent and shallow.

>>382147098
Not him, but BotW felt like a fully realized version of what they were attempting (and failing) to achieve with TP and SS.

Its not a perfect game, but it's definitely a return to form for the series.

>>382146784
Except he wasn't. Aonuma did state on EGM Mexico that Ganon was returning back in early 2005 before the game had a subtitle.

>>382143150
>"Can we all agree that my opinion is objectively correct?"

No, go fuck yourself

>>382143150
It was until SS came out.

>>382143150
Of the 3 that are usually up for "worst 3D zelda," I'd rank them:
TP>SS>WW
I like puzzles and dungeons, so WW is clearly the worst for me.

>>382145558
This

also
>wolf mode
>items that never get used outside the dungeons
>mind-numbingly long tutorial section
>ending had zero stakes

>>382143150
It does every single aspect arguably besides art style and music better than WW.
>item variety
>world variety
>dungeons
>over world content
>sword combat
>mini games
>outfits

>>382143150
MM > BotW > WW > OoT > SS > TP

anything else is a meme opinion

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Can we talk about how bullshit it was that we didn't get zant or ghirahim as characters in smash bros but got shit ton of fire emblem newcomers? Come the fuck on smash needed more villains and zelda had plenty of good ones I'M STILL PISSED FUCK OFF

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>>382147783
>item variety
The deku leaf alone was better than anything that TP introduced. TP's items were shallow and only used in extremely narrow situations. Deku leaf allowed you to explore the world in an organic way.

MM > BOTW > WW > TP > OOT > SS

>>382147998
I think it got hurt by the fact that the game releases are so few and far between

Smash Bros isn't really a celebration of Nintendo and the fans anymore. It's just an advertising platform.

>>382143150
You posted the wrong image, you were OBVIOUSLY going to post Wind Waker...

>>382143150
Honestly? Yeah. It's my favourite, but I think it's the worst. It was just more of OOT, instead of trying to be its own thing.

>>382145558
>atrocious character design
>forgettable characters
That's wrong though.

>>382148136
And the deku leaf was one of two unique items in that game.

>>382143150
It was a stained gem. GC version less so.
HD edition fixed it.

>>382148528
He posted evidence, doofus.

Sure Link, Ganon, Zelda and Midna had decent deisgns. But it clashed so badly with the deformed NPCs that populated the world. It was jarring and inconsistent.

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>>382146784
They didn't alter his character. A villain with a god complex masking a fragile ego is a time-honored archetype. Soujiro Seta, Light Yagami, etc.

And if you think Ganondorf came out of nowhere you're nowhere you need to open up a third grade literature study guide and turn to reading comprehension cause wew lad. The whole point of the game is that Zant is wrecking havoc from another dimension because he was granted godlike magic and stripped the powers that be of their status. Gee what could the impetus of this have been that even Midna wonders?

>>382147482
Shhhhhhhhh. Extra-diegetic information is way too much to ask these low tier fans to take into account. They will start whining about how Nintendo wasn't "playing 4D Chess!" and that "THERE'S NO TIMELINE!"

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>>382145558
>atrocious character design
>not thinking Twilight Princess Zelda is Best Zelda
>so best that they still had her be Zelda in Super Smash Bros Wii U and 3DS instead of the more recent Skyward Sword Zelda

>>382148814
>He posted evidence, doofus.
Yeah, of great and memorable characters, nitwit. Some of them are a bit dull, sure, but only some.

>>382149004
see
>>382148814

>>382143150
the objective answer is of course skyward sword and breath of the wild and any handheld 3d zelda game

>>382149104
what measurements brought you to that objective conclusion?

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>>382149004
Same goes for this boy

>>382148727
>HD edition fixed it.
not really, no

>>382149004
I agree TP Zelda is second only to OoT Zelda, but I hated her alien eyes in Brawl when she is introduced in that Petey Pirahnna cutscene. Like WTH were they thinking? Made me want to save Peach.

Also, Sakurai is a hack,

>>382143150
Worst 3D Zelda? It's one of the best.
>BotW>TP=OoT>MM>WW>SS

>>382143150
Where you 12 or younger when OoT came out?
Tp was my first 3D zelda and i love it
As well as minish that was my first 2D zelda

>>382149482

>shortened wolf segments
>touchscreen inventory
>hero mode
>better graphics
>gyro aiming

what DID he mean by this?

>>382143150
no, but it had some flaws.
strong opening though. one of the weirdest parts for me was that you need to call epona using a reed growing in specific locations. the fuck? this makes no sense and is a step backwards from ocarina.

>>382149659
Wolf segments are still there, touch screen inventory and gyro aiming is negligible, and the graphics really aren't that much better

>>382145558
>surprisingly bad music
Mf what are you talking about?

>>382143597
>The real worst 3D Zelda is Ocarina of Time
People who unironically say this are autistic little shits. Grow up kid.

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>making a bad section shorter isnt an improvement
>gyrom aiming is negligible despite being better in every way
>graphics are much ebtter and make the landscape stop being a better mess
>nah, it didnt improve it at all

>>382150041
>>making a bad section shorter isnt an improvement
Its not as much of an improvement as removing it
>>gyrom aiming is negligible despite being better in every way
precise aiming was never that big of a deal in TP
>>graphics are much ebtter
They're marginally better, its not much of an improvement
>>nah, it didnt improve it at all
Not worth paying $60 for

>>382143689
what does wii u do?

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only marginally better

>>382150209
Hard mode and traditional controls as opposed to Waggle.

>>382149640
>Where you 12 or younger when OoT came out?
I was 12 when MM came out. I fully admit that this is probably a big part of why it's my favourite one.

I was 18 when TP came out. I got pretty fucking hyped for a "mature" Zelda game, but the flaws became pretty apparent just a few hours into it.

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>>382145558
>>382149920
WHAT DID THIS FUCKING QUEER JUST SAY?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDgoPXyzwQ0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoBRdekWKxI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRHoPxAfy_Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kr-I76OxsVg

>>382150367
is that it? meh.

>>382149920
>Mf what are you talking about?
Production was noticeably worse than WW. It honestly felt like this was somebody's first project using MIDI. There were no dynamics, no attacks, no variation in soundfonts. Everything that made the midi in WW sound so realistic was completely absent in TP.

Also, they rehashed the main Hyrule field theme at least a dozen times. It was just fucking lazy.

No to mention the bait&switch with Yakota's incredible orchestral themes in the trailers. completely absent from the actual game.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sDk9LM60qg

>>382150445
what flaws?

>>382150172
they arguably made it look worse.

>>382151053
It was held back far too much by a desire to be a prim and proper heir to OOT.

>>382151206

in what way does it look worse?

the fucking one cutscene of illia in the beginning?

>>382150714
oooooh boy, now I gotta go replay this

>>382143150
Just because it was the "worst" doesn't make it a bad game. Still very much enjoyed it.

Even thought OoT is the "best", WW is still my "favorite".... so many good memories

>>382151053

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ViTiPDZGLBc

Nintendo literally lying and pulling a Bioshock Infinite about the content in the game.

>>382151646
>OoT is the "best"
But that's wrong. WW is straight-up better.

>>382150357
Why do people love posting screenshots of this room to complain about the lack of colors? Link travels to the past and the sepia tones are supposed to indicate "You're in the past".

Nothing will ever be as bad as Squidward Sword

>>382145558
looking back, the dungeons were pretty bland.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BTsgWepH3GY&index=8&list=PLc38fcMFcV_ul4D6OChdWhsNsYY3NA5B2

they also fell into the same tired rut of "ice dungeon, fire dungeon, etc." and the series deserves better than that. I don't know why the 3D ones always do this.

>>382152209
Skyward Sword is seriously underrated.

It's still the worst 3D Zelda, it's just also underrated.

>>382152148
As much as I love WW, it wasn't. But it was so close. An extra dungeon and maybe a few more towns/hubs, and it would have been perfect

>>382145558
mind showing what the characters were supposed to look like? they're a natural progression from OOT. WW's models look hideous.

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>>382143150
Twilight Princess is literally OoT 2.0. It brought absolutely nothing new to the table, and that it's main sin - mediocrity.
Even if Skyward Sword was worse, it still tried to do something new. Twilight Princess didn't.

>>382152461
WW had more character, and the sea was amazing, and also it ran above 20 fps.

>>382152513
This.

I still love Twilight Princess, but that's pretty much just because I played it before OOT.

>>382152461
This.
It would be by far the best video game let alone zelda if it let you explore the expanse of hyrule underwater.

>>382152513
it was even worse. at least TP had the light/dark world. SS had a shitty small skyhub with nothing to do in it. it even removed key features (no day/night cycle, etc.)

>>382143150
The worst is Skyward Sword
By leaps and bounds and a cross-continent train-ride

this is the first zelda i didnt bother to finis. it was so bad i didnt even bother trying skyward sword.

>>382143150
it was meh, not as good as good as people think.

>>382151721
WHERE. ARE. THE CATS!

>>382152563
Hey man, that's why I said it's my "favorite"... I loved the cast of characters and the look and the adventure. But the pacing and experience of OoT was absolutely perfect and was the foundation with which WW wouldn't exist

>>382152804
That too. Exploring old abandoned places like Goron City and Zora's Doman would've been cash

>>382152804
in a submarine, fighting sea monsters.

>>382143150
I was 12 when it came out, but it was so bad that I never bothered playing Skyward Sword.

>MM >= OoT > WW >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TP

>>382150954
And a gauntlet extra dungeon for wolf Link. Really, only useful so you can have Wolf Link at 20 hearts in Breath of the Wild.

>>382153687
Twelve year old you had shit taste God damn. It's a bad Zelda, not a bad game.

>>382148528
I literally can only recall three people in OP's picture besides Link, Zelda, and Ganondorf. Of those three, the only one I liked was Illia.

>>382148136
>TP's items were shallow and only used in extremely narrow situations.
this only describes the dominion rod and spinner

Meanwhile WW's deku leaf "allowed you to explore the world in an organic way" on what, one island outside of dungeons?

>>382153775

I never entered the gauntlet, and my wolf link is 20 hearts anyway.

>>382154087
No, it was a bad game. I'm sorry you're too much of a fanboy to see that.

>>382154482
>shitposting from a 12 year old

TP is the dullest game, but SS is somehow worse. I hate both of them and always have, unplayable, mediocre garbage.

>>382145860
Shut up you nostalgia huffing retard.

>>382154172
i remember all of them

ive only played the nes, OOT, MM, WW, and some of TP and hourglass. why is it so hard for me to find the will continue in TP? the rest it was pretty easy for me to want to play

>>382154783
How the fuck should we know.

>>382154857
why, with your superior gaming knowledge, friend. /v/ is experts on video games

Breath of the Wild is the worst 3D Zelda I've ever played, so no.

Man, the fanboys are riled up on this thread

>>382154940
Uh, alright then. You are a closet furry in denial, and you don't like those strange feelings wolf link gives you.

>>382143150
please don't start threads if you were 12 or younger when OoT and MM came out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VE2Dc1sx71U

>>382143150
Best 3D: Wind Waker
Worst 3D: Skyward Sword

Seriously, SS was a fucking chore to play. Everything about it just seemed low quality

Yes, either this or MM.

>>382143150
No, the Zelda with a flat blue field where you travel in a straight line for 10 minutes to get from place to place whilst having the most linear hallway dungeons and least creative items was the worst 3D Zelda.

Please don't respond if you think "comfy" or "the art" is synonymous with good game design.

>/v/ hates wind waker again
This is just a generation gap thing right?

>>382155343
>creative items

You mean stupid bullshit like the spinner or the ball and chain? I don't think TP was the worst Zelda, but it had the worst items by far

>>382143150
the only seriously bad part in this game is the overly long and unskippable tutorial. everything else is at worst mildly disappointing such as some items like the spinner not seeing more use outside the dungeon it was made for.

seriously take off your fucking goggles people, OoT and MM were good at the time but have aged like sour milk and MM only seemed spooky and shit because you were a kid.

>>382155517

how the fuck can you think the B&C is a bad item

it does more damage and comes at a cost of speed and mobility

its the perfect answer to everybody wanting some kind of 2H sword option

>>382143150
I liked it.

I like/love all Zelda games and don't dislike/hate a single one!

>>382155517
spinner and ball and chain were fucking great though. spinner should have been in a ton more places and ball and chain is only ever bad if you used motion controls, but then again everything is shit with motion controls.

>>382155785
Because it's fucking stupid? If people wanted a 2H sword, they could have, you know, had a 2H sword like OoT. B&C was just slow and useless outside of a few niche scenarios where they forced you to use it. You could always fight enemies better in a different way

>>382155141
fuck, man, no wonder those were my least favorite parts. all that cognitive dissonance. it makes so much sense. i knew you could do it bro, i knew you could help me and now you have. brb killing myself

>>382155246
Was that Conan music?

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>>382156005

>its useless

maybe if you only used it in the mansion and never tried it against anything

>>382155984
>Unironically defending the spinner
Now I've fucking seen it all. Literal brain damage

>>382154352
Did you bought your amiibo used? I had to do it or else my wolf link was 3 hearts.

>>382156203
and what would you say is a better item? yet another fucking hook? why not a double boomerang, might as well. the spinner was great and so was the boss fight for it's dungeon, take your shit taste somewhere else.

>>382156029
Yes, up until Twilight Princess, Riddle of Steel was used in every 3D Zelda reveal

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>>382156203
>Doesn't like riding on a beyblade

>>382156005
>give us new items to use
>here's a ball and chain you can use to deal tons of damage and also to protect yourself from incoming attacks!
>n-not those new items! g-give us something like the biggoron sword

There's no fucking pleasing nintenbabbies like you

>>382143150
Out of all the 3D Zeldas, the one I've enjoyed the least was Skyward Sword, but I'm not going to act like that game was irredeemable garbage either.

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>>382143150

I was 15 when this came out and it's my personal favorite 3D Zelda. I was 12 when Wind Waker came out and I think it's the worst 3D Zelda and one of the absolute worst Zeldas period.

>>382143150
It was average for a zelda game, but still pretty fun. There's glaring flaws though, most of which everyone will notice while playing.

>hyrule field is empty
>no incentive to explore
too many items that have no use outside of their respective dungeon
>forgettable soundtrack, the only good one was hyrule field
>several of the dungeons feel too similar to each other
>rupee armor that nobody bothered using
>lack of sidequests

>>382143373
Reminder that Moon did everything "new" Majora's mask tried but better and years before MM's release.

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>>382156775

>rupee armor nobody bothered getting
>lack of sidequests

anon...

>>382156761
That's some shit taste, friend, and TP used to be my favourite Zelda.

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>>382156775
>forgettable soundtrack

>>382157261
Not saying it was bad, but none of the songs stood out for me aside from just Hyrule Field. It's probably because i'm comparing it to OoT and WW's soundtracks which had plenty of good songs.

>>382156978

I can accept shade being thrown at TP - it might be my favorite but I won't pretend it's perfect so much as it's Zelda most to my personal liking. But Wind Waker has so many cracks in its armor across almost everything it does that sailing is actually my favorite part of the thing, and exploration usually is my least favorite aspect of Zelda. But WW's dungeons and pacing were so subpar that it just rubs me the wrong way. TP had its pacing issues but I adore its dungeons with a passion and the game at least gets its shit together a third of the way in. WW never gels together as a truly coherent thing for me, not in the beginning, middle or end. I always have some sort of bone to pick with it at nearly any given point in the game, it just grates on my nerves.

>>382143150
>So we all agree?
No.

>>382157603
Most people dislike TP dungeons now because of that Mark Brown video >>382152289

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the worst 3D Zelda is, no contest, Skyward Sword

>2D
LA > Oracles > LoZ > LttP > Z2 (Haven't played GBA, DS and 3DS games)
>3D
MM > WW > OoT > TP >>>>>>> SS (getting my Switch on friday, can't rate BoTW yet but it looks great)
TP is okay. I liked it. SS stops it from being the worst.

>>382157871
What's wrong with Skyward Sword?

>>382157912
>I actually agree with another anon's rankings
Huh.

>>382156539
The spinner is objectively the worst item in any Zelda game. It's a perfect example of broken game design. An item that has practically zero use outside of a few very tightly controlled, pre-defined tracks that the developers put in. There's no way to use it creatively unless you just want a worse weapon that restricts what you can do. It's not even cool, it's just fucking stupid.

>>382157740

3D Zelda dungeons were never about their complexity, though. Even OoT and MM aren't all that impressive in that regard compared to, say, ALttP or the Oracles. What 3D Zeldas are good at are fun dungeon gimmicks and, while it was certainly easy as piss, TP's dungeon gimmicks were really fun and inspired. Shit like using magnetism to walk up walls, traversing winding tracks using ancient gear technology, bringing inanimate statues to life or being Spiderman in a sky society way up in the clouds were all nice ideas. The things you did in TP were really cool and I still have fun revisiting the game and running through it all again for like the 8th time. I've replayed OoT more than TP but I've had that game for far longer, TP pretty much plasters a smile on my face with its dungeons and setpieces.

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>>382158269
the dungeons, the overworld, the art direction, the soundtrack, the combat (not the motion controls for the sword, it worked fine), aiming (because they insisted on using the motion+ instead of the pointer), the new dungeon items (except for the beetle), swimming, flying, tadpole collecting, that forced stealth segment

the only good things to come out of SS were the silent realms and the timeshift stones which were cool as fuck

>>382158409

Spinner was shown to be useful in traversing quicksand. It definitely should've seen more use in the context of traversing environmental hazards.

>>382158515

SS had good dungeons though

not great

but good

>>382158556
>Traversing quicksand
So, one of the tightly controlled precise locations where the devs say you can use it.

>>382158515
Okay do you mind maybe explaining yourself.

>>382158662

or the gigantic desert right outside

>>382152374
Underrated? It's the only real Wii-Zelda and probably won dozens of GOTY rewards.

>>382158778
The fuck are you on about I don't remember that.

I mean on /v/ anyway.

>>382158757
There isn't quicksand out there if I recall

>>382143150
No, skyward sword is. It was so bad I quit playing 3 hours in.

>>382143507
You misspelled contrarian.

>>382149948
>People who unironically say this are autistic little shit
No, he's right, Ocarina is actually one of the most overrated games ever.

>>382158662

Read my second sentence. I'm saying there was grounds to use the item in alternative ways that the game didn't take full advantage of but should've. It wouldn't have been hard to implement ground-based environmental hazards in the overworld that required the Spinner to pass.

>>382158825
When SS came out IGN literally said it was the best Zelda game of all time. Pretty funny considering it's actually the worst

>>382143150
i haven't played skyward sword or breath of the wild but it's definitely the worst out of the first 4
i wouldn't say it's a bad game and there are some things i like (like the dungeons) but i gotta say that the early parts of the game before you can control your wolf transformation are just god awful

>>382151015
You have shit taste that cannot be cured, I have no words for you

Breath of the wild sucks, no dungeons, stupid bosses, no item system that made the other ones good

>>382158948
IGN says that shit about everything, which is why I never read it any more, which is probably why I never saw that.

>>382158925
I guess that's fair. I still think that as it stands the items in TP were extremely underwhelming

>>382143150
The gamecube version was very serviceable as a better version of oot, oot people just annoy me. The wii remote usage is so loud you just can't play it.

>>382158908

And people who say this have no context of history. OoT is one of the most important cornerstones in regards to early 3D game design. Devs everywhere were taking notes from it and Super Mario 64 in the 90s.

Never understood the WW love

ONLY thing the game has going for it was great soundtrack

>Game Start
>Worse tutorial area than TP or OOT
>Takes almost as long as TP for the map to open up to you
>it takes forever to sail between islands
>Any sense of exploration is ruined by more limited enemy variety than BOTW as well as every hidden item literally GLOWING
>Do you like escort quests? Cause WE DO! 50% of dungeons have them!
>Do you like fetch quests? Cause we love them so much we put the games plot on hold for it!
>Least dungeons out of ANY Zelda game
>King of Red Lions is worse than Fi, while he doesn't derail your game as much, and isn't as hand holdingly infuriating his literal ONLY purpose in game is to be a glorified raft
>Worst Zelda, oh Awesome Tetra is Zelda? Immediately sent to basement and later kidnapped
>Oh and did mention the REAL fetch quest? The first few were for simple items like sail cloth or fire/ice arrows! This mother of all fetch quests has you spending an hour collecting sea charts from entire world, then shoveling multiple wallets worth of rupees into the most universally hated character in franchise's face, followed by a SECOND hour long fetch quest to actually gain triforce
>Least satisfying Final Boss Sword duel, OOT incorporates the environment and two distinct bosses, TP actually has four phases as well as location change mid way, even skyward swords single phase finale is better purely due to spectacle of bashing a boss with a lightning infused master sword

And yes WiiU port fixed at least one of these, but this is still quite the laundry list of bad choices

>>382158908
Not him but that doesn't make it the worst Zelda, dumbass.

>>382151721
Wow, that looks really fucking cool. Damn I'm jelly for alt-universe me.

I can go back and play through TP whenever without issues. I can't save the same for the mess that is SS

Skyward Sword is the Dark Souls 2 of Zelda

>>382143150
Skyward Sword is definately worse.

Wind Waker is arguablye worse, but here I'll let it come down to a matter of opinions.

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>>382158576
>>382158695
>kill enemy
>next room
>kill enemy
>next room
>push obvious block into hole
>next room
>oh, finally, an actual puzzle
>master, there's a 95% chance you can solve the puzzle by doing X Y Z
>oh thanks Fi, I almost had fun there!

the dungeons were shit
the overworld is a big huge world of nothing where you fly around with shit controls from small island to small island

activating those stupid cubes on the ground is fucking ridiculous, because you have to go back up to then get the reward

the combat works fine, the problem is that it's boring and generally easily exploited (most of the enemies can be destroyed by simply slashing from right to left, wait a split second, then left to right and it'll connect and then you combo, rinse and repeat), though some instances were cool (like Ghirahim and Demise), some were annoying as fuck (engineer bokoblins with tasers changing their block right before you hit them)

the whip is a shit item because it's that -Z target it, whip it, move on-, Kolotkos for example felt really cool the first time, but when I fought him in the boss rush for the Hylian Shield the cool wore off and I was taken back to the regular Zelda boss fighting: whip it a few times, sword him up, repeat

gust bellows is the shit version of the minish cap gust jar

the soundtrack is beautifully orchestrated music that I forget in like 10 seconds after I leave the area

I really hope I don't need to elaborate on the tadpoles and the forced stealth section in the volcano

timeshift stones are cool in concept and execution, specially sailing through a sand of sea because the stone rollsback the area to become sea again, silent realms were short and kept me on the edge, I enjoyed them

in fact, the desert in general was better than the other 2 areas, both times you visit it, what a coincidence

I had to force myself to finish the game, and I know I'm never going to touch it ever again

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>>382159010
That particular opinion was shit, but I kinda like IGN because they tend to be predictors of a game's overall average meta score. If you go through average scores from review sites IGN's scores tend to skew almost exactly in like with the average most of the time.

>>382159056

The only items that truly underwhelmed me were the Hawkeye and the Ball & Chain. The first one is skippable so whatever but the latter really didn't need to be around. Hurts like a motherfucker and it shatters ice-based anything pretty well but that's damn near irrelevant outside of Snowpeak. Like one grotto and a couple of floors on the Cave of Ordeals is all it's really needed for. Even the Dominion Rod managed to squeeze out a few puzzles regarding its use in the arbitrary as fuck story quest surrounding its use.

>>382158993

Breath of the Wild is a better Wind Waker in that it did everything that game did well better despite falling into many of the same pitfalls. The one concession I give to WW at this point is that it remains one of the better standalone stories in Zelda at this point.

>>382159464
>complain about cheesing combat
>complain about electric enemies that require patience or a different weapon

Come on, anon, make up your mind. I agree on most of your other points though. Skyloft was a fucking mistake.

>>382159510
Anon metacritic is weighted in favour of IGN. IGN's score is literally more impactful than other scores.

>>382159464
I liked the whole overworld-to-dungeon mesh they had going. Not that shitty sky overworld, the actual overworld (the bits before the indoors dungeon). The art style was also pretty cool.
>the soundtrack is beautifully orchestrated music that I forget in like 10 seconds after I leave the area
Damn, you're right. I literally can't remember any.

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>>382159745
did you even read what I posted? I'm ok with the electric enemies punishing you for trying to cheese them or reckless swinging, I'm not ok with them having just changed the block stance, and as I move my sword and slash him from the right angle poof, he just moved the block again, completely out of pattern

>Skyloft
thanks, I forgot to complain about load times up the ass

also, cringy as fuck dialogue trying to be emotional, they really managed to fail as hard as possible on trying to make me care about the characters

>>382151206
Bull shit. Did you like being blasted with gloom bloom?

>>382159789
Source?

Not saying I'd disbelieve it, but you got proof?

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>>382160093
>I liked the whole overworld-to-dungeon mesh they had going.
not when they're that fucking trivial, but if they make them hard then it'd be really overwhelming, I just don't see it really working properly one way or the other

>>382160275
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metacritic
>Before being averaged, the scores are weighted according to the critic's fame, stature, and volume of reviews.
Okay, I don't actually have proof they specifically give IGN that weighting, but that's only because I'm lazy. You know as well as I do IGN are THE biggest, most famous, and most prolific reviewers.
>>382160365
I prefer the other Zeldas anyway. I just thought it was a neat idea.

>>382155309
(you)

OoT: The golden standard for 3D Zeldas. A game that will never be made obsolete, just like TLoZ and ALttP.
TP: Coolest items, beautiful environments, Midna, Agitha, need I say more?
SS: Some cool bosses, especially Koloktos and Levias. Memorable dungeons.
MM: Masks are glorified fetch quests. Too much waiting. The well sucks. Gyorg and Ikana are bullshit.
WW: Sailing sucks, dungeons suck, story sucks. About the only good thing is the music and the graphics.

>>382160706
>A game that will never be made obsolete
2 0 f p s
>Midna, Agitha, need I say more?
No. They are truly the best waifus in gaming.

>>382160480
Makes sense, but even still, when you've got ~100 reviews on a game weighting only goes so far.

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>>382145558
Clearly a pedo WW fag.

>>382158269
it's not good.

>>382158662
you mean like 90% of games?

because please tell me what items you use in any zelda for that matter outside of situations the devs intended them to be used on. hint: combat is a controlled event placed in specific parts of the game by the devs as well.

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>Any 3D Zelda
>good

>>382158452
they were memorable. I just wish zelda threw out small keys/locked doors. there's really no point and it's incredibly archaic design. also, hate how the later (especially TP) games try to trick you into picking up pieces of heart hidden in chests to make the game easier than it already is. when you have to go out of your way to make a game remotely challenging there's a problem.

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I don't l know anyone can think it's worse than Wind Waker. WW's dungeons, items, overworld and bosses are all shittier. It's like people only pretend that it's great because of how much shit it got 15 years ago.

>>382161461
>when you have to go out of your way to make a game remotely challenging there's a problem.
I still remember that final boss fight.

Christ, that was anticlimactic. I didn't even go below three-quarters health, and what I did lose I only lost because I tried throwing myself into Ganon do see what'd happen.

>>382159376
skyward sword came before ds2 faggot

>>382161993
Literally irrelevant to his point.

>>382161696

Wind Waker is colorful and ambitious in its overworld approach, even if the game is a pretty fractured mess in every other respect. TP, on the other hand, is almost traditionalist to a fault - it sticks to what works, but at least it does those things well. I personally think TP is a vastly superior game to WW but for people who are enthralled by novelty over sticking to the basics, I can at least envision why they'd prefer WW to TP. That said, I can't justify it with any sort of sincere deeper logical thinking. WW cracks under pressure when looked at funny while TP holds water in spite of its relative lack of ambition.

>>382159705
I barley played windwaker but I did love Phantom hourglass, Breath of the wild feels so empty and feels as if they strapped most of its core mechanics just so they can give you more land to walk and do nothing. I feel as if most people who liked it never really played Zelda games and are just bandwaging, dont get me wrong I was fucking pumped for that game until I actually played it

>>382163089
You need a new keyboard.

>>382158992
I articulated my point and baxked it up with sound reasoning.

You have shit taste

>>382143150
I was 13 when it came out, and yes it's the worst 3D Zelda.

SS was at least ambitious and has great dungeons, even though I abandoned ship at the Tadtones segment.

>>382143150
>So we all agree that this is the worst 3D Zelda, right?

Objectively speaking, Wind Waker is the worst 3D Zelda by a large margin. It would be the worst overall, but Spirit Tracks exists.

>>382163089

I actually liked PH more than WW, though very few will agree with that sentiment. Temple of the Ocean King wasn't all that bad IMO which is what people really get caught up with on it.

>I feel as if most people who liked it never really played Zelda games

This is normally the part where you'd be told that it's a return to Zelda 1 form but there's 2 things Zelda 1 did very differently - its content matched the size of the world and it actually had rewarding points of interest. I do like BotW's take on overworld design but for all the stuff there is to do so much of it doesn't feel terribly rewarding. Sometimes cool looking and sometimes refreshingly open, but it's hard to care about its core gameplay loop at length IMO.

>>382164272

Spirit Tracks has FAR better dungeons and bosses than WW, not to mention Ghost Zelda is the most top of top tier sidekicks. Unfortunately, that overworld is the most atrocious in the series, bar none. Nothing about the train is fun, the towns are painfully bland, and did anyone like the flute mechanic?

>>382158409
shame you lcoudln't just travel on it around hyrule.

>>382159376
SS borrowed heavily from DeS.

>>382164978
literally how?

>>382145558
>>atrocious character design
I don't agree. They look fine.
>>forgettable characters
Most Zelda characters are bland and don't have much depth. They rely solely on their zany personalities. TP is the Zelda game that gives the characters the most background detail of their own.
>>schizophrenic plot
I don't know what you're referring to. The plot was clear and understandable to me.
>>empty, lifeless cities
Literally every zelda game.
>>no memorable sidequests
For you.

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>>382143373
>Best 3D: MM or this

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>>382143150
First played this in college when I was 17 on GC and it's my favourite Zelda as I love the art direction (anything Twilight is borderline beautiful) Link is a hardass that takes down goats and Gorons with his bare hands, Midna is a fantastic companion, Ganondorf looked fantastic, best Zora armour, great dungeons, I could go on but I enjoyed it immensely.

Botw is the worst 3D Zelda to me. No, not because it's "not a zelda game." It's shit because the only good thing about it is the expansive world, which is a drag to traverse. In all other areas it shits the bed.

>>382145558
>"The characters aren't attractive so their designs are bad"
But that's fucking wrong. Half of the characters in these cherrypicked collage are hicks and weirdos whose designs fit them.

>>382165461
>best Zora armour
Do you still think so after BOTW?
I think everything related to the Zora, from their designs to the Domain, the ost, the quests surrounding them, and the armor you get from them were all vastly improved as of BOTW.

>>382149243

I love how they decided on making Ganondorf strongfat. It's a pretty uncommon bodytype for villains, even though it works so well. He's way more intimidating now than when he was like 2% bodyfat in OoT.

3D: BOTW > OoT > MM > TP > WW > SS

2D: OoA > LA > ALttP > OoS > ALBW > MC > TLOZ > ST > AoL > PH

>>382147214
>Why else would they turn Zant into a loony tune out of fucking nowhere?
That's the character he was from the very beginning. Every ounce of menace or subtlety was him letting Ganondorf play co-pilot in his head.
Did you think it was a coincidence that Zant spends most of the game acting exactly like Ganondorf and then goes daffy the moment the G-man's been resurrected in the Light Realm?

Phantom Hourglass is the worst 3D Zelda. This is not up for debate.

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>>382165802
While I really like the BoTW version and have it equipped at all times with the hylian hood, the TP armour still stands above it in my opinion due to the ninja mask and it actually looks like a hybrid between armour and swimming suit, the BoTW version is like an MGS sneaking suit in comparison. I also prefer the Zora design in general in TP, Rutella for example is so well designed.

>>382143150
Wrong, SS and WW were worse.

>>382166260

>top-down 2.5D Zelda counts as 3D Zelda

Can we not have this semantically fueled argument for the 50th time?

>>382143150
I think I was 12 when it came out, and I still think that. It's so bad nostalgia can't even save it

>>382166593
3D Models

>>382143150
Skyward Sword is easily the worst

Majora's Mask is the best 3d Zelda
Link's Awakening is the best 2d
This game is good, just not as good as Windwaker, BOTW, or OOT.

>>382166079

3D: TP > OoT = MM >>> SS > BotW > WW

2D: OoS = OoA > ALBW > Zelda 1 > Zelda II > ALttP > MC > PH > FS > ST > FSA

Can't remember LA well enough to comment on it and yes, I unfortunately respect ALttP's influence more than I enjoy actually playing it.

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It has some of the best-looking bosses in the series. Too bad they're mostly just great to look at, since they're so easy.

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>>382167010
>This game is good, just not as good as Windwaker

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>>382167791
I find it funny that the temple of time has the easiest boss in the game

>>382167893

I think it's genuinely insulting to be worse than Wind Waker.

>>382163089
>le empty meme

kill yourself

>>382168040

Armogohma doesn't even fit with the theme. Should have been something techno-magical like Gohdan instead.