which WoW xpac was the best, vee?

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lets go cata

>>382031252
>WoD even have votes

>>382031252

>which WoW xpac was the best, vee?
>strawpoll has vanilla

Wrath of the Lich King is definitely my number one thanks to the zones being the comfiest for me. But vanilla has my vote because back then you had to interact with people and you had fun doing it.

>wotlk is winning
i knew /v/ had good taste after all

>ITT: wrathbabbies

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No pandaria

>>382031252
Wrath.

But Cata is incredibly underrated.

cata boyz also where the fuck is pandaria

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just vote for cata if you wanted to vote for mop

>>382031252
>underage shitstains voting WOTLK when we got dungeon finder with that

Part of what killed the game.
I fucking hate you greenhorns.

As someone who's played since release day, Wrath was the best. It had by far the best dungeons and raids, and the best story and moments.

Vanilla was where the community was the strongest and accomplishments and gear had actual meaning, but the content itself was largely shit. Anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional.

>>382032779
mid cata was the beginning of the end tho

>>382033376
Since WoW is an MMORPG, the social aspect, community etc. are what makes or breaks the game.
Dungeon Finder broke the social aspect to a large degree already.

just out of curiosity... how good is legion?

wotlk is the best expansion

anyone who disagrees must die

>>382033248

i remember almost no one fucking used that shit back then though, we'd just spam dalaran while dueling in the sewers and only check in the dungeon finder if we desperately needed a 5th (and even then hardly ever found one through it)

>>382033578
Icc patch killed wow

>>382033645
eh its really specific i would say
if you like diablo 3 youll enjoy it
alot of stuff to grind
weird class design
its okay overall

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>>382031252
>wrath babies
half the expac was pure shit

>>382032028
It was supposed to be the one! It was supposed to be the expansion that gave me everything I wanted and they FUCKED it!

I'll never forgive Blizzard.

>>382033645
worse than wod

>>382033376
>t had by far the best dungeons and raids, and the best story and moments.

>literally everything was AoE and HCs were normal tier for bc
>all bosses on release were easy as fuck even sarth 3D 10/25
>started with the introduction of super lazy """hard modes""" to just artificially increase the length of content

No, just no.

>>382031252
WoTLK

>dungeon finder
>looking for raid
>change of talent trees
>allowing people to use too many addons
>no more 40 men raids
>farmville I mean garrisons
>cross realm shit
>heirlooms
>level boost
>no more open world pvp
>people no longer playing for the journey
>gearscore

What are some other things that killed WoW?

>>382033645
better than wod
but way too rng and grindy

>>382031252
Burning Crusade.
Best balance between easing the annoying grind without becoming too casual.
Pity it started the lore rape train and areans

>>382033645
If you don't care about the actual MMO aspect of the game, it's the best xpack so far. If you do, then it's objectively the worst.

Actually, I guess WoD was worse because everyone sat alone in their garrison, now at least people are sitting with other members of their class with the class hall. Class halls are cool and all but they're just watered down Garrisons Lite.

I haven't done any raids yet but I've heard they're more interactive movie theaters with friends at this point than traditional raids. Wiping is impossible even on Mythic unless people do it intentionally.

>>382033910
well then, glad I dropped the game after wotlk

>>382034058
achievs

How in the fuck can you possibly thing WoTLK is better? Naxx was a dumbed down rehash and ToC was just crap. WoTLK only had Ulduar... ICC was okay, but that's when they started cheating and putting together raids with loading screens instead of actually making a raid that fits together.

BC had the most consistently good raids. They had great layouts and bosses.

>>382034058
class homogenization in wotlk, pruning talents in cata, pruning talents and abilities in pandaland, further ability pruning in wod.

>>382034278
How much more can you possible prune

>>382034058
welfare epics in BC were the beginning of the downward spiral, everything else was just a natural progression that followed

welfare epics were the true thing that killed wow

>>382034058
cringe story made up to fill expansions

>>382034332
we'll discover that in the next expansion.

>>382034278
>muh pruning

Do you really want us to still have our vanilla rotations with 15 extra buttons on top of it? Fuck off.

>>382033731

>no one used dungeon finder

Are you talking about group finder? The full on queue for dungeon, dungeon finder came in wrath and most people used it.

>>382034058
flying mounts
resilience
e-sports

>>382034451
do you think the game is fun now? every class is the same, 1 strong attak, 1 soft attack etc
they are making it a fucking moba, next exp is 1 skill 2 passives

>all these wotlk babies

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>atleast some catabros
its good to not be alone

>>382034451
I do. 15 extra buttons are for fun.

>>382034451
Yes you fucking casual shitter go back to your assfaggots

>>382034332
well they did it even more in legion, so who knows

fire mage is literally 3 buttons and a cooldown you use every few minutes, rogue is similar just in melee range

next expack is probably going to be 1 ability for each class then another one for when the first one procs something, and versatility will be the only stat on gear, it gives damage or healing based on class, defense based on class, and hp and mana based on class, enchanting and jc removed because versatility is the only stat, etc.

if you had told me 10 years ago they could water down an MMO to this level I would have called you crazy

>>382031252
>not including pandas
>including cata and wod which are objectively the worst
kys

>>382034657
> every class is the same, 1 strong attak, 1 soft attack etc

You're joking right? Specs are the most different they've ever been with spec specific talent choices for every spec instead of every spec using the same set of talents.

Hunter, for example... Marks doesn't have a pet and survival is a melee spec. They're all completely different.

>>382034747
At least DH was pretty fun and complex until they nerfed momentum.

>>382034747
>if you had told me 10 years ago they could water down an MMO to this level I would have called you crazy

Man I miss abilities that were ridiculously situational and barely ever useful but added flavour to the class, PVP balance helped ruin this as well. Miss WoW feeling like an RPG, even all the quality of life changes really just made it feel less like an RPG.

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>>382031252
>No MoP

>>382034741
>>382034745
I'd rather have less buttons and more interesting boss mechanics. Boss in Legion have double the abilities that bosses in Vanilla/BC/WoTLK had.

>>382035037
>added flavour
>i just want a stale game
people like you killed wow and you dont even know it

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>No MoP

Fucking dropped

Take your shitty poll with you somewhere else, MoP was the golden age

>>382035051
Not like anyone would vote for that anyway.

>>382034387
The badge epics were originally on par with heroics, which you'd be doing to get badges anyway, nothing wrong with them then.
It was when they went up to BT tier that they became an issue

WotLK was objectively the best but the jump in quality from Vanilla to TBC was a lot bigger

>>382034913
>>382035051
>>382035198
hello samefriend

>>382035121
i dont even remember a good fight in legion

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>>382031252
>no MoP
FUCKING wrathbabbies i swear to god

ITT butthurt subhuman weeb pandafags

>>382035327
>>382035238
Fuck off you fucking faggot.
>B-BUT MUH WRATH!!!

>>382035121
And they manage to be far easier than anything from the past.

>inb4 xDDD it's not truehehusaeu do hardmodes or whatever shit we swallow!!

Listen to someone that actually has a clue of what he's doing instead of your shitter guild

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9kTpmAvcPs

WotLK > BC > Vanilla > Legion > Cata > WoD > MoP

>>382035515

They were hard because of gear checks not mechanics.

>>382035651
Thanks for showing how you don't know shit, gear checks are always the easiest fights, like patchwerk and hardmodes, mythic + or whatever shit you kids use now are l i t e r a l l y gearchecks.

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>>382035198
>Isle/Throne of Thunder
>Mogushan Vaults
>SoO
>All those fun as fuck quests
>All that juicy class utility (Warrior banners were GOAT)
>Hands down the most gorgeous areas in any part of the game
>Fun and lighthearted until SoO, didn't take itself too seriously, just enjoying the locale and kickass panda culture
>Comfy levels off the fucking charts

MoP was a gem. I want it back.

>>382035615
>I haven't played WoW since Wrath: The Post
Stop trying to fit in.

>>382031252
Pandaria

>>382035515
lol that vid

TBC > MoP=WotLK > Vanilla > Cata > Legion > WoD

>>382035814
My brother plays and I always try a character on his account to see if I should resub

So I have tried every addon. But I am not monetarily invested.

So I am way more objective than you are having invested money in it.

>>382035814
I havent actively played since end of cata but i have played every xpac a bit
his list has some flaws and id go with
wrath>bc>vanilla>cata>mop>legion>wod

>>382035806

Are you implying that guilds that cleared Mythic Gul'Dan wouldn't be able to clear Naxx 40 if given the gear they needed to do it. I haven't even played in years but you'd have to be brain dead to not see how much more mechanically difficult the bosses are now. It was hard then because it was a massive time sink getting all your people equipped enough to actually take on the content.

>>382035515
>linking videos of other peoples opinions about a game you don't even play
You're a fucking retard. This video is also retarded, either way.

>kill boss with 40 people
>get 4 pieces of loot
>later bosses pretty much require everyone to have good gear
>WOW LOOK HOW HARD IT USED TO BE

>>382035809
>lighthearted until SoO
There's impaled Klaxxi that are still alive in the entrance in Heart of Fear

>>382036084
You sound like a massive fucking faggot to me honestly.

>>382036360
That is an even better argument.

>>382036431
Better than
>is bad cuz i said so xDDDD

>>382035809

SoO was fun for the first month or two. The following twelve months were painful.

>>382036520
>I have played all of them and I am don't have to pay for it so there is no Buyer's remorse
>lol you sound like a fag

the state of modern wowfags.

>>382036660
Agreed. Only part of MoP I legitimately disliked, that and the rep-grind based endgame when it launched. It wasn't perfect, but it was still by far my favorite expac.

>>382034206
First mythic kill of the last boss of the second raid (Gul'dan, Nighthold) took 300 attempts. Average wipes for guilds were 200.

>>382036660
SoO was a good raid that had the misfortune of being the last one before the content drought hit again.
Better than Dragon Soul though, for being a bad raid on top of the content drought.

>>382031252
>all these fucking wrathbabbies

It's funny, because despite all the good things about Wrath like the zones and music, wrath was when the cracks that got overlooked in vanilla and TBC all became very apparent and still never got fixed. The talent system was starting to show signs of needing a retouching, PvP was falling apart because of arenas, the growing dependency of showing lore in books instead of in-game, the reckless disregard for consistency even within the same expansion, poorly designed instances deemed bad because they where too 'experimental' instead of just because they where shit à la The Oculus, focusing too much on instanced zones and the player's special adventure, the whole way gear was being treated, and the realization that we where never going to get a new story and it was all going to be one long regurgitation.

The music was fucking beautiful though, and it was comfortable just sort of riding around the zones to quest.

>>382036794
>Played
More like demo'd for an hour.

WOTLK was pretty good until the halfway point where they introduced dungeon finder.

Legion seems cool but the game isn't for me anymore.

>>382036983
I have a character on max level and I raid a little and do some pvp.

>>382036968
I only voted Wrath because Pandaria isn't there

>>382036968
pvp was falling apart because of arenas?

It was falling apart because of DK hero class. The other 2 problems: Paladins with no mana issues, and Survival hunter explosive shot also fucked up pvp outside of arenas and inside.

They weren't balancing for arena AT ALL.

>>382033248
This
>B-but muh LK best villain, because I'm gonna keell everyone because I'm evil lol

>>382037101
dungeon finder only released with the ICC dungeons and placed you with people from your battlegroup much like bg's did
I dont give a fuck about it because I didnt care about making friends or wasting time looking for people in trade/lfg pve was always a snorefest I endured to get loot

>>382036273
>i dont like facts
come on man what do you want
your woo woo game isnt dead?

>>382033248
So basically every addon afterwards is already confirmed shit?

>>382037116
>Got one character to max level
>Then went into LFR
>Then queued up for a random BG
>lol i totally have enough experience to call it shit

>>382037435
>addon
Kill yourself.

>>382036794
>Buyer's Remorse
Are you serious?
People payed more for WoD and Legion and would defend those more if that was the case.

>>382037462
So its still just a demo if you do every part of the fucking content?

The desperation of modern wowfags.

I am so glad you guys are all sudicidal

>>382036889

Don't get me wrong because I agree with a most of the points you made about the expansion. SoO progression was tons of fun, much better more enjoyable than Mogushan Vaults or that Klaxxi raid. I enjoyed ToT solely because I was a Prot Paladin and I could solo tank like half the raid but SoO had some great fights. I wish it didn't go on forever. Which is a shame since I genuinely liked it, I just ran it so many times.

>>382037569
>People payed more for WoD and Legion and would defend those more if that was the case.
What do you think they are doing if they so vehemently disagree with someone putting them at the bottom? Is that not defending?

>>382037578
>Can't even spell properly
Fuck off BR

>>382034058
>dungeon finder
>no 40 man raid
>heirlooms
All not that bad
>gearscore
This has been around before blizz actually started putting ilvl in the game

>Wrath added pretty much everything that people claim is responsible for "killing WoW"
>People still treat it as if it was the best expansion
Fucking Wrathbabies

>>382037887
>most of those "wow killing" things were added near the end of wrath

>>382037887
>start with MoP
>people talk about the good old times you were never part of
>haha I point out the stuff that was added at the end of wrath and has been a part of 100% of MoP
>that will show them

okay I admit wrath is bad. Then BC and Vanilla are the only good ones

But you fucking MoPbabies need to get cleansed. Like a full on genocide. Because your genes are a danger to the human race.

>>382034507

wait what

what was the difference between group finder and dungeon finder, i'm talking about the little green eye thing you clicked and looked around while it showed you other people on your realm who were also looking for a group

personal opinion:
BC>vanilla>cata>wrath/panda>>>legion>>>shit>>>diablo3>>>>>>>>>>>wod

Vanilla > Cata > MoP > WotLK > TBC > Legion > WoD
Tbh
t. someone who's been playing private vanilla servers for the past 5 years

>>382038557
>>382038640
>cata that high
Why?

That was the moment I hated the world. Now the whole progress of leveling a character is completely fucked as far as the story goes.

>>382038741
10 man raiding

>>382038741
I agree the old world revamp was shit and fucked the endgame of cata because it ate so much resources but I really liked the new zones (except the indiana jones meme-zone), class changes, dungeons and raids. At the time they didn't start with the whole pruning bullshit that started in MOP and resulted in console-tier legion crap we have now.

>>382038741
i loved the pvp in cata
i loved the new zones
deathwing was really cool
tentaclesword

>>382039131
uldum was the best
also twilight highlands

The problem is no with the game.
its with western Gamers.
Western Gamers even when playing an MMO don't want to play with other people. Blizzard is just appealing to those people. You can't blame them for making the garrison and singleplayer content.
that is what people want.

>>382031252
i love how you are so in denial that Pandaria was the best you didn't even put it there

>>382039687
i blame assfaggots

The ONLY version of the game I like is Vanilla

Every other expansion is boring to me, because of things like:

>flying mounts
>no world pvp
>Pvp is extremely slow paced with everyone having 80 gorillion health points and healers being impossible to kill
>CC's only last like 8 seconds
>Stuns nerfed
>The gearing process is boring, Everything is too streamlined, All you do is follow the themepark quests and every quest gives you slight upgrades of gear, No thought required
>The new races/classes are all dumb
>Game changed from a Tolkein-style Medieval rpg, into a Disney-Pixar with all the stupid animal characters, bird-men, walrus-men, worgens, pandas, etc
>Cringey voice acting from all the villains and the cinematics in raids are bad
>No more 40 man raids
>Literally pay $60 to the blizzard jews to get a character boost and skip past the game, How can people defend this?

I could go on all day
This all started in BC and continued on a downward trend with no sign of stopping

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>>382038557
>>382038640
BC>Vanilla>WotLK>MoP>Legion=WoD>Cata
With each expansion the game became less of an MMORPG, focusing less on the world and more on instanced and solo content. However the gameplay and classes have generally been more polished with each expansion (save the last few expansions that killed class identity) so it's really a matter of opinion. If one prefers the classic MMO, going around meeting new people and grouping up for quests, they'd probably prefer Vanilla, while people that prefer solid class and dungeon design will likely prefer WotLK. Personally, I think that BC was a good mix of both, which is why I like it the most.
I put Cata last because it fucked up the old world and even though overall WoD and Legion might be worse in some ways, Cata was the point of no return, and the things implemented then can't be undone.

>>382039508
There were many great zones in cata. I loved Gilneas, Vashj'ir, Tol Barad, Twilight Highlands and the new Dark Moon faire island. All awesome, all had great atmosphere.

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>>382031252
>Legion having votes
>Cata having votes
>WoD havin votes
>All those Wrath Babbies
good god /v/...

>>382037398
ICC dungeon finder was the server one, but it was there before ICC within your own server.

>>382039131
Do you think Cata would have been less shit if they'd steadily been revamping the old zones per expansion, or was the mindset that made it shit too far ingrained?

>>382033248
>Wrath came out Nov 13, 2008.
>That was over 8 years ago
>Everyone that doesn't like the leveling gaps in Vanilla or "muh TB(B)C" on /v/ played wow at the age of 10 or younger

Ya nah, you're just a fucking retard. kys fempai.

>>382040005
>The new races/classes are all dumb
playable goblins were a long time coming.

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>>382040143
tbc isn't all that great
vanilla isn't an xpac

>>382040352
I wish they would have just left them alone really. They destroyed so many places with huge nostalia value and replaced them with meme and pop-culture quests. Have deathwing torch the zones once in a while to show he is there but leave them alone otherwise.

>>382038741
Cata had the best:

-Class Design
-PvP
-Gameplay
-Dungeons
-Difficulty (until the LFR patch)

All it's problems were related to the old world revamp.

>>382031252
>wotlk
>literally the expanson that killed wow by adding group finder
wrath babies need to be gassed

Cata is the best.
>80-85 leveling experience is fun
>Lots of stuff to do at level cap outside of instanced pvp or pve
>1-60 zones are objectively superior once you turn off the nostalgia glasses
>Some of the best raids & dungeons ever
>Classes felt fun to play
>PVP was probably the least bullshit while still having fun stuff
>Consistent updates adding new content
Downsides: Added a furfag race, Dragon Soul. That's literally it. Cata had far less mistakes than any other version of the game.

>>382040579
it was all great till the first patch
but it came from the greatness that was wotlk, maybe the first patch was the real cata

>>382032685
I played since vanilla and think WotLK is the best expac. Haven't played and WoD or Legion though.

>>382040868
I can excuse the first patch since Zul'Gurub is the greatest dungeon of all time.

>>382040849
>1-60 zones are objectively superior once you turn off the nostalgia glasses
NO! You're supposed to grind off boars for hours and have no quests! That's objectively the funnest way to level!

what? did you hear that noise? it sounds like the best soundtrack from each expansion!

>VANILLA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2SZuqyjKtA

>BURNING CRUSADE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PlFr_qqOp54

>WRATH OF THE LICH KING
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCN1yKRjebs

>CATACLYSM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPVjh0kxUE8

>MISTS OF PANDARIA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZeiOQJ8WJ0

>WARLORDS OF DRAENOR
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HObQ7SH9zxU

>LEGION
>implying i played it

why did wotlk have the best ost bros? how did they manage to make such a masterpiece?

>>382040849
By the time Cata came around, the game was already about end game raiding, and I guess they didn't want PvP to be dead back then either. The thing is though, Cata raids were mediocre at best. The only decent one was Firelands.

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>>382031252
>the current ranking is exactly how I would rank them
>tfw in symbiosis with /v/ for once

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Early Wotlk
>Death Knights were OP to the point of absurdity
>The beginning if "insta-craft"
>Disc Priest
Mid Wotlk
>Dungeon Finder is introduced
>DKs are finally nerfed and only OP in the BC areas
World PvP is dead by now
End of Wotlk
>People not knowing how to get to dungeons
>rarely find someone outside of the city
>guilds start disbanding or moving to bigger servers

Vanilla was god tier but had flaws like excessive grinding that rivals and even surpasses runescape since it was competitive. TBC was near perfect sequel. Flying mounts hurt world pvp, but only slightly especially compared to later expansions.

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>Wrath at #1

Yet more proof this board is full of faggots born in '98.

TBC had great PvE content and improved on class/spec design. PvP was still pretty dogshit. Flying was the one of the worst features they've ever implemented. Gearing up wasn't a horrible shitty farming grind like vanilla, but it wasn't overly rewarding to the point you don't feel like you earned anything like Wrath and beyond.

Wrath had the best instanced pvp, raid flexibility, introduction of hardmodes, all specs were viable and not totally garbage like in TBC/Vanilla. There were definitely tons glaring flaws such as the introduction of DKs.

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>>382041409
>blizzturd is so embarrassed about wow sub numbers that they don't even make them public anymore

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MoP

>>382041394
In terms of how the bosses were balanced and how the fight mechanics worked Cata's raids were leagues above most before it.
Keep in mind I'm talking about heroic 25 not the difficulties for retards nor am i talking about the way the dungeons looked (Bastion of Twilight is just a series of hallways)

>>382033502
Cata was absolutely the beginning of the end but it was also the end of the beginning. The last good expansion so to speak.
Wrath was not as good as TBC what the fuck is up with these poll results?
And holy shit Legion is dire.

>>382041316
>Ever running out of quests
>People still propagate this myth a decade later

It only ever happened if you were a dumb faggot that refused to quest in more than one area per level bracket.

>>382041860
I think he's saying
>Go do this quest where you have to kill 30 bandits!
>Now do this quest where you have to kill another 30 bandits!
>Now do yet another quest to loot 20 hats with a low drop rate!
Which meant all you were doing was grinding the same mobs forever

>>382041781
That autismal focus on raids is why WoW turned to shit in the first place.

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>>382042250
i think you are right

>>382042129
He literally said "and have no quests"

>no MoP
Reddit please leave.

>>382041321
Barrens, but probably just for how much I spent there. There's really too many to choose from.
Eversong, Nagrand, or Netherstorm.
Howling Fjord, or Grizzly Hills.
I don't really know.
Valley Of The Four Winds maybe? I don't remember MoP music as much since I didn't play it that much.
Auchindoun, I liked the music that came up right after you beat the first boss.
Don't know either.
All expansions have had pretty good music. I think I still like most of the original Vanilla music the best though.

>>382042250
You're right, which is why I usually feel like Vanilla or BC are the best. WotLK was still good, but I feel like it started to get too endgame focused. Cata and beyond you might as well not even are about any level other than max.

>>382032685
Vanilla was the best, but the question what what xpac. Wrath was the best, and BC is a close second. Cata pre-patch was where it all started tumbling down.

>>382042250
>Muh raids
Meanwhile Cata alone has

>Several long quest chains for max level characters
>A pvp zone
>Several daily quest zones
>Achievements you can get by exploring the world and discovering things you would normally overlook such as the pvp zone in Twilight Hands
>Several extremely rare spawns which give you mounts should you find them
>Regular rare spawns which drop valuable bind on equip items
>Battlegrounds still exist
>Arena still exists
>Gathering professions still exist
>Crafting professions still craft pre-raid bis and in some cases regular bis pieces
>A new profession which gave lore insights and could also give pre-raid best in slot gear mounts pets and other vanity items
>Nearly every zone in the game got remade featuring 100s of new quests

tl;dr you're baiting and probably didnt play the game in the first place or just retarded

>>382041447
>World PVP is dead by now
World PVP died with the introduction of flying and arena, the two worst additions to WoW.

Wotlk was the beginning of the end.
I understand people were hyped as shit, I was aswell, but the bad signs were there even before toc and the dungeon finder.
Classes homogeneization, wintergrasp fiasco, phased areas, and the lore starting to going to shit.
I am voting tbc because that was the time I had the most fun.

>>382043561
You're literally saying world pvp died after vanilla which is not true at all.

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I don't know which expansion was best since I didnt like BC much and didn't give a shit about wow since 2007

But I can definitely say that Cataclysm had the best music.
Got a shit ton of variety to it (the lack of which was my only problem with the WotLK ost). It's much like vanilla, but even a bit better since the motives are more pompous and elegant. The shattering is also a damn good theme.

Second best is either vanilla or warlords (the garrison music is probably one of the best waltzes I have ever heard in a video game). Can't decide though since vanilla has too much nostalgia value (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2SZuqyjKtA & https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvW-QTiZLQ0)

Shittiest music was Mists of Pandaria - holy fuck blizzard you got glen stafford and jason hayes, why the fuck would you hire jeremy soul? He's literally the Hans Zimmer - a.k.a most unimaginative fuck - of video games, holy shit

>mfw listening to that japanesy morrowind shit

holy fuck I'm still mad

>>382043654
world pvp dies as soon as flying mounts are readily available and even when they aren't shit like phasing makes it almost impossible.

>>382043527
And Cata has absolutely zero (0) meaningful content at any level except 85.

>>382032402
Vanilla was good because players back into 2006/07 were more relaxed and friendly

Hell even cs 1.5 I remember being able to play at peace without hearing baby rage everywhere

>>382043654
Sorry, how could I forget the towers in HP, or Hala in Nagrand. Excuse me for not remembering all 20 people who were involved with those. World PVP died when people could rez and fly away before there was any threat, and Druids were the absolute fucking worst.

>>382043527
>>Several long quest chains for max level characters
aka "solve thrall's daddy issues as his personal psychologist"
>>A pvp zone
tol barad is objectively shit
>>Several daily quest zones
dailies are shit and not real content
>>Achievements you can get by exploring the world and discovering things you would normally overlook such as the pvp zone in Twilight Hands
achievements are not real content
>>Several extremely rare spawns which give you mounts should you find them
literally not content
>>Regular rare spawns which drop valuable bind on equip items
see above
>>Battlegrounds still exist
>>Arena still exists
>>Gathering professions still exist
pretty timid way of saying "cataclysm didnt add any new content to these areas"
>>Crafting professions still craft pre-raid bis and in some cases regular bis pieces
professions were fucking gutted, especially engineering. completely ruined.
>>A new profession which gave lore insights and could also give pre-raid best in slot gear mounts pets and other vanity items
now i think you're just shitposting
>>Nearly every zone in the game got remade featuring 100s of new quests
this was the worst part of cata though

>>382043851
How do you define meaningful content?

>>382031252
>WOTLK winning
Jesus, Wrathbabbies have no self-awareness.

>xpac that added the most cancerous elements of WoW is winning

This thread is the proof that this place is filled with redditors

Vanilla is the only good WoW game worth playing. Everything added in later xpac was poor decision and dumbed down content.

Objectively best tier list
BC>WOTLK>Vanilla>CATA>LEGION>MOP>WOD

>>382031252
>all these wrath babbies
Disgusting

>>382043949
>Content is not content
Ok then do 5 man dungeons, battlegrounds, and arena if nothing else is content you have what you want, right?
>Gathering professions still exist
>pretty timid way of saying "cataclysm didnt add any new content to these areas"
???
theres new ore cloth herbs fish and meat in cata my dude
>professions were fucking gutted, especially engineering. completely ruined.
engineering still had a bunch of tools in cata such as bombs a shielding belt its own potions rocket boots, a ranged loot item, and a bunch of other shit

>>382043965
Dungeons or quests that were challenging and relevant that gave rewards that were useful over a long period of time. For example the Whirlwind Axe questline for Warriors at level 30 which was very hard, but awarded a weapon that was top tier until you hit level 60. This questline, along with almost all the other long, hard, and rewarding questlines from Vanilla, was removed in Cata.
Likewise many dungeons in Vanilla dropped items which were great for a very large distribution of levels. You could also CRAFT gear that was good for a large distribution of levels, Shadoweave gear for Warlocks for example.

In Cata, and to a lesser but still significant extent WotLK, nothing before level 80/85 mattered at all. This turned the leveling experience into a chore you had to do before you could play the actual game rather than being the meat of the game with level cap simply adding some extra content. This style of development also resulted in "old" world content being totally irrelevant. Blizzard increased exp rates because they wanted you to skip it, further eroding the fun. The game ceased to be an MMO with a focus on the World and turned into a multiplayer, lobby based dungeon crawler.

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I stopped caring about raiding at a high level during Dragon Soul and just play casually on and off now. If anything what mainly keeps me around still is the RP.

>>382044279
>recolored mobs that drop cosmetics and shitty blues on 48 hour respawn times are comparable to dungeons

>>382044436
you have patrician tastes anon

>>382043723
Imagine having taste this bad

>>382045050
>thinking MoP is shit on every level - even artistic
>bad taste

No anon, you are mixing this up.

>>382044436
Did you play Cata during launch? While it is true, blues you get from a level 82 quest aren't going to be useful while you're balls deep into a raid, but that doesn't mean the gear is useless. At launch the first thing players had to do was get geared for heroics. How did accomplish that? You did quests, normal dungeons, killed rare spawns, or crafted gear. These methods were all pre-level cap content. You could also do archaeology which gave one of the best 2h swords and caster rings.
How is the progression from
Gear you mostly obtain while leveling -> Dungeon/Rep gear -> Raid gear different from any other point in WoW's history?
It's as if you want some random item you got in Netherstorm to still be useful in Cataclysm which is unreasonable.

by the way the whrilwind axe questline wasn't "hard" it was just a quest to kill a level 40 group mob in which you get the quest at 30. All you had to do was find a healer, or even better a level 60 to help you do it. By the way patch 2.4 removed a massive number of elite quests, though some still exist even during Cataclysm.

>>382044436
Every word of this is truth.

>>382043346
essentially this.

>>382043346
>Cata pre-patch was where it all started tumbling down

Don't you mean Cata post-patch?

Cata pre-patch was better than WotLK

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>>382033248
>spend an hour looking for one more person to a dungeon
>had to run/buy a fly all the way, even with a warlock, 3 people was needed
>someone left, had to Hearthstone to the city to start looking agian
>people didnt know where the dungeon was

as a person that leveled only using dungeons, i can say like the dungeon finder. before everything took 1-2hours just to get started

>>382034058
achievements (would have worked if they were very rare and only used for the most exceptional accomplishments such as the Grand Crusader), and arena due to it being factored into ""balancing"" classes

>>382045816
No, Cata was the death spiral.

>>382045487
>At launch the first thing players had to do was get geared for heroics.

That's the entire problem. Aren't you reading? Everything about it is designed to push you towards "endgame" to the point that the actual content of the world becomes irrelevant, or worse, a bunch of shit you have to checklist before you can do endgame.
Vanilla WoW was set up in such a way that leveling was itself the major focus of the game. Level 60 raids were just icing. The problem with Cata design is that by definition it sacrifices the quality of the REST of the game which leads to expansions like WoD and Legion where everything except raids is a chore that you need to do so you can raid.
Flip that around and it means that you wouldn't play the game at all if you weren't raiding, which is why WoW is down to less than 2m subs in the West. If you want to make WORLD of Warcraft good you have to actually have the WORLD as part of it.

Instead, Blizzard has been putting forward a concerted effort to sweet under the rug everything that isn't the current expansion level, and by consequence, the vast majority of the content in the game.

>>382045487
>>382046215
The gear treadmill infects almost every MMO on the market, will they ever be able to break the mold?

Activision merged with Blizard in 2008, end of that year WotlK was released, so I would say BC and the beginning of WotlK was the best and no i didn't clear vanilla Naxx, so I was quite happy about the content in the beginning

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>people trying to imply BC was a great expansion
>when it introduced arenas
>when it introduced flying mounts
>when it shit on the lore and was the true beginning of "Kill this WC3 guy because he's corrupt now/muh demons"
>when there were several lore points that were added to imply there were later plans, but they did nothing with them (I'm looking at you, Turalyon's son)
>when it retconned Draenei to be goat people instead of what the Broken were because we can't have an ugly race for the Alliance it's funny because we eventually got Worgen
>when Outlands was really fucking tiny, and all the zones, sans Nagrand and maybe Zangarmarsh, were awful to look at
>when it introduced the Heroics system to begin with so they could reuse old content
>when it still didn't fix several different specs, meaning you'd still ultimately be locked to a specific spec depending on what you were
>when it started the trend of "hey, you reached a new expansion! Here's some greens that are way better than those purples you worked hard on"
>when other tanks, while improving upon their roles from Vanilla, still didn't matter as much as Warrior tanks which were still the goto as MTs for most fights

WotLK > BC > Vanilla > Cata > MoP > Legion > WoD

>>382046461
For some reason, will all the shit Blizz has pulled, nothing angers me more than Arena. I fucking hate what arena did to WoW.

>>382032431
I'm not saying it was a bad xpac, however it was the most popular, probably the first xpac of many on /v/ so that's why it's their favorite

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I liked WOD, fight me.

>>382046215
It's not like you literally had to do heroics. That's simply the fastest path to eventually reaching the best possible gear. There are many adventures for you to have if you don't wish to raid. For example, have you ever explored Vash'jir? Did you ever do the Black Prince quest line? Did you partake in the war between the Wildhammer dwarves and the Dragonmaw Orcs? I agree that the system of out dating old content when a new expansion comes out is terrible, but I personally have no idea how to fix it.

>>382046176
>no friends to fill up the group
>no guildmates to fill up the group
you're not supposed to play it on your own, you know
it's an MMO after all

>>382046215
this is spot on.
when cata launched, i was amazed and thought this was the best expansion ever. why? because i started with multiple characters at level 80 already so i could jump straight into the new zones, get to max level, and experience the early gear progression through dungeons, heroics and raids with my guildmates and the rest of the server.
but when i look back at it now, the cata design philosophy absolutely ruined the rest of the game. leveling was dumbed down and streamlined like crazy, all group content was removed from the world, dungeons and dungeon quests were redesigned and tuned around brainless LFD groups.

if i had joined as a new player during cata, i probably would have quit the game entirely before even reaching level 50. the leveling is just so damn dull, everything feels completely meaningless, nothing comes close to challenging the player, the world feels empty and forsaken. no wonder subs started dropping in cata.

>>382046862
Me too
>Log in inside my garrison
>Head to mission table
>Get 7400 gold and a best in slot mythic raid item
>Do my daily pet battle
>Log out
I cant wait for legacy servers so I can do it all again

>>382045487

>by the way the whrilwind axe questline wasn't "hard

It was. They gave you the quest at 30, most of the mobs dropping charms were 35+ and the endboss was a 40, plus you had to gather/buy the liferoots too. If you were prepared/social/jewish you could get the weapon much earlier by getting help or just buying shit yourself but you still had to travel around the world and have a nice class quest yourself, including pitfighting in the barrens.

This is a case of excellent story, world and gameplay integration, making the world seem alive and meaningful to players.

Modern day levelling is a non-content, there is no feeling of progression and they hand out worthless blues to heirloom decked players like its candy anyway.

>>382045816

Fuck no, they completely gutted everal specs, especially ret paladin, turning them into plate rogues. Maybe you were just feeling the novelty after literally a year of running ICC and getting bored to death of frozen shit.

>>382046461
You forgot

>start of sanctuaries, where Blizz just pushed both factions together in one city
>Resilience as a PvP stat
>gems, which were just minor stat increases at best

I liked BC myself, but it had plenty of problems people overlook.

>>382046398

MMOs are like progressively harder mountains you can climb. The purpose is climbing together. By regularly ferrying complainers to the top, everyones fun gets ruined.

It would help WoW so much if they shut down servers and reopened some of them as fresh servers that you can't transfer to or race/faction change on. Everyone starts out completely fresh and completely disconnected from x-realm stuff including heirlooms. Even with how casual as fucking hell modern WoW is, it would definitely do a lot for the game. Basically like D3's season thing.

>>382047217
>wow the world is so alive i went to the auction house and purchased crafting mats xD! you can never do this on retail now days!

>>382047389
>Everyone starts out completely fresh and completely disconnected from x-realm stuff including heirlooms.

You don't need a max level character to buy heirlooms anymore. If you start fresh you can pretty reliably buy a couple by the time you hit level 20.

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>that guy who pushes for a more lengthy leveling process

I don't understand these people. Do they honestly find getting 10 bear asses so enjoyable that months of in game play should be required for reaching cap. Do they not comprehend that cap is where the game begins and leveling is just a tutorial?

>>382031897
"my life for yours"

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WotLK

>top-tier zone design, aesthetic, feel, questlines, diversity
>quests were engaging, well-written, decently fleshed out, and interesting as hell, while still keeping the gameplay up front and cinematic bullshit to the back (there were maybe a total of 3 cinematics the entire expansion, and story narrative never pushed gameplay aside like Cata onwards)
>PvE was top tier, and accessible due to gear vendors in the City helping people scale the gear ladder slightly faster with each content patch
>PvP was inarguably at it's tippest toppest peak in quality, no rated BGs splitting BGs in half, no gargantuan health and mana pools to compensate for bads who can't strategize, and nuking / being gloabled gave incentive to play more carefully and time CD's properly, and build specific groups or counter groups
>Lich King saga finally got it's continuation, and met it's finale, which was what a huge amount of WC3 fans played WoW for - the closure of Arthas
>game still had a huge semblance of community until LFD patch landed and sent the game into a downward spiral in terms of community quality and game quality
>game was inarguably at it's apex throughout WotLK until Blizzard started catering their MMO to people who don't like playing MMOs

WotLK was when Blizzard found the right balance of quality and how they wanted things to work. TBC still had that feeling of them still not quite having shit figured out, and this was constantly apparent due to the fact that there were still a lot of classes who only had 1 or MAYBE 2 viable specs, whereas in WotLK, more specs continued to become viable.

People like to shout TBC and disregard WotLK because of all the casual elements that paved the way for the game today being introduced starting at 3.2, but prior to that, the game was at it's greatest and strongest, and people tend to forget that Blizzard bought themselves out from under Vivendi and merged with Activision, which effected their strategy and priorities.

Dispute me.

>>382047471
>A fresh character can easily just farm 500 holiday event currency or 500g
(you)

>>382047439

You had the option.Prepared players were rewarded. Those low level quest materials were meaningful and valuable. People were constantly farming and PvPing around Arathi circles of binding because they were worth controlling. And getting the axe itself was EXTREMELY memorable

I dont even get when all the people wanting a lobby game where no one ever gets left behind flooded in and why blizzard catered to them. Removing/not implementing stuff like this means the game isnt even an MMO anymore.

>>382047643
Leveling wasn't boiled down to 10 bear asses until WotLK. Most quests in Vanilla had at least a few Elite mobs involved, often 2-3 levels higher than the rest, and Elites then were hard, with levels mattering.

>>382047737
Bro you get like 100g for doing a random dungeon.

>>382032402

You had to interact with people in WotLK too.

You still had to get groups together for Heroics. You still had to join guilds to raid, even for PuGs. You still had to keep a positive reputation or else your server would avoid selecting you for server PuG raids and etc.

I had a group of 7 people I met throughout leveling in WotLK alone that I would always do groups with, and we eventually joined a guild together.

WotLK was still very social until LFD was introduced.

>>382040550
BREAKING ME DOWN BREAK ME DOWN SWEET SUGAR

>>382047823
>>Bro you get like 100g for doing a random dungeon.
Maybe at level 60+ if you need on everything and vendor it

>>382047823
Its still mindlessly grinding on bear asses no matter how hard it is to get the bear asses. Its a waste of fucking time

>>382047724

< TBC still had that feeling of them still not quite having shit figured out, and this was constantly apparent due to the fact that there were still a lot of classes who only had 1 or MAYBE 2 viable specs

Wrong as shit, every single spec was viable in BC, sometimes even required for progression. Ret paladin for M'uru, disc priest for Gurtogg Bloodboil. Bloodlust/tremor shaman stacking was the cause of pure cancer.

>whereas in WotLK, more specs continued to become viable.

Every spec was viable in wotlk, not even just as niche picks.

>>382034278

Class homogenization started in Cata.

I played a Shaman from Vanilla to TBC, and WotLK was when they finally made some excellent quality of life changes to shamans.

Cata was when they fucked everything up, got rid of our totems, gfot rid of all our flavor shit, and made the class a boring fucking healbot that never ran out of fucking mana.

>people genuinely preferred the expansion that introduced group finder, eliminating raiding tier progression and raiding the same content for over a year

Ulduar was the best content Blizzard have ever made for WoW though so I'll give them that.

>>382047951
>Having to form groups and communicate with people to progress is the same as mindlessly grinding easy mobs alone

Not really.

>>382046862
I liked it a lot more than Legion that's for sure. That's probably just because I was in a more fun guild though. Also all the classes I liked to play got gutted in Legion, so there's that. I only raided for the first patch of each expansion before getting bored (well, I did a bit of HFC), but for the first tier of raids, I can easily say that HM>EN
Personally I wouldn't mind if the content wasn't up to par, but I really just wish that the classes are more complete and fun in the next expansion. Right now they're all just a mess, and from what I've heard is that they made a few mid expansion changes to some classes that a lot of people hate, like Prot Warrior, which I enjoyed playing.

>>382047643
>cap is where the game begins and leveling is just a tutorial

t. nu-wow playing underage

>>382047823

Dont forget the long and winding questlines leading you through the world, often with dungeon and elite steps too and all the hidden quest starters.

I hate how overtly convenient wow became, you enter a town, get 3 quests, coveniently in the same subzone, do them, turn them in, get another 3 in another subzone and a breadcrumb to the next subzone camp, rinse and repeat.

>>382033578
>Since WoW is an MMORPG,

not anymore lol.

I just got into WoW for the first time this month. Reading about how the challenge to the earlier portions of the games is gone makes me sad but I am enjoying my journey so far. It does feel like I'm taking a tour through a game world a bit, but I like the exposition and lore and the exploration.

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>>382031252
Vanilla,
Panda,
Outland,
Lich King,
Demonhunter even though I only played it for a month,
one of those Warcraft 2 rpg maps,
getting dick pierced by a rusty nail,
Cataclysm.

This is the only proper response.
Too bad the pandaren models are so fucked up that you look anything but retarded in 99,9% of the armor.

So is Legion on its final patch? Or is it getting another raid before a year long content drought?

Fuck man, I still remember how fucking hype Deathknights were when they announced them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2IvDjY3CtQ

I also remember that the original concept was that you'd take a capped character and convert them to the Deathknight class permanently, until they decided you had to have at least one character at 70 before you could make a DK.

Northrend was also pure fucking kino

>the entirety of fucking Zul Drak

>>382048475
I think it's getting another patch with Argus, but I don't think anyone knows anything about what's going to be there.

>>382048216
WoD at least had the advantage of not requiring you to grind bullshit outside of raids to raid. It was, at least, fairly honest about it being raid or fuck off. You could raid, log out, then not log in again until the next raid night.

Legion on the other hand put up all these hoops which you were required to jump through in order to raid, all of which were extraordinarily time consuming, where they weren't also completely RNG dependent. Having 15-20% of your DPS tied up in a random legendary is the epitome of cancerous class design, especially given how much time you had to put in to get a Legendary, doubly so because they fucking soft capped it initially.
A bunch of people in my guild at the time ended up creating multiple characters of the same class so they'd have a better chance of getting the right Legendary. Shit like that should never happen.

>>382048475
Next major watch will be Arguas or whatever the legion planet is called

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>Wrath is winning

Holy fuck you morons actually have taste for once. MoP was second best.

>>382048538
DK's would have been so much better if they required a level 80 to create, and started at level 70. Starting at 60 made the experience so dyslexic, you start the character, then go back in time and gradually work towards where it started. It's retarded.

>>382047643
leveling:
>gett 10 bear asses for exp

endgame:
>buy 1000 bear asses form the auction house to max out your bear ass profession
>get 10 shitty bear asses for reputation, and do it every single day
>get 10 mega bear asses from raids once a week

>>382048538

I just realized something.

Why did they gut Glyphs and, as a result, Inscription the way they did? Iirc, Glyphs were actually a decent system that kind of changed how certain abilities worked? They could easily have kept it going by changing it up from time to time, but they outright did away with it and now Inscription is nothing but "USELESS BUFFS FOR ONE BOSS ONLY: THE PROFESSION."

>all these wrathbabbies
you can't pretend the 2nd half (or the first really) of wrath didn't blow dicks just because Ulduar was the best raid in history.

>>382048751

I assumed it was to give perspective to the narrative of what the LK was up to during TBC.

I agree though. The class should have required an 80 character and then started from 70. It would have made a lot of sense. Like having that character become corrupted in Northrend and undergoing the process of becoming a DK.

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>>382048538
>B-rez used to turn the target into a zambo for a short period

DKs will always be my favorite class.

>>382048538
I'm genuinely sad I'll never be as hyped for a game again.

>>382038436
Dungeon finder was the one where you just put yourself in the queue and got auto-grouped and teleported to the instance.

>>382048884

>they cut Ulduar short for ToC
>they even made that 5 boss, no trash vomit into a tier so Ulduar gear would completely get obsoleted.

that was the moment that did it for me

Wrath was the point where everything played pretty well. I don't know if I'm forgetting something, but I remember the gameplay being pretty solid for every single class and spec. I liked all the raids too.

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>>382048028
I also played a shaman from Vanilla until Legion. Cata was a step in the right direction and MoP shaman was perfect. I think you don't know what oyu're talking about honestly.

>>382048923
Better, they could have integrated it into the game itself, where turning a character into a DK is actually a questline you undertake rather than a tutorial.

>>382048705
It's because over time, people have started seeing how many flaws BC brought to the table and how many it actually had during its own time.

Vanilla also isn't an expansion, I don't know why it's in the strawpoll.

So how do we save wow from its downward spiral?

Legion had some great moments in the beginning, the pre launch event was epic for filling up the older zones, and the world pvp was great in the beginning.

Now that they can level sync everything, can we make every zone syncable and the whole game relevant at every level once again?

>>382049120
Wind rush totem is so much fucking fun to use. I wish the cooldown was shorter.

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>WotLK best expansion
>dungeon finder
>"bring the player not the class"
>multiple difficulty modes for raids
>braindead easy heroics, facerollable even by people in questing greens
>braindead easy first raiding tier (except sarth10+3d)
>a single decent raid tier followed by objectively the worst raid tier in WoW history and then like 1+ year of ICC
>start of the capeshitization of the storyline by shoving in faction leaders in pseudocinematics and turning Arthas into a parody of a cartoon villain
>tirion fucking fordring
>dragon mounts handed out as candy
>killing a fucking dragon aspect
>gearscore
what the fuck is wrong with you people

>>382049120
Enhance Shaman is great right now

>>382048538
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2IvDjY3CtQ
fuark that video still sends shivers down my spine

>so come then, you "heroes"!
>come, in all your power and glory!
>for in the final hour, all must serve
>the one
>true
>king!

>>382033645
Just as bad as WoD.

>>382049028
t. 10 man normal mode shitter.

Ulduar had many BiS items until the Onyxia patch

>>382049258
>meme frog poster
>has shitty worthless opinions

>>382049245
Blizzard aren't going to save shit. They're already talking about their designs for the next expansion in their Q&A's. Blizzard are going to continue the same trends.

>>382048538

Fuuuuck man. The prerelease event for WotLK was some amazing shit too. I remember my whole guild of like, 50 people getting together and infecting each other to create this massive fuck army. We migrated from UC to Org to TB and then tried to get to Nordrassil before we finally got purged as fuck by this raid group of anti-fuckers ruining the fun.

The fact that the event ended early because of people being such bitches about it made me really angry. It was truly one of the greatest most creative
events the game ever had.

only people who like MoP onwards are the people who started playing in MoP
i know a dude who started in MoP and he thinks Legion is the best shit ever

>worst class right now (sv)
>still topping charts in my guild
>get 7% damage buff
cant wait to raid tonight

>>382049391
Vanilla player here
MoP was good except for 1.6 years of Siege
Legion would be good if not for artifacts, and bad class design

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I'd still be subbed if Blizzard could stop shitting on the Horde for just one patch. Cata was the last time I saw content that wasn't Anti horde.

>>382049391
he's not wrong. MoP and WoD are trash.

>>382049464
Survival is cool as fuck. It's one of the few specs in the game I really like, and one of the only things that makes me want to resub slightly.

>>382049391

MoP was actually good though, but I still can't decide if it's because it was actually a good expansion, or if it was because Cata was so god damn shitty.

>>382048789
>Iirc, Glyphs were actually a decent system that kind of changed how certain abilities worked?

most major glyphs were just variations of
>[skill] has X% increased damage/healing
>[debuff] lasts X seconds longer

not that there's anything wrong with that

>>382031252
no pandaria stawpoll null and void

>>382049537
>we dindu nuffin

>>382049348
To be fair he is right on all those points

>>382049617
it's certainly challenging. Plus, there's no beating butchery. 2 million damage instantly to every creature in 8 yards.

Vanilla > TBC > wotlk > mop/cata > legion > wod
Vanilla was flawed in many ways but that also made it interesting, it had a lot of content and people talked to each other. At the end they opened up battlegroups though which helped queues a bit, but at the same time ruined the server community. Probably the very first "beginning of the end"-type thing.
Early TBC was really good, had fun gear progression in a linear yet kind of open way. Flying was a bad idea in hindsight, and then they introduced free epics etc, which to me felt like a negative. Also opinions and all, I was never really a fan of the way Outland looked, except maybe Nagrand and maybe the mushroom place.
wotlk introduced aoe tanking and generally felt mediocre. The quest system also fucked up the world, since people were in different phases. Then introduced dungeon finder. It had its charm in some ways, but fuck wotlk honestly.
Everything after this was downhill. Had some charm, but most of it just felt mediocre.

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>/v/ now unironically thinks MoP was the height of the game

>>382049695
I quite enjoyed cata Garrosh. he was the Ogrim Doomhammer of his time, hardass warrior Orc asshole. But then they teacked on racism and made him a villain for no reason and it just kept spiraling down.

>>382031252
just gonna vote for WoD since MoP isnt on there

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>>382048789
>Glyph of Bladestorm
>Reduces the cooldown on Bladestorm by 15 sec.

>>382048789
I don't remember glyphs ever being interesting.

>Your aoe hits 1 more target but deals 10% less
>Hitting 1 more target is equal to far more than 10% so you always use it unless its a pure single target situation

Not that I think what they did to Inscription was even close to acceptable

>>382049537
Funny you say that, one of the reasons I don't even bother following Warcraft story anymore is because I'm tired of them shitting on Alliance and dicksucking Horde literally non-stop since RoC release.

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>>382049765
Yeah, but I also really appreciated the aesthetic with the explosives combined with natural weapons. You're literally playing Dutch.

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>>382048645
Reasons like this are why I'm staying the fuck away from Legion until the expansion is over and we get something new. I don't like the artifact weapon, I don't like legendaries, I absolutely fucking hate the class hall, and I can't stand the gameplay for a lot of the classes. Fury warrior is the only spec I can honestly say has been improved and is actually really enjoyable to play since the start of Legion.

I'd rather just wait until the next expansion hits (whenever the hell that will be) so I can start fresh into a new place and immediately replace my dumb ass artifact weapon. It's really a shame too, because the Broken Isles are a genuinely interesting place, it's just I cannot for the life of me stand all the dumb little bullshit you have to do in this expansion. I find none of it fun and they all feel like chores to me.

>>382049646

But I know some of them actually changed abilities. I played Warrior at the time, and I recall there being a glyph that changed Devastate to where you stack sunders faster, which was great.

I also know there was one for Mocking Blow that essentially turned it into a second taunt in case your regular taunt was on cd.

Personally, I felt it was a great system. You had major glyphs that effected abilities, and then you had minor glyphs which were just neat little cosmetic things. It was a system that added a bit of itneresting depth to your abilities, and could have been improved further, but instead they just trashed it entirely and made an entire profession useless.

>>382031252
>mop not listed

I guess I can't vote then

>>382050010
yeah we get it stop samefagging

>>382049939
They're going to do the same things in 8.0 in all likelihood.

>>382049786
You can still make that same exact trek in MoP though

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>MOP gets announced
>Instant fan backlash because of the retarded ass pandas
>Players leave in droves.
>Pandafags claim its because the game takes place in an oriental fantasy setting and western players are racist

>Fast forward to 2017
>XIV releases Stormblood in an Oriental fantasy setting
>The absolute height of the games entire life
>Pandafags forced to deal with the fact that no one liked stupid fucking pandas and they single handedly ruined the entire expansion

How will pandafags ever recover?

>no pandaria

>but cata and WoD is there

fuck you op

>>382041564

There's plenty of people who played since vanilla who think Wrath is the best.

Wrath was the expansion that nailed atmosphere, PvE and even to an extent PvP.

Burning Crusade was under development early in vanilla so the issues that vanilla had were still present to some degree in BC. BC's zones felt pasted next to each other and raids were still being fine tuned.

Everything about Wrath felt great, the way the zones blended together, the way early zones were designed for ground mounts and the later zones designed for flying mount. Raids felt challenging but not absurd, Wintersgrasp was amazingly fun and actually brought back some element of world PvP.

Finally Wrath featured the most popular villain in the Warcraft lore with proper interaction. Whole expansion felt great.

>>382049767
I like you, for the most part. At least you're spot on about wrath.

>>382033248
dungeon finder came with cata you retard

>>382050072
>Release expansion full of content
>Casuals cry about vain bullshit
>Release Orcraft: Orclords of Orcland
>Game nearly dies because it's all DUDE ORCS instead of actual content
really makes me think

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>>382050067

>>382047972
Even something as Fire Mage ? Shit was flashy, but you needed to be way too close to the action for your AOE to work. Plus relying on crits was a bit too gimmicky.

Still loved it, though.

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>>382050201
No it didn't

>>382031252
Vanilla and TBC were objectively the best eras in terms of community and gameplay. The whole feel of the game was on point back then.

Wotlk is when the game started going downhill in terms of development, casualizing the game, etc, gradually getting worse each expansion by introducing cross realm servers, raid finders, being teleported to the dungeon, heirlooms and the overall balance of the leveling experience going to shit.

>>382050105
WotLK raid content was trash. Ulduar was the only decent raid in that entire expansion, and even it is highly overrated because of Karazhan syndrome. The way they handled Arthas was downright insulting for anyone who actually liked Warcraft 3. Even the abortions that were Diablo 3 and Starcraft 2 were not as bad as WotLK.

>people defend the MoP gutted talent trees
>people defend the McChina setting
>people defend over a year of SoO
>people defend the rediculous numbers
>people defend the dailies

>>382050201

Dungeon Finder was Wrath
Raid Finder was MOP

>>382050528
Raid finder was the last patch of Cata.

>>382049786
Never understood this meme. Draenai and Elves had natural progression routes all over Kalimdor.

Unless of course it's for playing with humans/dwarven friends, in which case no need to go to IF, just roll Loch Modan instead. It's a comfy zone.

>>382050526
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the talent over haul. it went from getting +0.05% more damage with your chosen weapon to actually making build changing choices.

>>382049941
yeah there were a few glyphs that altered abilities in a major way
>glyph of eternal water
>water elemental is now permanent, but can no longer cast freeze

ther also was some warlock glyph that gave corruption ticks a chance to give you an instant cast shadowbolt (same as nightfall talent) and a few other neat things like that.
still, most were just straight "this skill gets X% beter" upgrades. like the one you mentioned :
>devastates inflicts 2 stacks of sunder instead of 1
it's just a straight upgrade that makes the skill better at what it does.

still, i don't think there's anything wrong with most glyphs just being upgrades to skills. inscription was a good way to make herbalism relevant to more than just one profession.

>>382050489

Don't forget letting people be Horde or Alliance on the same server. This and menu-based pvp/dungeons obliterated any sense of friendship on the game.

>>382050520

Okay.

>>382050528
no

>>382050759
Glad to have helped.

>>382050526
MoP talent trees were actually better. With the old system you would take all the obviously good talents for your spec then have 10 points left over to take useless meme shit like 1% more dodge on a non-tank class

In MoP you get 18 extremely powerful talents which allow your choices to matter

>>382050426
that old looking for group tool already existed in TBC
but it didnt teleport people anywhere, it wasnt cross realm, and it didnt auto match. it was basically just a list where everybody could look for other people to do dungeons with. nothing wrong with that, but it wasnt used very much.

>ITT: People stating what they liked about certain expansions.

>Also ITT: Spergs who refuse to believe that people like content other than their precious BC.

>>382050715
>Don't forget letting people be Horde or Alliance on the same server.
As in ? You could create an orc AND a human in the same serv during Vanilla, couldn't you ?

>>382050526
>>382050687
>>382050976
like clockwork lmao

>>382049373
yeah. thats was pretty cool. reminds me of the zul grub glitch that could whip out an entire town..

>>382048705
people are to young to remember/have played TBC.

>>382050976
The old vanilla system actually allowed people to come up with unorthodox specs, like say shockadin or reckoning bomb. The new system was just removing spells and allowing you to repick some of them.

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>>382051046

>still no profession other than Leatherworking that benefits from Skinning as its main gathering profession

>>382050976
That whining about old talent trees just being x% increases is a bare faced lie made up by Blizzard. The reason the old talent trees ended up that way was because every time someone found a neat, unique build, Blizzard removed it. Straight up removed it.
Dreamstate Druids, Cataclysm Warlocks, sl/sl, Spellhancement Shamans, Shadowfrost DK's, Sword Spec Fury warriors, Prot/Holy, Shockadin, Reckbomb, Ele/Enh hybrid, Boomkin healers etc.
Every time players actually USED the old talent system to come up with something new and fun Blizzard gutted it. Ultimate evidence of this is the Cata system where they locked you into a single tree until you got the final talent to prevent people creating new and unique things.

>>382050715
There is so much that went wrong with the game.

The removal of class specific quests, or the removal of class specific buffs that made the classes feel unique, etc. You can't possibly mention everything that went wrong with the game in a single comment, because there is simply too much.
All the small innocent changes that gradually changed the entire game.

>>382051297
Tailoring ?

>>382051409
True, but Tailoring mostly uses cloth, skins are not a staple and were only used for a few recipes. You otherwise just need something like wool cloth and some thread bought from a vendor. I'm talking about how Mining is used for Engineering, Blacksmithing, Jewelcrafting, and Herbalism is used for Alchemy and Inscription, so their gathering professions can be sold to multiple crafting professions. Skinning is only made for Leatherworking.

>>382051330
Most of those never got removed lmao shut the fuck up. Most of them weren't even good
>Dreamstate druids
LOL

>>382050976
Old Talents
>something to look forward to each level, even if it's minor. It might sound silly, but the act of going into your tree and clicking which bonus you wanted was actually fun.
>A new skill every 10 levels
New Talents
>A new skill every 15 levels

The new talents make leveling even more boring. The only benefit it has is that it's easy to change talents when you need to, like for PvP, grinding, or raiding. Don't say that you're given more choice now, because talents are just as cookie cutter as they always have been.

>THERE MUST ALWAYS BE A LICH KING at #1

Literally ruined the franchise. That's when the shit started where they assrape the lore and characters in favor of having "cool shit" for players to grind through. Nothing in the story matters, anyone and everyone gets corrupted if it makes for a cool raid boss and character permadeath is a good joke.

>>382051192

The old vanilla system was literally just picking core certain talents that were the obvious choice, then just chucking your left over talents into w/e the fuck you wanted. People say vanilla had a ton of flexible specs when really it was just those core talents + gear.

I once tanked LBRS as a fucking Shadow Priest, that didn't make the spec good.

>>382051849
>Nothing in the story matters, anyone and everyone gets corrupted if it makes for a cool raid boss and character permadeath is a good joke

Why talk about Burning Crusade like that?

>>382051849
The worst part is "There must be a Lich King" would have made perfect sense if Blizzard hadn't cut all the context. Bolvar had to become the Lich King in the original script because the masses of undead were needed to hold back the Nerubian hordes. But with the Nerubian zones being cut, that wasn't on the table. Blizzard consistently fucks up by cutting important story elements and not bothering to re-write the story itself.

>No MoP
Found your cool video OP. Nice Night Elf : ^)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_GX8Crrak4

>>382052005
Both Illidan and Kael'thas were obviously evil by the end of TFT. Just because you played with them in the campaign doesn't mean they were good guys. You played with Arthas too, remember?

>>382052005
Explain. In BC Illidan actually got killed off for good. That is until much later when the franchise had been fucked to death and they needed to bring him back because they are incapable of writing completely new hype as fuck characters.

>>382036660
Hey man, Bear tanking SoO was god tier with the vengeance reworks.

>400k DPS as bear on iron jugg.
>Only time during the expansion where bears were not complete shit.

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>>382052051
That makes even less sense, considering quite a bit of lore said that the Nerubians were mostly wiped out by the undead (Anub'arak being a traitor and one of the reasons the Nerubians got fucked so hard by the undead in the first place).

Wod is on this but panda isn't? Panda wasn't great but it was better than WoD

>>382052354
It was intended to be explained in the Azjol Nerub zone. They were leaderless without their Old God to command them, but when Yogg Saron started speaking to them their civilization rallied, and they also started practicing their own brand of necromancy and using their own undead. Bolvar was meant to use the Scourge to put them back in their hole, but the zone got cut and instead we got "THERE MUST ALWAYS B A LICK KING XD".

So many people voting for wotlk, how? Wrath went to shit once toc was released and lfd was introduced along with "there must always be a lich king". Ulduar was the peak of the whole thing.

I'd vote for Vanilla since times were simpler back then and the game felt huge and alive, but it's not an expansion. My vote goes to tbc then, even if flying mounts killed world pvp. At least the player interaction was still there

>>382052262
Illidan did not get killed off for good he gets captured my maiev as she finishes the fight for you.

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>>382031252
Wrath

>>382052757
world pvp was fucking shit anyway
99/100 times it came down to who jumped who first

>>382031252
>no mop
>this many wrath votes
>vanilla is an expac
I want neo-/v/ to go

>>382052235
Illidan was ded at the end of TFT, or mortally wounded. Kael showed signs of villany and Kil'Jaden saw "potential" in him.

In TBC he's now lusting after demon cock and betrayed his master (starting the Legion-Illidari conflict in Outland - wished they expanded more on it). Quite a change.

>>382051849
This was the end of 3.3.5 - all before was good.

>>382052262
>>382052235
Illidan was literally sitting in his corner and weeping about "muh Tyrande" and also anally anguished over losing to Arthas with his stupid anime jump during the battle. He did jackshit and then we straight up murder him because Akama was upset he didn't just hand over Black Temple back immediately. I'll give you Kael'thas because it seemed obvious from the start with him wanting power it would turn him evil. Meanwhile Vashj was just following orders and gathering water, the Naga were doing for some reason. This is still literally the start of killing WC3 characters because they became corrupt and evil. Are you saying for some reason killing Arthas, Anub'arak, and Kel'thuzad, all of who were on the evil side, didn't make sense lore wise?

Outlands was a dying planet anyways, why did we have to go there other than to see Thrall's grandma? The Lich King seemed more of a threat, especially with Naxxramas being at the end of Vanilla and the Scourge still having quite a presence on Azeroth. If you just destroyed the Dark Portal, then there wouldn't be a need to go to Outlands.

BC hit the best balance for me of having to actually work for things and easing up on the most archaic systems.
WotLK comes second to me but the launch had really boring raid content and Ulduar took forever to come out but it was really good. Raids getting difficulty levels is what finally killed it for me. No I don't want to clear a raid and then instantly have to go back to progression the week after. With Ulduar you had clever ways to augment the fights but then they instantly went lazy.

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>Be Horde.
>Garrosh becomes warchief and starts expanding borders, reinforcing Ogrimmar and shitting on the Alliance
>WE ARE FORCED TO LAY SEIGE TO OGRIMMAR AND KILL A BUNCH OF MAJOR ORC FIGURES GUILTY OF NOTHING BUT LOYALTY
>So he goes to jail and gets sprung
>FORCED TO CHASE HIM THROUGH TIME AND KILL ALMOST EVERY MAJOR HORDE LORE FIGURE THERE EVER WAS.
>Go to broken shore
>EVERY MAJOR LEADER IS BELLY UP, WARCHIEF GETS KILLED BY TRASH AND SYLVANUS DISHONORS US WITH RETREAT.
>Well this can't get much worse I guess...
>SYLVANAS BECOMES WARCHIEF, NO ONE CALLS BULLSHIT THEN SHE GETS SHIT ON BY A LITERAL WHO WEREWOLF.

I stopped subbing shortly after Emerald Nightmare was released. Did Blizz ever stop taking huge dumps on the horde?

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>>382031252
do people actually like wrath? thats when i knew the game was dead
still played mid way through then i couldnt take it anymore