Perfect fighting games don't exi-

>>381518117
Smash is NOT a fighting. Repeat after me. Smash is NOT a fighting game.

>>381518117
This could've been someone's son or daughter.

Yo dude, I'm a BEAST at pin the tail on the donkey.
1v1 me irl in kick the can, bro.
Olly olly oxenfree, get bodied son, BOOM.

>>381519043
BOI you ever play marco polo with ME I'll make you unplug your goddamn controller SON

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Perfect Metriodvania games don't exi-

>>381518117
st

>>381518117
Melee was very fun, but it was in no way perfect.

>>381518409
you fight and its a game so objectively you are wrong

>>381518409

>Characters fight each other with no other mechanic in between, just beating the shit out of your opponent.
>not a fighting game

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>tfw no more PM

>>381519393
I wanna play this game

but im so fuckin tired of overrated metroidvanias

>Guacamelee
>Shadow Complex
>Dust: Elysian Tale
>Ori and The Blind Forest
etc...

im not sayin they are bad, but man do i feel like these are the "Oscar-bait" equivelant of gaming

>>381519575
PM with mods, and friends is the best.

>puff
>ice climbers
>peach
>luigi

enjoy your perfect game brah

>>381518117
>melee is perfect
lol?

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Smash is a casual fighting game like Team Fortress 2 is a casual FPS game

>>381518117
Brawl in 2x speed or stamina with character bans is better, only problem with brawl in these modes is tripping.

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Reminder that Hax saved Melee once again recently

Also post more Melee webms

>>381519687
It really is. I'm so tired of playing the same melee maps with the same two characters. Why can't we just have fun for once

>>381518117

I would prefer if Ganondorf was top-tier, otherwise it's near perfect.

>perfect
>when pokefloats and ice mountain exist\
>when less than a quarter of the roster is viable

>>381519926
hax is a little bitch who cried about leffen being a bully despite being more of a shitbag.

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>every character must be equal or it's not perfect

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>>381519575
>tfw PM stopped development just as they were about to release their best character yet

>>381518117
>fighting game

>>381520450
Well fuck I didn't know that. It hurts more now

>>381520450
Honestly Knuckles looks janky as fuck, doesn't really look completed.

>>381520569
He's not.

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>>381518117
Melee is not a fighting game
this is why it's superior to them

>>381520450
I looked it up and the dude has a fully working knuckles and he only made a video to show that they did it and went out of his way to specifically mention that no one will ever get a download link. What the fuck man

>>381520569
He was unfinished when they stopped development, but was obviously going to be the next character. You can only play as him, along with Lyn and Isaac, in a build that one of the devs leaked after shutting down.

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>>381519926

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If Smash Bros can be considered a fighting game, so can Dark Souls.

Prove me wrong.

>>381521631
burden of proof is on you dumb shit

>>381519043
>>381519335
Money match me in Twister faggot

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>>381518409
>Super Smash Brothers
>A game
>The main objective is to fight
Sub points:
1) Playable units are referred to as "fighters,"
2) Each "fighter" has a "moveset" of button-related attacks which exists for the purpose of damaging your opponent "fighter."
3) Each allotted time-frame of gameplay is referred to as a "match" and a series of "matches" is deemed a "set."
4) The objective to complete a "match" is to win against your opponent by defeating them in a battle.
5) In order to win a "match" or a "game set" and defeat your opponent in the battle, you must attack the opponent with your "moveset" until enough damage allows you to smash said opponent into an non-recoverable state off of the stage you are battling on.
6) Should the opponent make contact at any point during your battle with a "blast zone" (an invisible, off-stage perimeter surrounding the 2 dimensional plane to the sides and both above and below the stage), a "stock" from their pool of "stocks" is removed.
7)) This aforementioned damage is counted in a percentage, growing from 0% all the way to 999%. The higher the percentage, the easier any move from your "moveset" may smash the opponent into an non-recoverable state. Should a stock be removed, the damage counter is reset to 0%.
8) If all stocks are removed from your opponent's pool of stocks, and the remaining stock count is zero, you win! Conversely, if all of your own stocks are depleted to a non-existent amount, you lose! This can all be parlayed as "health," "lives," and "KOs" as is common in other fighting games of this genre.
9) Super Smash Brothers, Super Smash Brothers Melee, Super Smash Brothers Brawl and Super Smash Brothers 4 Wii U have all been relevant games at conventions where fighting games are being played in a large tournament. For nearly two decades, Super Smash Brothers has been officially recognized as a "fighting game."
10) Grow up.

>>381521418
those are two really terrible players. watch an actual fox main play in a tournament.

cherrypicking per usual though.

>>381521802
man twister is kiddie shit. You wanna put some money down let's play some hardcore Clue or Apples to apples lil nigga. It's gonna be me with the candlestick in YOUR ASS BRUH FIND ME ON THE STREETS

>>381521903
Boy don't test me I'll bring my game of Sorry! anywhere anytime and whoop your ass until you got more sides than the die

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>>381518117
Melee is just a party game that speed runners pretend is a fighting game.

>oh yeah, I'm one of the top pro Smash players in the world
>except for that time I had to walk away from a tournament because none of the controllers were defective, and my strategy revolves around exploiting defective controllers

That's not a fighting game, it's a physical form of autism.

>>381521850

You forgot to mention the Stamina Mode.

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>>381521669
both games you fight other players

Seems to be the main argument for Smash

>>381521850
1, 2, 3, 4, 5 all apply to Dark Souls 2 pvp arena

6, 7, 8, and 9 are just describing Smash Bros and 10 is just an insult.

I love Smash. It's not a fighting game. Not in the sense that Street Fighter or Tekken are. It's a party game. You grow up.

>>381522052

>compshit

Who gives a crap about that autism fest? I've never seen a single "comp" player that isn't a train wreck.

>>381521850
With this kind of logic used you could also say Super Smash is a MOBA

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>>381522187
>Not in the sense that Street Fighter or Tekken are.
Literally the only difference is not having a life bar deplete.

>>381522072
...which this
>Stamina Mode
completely nullifies as a difference.

And why are you talking about Dark Souls, a role-playing/adventure game?

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>>381519393
SOTN started and ended the metroidvania meme. It's essentially the only good one, along with the GBA CV's.

hows the smash 4 comp scene been? is it still just ally and zero playing mario diddy sheik and cloud

>>381522539
Except, mechanically, it is nothing like a MOBA???

I guess every game is a gacha, RNG clicker!

>>381522783
Now you're getting it
Mechanically it's nothing like a fighting game either

>>381522762
No, there is a large group of people, both nationally and globally, playing no less than 9 different characters at champion-level competitiveness.

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>>381522187
>1, 2, 3, 4, 5 all apply to Dark Souls 2 pvp arena

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>tfw the combined force of autism of capcomfags and nintentoddlers is enough to finally kill the FGC

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>>381522869
>Mechanically it's nothing like a fighting game either
Simply stating it to be so, without any evidence to support said statement, does not make it so.

Sorry this is so tough for you to accept :(

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>>381523083
Even if one was to say that Smash is a fighting game, it lacks the complexity of even the most basic of games in the genre. SF2 is more mechanically complex than Smash is.

Marth's reverse bair is the sickest move in the game, prove me wrong

>>381523253

>it lacks the complexity of even the most basic of games in the genre.

Such as...

>>381523253
How is complexity a defining trait of a genre? There are simple and complex strategy games. Simple and complex puzzle games. Simple and complex FPS. But fighting games are a rare, special case where it can't happen?

Divekick is probably the simplest fighting game, and yes, it's still a fighting game.

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>>381523253
>Smash is a fighting game
>but
>it lacks the complexity of even the most basic of games in the genre
I'd love to hear your thoughts and a list of what you believe are the "basic" games of the genre. And don't cheat on me with some indie "Dive Kick" level shit. Make the games popular and prevalent.

>SF2 is more mechanically complex than Smash is
Is it?

>>381523083
No meters, no directional inputs, no life bars, no supers, movement system is entirely different from every fighting game, KO system is completely different than any fighting game

That's just the tip of the iceberg too and assuming you're playing with items off and on final destination maps. Your argument is that it's a fighting game because you hit your enemy until theyre dead, which is an argument you can use with tons of games

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>>381523487
I love you for being on the same Divekick wavelength, anon. Let's be friends.

>>381523556
So just because it's not a Street Fighter clone means it's not a fighting game.

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>>381522187

Hey. Question.

What makes you think it's a party game? I'm not >>381521850, but I have my own little set of "sub points."
>smash requires all the same skills as a recognized FGC game except multi-input moves
>smash requires greater spatial awareness and stage knowledge
>smash requires knowledge of recovery moves and how viable they are in the given situation
>combos aren't as guaranteed due and require a greater focus on reading DI, character weight, FAFs, etc.
>the game IS jank as fuck and you have to take into consideration player exploits as well as programmed gameplay
>effects like rage, knockback growth, and moves becoming stale means you can't effectively use the same play style for an entire match
>having the "percentage" style damage falls semi-in-line with an actual fight
That being that the more damaged you are, the more likely you are to be KO'd
>a great number of characters have specific attributes like Luigi's traction, Bowser's tough guy, Samus' roll, intangibility on certain part's of hitboxes, super armored move sets, etcetera add layered depth to even the bad characters

I mean, if anything, Smash requires a significantly larger skill set than traditional fighters. Whether it was designed for it or not, I think it's time to get off the "real fighting game" high horse.

How come Smash players are so intent on having the "fighting game" label when they don't have any interest in or respect for the rest of the genre? Honest question

>>381523729
No. There's 3d fighters like soul calibur and other games like dive kick, skullgirls, and marvel vs capcom
These all share similar mechanics

You might as well argue that duck game is a fighting game if you're going to argue that super smash is

>>381523949
>These all share similar mechanics
In other words, they play like Street Fighter

Remember kids, only generic Streef Fighter clones are allowed to be fighting games!

>>381524012
>play like street fighter
How about you actually play a few fighting games before you decide what is and isn't one?

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>>381523487
Yes. Fighting games are significantly different than other genres, a "simple" fighting game doesn't work as well as a simple strategy game or shooter game. The more complex a fighting game js, the more challenging and engaging it is to play because your options and the options of your opponent are increased. Obviously layers of depth that aren't well implemented don't make the game better, but since the genre has moved past the experimental stages most games that come out today are very well polished.

>>381524138
>The more complex a fighting game js, the more challenging and engaging it is to play

Good job you just described how every game genre works.

Smash is a platform fighting game
Street Fighter & co are traditional fighting games

Both fighting games, just different subgenres. You lads need to calm down.

>>381519535
>>381519570
>>381521850
The creator of the game doesn't consider it a fighting game either.

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>>381521631
>>381518409
*sips tea*

>>381524012
>all play like Street Fighter
I'm a smashfag but way to lose all credibility anon
Saying Soul Calibur or Divekick play anything like Street Fighter is retarded

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>>381523556
>No meters
Wario's waft, Donkey Kong's Punch, Samus' Charge Shot and of course the many chargeable moves like Marth's Shieldbreaker, Ike's Eruption or Little Mac's KO punch. Many characters have specials that indeed charge up or deplete in strength as they are used. "Stale" is also a very abstract form of a meter. So, point 1: refuted.

>No directional inputs
"tilt" is literally a term for every single character's movesets. Point 2: refuted. btw, there are totally "directional inputs" to eliminate lag on many moves and add to the movement and combo dynamic in every variation of the Smash series.

>No life bars
Literally the damage percentage. Wrap your head around the concept. And if you still cannot, "Stamina Mode" exists. Point 3: refuted.

>No Supers
Every single smash attack or charged special is a super, let alone what Smash Balls attacks are. Point 4: refuted.

>the movement system is way different
No it's not. You walk, dash, run, jump and dodge on a stage all by using a dpad or analog stick while pressing a jump or dodge button on your controller. If anything, fighting games like Ehrgeiz or Tekken are "way different" with their rotation mechanics. Point 5: refuted.

>KOs are by blast zones, not death from a depleted life bar
Granted! Pretty interesting twist on the fighting game win scenario, isn't it? Point 6: acknowledged! But does not support the mechanics of a fighting game, only the win condition...which is still directly tied to damaging your opponent to hurt them anyway.

>That's just the tip of the iceberg
And yet your Titanic argument has already sunk. Maybe you should spend some more time designing the framework of your argument.

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>>381523556

>>381518117
Meleefags ruin smash.

>>381523929
>Capcomcucks eating SFV and MvCI
>people buying GG and BB AGAIN after the trillionth re-release
>Injustice full of normies and dominated by a furry
>Tekken 7 will last two years at best
>Best hope for the genre is a Dragon Ball game that is already confirmed casual as fuck

I don't even think the FGC likes it's self anymore, I don't know why there's so much gripe between communities.

Smash is not a fighting game

>>381523729
The term fighting game literally means street fighter clone.

>the most broken Smash game is considered the only legitimately competitive Smash game
Explain.

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>>381524297

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why can't the fgc and the smash community exist in peace?

Your existence only fosters each others.

>>381524105
How about you provide me evidence that not all fighting games are Street Fighter clones with only superficial differences between them?
Prove yourself or shut the fuck up, tourneyfag.

>>381524494
>the most broken Smash game is considered the only legitimately competitive Smash game
Brawl's competitive scene is dead though.

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>>381524330
https://youtu.be/HIeB8vLx-6M?t=113
Sums it up perfectly, fighting game fans just pretend like they don't hate the shit out of smashfags because they bring in the money.
Not just that but if you look at the registration numbers you also see that people that register for the smash games also barely register for the other games, they really are only interested in smash instead of actual fighting games.

>>381524494
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qxVDOc-oV8&t

Watch the first half, the rest is retarded

TL;DW Melee being rushed made it like a fighting game with Rocket Jumping-tier shit on Quake or Mario 64 game breaking speeds, but it doesn't detract from the game so it's broken-ness and actual worth as a game work together to create quite of an spectator sport and hell of a fun time to play

>>381524352
>this amount of delusion
>jerks himself off saying refuted each time
It's not even worth arguing with you at this point anon, you're clearly desperately going to twist smash mechanics into something that resembles a fighting game mechanic
Charges and CD's =/= meters
Tilt =/= directional inputs
Knockback percent =/= life bar
Special attacks =/= super
And you're saying the movement isn't different? Have you played a fighting game? Jesus anon

>>381523929
It's not about having the title, it's being dismissed from popular venues for not having the title...despite its enormous popularity and community. This constant attempt at dismissal comes from a strict, but very loud, few who seem to feel threatened this mildly unconventional fighting game may decrease the amount of casual or dedicated fans of their own more traditional "deplete the health bar with DP motions" fighting games.

>>381524691
Smash players can't seem to decide whether they actually want to be a part of the FGC, whenever it comes to the prestige of being a part of it they'll fight to the last nail but they simultaneously hate every other fighting game. They use their own set of terminology that's completely different from the rest of the genre then try and compare it to other games to make other people think it's the same thing. The community is also obnoxious when they show up to places and fill up venues with kiddies and neckbeards.

>>381524743
>all he does is say smash isn't a fighting game
stunning argument
I mean he's right about the rest of it but hey

>>381524697
>How about you prove that these games I never played aren't like this other game I played
Why don't you actually go play them dumbass, instead of making assumptions. I could sit here and go into depth about how Soul Calibur is completely different than Street Fighter but it's pretty fucking obvious to anyone who has played either

>>381524138
Your argument isn't even now about what makes a fighting game, you're just complaining your subjective opinion of a "good" fighting game isn't the standard for the entire FGC anymore. I'm betting you're also extremely frustrated that it's only the most recent iterations of Street Fighter, Killer Instinct and Mortal Kombat are played regularly and not the super good fighting games like Tekken Tag Tournament and Soul Caliber 2 aren't being played anymore.

>>381523556
>Virtua Fighter isn't a fighting game

I don't like Smash, just came to this thread to call you a faggot

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>>381522052
>>381522187
PARTY GAME IS NOT A FUCKING GENRE
Mario Party, Mario Kart, and Smash are all considered party games, because they're commonly found at parties. However, this does not mean they're all the same genre. Mario Party is a party board game. Mario Kart is a party racing game. "Party games" are just games commonly found at parties, but do absolutely nothing to describe the genre the game actually is.
If you want, you don't have to consider Smash a fighting game. I'm fairly certain that you could classify it as a platformer game or an action game if you wanted to. But stop throwing out this term and acting like it means something.

>>381524697
>explain to me how a 3d fighter isn't the exact same game as a 2d fighter
Does he even need to?

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Perfect fighting games don't exi-

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>>381524330
>2 smash games

everytime

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>>381524985
>but they simultaneously hate every other fighting game

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>>381524820
It's proof of maturity to accept your loss, good work, anon. If it's important to you, you will come up with a better way to voice your argument in the future to try and convince others with objective data and community group-think to support subjective classifications like "what's a genre?"

Keep working on it, little buddy :)

>>381525206
Yes, you do. I don't see an argument, and unless you present credible evidence to support your point, I will not be convinced.
And no, I won't play it when I could easily replicate the experience by paying Guitar Hero while watching a Bruce Lee film.

>>381524330
SF third strike is the best SF game, and like everyone else, they let it go. Learn to adapt people.

>>381524985
I play Smash and also like other fighting games.

>>381525201
Virtua Fighter has plenty enough of traditional aspects to fit in the fighting game genre anon
I didn't mean to imply that it wasn't
As well as Fighting is the best, and pretty much only genre, Virtua Fighter would fit in

>>381524776
>Caring about the opinion of retard who don't even watch sports and wanted to imitate the actions of meleefags by buying a gamecube.

D I S G U S T I N G.

Absolute cringe. Just because he has a good voice doesn't mean he is right.
You could watch some smash 4 competitive scene and it would be the same.
Just because he learned some terminology by watching melee doesn't mean that melee is good. He is just a fag who takes melee hell seriously. Nothing else

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>>381525217
>Smash players so stinky they actually need a bouncer to get rid of them

>>381524776
Sakurai removing advanced mechanics in the later games because he wants it to be a party game is so fucking retarded. Removing those mechanics doesn't make the game better for casuals and all it does is making it worse for the hardcore players.
>>381525315
Then explain why most people that sign up for smash only sign up for smash and none of the other games.
Smash players don't give a shit about actual fighting games they just want to play smash, they just want to be part of the FGC to be bigger.

>>381525438
they only do it because of Capcom.
if the industry suddenly abandoned fighting game players the community would be something very different.

>>381524330
I can't wait for Sunday to be delayed by four hours again because god forbid smash isn't played on the main stage

>>381525478
>Removing those mechanics doesn't make the game better for casuals and all it does is making it worse for the hardcore players.
It's given me a decade of entertainment from Meleefags sperging out

>>381525448
You missed the point, the first half of the video is literally about a faggot that doesn't care about sports nor fighting games explaining how Melee attracted him as an spectator esport and why is it engaging as a game and what makes it different from other fighting games and future instalments in the series, the question the original anon asked.

But continue in denial.

>>381525514
Wasn't Smash delayed by another game though last year?

>>381525478
I don't hate fighting games, I love fighting games and smash.
I do hate fgc that mindlessly hate on smash though.

>>381525514
There is nothing to watch on Sunday anyway. GG and Melee are both Saturday.

>>381525640
Well the same thing is happening now to SF in V. the next installments are only going to get dumber too, you'll be in the same boat as us except you'll still be bending over and grinning.

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>>381524012
>they all play like Street Fighter

>>381525656
Well I meant in a general sence, the majority just seems to be like that.
And yeah, mindlessly hating on smash is dumb because even if you don't consider it a fighting game it still has a competitive value.

>>381525641
He is just repeating the obvious you mongoloid.

All the stories I've heard, and the people I've met, and the lackluster arguments for why Smash should be considered a fighting game, I have to wonder why Smash isn't just annexed from the FGC considering the property and its mechanics and its community are so arbitrarily segregated and different.

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>>381525897
>you'll still be bending over and grinning.
But even the pros of SFV are literally calling the devs behind the game retarded.
They take it because they get paid for it, not because they like the game.

>>381526212
>hurr he's just repeating the obvious
>WHY IS MELEE POPULAR AGAIN?

Pay attention nigger.

>>381526213
because they bring in money and viewers
like everyone has said over and over.

>>381526213
Because money, why would you turn away that one weird guy that mostly just does things on his own in the corner when he wants to give you a shit load of cash?

>>381526213
Because the only people who say it isn't a fighting game are people on /v/.

>>381526283
well yea whores are paid to get fucked too
doesn't mean they enjoy it

>>381526139
Give proofs, fag

Nah Mario party is the best fighting game
>compete against other players to raise your star count (round wins)
>fill your meter for advantages. Fills more for doing good (coins)
>expend your meter to unleash a devastating super attack (candy)
>beat your enemies into submission so they can't score and you win during a time out
Fuck why won't the FGC just accept Mario party already??

>>381526508
Play Marvel vs Capcom or Mortal Kombat and say it's like Street Fighter.

>>381526417
a fairly large percentage of the fgc believe it to be the case.

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>>381526508
>prove to me these clearly different games are different
Why don't you go watch some videos or something?

>>381521903
>>381522038
Fucking scrub ass niggas. Why don't yall take off the skirts and play me in some Operation? Come at me so I can OPERATE ON THAT ASS!

>>381526587
Guilty Gear probably would have been a better example.

>>381525478

If every FGC player plays literally every other fighting game then why the fuck is BB pretty much dead?

>>381526737
Any fighting game series really. It's like saying all 2D platformers are the exact same.

>>381526764
it's anime that has no nostalgia value for them
at least GG was around during many of their childhoods

>>381526764
or KOF, or GG, or Skullgirls, or Pokken, or Mortal Kombat...

>>381526628
Then they have no idea what they are talking about.

Anyone who actually takes the time to learn the mechanics of melee would say that it is a fighting game.

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>>381521850
1) All of your points literally apply to Call of Duty when concerning the game itself.
2) They are extremely vague so you can justify something similar to being identical. RTS =/= MOBA.
3) Grow up, mommy can't pay for your nintendies all the time.

>>381526213
You are aware that this is just a /v/ thing right? Tokido, JWong, and most notable FGC players consider it a fighting game and watch the tournaments. James Chen, FGC commentator, said on a recent podcast that Melee takes the most skill of any active fighting game.

>>381526587
>>381526673
>Clearly different
Oh no no, is not Street Fighter, there is different waifu
The differences between those games are superficial, if not non-existent. You're fucking kidding yourself if you think they are any different.

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>>381526523

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>>381527072

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>>381527072

>>381523253
melee is probably the most complex fighting game ever made btw

>>381527158
>>381527147
I see memes and ad-hominem but no proofs. All you've done is reinforce my view of tourneyfags being delusional retards.

>>381518409
>a fighting game HAS to be a linear 1v1 set in an obstacle free 2D map where you hit each other until someone dies

Autism.

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>>381527072

>>381526910
most of them don't
It's too different. Plus the big thing is that to many of them it doesn't look like a thinking man's game, it looks like less RPS over and over and then first hit into tech skill video. The concept of neutral in smash is a lot different than other fighting games, which I think is the hardest thing to swallow, that such a neutral game really exists.

Another big thing is confirms. because of DI a lot of combos are not 100% confirms, many stray hits are also either 0 to deaths or do nothing at all depending on % and position.

Lack of certainty in punish game is another thing that scares the fgc.

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>>381527017
>He thinks Justin is reputable and credible
>He forgets the amount of Evo shill cocksuckers there are in the FGC
>He thinks this is EXCLUSIVE TO /v/

This thread is fucking full of gold. Please just pretend that this was epic bait instead.

>>381523253
>it lacks the complexity
Because it's not an arcade game made in the early 90's designed to take your quarters until you figure out how to do one move?

Movesets in Smash are intuitive. Everyone performs their moves the same way and it focuses on what really matters, which is actually using those moves well. The fact that "fighting game fans" focus on stupid shit like that is why the genre has been stagnate for like over a decade.

I'm practicing Melee. Does anyone have interest in looking at some of my recorded practice sessions and giving me their impressions?

>>381520450
Were they ever working on Sami?

>>381525217
They would have had to kick out westablls though.

Before we can have a serious discussion on this topic, we need to offer our definition of a fighting game, and detail how and why we came to that conclusion (otherwise why should anyone put any stock in your interpretation? The most informed and well-thought out and best articulated definition is likely to be the one best to use, after all). Then the two arguing parties would come to a consensus on that definition.

Otherwise, we just have threads full of "NUH UH!" "YUH HUH!"

>>381524776
Thank you for that youtube link, I loved watching that. It was well-made and DAMN what a clip to end on!!

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>>381527336
>le green letters so it doesn't count
too green

>>381527347
post em

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>>381527280
>Hey look /b/ros, I learnt of this sick new latin word that lets me win arguments, regardless of its meaning. It's called a fallacy!

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>>381527362
Not enough to warrant anything playable. She was gonna be a Snake clone I think.

At least we have a Ridley mod.

>>381527336
have you ever even been to an fgc event? the whole shitflinging is limited to the internet, in reality most fgc are mild to neutral about their interest in smash

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>>381527338
Input commands are a design feature that adds depth to the gameplay beyond requiring skill to do combos.

>>381527443
This is /v/.
manchildren on both sides will never stop talking shit

>>381527323
>The concept of neutral in smash is a lot different than other fighting games

I don't get this, because unless the game is in the series this true for every fighting game, like GG's neutral is nothing like Tekken's neutral

>>381527508
I really should hack my WiiU and start downloading some Smash 4 mods.

>>381518117
Nintendo should be ashamed for not supporting this game.

If they want to be relevant in this industry, they should start manufacturing CRT TVs, Gamecube controllers and a version of Melee that uses both.

At this rate, Melee can't survive and it's Nintendo killing it.

>>381527632
>are a design feature
Yeah. It was literally designed to take your fucking quarters.

>>381527763
*A rerelease of Melee

Stop making shit smash games like Brawl and 4, obviously

>>381527443
The term "fighting game" already defines itself though. Literally any game where the objective is to beat another person in melee combat should be considered a fighting game.

Street fighter should not be considered the only definition for a fighting game just because it was the first big fighting game.

>>381527338
There's a reason smash is the only fighting game with a simple control scheme that's been successful.

>>381527682
right but I mean in terms of lows highs and blocking, which still works the same way in both GG and tekken. Plus in smash it's possible to just run around and be an asshat while in other fighting games the run away shit doesn't really work because of restricted movement/environment.

>>381527336
http://chigesoku3.doorblog.jp/archives/39344570.html

"I'm interested in Smash and want to play it. But to not neglect SF, I don't plan on entering tourneys yet." - Tokido

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>>381527728
>Smash 4
Nigga, this is Project M Legacy XP, which is a mod of Brawl.

>>381527494
This is my most recent one, and I'm going to be doing one today as well. I don't expect you to watch all of it considering it's against CPUs for over an hour and that's completely boring so I have some timecodes in the video description that I thought were key points, but you might find your own or criticism for me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSUPhspXenk

Some information you might not notice immediately is that I strictly use tap jump and that my computer itself sometimes causes inputs and other issues, but other than that the mistakes are my own.

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>>381527541

Do you even FGC? I'm the toughest FGCer in the FGC. FGC FGC FGC. My usage of this acronym means I am FGC.

Look you dumb mouth breather, everyone ignores Smash at a local event. The idea is to distance it from the EefGeSee. Nobody cares about Smash because it's not a fighting game, it's not a bad game in itself.

>>381527763
>manufacturing crts
good joke
and they still are making gamecube controllers, albeit pretty shitty ones.
all they would have to do is remake the game in HD with no lag on LCD.

>>381527914
Oh. Well I still need to download that shit too.

>>381527970
Cringe

>>381527982
Melee fags still wouldn't play it because "it wouldn't feel right"

>>381527982
Smash community won't play it. They need CRTs.

Nintendo is doomed unless they comply. Competitive smash players are the only thing that can save Nintendo. It's time Nintendo listened to them and not their own interests

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>>381527883
>He wants to compete in it for event money due to his occupation as a fighting game genre pro player
>This means he loves the game and it's a fighter because he wants in

>>381528048
>>381528045
>misconceptions about the community
everyone would play on that shit if they could
in the future faster melee might become the norm assuming crts staring kicking it/become too infeasible.

>>381519619
Dust was utter shit imo. The only one worth playing is Ori. It's actually good.

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>>381528042

>>381527982
That's actually already possible with gamecube hardmods. Most early gamecubes have the required hardware to output digital signals.

>>381528048
>They need CRTs
Is that why all of the top players frequently play Melee netplay on their 144hz monitors?

>>381527883
>Tokido wanted to get into Melee/Smash 4 3 years ago
>Infiltration wanted to try it out too

>years later no word from this, still playing SFV when we know they don't enjoy it

Man being an esports player for the money must suck dick

>>381528197
>faster melee
It's objectively better but they still wouldn't want to play it, and again that's because "it wouldn't feel right". Meleefags are stuck up bitches, like that guy that refused to play because there weren't any specific defect controllers at the tournament.

>>381527925
I will say that tap jump is just infeasible for some things, particularly retreating double fair as marth and instant upairs/upair juggling in general. You could easily learn to use y/x just for those things as I also use a mix of tap/x/y in my play but you pretty much will have to for those.

>>381528436
What do you mean? They already play it. It's literally the standard for netplay.

>>381528229
if there was ever a better time to use that gif, it was now

>>381528581
>for netplay

>>381528436
low tier troll but the main real reason everyone sticks with crts is because it's the only "official" way to do it. We still vaguely hope nintendo will recognize us and using unofficial methods to play the game in tournament would deny any chance of that.

>>381520569
I could care less. His Superman punch and digs are kek as fuck

>>381527970
what he meme by this

>>381528440
Right, I understand that and have problems with U-Air juggling among others you mentioned. However I'm incredibly stubborn, so I'm going to make tap jump work for everything like I've always played Smash. Aside from performing certain things with a mix of jumping methods, do you have any tap jump specific tips you could share?

>>381528675
Indeed.

>>381528675
If you can play netplay you can play local, anon

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>>381527925
Do you use tap jump by choice? imo it would be way better to learn to use buttons asap because tap jump is a lot more inconsistent and it makes things like wavedashing stupid hard.

I've only been playing with a competitive focus for about a year so I'm not super experienced or anything but good general advice is to break down the different parts of the game and work on them individually, like

>neutral
>punish game
>DI/escaping combos
>edge guarding
>matchups
>character specific techniques

Also I'm sure you've probably heard general advice like stick to one character and play to learn not win, which is really important. Its also good to work towards consistence and long term improvement than easy or cheesy tactics.

>>381523556
> no meter
Street fighter 2 vanilla

> no directional inputs
Smash has tons, do you mean special move motions? soul calibur has none.

>no life bars
you still take damage and can die from hits, its just not set in stone exactly how much damage will be needed to kill you

>no supers
SF2 vanilla

> movement system
Plenty of 3d fighters have weird movement mechanics too

> KO system
Soul calibur had ringouts before smash

>>381524297
Randy doesn't consider battleborn to be shit, doesn't mean it isn't.

>>381527816
I feel that "fighting game" is a label assigned to a more abstract concept rather than something that should be defined by the semantic meaning of its title. That's almost like labeling all arcade games as "scoring games"; sure, you do score in Final Fight, DoDonPachi, and Valkyrie no Densetsu just as you fight in both Street Fighter and Smash, but it makes little sense to equate the former three when the actual experiences are so far removed. I would say that the digital and analog controls alone (that is, there implications and impacts on gameplay) would warrant dividing the camps.

Traditional fighting games and Smash are both cool and fun.

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>>381525202
>party board game.
>PARTY GAME

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>>381518117
>There are people RIGHT NOW on this board that un-ironically think melee is better than brawl

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>>381528229
Is this OC

>>381529124
this is an even worse troll than claiming smash isn't a fighting game

So who wins Melee at EVO?

This is neither perfect nor a fighting game

>>381529124
Brawl is literally busted dude. Every other has guaranteed chain throws and brawl is the only smash game to ever have a character completely banned.

>>381529192
this is an even worse troll than licking lead

>>381529005
*their implications, I need to go to bed.

Point is though, there is a difference between the traditional fighters and Smash despite the label assigned to it, which warrants exclusion of Smash if we're to keep using the label. Yie Ar Kung Fu and its ilk could just as easily have been called "digital input controls relative to the opponent life depletion martial arts games" and we wouldn't be having this discussion. Just because it had a more ambiguous descriptor instead doesn't make the clear divide in the experience of playing each type of game any less extant. Or something. My bed is beckoning me.

>>381528898
I use tap jump by choice and out of habit since that's all I've ever done.

You might not be able to tell against the CPUs, but I understand neutral and edgeguarding fairly well; I'm not new to Smash but more new to learning the techskill of Melee and converting that into muscle memory.

I do try to break down what I want to practice each time, so some videos I work on doing aerials from the ledge or how I dash dance. I have yet to fight against a human opponent because my computer is too shit for netplay at the moment, so I don't have the matchup, DI, or punish knowledge quite yet.

Based on the video, do you think I'm practicing appropriately? Is there more in a particular area I need to focus on? I don't have anyone to talk Melee with so any kind of feedback is very helpful.

>>381529240
m2k, armada or a non-god

>>381529192
Smash isn't a fighting game though
It's a party game or platform brawler

>>381529124
I don't, Brawl was fun as fuck. I really miss it, especially since it was devoted mostly to mid-200s Nintendo, which was my favorite period of theirs.

>>381529240
I see only Armada or Mang0 taking it honestly. Mang0 is the only one around right now that can take out Armada consistently enough, he just has to make it there without losing to Chudat or Axe or something.

>>381529240
as long as it's not hbox im literally happy with any outcome
>armada wins, secured as the eternal goat and no more arguements will ever be had
>mango wins, 3vo kino
>leffen wins, finally can deliver on all the shit he's been talking
>m2k wins his first major in centuries

he's gonna kill the views again if he has another cancerous winners run like smash n splash

Gee well you beat each other up, or ..um "fight" (by the very definition of the word) and, and its a video game. SO uh

Lets just put those two things together and what do we get?

>>381529510
Super Smash is multiplayer? It has online? You battle? It's in an arena? Woah let's put those together
Super Smash must be a MOBA

>>381529510
Can't you come up with a better argument? Like you "fight" in a lot of games dude please come up with something better. I'm not even trying to get in on this "Is smash a fighting game or not" argument but damn you look like idiots when all you say is "WELL YOU FIGHT DUUUUUR" and you aren't making any valid arguments to defend yourselves.

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Who the fuck even cares if it's a fighting game or not? It's still fun to watch and play and that's all that matters. Even if the FGC decided to ban smash from all its events i literally would not give a fuck as the game has enough majors on its own anyways to sustain itself. Maybe smash needed evo back in 2013 but at this point fgc acceptance is completely irrelevant

>>381529510
Holy shit anon... you're right...
GRAND THEFT AUTO V AT EVO WHEN?

>>381529406
One thing I do notice is the lack of crouch cancel.
Tons of times the npc dash attack/jabs or something and you get sent into hitstun when you could be easily cc'ing it and punishing.

>>381529876
Yeah, I don't know how to consciously train to do crouch cancels. Do I just expect to get hit and need to work into muscle memory to crouch? I figured I should be trying to be mobile and dodging instead of tanking a hit. But even then, I'm not quite sure how to practice it naturally and so it sticks.

Is there any reason to play anyone other than Yoshi?

>>381530064
Sincere question
Are you gay?

>>381530260
Yes, why?

>>381529406
>You might not be able to tell against the CPUs, but I understand neutral and edgeguarding fairly well

Yeah you definitely understand it but until you get the edgeguard 100% of the time then you still have things to practice but that's just melee in general.

If you don't have the ability to play against actual people then 20xx cpus are probably the next best thing just don't actually focus on beating them, especially in neutral because they play nothing like humans and constantly drop easy combos that someone who has been playing a week could probably do no problem.

>Based on the video, do you think I'm practicing appropriately? Is there more in a particular area I need to focus on?

Yeah I think so, but its also important to practice while not fighting a cpu so that you can focus more on execution. Setting up a cpu to hold shield and using that to practice shuffl timing is by far the best way to learn it.
A very good thing to put a lot of time into right away is movement, especially with marth since all his movement options are really good. Other than that just put time into playing the game and figuring out how to use your moves to the fullest. A lot of times I find myself trying to think of some way to beat something like a short hop approach and I forget that I can just reverse fox's uptilt and beat most moves in the game if timed correctly.

>>381529794
It sure is a lot better of an argument then others have, a video game centered around fighting each other to win. I really is that simple. I doesnt have to be a street fighter clone. Dude.

>>381529743
Yeah whatever and its a fighter, you fight each other

>>381530042
well another thing you can do is buffer asdi by holding c stick down as you dash, this works as pseudo crouch cancelling but yea in general you just should crouch when you expect to get hit, its a better defense than shielding unless you get hit by a move that beat crouch cancelling like fox dair or shine or whatever. I worked it into my gameplay by randomly holding down a lot and then just naturally learning to hold down more or less situationally, it's not easy.

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>when a 500APM party game gets continuously invited to EVO but your pr0 fightin gayme isn't, and its community dies every day

>>381530541
skullgirls?

>>381530320
Just wondering

Why is Puff so tough to play? How does Hbox make it look so easy?

>>381519619
>>381528220
I genuinely couldn't finish Dust because of how bad the art and voice acting was. The combat was also very spammy too.

>>381530779
He's put more work into the game than you.

>>381530779
30+ years of paying against fox

hopefully he dies b4 EVO

Should I go to GOML?

It's really far away and I suck but a friend of mine in Toronto offered to house me.

>>381530349
>but until you get the edgeguard 100% of the time then you still have things to practice
Absolutely. I was more clarifying that I wasn't new to Melee or Smash in general and not that I've "mastered" anything. Edgeguarding has always been my strong suit and my favorite part of Smash, but I'm not quite used to all the angles, fallspeeds, etc. which plays a part in why I can't do anything impressive, but that should come with time.

>20xx cpus are probably the next best thing just don't actually focus on beating them, especially in neutral because they play nothing like humans and constantly drop easy combos
I think I am playing too much to beat them, so good call. I have to adjust that. They're giving me a bad habit of F-Smashing them because I understand how they jump very well.

>its also important to practice while not fighting a cpu so that you can focus more on execution. Setting up a cpu to hold shield and using that to practice shuffl timing is by far the best way to learn it.

I do practice that way in addition. I don't want to spam video links unless you think of a particular technique you want to see how I work on it, but I have a whole playlist of my practice so far in case you want to see more of what you're talking about or how I address practice in general.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLl8SBY_SAfBj-IpyT75fgX_SyHp_ljtZn

>A very good thing to put a lot of time into right away is movement, especially with marth since all his movement options are really good. Other than that just put time into playing the game and figuring out how to use your moves to the fullest.
I'm definitely working on movement. That's why I like playing against the CPUs to practice weaving in and out of their moves with movement alone. Like I mention above, the various intricacies I'm still working on internalizing.

>>381518117

Autistics strike again. When will you losers off yourselves?

>>381530410
>>381530410
I'm unfamilar with ASDI, but I do know of SDI (That's another aspect I'm not sure if I'm doing correctly and is why I've been turning on those DI lines like in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFo97NOTuPg to try to learn what my options are). Is it Assisted or something because of the C-Stick?

>its a better defense than shielding unless you get hit by a move that beat crouch cancelling like fox dair or shine or whatever.
How do I learn when I should be crouch cancelling? I know it only works while I'm at low percent, but what percent does it stop working? Is there a list of moves that crouching against won't work, or is it something I just learn over time through experience?

>I worked it into my gameplay by randomly holding down a lot and then just naturally learning to hold down more or less situationally, it's not easy.
Thank you. I'll try to consciously use your method when I practice today.

>>381531154
how much crouch cancelling do you use out of a dash? crouch cancelled dash downtilt is one of Marth's best tools and should be learned to be second habit. pivoting is a bit more high level but dthrow/bthrow pivot tippers is marths best way to deal with a lot of floaties.

>>381531365
multi hit moves like peach dsmash/fox dair cannot be cc'd (or rather they are stupid to cc) as well as moves with fixed knockback (shine) and spikes (falco dair)

>>381531440
I go for D-Tilts out of wavedashes, but that doesn't sound the same as going for them out of purely dashes. So no, I don't think I'm crouching cancelling out of a dash at all. Any crouch cancelling you see me do is purely by accident and not that I've learned it. Can you crouch instantly out of a dash to go for what your saying without needing to wavedash first?

>pivoting is a bit more high level
I've heard of it but never dedicated a session to attempting to learn it. It's turning the control stick very quickly in the opposite direction out of an initial dash, correct? Or am I mistaken? Is there a video or something you recommend to learn it?

>>381531612
Right, I know Peach's D-Smash and Fox's D-Air you should avoid doing it, but everything else you didn't mention is fair game to attempt to crouch cancel? Is there a general percentage where it stops working? For example, "Marth should always go for crouch cancels against X up until percent Y"?

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>mfw a guy with the tag "Dr. Peepee" literally became the best in the world at this game

I've always wanted some fuck with a tag like "Sergeant Dickballs" that you see in low pools on stream sometimes to become the best in the world so they'd be at EVO top 8 in front of hundreds of thousands of people representing the game and community with a tag like, "Rectal Fissure Farts".

>>381531928
You have to admit that the family friendly version of his names sounds much cooler.

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>>381518117
This is what a perfect fighting game looks like.
https://youtu.be/WBQKMJsYEro?t=128

>>381531154
>https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLl8SBY_SAfBj-IpyT75fgX_SyHp_ljtZn

Ah I didn't see that. Yeah that's pretty much what you should be doing.

I noticed that you also record matches with people and that's really good for analyzing your mistakes and bad habits and definitely one of the quickest ways to improve.

I don't really see any specific tech that you need to practice that you already aren't but one huge overlooked mechanic is finding out what can and cannot be buffered. I'm sure you know that in smash 4 pretty much everything can be buffered but only certain things can in melee and some of them are kind of weird so its good to go over that. Things like using the C stick to buffer frame perfect rolls/jump out of shield is extremely useful.

>>381531365
ASDI occurs when you are holding a direction on the Cstick or control stick before you are hit. It does the exact same thing as SDI except you don't go as far.

>>381530779
Autistically playing Puff every single game since he got into Melee because he was too much of a shitter to play Fox consistently.

>>381531918
>but everything else you didn't mention is fair game to attempt to crouch cancel?

It really depends on how strong the move is. Also be aware of certain moves that do fixed knockback like fox's shine. Its almost always bad to crouch cancel moves like that or it makes no difference.

>>381531918
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_aqH9sJnbU
best video on pivots I think

as for crouch cancelling percentages there are just so many different moves that I'm not sure there is a list. I'd say around 50-80% is where it breaks but I;m not truly sure and it probably changes from character to character too.

>>381532036
>one huge overlooked mechanic is finding out what can and cannot be buffered. I'm sure you know that in smash 4 pretty much everything can be buffered but only certain things can in melee and some of them are kind of weird so its good to go over that.
Right, I know Smash 4 is extremely lenient with buffering but I have no idea what can be buffered in Melee save for accidentally getting light shield when I go to L-Cancel an aerial or try to grab immediately after I land and get one.

>Things like using the C stick to buffer frame perfect rolls/jump out of shield is extremely useful.
Is there any video or information you could share with me to look into this or at least learn more options I could be doing with buffering?

I'm not used to using the C-Stick for anything save for occasionally aiding in SDI (is that how it even can be used in Melee?) I really need a lot of practice on how to SDI/DI properly because I feel lost at times. I know that in general you want to hold perpendicular towards the angle you're being launched at, but past that I have no clue.

Another thing I remembered is that I don't know how to mash out of grabs in Melee very well anymore. I've always just rapidly spun the control stick, but it doesn't seem very effective against the 20XX CPU.

>>381532340
I've managed to crouch cancel strong moves like Falcon's knee or certain D-Smashes and then tech afterwards (that's an Amsa tech, correct?), so is it more not to crouch cancel strong moves unless I'm also prepared to DI correctly and tech? Or is it better to stick to avoiding the situations instead?

>>381532476
Thank you, I'll get on this. I might not be able to understand it well enough to practice it today, but I practice at least 3 times a week so I will get to it soon. If you or anyone else has a Youtube and has interest in following my improvement, please feel free to comment on my videos with any critiques and such you have. I'm very grateful to have all this feedback at once, and to have it more often would be wonderful.

>>381532720
holding shield and c stick/control stick are the only things that can be buffered in melee
c tick for aerials is generally faster and can be more useful (such as for retreating aerials so that you can perform fairs while maintaining backwards momentum without holding forward.
mashing out of shield you can spin both stick and mash buttons but iirc mashing doesn't help as much as spinning both sticks and can be dangerous if you accidentally press an input when you get grab released.

>>381532973
if you are teching a move you aren't crouch cancelling it anymore. crouch cancel means you don't get sent into hit stun and can act immediately

>>381526890
Pokken has a pretty active online,around 4000 players, and gets decent entrants numbers. It's certainly more fucking alive then skullgirls or GG.

>>381532720
>accidentally getting light shield when I go to L-Cancel an aerial

I think that's just you holding L too long and shielding after your lag ends.

Is there any video or information you could share with me to look into this or at least learn more options I could be doing with buffering?

Here's one specific example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2O0aiXHeV4

Buffering rolls works kind of the same way. Just shield and as soon as and attack hits your shield hold a direction with the C stick and you will do in on the first possible frame. You can also hold shield and hold c stick in a direction and you will keep rolling/spot dodging until you release one. This is situationally good for spamming spotdodge as a mixup. There are a few other things like buffering jumps out of hitstun and I think you can technically buffer a fastfall 3 frames before you reach the peak of your jump.

>I've always just rapidly spun the control stick

I believe this is fastest way to escape a grab but it has the downside of not letting you choose your DI although since your spinning the stick your DI is basically random which can be a good or bad thing.

>>381533072
>mashing out of shield
I meant out of grab

>>381533072
>c tick for aerials is generally faster and can be more useful (such as for retreating aerials so that you can perform fairs while maintaining backwards momentum without holding forward.
Yeah all of that is definitely great for Marth, but I'm stubborn with that too and try to do my best with using A instead even though it isn't optimal.
>mashing doesn't help as much as spinning both sticks and can be dangerous if you accidentally press an input when you get grab released.
The only part of that I worry about is if I start spinning the C-Stick as well, wouldn't I run into the same potential problem as mashing buttons ini that an input might come out at the worst time?

>>381533182
Gotcha, my mistake. That would make more sense as to why I should be only doing it against weaker moves.

>>381532973
>>381533259

Forgot to mention but here are some videos that are super helpful.

https://www.youtube.com/user/meleemechanics

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03qCJ_Ikbho

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkdPVUlrSOo

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101KB, 285x285px

>>381533259
>I think that's just you holding L too long and shielding after your lag ends.
That sounds likely, I don't really lightly tap any button I press. But I use the Z button to L-Cancel, so does that cause any different issues or it's the same thing that I hold it for too long?

>ust shield and as soon as and attack hits your shield hold a direction with the C stick and you will do in on the first possible frame. You can also hold shield and hold c stick in a direction and you will keep rolling/spot dodging until you release one. This is situationally good for spamming spotdodge as a mixup.
Oooh I didn't know all this. That all sounds cool.

> I think you can technically buffer a fastfall 3 frames before you reach the peak of your jump.
This might be very relevant to me, because I'm still struggling to get the short hop and fast fall part down pat with tap jump, so maybe this could be an assist on one aspect of it and thus leave me more room to concentrate on the short hop muscle memory.

>I believe this is fastest way to escape a grab but it has the downside of not letting you choose your DI
Ah ok, thank you.I guess I just need to spin even faster.

>>381533525
Thank you very much, I don't think I've seen either of these before. I'm also keeping a running playlist of tutorials I find (and will add these videos you shared to it), so perhaps someone else might find one they need that I can be of service to.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLl8SBY_SAfBjXh1piW_1Yejx1uV3KbCPX

>>381533441
>I'm stubborn with that too and try to do my best with using A instead even though it isn't optimal

You really should work on using the c stick and not using tap jump for shuffling. I know everyone will tell you stick to your preference but it really is so much harder. Just for context try to do a shorthop downair and fast fall with just the right stick and then try with a button jump and c stick down. Its easier and since you have one stick dedicated to your aerial you have so much more control over your air movement and fast fall timing.

>>381533916
No problem dude, I'm just happy to actually be discussing melee and not just

>melee
>fighting game

>>381534152
Because you don't need to discuss the fact that Melee is not a fighting game, it's a fact that it isn't, all autists try to argue against this and just end up embarrassing themselves.

>>381534038
>I know everyone will tell you stick to your preference but it really is so much harder.
Hahahaha! I've actually never heard anyone tell me to stick to tap jump; it's always legitimate reasons like yours to switch off of it. Although I'm stubborn, I'm not oblivious to the benefits of switching over to C-Stick aerials, button jumps, etc. A few months ago before I started to practice more seriously I posted in a thread like this one and describing how I would have to learn to wavedash, SHFFL, etc. with tap jump and if that would be possible or not. It is needlessly difficult and doesn't necessarily provide any benefits as a tradeoff, but I'm making progress with it and I want to see how far I can push it.

>>381534152
Agreed. I don't remember Melee threads being so devoid of actual content, but it's been bad for a while now. I guess there's not much to discuss unless you actively play it, and even during tournaments it's more about the "hype" or the people there then meaningful discussion on the gameplay.

>>381518117
When will this be real life and not TAS?

>>381535943
in the year 20XX

>>381536023
I don't want to see just Fox doing it. I want SSS tier combos.

>>381524776

>cuck faggot complaining about sexism

he even sounds like a nu-male

>>381524776

>hates fox
>hates mango
>complains about gender diversity
>cares about racial makeup of the community

what a tremendous faggot

>>381537017
All you needed to figure that out was that he likes hbox. He's one of those fucking retards that thinks he's cool for playing a low tier and doesn't care how much of a faggot he actually is irl and in game

is there any hope for a smash game like melee again?

>>381539625
Nope.

Smash and GG are the only games worth watching, none are worth getting good at.

>>381540001
Why not? You could say almost anything in the world is not worth your time so give good reasons for your case.

>>381524884
I don't want Smash to be considered a fighting game because the spergs Smash brings in to ANY venue is fucking abhorrent.

You Smash fags are actually some of the worst people on Earth.

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if smash is a fighting game then dota is an rts