Stop romancing characters.

but he's right, most romance in vidya is shit, virgins with fragile egos have low standards for that stuff, see persona

>>381416024
I stopped doing that after I played Planet Escape: Tournament and realized that light-hearted flirting: cringe-worthy romance shit aimed at pathetic basement dwelling autistic permavirgin cucks.

>>381416024
But Pillars 2 will have romances, Josh. What happened?

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>>381416495
>Planet Escape

>>381416808
planet escape tournament

I just want to romance Josh.

>>381416808
It's an old and obscure Russian meme.

>>381416024
This guy has never made a good game why the fuck should his word be taken as anything but shit?

>>381416923
Don't you have some journalists to kill, Putin?

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>>381416267
FFIV
FFVI
FFVII
FFVIII
FFIX
FFX
Chrono Trigger
Metal Gear Solid
Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence
Valkyria Chronicles
Cahterine
Uncharted 2
The Witcher 2
The Witcher 3
Persona 4
Persona 5
Baldur's Gate 2
Silent Hill 2
Ico
Star Control 2
Shadow of the Colossus
inFamous
Nier Automata

>>381417184
>a bunch of weebshit
wow do you really expect anybody to take you seriously

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I love Reisen!

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>>381417184
>persona 4
cant catch me fucker

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>>381417184
>weebshit
>muh chloe or muh elena
>implying the witcher is not virgin pandering
>inFuckingFamous aka superbitch girlfriend in a super cliche situation of needs of the few versus needs of the many

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>>381417287
I'll take Japanese romance over Western romance.

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>>381416765
It doesn't matter to me anyways, none of the girls is cute enough for me to soil my paladin's honor.

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>almost every successful film, tv show, or novel has a romance sub-plot

>/v/tards: "ROMANCES ARE FOR DUMB DIRTY VIRGINS!!!!"

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TODD!
GIVE BACK MY WIFE'S SON!

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>>381416024
*romances a character AFTER exploiting her naivete and getting her drunk* ;)

>>381416765
>I don't hate love in game stories; I just hate reducing love to shallow, masturbatory fantasy indulgence. Maybe that's all love is to some people, but I think that's a pretty narrow view. Ego-stroking is very popular in CRPGs, which is one reason I don't feel comfortable doing CRPG writing anymore.

>I appreciate that people wanted more romance options in NWN2, but sometimes I think that people want there to be romance "victory" conditions for all companions. I think that can diminish some characters. For instance, if Shandra and Qara had their own romance plots, I think some people would still want Neeshka to be "romance-able", regardless of how Neeshka's author felt about the character's place in the story.

>That bugs me. I don't like the idea that you can "win" everything or get everyone on your side. I'm also not fond of the idea that romance always has to resolve with a "fade out" to implied coitus, but that's another issue.

>I'll re-state what I wrote before: I want romance to receive either less or more attention in games. Anything worth doing is worth doing well, especially when it's something with so much emotional potential. But I certainly don't want to go the route of harem anime, which is total fantasy indulgence and gross pandering.

>>381416024
He's not against romance, the opposite actually. If he makes romanceable characters, he just wants to make sure they're done in a meaningful way, that develop those people like real ones, with their own free will and not like a checklist for the player to do until they can fuck them and that only exist to further boost the same shallow power fantasy, like for example in Bioware games.

>>381417184
Most of those games have scripted romance. It's not like it's bad, but I do't think it's what Sawyer was specifically talking about. He refers to player-driven romance.

>>381417706
Todd pls leave I already bought fallout 4 with a season pass

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>>381417656
>none of the girls is cute enough for me to soil my paladin's honor.
Regrettable taste, desu

>>381416863
>Planet escape : Tournament
I heard they have a new one coming with Malcom "X" middle and liandri corp being the protag.

>>381418034
Iselmyr is gone in my paladin's save. And he's fucking dead in my elf ranger's save

>>381418210
;_;
You know what you have to do now, right anon?
That's okay, Aloth is meant to get some bonuses if he sublimated Iselmyr. And one of the new companions looks pretty cute, the priest/druid girl.
I could never bring myself to send Aloth away.

>>381417184
>no Xenogears
>no Odin Sphere
>no Darkness
>no Trails in the Sky
At least you've mentioned Automata which is on fairly high tiers as far as love stories go.

>>381416024
It's the only sexual attention I'm getting so no, get lost.

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>>381416024
Sawyer is right, PC romance sucks dick. It only fools virgins who think that "input gift to NPC, output sex from NPC" is romance.

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>>381416024
I already romanced the only girl I care for

>>381417692
The Thing
They Live
Alien
District 9

>>381416024
Stop making shitty games.

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>>381417820
>I think some people would still want Neeshka to be "romance-able", regardless of how Neeshka's author felt about the character's place in the story.


Because Neeshka's lines had tons more chemistry with the MC in the dialogue than any other female character, you dumb fuck. Maybe the authors should have recognised how shit the romance with the dumb forgettable elf character was.

Still fucking mad about NWN2.

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>>381420309
I agree, but chill out, anon - it's just an example he's using to explain why he doesn't like harem-romances. Neeshka's was cut for time more than anything else, I believe.

At least we got Safiya in MotB to make up for it.

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>>381417820
Is he legitimately trying to balance romance in games?

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He's absolutely right about shitty "romances" in rpgs - they are poorly written and feel more masturbatory than anything. Only actual love stories with a single canon option have a chance to be good, and even then devs need to be sure to actually fucking write it well to avoid garbage like Rinoa who singlehandedly destroyed FF8.

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>>381420851
>o avoid garbage like Rinoa who singlehandedly destroyed FF8
stay mad

>>381416024
ropekid is right for the wrong reasons. he seems to think fictional video game npcs should have some kind of agency over who they have to fuck, when he should be opposed to video game romances because they are cringeworthy trash 100% of the time

>>381416923
it's an older may-may, but it checks out

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>>381420770
Exactly.

>>381421496
Seifer's sloppy seconds

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>>381416024
stop not doing drugs

>>381416024
I mostly agree with him, but i found it weird that cass was a huge slut but never slept with the courier

>>381421724
She tried in one of the endings, but got the wrong tent.

>>381421724
>cass was a huge slut
[citation needed]

>>381421532
i thought he also said that, something along the lines of 'either put more focus into romance so it isn't garbage or dont do it at all'

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>>381417692
>successful
>good

>>381421808
she's a female

>>381421913
So is your mom.

>>381421951
so's urs lol gotem

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>>381421496
She was absolutely atrocious. Which is hilarious given that there also were Laguna/Raine, probably one of the best love stories in the entirety of FF.

>>381421724
Yeah it sure was better when she cucked the courier for a random NCR soldier
fuck you avellone

>>381421991
It's been fuckin forever since I've played FF8. Remind me why she's the worst again.

>>381421951
how do you know his mom isn't a male?

>>381421808
LONG

>>381422030
>cucked the courier

You sure you weren't just roleplaying as a cuck?

>>381417820
He's got a point.

See modern Bioware "games", people care more about who they can fun instead of the game itself, you have threads with 900+ pages on BSN and what not just about a single character.

And the romances are never good, you just watch 3 scenes of your love interest then sex, then it's never mentioned again until the ending where the game goes "oh yeah, you romanced that chick/guy, right? here's the ending slide for completing that romance"

>>381422091
DICK

>>381422113
that is literally what happens in the endings if you choose NCR
yet again only cucks choose NCR

>>381422030
>cucked the courier

The only one cucked here was you for having feelings for a known slut who couldn't stop talking about cocks or booze for 10 seconds m8

>>381422167
JOHNSON

>>381422125
who they can fuck*

I need to sleep.

>>381416024
No. They're quite popular with those whose love lives are unfulfilling/non-existant in real life.

>>381422208
after getting rid of the Van Graffs and Alice McLafferty it would be grateful to get some fucking sort of compensation m8

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>>381422040
>Seifer's sloppy seconds, only tries to get Squall's dick to piss Seifer off
>daddy issues
>clingy, dumb, spoiled and annoying as shit
>not even good-looking
>almost ruins Edea's assassination
>feels forced as fuck because for first two discs Squall shows virtually zero affection towards her but suddenly flips hard on third disc, which doesn't feel natural or well-written at all
>second half of the game tries its hardest to show their love for each other which plainly doesn't work because they have zero chemistry between each other

>>381421808
ok
"cass was a huge slut" -anon
happy?

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>>381417610
I agree.

>>381422472
>feels forced as fuck because for first two discs Squall shows virtually zero affection towards her but suddenly flips hard on third disc, which doesn't feel natural or well-written at all

It makes sense once you realize that he falls in love around the same time she gets here sorceress powers and that she basically magick'd him into loving her.

>>381423602
If that's the case, the game is just one big fucking missed opportunity to capitalize on this fact and maybe make Rinoa an ultimate antagonist.

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>>381422472
>>Seifer's sloppy seconds, only tries to get Squall's dick to piss Seifer off
She spent a summer with Seifer. Meanwhile, she falls in love with Squall after what they go through together.

>daddy issues
Makes her cute. She clings to you and wants comfort.

>>clingy, dumb, spoiled and annoying as shit
None of those are bad things in a girl.

>>not even good-looking
whatever

>>almost ruins Edea's assassination
She had a good plan.

>>feels forced as fuck because for first two discs Squall shows virtually zero affection towards her but suddenly flips hard on third disc, which doesn't feel natural or well-written at all
He's tsundere.

>>second half of the game tries its hardest to show their love for each other which plainly doesn't work because they have zero chemistry between each other
Some of the best parts of the game are Squall and Rinoa alone.

>>381417820
He's right.

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>>381423719
>None of those are bad things in a girl.
I won't even bother with the rest of your post.
Refer to Raine to see an actually good FF8 female character in comparison with this spoiled abomination.

>>381417820
Based Sawyer blowing ShallowRomancefags the fuck out

>>381417820
what a fag

>>381417820
Absolutely based

>>381423665
>and maybe make Rinoa an ultimate antagonist.

Well there are hints in the game that Ultimecia and Rinoa are the same person.

>>381416024
LETTING THE DAYS GO BY

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>>381421870

>unsuccessful
>good

>>381423719
>she falls in love with Squall
she's the same clingy bitch she was in the beginning
she never changes, her personality never progresses
>Makes her cute.
>None of those are bad things in a girl.
i'm sorry anon but you objectively have a horrible taste and i hope you will find a person like this and allow her to ruin your entire life
>She had a good plan.
WHAT
do you have brain damage?
>He's tsundere.
you can also see his thoughts at various points of the game
none of them concern Rinoa
>Some of the best parts of the game are Squall and Rinoa alone.
if you like forced sappy shit, that is

>>381417692
>almost every top 40 song is about romance
wtf I love the radio now

>>381420770
kek

>>381417820
Is this from Sawyer? I remember MCA pretty much saying the same thing a long time ago.

>>381424923
Nevermind.>>381419916

>>381417820
>gross pandering

I'll take "worthless SJW buzzwords" for $500.

>>381425086
I'll take "shitposts" for about tree fiddy.

>>381417820

>want there to be romance "victory" conditions for all companions. I think that can diminish some characters.

Or maybe they just like the characters, and romance is a fact of life. You are supposed to be roleplaying right? Why is it wrong to romance the girl in your party who your character gets along with really well?

>I don't like the idea that you can "win" everything or get everyone on your side

Fair enough, but you should surely be able to convince some people? Or else what the fuck are you doing playing an RPG you should be playing Doom or something where there's no demon negotiation

>But I certainly don't want to go the route of harem anime

Nobody asked you to do that faggot


Basically, in summary, Jew Swinger is a faggy retard who needs to talk to an actual woman at some point in his life before he dies

>>381425605
He has a gf. I'd post photos but her twitter account is protected. :(

Is that one autist who kept shitposting this still going?
https://boards.fireden.net/v/search/image/sfpXTYE7MQEEApLNbEY_hA/

>>381416024
He will make em romanceable in POE2, though, right ?

>>381425605
>Or maybe they just like the characters, and romance is a fact of life. You are supposed to be roleplaying right? Why is it wrong to romance the girl in your party who your character gets along with really well?

I think the issue is that a lot of those characters are made for the sake of the player being able to romance them. I think it would be more interesting if sometimes you tried to romance a character and maybe she rejects you because of many possible reasons. Maybe she's already with someone else or not interested in you or just dislikes you because of you alignment/morality/whatever. Or that it's the character itself that approaches you first. Something that gives her more autonomy and agency when it comes to personal relationships, more than just "talk to me until I let you fuck me"

>Fair enough, but you should surely be able to convince some people? Or else what the fuck are you doing playing an RPG you should be playing Doom or something where there's no demon negotiation
This already happens in New Vegas, which he directed.

>Nobody asked you to do that faggot
No, but it's definitely how most of the time these games end up being.

he probably says that cause he's 40 and got no wife or kids and lives with a bunch of cats

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>>381419741
Thanks for the recommendations, sucker.

>>381426234
>I think it would be more interesting if sometimes you tried to romance a character and maybe she rejects you because of many possible reasons
On this point refer to ME2's best romance option, Samara.
Precisely because you couldn't romance her, you could try but she ended up just going "nah"

>Pillars of Eternity 2: Cuckfire

Fo4 has way deeper romances than new vegas

>>381417610
But fucking Alistair is literally the only reason to be playing Dragon Age.

>>381417820
He's not wrong.

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guys

What's the best romance out of all the vidya you have played and why is it the Morrigan romance from DA:O?

>>381417820
He's literally 100% right. I hate his balance shittery, but on writing issues he's usually very right.

>>381429832
If we're strictly talking about shitty rpg "romances" then Visas Marr.

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>>381429832
Ico has pure love

>>381420005
The Thing ?

>>381429252
new vegas didn't really have romances though, right?

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>>381430128
>younger but extremely protective boy
>slightly older girl
Why is it always the best pair?

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>>381417820
Obsidian has kept teasing the player with waifus in their games for long time.

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>>381430323
Please don`t reply to Todd.

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To be fair he hates romances because usually they have to be accessible to most type of characters, especially nowadays thanks to Bioware.
If they are not people will bitch about it and he hates having romances like this

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which one would you romance /v/?

>>381431062
based lord of balance

>>381431148
>pipers voice actor for Fallout 4 saying the love lines are so doting and weird they don't at all resemble a human relationship
He's right you know

>>381423719
cuck: the post

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>>381417184
I have come to the realization that one thing i will never ever be able to even come close to comprehend is how weeabs are capable of enjoying anime or their weeab vidyas.

This fag is citing MG"can love bloom on the battlefield"S and fucking Final Fantasy as some sort of exemplar of video game romance. Like wtf?
At some point in your consumption of these garbage excuses of medium of story telling you must be self-aware of how cringe worthy and just shit-tier it all is

>>381417820
Based Balance Man.

>>381431148
I love me some DFC, so probably Noel, but bullet does weird things to my bepis (probably due to tomboy + delicious brown amazon)

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>>381430341

>>381416024
I can't, I'm a lonely sexually frustrated bloat

>>381431859
>likes DFC, chooses noel
>unironically liking worst cowtit girl
wtf

>>381429832
Ocelot and Big Boss

>>381429832
Jack from ME2 > Morrigan

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>>381432024
>cries and nearly devolves to autistic shrieking in most side materials

>>381426234
>I think it would be more interesting if sometimes you tried to romance a character and maybe she rejects you because of many possible reasons.
How many vidya end with the MC losing? What's the point in that? Even if the game has some bad endings it needs good ones, because that's the entire point of a game.

Sawyer isn't against romance in video games, he's against fap bait. And it's mistaken for hating romance because if the girl doesn't have her legs spread in the first few dialogue screens, it's SJW shit.

It's sad to see weebs here becoming the new normies.

>>381433106
>he's against fap bait
What is fap bait? Attractive cgatacters?

>>381417184
nigga you're retarded

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>>381433885
>left => not fap bait
>right => fap bait

>>381433885
Depends. Do you consider flesh dolls attractive characters?

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I kind of like the way they handled Bastilla's "romance" option with male Revan. Witty, interesting in the sense that they're breaking pretty sacred rules. Revan has quite a dominant streak in him, actually, since the romantic options hinge on him almost pushing Bastila to the edge, and over, her comfort zone. I don't know what the fade-to-black kiss at the midpoint implies, but honestly not knowing is half the fun. It's a lot less clunky and shoehorned than what Bioware does these days, it's almost like they've forgotten how two people who're interested in each other talk to one-another in real life. I mean, shit, the chemistry seems pretty legit and they're (possibly) part of some strange cult-like order that's more ridgid in philosophy than Islam.

Carth was a bit of a boring character, but ironically and contrary to the thread his best dialogue happens if you "romance" him as female Revan. He has his moments, but I don't consider it that memorable. Contrary to male Revan, to succeed with Carth you need to be as nice and subservient as possible and I rarely could resist the urge to call him out on the retarded shit he occasionally says, especially since I like to play female Revan as dark as possible.

What the hell went wrong with Bioware?

>>381425086
>post is from 2006, long before SJWs
kys

>>381429832
Visas Marr from KotOR 2

>>381434375
I really hated Bastila in KotOR. Never pursued her romance but the game still kind of acted like I did when you meet her and she's all dork-sided.

>>381434180
>flesh dolls
Sounds like some fucked up Hellraiser/Tzimisce kind of shit.

>>381429832
>generic tsundere romance
>good
wew

What are the playtrough you have done in preparation for 2 ?

I got a priest of eothas, a dwarf ranger (crossbow), a 2 handed bleak walker and a ''melee'' mage (summon weapons/buff yourself than fuck things up close)

>>381417820
Is there anything this man cant do

>>381434874
Stop being based.

>>381417184
>Nier: Automata
Hahaha at least put the first Nier in there. The romance between Nier and Kainé was actually subtle unlike 9S and 2B shoved down your throat.

>>381432803
>How many vidya end with the MC losing?
Quite a few actually.

I don't know why you relate romance with winning or losing or good and bad endings. This win-state thing with romances is precisely what Sawyer is complaining about. You don't "win" a romance in real life, you earn it, it's not even limited to romance, friendships work similarly. You get to know the other person, you gain their trust, both express their affection and basically get to deal with each others strengths and flaws despite everything, as long as there's sincere interest.
Reducing human interaction to "sex=win" and "no romance=lose" is completely stupid, boring and simplistic unless you're 14 years old and think this is what getting a girlfriend is all about.

>because that's the entire point of a game

Also I disagree completely, the point of a good story regardless of the medium is to tell a meaningful message. The ending, no matter if it's good or bad is still secondary. Books have done it for centuries, if not millenia.

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>>381416024
>asking virgin losers to stop being virgin losers

>>381434874
contain his autism. But, in a good way

>animators have trouble animating the burning man pistol
>bring your own 1911's so you can show them how it looks

>>381435094
it wasn't just the 1911
Sawyer actually bought a bunch of guns and learned shooting just for designing New Vegas. According to Anthony Davis (another developer there), Sawyer isn't even a "gun" guy.

>>381435397
amazing

>heys guys I bought a bunch of guns so we can see how that works.

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>>381435652

>>381434738
It's not tsundere, though.

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>>381434874
Design a fun battle system.

>>381434872
i played a deadfire aumaua specifically because of 2, there better be unique dialog options for me in deadfire

>>381434872
>playing a shit game that much
Hope you dies before 2 comes out desu

>>381435007
So why is it OK for games to have simplified other things but romance?

>>381417184
Wrong with literally all of those
The only vidya with a well written romance plot is Monster Girl Quest

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>>381434375
I think cassandra in cisquisition was handled pretty well.
tfw you will never make a workaholic fall inlove against her will

>>381435007
Wouldn't want inaccurate depiction of romances in my games about mage killing dragons and shit

>>381437263
Who said it is? Making romance options take a huge amount of dev time, so if you're going to do it, might as well try to make it so that the relationships are meaningful and give more development and importance to the character, instead of turning it into a checklist of shit to do until I can get virtual laid.

>>381438369
Coherence =/= realism. Really not that hard to understand Pete.

>>381438992
>Coherence
How is it Incoherent?

>>381439094
You're trying to depict those characters as real people, even if they're in a fantasy setting. Sawyer already explained much better. By simplifying human interaction (and romance specifically) to "sex as a win-state" you're shooting yourself in the foot and devaluating the characterization and agency you've tried to give to that NPC.
As an example, Miranda from ME2. A decently well written character that is trivialized when her sub-plot ends after you have sex with her, when that should just be the beginning of her romance.

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>>381416923
[b]POBEG S PLANETKI: SOREVNOVANIE[/b]

>>381439648
>You're trying to depict those characters as real people
So walking loredump that don't care if you murder kids are okay Josh?

>>381440118
Welp, you got me there. I'm asuming you're taking about Pillars, but I haven't played it. Scripted RPG dialogues are inherently limited, so I think situations like that are almost inevitable at some level considering the huge amount of different ways that you can play your character as if the role-playing is good enough. Specially if we're applying the typical budget and schedule games like these have.
Then again, this can also apply to romancing, but like I said, considering how much work it takes, if you're going to do it, at least make sure you get it right.