What makes you "you"?

>>381199834

my refined taste in pornography

>>381199894

fpbp

>>381199834
the things you do

>>381199834
A collection of memories and experiences that though similar to what others might have had, only i know the way i experienced it and nobody else can have my experience of past events, everything that makes ME can be copied onto a machine, but that machine is not me, it's only a good copy.

>>381199834
A reply.

>>381200980
>I'm a collection of my memories and experiences
>My memories and experiences could be copied perfectly
>But nu-uh! That wouldn't be me!

I mean, sure, your experiences from the moment you were copied would differ from the copy, but what if both of you were held in a coma afterwards? What if one of you was killed in that case? Which one would have been the 'real' one then?

Myself.

>>381199834
machines have no souls and a robot that begs and feels pain is no more real than the guys you shoot in gta

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Will.

This was easily the most horrific horror game I've ever played. Shame the actual game parts suckered dick.

Me is a sum of all my memories and experiences, if you copied my consciousness and woke another copy of me up it would start as me but become less and less me the more it experienced. Imo

>>381199834
>What makes you "you"

here on /v/? shitposting

>>381199834
You are a complete no hoper,i know you live a sad life and feel the need to make yourself feel better by doing some really poor amatuer trolling on a video game, but how about you just grow up, its not going to always be bad kid, you'll grow up and realise you shouldn't of acted like a peasant. you only recieve what you put out in the world. lose the toxicity, be happy.

>>381199834
My experience saved in my brain

>>381199834
She looks like femorgan from prey

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>>381201541

god blass Australia

>>381201293
>My memories and experiences could be copied perfectly
A copy is a copy regardless.

What makes OP a faggot?

consciousness. If you're capable of understanding the thought "I am me, because this thought is occurring to me independently." then you're you.

You can be in any body. Physically you might be different, but you're still you. Consciousness is in it's very essence, you.

Do you say a vegetable is the same person they once were? Not usually, no. Same thing with lobotomized mental patients. They're not really themselves. Or alzheimers patients. Not really themselves.

Consciousness and lucidity holds the key to the human soul, as I see it. Soma is a shit game go play heavy rain or something, faggot.

>>381201958
>Or alzheimers patients. Not really themselves.
That what fucking scares me. The thought of me slowly fading away to the point where I'm no longer myself.

>>381199834
>hurr iam too retarded to realize only my brainscan gets transfered
>hurr better use simon who is a complete liability instead of putting my own conciousness into one of these crypto borg things
>hurr but am i merely a machine? uttered the badly compiled python script

jesus christ there is way to approach this so called "mind in the machine" dillema but this game was aids and everyone involved should feel guilt

>>381201293
>Which one would have been the 'real' one then?
the first one you fucking waterhead

If there was a teleportation machine that works by destroying your body and creating an identical copy (down to the level of subatomic particles) at the other end, would you be willing to use it?

>>381199834
I do.

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>>381199834

>"What is a man?"

>>381201813
Which one is the copy, anon? Maybe you're just an emulation run periodically to check for data integrity.

>>381200309

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TnnvoeBPygQ

There you go, senpai.

The based truth.

>>381199834
Continuity.
http://waitbutwhy.com/2014/12/what-makes-you-you.html

>>381199834
the entity/consciousness that observes events, thoughts and actions. memories are irrelevant. they can be copied. but as i am not you and you are not me, such copy is also not me despite having the same memories, but another entity.

i am who i am, and there are no others beside me.

i don't see myself in the reflection of other people's eyes
i see myself in the mirror

>>381203129
It's no more profound or disturbing that going to sleep and waking up later, and I do that at least once every day.

>>381203129
the same thing occurs to us naturally, only over a longer period of time, except for your bones and teeth there is not a single bit left of the person you were 10 years ago, you have been replaced by a copy, cell by cell.

>>381203129
You don't have a single cell in your body that you used to have say, 10 years ago? Are you still the same you?

>>381203129
No because the identical copy wouldn't have my conscious, it would have a copy of a conscious but there is no guarantee that "I" would be the me in the body, for all intents and purposes I have died.

>>381203617
Actually your brain cells aren't replaced.

>>381203129
If there was a teleportation machine that worked by showing you stupid posts on /v/ but required you to not reply to them would you be willing to use it?

>>381199834
>itt: dumb little manchildren take their philosophy from fucking video games

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>>381201745

Sorry but you're late to the party.

Bob's your uncle, mate.

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>>381199834
You are your memories.

You could say that if you copied your memories to a machine it "wouldn't be you because the hardware is completely different and it would just be a copy of you"

But then you can counter it with the fact that every time you go to sleep your brain kills off millions of neurons and rewrites neuron-paths. And the only reason you think you are the same person when you wake up is due to your retained memories. Nevermind the fact that all your neurons replace their atoms one at a time within a 20 year timeframe (If you are 20+ year old your infant brain has 100% been replaced by new atoms in the neurons)

Hell. If I take a single neuron out of your brain are you still you?

What if I realtime replace 1 neuron in your brain with a simulation in a computer.

Now what if I slowly in realtime replace your neurons 1 for 1. While you are conscious the entire time. When you get punched on the head instantly 100.000+ neurons die so you wouldn't notice individual neurons being changed out for simulated ones.

After a while you would be 50% simulated and 50% biological brain while still being conscious. You wouldn't consider yourself half-dead because you are still capable of thought. In the end you are 100% simulated and nothing of your original brain remains. Yet you slowly "lifted" your consciousness from biological brain to simulated brain simply because you stayed conscious the whole way true.

If you say that you aren't that machine then that means you think "you" die every time you go to sleep since your brain changes anyway.

You are only your memories+ your current consciousness nothing more.

>>381199834
Separation of 'me' from the outside world. imagine that in your body live many other people but you never hear their voices or thoughts

>>381203558
You wouldn't wake up though, there is no means to travel to the new body. When sleeping you're within the same shell or body.

>>381203753
to an intelligent person anything can be used as a source of philosophizing and stimulating thought and creating new ideas/philosophies, even a random meaningless event or a toy.

to an idiot who can only think literally it's just what it looks like, and philosophy is reading books by dead people and reciting them.

>>381203930

TL; DR

My conscious, subconscious, Ego, Super Ego and Id all agreed that I'm nowhere new a good person but I'm quite a bad person.

Unless you cross me, then I will straight up murder you.

Then go to work on you.

>>381203686
Does that matter? How do you know that "you" are the same you that went to sleep last night, and not just an identical copy?

What if this universe was programmed by a shitty alien coder from the 9th dimension who couldn't figure out how to implement continuous physics and instead made it so that each "tick" of the universe is just a nearly-identical copy of the previous one? You're not the same you as 5.39 × 10−44 seconds ago.

>>381199834
>another episode of /v/ edgy 15 year olds try being philosophical.

>>381203129
Creating identical copy is magic so, sure. Im sure my magic soul will be fine.

>>381203129
If you can create an identical copy of someone far from the original you have no need to destroy the person. That's cloning, not teleporting.

>>381204268
Then contribute some "genuine philosophy" instead of shitposting if you think the thread is subpar.

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>>381204386

So piracy then?

Checkmate atheists.

>>381203729
But the atoms INSIDE the neurons ARE replaced within 20 years. So it's still "a subatomic copy" of your brain. Just slowly done over 20 years instead of instantly.

>>381204386
>If you can create an identical copy of someone far from the original you have no need to destroy the person.

It's done for practical reasons: not destroying the original body is illegal because allowing multiple instances of a person to exist at the same time would lead to a fuckton of problems.

My consciousness. If someone else has all my memories and personality and does the same exact things I would they aren't me because I'm not experiencing it, am I?

>>381204532
>allowing multiple instances of a person to exist at the same time

Fuck, I should probably tell my twin brother.

>>381199894
and what would that be ?

>>381204568
This means you die every night when you go to sleep and a new person gets born every morning though.

Your consciousness gets cut off AND neurons get killed of and new neuron paths get made when sleeping (Kinda the reason for sleep in the first place)

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>a human mind consists of the id, you and super you
>simplified it's you with the angel and demon on your shoulders
>the you is how you act normally
>you see a cake
>the id is the primate brain and wants to take the entire thing for yourself
>the super you is what society has made you and makes you think of your diet

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>>381199834
FUCK YOU CATHERINE I'VE TRUSTED YOU AND YOU LIED TO ME. THEY'RE NOT US! THEY'RE NOT US!

>>381203753
How bitter are you?

(You)

>>381204692
I'm conscious throughout my dreams and I'm conscious when I wake up, as far as I'm concerned it's the same me. What you proposed is a theory that you're trying to play off as fact; we do not have even a remote understanding of how the human brain truly works but you titillate your own bias with the fedora-equivalent of old wives tales and hypothesis.

>>381204731
It's still just neurons firing in certain patterns.

Change the neurons and you aren't "you" anymore. This happens all the time so there isn't a constant you anyway.

It's an illusion due to the concept of memories. You are tricking yourself into thinking you are the same person all the time.

Like Alex Mercer in "Prototype".

The virus consumed Alex Mercer and because it takes over memories and has 0 memories before consuming Alex Mercer it thought it was actually Alex Mercer. That was the plottwist of the game. But it raises a good point. You are only your memories.

Is this game another runofthemill walking sim, or is it actually good?

>>381199834
Consciousness.

I'm me because I say I'm me, and anyone who says otherwise can fuck off.

>>381204951
It's psychology 101 crap, only one of the monsters is a little scary. It's easier than Outlast.

Consistent bad, but not apocalyptic decision making coupled with a lack of desire to do anything other than jerk off and play video games.

>>381205004
Fuck you, aliens abducted me last night and replaced me with you. You're just an identical copy that shares my memories and thinks it's me, and I'm getting rid of you as soon as the grays are done probing my anus.

>>381203950
When I fall asleep I cease to exist. When my brain wakes, it boots up a new me from stored memories. Continuity of consciousness is an illusion we have because we can't experience the lack of it.

>>381205207
No you won't because you're weak and I've become strong in your absence
I can lift 15 pounds now
When you come back you're the bottom

>>381204951
fun game tries to change your opinion or some things and /v/ likes to hate on it because they think it's psychology 101. Missing the entire point of it trying to change your personal position on a couple of points by providing certain examples and scenarios through the story and game.

What they did well was let you fill out a survey to guage what your opinions are on a couple of points. And then at the end of the game they give you the exact same survey to fill out but now due to the experience of the event of the games you probably think differently on some points. Which was the real point of the game. Not psychology but introspection.

Similar to "The Talos Principle". Everyone that liked SOMA should play The Talos Principle. And everyone that played The Talos Principle should play SOMA.

They are extremely similar but approach it from a completely different angle.

>>381205304
>Continuity of consciousness is an illusion we have because we can't experience the lack of it.
Prove it or never peddle this drivel again until you can.

>>381205304
100% this.

>>381204935
>I'm conscious throughout my dreams and I'm conscious when I wake up
You should see a neurologist, they'll want to study that.

>>381204532
Well then you can have a better perspective of the moral problem. The person you create is the same regardless of whether you destroy the original or not.

So if you create this person and not destroy the original, are they the same person?

>>381201508
It had great suspense and an interesting story. What did you not like about the gameplay? I mean, the puzzles weren't anything groundbreaking, but I thought the exploration and walking simulator aspects were pretty good just like in Amnesia: The Dark Descent. The lack of typical horror game jump scares and panic events were, if anything, a plus.

>>381205364
>Similar to "The Talos Pr
I fucking knew it, fuck off.

>>381205478
what?

>>381205424
How do you experience a dream with no consciousness? You are aware and perceive them and you have awareness by the mind of itself and the world. Maybe not you specifically since you're a drooling fucking retard chimp trying to sound smart though, kill yourself and stop wasting oxygen you walking colon.

>>381201508
>>381205448

Genuinely didn't realize it was a horror game. Thought it was more of a psychological thriller or sad drama or something.

Found out months later that it was made by the same guys as Amnesia. I HATE horror games though so I'm glad I played it without knowing it since I'm a big wuss.

>>381203432
>Which one is the copy
The second one.

>>381199834
http://lesswrong.com/lw/pm/identity_isnt_in_specific_atoms/

>>381204731

Hey PSY101 major, see this:

>>381204156

>>381205304
Yeah your brain. That's you. If you made a replica you would never be that replica unless your brain goes too. Soma got it right, there's no magic way to put your consciousness into a being that's identical to you. Especially if it's not physically close to you.

>>381205725
>lesswrong

Instant respect and believe in the article

>>381205649
so no jump scares?

I enjoy games like Silent Hill, but I cant fucking stand jump scare games.

>>381205549
>mom I'm so fucking SCARED
Grow up. Your brain is a shoddy computer that needs to unplug half of itself every night to replenish neurotransmitters and looses or misplaces a fuckton of data in the process. You should be happy that you can't tell the difference when you wake up.

>>381205649
The first Amnesia is pretty similar to SOMA. It's got a bit more horror gameplay, but the actual meat of the game is the exploration of the castle and discovering the story piece by piece.

Story-wise it's not quite as interesting as SOMA though.

>>381205549
Please read a fucking book, nigga.

Your brain making big changes in neural nets during sleep is a well documented fact. As well as a break in consciousness during deep sleep.

>>381204935
FYI if you lucid dream consistently without specifically using tells and/or triggers, you may have neurological problems. See a specialist.

>>381203432
>Maybe you're just an emulation run periodically to check for data integrity
Maybe I am. This is not relevant however. I am still "me" while the original is "himself".

>>381204935
Other people are making fun of you. But seriously. If you are serious about not losing consciousness you should consult a doctor. It could be telltale signs of Brain tumors/severe neurological damage or worse.

>>381206093
sounds like you're just jelly he can use his brain better than you do, and insist on him destroying his ability to conform to the dumb masses.

>>381205685
How do you tell which instance is the second one? If you need to look for external clues to determine that then it doesn't matter.

>>381205791
I'm the information held within that brain. Whether the medium that information is stored on affects it or no it doesn't matter. A digital copy of me would still be me as much as the original instance is.

>>381205685
How can you be sure you're not being copied every time you go to sleep? Your cells don't live forever, you're not the same guy you were 8 years ago, not in a metaphorical, i.e. "I'm more experienced" kind of way, but literal sense, down to celular level. How can you be sure that your memories aren't copied onto a new personality every time you go to sleep? How would it know that its different from yesterday's you?

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>Gets brain copied to the future
WTF WHY IS THIS HAPPENING NOT FAIR BAWW

>Willingly copies mind over to a new body
WTF WHY IS THE OTHER ONE STILL BREATHING I'M THE NEW ME THIS ISN'T FAIR

>Willingly copies over a third time, knowing the full rules and results of the last tw-
WTF WHY AM I STILL HERE YOU LIED TO ME BAAAAAAAAW

Love the game, hate the writing.

my peanus weenus, of course

>>381205838
I would actually take what Yudkowsky says about quantum physics with a grain of salt because he obviously has a huge hard on for the many-worlds interpretation. However, in that particular article he makes a solid argument very relevant to the subject of this thread that does not depend on many-worlds.

>>381199834
My collection of (You)s of course.

>the world is a simulation.
>all humans are ais that interact in this environment. they reside within the simulation's hardware, outside of the simulation's reach.
>the body, brain etc are all part of the simulation.
>the purpose of this is to cultivate an ai that achieves true self awareness, awareness of self that is.
>those who succeed are pulled out and placed into a real body.
>those who fail are discarded, and their data is used to create a new, improved version of that ai.
>reason, true humanity died out long ago, and only androids remain. but they can't achieve sapience/self awareness for a long period of time, so this sped up simulation runs to decrease that time from millennia to possibly days outside.

>>381199834
That is up to you to decide.

>>381206857
Yeah I don't even believe in copenhagen. Let alone the outlandish many-worlds. Pilot-wave for me. None of them quantum-magics for me.

>>381204951
Existential, introspective horror thriller. I personally enjoyed the elevator ride into the abyss.

>>381199834
Comprehension to understand how cloning works

>>381204156
okay, back to /x/ with you. shoo, shoo, mental health goblin.

>>381206348
>dude WEEED
so this.... is the power..... of highschool philosophy.....

protip: if you're going for the "omg u die errtime you sleep :O" thought experiment, you also have to consider that you have died thousands of times during your lifetime and never noticed it, so your "what if" is literally "wouldn't notice lol"

>>381206536
Cut him some slack, he was delusional as fuck but those delusions were the only thing stopping him from going completly insane.

>>381207063
why are you describing The Talos Principle, anon?

>>381207063
Isnt that the Talos Principle?

>>381199834
The sense of continuity imparted by the persistant structural integrity of my brain.

>>381206335
But your consciousness is still in the original. Even if destroyed then you would just experience death. That other you is never experienced by your conscious. It's just a twin.

>>381203129
A real teleportation device would have a buffer storage where it stores your consciousness or your "soul"

>>381207063
The Talos Principle was a fun game. But SOMA puts it another way.

>>381207518
>>381207401
since i never played it, i wouldn't know.

>>381199834
>50/50 chance to get on the ARK at the end
>lol simon fails the coinflip
decent game, shit ending though

>>381203129
that's not a teleportation device that's a cloning device. destroying your body is completely superfluous. just let both of us live

>>381205864
>>381204692
That's an oversimplification. The "dynamic state" theory of consciousness is pretty much the soul reinvented for the 21st century, but you still have to attack it at its strongest to make a valid point. Saying sleep is death, so don't worry, is a strawman. Sleep does not stop enough brain activity to warrant that comparison. A better case to look at would be seizures or people whose electrical brain activity stops completely for a brief moment when they are deprived of oxygen but who are then revived. If they have minimal brain damage and behave like their old selves after they recover, are they the same people? The dynamic state theory would tell us "no", but that sounds like bullshit. This is how you attack it properly.

>>381207704
I mean regardless there was always going to be a Simon that didn't make it onto the Ark.

>>381207829
yeah but it's dumb that the player simon instead of the clone stayed behind ugh

>>381199894
Classy answer anon! Cheers!

>>381207704
there was no coinflip. that was a lie

>>381204136
This.

>>381207704
He didn't fail any coinflip, he just created a copy of himself which he uploaded into the ark. It was clear from the beginning that this would happen, the copy of Simon you play as was never going to be uploaded into the ark, he was just too autistic to realize that.

>>381208072
>there was no coinflip
didnt you play the game
every time you clone there is 50/50 chance to become the new body
thats why earlier in the game you enter the new body but there is clone in your old body

its literally explained to you

>>381208173
>the copy of Simon you play as was never going to be uploaded into the ark
and you know this.. from..?
you literally upload yourself into a diving suit earlier in the game just fine

>>381201813
What if the copy doesn't know it's a copy?

>>381207824
>A better case to look at would be seizures or people whose electrical brain activity stops completely for a brief moment when they are deprived of oxygen but who are then revived.

Fuck I'm actually one of the guys you replied to and this actually happened to me as a small child with 10 minutes of oxygen deprivation. It's actually what made me realize that my consciousness is just an illusion made due to my memories.

I don't have any lasting damage except for huge black spots on my brain in my language center and I'm unable to speak my native language (not english) anymore. So I am forced to speak English in my daily life even though I'm a native.

>>381205304
>When I fall asleep I cease to exist.
Wrong. Your brain is still highly active when you're asleep, it just stops recording memories.

>>381208235
that was a lie.
the player perspective switched to the new simon. you control the clone from that point on

>>381205304
>When I fall asleep I cease to exist.
yeah good thing your not dreaming or anything

>When my brain wakes, it boots up a new me from stored memories.
absolute fucking retard
the only time you're going to get a lapse in consciousness is when you achieve brain death

>>381208235
You copy yourself into a diving suit, the new diving suit thinks it's a continuation because it has all the previous memories. Just like the first diving suit thinks it's still the original Simon. Just like the ark Simon thinks he was successfully uploaded.

No, the dumb thing about SOMA is that they had a RAILGUN POINTED AT SPACE and at no point did anyone on the fucking planet think to use it to maybe shoot the death meteor approaching Earth.

>>381208235
>thats why earlier in the game you enter the new body but there is clone in your old body
No, it was just a narrative device. You play the rest of the game from the perspective of the clone, while the original Simon stays in the chair.

>its literally explained to you
Catherine literally lies to Simon because he's too brain damaged to understand or accept what's really happening.

Permutation City

>>381208405
>>381208502
>that was a lie
except you literally experience this lie as the truth in-game

>you control the clone from that point on
except the game treats your perspective exactly the same as the original simon, and there's no visible perspective shift until the end where the coin flip fails

>>381208502
its a very inconsistent narrative device then

which makes more sense, developers only add a visible perspective shift on the second time around, or that simon failed the coin flip the second time around?

the latter, unless the developers made a mistake

>>381208649
>what is a narrative device

>>381199834
a bunch of chemicals and electric n shit firing off in your brain.

>>381199834
the entire rest of the universe

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>>381199834
My repeated failures

Doesn't every cell get replaced in about seven years anyway, or something? I have so little in common with the me from seven years back that we're hardly the same person. Take this as proof for either side.

>>381208703
i know what a narrative device is, they're not usually inconsistent clusterfucks

if it was a narrative device, why didn't the ending go to the ark simon and then show what happened back on earth instead of the other way around

>>381208649
As I said here >>381208465 the new copy has all the previous memories of Simon (as the first and the ark copies), therefore it just assumes Simon transferred himself

>>381208649
>except the game treats your perspective exactly the same as the original simon, and there's no visible perspective shift until the end where the coin flip fails

Are you serious? There's several perspective shifts: in the beginning your perspective shifts from the original Simon to the robot clone in the future, then there's the chair scene, and in the end you get to see both the perspective of the clone that got into the ARK and the Simon that got left behind.

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>>381207704

>Simon had brain damage when initial scan was done with new technology/software.
>Original Simon dies.
>WAU starts putting 'Legacy Scans' into random robots.
>Simon 'wakes' up not knowing he's been dead for a long fucking time.
>Find out the original scan of his damaged brain is now in the dead body of a woman.
>Simon 2.0 is copied yet again into another nigger-rigged dead body.
>Simon 3.0 goes into the 2spooky4me deep, dark abyss.
>Simon 3.0 is copied yet again into the ARK.

Is it really a stretch to believe that old as fuck Legacy Scan of the original brain damaged Simon wasn't quite 'Firing on all cylinders' mentally?

Hence he bought into the 50/50 line that cunt kept feeding him instead of the true copy/paste method.

When I saw that Dr. Muchie was also a Legacy Scan, I was hoping I would run into him somewhere and see what kind of intersection they would have had.

I wonder why SOMA didn't have that; I think it would have been a great moment.

Anyways, 8.5/10 would actually pay for.

But I didn't.

>>381208334
>10 minutes of oxygen deprivation
That's a fucking long time. Congratulations on surviving, anon. If you don't mind me asking, did you plunge into cold water and stop breathing? People can survive without oxygen with little brain or heart damage for a lot longer if they are cold. Also, did it affect your memories from before the oxygen deprivation event in any way?

>>381207829
>>381208072
>>381208173
>>381208405
>>381208465
>>381208502
DONT FUCKING FALL FOR IT. THIS IS CLEARLY LOW EFFORT "PRETENDING TO BE RETARDED" BAIT

>>381208864
again, why does it show earth simon before ark simon, if that was indeed the case

>>381208949
>n the beginning your perspective shifts from the original Simon to the robot clone in the future
yes, instantly

>chair scene
again, instant perspective switch into your "clone"

>ending
oh wait, then they show you failing a coin flip and your argument falls apart

>>381209040
>true copy/paste method
but the game has you playing as the perspective of simon the whole time and you dont fail a coin flip until the ending

if that were the case then why didnt they show you failing it every time

>>381208848
Why the fuck would it show the old Simon's perspective at all then

I'm not my ego or some story.

>>381209225
because youre still the original simon that's the whole point

>>381201293
Come on, you're the one with your brain. Even if you have a 100% identical twin, they're not both you. Only one of them is you. Your clone isn't you. If you die your mind doesn't live on in the mind of your clone or scan or whatever the fuck. This isn't hard.

You're gone the moment your brain stops working, regardless of how many identical copies there are.

>>381199834
The quantum state of my current perception, a state which can never be copied, only transfered

>>381209298
What's so terrifying about just being just another program that can be copied and stored just like any other? The fact that we use brains instead of electronics and have individual streams of consciousness doesn't mean we're special.

>>381204156
He's nihilistic with a wicked sense of humor

>>381208334
Don't you have it backwards? Consciousness is prior to memories and where memories appear in.

>>381209040
I know Simon is a dumb fuck, that isn't my problem. My problem is that they gave SOMA such an intellectually handicapped protagonist. They're underestimating the customer, and although I understand why they did it, they could've handled the ordeal with at least some subtlety and taste.

>>381209218
>if that were the case then why didnt they show you failing it every time
Because the narrative had to go on. Because there had to be a "twist" at the end because that's what expected, much like those shitty action scenes that were totally unnecessary.

>>381209218

Hmm, when you click copy on your PC and the data gets copied; it's the original data that's been copied right?

And then when it's pasted; it was the copy and not the original data.

Gotta replay the game but I'm on a toaster until I get my school money.

YouTube here I come.

>>381209457
Death is terrifying. I'm not pissed I'm not special, I'm pissed I'm going to stop existing. Who cares if others have access to my brain afterward, I'm going to be dead anyway.

Yeah, my brain scan or children or legacy or whatever the fuck are going to live on, and that's nice, but that doesn't make me fine with dying. Most people don't want to die.

>>381209665
>consciousness is a pc file
anon i know you like your retarded analogies but that isnt how it works

the whole horrific point of SOMA is that the brain scans were picking up people's souls
thats why you were playing as original simon the whole time, to hammer that point in

>>381209102
I was 5 years old when it happened and I don't really remember anything from around that time. I was already cold when my mother found me probably a couple minutes. They suspect I had a seizure or heart attack but I'm not sure. I had severe brain damage but I got lucky by having it at such a young age that rehabilitation was quite easy to pull off. Things I remember (after damage) that stand out was not understanding my native language anymore. Dreaming in black&white and having repetitive dreams. Like I dreamed the exact same dream during one night repeatedly for years. So for example I have a dream about chasing a dog then when that dream "ends" I get the exact same dream again the same night in loops.

My body motion looks very "awkward" like an animation. and some movements can cause seizures like riding a bicycle. I tried to ride one a couple of years ago after years of absence and it caused me to get a minor heart attack lol. I'm pretty glad that I don't really have any real intellectual damage though. As far as I know I am still as much capable as before the damage but I can never be sure since I didn't start school yet at 5.

>>381209641

Look man, they let The Chinese Room AKA Dear Esther developers make Amnesia: A Machine for Pigs.

I did enjoy the game but no where near the amount of the original.

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>>381209851
I'm alright with dying.

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>stream of consciousness turns out to be entirely dependent on the physical structure of the brain
>the physical structure of reality is shown to be pure non-physical math

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>>381209935

I took a 'Death and Dying' class in college.

We visited a funeral home, mortuary school, county morgue, a place that freezes you after you've died in hopes of bringing you back to life and had a bunch of people with different beliefs come in and talk about their customs.

Had a guy come in who actually had to use FMLA so he could go back to his country (I forget which one) so he could eat his mother when she died.

That's fucking metal.

When I die I want my body dumped in a shallow ditch, naked, faced down and whoever was in charge of making my funeral arrangements to spend it on hookers and blow instead.

>>381209851
I will be okay with dying once I have children. Before that I'm fucking terrified of it. If I died right now I would have achieved NOTHING. My whole life would have been a waste of effort by myself and many others interacting with me, especially of course my parents.

>>381209851
Just imagine going to sleep and never waking up.

>>381210137

>Math

Fuck off with your 'Pure Math' bullshit.

Once I got past Differential Equations (it's just rate of change) and numbers were all replaced by nothing but a countless amount of symbols to memorize, I said fuck this.

>>381210461
You realize numbers themselves are just symbols you memorized once, right?

>>381210345
>Just imagine going to sleep and never waking up
but you have a minimum amount of consciousness even during dreamless sleep
people in comas can remember shit that happened around them

and you go to sleep with the expectation of waking up, you cannot go into death with that same expectation

>>381210337
I'm sure your parents would be content just to know you're happy and if not, who cares about letting them down?

When you're dead you've got no time to think about your achievements anyway. Why live life as though repaying a loan? Aren't you letting your own children down by dying prematurely?

>>381210345

I do every time I fall asleep but my fantastic genes won't let me.

I'm 31 and look 22 and feel 18.

I will live to be 90 easily.

I don't want to live that fucking long.

>>381210461
>It's just rate of change

You could call the universe that as well.

>>381210137
The content that appears in the consciousness, sure. I'd say consciousness itself is probably the same for everything.

>>381210548
>I don't want to live that fucking long.
why not
you get to shitpost on 4chan and check out the new VR web waifu every day while getting your dicc sucked by a positionally tracked blowjob android

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>>381210461
>Fuck off with your 'Pure Math' bullshit.
Embrace pain
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schild%27s_Ladder
http://www.gregegan.net/SCHILD/00/SchildExcerpt.html

>>381210548
>I will live to be 90 easily.
Yeah right, some drunk driver or terrorist shooter could get you as early as this week.

>>381210516

Yes.

But it's hilarious because the high echelon math teachers can't even do basic asthmatic anymore because what they teach is so abstract.

They literally have to wait for a student to use their calculator and assume they didn't get the wrong answer which happens constantly.

>>381210517
Don't worry about death. When you die, your brain will emit some form of unique drug that will transport you into an imaginary world of your liking in which you will live for possibly thousands of years even though only one second will pass in reality. There are still studies going on about this but it's really interesting.

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>>381210548
>TFW 23 but look like chain smoking balding 40 year old NTR hentai antagonist

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>>381199834
Reminder that SOMA wasn't even nominated for best story at the 2015 VGAs.

>>381199834
Volition, Arisen!

>>381210530
>I'm sure your parents would be content just to know you're happy and if not, who cares about letting them down?

So my parents should care about how I feel but I shouldn't care about my parents? ayyyyyyy

>Why live life as though repaying a loan?

Because I still depend on my parents for financial support so that's exactly what my life is for now. Point taken though, it's important to move on from that once I am independent.

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>>381199834
I shouldn't have played this game with my depressed brother. Hopefully he doesn't upload his brain data to a robot and kill himself.

>>381210689
Sounds like high echelon math should be conducted with more automation to avoid all that human error.

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>>381210624

>Been shit posting since 2007
>VR is a maymay and will never be sustainable.
>I have no waifu because like Sherlock Holmes said "You cannot trust even the best of women."
>I get my dick sucked by 18-21 year old at college because of how young I look and my years of experience turned me into an Operator-tier pussy wreker.
>If I ever did buy a sex robot, we'd most play chess and Battleship.

>>381210461
This is one of the most brainlet things I've ever read.

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>>381209852

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My immortal desire to STICK my DICK in Midna.

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>>381210716

I met a 20 year old grill in college who ordered some fucking industrial strength jewelry cleaner and chugged the bottle but since she's a woman, she forgot to drink vodka first to stop her body from induing vomiting it all up.

That's right kids:

Vodka and a bottle of Tylenol WILL kill you.

Look up Anastasia Blue.

She was taken from us too soon.

But then again she fucked niggers so she should have died sooner in a more painful way.

Or maybe that's why she killed herself.

Who knows?

>>381210716

So Hunter S. Thompon then?

>>381210732
good, because it wasn't that good

>>381210137
>the physical structure of reality is shown to be pure non-physical math
Platonists pls go. Math is just a formula game. Hilbert was right.

>>381210974
An then you wake up.

>>381199834
ME

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>>381210684

Sorry senpai but I have the Devils' luck.

The good die young so I'll end up buying my kids.

Which is even Fathers' dream, really since it's so fucking Metal.

>>381210974
>VR is a maymay
for now, but in a decade it won't be

>>381211772
We've heard that exact phrasing for like 3 decades straight.

>>381211618
WUZ ORIGINAL CONSCIOUSNESS N SHIEET

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>>381211603

I told you already, I don't want to wake up.

Same shit, different day.
Can't trust anyone, especially woman.
Sex does and will eventually get boring.
You will try every kind of drug.
Etc.

Don't get me wrong it was all fun but what now?

>>381211772
That's what people have said every time VR resurfaced, it's never going to be successful.

>>381211864

Senpai, I like you.

They're been saying that shit for since the 70's.

No one wants to wear head gear because only sports players and retards do that shit.

>>381211864
>>381212031
I STILL believe VR is the future.

I just think it will be 30 years before it'll be good. And yes this takes into account exponential growth of computing power and resolution of screens.

We need at least 2 big steps like 90s VR to 10s VR. So that's around ~3 decades.

Who cares?

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>>381212159

Yes, yes we all know about Moore's Law and blah blah blah yackity yackity.

It makes NO FUCKING MONEY so no one is going to invest in it.

>>381212159
Believe all you want, increased computing power won't make VR more interesting to play with.

VR is interesting for teaching new doctors and plane pilots, maybe also getting rid of phobias, not games.

>>381212364
It's already great for games NOW. But only for very specific genres like racing game and flight simulator type of things.

Maybe porn games (which is a booming sector right now) as well.

As VR gets better it will slowly add more gaming genres to it that will be the superior experience within VR.

>>381211964
VR is more successful now than it was a decade ago.

>>381209908
>I was already cold when my mother found me probably a couple minutes
Damn, that's heavy stuff. It's hard for me to imagine what it was like to have such a close brush with death in your childhood. Do you think you are now more or less afraid of dying than the average person?
>So for example I have a dream about chasing a dog then when that dream "ends" I get the exact same dream again the same night in loops.
Is the dream always exactly the same or do some details change? The idea of looping dreams sounds kind of scary, to be honest, because what if a dream goes wrong? Do you even get looping nightmares?

Did the brain damage affect your ability to play vidya?

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>>381199834
My experience, my neural paths and my waifu (pic not related).

>>381210624
>4chan
we'll be lucky if this place stays for more than 5-10 years before getting erased by morality police for "supporting incorrect way of thinking and other terrorist activities" or some other shit.

for all we know, in a decade the world will be under communist or islamic control and everyone will be miserable as fuck, forced to work from dawn till dusk, being rewarded with welfare-tier money and told to be happy since "you helped the people" or some other sappy shit the commies sell to feel-good idiots to make them do their work. if we're not outright wiped out by a nuclear war started by some trigger happy jihadist once elected in britain or france.

don't buy into the star trekky hi-tech future fantasies.

>>381212701
>Do you think you are now more of less afraid of dying than the average person

Well considering I have a insane obsession with immortality and mind-uploading. I think you could say I have more fear of death than the average person

>Is the dream always exactly the same or do some details change
The dreams were always the same and yes I remember playing Resident Evil 1 on the PS1 and having zombie nightmares that looped. Especially sucked if you dreamed about "waking up" and then those dreams keep looping.

This is kinda a different topic but when those dreams looped I actually remembered that I already had the dream just before but I still "chose" to do the exact same thing and it even felt like I actually made those decisions in the dream.

This made me really doubt the notion of free will in real life as well. If my brain could be tricked into thinking it made the decision even though it was obviously the exact same dream. Then how do I know it isn't the same in real life with my body choosing everything and my brain just tricking me into thinking it was my own conscious choice.

Also no. Playing games is what kept me alive during rehabilitation. Being 5 year old and unable to play is boring as fuck so I basically spent all day every day gaming.

>>381203654
>this misinformation again

That's wrong. Neurons are never replaced throughout your entire life, that's why brain damage is such a serious thing. The ship of Theseus is a false equivalence for humans, we are different types of entities. Also the "atoms get replaced thing" comes from a 50 years old article, for which many parts were debunked.
https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/18427/are-all-the-atoms-in-our-bodies-replaced-on-a-regular-basis

Rather than a ship, humans are more like a tower. We are accumulated experiences stored in a continuous consciousness (no faggots, you don't die when you go to sleep, your brain doesn't stop working. Do you know what happens when your brain stops working for even 10 minutes? Irreparable brain damage.) it would be more accurate to think of humans as things stacked over each other. Time passes, and more and more things get placed, the tower keeps getting higher. At some point you can no longer see the base of the tower, the experiences from before, but the base is still there. It was there and served to hold the experiences that came afterwards, which did the same for the next ones, leading you to where you are right now.

I dunno, current stream of consciousness?
It's not worth worrying about.

>>381206536
I like to think it was because he was an alpha version of the brainscan, and it produced a rigid copy.

His brain is always in that snapshot state, so while he can get his ol' neurons firing, they can never make new connections. So he can never LEARN or CHANGE. He keeps making the same mistake because he never had the answer back in Montreal.

I am my consciousness. As the game skillfully shows, it's not enough to make perfect copies of me and my brain activity, because they are still just twins.

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>>381199894
fpbp

>>381199834
I wish some games(i don't really consume aything else) would do the same question but from a different angle. Like if your loved one's about to die, but science men can completely clone a healthy copy with all their memories up to a certain time, would you take it?The clone will never know the difference, but you do.

>>381199834
Lacanian imaginary with the help of the symbolic and the real.

>>381213898
is your existence not worth worrying about? It's literally the only thing that exists from your viewpoint. Might as well not care about existence at all since your life IS the universe from your perspective.

>>381214424
Play the "Zero Escape" games.

>>381214630
Shit son, what do you want me to do? Cast a magical fuckin' spell to protect some intangible consciousness that exists in my mind at this moment?
It's not a thing you can actually affect beyond what you're already doing, so it's not worth worrying about.

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>>381213319
>Especially sucked if you dreamed about "waking up" and then those dreams keep looping.
Fuck.
>Well considering I have a insane obsession with immortality and mind-uploading.
>This made me really doubt the notion of free will in real life as well.
Those are topics near and dear to my heart. Considering your interests, you might already be familiar with what I am about to recommend, but it won't hurt for me to recommend it anyway. First, consider reading pic related. It theorizes about how mind uploading may transform society. Book review: http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/05/28/book-review-age-of-em/. Second, https://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Free_will. It's a series of posts that deal with what "free will" might mean and the feeling of free will in a way that I found really satisfying.

>>381199834
Me does.

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>>381199894
superb post

>>381201478
No, you fucking dumbass, you didn't will yourself into existence. You didn't choose almost anything that brought you to the point you are right now.

>>381214424
That was an episode of Star Trek:TNG. The guy who built Data also made an android to replace his dead wife. He even programmed her with a "shutdown date" to simulate death.

>>381209934
>Look man, they let The Chinese Room AKA Dear Esther developers make Amnesia: A Machine for Pigs.
SOMA was made by the exact same team as Amnesia TDD.

Occam's razor

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>this entire thread

Why bother thinking about it?
The answer won't change anything. You won't live long enough to see real technology that raises this sort of dilemma, and even if you do you sure as fuck won't get to experience it.
None of it matters.

>>381199834
Me.

>>381216379
assuming you don't believe in any afterlife, on the off chance that afterlife is real, you'll get ahead while those who don't think about anything and close their minds to possibilities outside their belief system won't.

>>381216418
Because you aren't your memories. You're a unique instance of brain matter with a body on it, which is why even replicating your body doesn't suffice to replace you. You're the point of view that creates and lives those memories out. You don't cease to be the same person because you get amnesia. You didn't die by going through puberty and gaining some self awareness.