RELIC APOLOGIZES FOR DOW 3 BLUNDER - ADDS NEW MODES

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>>380643038
>action-RTS

>>380643038
Call me when it becomes DoW2 again.

>>380643038
>their game is gonna die unless
Their game is fucking dead as a rock already, and a new mode (which will split the tiny number of people still playing up even more) and (((free))) skins isn't going to change that

>>380643038
Call me when it becomes DOW1 again

>>380643038
it had 2000 players like 2 weeks ago, the game is kill

Too little, too late Relic. You only get one chance to make a good first impression and yours alienated your entire fanbase.

>>380643038

DoW3 is fun. It's not DoW1 or 2, and it's probably not worth 60 fucking bucks for a shit campaign, three factions and one mode, but I have had fun stomping AI with large Ork armies, and that makes it worth the 40 bucks I spent on it.

All I need now is Imperial Guard, Chaos and Necrons, and I'd be more or less set.

>>380644373

If you think that is kill, look at poor battlefleet gothic

https://steamdb.info/app/363680/graphs/

>154 24 hour peak

And for what it's worth, Steel Division

https://steamdb.info/app/572410/graphs/

>1,299 24 hour peak

I don't see people saying that game is dead, then again I don't see people saying ANYTHING for that game.

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>>380644576

Hey fucker. HotS made a terrible first impression and flopped. one 2.0 later and now /v/ loves it.

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I played it and even though the game mode looks like a mistake it's more about the core gameplay than the turret and nexus what is completely off the wall wrong

It needs SO MANY THINGS REDONE that I cannot see it working in a 6 months time frame, maybe it will take much more, a year perhaps

Elites and the system are stupid. Balance is bonkers and the """""cover system""""" needs actual development.

It's just so wrong, even fucking graphically.

I don't even know.

>>380644827
HotS is free. DOW3 is not. Relic made their choice. They decided to chase the MOBA e-sports crowd and abandon their RTS roots. Good luck with that.

None of the DoW2 veterans I used to play with play DoW3, so there's still no reason for me to play this.

>>380644810
>comparing two games that cost half as much to a full-price title
>a full-price title with a name behind it, money behind it and it still died quicker than the other two
Not sure what you're trying to accomplish but it just speaks even worse of DoW3.

>>380644810
Could

you

redditspace

any

harder?

>>380644810
>If you think that is kill, look at poor battlefleet gothic
>https://steamdb.info/app/363680/graphs/

Yeah my man but BFGA was a really small indie project that returned mad profit because of it, and it's pretty good overall. Really good actually, might be one of the best licensed 40k games ever.

DoW3 was really high hyped high budget and it's not returning the scoped profits.

>>380645117


In terms of RTS games, it's about the same as others in its genre.

You know, if you read

>If you think that is kill, look at poor battlefleet gothic

Eh, the turret mode will still be "ranked" mode so it probably won't change anything.

Turrets looks a waste of time especially since they going to be a doctrine (just like eldar's shield)

Oh well at least they will nerf space marines a bit in this patch.

>>380645319
And once again, BFG has been out much longer than DoW3 and had a fraction of its budget. Which means they made much bigger returns comparatively.

Your example is shit and once again just puts DoW3 in an even worse light.

>>380643038
>So they've finally admitted we were right all along

every company needs to hire three people to scour the web for opinions on their products, and compile that into a set of obvious glaring issues that need fixing

there's an immense plethora of information floating around uselessly because a good chunk of the world has no idea how to make use of it

>>380645504

It's been out for a year. That's not that long.

Sure they can fix it by remaking the entire game.

By taking either dow1 or dow2's mechanics and sticking with it.

>>380645234
>DoW3 was really high hyped high budget
That's bullshit m8

>>380645621
Stop trying to move the goalposts, BFG has been out a lot longer than DoW3, a year is a long time compared to a month.

>>380646040

I'm not moving anything. I'm saying what I've said in my first post. DoW has numbers typical of RTS games. Steel Division came out just about the same time and has similar player counts, is it dead as well?

No, because it's typical for RTS games that aren't starcraft to not have 200K people playing all the time.

I'm sorry if you feel otherwise, but DoW3 is just doing average, which might be bad given its pedigree, but it's not kill by any means.

>>380646539
Whatever makes you and your colleagues feel better about your dead game, pal.

>>380644827
Wasn't Reddit invasion around the same time?
Fishy fishy

>>380644810
Battlefleet Gothic is an old game now and there's no hint of future updates with the last being in November. That game being dead is pretty normal considering the budget and age.

It was a million times more enjoyable than DoW 3 too.

>>380647293

And steel division? Y'all are ignoring the obvious truth: RTS games in general don't have high playerbases. You're looking at DoW3 like it was supposed to have a shitton of players, but short of Warcraft IV, there isn't going to be something like that, as RTS games just aren't in vogue anymore.

I guess we'll see when spellforce 3 hits. I wouldn't be surprised if it also has around 1,000 or less players after a month.

>>380647720
Why do you keep bringing up Steel Division? A game based on RUSE is niche as fucking hell.

>>380643038
can't fix the shit gameplay with new game modes

>>380648161
steel division has basically nothing in common with RUSE

for starters, steel division is a good game

>>380648161

It's sadly the only recent RTS game out with any amount of relevance in the RTS genre. Can you name another one?

I mean, there's Total War: Warhammer, but that's a Total War game. That is in its own league. I can't think of anything that isn't niche as fucking hell and is an RTS that came out in 2017.

If you go back to 2016 there's Battlefleet Gothic, which I brought up but apparently one year is too old.

There's also Northgard, but that has about 1200 players right now, and it's cheaper than DoW3.

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DoW3 is shit.
>No generic leader for you to customize with gear to call your own
>No loot
>No choosing your race for campaign
>Have to play as faggot Eldar
>No matter what chapter you are your special characters are still blood ravens

>>380644810
I'm pretty certain one of the main reason barely anyone touches BFG is because of all the cheating that is/was going around in multi. It's a solid game otherwise for the most part.

>>380648872
>Warhammer is about customizing your models with unique looks and gear
>DoW 3 has zero customization
It's the biggest problem with the game.

>>380643038
Nope it's shit Dark Crusade is still better

>>380648872
Not to mention how the campaign provides Z E R O progression to the story of the blood ravens.

>>380649458
>DoW 3 has zero customization
It has army painter....

>>380649458
Are you fucking kidding me? Loot was the best part of DOW2, I lootwhored like crazy in that game just to see what wargear would drop. Relic just dumped everything fans liked to chase the MOBA crowd, didn't they.

>>380647720
I've never even heard of Steel Division so I would put their numbers down to lack of marketing more than the genre.

>>380644827
Nope it's equally shit, /v/ still considers it shit. Asshurt HoTS fan detected

>>380649732
>Relic just dumped everything fans liked to chase the MOBA crowd, didn't they.
Yep.

>>380647720
>And steel division? Y'all are ignoring the obvious truth: RTS games in general don't have high playerbases. You're looking at DoW3 like it was supposed to have a shitton of players, but short of Warcraft IV, there isn't going to be something like that, as RTS games just aren't in vogue anymore.

And they won't ever be again in vogue if they don't attempt to make a good one once in awhile for starters.

It's not the genre it's about making shit and selling like shit

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>>380643038
too little too late, Relic
reap what you have sown you fucking traitors

>>380649732
>They tried to chase the MOBA crowd
>MOBA crowd won't play anything but dota and league
>DoW fans hate it
>In the end they appeal to nobody.

>>380649458

>It's the biggest problem with the game.

Its streamlining in general, like the stupid rush-killing turrets and escalation phases. It artificially limits the options to play the game. Rushes are not a problem in an RTS game as long as theres an easy way for each race to deal with them.

Rushes are a natural counter against greedy steamrolling build orders that just tech up really quick and roll the best units. Dow 3 prevented both of these playstyles completely, first one with turrets, second one with Escalation Phases. It forced the meta instead of letting the meta develop around the way people played the game, thats the main reason shit got stale so fast. And thats the main problem of the multiplayer.

Much harder-to-fix problem with Dow3 is its Saturday Morning Cartoon-art style and only 3 races. You don't make a Warhammer 40k game look like fucking DOTA, you make it look like 2000AD-type of cartoony gritty, like Judge Dredd, or Nemesis The Warlock.

>>380649732
The fuck you are talking about, loot in dow2 was SP shit trash.

>>380644810
>one mode
>three factions
>complete deviation from the series
>$60

ANYBODY who bought this is a fucking idiot.

>>380650540
All I care about is single-player. I don't play multi-player.

>>380650828
This.

>>380644827
Speak for yourself. I still call it the worst of the big three MOBAs. They're all fucking garbage but this took fucking garbage and dumbed it down even further.

>>380643038
>Dawn of War III was meant to reunite our Dawn of War and Dawn of War II fans
>makes a watered down MOBA

holy kek, the disconnect from reality is astounding

>>380648678
TW series are RTT with 4X elements. There's nothing RTS about any of them. There's no point even bringing them up here.

>give middle finger to all RTS and WH40k fans that supported them
>realize the fucked up
>they dig the hole even further

You can't make this shit up.

>>380650828
Then you are in the severe minority.

>>380651521
I've no doubt that's true but the sp campaign had been worth playing in the prior DOW games and it sounds like it's a complete waste of time in DOW3.

>>380643038
>We spend a LOT of time on the forums, and just as much looking through the data on what you’re playing, and what you’re not.
If they spent so much time on the forums, why did they go for MOBA/esports elements? I don't recall anyone asking for those.

>>380651909
I think it was pretty good, not as good as dow2 one in some aspects but way better than first games.

>>380651521

That severe minority made first and second Dawn of War successful enough. At the end of the day attracting enough casual players at first is important to have any multiplayer scene whatsoever. And you can do that without casualizing the game by simply offering enough singleplayer content.

Not just a thing in DoW either, remember Mortal Kombat 9? Why was it successful? Not because it had its time in EVO, but because casuals fucking loved the game, its story mode and its tower-climbing mode.

>>380643038
>annihilation mode

How about you give us some good old control points?

Annihilation was such shit because games took hours.

>>380652373
Moba is for new audience
Esport is for all people who stayed playing dow and dow2 multilayer after all this time.

>>380652442
Speaking of casualizing the game, this isn't the first time they've done it, Winter Assault "streamlined" the original DOW by taking away unit options. I always played with the WApro mod when I was doing compstomps because it added all those options back and more units besides. Sadly the WApro mod isn't compatible with the Steamworks updated version of the game.

>>380652782
MOBA players are loyal af to their MOBA of choice. There's no new audience to draw from with that crowd. How many fucking MOBAs have been released over the years that were DOA? Relic couldn't have been dumb enough to think they were going to pull people away from LOL or DOTA. As for e-sports, who the hell wanted e-sports in this game? Did the players ever want to turn DOW into an e-sport?

>>380653572
People made "wow killers" for a solid 10 years, anon.

Suits see a successful game, they're going to tell devs to make one of those at the next board meeting.

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I doubt they can fix it at this point. A shame they didn't have this realisation six months before it launched. I was so fucking hyped when that trailer announced the game but everything since has been a massive turn off and I doubt I will ever purchase it.

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they just throwing scraps to calm down the masses

>>380653739
I knew it was going off the rails the moment they mentioned MOBAs.

>>380653572
As I see it, they wanted to add something new to the game so they went to the most favourite stuff right now.
I could say they make the heroes too overpowered but whatever...

I am pretty sure anyone who play multiplayer does, like why the fuck wouldn't you?

How do i get more loot in DoW 2? Increase difficulty?

>>380654253
In the base game do all the missions including all those Tyranid missions until the game stops generating them. Or install a mod that increases the loot drop rate.

>>380644827
Why HotS, and why not DoW2. After DoW2 was out everyone was bitching about the removal of base building, how your armies were like 4-5 squads max, and how gameplay boiled down to playing grabass for 30 minutes over a handful of control points. It wasn't until Retribution that most people really started getting warmed up to the new style of gameplay.

>>380653739

>I doubt they can fix it at this point. A shame they didn't have this realisation six months before it launched.

Their forums are filled with retarded sycophants who spit out shit like this:

>An unprecedented barrage of salty-neckbeard-40k fanboy hate that comes from an aging playerbase unwilling to be charitable at all to a game based on superfluous first impressions of the game.
> I honestly don't know why people hold up DoW 1 and 2 as huge successes that deserve to be emulated for the sake of the playerbase. The "playerbase" straight up abandoned DoW2 after a couple months of release (not as sure about DoW1 since it was released in a different environment). Tell me why relic should just duplicate their old games when hardly anyone stuck around to play it after a couple months?

So no wonder they didn't realize this in time. Blind fanboys who praise everything are the worst possible people you can listen when it comes to criticism.

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>>380656448
Yes, why should Relic continue to cater to a playerbase that supported them thru Dawn of War, Winter Assault, Dark Crusade, Soulstorm, Dawn of War 2, Chaos Rising and Retribution. Why indeed.

>>380656448
Man you really don't go there, their forums is same shit as this entire thread.

>>380657506
Because none of DOW games were actually popular enough for them to appeal to the same people.

>>380658027
So instead they appeal to neither groups and end up with even less supporters, genius!

>>380658027
That makes no sense. If you were into the multiplayer scene you bought the expansions in order to unlock new races to play. If you were into the single-player you bought them to see where the story went. Clearly there was a divide between DoW1 and DoW2 fans but obviously there were enough buyers to support 6 releases.

>>380658323
It's probably sold more than dow2 for sure

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>>380643038
>We make these games for you, and we need you in order to keep making games.
Yeah, you need me. That's why I didn't give you my money so you'd have to work harder to earn it. I'm feeling rather satisfied right now.

>But that takes time.
Maybe should've developed it more before throwing a half-finished piece of shit onto the market.

>b-but there were no bugs and the core gameplay was okay-ish already
Fuck off, don't launch a game without enough features to sustain itself. Couldn't even get fucking leaderboards in on launch for your "maybe it'll turn into an e-sport, who knows", "we removed sync-kills to make it more competetive" game.

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>>380643038
>saved
>Heroes of the Storm

>>380658856
>Maybe should've developed it more before throwing a half-finished piece of shit onto the market.

That's actually their masters decision aka sega

>Dawn of War III was meant to reunite our Dawn of War and Dawn of War II fans with a bombastic, action-RTS packed with incredible heroes, giant space lasers, and whole, new planets made of things that go BOOM. While we’ve checked those boxes, it’s clear that those weren’t the only things that you were looking for. So, what now?
This is Battleborn-tier PR. I wonder how indicative of actual dev direction front-facing shit like this is. As if relic was more concerned with making a market researched, financially 'smart' set of Fisher-Price jingly keys instead of a worthwhile modern RTS revival. There is truly no forgiveness

>>380658608
according to steamspy it has only sold around 250k copies, whereas DoW2 has easily sold around 3 million
heck, DoW2 has maybe even sold even more than that if you take into consideration the amount of times that Retribution has gone on sale

>>380643038
>with a bombastic, action-RTS packed with incredible heroes, giant space lasers, and whole, new planets made of things that go BOOM. While we’ve checked those boxes,
That's one way to totally sidestep the actual criticism of your product.

>>380659410
I probably should say in the same time frame

>>380643038
Are they doubling down on the base building crap that forumdads whined for?

They need to make the game more like DoW 2 for it to sell. People want actual skill/tactics/strategy, not "churn out mindless hordes of troops to left click on the enemy while you turtle and research" like starcraft, red alert, C&C and dune 2000

Every game with genuine strategy/tactic elements has sold well - Wargame titles, world in conflict, myth I and II, company of heroes, men of war, x-com, etc. etc. The old RTS games are out of vogue because they've been replaced by MOBA's, which offload the boring unit churn for hero management and thereby reintroduce genuine strategy/tactics.

Old RTS is stale, it doesn't sell, nobody wants to play it, and doubling down on that style of gameplay is just about the dumbest thing relic could do.

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On this occasion can we appreciate how shit gaming media is?

>>380659396
You know a company has gone to shit when they can't communicate with people without sounding like brainwashed slogan-spouting marketdroids.

>>380660427
All journalism exists to lie to you and sell you products.

The journalist "profession" is that of paid liars. They accept bribes and in exchange tell lies to the public. They couch these lies in carefully constructed verbiage, they've done serious research on how to manipulate people with words, and how to lie to them better.

All reviews from the media should be thrown in the trash. You can only get genuine input from literally-who's that aren't big enough to receive sponsorship bribes yet.

>>380660427
77 is fair score for dow3

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>>380659318
It's been obvious to me that Relic was starved for budget with this game.
Dawn of War 2 looked like money in every way. Dawn of War 3 looks like it went for the cheapest option every time:

They got maybe a third of the voice acting with a quarter of the talent.
They only managed to develop 3 factions, one mode, a tiny hand-full of maps as well as a linear campaign with little to offer and no leaderboards or observer system.
Sync-kills may have always been a bit of a problem child, but cutting them in this context seems more like they wanted to save on animation costs. Especially with animation quality in general being way lower.
Music isn't full choir and orchestra like Dawn of War 2, but one (admittedly talented) guy on his laptop.
Audio design in general is way lower quality.
Graphics are cartoony to save on graphical fidelity.

All that and I still feel like I probably missed a thing or two.

>>380661398
>All that and I still feel like I probably missed a thing or two.
They also didn't localize audio into different languages, just added subtitles for everyone.

>>380661398
That means they bit off more than they could chew.

Too many of these devs are dreaming too big.

Get the basics of the game hashed out before you commit to a serious investment. Your game should be fun to play before anyone's even added textures and all the characters are literally just blank spheres.

You have to quickly prototype and adjust and playtest and adjust. You have to play your own game and understand what needs work and where.

>>380657712

I do, and its fanboys going "Go back to your DoW1/DoW2 if you dont like it." in every single fucking thread where you try to give the actual reasons why the game lacks players.

Well guess what, players did fuck off back to older Relic games and now DoW3 is in trouble. And part of the blame why Relic failed to listen to its actual audience is thanks to these sycophants who go to say nothing is wrong with the game in threads where developers themselves apologize and ask the audience to come back. Fucking idiots.

>>380661916
But it's fun

>>380661249
That's almost as much as Mount and Blade Warband.

You just need to look at the screenshots to know its shit.

It looks like ass. Just horrible. i mean, google DOW3 images, and just look at them, let it sink in. DOW 1 looks better.

This game is completely unplayable. It's easily blunder of the year.

>>380661993
Probably because all you sound like same nostalgia fags...
Waahhh l want base building
Waahhh the elites are too powerfull
Waahhh but muh shitty single player from DC/SS


I played all DoW games since release and loved them all even if they are different

>>380663412
All of those are superficial reasons that people touted way too much. The real problems of the game run way deeper.

>>380663412

Whether you like it or not, that singleplayer, those sync kills, that 2000AD graphical style was what brought the core chunk of the playerbase to Dawn of War in the first place. The W40K feel has to be good in the game for anyone to bother play it. But Relic decided to make the game look like a DOTA Mickey Mouse Cartoon instead.

DoW was successful because everyone from casual to more experienced RTS player felt how awesome it was when tanks shot in the middle of Ork hordes and sent them flying in bloody viscera, with great sound effects, wartorn gritty landscapes and so on. Sync kills were not good balance-wise but damn did if feel good when your army elite melee unit started chopping down enemies.

And thats just the problem of the game not feeling like W40K game but more like a more colorful Starcraft 2 mod. Then theres a whole another basket of problems with the stupid fucking turrets and most notably Escalation phases which ties the hands of players way too much.

Oh but of course none of these points will be heard and thought about, because DoW3-fanboys will say the game is perfect and its really just players fault the game is doing bad and they don't recognize how perfect the game is. Everything is fine, ignore Relic's desperate apologies and the dwindling playerbase, nothing to see here!

Reminds me back when I was going to Games For Windows Live support forums to ask why my copy of Dawn of War 2 was not working despite just buying and registering it. Those forums were filled with exact same kind of sycophants who kept saying GFWL is actually perfect and I'm just too much of a pleb to understand the brilliance of it. And guess fucking what GFWL tanked as one of the shittiest services in gaming history not few years later.

Call me a noob if you wish but I felt DoW3 was too micro heavy for me to enjoy.

>>380664820
DoW 2 had a really nice amount of micro.

Not too many units, you can only handle maybe 5-8 squads at a time, but that's enough for interesting gameplay.

>>380644827
I liked it for a grand total of 3 hours and moved on when I realized I had to grind for Sgt. Hammer who was literally the only unique hero I could enjoy out of all the MOBAs I've played so far, and I don't play WoW so I don't know these cool Warcraft characters.

At lest the Orkz have never been better.

>YOUV GOT YA SHOOTA BOOOOYZ!