This is the worst Doom map of all time. John Romero is a hack.

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E4M6 exists.
E3M9 exists.
Half of Doom 2's maps exist.

>>379571825
This is ultimate doom, right?

>>379572268
>le doom 2 maps are shit xD

why don't you go back to your D1 flat labirynths you love so much

>>379573820
I don't know, is it?

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>>379574006
It's E4M2

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>>379573895

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That's not E3M2

>>379574006
I don't know, that's why I asked. What the fuck is your problem? Go be a smug cocksucker elsewhere, faggot.

>>379575016
You asked >>379573820 and i said >>379574006 because only a fucking retard couldn't tell that it was The Ultimate Doom.

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>>379573895

>>379571825
shut the fuck up daikatana was a MASTERPIECE!

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Perfect Hatred is literally the best Doom mission ever made. It's an absolute work of art.

On an unrelated note, AVP Gold/2000 is the absolute most underrated FPS out there.

>>379571825
Fuck you, E4M2 PERFECT HATRED was one of my all time favorites

>>379576248
What to expect from someone who posts with an image from fucking FE Tokyo Mirage Sessions

>>379571825
lets be honest, i love doom and doom 2 but E4 in general we do not speak of

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>>379576353
I've never even played it though. I just like Tsubasa. I haven't played a single nu-fe game at all.

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That's why he works at a gas station now

>>379578871
This guy spend his money on a lot of useless garbage, doesn't he? How about spend some of that on some classes and books about game design and time management because he fucking sucks at that.

>>379571825
I agree

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Haha

git gud

>Play megawad
>Lol, Revenants and Archviles are so funny! Spooky skeletons am I right?!

>>379576248
>>On an unrelated note, AVP Gold/2000 is the absolute most underrated FPS out there.

I played this last year and found it pretty bland. Why did you like it?

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>>379571825
The fuck? Why? Its hard but really fun once you figure it out.

>>379579275
More like he spends his own money on his own interests like any normal human being would.

>>379579828
>play megawad
>suck ass
>blame a few enemy types for no reason

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>>379579828
>play megawad
>"What an ass! Mind if I fuck it off for you?"

>>379580749
Why the hell do you assume that I just suck? It can't possibly be that your meme enemies are overused by everyone and their mothers, no, it must be that the player sucks.

>>379580797
Sometimes it's a matter of getting gud, other times it's, 'Why the fuck would you put 8 archviles in a room with zero cover'

>>379580797
you either play badly or play bad maps but those enemy types themselves can't be at fault.

>>379580706
John Carmack doesn't agree. He says John Romero was way too frivolous with his spending and his work ethics were shit.

>>379577001
>I've never even played it though. I just like [uneventful anime design with a random cliche personality].
Yup, bad taste.

>>379580797
>meme enemies
are you the same butthurt faggot that pops up on the /vr/ doom threads whining about revenants?

>>379573895
this so much

half of doom 2 maps are bad is such a fucktarded meme

only good episode of doom 1 is the first one, everything else is unforgettable as balls. episode 4 has some good maps though.

doom 2 at its peak is far superior to any of the heights doom 1 reaches, it's not even a contest.

most of doom 2 maps are great, only meh/bad ones are Factory, Suburbs, Courtyard, Citadel and Chasm. That's literally it.

Doom 1 is a fucking boring game. highly influential and the grand daddy of them all, no shit, because it was first, but I don't see how anybody doesn't find it utterly boring compared to Doom 2's levels, which have far more variety of level design (size, scale and close encounters), more enemies, SSG and the maps are harder, too. doom 2's gameplay trumps doom 1's boring ass shit.

>>379581294
I'm fairly sure there are more than one person who just flat out doesn't like them for reason or another

>>379580797
not him but yeah you really sound like you suck pretty damn hard

>>379580990
>John Carmack
Who? Do you mean that shitter who sold his soul to Mortimer Zuckerbergstein for massive amounts of jew gold?

>>379581370
Yeah but butthurt that intense is very distinct. We have the same faggot pop up every so often talking about "Le skelytons XD" and shit like that because he's just THAT butt clobbered about them.

That being said, Revenants are easily one of the worst Doom monsters when used irresponsibly.

>>379581473
I think revenants are one of the best monsters as they're fun to fight even when it's just one in a straight hallway.

>>379581556
Yeah but when I say used irresponsibly, I'm talking about like, a closet opening up and 8 of the bastards pour out, or when a bunch of them are perched up on high where they can snipe at you freely.

>>379580294
Mostly the alien campaign. Being able to go at sanic speeds by running and jumping diagonally and being able to crawl on the walls made it amazing. You probably move 4 or 5 times faster than you would just running forward. The tail striking and head biting are satisfying too.

Also all 3 campaigns can get pretty exciting, and there's a bit of difficulty and sense of danger if you play on Directors' Cut.

AVP2 is nice too but its more of a multiplayer only game. The campaigns basically just serve as tutorials.

>>379581636
I know what you mean but it just comes down to poor map design. Any amount of revenants is perfectly doable if you have the room and not tedious if you have the weapons.

>>379581982
>AVP2 is nice too but its more of a multiplayer only game. The campaigns basically just serve as tutorials.

What a shame. That was the only one I hadn't played yet.

I tried AVP2000 and AVP2010 and found both underwhelming. The alien gameplay with going on the roofs was cool as fuck, but I found it underused. I dunno I just felt the game could have been better. The predator campaign was also underwhelming and Marine not that great.

I thought 2 would be better since it was a Monolith game instead of a Rebellion game like the other 3 games. Never played the original title though.

>>379581326
Spoken like someone who hasn't played Doom 2 recently.
Doom 2's maps have two fundamental problems. The first is how unintuitively far apart keys and doors are all but ensuring new players will get confused backtracking.
The second is how crowded they are, where in Doom each corridor would be devoted to a sprinkling of enemies in Doom 2 there are a dozen enemies in every room which waters down the player's sense of enjoyment when playing them and causes levels to drag on.
In terms of layout they're fine and some are even better than Doom's levels however the two previous points combine to make them all feel tedious.

That criticism only applies to real maps, Doom 2 also has the habit of including dumb gimmick maps like barrels of fun or maps that pit a cyberdemon vs X enemies. Filler maps which add nothing to the game.

>>379581982
>AVP2 is nice too but its more of a multiplayer only game.
What? That's a load of bullshit. AVP2 campaigns are the largest, most complex and progressing in the series. Just think about Alien campaign where you have each level devoted to a different stage of growth.

>>379582393
That guy is bullshitting, AVP 2 campaign is great, especially the Alien campaign, and the Marine campaign is more of a horror game

>>379582574
>>379583035

Ah thanks, that's nice to know. I really should get around to playing AVP2 someday.

>>379571825
*best
*genius

>>379576248
Catching a facehugger after doing most of a long map as a Marine was the only moment where the game made me physically recoil in my chair.

>>379582542
lol I beat Doom 2 when I was literally 10 years old. you just sound like a total shithead.

>>379582542
barrels of fun is actually a good map though. gimmicky yes but it actually has interesting layout and good gameplay.

again you sound like a typical retard that sucks balls at everything that isn't doom 1.

>>379580783
UACMN2 never

>>379581408
>Who?

I believe he goes by John "Need to wipe the drive before 5" Carmack as well

>>379580797
>Why the hell do you assume that I just suck

you sure as shit sound like you do :)

>>379583965
IIRC, Before The Nightmare is regarded as true 'sequel' (It's actually a prequel) to UACMN.
>As ancient hawaians used to say, it's time for dicking.

>>379581982
>AVP2 is nice too but its more of a multiplayer only game.
I know you've been called out already for this but it can't be stressed enough how much of a fucking lie that is. You're full of shit.

>>379575000

this. totally sacrificed level design for a "cool" looking map

>>379576535
The only problem with E4 is the fucked up difficulty curve. On their own, the levels are actually really fun.

>>379584237
>>379583035
>>379582574
I'm just now realizing that AVP2 is in fact longer than Gold, at the same time though that's probably because its slow as fuck and wastes so much time on getting all atmospheric instead of killing things, and that's probably why years ago when I last played it, it somehow felt short as shit to me and mostly disappointing. I'm going to play it again later today and again tomorrow just to make sure that I'm not full of shit due to judging it on outdated knowledge, and I'm actually looking forward to it now that I think about it. Mostly because I remember that I used to think the marines' pistol was the sexiest pistol ever put in a game.

>>379583498
I don't know why but I literally can't build up an immunity to getting face hugged at all. Every time it happens I freak out. Must be my fear of vagina.

>>379571825
Hard =/= bad

Fun fact: id created E1M1 last when making doom so they could combine all their experience from making the other maps to make the best map they could for the players to start off on.

>>379571825
That's not E1M6 and most of Episode 2's levels with the only fun ones being Halls of the Damned and Tower of Babel

Episode 3's fun but not memorable, only House of Pain made an impression on me

>>379582542
You are right, but don't shit on barrels of fun. That map was actually pretty cool

>>379587340
That explains why the game gets worse as it goes on.

Final Doom is better than both Doom 1 and 2.

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>>379571825
>E4 is bad

I'm tired of this meme

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>>379571825
>This is the worst Doom map of all time.
That's not Downtown. That's not The Chasm. That's not Barrels o' Fun. Perfect Hatred is a pretty good map for the challenge it gives to the player, and it's one of the best maps to UV/MAX pistol start to really test your skills.

>>379579669
I'm on this map currently actually. Platforming shit like that just does not work well with Doom.

>>379590713
>Downtown
This is the map that stops me from replaying Doom 2 more often. Such a fucking slog.

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>play gameplay mod with monsters replacements
>LOL this sprite frankenstein recolor can walk really fast has 100000 million HP and also a 1hko melee attack and also 1hko hitscan attack and 1hko area attack and also can spam homing missiles and hes also a angel-demon hybrid and hes my dad XDDD
fucking complexdoom addons

>>379591825
I still firmly believe Downtown to be the worst official Doom map. It really is just that bad of a map. Sandy's got some good maps (he did make most of D1's and D2's maps after all), but you can tell that he was burning out with D2 and a lot of the game's mediocre or downright bad maps came from him.

>>379575000
correct

>>379592347
I really like Downtown.

>>379592309
Are there any randomizers that are actually good?

>>379593437
>A goddamn Cyberdemon in the middle of the plaza
Playing Doom 2 UV on Zandronum is goddamn insane.

>>379581326
How? The game was rushed out as fast as humanly possible to cash in on Doom's success

That's just a fucking fact

>>379593640
Are randomizers all bad?

>>379593640
Base Complex Doom is fine all things considered, some bosses and even mini-bosses can be bullshit though, not really "hard" but force you into cover more than they should in my opinion, you could say it's justified because it's mostly balanced for co-op. The many "addons" you can use with it however, mostly extra monsters and overly OP weapons, can be plain retarded, co-op or not.

DRLA monster pack is okay too, regular enemies are decent and most bosses I've fought against don't kill you in one hit unless you're an idiot.

>>379593640
OMG Weapons

>>379594140
Any other good randomizers?

>>379594140
>>379594486
What about colorful hell? I used to play that a lot before the ëpic"enemies made some maps unbeatable, but i dunno if he toned them down a bit now

Are there any mods that are good enough in a way, where you can play them in vanilla maps, because they try to still "capture" the classic Doom gamelay?
Even if they still have some certain additions to it?

>>379594626
I have yet to try this one.

>>379594486
It also depends a lot on how you play, if there are any more gameplay mods in the mix, or if you're forcing yourself into extra rules or whatnot.
I've been enjoying lately playing small/tiny oblige-generated maps with few enemies but pistol start and with "no monsters to exit" enabled, so I might value balance more than if I was playing slaughter maps or megawads in a "regular" way.

>>379594856
I enjoyed the metroid and kira yoshikage mods.

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>>379571825
I am playing Knee Deep in ZDoom now

>its good

What are your favorite gameplay mods and why?

>>379593640
Doom RLA; whatever bullshit the game might throw at you there's the perfect class and loadout for killing it

>>379594856
Beautiful Doom and Burl Tumd, I suppose

Heard good things about Smooth Doom but I have not gotten around to trying it.

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>>379595517
Smooth Doom + Perkristian's HQ SFX + BD HQ music add-on
I like to think of it as the vanilla enhancement bundle. It makes playing Doom feel fucking amazing when the action gets heavy, TNT has been a fucking blast to play because of this.
As for non-vanilla mods, I quite enjoy GMOTA and Samsara, so I can play as the Marathon security officer.

>>379575000

That level was great though. I swear Doomfags are retarded and have shit taste.

>if the level is good Doomfags will hate it
>if the level is shit and generic Doomfags will praise it as the greatest level ever made

Romero is a hack and overrated. Knee Deep in the Dead is the worst part of the original Doom. Sandy Peterson made the best Doom levels. Doomfags have shit taste and like Doom for all the wrong reasons.

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>Romero signed this for me

he's a big guy

>>379595930
I like Beautiful Doom better than Smooth Doom nowadays.

>HQ SFX
Most HQ sound packs I've tried sound like shit, what's so different about this.

>>379595179
Turn off that disgusting N64 filter.

>>379596180
I've heard various things about Beautiful Doom but haven't tried it myself.
>what's so different about this.
I can't really compare it to any other HQ SFX mods since I haven't tried any others, it overhauls just about all the SFX but most notably it makes gun/explosion sounds more satisfying and some enemies sound better, in my opinion at least.

What's the best NuDoom inspired mod?

>>379571825
Clearly a troll. That is seriously an amazing map. OP you're a massive faggot. Kill yourself.

>>379584069
what did he mean by this?

https://www.doomworld.com/idgames/themes/terrywads/uacmn2

>>379596870
D4D is the most accurate

>>379595732
Demolitionist is the worst (starting) class

>>379580990
John Carmack has no right to comment on human behavior, considering the fact that he's just a technology-obsessed alien wearing a human skin that can't comprehend emotions.

>>379593640
There's an Aliens themed mod that randomizes item and enemy placement. It's pretty fun overall, but you'll get these bullshit moments every once in a while, like opening the monster closet in the blackout room on E1M3 and revealing like 20 xenomorphs that somehow fit in the space where 4 imps once were.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-D7-ZNt1kE&t

>>379593640
MetaDoom?

>>379594856
Doom 64 Unabsolved is pretty fun. It replaces all the weapons and monsters and shit with the Doom 64 versions, and replaces most of the Doom 1 and 2 textures with D64-inspired ones. Still generally feels like a Doom game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bxadxvfIMM

>>379580990
Frivolous spending like buying a Ferrari, you mean?

What's the name of that multiplayer FPS where you could fly around at sanic speed and try to capture the enemy flag? It died because the devs fucked it up

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>>379599149
Sounds like shazbot.

>>379598156
>Pistol isn't VP70
Impressive work otherwise.

>>379599252
thanks

>>379571825
I always liked this map so I never got the hate for it or Episode 4in general

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>>379599252
Such a shame.

>>379599383
There were some older versions that played more arcadey. I think those were actually a lot more fun.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJ0AwUfvgyc&t

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>>379599624
>Played T:A and Planetside 2 both when they were first starting up
Those were some really fucking fun weekends, even if I sucked ass at killing anyone.

>>379579828
Sounds like Plutonia

>>379575000
god I FUCKING HATE this map

Even the original Painkiller had a few weird platforming bits to get a secret item or finish a level and it always felt super weird and out of place.

>>379600418

god I FUCKING HATE (You)

>>379595956
(You)

>>379590713
>>379591825
Serious question. Why do you think Downtown is that bad?
I thought this level was a nice change of scenery and pace. It's a big and mostly open level. It's not perfect. It might be a little confusing the first time and some teleporters are unnecessary and annoying. But I can't think of a reason, why I wouldn't replay a game because of this level. There's this other big open level whose name I forget, that machinegunners on every tower or window. That was far more annoying in my opinion. Downtown thankfully only has imps.

Since this is the Doom thread, I want some honest opinions on nu-doom. I personally don't understand all the asshurt and hate surrounding it. I get that it's not really a 1-1 of the originals, but it's a pretty fucking great Painkiller-esque shooter and the level design is pretty good for the most part.

>>379602592
IIRC Downtown is the map with tower chaingunners.

>>379603729
It's okay for the first couple of hours, then all of the decent level designs run out and they all become a journey through a straight hallway to the next battle arena.

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>>379581326
>>379573895

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>>379595179
>Filters
>Y-axis aiming

>>379604210
Why the fuck is that anime's head so BIG?

>>379604448
>>Y-axis aiming
he's not playing a vanilla map stupid
>filters
literally no excuse for that, though

>>379604210
why is a goblin sitting at the table

>>379604210
that anime made me realize why Japs don't draw lips usually

>>379604448
>Y-axis aiming
I play vanilla maps with autoaim off.

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That's not Tricks and Traps.

>>379604210
lieutenant degurechaff is cute! CUTE!

>>379581326
Objective Doom 2 Map Rankings

God Tier
>11 Circle of Death
>14 Inmost Dens

Great Tier
>1 Entryway
>2 Underhalls
>3 Gantlet
>4 Focus
>5 Waste Tunnels
>7 Dead Simple
>15 Industrial Zone
>17 Tenements
>20 Gotcha!
>22 Catacombs
>25 Bloodfalls
>26 Abandoned Mines
>27 Monster Condo
>29 The Living End
>30 Icon of Sin

Good Tier
>6 Crusher
>8 Tricks and Traps
>9 Pit
>10 Refueling Base
>23 Barrels O’ Fun
>28 Spirit World

Okay Tier
>13 Downtown
>21 Nirvana

Shit Tier
>12 Factory
>16 Suburbs
>18 Courtyard
>19 Citadel

Chasm Tier
>24 Chasm

Only retards disagree.

Meanwhile Doom is only good for E1 and E4, and doesn't at all compare to the best of what Doom 2 has to offer.

>>379604210
>Head is way to fucking round
>Those fucking bird wing eyelashes and big eyes
>Those duck lips
>Huge head in comparison to her small body and tiny hands
This looks like garbage.

>>379603858
It's not. Unless this guy is wrong.
https://youtu.be/DSJjfjdJz3g

>>379605180
>icon of sin
>great

>E3M2

I don't have enough ammo for this shit, do they expect you to just run?

>>379605223
>this avatar
BARNEYFAGS THIS IS YOU'RE MINDSET

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>>379605193
APOLOGIZE TO TANYA RIGHT NOW YOU FUCK

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>>379604572
>>379604757
>>379604843
>>379604926
>>379605193
>Look this garbage up
>It turns out that character is literally a man who was reborn into the body of a girl
wtf japan

>>379605180
I don't know, I like Suburbs, especially its Plutonia remake.

>>379605463
It's all Aura Battler Dunbine's fault, but that in itself wasn't a bad show. It was just the first of what we now call isekai.

>>379605446
Seriously, what the FUCK is with those eyelashes? And that image just shows even more how her deformed head is so inproportional from the size of her body.

>>379605393
I'm not sure what you're talking about, but he has decent playthroughs of Doom 1 and 2 with no faggotry. Best equivalent of an LP that I could find for these games on youtube. Which kinda surpeises me. You'd think there would be more good LPs of Doom.

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Does nobody FUCKING hate but kinda like Deimos Lab?

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>>379579275
His fireplace mantle is literally covered with books on game design.

>>379605997
I honestly find it too hard to hate any of the original Doom maps. Too much nostalgia even if they're not all great

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>mfw unironically like the chasm and the pit

>>379605997
E2M4 is pretty fun and the map's design is really memorable and unique, each sector is varied and stands out and really sticks with you.

>>379605446
>>379605693
Eyelashes look fine but my god that head proportion looks like shit along with the odd shadows always cast her face makes it look like she has an invisible nose.

>>379606197
I first played Chasm late at night, so the random Lost Souls popping up from below was maximum spook material.

>>379606265
You're all a bunch of fags. She looks great.

>>379606197
pit is a great map.

>>379579275
>>379606037
Doesn't he give lectures on game design?

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>Perfect maps don't exi-

>>379606351
His husband does too.

>>379605180
*pit should be in great tier that's a bad mistake I made welp

>>379606404
>all that aimless running around and backtracking to find which door your key opens
>perfect
no

>>379606345
Are you fucking retarded? She looks absolutely awful.

I would kill for a wad which is just the good maps of Doom 1-2 without the shit ones

would be like the length and a half of a full campaign but every level is fun and no filler shit

>>379606547
Just make it yourself. It's not that hard to use Slade.

>>379604869
One of my favorite maps.
The Pit though...

>>379605693
isekai is older than anime really

remember Mark Twain?

>>379606543
Are you autistic? She's beautiful.

>>379606701
why do shitters not like the pit exactly?

not only is the map itself great but it also has a unique track that rocks and is only used once in the whole game.

I'd almost put Doom 1 and Doom 2 in different genres. Doom 1 certainly felt like a horror game at the time which caused it to age worse than Doom 2. Doom 2 is still fun today because of it's focus on action and not sprawling exploration type levels. I'm aware that the tech wasn't there for Doom 1 to have the same amount of enemies. Hell, even today to make a Doom level scary you have to have a pack of archviles hunting you or some sort of sinister teleporter trickery

>>379603729
There is no asshurt and hate, I can guarantee the only people disparaging it are disingenuous shitposters. It's like how they try to spark arguments between Metroid fans over whether the 2D or Prime games are better - they're both fantastic, and the real fans were overjoyed when Prime came out because it revitalized the franchise. There some genuine criticisms about nu-Doom, mainly the fact that 90% of the encounters are setpiece arenas, but I think you'd have to be a contrarian douchebag to genuinely hate it.

>>379606816
Anon she looks like someone used the Big Head cheat code on her. She looks fucking stupid.

>>379606831
>Projecting

It's is a bad map because I say so.

>>379606197
I like pit. Great soundtrack and perfect packs to blow away with SSG

>>379606915
It just enhances her cuteness.

>>379606938
do you even know what projecting means you fucking retard?

>>379607010
pedophiles are NOT welcome here

>>379607010
No it doesn't, It makes her look like an abomination. Especially combined with those fucking duck lips and eyebrows.

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best map the courtyard

>>379607032
Yes I do, you shitter.

Doom 2 maps are so abstract and weird in comparison to Doom.

At least Episode 1 tried to look like a moonbase. The other episodes not so much since it's implied Hell is taking over.

But Doom 2 is supposed to be set on Earth and it's so bizarre.

Where is Episode 4 set anyway? Is it also earth?

>>379607143
maybe not best, but I use it for testing weapon packs

it's also "caughtyard", a pun

ha ha

>>379607060
>*checks address bar*
>Says 4chan
He's at the right place.

>>379602592
It's big and open with no obvious path of progression, so you're left to aimlessly wander around trying to find the first key in this big, empty map with enemies attacking from windows all over, then you have to play guess-the-right-door with each building you enter in hopes that it leads you on the correct path to progression, and then backtracking is a fucking slog because "WHERE THE FUCK WAS THE RED KEY DOOR" and "WHERE IS THE EXIT". The lack of direction in a map of that scale and openness is seriously what ruins the map, it's just confusing and disorienting to play and leaves a bitter taste in your mouth afterwords.
It's not so bad as to make me want to not replay Doom 2 altogether, but it's definitely "that" level that I dread getting to each time, along with others like The Chasm. But that's not really a problem for me since Doom 2 is the least fun for me to replay overall, so I'm less likely to replay it for a few years to come, I find a lot of its levels to be pretty mediocre despite what other anons ITT might think. Doesn't mean there aren't good or great levels in it, but a lot of them are pretty "okay" or mediocre while also featuring some of the worst maps in official Doom wads. I'd rather just replay the individual good or great maps from pistol start than play through the entirety of Doom 2 at this point.

>>379607219
>it's also "caughtyard", a pun
that's from Final Doom.

>>379607060
Thinking a little girl is cute doesn't make me some sexual deviant. The fug made you think that?
>>379607127
Are you seriously complaining about a drawing having a unique style?

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Global Grilling.

>>379607261
>"WHERE THE FUCK WAS THE RED KEY DOOR"
it's only really a problem because red doors are hard to notice on minimap, unlike blue and yellow ones

>>379607446
Unique doesn't inherently mean good. Her design is fucking garbage and she should be ashamed.

>>379605997
Its actually my favorite map in the series.

>>379607645
Your sensibilities are garbage dude. That's a cute girl if I've ever seen one.

>>379571825
Spotted the shitter.
Fun to play even on pistol start.

>>379607819
You have some really bad taste.

>>379607850
I find it easier on pistol start - sure you can grab the RL and some ammo from Hell Beneath, but I usually just lose so much HP there from running past Hell Knights through imp hordes, and you get the shotgun from the sarges immediately anyway. A couple of rockets won't save you from the hissing menace from the depths.

>>379607905
Right back at you.

>>379607993
Usually one shotting of them might - and I mean MIGHT - help you if the infighting between Cacos and Sarges goes bad. But yeah, usually you end up with 20 health after E4M1.
Hence why it's also a good map. Romero was aware of E4M1, and designed pistol start to be feasible.

>>379606854
Havent played Doom 2 but hope it isnt some shitty serious sam like this thread is making it seem to be. Doom was perfect, gave it a complete, real play for the first time recently and the level design makes it stand out from other shooter easily, even today.

>>379608347
If you don't enjoy D2 try Duke Nukem 3D. After playing Doom and Doom mods for months I found DN3D to be very fresh and exciting.

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>>379608347
>Havent played Doom 2
Play it at once.

>>379571825
That is the best Doom map of all time. John Romero is redeemed.

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>>379604869

>>379578871
ohmygah is this real??!!

>>379605193

They intentionally make her look weird to try and keep waifufags away.

it didn't work

>>379610118
He likes collecting gas station memorabilia

>>379610297
Does he steal it from work???!!

>>379610448
Yes.

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>>379605180
>>379606482

Pit is one of Peterson's worst acid trip abortions. It's complete garbage that looks and plays like something made by someone screwing around with the editor for the first time and you're out of your fucking mind for thinking otherwise.

>>379607261
Subtle directions are fine and all, but sometimes just exploring a big open map can be nice too. It's not like every other map is like that. You can tackle monsters in the open in any order from any angle. And then you just chek all buildings one by one. And it's not THAT big so you shouldn't get lost even on your first time. And on consequent playthroughs it should be even easier.
I dunno. I finished Doom 2 fully only once and don't remember all the levels. But this certanly wouldn't be the one I would dread to replay on my next playthrough.

>>379595956
>Sandy Peterson made the best Doom levels
I'm gonna take this bait.

>offensively ugly use of textures
>potato tier simplistic shapes and geometry
>retardedly spread out morsels of health and ammo plastered over the whole map
>boring mobs of one single enemy type
>huge mobs of low level enemies that become a chore to fight
>little room to maneuver, forces you to constantly hug walls

Sandy's levels are the antithesis of what Doom stands for, in many ways they are more similar to modern shooters than classic Doom. This is not a good thing.

>>379596054
Nice. You have some signed plastic wrap and a copy of Quake.

I like The Pit. Except for that part where you pick up the rocket launcher and the walls open to reveal a million hitscanners that shred you apart. Fuck that.

>>379596054
uuuu

>>379610682
pit's gameplay is fucking fantastic. you just happen to be a gigantic fucking pleb. it's okay, don't worry about.

>>379571825
It's not the worst doom map of all time if you make effective use of quick save.

Why do you guys hate Brutal Doom, without mentioning the creator?

>>379571825

was it explained why Doomguy can quicksave?

>>379612717
>fucks with the delicate balance of the way the monsters behave, how much damage they deal out, how quick they die, etc.
>zombies go from cannon fodder to the most lethal enemies, able to kill you within 7 or 8 attacks from extreme range
>flying enemies and zombies can dodge to avoid projectiles, maknig you use bullets in order to not waste your rockets or plasma on shots that they'll just dodge
>fall damage was added in some of the newest versions
>poorly optimized with lots of unused code, resulting in shitty performance

Also, the fanbase is shitty.
>underage kids that saw BD videos on YouTube and decided it looked 1337 because of the gore and le fuck yourself button
>hipsters that pride themselves on playing a 20 year old game while refusing to play that game in its original intended state
>talk shit about Vanilla Doom in defense of BD, calling it outdated and boring and insisting that BD is the real Doom experience
>hostile to other mod developers, perceive other gameplay mods as competition to BD

>>379612717
It just makes me want to play vanilla instead

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>>379612717
>Why do you guys hate Brutal Doom, without mentioning the creator?
Instead, allow me to ignore that request entirely and instead post this image so I can have a laugh.

>>379613296
god he's such a faggot

>>379612967
>fucking retarded 09er talking like he knows a god damn thing about doom
kill yourself retard

>>379612717
>without mentioning the creator
Not wanting to show support for some faggot is an entirely valid reason to avoid something.
>appropriates other peoples' assets without giving them credit
>used to list himself as the only guy working on the project despite multiple other modders assisting him
>attempted to include sprites edited out of real photographs of gore and dead bodies until he was talked out of it
>needlessly edgy, basically Shadman if Shadman ended up as a mod developer instead of an "artist"

>>379613547
>*shitpost*
u 1st kiddo

Monster Condo was a creepy map

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>>379598191
>MetaDoom
My melanin enriched person

>>379606197
the chasm is a great fucking map with cool secrets, architecture, and overall is just a really fucking cool gimmick in general but people here have a hateboner for peterson

>>379613116

This. I even like Brutal Doom is small doses, but the moment you go back to vanilla you appreciate how much fucking better Doom is when it's just Doom.

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>>379608347
>there are people in this so called "video game" board that have not played possibly one of the best games conceived by man-kind
nigger what the FUCK are you doing with your so called "life"

>>379614804
Love the cast of monsters. The Summoners are a great addition. I stopped playing doom for a while, but started again with V4 of this came out.

https://youtu.be/gZlpcixe3Dw

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>>379575000
Tried this map hardest difficulty, so damn hard.

>>379605997
it's alright once you know where to go, and there's a nice contrast from the first part of the level with the more hellish architeture

I think the SNES version of Doom cut out the worst levels, because that's the ideal Episode 2 for me, coincidentally it's the shortest chapter in that version of the game.

>>379606197
The Pit is great, and the level that follows it is even better feeling-wise

>>379606404
Music alone makes it GOAT

dont be mad because you cant beat it

>>379607143
>has to literally shoot at the fucking door to progress, go to some shitty open area where the Yellow key is literally just sitting somewhere, take the blue key and leave
You know, I think we might have a winner

>>379607172
Episode 4 is Earth taken over by the demons, except it literally just looks like Hell except with a different skybox

I don't think they cared about what kind of structures they were attempting to recreate with Doom 2 other than the city levels, what the hell is the first level supposed to be? What is The Pit? How does the maps between Gotcha and Ring of Death supposed to represent the demon-infested Starport? The game doesn't even look like hell once you're in it

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>water hurts you on this level, but the green water doesn't
>now water DOESN'T hurt you, and neither does lava, but don't touch this green poison water
>THIS lava hurts you but this THAT lava doesn't
WTF IS THE LOGIC TO THIS. WHO DO I BLAME, MAP DEVS OR ID?????

>>379575826
actually ive played it for the first time, and while i haven't gotten far and my first experience has been with the newest patch i don't really see whats so wrong about it. you can go at a fun pace but its hard as fuck

>>379619750
Plutttonnniaaaaa!!!!!

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>>379619750
>Maps that make heavy use of having to backtrack along damage floors with limited radsuits.

>>379618471
Nice

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>>379619750
>that section in Industrial Zone where you jump down a hole that's full of poison water, go down a hallway with a arachnatron waiting for you, only for the tunnel to lead you straight into the chasm in the middle of the level where you have to run for your life to get the teleport, with the structure of the building that's in the middle of the chasm being designed to make going from A to B waste as much time as possible

>>379580381
I think the maps in TFC are just in the wrong order because the difficulty is all over the place. I don't mind the episode itself. It's better than Shores of Hell.

Does anyone here play Master Levels of Doom II? I played it in the Playstation version of Final Doom, but never the full version on PC, seems rather overlooked

I remember liking the Pit, though it maybe because it had the best track in doom 2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkhCNx-8Qos

Most of the city styled maps though, I hated. Industrial Zone also, that one had a problem with chaingunners a super far distance away from you.

>>379621336
I'm pretty sure that I hate every single level in Doom2. Music is good but I can hear that in TNT.

Ultimate > Plutonia > TNT > D44M > Doom3 > Doom II

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>That Plutonia map that starts with a chaingunner behind the spawn.

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>>379571825
No level in Doom, Doom 2, TNT or Plutonia gave me as much trouble as this one. Not even the Arch maze. My issue was that I always try to kill everything, and turns out you can run out of ammo if you're only using shotguns. Health was a big issue also.
I had to save every two steps in there, later levels were a breeze compared to this. I had to make the shotgun zombies in front attack that horde and I barely made it through with like 5 shells.

>>379622849
Hatred is a map that forces you down paths that lead to high damage enemies with no room to avoid them and most of the level is a pit of lava. Hunted is just full of enemies that can't even damage you if you simply move behind a wall and even at a pistol start you get literally the best weapon to use against them. Bu of course it has to throw you a curveball and give you a binary choice between getting torn to shreds or moving to the next map. But still it's probably the easiest map in the megawad.

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>>379571825
>pay respects

>>379605446
>Those legs
BAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH

>>379621864
Industrial Zone is not THAT bad, it gets better after you cross the chasm where you're just finding your way through hallways

Suburbs is the epitomy of Lazy, losing only to The Courtyard, and the very last section of Tenements where you have to do that stupid shit where you're running from one end of a hallway to another activating doors and then they decided to put another hallway in for you to run back and forth, putting Chaingunners right next to the fucking exit.

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>>379623629

f

>>379623629
F

>>379613296
He really credited himself for everything? Wow.

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>>379623629
>tfw no wad that uses the original source files to make a high-res version of the original doom textures

>>379624062
Ooooh now I get it.
I always thought it was some monolithic, bigass building, but it's a city's entrance with a warped perspective.
Fucking graphics man.

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>>379623629
F, rest in puppers Daisy.

>>379621823
I am playing Final Doom now, and was curious about Master Levels too.

>>379622682
That 'Onslaught'? Plutonia has so many hard-starts... kind of gimmicky but, eh. Fun levels for the most part.

>>379623828
The fact the chasm exists at all with the enemy placements it uses bins to whole map. It always seems the worst maps tend to have large stretches of open terrain or huge chasms with nothing breaking them up.

>>379623629
F

>>379624273
It doesn't help that none of the buildings save the one inthe middle dont have windows

>>379624341
Is there a Deus Ex inspired mod for Doom?

>>379624846
Not that I'm aware of, but I wouldn't be surprised.

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>>379623629
we did it all for you, Daisy

>all for you

>>379581326
>Factory
>Suburbs
>Citadel
>Bad

>Not even mentioning Barrels o Fun