Was he a better Big Boss than the real Big Boss?

>>379322275
yes, he could take 4 rockets to the face while Big Boss lost to a naked Solid Snake who had a can of Axe and a lighter

>>379322275
Because the real Big Boss was just a meme that Venom lived up to. Naked Snake was a bitch.

Solid"Hard Life"Snake still the GOAT.

>>379322401

How old and worn out would Big Boss be by MG2?

No, Venomfags are literally the most delusional idiots in the MGS fanbase. Big Boss has done what Venom did numerous times, Big Boss even showed some retarded super-human strength in Peace Walker. Venomfags are just self-insertfags who think Venom is a better character because they were Venom.

>>379322275
I wanna say no, maybe at first yes, but the moment ocelot left him he let kaz turn him into a fucking monster. However much of a manipulative bitch big boss turned into, he always did what he wanted. Venom needed to seek guidance too much, whether it was from ocelot or from kaz.

>>379322537
always wondered why killing a bunch of over the hill soldiers was considered such an achievement, fitness is pretty essential to be effective in combat which is why older soldiers rarely serve on the frontline and instead plan strategies.

>>379322718
hey look, BB defense force arrived

>>379322704
Worn enough to die to some makeshift flamethrower I guess.

>>379322275
Venom has more grit than bb why did he turn out to be the medic man....

>>379322704
Venom was 63 when he was killed, and Big Boss was 64 in MG2 and have body armor and a machine gun

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>>379322275
I fucking love the idea of Venom _____-type characters
pic related was my favorite Char clone

What do you mean "the real big boss?" You sound retarded

I only got up to the bit when you get Mother Base for the first time, did I miss something?

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Yeah, because he had best girl backing him up

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>>379323223
You're gonna feel like an asshole in a few minutes

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>>379323256
but that's not Chris Jenner

>>379322798
Because he killed a bunch of over the hill soldiers + sneaking through an entire Soviet-controlled area, defeated Volgin in one-on-one combat, and destroyed the Shagohod. Plus, he did this all while he was injured (he left on Operation Snake Eater only a week after getting BTFO by The Boss in the Virtuous Mission) with a one week time limit.

>>379322275
No, to be honest Venom's deeds are a lot less impressive than what Big Boss did.
The skulls and Sahelantropus were really lame.

>>379323547
Still, Venom still managed to do it all while he had over a hundred pieces of shrapnel embedded in his chest and head

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>>379322275
>Was he a better Big Boss than the real Big Boss
Because he cared for his most loyal subordinate

>>379323223
You should leave.

>>379323840
oh god what the fuck

So we can agree that Venom did nothing wrong?

>>379324428
He did literally everything wrong, what are you saying? He wasn't literally playing to zeros script while kaz and ocelot pulled his strings, then got dropped by ocelot and left in the hands of kaz and became a piece of shit. He may not have been a bad person, but he made like every wrong choice possible.

>>379322275
Was he, dare I say, a *bigger* boss?

>>379324636
Was*

>>379324685
For you

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>>379324636
Name 3 bad choices and the context in which it was bad

>>379324636
He completed his mission

>>379325348
Allowing kaz to rile HIS men up to the point of paranoia and causing them to completely drift away from what the whole PF is supposed to be.

Letting liquid on his base and giving him endless amounts of chances despite how irredeemable that little cunt was. Having so little foresight that he kept treating him like a misguided child instead of the warmongering killer he was.

Taking Huey back instead of killing him, causing the near destruction of his own base, again.

Blowing up mfinda oilfield literally causes the Kikongo virus to spread out into the water to begin with.

I can keep goin If you want

>>379326257
If he hadn't spared Liquid and Huey, he would've created a TIME PARADOX

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>>379326451
ALL FOR REVENGE

>>379322781
At least Venom didn't piss himself

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>It's been 16 years since the last proper Metal Gear

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>>379326693
REEE HE WAS BEING ELECTROCUTED

>>379322275
If Venom is a Big Brother pawn, who does that make Kaz?

Did any base in MGSV come close to be being as good as Camp Omega? The oil field was kind of interesting and that house in the corner of Africa was sort of cool, I guess.

>>379323547
Sahelanthropus was the ultimate metal gear. Retarded as the lore is, that's the truth. Plus all those other missions Venom whored himself out for

>>379326257
>rile the men up
Couldn't be helped. Cyber was literally everywhere and big bosses closest most trusted men pre ground zero betrayed him. You're just not considering what that's like arming new recruits with weapons that could be used against you.

Venom underestimated liquid just like big boss underestimated solid. Not saying it's right but he was a fucking kid. You're holding that against him because you have future knowledge of his potential risk and not treating him like the child he is like what everyone else was doing.

He took in emerich to interrogate him. Emerich only became dangerous because there were cypher spies in the base that have him parasites to use.

And the mfinda oil field was polluting the neighbouring villages with crude. Diamond dogs were contracted to put a stop to it. Why are you bringing up things that escalated as if they even fucking knew about it to begin with. Is this autism.

>>379327116
Mission 30 has OKB Zero, where you go to meet Skull Face

>>379327158
Zero...I'm BURNING UUUUUUUP

>>379326980
So was Quiet

>>379327267
>Cyber
You're going to die someday and this is all I'll remember you by

>>379327267
they were being played by xof the whole time. Theyre bad decisions whether u wanna treat venom like he DINDU or not.

>>379322275
Uh guys?
I just logged into MGSV and there is a Ford F150 Truck sitting on my Mother Base.

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>>379328452
Don't remember me at all asshole. I'm anonymous for a reason.

>>379328545
Well xof ended up playing themselves.

Why the fuck was Kaz involved with foxhound?

>>379327116
OKB Zero

Codetalker Mansion

Oil Refinery

I forgot the name but it's the base Huey was rescued from.

Mother Base in the invasion mission.

The ruins from the Honeybee mission.

>>379329291
Seriously? Take a screenshot then.

>>379331016
OKB felt empty to me. It's supposed to be some super secret weapon designing facillity, but all you see is some gates, a couple of tanks some barracks which contain materials and the helipad.
Why was OKB a secret then? There's nothing interesting.
Why

>>379322781
So just like a person with brain damage?

>>379331313
I guess the secret stuff was in the last section that you barely see. That's the only explanation that suspends my disbelief.

>>379322537
>Naked snake was a bitch
Absolute retard. Venom was a literal clone with no identity trying to live up to Jacks legend. He did everything exactly as Naked would have, which is why the twist didn't matter.

>>379331016
If you combined two or three of these together they might be good. Individually they're just mildly better than the average outpost.

>>379326726
>MGSV isn't a proper metal gear

>>379331724
>venom was a literal clone
interesting. who is venom exactly? tell me more, anon.

>>379322275
He was less of an asshole at least

>>379331724
>Venom is a literal clone
No, that would be David, Eli, and Solidus

>>379331748
They were all fantastic I don't know what people are on about when they say Camp Omega was better than anything in MGSV. The forest leading to the mansion and the waterfall on the other end alone blew camp omega out of the fucking water. That entire mission to get code talker was stellar and the ONLY thing that could have made it better was a subsistence mode where you were forced to on-site proc and had to drive out instead of heli-out.

>>379332201
A memetic clone of Big Boss aka Jack aka Naked Snake. He truly believed up until the very end that he WAS Jack. What makes you think he's better than him when all hes doing is trying to be exactly like him because he actually believes he IS him?

>>379331724
wait what? I thought naked snake was big boss, and also the protagonist of MGSV was big boss too.

can someone explain the timeline? who is venom?

>>379322401

Graphical limitations and all. That or Solid Snake is just that good. Reminds me of when Riddick killed a guy with a teacup.

>>379332445
Read the post above you. The twist really doesn't matter. Venom Snake is Naked Snake aka Big Bosses "Closest subordinate" [Self insert] Who was deliberately brainwashed by Zero to believe he was Jack (Naked Snake/ Big Boss). Jack or the REAL big boss didn't know this until a month before venom woke up and was already fully molded how Zero wanted him, so he was forced into hiding and confiding in Ocelot who would put Venom on the right path to defeating skullface and keeping the heat away from him while he built Outer Heaven.

>>379332445
Since you're so eager to know.
Venom (MgsV protag) is one of Big Boss' soldiers, the medic in the chopper from Ground Zeroes.
He went through extensive plastic surgery and was brainwashed into thinking he was Big Boss.
At the end of MgsV, he has a flashback and remembers who he truly is, and listens to a tape from the real Snake telling him the truth

>>379332509
Big Boss is in his 60s in MG2 and Snake is in his 20s, it's not much of a stretch to see how after a long and protracted battle Snake would win with the same sheer cunning Big Boss would use himself.

Kojima royally fucked up by not having the final 3rd of the game being Metal Gear 1 from Big Boss' perspective, with the final boss fight being against Snake himself. The twist could've remained, but the end would finally closed the series and brought things full circle. Ah well, at least it's better than 4

>>379333539
Kojima didn't have much of a choice after what a Konami did to him

>>379332652
>>379332707
ah I see. I got tired of MGSV and never finished it. I am pretty ambivalent about this plot twist.

>>379333539
>Borderline unwinnable fight with SS, lose and get the standard ending
>Bonus non canon ending if you actually manage to beat SS

>>379322275
Venom is the real big boss to me

Did MGO2 ever come back? I heard a couple months ago some guys made a workaround to get a server running again.

Post Snake rankings

Solid>Venom>Naked>Liquid>Solidus

Metal Gear 1 and 2 remake never ever

>>379334715
Venom>Naked>Solid>Solidus>Liquid

>>379334449
It's running on CFW and is planned to release on OFW June 12th.

>No game starring Big Boss building Outer Heaven
But at least Metal Gear Survive is coming, AMIRITE guys?
Ha,haha,AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>379323256
what happened to quiet in the future?

>>379322275

The entire point of the MGS prequels is that Big Boss is a fucking hack fraud whos legend was artificially created

Why was Liquid so fucking unkillable?

>>379336271
Superior genes

>>379336072
No one knows.
Maybe she died.
Maybe she's still out there somewhere.

>>379335367
Yeah which I plan on buying and there's nothing you can do about it. I'll even buy an extra copy on all platforms availble just for you.

>>379334053
Just be glad you found out this way, it is much stupider if you find this out by playing the game. (fuck cassette tapes, and fuck kojima)

>>379336271
British accent

>>379336940
SILENCE KONAMI DRONE

Nanomachines, son,

I know about the whole 'he had a cold' thing affecting Hayters voice itself, but how come he was never able to match the range, depth and delivery of his MGS1 performace? The prison codec lines were great.

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>>379334715
>>379334910
Solid>Solidus>Venom>Liquid>BB

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>>379322275
He's definitely cuter

I liked this scene at least.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqXZ2eRqHds

>>379334715
>>379334910
Ranking Solidus this low?
He was the only guy with his head straight, literally did nothing wrong. He was the good guy

>>379322275
He was certainly more sentimental. But ultimately he gave up his identity to be Big Boss Jr. and by proxy (regardless of how sincerely he was invested in Outer Heaven's goals) turned out to be a huge cunt. So he was really the same shit. In terms of skill set they were basically the same.
>>379333539
>Kojima royally fucked up by not giving me tasteless redundant fanservice
Cool. MGSV's story and a lot of its game design are a mess, but it's more than "full circle" enough. The series never needed to come full circle anyway: we know what happens.

>>379334836
Good. Remakes are a bad idea.

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Man, I want another MGSV game featuring the further adventures of Venom Boss.
Move them to South America, South Asia, Eastern Europe or something. A dense jungle full of bases, outposts and shit.
You already have the engine and the code, Konami. Stop being lazy

>>379334715
Solidus>Naked>Solid>Venom>Liquid

ruse

>>379331997
It isn't

>>379330242
Same reason Big Boss becames the leader.

He connects ties of Diamond Dogs with the US, then eventually abandons the PMC business and retires into being a consultant for Foxhound rookies

>>379344857
your hurt fee fees are not an argument, it's as much a metal gear game as any other

it's amazing that MGR gets more credit as a metal gear game than V does

>>379331724
He was more of a perfect copy than a clone.

>>379345140
MGR is more Metal Gear because of how over the top wacky it gets. MGSV just seems too serious

>>379322401
But it was venom snake in mg1

>>379323840
WOOOOOOH
IVE GOT SOMETHING IN MY THROOOOAT

>>379322275
>Cobra unit blew themselves up
>The Boss let him win
>Peace Walker sunk itself
>Ground Zeroes was a ruse

What did Big Boss do right? His little 300 man army got destroy because he's an idiot. Meanwhile, Venom built his own army with 3500 soldiers spread across 5 bases, got revenge on Skullface, and put Huey on a raft.

The only thing Big Boss did was strip Venom of his army and throw him on his shitty little base with D Rank soldiers like Shoot-gunner and Coward Duck. And then lost to Solid Snakes hair spray before commiting suicide after pulling the plug on a paralyzed brain dead old man who still considered him a friend. What a worthless human being, how many times does he betray his own soldiers and run off?

>>379345789
Fyi Big Boss could've gotten more than 300 if the Peace Walker mechanics let him

>>379334715
Solid>Naked>Solidus>Venom>Liquid

But even putting Liquid as the lowest, I still like him.

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So was his name John or Jack?

>>379346245
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_(given_name)

In English Jack is traditionally used as the diminutive form of John, though it is now also a proper name in its own right.

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>>379341454
>Yfw they were humming the peace Walker theme

>>379341943
>remakes for unplayable game = Bad

>>379346990
>MG1 and MG2 are unplayable
Get a load of this turbo-teen.

He's just like a lifeless robot. The real Big Boss gets triggered into all these philosophical debates and has a fetish for high quality modded guns

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Top 10 anime couples

>>379347135
Im sorry but not everyone could sit through bullshit gameplay with story retcons here and there

>>379322781
>nice Ocelot leading a nice meme Big Boss results in a base that actually does some good for the world
Maybe they should have let the real BB die.

>>379347335
You could say he's...a phantom

>>379347615
I don't think they have "bullshit gameplay" (though they have bullshit moments like every Metal Gear game) but either way you already know what happens in the story. Remakes would be almost entirely pointless.

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>Put Ocelot in the game
>Never give him any time to shine in a fight
>His only purpose is to spout exposition, be super nice,torture Huey, and have a Texas accent

>>379348221
>Baker's shitty inconsistent accent
Nothing worse than going back to the earlier games and hearing how good Ocelot used to sound, the lack of gun action just made it all even worse.

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Is this ranking correct?

>>379348560
You! You leave Troy alone!

>>379348695
Hard to tell what's going on here

>>379348221
>>379348560
It really disappoints me that the majority of people forgot what the point of Ocelot was and only remembered him as an eccentric cowboy meme. He was faithful to who he was revealed to be in MGS4.

>>379349092
You're pretty good

>>379336543
BBC genetics

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>>379340081
Is he a top or bottom?

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How do we go from this...

>>379349092
The real actual Ocelot only appears in MGS4 for like 5 minutes before he dies after getting beaten so bad his nanomachines malfunction. The other 99% he's Liquid

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>>379349540
To THIS?

>>379349562
>Metal gear solid 2-Liquid Ocelot has his Liquid British voice
>Mgs4-Liquid Ocelot has old man Ocelot voice
What was meant by this?

>>379322275
>You will build an army for me like a good fuckboi while I will chill out somewhere far away and I will get all the credit for it lmao
Fuck real Big Boss
And fuck Kojima for ruining his character

>>379323108
Got any more examples? I love them too

>>379322275
haha this game was so shit I couldn't even finish it half way

>>379349851
>he expected big boss to end up as anything but a villainous asshole despite the very first two games in the series showing him to be a villainous asshole
You have literally nobody to blame for his "ruined" character but yourself.

>>379349562
And that's the point. There was enough of the real Ocelot to know he's relatively just a normal guy who loved Big Boss with all his heart and did everything he could to pass on his mother's legacy. Even if it meant doing some really horrible shit and brainwashing himself into committing a lot of it.
MGSV Ocelot is that person. You could also debate that MGS3 showed his true side as well but more immature. You saw it in the plane during his fight with Big Boss. That encounter was solely to indulge himself.
The only issue is that Troy's accent fucked up from time to time. You didn't have those sort of issues with his Jap VA. There are even some differences in the translation which make somewhat of a difference in some scenes. But there is so much dialog it's really not worth going through all of it to see the inconsistencies.

>>379349851
*Konami

>>379349965
> the first two games
you fucking nerd

>>379349894
It's speculated that Jensen in Mankind Divided is a clone, but nobody cares and we'll never find out.

>>379349620
By firing kojima and not letting him finish his game which raked in substantial profits and (would have) earned his parent company some of that sweet intangible asset we call consumer loyalty

Reminder that you probably killed D Wolf in Metal Gear.

>>379350031
Did you say "node"?

>>379349965
But he was that "cool" villain.
Have you never sympathised with a bad guy in a game before?

>>379350039
Rip. I'm thinking of re-entering fetish porn draws with a venom character. Nothing fetishy about the scars and shit, I just think they add a lot of depth. I'm a sucker for porn with backstory

>>379350217
The fan attitude to big boss went beyond sympathy and well into idol worship. MGSV did him a favor by making him do something actually disagreeable for a fucking change, and it was sorely needed.

is Venom the one that gets BTFO'd in metal gear one? Why is he a fucking retard? Why make a character who just dies hilariously in the first game?

>Big Boss/Naked is bad maymay
No.

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>>379350193
Reminder that Ocelot was involved in building Zanibar land from MG2 with the money he stashed from the Legacy.

>>379350169
>He still thinks kojima was fired

>>379350434
To fill in a plothole

>>379350020
>his heart and did everything he could to pass on his mother's legacy
There's no indication at all that Ocelot gave a shit about the Boss. He only cared about Big Boss and what Big Boss wanted.

>>379350468
Explain your conspiracy theory

>>379350567
A plothole nobody even knows or gives a fuck about

>>379350465
That reminds me, why the fuck can't we build special units/teams to deploy with?
I want a personal Ocelot unit. Also, Quiet sucks ass as an companion. Only D-Dog and D-Horse are worth anything.

>>379350567
I really like plothole fillers. Maybe it's just me.

>>379350378
I wanted him to do something bad too, but the route Kojima chose was cheap.
Big Boss could have burnt a few villages, make child soldiers fight for him, torture and execute prisoners, something really fucked up and evil.
But instead we got that shitty ending.

>>379350581
>There's no indication at all that Ocelot gave a shit about the Boss.
Did we play the same game?

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>>379350434
yeah Venom dies in MG1 and Naked ''''dies'''' in MG2

and I'd argue Big Boss's defeat in MG2 was more hilarious

>>379350449
>Big Boss/Naked is good maymay
No.
>>379350434
>>379350567
It wasn't about the plot hole; Kojima just realized that having him die during the events of MG1 allowed for Venom and MGSV's story to exist while making Venom's character somewhat self-contained.

>>379350434
Real Big Boss actually thought Venom could take Snake out. Whole thing was a ruse meant to make it look like Foxhound tried but failed to stop outer heaven. Most members like gray fox just got captured.

>>379350785
>Remember the basics of CQC
>Oh fuck

>>379350728
I know right? The could have you be Big Boss and actually become evil. The could have you betray people kill people etc but no I don't even know why this makes real Big Boss a worse character if he just sat this out and had his clone do everything

>>379350728
Are you new to MGSV or something? Kojima had him kill his own men as a teaser for killing the children in Chapter 3. That's where the clip of venom screaming whilst covered in blood comes from. It was cut from the game because Konami shareholders don't care about long term gain, only short term profits. They changed their business model to start punting out shit content - hence MGSV Survive. This is at odds with developers who don't care about profit, only about making a game that matches their vision regardless of time or money

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So we can agree with Kojima retconing Portable Ops that BB banged EVA then Ocelot before telling them to fuck off for his addiction to the battlefield, right?

>>379322275
i think he's a better post shagohod Big Boss, but MGS3 Big Boss will always be GOAT

>>379351036
All the budget went into the scene where Snake and Skull Face stare at each other in the truck

>>379350764
He was part of the Patriots, but it's made overwhelmingly clear that his motivations stemmed from an infatuation with Big Boss.

>>379350892
He was building zanzibarland at the exact same time. No one knows what he really did to get it going after he rode off with his bike but he clearly did more than just sit on his ass. Besides all the languages Big Boss speaks made him a liability with the vocal cord parasite

>>379351036
I'm not trying to defend Konami or anything here but Kojima wasted time and money on really useless features.
If you fuck around in the open world you'll notice many nice things that will also make you say "but why though"
Kojima should have focused on main story and gameplay first, and then add his little details.

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>>379350785
The only reason this is hilarious is because of the shitty deviantart picture. It looks like BB is flinching against a stream of piss, when in reality he wouldn't have time to react before his flesh melted. He does not look like a man horrifically set on fire.

>>379351453
Hindsight is 20/20. I'm sure he didn't think he'd get axed out of nowhere, as one of the games industry's legends. Hell, even with this blunder MGSV was easily GOTY for most. Don't give Kojima higher standards than you would other devs, the only game I'd consider more polished is TW3

>>379351443
No, he was building Outer Heaven. ZL came about after OH got trashed and Venom died.

>>379351483
Oh, and I forgot to follow on from this - BB's "setting on fire" was hilarious, but Quiet's wasn't? It was essentially the same thing. Except in MG2 he wasn't the one giving the light

>>379351434
It was both dude. The Patriots did not embody the philosophy of the boss. Everyone knows that. You want to know why its both? Because if it was just Big Boss Ocelot wouldn't have bothered killing himself just to take down the Patriot A.I. He would have just saved Big Boss, killed Zero, and let the world rot. Since he KNEW where Zero was before the A.I was destroyed. Destroying the A.I. was the boss's will.

>>379350728
I strongly disagree. What you're saying he could have done would have been even cheaper with how on the nose and cliché it is. It's far more thematically rich that he finally crosses the morality threshold by abandoning his principles and doing something worse than what the US government did to The Boss by allowing a man to have his identity taken from him and using him to enrich his own personal brand.

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Would he have killed Quiet?

>>379351674
Ocelot tells Miller that Big Boss is building his "new nation" at the end credits before outer heaven goes to shit. I don't think he meant the outer heaven from mg1

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>>379351483

>>379351962
Eveything Venom did would be exactly what Naked would have done given the same situation. So no.

>>379351843
He had to destroy the Patriots in order to wake up Big Boss. Big Boss himself states this before he croaks.
>>379351979
He did. Outer Heaven was a military state. The timeline even mentions Big Boss establishing Outer Heaven.

>>379351979
Zanzibar was always the height of the dream. it wasn't a second resort. BB gathered the best of the best to serve him in that compound and many who fled went to Zanzibar. Zanzibar was also set up very similarly to the mother base from PW. It even had a swedish style sauna. Zanzibar wasn't a bad place. All the kids who lived there as "child soldiers" were actually well taken care of and all the soldiers treated them like family. They all called Big Boss "Uncle One-Eye".

>>379352059
Technically untrue. Everything Venom did is what the hypothetical ideal of Big Boss would have done. The real Big Boss was deeply flawed, as evidenced by what he did in MGSV. Venom subconsciously did what he thought the great Big Boss he knew would have done, and did a lot of good as a result.

>>379352059
Wrong. Venom's hypnotherapy was cut short. It's why he feels like a shell - his limbs move as if he's BB, but his mind is only semi-conscious of what's going on.

>>379351907
It could have been presented in a better way atleast.
Whole I've awaited for some twist but when I saw the ending I said "that's it?"
We should have learned about it in the first half, and then have missions from the future when Outer Heaven was at it's peak and they were the biggest scumbags in the world.

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How is Big Boss/Naked even close to being bad?
All of his intentions are good.
>Wants to create a place where soldiers are longer puppets of war.
Sounds good to me.

>>379352480
I agree with you there, it could have been executed better. I definitely don't think having him do something as trite as killing younglings would have been a better alternative though.

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MgsV: "They're no sons of mine"
Mgs4: "Let it go, my son"

>>379352532
The method and the means to achieve that goal is what made them bad.

>>379352532
>all of his intentions are good
You know what they say about what the road to hell is paved with.

Looking back, it was pretty damn obvious Venom was a fake from the time leading up to MGSV's release. I wasn't paying attention to the speculation, did people figure it out before release or was it really a complete suprise to everyone?

>>379352312
Aaaand also wrong. Aren't you guys aware of psych experiments that study the effects of the environment on identical twins? Even if we assume V is an exact copy of BB (Again, he's really, really not - evidenced throughout the game, especially during the paz side missions), he'd act a little differently based on, I dunno, the gigantic bit of shrapnel he took to the head? His missing arm? The fact that BB set her alight whereas she tried to kill V?

>>379352242
>>379352251
I must have just got confused about outer heaven cause it had a desert and shit in MG1 but I figured that just got retconned for the MGS5 version venom built.

>>379352694
>he didn't actively avoid everything MGSV related for three years
Its like you don't even videogames

>>379352602
>"They're no sons of mine"
Naked didn't say this though.

>>379352694
A lot of people figured it out. I strongly suspected it myself but I was in heavy denial for almost the entire game simply because I didn't want to believe it.

>>379352694
The big give away was the robot arm, scars, and giant piece of metal in his head

>>379352794
Yes he did. Ocelot was even trying to get him to reconsider his stupid actions

>>379352893
>yes he did
when

>>379352730
Diamond Dogs are presumably brought on board with Outer Heaven at some point, given that Venom helps out at Outer Heaven, but both Outer Heaven and Zanzibarland are Big Boss's projects. The latter happened because the former failed.

>>379352729
How does any of that refute my post? He's brainwashed to think he's Big Boss. He acts how he thinks Big Boss would have acted. What you're saying a about experiments with twins and environment is the reason why he isn't a perfect copy of Big Boss right down to the logic.

>>379352949
Secret tapes between Ocelot and Big Boss in the hospital before the attack.

>>379349092
MGS3 Ocelot is mostly true to his real self too, he's just pretending to be Snake's enemy. I don't have a problem with him not being le crazy meme because he's literally never been a nutjob, but he's never been a boring cowboy who doesn't whip his gun out wherever possible.

>>379352949
>>379352794
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1BJTSRkyV4

>>379352694
Something always felt off about him to me in my first playthrough but I mostly figured it was because David Hayter got replaced. I thought the avatar at the beginning was for multiplayer.

>>379323223

If this isn't bait, then damn....go finish the game or look up some shit.

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Why was he such a fucking asshole?

>>379323497

>Dislocated arm
>Thrown a hundred feet into a river
>Generally all fuckered up
>Emotionally fuckered up
>Nuclear blast goes off a few hundred meters from him
>Fultons out

Goes on to kick the ass of: Skinny Russian Bitch, Cave Crab, Bee Man, Spider Man, Old Man, Space Man, Butch Bitch, Russian Lightning Man, a shitload of Russian special forces, and a tank the size of C-130.

>>379353053
Ocelot did have one cutscene of him whipping out his gun though. You also have to realize his nutjob self was a persona. He used it during interrogations so people would keep their distance. No one wants to associate with someone obsessed with torture. In reality he just saw torture as a tool and respected it for it's many sophisticated and necessary talents. This didn't stop him from enjoying the shit out of torturing Huey though You have to remember, Ocelot knew the entire time that Huey was responsible for the attack on mother base he just couldn't say it because it would blow his cover

>>379353283
>Lost his arm
>Lost his leg
>Lost his sight
>Lost his men
>Lost his home
>Lost his friends
You tell me

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>>379326257

>Taking Huey back instead of killing him, causing the near destruction of his own base, again.

In venoms defense, he couldn't kill Huey because canon dictates that Huey gets cucked to death by his son.

>>379353378
>>379353283
Kazuhira "Hide Your Kids I'm a Diddler" Miller

>>379326257
>Blowing up mfinda oilfield literally causes the Kikongo virus to spread out into the water to begin with
that's horse shit and you know it

>>379352987
What are you struggling with, friend?

>Technically untrue.
No, it's just flat out untrue. No "technicals" about it.

>Everything Venom did is what the hypothetical ideal of Big Boss would have done.
Nope. That suggests he's been fully brainwashed. He wasn't, and suffered constant hallucinations as a result of his old memories seeping through.

>The real Big Boss was deeply flawed, as evidenced by what he did in MGSV.
Irrelevant. That's got nothing to do with what makes them similar/different.

>Venom subconsciously did what he thought the great Big Boss he knew would have done
What? No? He did what he thought he would've done. He thought he himself was BB.

10/10 if that was bait though, good job.

>>379353359
That scene where he walks back into the room after everyone else has left and props up the archaea syringe under huey's leg was so fucking cold. It was the closest we got to seeing MGS1 Ocelot in the game, and it was damn close.

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>>379353283
Leave Kaz alone, he's a good boy.

>>379322718
>I want a world where soldiers are treated as humans and not tools or pawns

>Therefore I will rob my best soldier of his humanity and identity, and use him as a pawn while I'm off hiding from the badguys like a coward for literally no reason

Big Boss a shit.

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>>379348221

>Have Ocelot as a starring character on your team
>Known for being double/triple agent and fucking everyone over
>Is played entirely straight with no twist other than "I hypnotized myself to believe Venom was the real BB"

What a waste of potential, I expected so much more fuckery from him.

>>379353359
Wait what? Where did you get that spoiler info? How did he know? Even I still don't know after having gone through all the tapes. Unless I'm remembering wrong.

>>379352242
>He had to destroy the Patriots in order to wake up Big Boss. Big Boss himself states this before he croaks.
Go listen to the secret tapes in MGSV again. He talks about destroying the Patriot A.I while it's still being developed calling it a threat to humanity and that him and Big Boss need to plan to combat it. In that whole tape he's predicting what happens in MGS4 and what needs to be done to circumvent it.

>>379353601
You honestly sound like you're just repeating what I'm saying back to me and somehow wording it as a disagreement.

>>379353720
...also while I'm picking apart shit arguments, this reminds me.

Venom Snake was not BB's idea. It was Zero's, somebody BB hated. BB just ended up grudgingly playing along. He was never really the bad guy.

>Big Bitch and Venom Fag fighting for second place

Solid Snake lmaos at both their lives

>>379353359
>That first torture scene where Miller has Huey's robotic leg augment flip backwards, slowly causing a hairline fracture just before the machine broke down

>>379353884
>somehow wording it as a disagreement.
I literally copypasted what you said.

>>379353783
Ocelot brainwashed himself to believe Venom was the real Big Boss. He still knew about the information he learned from Zero. About how the base was destroyed and who lead the attack. He planned on getting his revenge on Huey from the start.

>>379336072
After speaking English on the radio to save Snake, the English parasites in her started to infest her body. She dies the same way as your men do during their infection, in the middle of the Afghanistan desert.

>>379354049
I know about the brainwashing bit, I just don't remember it being explicitly said that Huey was to blame for the attacks.

>>379353932
>BB just ended up grudgingly playing along
He did nothing grudgingly. He saw an opportunity to turn one of Zero's plans around and use it to a greater degree for his own benefit. He could have approached Venom and explained the situation at any time, but didn't do so until after the events of MGSV had already passed. He did it with no consideration for Venom whatsoever.

>>379353870
But again, he's completely on board with Big Boss and Outer Heaven and those are his sole motivations. He had a distaste for the Patriots, but the Boss herself and what she wanted is never indicated to mean much to him, at least not in comparison to his idolization of Big Boss.

>>379354225
>Parasites attack the lungs
>Quiet has no lungs to attack
She'll be fine

>>379353884
>this level of deflection
Jesus christ dude, your comment was a load of horseshit and it got called out. Don't triple down on your stupidity by claiming it's not what you said

>>379354226
No its not explicitly said. But Ocelot is quite detailed on what information he altered in his mind. I really shouldn't use the word brainwashing. It's doublethink and that's actually different.

>>379353720
Big Boss only woke up like a week before Venom and all the plans were in motion already. Then the hospital gets massacred and he goes out of his way to protect Venom. He could've easily escaped that hospital solo given his skills

>>379333539
4 is the best in the series though

>>379353932
He still played along though like a little hypocritical bitch. He had no reason to keep the ruse up. Who was he supposed to be hiding from? Skullface who proved to be almost no threat at all when he wasn't blindsiding you? Zero who had no intentions or harming him in the first place? The rest of the world/government who had no problem with him?

>He was never really the bad guy

That's right, he was just a submissive passive coward, a far cry from the descent into villainy and demonhood that Kojimbles promised us. One day I hope something disappoints me more than MGSV did so I'm not constantly reminded of the feeling every time I browse /v/.

>>379322275
MGS V is like that final test at school that you needed a 90 on to get an A on the class but you end up getting an 89 and the teacher doesn't bump you

it's good but had kojima just gotten it a little together it could have been great

>>379354306
>But again, he's completely on board with Big Boss and Outer Heaven and those are his sole motivations.
You missed the fact that Big Boss didn't know what to do and Ocelot gave him all those suggestions and a means of escape? About the only thing Big Boss was absolutely firm on was the treatment of his "kids" and Ocelot wasn't even really happy about that either. Ocelot's entire motif is coming up with this long ass overly complicated plans in order to justify his means. He even talks about finding Zero not for Big Boss's sake but so the Patriot A.I. can be stopped.

>>379354357
>he goes out of his way to protect Venom

Because he needed his pawn to win the game obviously.

>>379354240
Yes, grudgingly. It's like when one picks up a bill off the floor in public, unsure of whether or not the person who dropped it is round the corner. That's an opportunity. It's certainly not the equivalent to pickpocketing someone's wallet, which is what zero did.

>>379348695
Most of us can't read moonrunes

>>379354437
Big Boss being a hypocrite is nothing new. Solid Snake calls him as much in MG2.

>>379354046
I'm talking about how your responses are completely inconsequential to my own. Venom's brainwashing and vestigial former personality make him act like he thinks Big Boss would act, not the way Big Boss actually acts. Everything else you've said reads like inane semantics.

>>379354326
Suck a dick.

So if beating the boss earned naked the title of big boss, does that mean solid is something like bigger boss or biggest boss after he beat both naked and venom?

Anyone know why Big Boss pissed himself when the XOF guys were right near him and Venom in the hospital? It drew attention and almost screwed up the whole plan

>>379354536
That's not grudging, that's just caution and opportunism. Big Boss expresses no remorse over what he did at all.

>>379354730
Completely Erect Cock

>>379354730
No. Solid Snake got his codename long before the Outer Heaven incident.

>>379354742
He didn't. He was laying on a busted IV bag

>>379353746
>>379353746
But that WAS the twist anon

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Venom > BB

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>>379354453

This is the exact thought that gave birth to /r/neverbegameover and Caramel.

They can't let it go, it's only a chapter away from wrapping everything up and tying everything up with a neat ribbon and a few twists that they just can't imagine that it's over.

They'll create conspiracy theories, and include billion dollar companies, and crazy medical doctors, into their narrative that there's something more beyond the veil to push that grade up a little higher.

But they're wrong, they're so fucking wrong.

>>379354609
Your only response is literally "I don't understand". Is english your first language?
If so, get out of here. No point being here if you're too afraid to have your argument challenged. What I said was perfectly coherent - and even if it wasn't, you'd be able to give examples as to why. Not just "U-uh it doesn't make sense to me"

Tell you what though, you'd make a great politican. Their job is to pretend they don't understand criticism.

>>379354742
>>379354878
>after all this time someone still doesn't get Kojima's "well planned" joke in that scene

sad desu

>>379348939
>>379354541
1. Ocelot
2. Quiet
3. Venom Snake
4. Big Boss
5. D-Dog
6. Kazuhira Miller

Buddies:
1. D-Dog
2. Quiet
3. D-Horse
4. D-Walker

wait, so is the Big Boss in MG1 and MG2 actually Venom? if not, when else does Venom show up?

>>379354764
It is.

>>379354510
>and Ocelot gave him all those suggestions and a means of escape?
Big Boss following Ocelot's lead in this instance doesn't erase their entire dynamic. Ocelot makes it clear he's ultimately just supporting Venom as a roundabout way of helping Big Boss get his vision in order.

>>379355038
>Your only response is literally "I don't understand". Is english your first language?
It's ironic that you ask that, because you seem incapable of understanding what I'm actually saying.

>>379345429
Exactly.
The Axe and a lighter was MG2

>>379355164
Only the one in mg1 is venom. Solid Snake killed venom with a lighter. Mg2 was the real big boss

>>379355170
It's really not.

>grudging
>ɡrʌdʒJŋ
>adjective
>given or allowed only reluctantly or resentfully, "a grudging apology"
There was no indication of any kind of reluctance in Big Boss' use of Venom.

>>379355170
No. Shit analogy that doesn't work.

>>379355164
MG1 BB is Venom
MG2 BB is Naked

>>379354609
>Venom's brainwashing and vestigial former personality make him act like he thinks Big Boss would act, not the way Big Boss actually acts.

...no mate, you're tripping yourself up. Venom doesn't think anything, he's literally had Big Boss's memories put in him. For all intents and purposes, he's Big Boss. Those memories are his. He's not trying to decipher them, or consciously assess how his supposed idol would act.

>>379355164
Venom is mg1, real bb is mg2

>>379355164
Metal gear 1-Venom
Metal gear 2-Big Boss

>>379355164
Venom is in Metal Gear as Big Boss' body double

Big Boss reveals himself in Metal Gear 2, gets burned to "death" by Solid Snake using Axe Body Spray and a lighter, then returns in Metal Gear Solid 4 for a whole 5 minutes because he was really in a nanomachine-induced coma.

>>379355313
Memories aren't personality. He's subconsciously interpreting those memories and applying them distinctly differently to how Big Boss would have. Subconscious thought is still thought.

>>379355173
"you seem incapable of understanding what I'm actually saying."

Deflection number 3. Or 4? I've lost count, getting pretty bored of you desu

"you'd be able to give examples as to why."

Still waiting on those examples.

>>379355172
I wasn't suggesting their dynamic is erased anon. I'm just telling you Ocelot isn't helping create Outer Heaven for the reason you think. EVA and Ocelot are working together right now. The same EVA that was completely against Outer Heaven and for enacting the Boss's will. In MGS4 EVA is even saying Ocelot and her want the same thing.

All of this wasn't just to save Big Boss and let him do whatever the fuck he pleased. It was to save him from himself. To give him the chance to do the right thing and what the boss truly wanted of him. This is the entire point.

>>379355491
You've had your examples and you issued pointless non-arguments in response. Go back over them and actually read them this time.

>>379353359
I said I know he's not a nutjob, it's just a persona he puts on to fool people. Anyone who couldn't see that as soon as MGS1 finished wasn't paying attention. What I said that he's never been Troy Baker on tranqs. He's an interesting, eccentric guy. I don't get that with MGSV Ocelot at all.

>>379355268
Again, it's odd that you seem to lack the understanding of what it is I'm actually saying.

>>379355583
Okay.

Does anyone have the video where Kiefer Sutherland talks and the video shows footage of him doing stupid shit in between the footage of him talking about his role in MGSV

>>379355474
Psych degree here.

>Memories aren't personality.
Memories form your personality.

>Subconscious thought is still thought.
Absolute and utter shit. That's pre-50s psychology right there.

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>>379355551
He was more eccentric in MGS3. He really had no reason to be bouncing off the walls when he not acting under his cover persona. Being on Mother Base was practically like taking a break for him compared to the shit he had to do 24/7 for the KGB. But I know what you mean. It would have been nice to see him do some silly shit. But being chill is perfectly fine too. He also showed some character in the animal descriptions.

>>379355745
So are you saying that Venom acts exactly like Big Boss despite approaching situations from a far more empathetic point of view than Big Boss ever did?

>>379355543
There is no way Ocelot could have predicted Big Boss's change in disposition and zero indication he wanted it to change. Ocelot was in full support of Big Boss's vision in MGSV, and there's nothing to suggest this ever changes.

>>379355583
>>379355474
>>379354609
>>379353884
>>379352987
>>379352312

Venom thinks he's BB. He does not think he's emulating BB. Was that whole thread really necessary? I've never seen such a desperate attempt at damage control.

>>379355845
No, this is what I said:

Psych degree here.

>Memories aren't personality.
Memories form your personality.

>Subconscious thought is still thought.
Absolute and utter shit. That's pre-50s psychology right there.

>>379355793
Yeah I wish we got more of this type of thing. Giving him a few good tapes where he talks about the weird shit he likes would have gone a long way to bridge the gap for me. Sucking out the quirkiness from the series was a problem with MGSV overall though, it's just Ocelot who suffered the most for it.

>>379355845
Joking aside, Venom has both his own memories and that of BB's. So no.

>>379322275
He was a good man who tried to live up to The Boss' dream while the real Big Boss was a prick who didn't give a shit about her.

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>>379322275
Yes. That was the point. The real Big Boss was a war criminal and war junkie obsessed with stupid ideas that ultimately were just means to justify his endless hunger for war. Venom was the "ideal" Big Boss, how people perceived him to be. Unsurprisingly he eventually discovered that it was impossible for him to live up to that ideal because of what the real man actually was. Why is this question even being asked today, I don't know.

>>379355930
Holy shit, I was never saying he thought he was emulating Big Boss. I was saying that he doesn't behave like the real Big Boss because he's interpreting Big Boss' memories uniquely due to his unique circumstances. This entire thing has been unnecessary, yes, because people have been arguing against a point I wasn't making.

>Be me
>Hot Russian Major that all the ladies love
>Never knew my real mother
>Or did I?
>No not really, I don't think
>I can twirl guns really well and meow like a cat
>John Rambo knocks me on my ass
>But sweeps me off my feet
>I'm secretly a triple agent
>So I guess we're allies but not really?
>I don't even know at this point I'm tripping balls from all this brainwashing
>Rambo kills my boss
>He's just so sugoi, ne?
>Find out my husbando was put in a coma
>Help him out when he wakes
>Except that it wasn't really him, I knew all along, and I'm actually a triple agent again
>Got him
>Husbando's clones fuck shit up
>I stick with the one that looks like David Bowie
>Get my hand cut off by Solid's gay ninja lover
>He kills Bowie after I try getting that fag to press the "start" button
>Peace the fuck out with Liquid's hand
>Carry on my husbando's legacy
>Attach that filthy arm I found because why not?
>I'm actually Liquid
>BUT WAIT
>I WAS JUST PRETENDING TO BE RETARDED
>Fight an aged clone of my husbando armed with a genetic time bomb placed in him by the sister of his gay ninja boyfriend
>I'm equally confused as I am dead

>>379355845
They have similar goals but different ways of getting there

>>379356316

Yeah, just about.

>>379356316
>RUSSIAN major
>Has 3 different American accents

>>379356002
Yes, memories form your personality, but memories are not inherently personality. Big Boss' memories in Venom resulted in Venom's personality. Big Boss' memories in Big Boss resulted in Big Boss. Memory and personality aren't one and the same.

Maybe "thought" was the wrong word, I will admit to that. Regardless, there are subconscious processes that take identical factors and produce a different individual.

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>>379356316

Thank you for making me feel retarded for unironically loving metal gear.

>>379356316

Fuck, this would be an amazing anime.

>>379356441
Ocelot was never truly Russian. He's French by birth, Russian/American parentage, and American by upbringing.

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>>379356316
>John Rambo knocks me on my ass
>But sweeps me off my feet

That's the gist of it

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>>379356527

It already is anon!

>>379327739
does she need to drink?

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>>379356649

I want to rebuke you, but Ocelot's history is so fucked I can't say whether he was raised American to be a spy or Russian as sleeper agent for the philosophers.

>>379356948
Didn't Paramedic want that BB dick like super bad? Or was that Eva?

>>379355921
Ocelot predicted everything Solid Snake would do and you think its impossible for him to predict Big Boss's actions? Come on. Ocelot is literally the character capable of the most overly elaborate bullshit plans in the entire lore. He is the ultimate mastermind. Also you have to realize in MG2 Big Boss's disposition did change. The way he handled Zanzibar Land was different from Venom and even how PW worked. He went back to being a "family" again and fighting for an independent nation. And though there is nothing to confirm Ocelot played a part in that; Big Boss did start to shift in ideology slightly. That was the point. You were supposed to feel good for killing BB in MG1 and then feel bad for killing him in MG2. I mean it was nothing like his shift after being trapped in a vegetable state semi coma for all that time but that shift was kickstarted because despite his efforts and all he did to try and do it right this time he still failed. I don't think Ocelot planned on that happening. I think he planned on Zanzibar surviving long enough for him to find Zero but Solid Snake changed that.
I won't get into how Ocelot considered Solid and Liquid Big Boss's sons and loved him like an extension of Big Boss himself because it's irrelevant to this topic but I'm pretty sure this was always the case. Liquid just went so far off the rails there was no saving him. You know Ocleot did predict that they would fight and only Big Boss would remain.

>>379331997
Metal Gear =/= Metal Gear Solid

It's like saying MGSV and Metal Gear Rising are the same.

>>379357119
Eva seriously wanted (and got) the Big Boss, Paramedic was just a flirt

>>379357119

Both, well, everyone really.

>Eva
>Crab battles
>The Boss
>Ocelot
>Volgin
>Paramedic
>Zero

Hell, it's more of challenge to name a character in MGS3 that didn't want Snake's dick.

>>379343403
Mai neega

>>379356948
Whatever the situation is, I'm sure Ocelot was more closely tied to the US than Russia before he met Big Boss. He was an NSA code breaker, he stole the legacy and delivered it to the USA, and reported to the CIA director after Snake Eater was done. He never really did anything for the Russians.

>>379345789
Stop that meme. The Boss fought to her utmost.

He's exactly the same, because Venom is the player and the player controlled Big Boss in his last two games.

>>379355123
peepee

>>379357119
Big Boss made some comment about paramedic seeing him naked in the hospital but that was before he met Eva

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>comfy metal gear threads are back on the rise
thank fuck

>>379357119
Big Boss dicked Eva. Then he dicked Ocelot. Then he told them both to fuck off after feeling betrayed. Para wanted to fuck him bad. PAZ probably wanted to tap that. Amanda was all over his dick. That's pretty much it.
Para got her revenge for being passed up for EVA later though.

>>379356869
Ehhh kinda

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>>379357494

Comfy Metal Gear threads were my favorite before V was released.

>Batshit crazy speculation
>Trailer Memes
>Reminiscing
>Miller = Sunglasses
>No Caramel tripfagging bullshit

It's my favorite.

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>>379357316
Finally someone with some taste.

>>379357148
>and you think its impossible for him to predict Big Boss's actions?
Yes? How the fuck could he? Moreover, given that
MGSV shows Ocelot in full support of Outer Heaven, why would this change? Nothing shows that it does.
>He went back to begin a "family" again
Not even close. He describes his life and worldview in cold terms that reflect calculation and the "balance" Ocelot mentions being his goal in MGSV. MG2 paints him as a benefactor, sure, but a very manipulative and arrogant one. MG2 wrinkled the context by demonstrating how the cruelty of "good guys" like the U.N. can give rise to victims, but Big Boss himself is still an opportunistic asshole.

>>379357510
Did she rape BB?

>John banged Eva
>David banged Meryl
>Jack banged Rosemary
Venom didn't even get a kiss from Quiet

>>379357510
Big Boss fucks Paz in peace walker in the love box. I don't think you can get zadornov without doing that mission so it must be canon.

>>379356652
i love this picture

>>379357792
given how riddled with shrapnel and debris his body was after GZ, he probably doesn't have a dick

at the very least it doesn't work

>>379357730
>like the U.N.
Meant to write NATO.

>>379357798
SIDE OPS ARE NOT CANON
I guess Big Boss knows how to talk to felines too huh? I wonder why the Raithian species went extinct in the MGS universe? YOU TURD BOY

>>379357850
Only his upper body

>>379357865
UNATCO?

>>379357668
prime /mgg/ was a thing of beauty as well, I miss tuxedo railgun peace walker nights

I don't miss that tripfag nile crocodile at all though

>>379357798

But she's like 24 and a perfectly legal consensual adult in Peace Walker.

>>379357775
I have no idea but she must have had some fun with him when BB was trapped in that second coma after being set on fire.

>>379357937
I highly doubt that

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>>379357510
>he dicked Ocelot
If BB didn't push Ocelot away his life would have improved ten fold. Ocelot loved BB more than EVA

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>>379322401
>a can of Axe

Probably Axe Peace. Axe Peace is best Axe.

Lynx users need not apply.

>>379357937
He's 52 years old and was comatose for nearly a decade

The only thing Venom is raising is a salute

Were liquid and solidus good at stealth infiltrations like big boss and solid?

>>379358414
They both have the skills built in their DNA. Whether they used it much I'm not sure.

>>379350465
Do you think one of the original members were still alive by then?

>>379358414
Solidus, the perfect clone of Big Boss, became the President of the United States and no one seemed to ask questions. So yeah I'd say he's pretty good.

>>379352312
Peace Walker BB would've, but not our fallen hero

>>379358817
>so good at stealth he stealthily became president
That IS pretty good

>>379358720
>actually believing DNA counts for shit after presumably playing the entire series
baka desu senpai

>>379359001
>DNA doesn't matter
>Kiddy liquid beats up grown men and does cqc

>>379358386
It bothered me that Venom did not salute once

>>379359316
>no ability to salute your men
I will forever hate this

>>379358817
>>379358934
>Yfw mgs2 predicted the 2017 election

Who's the best looking Snake?

>>379359257
he's a scrappy tenacious little motherfucker, Venom still slapped his shit and he's just a good soldier

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>>379359384

>>379359384
Liquid, hes the only clone who didn't look like Big Boss

>>379359383
nah, trump is too much of a blithering windbag buffoon to be solidus

He's more like president johnson, except grabbing pussies instead of raiden's junk

>>379359371
>Quarantine scene
>Men raise one final salute before dying
>Can't salute back

>>379359384
>>379359470
Aside from hair they all look the fucking same.

>>379359542
>not giving them the 45 caliber salute, the only decent one to give them

>>379357730
>Yes? How the fuck could he?
How the fuck did he predict everything Solid Snake would do? It's literally the same thing.

Also I wasn't trying to imply Big Boss dropped his asshole ideology but clearly a lot of the things he did at that time contradicted with what he said. The kids on base are the biggest example of that.

>>379359642
suneku arr rook same

>>379359771
>>379359629