RTS

>>379175610
IS THERE ANYTHING THAT CAN RIVAL GOOKCLICK

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Stop playing Seton's then

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Hello

>>379175610
Where's Company of Heroes 3

>>379175610
best level indeed

I have a question lads. I haven't played a newer rts than supcom 1. I've played almost all of the ones prior to it. Will we ever return to an era with macro basebuilding that means something or has Moba trash and focused maps killed true rts forever?

>love RTSes
>be unironically bad at them

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I always see people talking about DoW:Ss, but never the Ultimate Apocalypse mod. This is what Dow should have been from the start, it improves it ten times over in every aspect.

>>379177070
Play RTT then if you get destroyed online

>>379177125
If you don't care about actual strategy, sure.

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speaking of w40k i just picked up battlefleet and its fucking hard, anybody got any tips for the imperial fleet ships?

>>379177261
don't the require even more micro?

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Why is there no innovation in the RTS genre?

>>379177459
No they don't, you don't need to give a shit about base building and autismo macro like larva injects and shit like that

>>379177070
good news, all games in the last decade have been catered towards you

>>379177070
it's easy man just memorize 15 different build orders for every race so you can tell what the opponent is doing based on the number of workers he has two minutes into the game how to counter it (:

>>379177518
Can you give me some titles? When I think RTT I think of stuff like Men of War.

>>379177664
Name few that are good.

>>379177481

>innovation

care to give some examples?

>playing DOW3
>people are just spamming one unit type each game
>play counters
>still lose because stacking one unit and piling damage clearly much better strat then using anti infantry to kill infantry, anti tank killing tanks
>balance is worse marines are the clear winners
>some doctrines should be basegame abilities

>>379177481
Why and how would you innovate dead genre?

>>379177916
Steel Division's the newest one

>>379176896
its a tossup. They have been putting out more rts's as of late though. None as good as supcom 1 or even supcom 2 though.

>>379178101
From what I saw it requires even more micro than Wargame

>>379178307
It requires way less, the game's much slower

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>>379177481
but there is

>>379178035
>Dow3 announcenemt trailer
>Get hyped into fucking oblivion
>See first screenshot
>It looks like shit
>"Maybe it looks better in motion"
>See gameplay videos
... and just like that, i had no interest in newer RTS games anymore.

>>379177481
Nostalgiafags will lynch you for that

>>379178216
I was going to check out the new Dow because i remember the og ones were pretty alright. But I saw they had the same lane based map and flood unit meta which I thoroughly dislike. The lack of the feeling of progress like in RON, AOE, and EE has made me very unenthusiastic about these new games.

>>379178336
idk, maybe i'll give it a try once there is a sale

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>>379177481

It's extremely expensive to make a proper RTS in comparison to other genres on top of it having a niche and very picky audience. Because of this you had developers mostly copy the C&C, AoE, and Starcraft/Warcraft genre for years. It's just not a smart business decision to try and innovate in the genre.

Some notable exceptions to the standard formula would be Warlord's Battlecry, Supreme Commander, Dawn of War, and maybe Battle for Middle Earth.

>>379176751
That's Relic's panic button when shit goes completely downhill for them worse than it currently has

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>It's a Scheldte episode

>>379178671

C&C, AoE, and Starcraft/Warcraft formula not genre. My bad.

>>379178671
I am still surprised nobody copied Kohan Ahriman's Gift - RTS, that shit was solid as fuck and seems nobody copied that.

How is CoH2 still alive and kicking

>>379178583
Sadly this
The reason that RTS is dead is because no sequel is "good enough" even when it's better

>>379178921
Because it's a great game.
By this point, despite the business model, its gameplay is solid. It just surpasses vCoH.

>>379178671
Warlords Battlecry at least 3 is great fun but balance is ass. No slow leaders can be used because of assassin rush.

>>379179041
>The reason that RTS is dead is because no sequel is "good enough" even when it's better
Name a few

>>379178921
there are no alternatives

>>379179093
CoH2 is objectively shittier than vCoH mate. let me guess, you play Axis?

>>379179101

I'd say it's best to just enjoy it for the broken mess it is. Great variety, but not the most competitive game.

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>>379177481
Because some innovated too much

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>SC just released
>all of us had shit PCs
>30 ingame minute no rush 4 player lan match
>after a while 1 ingame second took 15 real time seconds
>still the most fun I had playing video games

>>379179152
C&C3 and RA3
Remember "muh 2D sprites" and "muh artistic style" are not arguments

>>379178921
Unironically good

>>379179271
woah there man, Perimeter was pretty good. At least the vanilla first one was.

>>379179201
Oh I agree
>Empire Merchant
It literally feels like you are breaking the game with how fast you can make units but other combos are even stronger then that. Its quite a unique feeling honestly.

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>>379179271
Command & Conquer 4

>>379179192
>CoH2 is objectively shittier than vCoH
No not really
Maybe few things are worse but it is still an overall improvement.
DLC muddied up doctrines but at least gave us some diversity instead of "commander of the patch"

>>379179438
>C&C3 and RA3
Generals and RA2 were objectively better in every way. Also
>2007 games
Give me something recent within last 5 years.

>>379179653
This was an literal MOBA (not like DoW3 shitposting) forced by execs to release as sequel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlIkGlTMUNE&t=0s

Gameplay footage of the canceled F2P C&C game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rTK_DZG-oE&t=318s

>>379179774
>Generals and RA2 were objectively better in every way
Generals are not a sequel to anything and nope.

>Give me something recent within last 5 years.
Hard to say because there was only CoH2 that stick on market.
Rest like Cossack's 3 got forgotten quick.
RTS died around 2010.

>>379179774
CoH2

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>>379179192
It's better balanced. It is still BEING balanced. It has a better LoS system. A better vehicle <-> infantry interplay with the "70% engine damage system". It has a better sniper system (countersniping is actually viable in CoH2), and it has a better capping system.

They could have continued with the Wehr purchased vet, but giving all factions the uniform "vCoH US" vetting system was a correct choice in my opinion.


The two things CoH1 has over CoH2 is optimization and better doctrine design.

But because CoH2 has the virtue of being a sequel, I still consider vCoH the greater game. It was amazing and innovative back in the day. Coh2 had a rough start, but by now it is a better game.

>>379179438
C&C3 was good, if a little too rock-paper-scissors. RA3 tried new things but ultimately didn't work out better than the prior games. Innovation for innovation's sake is worse than doing a basic concept and executing it well.

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>>379180075
>It's better balanced

>>379180075
coh1 had way better sound design. gun shots sounded so good

>>379180018
>RTS died around 2010
Pretty much.
Cossacks 3 is solid though, but it's nothing new.

>>379180087
RA2 had
>god awful interface
>shitty pathfinding
>no group contextual actions
>lack of other ease-of-use functions
>trashed up MP balance
>navy being only useful in island maps

RA3 faults were mostly subjective at best

>>379180191
Nice greentext

>>379175610
>Its a Fighting Spirit/Lost Temple/Python episode

Fucking YAWN

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>>379175610
What happened to turnbased strat?

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>>379180736

they are dead.
mainly because they require some patience and actuall forward thinking and that things were not going well with instant gratification mindset on millenials

>>379180971
>Patients and forward thinking

Well I mean I just used orcs but yeah according to old forums you can do amazing shit with Frostlings.

>>379177481
War for the Overworld

Took two years of patching, but it's not a buggy pile of shit anymore.

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>>379180971
>dose yung kids ruinin muh video games
haha, this guy

>RTS with a good single player campaign
Are they extinct?

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I regret not playing with the Brits before. Just climbed up from 1490 to 1600's by spamming them in 1v1's. Glad nobody chooses Goths for some reason though.

>>379183478
RTS in general are extinct.

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I just bought this, but it seems really similar to Planetary Annihilation: Titans

Should I invest more time into learning it, or just refund it and get my $5 back?

>>379175901
This tech 3 rush meta is unnecessary.

>>379183804
i like this post a lot. thank you for making it.

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>>379177481
The strategic zoom in Supreme Commander was the best innovation the RTS genre could have asked for, but barely anyone is adapting the concept. Minimaps are archaic.

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anyone playing this? is it any good at its current state?

looks comfy as fuck and looks like the settlers gameplaywise

>>379180087
>RA3 tried new things but ultimately didn't work out better than the prior games. Innovation for innovation's sake is worse than doing a basic concept and executing it well.

Except RA3 has had a bigger lasting impact on future RTS titles than "lol, voxels ~ TibSun" could ever hope to.
It was the very first RTS with a co-op option and it was soon added just about everywhere.
DoW2 owes it its Co-Op campaign, SC2 owes it its Co-Op mode, heck, even a lot of old games got Co-Op campaigns made by fans as a result, like original Starcraft or Forged Alliance.

>>379183804
It's much better. Get the FAForever client and learn.

FAF question: do I just need to spam t1 engies and assist them to the factories like in >>379184179
to win? Cause I never do that since it sucks out shittons of mass that I dont have

>>379177285
Does literally anyone care about strategy in any form of Warhammer?

>>379184219
>looks comfy as fuck and looks like the settlers gameplaywise

unfortunately, there are very little content right now. 3-4 hrs max, and you seen and achieve everything.

but it's still EA

>>379177867
you don't have to memorize everything by build order after you get a general idea of how the race works. often in sc2 you can figure out what to do by just figuring out in what order he is adding bases or production.

for example terran either expands, then adds production, or expands twice then adds production, or does a one base allin

wow thats like four different scenarios i have to adapt to i guess you have to have literal aspergers to memorize all that.

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>>379184219
You'll see pretty much all it has to offer in a game or two.

Should probably put it on your watch-list and check on it periodically.

>>379184429
>>379184529
ok, thanks anons

>>379179101
>>379179201
that's why you play WB2 you dumb anons
play demon on your first go and then start going through the other classes, they're all equally shit besides demons so the game is actually fun

>>379184782
what should I look at there exactly?

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>>379184382

No.
You can thank GW for killing the thing by creating fuckzilion of sub-par spin-offs and selling the licence to fucking everyone and their dog, so they can create shits like pic related

>>379184803

I've played both the games extensively.

>>379177070
>>379184347
>>379184891
Just look up CrazedChariot or other ~2000 on FAF for build orders.

Did the new patch fix DoW 3?

>>379184347
Play Forged Alliance Forever (FAF)
It rebalances builds speeds so you don't have to do that anymore. It's mandatory in normal FA though.

>>379184782
>>379184989
I'm FAF guy(>>379177070). Stop responding to me.

i think no one makes good rtses anymore because the genre doesn't pull much from having modern technology. making a firstperson game photorealistic will be breathtaking but making a top down view game photorealistic will have the game look cluttered and it becomes difficult to tell whats going on.

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>>379184219
I just bought it. It feels great and very polished despite being alpha.
Also, they added multiplayers a few days ago, I'm having lots of fun with my buddies. I assume SP would have been quickly boring.

>>379184893
Is that fucking 40k Plants vs. Zombies?

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Will it be good?

>>379185104
I already play it
my question is: does spamming engineers on a factory make any sense and whats the resource gain compared to just making more factories?

>>379185145
*not

>>379178423
>literally the least innovative player

Remove FAF rating system or separate it from ladder

>>379185347

no

>>379185369
T1 engies are like 50 metal and had 5 buildspeed. T2 factory is over 1000 metal and had 40 buildspeed. T3 is like 3k metal and 60 buildspeed. It was many times more efficient to assist the T2/T3 factory than build an additional factory. That was in normal FA
Look up the buildspeed values for T1 engies and factories and see how much they cost per buildspeed in FAF.

>>379185295
>kröwns

come the fuck on

>>379175610
>its a look at my micro managing skillz episode
>its a land denial XXDDD hahhaha epic episode

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thoughts?

>>379184347
you either put mass engies on assist, or you build mass factories.
most people prefer mass factories because stacking 30+ engineers in one place means that a single t1 bomber can instantly destroy most of your build capacity.

>>379177481
It peaked with Forged Alliance

>>379185194
That's not entirely true but you do have a slight point.
Technology does not help unimaginative uses of the new power.

For instance, one very obvious change is the fact we can have bajillion units in a game if we want to without much effort.
But a bajillion units simply means they control like ass so it's pointless in the end.

However, imaginative ideas profit from better technology a lot. Archon is a very quick example... the whole time travel mechanism could never be done back in the day. The game failed elsewhere but as far as tech goes, it sets a good example of interesting uses of it.

Pathfinding is perhaps in the unimaginative category, but knowing it is possible to make it as perfect as you'd like without impacting performance is a major thing.

>>379185772

grrm called, he wants his title back

>>379185719
>reee it's not spamming basic soldiers

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total war

specifically medieval 2, rts battles while managing shit on a turn based map. It's literally the pinnacle of the strategy genre

>>379185347
The developers of it are decent folk and I liked their previous game but they have ZERO experience making RTS games so no.

With RTS games, you have to fail a bit at first before you can make a fun game unless you're Relic (and even they simply failed on their second game instead).

I'm amazed we haven't got a decent 3d space rts since Homeworld 2.

A sequel to Star Wars Rebellion with Homeworld-style 3d space combat would sell like hot-cakes, specially with the new movies coming out.

>>379177481
Warcraft 3 was innovative and it ended up spawning assfaggots

>>379185369
>does spamming engineers on a factory make any sense and whats the resource gain compared to just making more factories?

more engineers on a factory make the thing that is built by the factory finish faster, but you still pay the same total resources for it.

the only "resource gain" you could mean is saving the money for factories and building cheap engineers instead? which im pretty sure is negative, meaning that factories are a more cost efficient way to get build power than engineers.

>>379185369
More factories are better. Engies can be killed more easily and block units. And you need them for other tasks such as reclaiming, building other staff etc.

>>379185347
That depends how much they want a CoH with mechs of MoW with mechs.

I wish they combined CoH with Universe in Conflict alien super walkers.
Those walkers were the FUCKING SHIT.

>>379186112
>I'm amazed we haven't got a decent 3d space rts since Homeworld 2.

Because ever since HW1, the developers complained no matter how much their tried, people always simply resorted to playing the game as if it was on a plane?
Because they even included that design into HW2 and made sure to just keep all the missions and maps flat?

You have to make the extra space interesting and at the same time not too complicated.
That is an extreme, possibly not overcomable problem.
If someone figures it out, they could have a ticket to fame as long as they don't slip on the more mundane shit along the way.

>>379185981
>hahahha look i will bully his with my scouts in the first 30 seconds
>ahahhahahha

Is it possible to do FAF as an RTS noob?

>>379186956
yes just make sure you PC can handle the load otherwise it will be lagging for everyone.

t.Tried to play on lappy and they kicked me out

>>379177481
Because Relic made one really great game and didn't understand what made it great, and has been all downhill ever since.

Eugen is the best RTS developer right now and they're not perfect, either.

>>379186956
No

>>379186956
you can win with turtling against bots so yes its beginner friendly

>>379186956
There are occasional comp stomp lobbies

CoH 1 is a much better game than CoH 2. I think only genuine idiots dispute that at this point.

I think the fact that Relic has gone back and made CoH 2 more like the first game repeatedly over time in order to try to salvage it is all of the evidence you need that it was a huge step backward.

3 years ago CoH 2 players talked about how great and cool the snow and blizzard mechanics were. Now, CoH 2 players like to pretend that that shit never existed.

Sad!

relic are incompetent and coh was a lucky fluke

>>379175610

forged alliance is literally perfect

SO WHY CANT I FIND A FUCKING TORRENT FOR IT ANYWHERE AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

>>379185295

is this a settlers clone?

>>379187801
downlaod from mega
>http://pcgames-download.net/2014/06/supreme-commander-forged-alliance-prophet-crack-mega-uploaded-uptobox/

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>>379185982
Like a modern SimAnt

>>379188348
Does that still run on modern computers?

I still have a disk for it somewhere, but it might be the old mac version

>>379175610
>rts
>there's only a limited number of strats that could win you the game
>faggots go on and on about how the game is so diverse and you can do anything to get you into it
>all lies

>>379188570
>If there are too many ways to win the game is too easy.

Does anyone have any forged alliance webms I could use to convince my friends?

>>379188464
>Does that still run on modern computers?
It runs in DOSBox

>I still have a disk for it somewhere, but it might be the old mac version
If it's a CD then it's probably a dual version with DOS and Mac versions, in which case you could also try Sheepshaver or Basilisk or MiniVMac, depending on the system requirements. The Mac version might be better than the DOS version if you can get it working.

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>>379177916
Combat Mission. The slowest and the most realistic RTT.

>>379188036
I'd say it's a mix between civilizations, settlers and banished. With RTS aspects.

>>379177481
There's not much you can do without changing the genre.

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>>379189565

>>379175610
>tfw you have no idea how to play the game to any competitive level

I'm that guy who just plays AI 4v4 and spends 3+ hours slowly building the highest tech thing possible

How do I learn this supcom, the FAF tutorials were not helpful at all

>>379189903
Watch some average joes on Gyle channel YT.

>>379189903
Watch replays of good players with commentary.

>>379190153
this generally doesnt work unless the commentary is aimed at beginners

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>Only 1v1 automatch

>>379184219
My friends and I like playing RTS co-op, is there a shared victory condition, or are all alliances temporary until one of you has to win?

>>379190280
solo queue anxiety is a real thing as is the reason custom lobbies are needed in all games

>>379189565
Looks like the original ARMA/Operation Flashpoint in RTS format.

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>>379175610
I think the RTS genre needs a specialist team style play.

Me I love RTS for the base building / defensive parts. For instance, with Supreme Commander, this was fun and effective.

I really, really, really suck at doing this while launching an offense. Which means I suck at this game because I am always turtling or forgetting about my army as it gets picked off by a single sniper unit,. etc. Funny thing is, my buddy is really really good at offense but sucks at base building.

I wish I could be a "Minister of the Interior", and manage the economy, defense and give all my military control to my buddy for offense.

I think this would be the best new wave of RTS.

World in Conflict did this very well. You could "pool" your strategic points and let the Captain horde and nuke spam.
I

>>379185330
You wish.

It's 40k Samurai Dogs vs Ninja Cats.