Fire Emblem Echoes

>>378533905
I want to lick that inner thigh clean

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Alm and Celica are pretty cute, Faye can fuck off

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>>378534714

What's Faye's canon class? I made her a cavalier if only because she was one in the trailers. Also, girls like horses right?

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>mfw Echoes is ten times more enjoyable than the shitshow that was Fates

Why do you always lie /v/?

>>378535148

If girls like horses then logically she should get a SkyHorse instead of a normal horse.

But really she should be a cleric because she gets Rescue, Physic and Anew.

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>>378535593
>fates
>shitshow
At least it tried something new and took a few risks (even though those risks didn't work out in the end)

>>378535593
because you're a shitty casual who's never played any other games in the series

Conquest blows Echoes out of the fucking water
Birthright is about on par with Echoes
Revelations is slightly worse

damn, now you make me want to replay Revelations

I beat Echoes in 36 hours and never touched it again

>>378533905
Still playing. Think I'm nearing the final boss. I've had a great time with Echoes, most fun since RD.

Also did I fuck up with DLC? I can't seem to get it. I've got a hacked 3DS and Iinstalled the DLC files but nothing comes up. Do I have to go online at any point? Because I got permabanned after the whole Sun/Moon thing.

>>378535593
It's Awakening 2 Empty Map Rout Bugaloo

If you could tolerate Awakening, Echoes is fine.

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>I CAN'T GO ON WITHOUT THE THREE OF US
what did she mean by this?

>>378533905
Is it okay for me to skip Awakening and Fates and just pick up Echoes?

>>378538052
Chronologically Echoes is Eons before either of them if that's what your asking.

>>378538052
Not only is it okay, I positively encourage you to do so.

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>used triangle attack for the first time
>that animation
nice

>>378538052
It's probably the worst of those 3 and also the easiest so it's a good starting point.

>>378536861
>game is shit
>but it tried new things and failed at least!
>

>>378538025
>letting any of the sisters die
end yourself

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>>378538582
Wish there were more combination like Triangle attack. Hopefully FE Switch adds more to that. I really like it, Makes you use the characters together more.

Silque is top girl, heals all my lads and has some right proper hips.

Or, to put it plainly, I pray to Millia's Grace that she puts that ass on my face.

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>>378539438
Unf
Look at that

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I beat Thabes a few days ago.
Loved the game, made me excited for FE again after Fates shook my faith in the series. But somehow, I don't see myself replaying it often, unlike other FE. Maybe it's the abundance of brainless monster encounters that got too old too fast.

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>tfw trying to get the Dracoshield from Jedah
I'm glad he doesn't attack you during the enemy phase, even Celica's army of dread fighters couldn't deal with his shit.

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Circle your choices and we rate each other.

About to finish the game and feel like instantly replaying it. What should I do to mix things up?
I made Faye a Cleric and she was my best unit. But then I never used Silque much. Maybe rely on Silque for healing and turn Faye into an attacker?
Tobin was Archer
Kliff was Mage
Gray was Merc

Any ideas on what to do differently with the villagers to make the game feel different on a replay?

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>>378537641
DLC was a seperate .cia. Going on the store to update the DLC for the new patch deleted my hacked DLC. Ended up reinstalling the patch after getting Mila's bounty 2.

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>>378539873

>>378539873
Don't have paint so I'll type it.

Right
LEFT
left
right
RIGHT actually left
Left
Left
Right
Right
NONE
BOTH

>>378539873
I'm not going through all of that but Harken is the motherfucking boss. But I think he's kinda hard to get for me because iirc your magic users levels need to be lower than your weapon users and I always go full mage.

>>378539438
I am unsure of what the purpose of the hip wiggle in the heal animation other than to draw men to destroy her ass

>>378540021
I installed the .cia, but nothing shows up. I'm not able to enter the store because I can't go online.

>>378540168
To please Millia, of course.

>>378540058
Getting Wallace/Karel means you're playing the game wrong.

>>378539898
Cavalier Emblem

>>378538025
She gets captured every other week. If something happens to her sisters she's fucked. She needs them to save her so she can keep cucking Abel.

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How do I kill the dark mages with Mire tomes on Celica's route? They seem to have both high defense and res and hit 16 damage on my units.

deen or sonya? i'm about to make the choice and cannot decide

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>>378535593
>the shitshow that was Fates

>>378541915
Archers are fantastic for whittling down enemy mages with 3-range tomes. Leon needs to be carefully positioned because his resistance is garbage but have him weaken the Mire mage from outside the counter range and have someone else with a strong single hit finish it off. Once your archers get killer bows they can slaughter those mages without help.

Post more of hurting Celica.

>>378540094
It's more obscure than that. Magic vs Physical levels determines whether you get Kenneth or Jerme's map, then on each map:
>If you kill more than 1 promoted unit on Kenneth's map before turn 10 you get Karel, otherwise Harken
>If you open 4 or more doors in Jerme's map before turn 9 you get Karel, otherwise Harken

>>378542382
Sonya because shes fertile
Deen is a cuck

>>378542382
Deen comes with a brave sword, but Sonya is the only person who can support with Genny. I went with Deen (without knowing the consequences of killing Sonya) but I'm happy with it because having a second brave sword is really nice and Celica's group has no shortage of mages.

>>378542382
Sonya is really good, Deens just average and you already have 2 mercenaries at this point in Celica's team

>>378542382
Who sucks more; Saber and Kamui (and maybe Atlas) or Mae and Boey? I prefer Sonya just as a character.

>>378535593
I was enjoying it right up to the retarded "I"M GONNA SACRIFICE MYSELF BECAUSE THE EVIL GUY PROMISED ME WHAT I WANTED!" Bullshit. I absolutely hate shit like that. Its annoying and completely ruins the story.

>>378533905
Any more art of Celica and Faye together?

is it on freeshop yet ? too lazy to charge the 3ds

>>378542758

You get his brave sword if you kill him.

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Jesus why is Alm's side so shitty? My team over there is basically just Faye carrying everyone because for some reason she has 17 defense as a level 2 priestess. Mathilda, Clair, and Kliff all have mediocre defense and will basically just die if two 59% Mires hit them. It's not like they're getting healed either because miss Warp Only Silque ain't physicing there far-out asses.

Meanwhile I have to decide who I want to use next to kill a whole section of the chapter on Celica's side because everyone is doing so well I just want to keep them balanced.

>>378542758
You get Deen's brave sword regardless of whether you recruit him or kill him

>finally got a dracoshield so I can grind on the hard exp dlc without getting my units killed
too bad I got it really late game but I supposed it'll do me good for chapter 6

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>>378537030
HA. This bait though!

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>>378543274
I'm having the same problem. It doesn't help that I fucked up the villagers reclassing in hard because I went in blind not knowing that I'd get like 5 other lance users (Tobin/Cav, Kliff/Archer, Grey/Merc, Fae/Peg), but almost everyone on Celica's side feels like they contribute outside of two of the pegesus knights and sometimes Leon now that I've made Atlas an archer, who is a fucking murder machine. Meanwhile, I have so much fluff on Alm's side it's a god damned miracle how I've even made it this far. I'm having trouble on that fucking archer stage after you beat Desaix because everyone outside of Lukas has absolute garbage def and my archers can't hit the broad side of a barn. God help me if a witch decides to teleport into terrain because then I need to pray that I land sub 50 percent chances to hit or soft restart.

>>378543274

Because growths are garbage for everyone so Alm's army which a bulk of which is taken up by ex villagers have only good stats in whatever stats get bumped up when they promote. Meanwhile Celica's party has almost no villagers and most of her recruits start early 2nd class (for physical types) or late 1st class and the game is quite generous with stat gains for characters that are recruited later. Because of that Alm's party would be quite comfortable if the 3 member he picks up in part 4 were of classes that actually matter.

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I want to like it. I really do, but fighting the same maps with about 15 of the same enemies is really wearing on me.

Also, Genny cheesing invoke spam with Celica behind her healing is far more effective than it should be. I don't know why the AIs seemingly go for the illusions first, but they distract them just enough to squeeze out a win.

>>378545081

AI flowchart is why, #1 priority is targets they can kill, #2 priority is targets that won't kill them on a non crit counter attack, #3 priority is highest total damage they can score on a unit.

Phantasms mostly trigger on 1 and 3, it's also why enemies will suicide against archers for days.

>>378538025
Great voice acting with that line desu

What's the point of renown?

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>>378538025
Catria! Oh, Catria!

>Mathilda dies
>Clive... Clive are you there? I could not find peace with you here... Maybe we'll find it... when we...
That was a fucking bummer.

>>378535593
Conquest is a million times better than Shadows of no choke points.

I don't get why people shit on Fates when Conquest is GOAT

>>378547239
The story sucks, and the FE fanbase is full of people that only play for that (and characters who have no gimmicks, even if they are bland).

>>378539898
Tobin Mage
KIiff Merc or Archer or Cavalier
Grey always has to be Merc though

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>>378547239
It's because they only played Birthright or couldn't get past Chapter 10 on Conquest. Filthy casuals either way.

>>378547239
Probably because they didn't play Conquest but played Birthright/Revelations

I don't understand why people refer to Fates like it was one game. It's not. It's 3 different games with wildly different levels of quality. Grouping them all together is silly.

>>378547763
>>378547829
I actually got disgusted at the amount of people who only played BR

>>378547239
Fates as a whole left a bad taste in my mouth. I know that Conquest is the best gameplay wise, but everything else about that game just reeks of wasted potential.

>>378547239
The earlygame drags on, characters come in at a slow trickle and the game is balanced around you always using the same groups of characters until around about chapter 15 which limits reclassing shenanigans until later on.
The lategame is too restrictive with a ton of unavoidable damage that require you to have built your team in a certain way or you literally cannot progress and equipment variety is nonexistent because weapons are extremely expensive and rarely better than +2 forged steel.

>>378548059
I had fun with it, though. I think there's more wasted potential in an inoffensive setting with mediocre gameplay, instead of them finally making something really unique and fun.

>>378548178
>The earlygame drags on
what?

>characters come in at a slow trickle and the game is balanced around you always using the same groups of characters
This is true of every FE

>The lategame is too restrictive with a ton of unavoidable damage that require you to have built your team in a certain way or you literally cannot progress
you are severely blowing things out of proportion. Conquest is hard as fuck but you don't need to minmax 10 chapters in advance for anything.

>equipment variety is nonexistent because weapons are extremely expensive and rarely better than +2 forged steel.
this is true

>end of chapter 3
>only Mila's temple left
>shit keeps spawning there before I can attack
For fuck's sake I'm already 30 hours into this game. Is it trying to burn me out before even getting to the endgame? I really hate the random spawn rate.

>>378548178
>equipment variety is nonexistent because weapons are extremely expensive and rarely better than +2 forged steel.
That's untrue.
http://fireemblem.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_weapons_in_Fire_Emblem_Fates#Nohr_Weapons
Standard Iron weapons are the best since they have no drawbacks.

>>378548873
>This is true of every FE
To a degree, but not anywhere near as much as in Conquest. Most FEs give you your Cain and Abel, your Bord and Cord, your Palla, Est and Catria so that you can use people who fulfill the same roles with a different stat distribution.
In Conquest you don't have such a luxury. You're using Arthur until 13 at a minimum, Peri doesn't join until 12. Want a second archer other than Niles? You have to wait until Nina or Shura.

It makes a lot of the first half of the game feel very samey.

>>378543274
Faye is a mediocre Peg for me, and Clair outright sucks - she has 9 ATK at level 10. Kliff is carrying everyone instead, he's a murder machine with huge DEF.

But I like Alm's army because I actually have to think about how to use my shitty units to win the chapter, instead of just throwing everyone at the enemy like on Celica's side.

>>378549772
I don't know what you're even talking about. You don't need to use Arthur until anything, I benched him as much as I could since his join chapter since I fucking hated him. You get a second archer in Mozu very early on. you get 18 characters by chpt. 13, which I think is pretty standard fare for FE games especially since the first 6 chapters are a prologue

>>378547239
Same problem as a RD
When I was 17 I could tolerate RD story without dropping it in disgust(now I can't), but when fates came out on the west I was 26 years old and this shit was just too much for me, so I dropped after hostage mission(when guy from your country took weeb fags as a hostages and after you freed them they shat on you despite lobster doing the same few missions ago with your little sister)
Awakening did it right with story being so basic it was impossible to fuck up

>>378549772
I wouldn't say ""samey"", but rather restricted. Plus, Mozu can reclass as an archer and she's pretty good in that class. Villager doesn't give anything worthwhile other than aptitude, so reclass her immediately.

>>378548059
>else about that game just reeks of wasted potential.
That's how I feel about Echoes.

>IS potentially could have fixed the shitty maps
>IS potentially could have fixed the shitty simplified gameplay
>IS potentially could have fixed the shitty supports

Instead they added in a half baked dungeon crawling gimmick and called it a day. At least Fates and Awakening were new games where they were trying out new shit. Gaiden came out 25 years ago and all the groundwork was already there and all they had to do was put in a minuscule amount of effort and thought into improving the original and they could have made something fucking amazing, but they didn't.

>>378550446
oh my god you are the very definition of fucking casual

>>378550446
Just mash start. The story is just filler anyway.

>>378550740
You have to understand that this game was made by Gaidenfags who like the maps. There's an interview where they acknowledge this and say they perhaps should've added in newer stuff like an axe user, but they chose not to. The fact that this is a passion project really does excuse a good deal of the archaic stuff for me. Plus the presentation is just so nice.

>>378551304
The story is pretty much filler in most FE games.

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>"You're right Alm...I tried to reach them by peace but they refuse to listen. Our only option now is to crush these Rigelian niggers."

I don't remember that in the Japanese version...

>>378539729

>Be me
>On Thabes 9th floor
>Playing stealth like a fucking mouse surrounded by tigers
>Still getting all treasures though
>Get to room with breakable wall with a dread fighter spectre next to it
>"Fuck it, Im going to charge through the wall full speed"
>Avoid spectre and break straight through wall to secret room
>Run straight into the Fire Dragon battle waiting on the other side
>my weak ass time vs 10 dragons
>fuckfuckfuckfuck
>Celica gets killed and I lose all progress
>I hate this dungeon

Thabes was so much fun, especially when you find Grima at the bottom.

>>378551448
I'm not the guy you're responding to, nor am I a hardcore fan of the FE series as I've just recently only began with awakening after a friend lent it to me.

However, while I agree with your assumption that since this is a passion project that a lot can be forgiven, as someone who never played the earlier ones, I kind of feel like it's a bit of fresh air after plowing through Awakening, Birthright, Conquest, and Revelations.

I'm not saying it doesn't have shitty throwbacks (I personally feel that any archer doing damage over 3 squares away without a dedicated bow for the job is pretty shit), but all of those old imperfections kinda made me think in a way where I'd have to think 2 or 3 steps ahead instead of CHOKEPOINT ALL DAY ERRY DAY. Made me think a bit more, and that adds a certain flare for me.

>>378552084
Kind of wish I hadn't spoiled myself; I'd probably have been genuinely spooked by the reveal.

>>378551740
I literally have no idea what even happens in Sacred Stones anymore.

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>>378550446
>he plays fire emblem for the story
I thought you people were a meme

>>378551448
>You have to understand that this game was made by Gaidenfags who like the maps.
disgusting but that makes as to why the game is the way it is. I don't even hate Echoes but's so painfully mediocre that I doubt I'll have any memories of it in a few years where as at least I'll have fond memories of playing conquest.

What I'm most mad about is that the art for Echoes is too good and the main reason I wanted to like the game so much was the gorgeous art. Hopefully that artist gets another shot in a better game. Or at least a remake of a better game

>>378537658
But Awakening has horse shit character writing and story. Atleast Echoes story/conversation is enjoyable to read.

should I give lukas the villager fork after he promotes to baron and make him a merc?

>>378552180
>Made me think a bit more
The irony here is that Echoes is one of the easiest games in the series

>>378552276
>I thought you people were a meme
I don't
But story shouldn't be so bad that it makes me a drop game
This is why I said awakening did it right, if you can't write something decent, don't even try

>>378552556
Then just skip the goddamn story.

>>378552549
Yeah, well bringing those damned archers back into the convo, I'd hate to get one of my units fucked because I've been conditioned for archers only having 2 squares away to attack to...instead of the sometimes FIVE squares in Echoes.

>>378552841
Anon, the story is the most important part of a FE game. That and the characters, and the characters are only good if they have no gimmicks.

>>378552917
Whenever I saw an archer or a mage with more than 2 range I'd always click on it to keep its range visible. No need to remember exactly how far it can shoot, just stay out of the red.

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>>378553045
No it isn't. The first game was anything but an interesting one. The most important aspect of FE is the gameplay.

>>378553195
No one gives a fuck about gameplay, conquestfag.

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>>378553045
>the story is the most important part of a FE game

>>378552276
I agree that the art is 10/10 but you are still a faggot. What's great about Fire Emblem is how gameplay and story are connected. How do I recruit this character? Can this one talk to him? A somewhat important character is permakill but has a scene later the game how is this going to work etc. Path of Radiance did it the best and Awakening completely spit on it.

>>378553437
>Tellius kid

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>>378553339
>He doesn't play games for gameplay

>>378553195
Maps are not what define the gameplay. The bad weapon triangle, totaled magic, and waifu minigames definitely do not make Conquest a good game

>>378553045
Yeah, people really played FE1, 2, 3, 5, 6, 7, 8, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14 all for its story. Fuck off storyfag, gameplay is king in these games.

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>>378553587
Yes I am. Gameplay is way too slow but everything else is on point

>>378553707
How is the wt bad? The waifu minigames are optional. And by your logic with magic, FE10 and FE9 are bad games as well.

>>378552276
How is that thing on her head a helmet?

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>>378553707
>A completely optional mini-game which was cut from the prude release ruins the general gameplay

>>378553707
>bad weapon triangle
Expect Fates has the best weapon triangle in the series.
>totaled magic
Magic needed a nerf since it was broken in Awakening.
>waifu minigames
Optional and was removed in the western releases.

>>378553437
>How do I recruit this character? Can this one talk to him?
Where the fuck did I say I didn't like any of that? PoR was my second FE and is still probably my favourite. I was hoping Echoes was going to bring this shit back.

>To recruit Python, Forsyth, Jesse, Atlas, Cliff, Faye, Silque, Genny, all you need to do is talk to them in a town/base and they join you
>Mae, Boey, Gray, etc all just retreat instead of dying as well
The most complex recruitment is Zeke because you have to get Tatiana first.

>>378553919
The wt is bad because they put magic all under one category and bows shouldn't be on it at all. There is no point in using any magic weapons from Nohr unless you forge a normal Fire Tome 6 times while the ones from Hoshido are broken. This doesn't help the fact that every mage that they give you is bad. And that's pretending that every map is Conquest actually was good

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>>378554283
>Writing
>Gameplay

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What the fuck was her problem?!

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>>378554283
>People are calling me out on my shit points, better go for gets.

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>Conqucks trying to shit up a nice thread

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Alright it's time to settle this decisively once and for all:

>how many FE games you've played (treat Echoes and Gaiden as separate games, treat 3 Fates routes as separate games)
>whether you like Echoes or not
>whether you like Conquest or not
>whether you think gameplay or story is more important

>>378554304
>Where the fuck did I say I didn't like any of that?
Wasn't meant like that? It's just an example to show my point.
It's been a while I played this so my bad. But I bet FE7 had this. Like if Matthew dies 1-2 scenes change.

>>378554680
>8
>Yes
>Yes
>Gameplay

>>378554680
>19
>I like Echoes
>I like Conquest
>Gameplay

>>378554680
>10 games (FE6 -> Echoes except DS games)
>Echoes is mediocre as fuck
>Conquest is amazing
>gameplay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> story

>>378554680
>9
>Echoes was great
>Fates as a whole was dog shit
>Gameplay

>>378554680
10
Celica route is good, Alm is boring as fuck, maps are unmemorable
More liked than not
Gameplay>story, but if story is on the level of RD or Fates it's terrible game with nothing that could save it

>>378554680
>All the english releases except RD and Shadow Dragon
>It's okay 5/10
>It's good 8/10
>Gameplay

>>378554680
>10
>yes
>yes
>gameplay

Story is important too, but there isn't too much stuff you can come up with for medieval games without being repetitive. FE plot is generally the same.

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>>378554283
That's not how it works anon. Stop having a cow.

>>378554680
>11
>Yes
>Yes
>gameplay

>>378554680
>12
>it's alright
>loved it
>gameplay

>>378554680
>7
>Yes
>No
>Gameplay

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>Final Boss
>Silque finally fucking learns Invoke
>She summons fucking dread fighters
>My face when I turned that infinite reinfocement bullshit back on the enemy

>>378554680
>10
>Great
>Eh
>Gameplay

SoV suffered from the fact that it needed to stay faithful to Gaiden's shitty maps

>oldfags unanimously like Conquest
>newshitters too scared to even reply
whew lad

>>378554680
>10
>Yes
>Yes but it was exhausting and exasperating, made me not want to play the other two
>Gameplay is more important but story/characters also needs to be at minimum decent for a truly memorable/great game, it's not a black or white issue

>>378540168
>I am unsure of what the purpose of the hip wiggle in the heal animation other than to draw men to destroy her ass

I'm glad I'm not the only person that noticed that.makes me feel like less of a freak.

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>>378554680
>played every single one but haven't finished the first three because they were boring as fuck
>yes
>yes, probably my favorite in the series
>gameplay always

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>>378555329
>mfw Entrapping the final boss

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Let's be real here

Story: SoV > Fates
Characters: SoV>Fates
Music: SoV>Fates
Maps: Conquest>>>SoV>The rest of Fates

>>378555453
I liked Awakening too despite /v/ hivemind hate
What are you gonna do now, call everyone who dislikes it a newfag? I do, fucking tellius kids

>>378542382
Sonya because as far as overall stats go she's basically the best mage in the game and can actually take a hit without suffering a complete fucking breakdown but she even has some heartbreaking dialogue with Genny and she actually has some relevance to the story on the last stage unlike Deen who's just filling the quota of "1 edgy asshole" that FE games seem to require.

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What FE games let me kill niggers?

Pic related

>>378555603
Inclined to agree i suppose

>>378539679
I bet Silque enjoys raw anal sex.

>>378555603
I actually preferred fates music to SOV, it had a ton of great tracks with unique instrumentation compared to SOV, though I do agree that both soundtracks are great

>>378555703
Greith was a based Somali pirate

>>378538025
weird transparency
is she a ghost

>>378554680
>treat 3 Fates routes as separate games)
No, fuck you
It's the fucking same shit.

>>378555934
they at least between Conquest and BR, they had 22 unique maps, with different soundtracks, stories, and characters as well as totally different maps, its pretty fair to call them different games

>>378555817
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmoRT6nPiJA

This is way too good. Especially the battle version at 2:33.

The battle music not breaking the map music and just being an alternate version was fantastic in general.

>>378556068
>MUH MAPS
The same fucking shit, asshole.
Fates cast is bloated as fuck, has a bunch of shitty gimmick maps, and the same retarded story on whatever route.

>>378555603
>SoV>Fates
Dynamic music is superior to the map-battle music transition of Echoes.

>>378556140
yeah this theme was great, personally I also really enjoyed You of the Light, Alight, and Destiny by Blood among others, great soundtrack overall

>>378556221
>I didn't like it so I'm going to call them the same despite their massive differences
lmao@Ing at ur life

>>378556140
This song from Heirs of Fate is also great

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uXwp9iPq7g

>>378555603
How about this?
Good story+alright maps > Utter shit story + great maps

>>378556309
>BUT IN CONQUEST YOU CAN'T GRIND, SO THEY'RE DIFFERENT GAMES!!!!
Dumb asshole.
This is why IS got away with selling the entire fucking game for $80 (with the real ending DLC)
Retards like you are killing Fire Emblem.

>>378556476
>completely different maps
>completely different characters
>completely different weapons
>completely different difficulty and quality
>b-but I don't like it so I'm gonna call them the same!
kek

>>378556476
If you don't like map gimmicks that much, there's games you can enjoy like Awakening. There's no reason to be upset.

>>378533905
>Faye breaks Celica's leg
>Celica blocks it out and can never walk again
>Alm loves her even more for this and has Florence Nightingale and gently takes care of her for the rest of his life
What would Faye do?

>finally managed to get to The Creation after 4 attempts
>get completely blasted away
FUCK YOU

I would be more upset if I wasn't a lazy fuck and actually get my off my ass just to grind a little bit more for better weapons.

>>378555603
Nah, Fates' story is better because atleast its funny bad. Echoes' story is just really fucking boring.

Everything else is accurate.

>>378556140
https://youtu.be/uglKlZFv55o

Vanity Judge is my reigning champ for soundtrack in Fates.

>>378557203
> Something that is bad is better than something mediocre
What?

>>378557642
Fates story is ironically more enjoyable than Echoes

It's the reason why Titanic made headlines while a million other boats that reached their destination safely didn't

>>378557642
It's pretty straightforward. Entertaining is better than boring.

>>378536861
Gaiden was the definition of trying something different in the series

>>378533905
Is the romance between Alm and Celica any good?

>>378547239
Nu/v/
Conquest is the best FE game in the series by far.

>>378558034
As someone who is a massive faggot for shipping and romance in video games,
No, it's not.

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>>378533905
>tfw no jiu-jitsu gf/bf to do nude submission grappling
>tfw submission grappling fetish meterial is so rare

>>378558034
Not in the slightest.

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I'll just leave this here.

>>378557891
Gaiden may have been, Echoes sure as fuck wasn't.

>>378558034
no lmao

It's so terribly fucking written. "childhood friend" is the laziest excuse for romance, it's what hacks resort to when they don't know how to write a believable romance, when there's no chemistry between the protags at all. And that's literally all it is: m-muh childhood friends.

>>378558034
didn't they only know each other for like a few months when they were around 10

>>378558427
Not even that long. They knew each other for less than a month.

>>378558328
Echoes is a remake of Gaiden. What don't people understand about this. As a remake it stays quite true to the original.

>>378558669
Echoes may have been a risk when it was made but remaking it in 2017 sure as fuck isn't a risk, especially when you take no chances with changing ANY of the widely-criticized aspects of the original game.

>>378554680
8, counting echoes.
I think I like echoes so far. The story is infinitely better so far, which makes the experience a lot more enjoyable. There is grinding which I guess I didn't expect, but the grinding is different, with how the levels slow down as characters get higher levels.
I did like the gameplay of conquest, but I'm going to be honest, it was harder to get as invested in it as some of the other games because the story and characters felt weaker.
Gameplay is of course more important, but I think that having even a halfway decent story really enhances everything.

I still think the worst part of echoes besides the shitty map design is the map spawns, they're just a retarded waste of time

Fuck the post game dungeon.

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>that nuibaba map
>that map with the earthquake magic on an 18def mage inside of a maze
how the fuck do I even

>complaining about a plot in a new game when ideas become scarcer by the day
>praising the plot from a remake of a 25 year old game when games were still new and ideas running

It's harder to come up with a good story these days without being repetitive. The core concept was neat and not often seen, but it was poor. Still, they tried.

I'd like to see people here coming up with a fresh plot for a FE game. There is so little you can come up with that other games it the series haven't done.

>>378559214
Snipers trivialize the entire Nuibaba map. They can snipe Nuibaba, the Fortify mages, and all the Dread Fighters from the front door. If you have Faye's Rescue handy then it's not even dangerous to the Sniper because Nuibaba has difficulty landing killing blows.

>>378559214
spam invoke dread fighter with Silque if she has it and you can cheese Nuibaba easily, or warp/ rescue strats if you have Cleric Faye

>>378559214
Did you make Faye a Cleric?

>>378554680
>>378554680
5 all of the 3DS games
I liked it but it has its massive problems and it really shows. Won't probably touch again.
Conquest is my favourite game so far. Definitely the game I will replay again one day.
Gameplay by far. Some story is nice, but I play games to game, not to read.

P.S. Revelations is my least favourite. Fuck that pile of trash

>44 dollars if dlc

Worth it at all? Seems extreme

>>378559535
>>378559534
I should use invoke more. Faye's a great golden knight.
>>378559485
I only have python as a mounted bowknight, he can't kill jack shit in one turn and shit just heals over and over.

>>378557779
>>378557824
That's a stupid logic, if something is bad, it is bad and something that is mediocre is obviously better. Only a crazy person would find bad shit to be amusing or better.

>>378559443
I don't see how inability coming with new plot can excuse shitty writing
>Hey Nohr scum we are proud fox beople and we ambush you because we sure that otherwise you would attack us
>What why are you killing us????? feel bad shitty avatar
>Damn, I killed fox people, now I really feel bad

>>378559950
the arguement is that something thats so bad you can derive enjoyment from watching it is better than something bland, mediocre, or forgettable

>>378559950
some of us aspire for more than mediocrity

the worst thing to be isn't bad, the worst thing to be is forgettable

>>378559935
Invest in a Killer Bow for him next time you have a handful of spare cash and watch him become a murder monster.

>>378538601
Damn that b8 though.

>>378541915
Genny's soldiers can distract them while you your highest res guy in their face.

>>378554632
Conquest is the best in the series, every threads concerning a different FE game makes /v/ as a whole much shittier

What's the consensus on this so far? Better than Fates? Cause Fates was garbage.

>>378560683
>it's a "retard refers to Fates like it was one game" episode
lol

>>378560683
depends
>>378556472

>>378556472
its a shame echoes maps were far worse than alright, it was either chokepoint city or open plains, and we can't forget the utterly shit swamp and desert maps

>>378561001
That's more forgivable than a bad story. It's still FE, despite whatever the maps are. There's a lot more room for shit in the story.

>>378554680
All of them, even tear ring saga except heroes, Kaga's PS2 game and his new mobile game
Yes
Yes
Gameplay, but character interaction is a close second and the reason I love the series as a whole.

>>378543274
You naturally lack ranged units and healers. Alm theoretically has more flexibility because of all the villagers but because they're all mediocre units so if they're usable or not is basically luck. Silque is also a shitty healer because no physic. Aside from Alm himself you basically don't have a unit that's sure to be good till mathilda, followed by delthia. Celica meanwhile has all good units except for boey, who still learns lightning really early and is therefor useful. Her main advantage is just that she has tons of sages and priestesses though.

>>378547239
Lack of objectives are why gaiden maps are shit, not the chokes. Terrain being way more powerful, utility powers, and the fucking range units have make the maps better than awakening or genealogy where you just got into a formation and rolled over everything because the maps were too empty.

>>378552549
Depends on how you play. No grinding/quests lv20 promote only gives a decent challenge, unless your just talking about the turn wheel in which case you're retarded.

>>378554680
11
I like echoes
I like Conquest
Gameplay is 100% more important but a shitty story is inexcusable unless it's really barebones.

>>378557203
>it's good because it's bad

I've never an opinion so wrong

>>378558815
They did actually change the growths which were by far the worst part of the original.

>>378554680
>how many FE games you've played (treat Echoes and Gaiden as separate games, treat 3 Fates routes as separate games)
9
>whether you like Echoes or not
Yes
>whether you like Conquest or not
Yes, but Conquestfags are really fucking annoying.
>whether you think gameplay or story is more important
Both are fairly important, but gameplay wins out.

>>378563620
>Yes, but Conquestfags are really fucking annoying.
As far as I've seen they aren't anymore annoying than the people who bitch constantly. One thing I'll give them is they can openly admit to it's flaws, like the shitty story. I notice a lot of fans of the older games act like they were flawless masterpieces.

>>378554680
>7
>Haven't tried after I hated awakening
>Haven't tried after I hated awakening

Gameplay is more important, but it's a bonus if the story isn't offensively bad.

>>378563203
>the growths which were by far the worst part of the original
Not really because of how promotion works along with Falcoknights having ridiculous bases and slayer to one shot any terrors. Also angel ring.

>>378564370
>Newfag
>Hated awakening
Not even surprised

>>378564472

How did you deduce that the ones I played weren't oldfag FEs, Sherlock?

>>378533905
>buy the limited edition
>dont make any money scalping it
shit game f.am

>>378564392
It made it so all your units were basically just their promote stats plus a few incredibly random stat ups. They game already suffered from a lack of replayability because you never had to choose units but the almost nonexistent growths just killed it.

>that final map
MOGALLS LMAO

>>378539873
Arran
Sonya
Johan
(You forgot Olwen vs Ilios) Olwen
Sety
Echidna
Elphin
Dayan
Geitz
Harken
Tibarn
Kill both

>>378554680
>7 counting Fates as one game which is what it should have been
>loved loved loved, favourite game since PoR
>meh
>gameplay>story. but world building, atmosphere, characters and story >>>>>> gameplay
Also a lot of Conquest's endgame maps were garbage

>>378566991
>Conquest maps
>Garbage

Fuck off

>>378567851
Why are you so delusional? Are you falseflagging or am I replying to an honest to goodness Conquestfag?

Celica is probably the worst fire emblem protagonist only surpassed by tsubasa

if she was removed the only things that would have to actually be changed would be opening the sluice gate in act 3 and opening the final door in the endgame

not to mention how much full retard she goes in pretty much ever major scene in the game especially compared to how much of a bro alm is

is there any other game where a main character can be removed with only little changes to the story being required?

>>378568540
Micaiah

>>378534841
>lucinafag

>>378568540
Radiant Dawn - Ike
FE7 - Lyn

>>378568437
Compared to the rest of the series, conquest maps are godly, saying they are shit just needs shitposting

>>378560812
Just because they chopped it into three sections and sold it to you piecemeal does not make Fates three games.

>>378568661

micaiah is bad but at least shes both important to the plot and dosent go full retard at all times.

she dosent willingly give in to the antagonists like how celica and shes one of the few people to actually stand up to ike and not suck his dick like everyone else in the game (which is warranted since ike is great but still it shows balls)

celica

> gets mad at alm for doing the right thing
> still thinks she has a claim to the throne just for being a princess even though she knows nothing of zofia and is staying in the shadows
> keeps secrets to herself as opposed to alm working things out with his fellow deliverance members and trusting them
> willingly trusts jedah a person she knows willingly sacrificed his entire family

micaiah is bad

but compared to celica she looks amazing

sorry for going full retard fellas just celica is so awful

>>378566235
>you have to finish off Duma with the Falchion
>even one of the villagers tells you this
>and with finishing Duma off they mean when Duma hits 52HP he becomes immune to every damage except for the Falchion.

FINISHING OFF AND DOING DAMAGE ARE NOT THE SAME FUCKING THING REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>378554680
>Working on Path of Radiance RN
>Beat RD, SD, Awakening, FE7, Conquest
>Enjoying Echoes so far, though it is pretty flawed in a lot of ways that I find annoying
>Conquest is pretty tight, story is bearable
>Neither, music matters the most, gameplay can be kino-tier but if the music is ass it doesn't matter

Genealogy remake with Hidari's artwork that's fully voiced when?

>>378534714
Is Owain the best FE character ever?

>>378554680
>12
>It's pretty neat so far
>Mixed feelings
>Gameplay is more important, but if the story sucks I lose interest in the game.

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*multiplies in your path*

>>378554680
Fuck off, TQ

>>378568945
>literally every character that knows her identity thinks she's going to ascend and be a princess/queen one day
>why does Celica think she's going to rule?

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>>378557779
>food analogy

>>378554680
> Blazing, Binding, Sacred Stones, Awakening, All Fates versions, and Echoes.
> Yeah
> Yep
> Gameplay, though a story that isn't complete ass is appreciated (cough fates)

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Echoes would have been a solid 10/10 if it weren't these 3 things
>Maps
>No Lunatic mode
>Having to Grind
This is not debatable, this is a fact

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>act 3
>play thorugh Celicas path first
>now have to drudge through like 3 of these shitty skirmishes on Alms path before I can go do the story chapters
That retarded enemy spawn system is my biggest problem with this game so far

>>378570726
>Having to Grind
only if you are a shitter and lunatic mode is unlocked after finishing the game

>>378570726
>complains about grinding
>wants a Lunatic difficulty
What did he mean by this?

>>378571006
>lunatic mode is unlocked after finishing the game
Proof?

>>378570726
>No Lunatic mode
Fuck, I was hoping that it unlocked after beating the game on Hard. It feels so wrong to not struggle at all on max difficulty, especially on my first run.
It's Path of Radiance all over again.

>>378570961
I like it as an idea, since you actually have repercussions for dicking around on the world map. It shows that the enemy isn't just going to sit around and wait for you, they'll send out squads after a while.
But as a gameplay mechanic, holy shit is it annoying. At least it makes sure i'm not underleveled.

>>378571339
Forcefeeding me XP by throwing tons of easy skirmishes at me isn't a repercussion at all. It's just tiresome.

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>>378571490
>>378571339
>Go back to towns miles away from the current mission for sidequests/etc
>Have to fight through five different 3-man paladin groups that serve no challenge, give no exp and give a tiny amount of silver just to get back to the relevant battle

>>378571150
Just avoid grinding. Try to avoid enemies in dungeons, move Alm and Celica on the map evenly so extra skirmishes don't spawn, don't backtrack at all unless you absolutely need to visit a shrine to promote, etc. More than likely, you probably tried to do some side-quests along the way which caused you to visit dungeons more than once and engage more enemies or backtracked enough to to cause a dozen skirmishes to spawn. Just avoid doing those things, and you might experience some difficulty. The only complication you may have is the post-game dungeon, but most sane people will do some grinding at that point in the game to match those garbage inflated enemy stats.

>>378569996
3 years, no NA release, shitty English patch to follow

(lol

>>378572012
>3 years, no NA release
I'd honestly be fine with that. It means we get a translation that doesn't use retarded names like "Ced"
And I doubt the translation would be that bad. New Mystery came out before Awakening caused a huge increase in FE fans, and that got a good translation not long after it released.

>>378572673
Ever since the new patch came out, I don't even understand who's who when there's discussion in the threads

so how many of you found the secret shrine

>>378542997
Jedah wasn't lying though, he just mistakenly believed humanity couldn't have gone forth without the help of the sibling gods.

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>>378535593
Imo Echoes and Fates are total opposites.

Echoes gameplay is basic and simple, bordering on dull at times.
Fates has excellent strategic combat with a lot of customization, maps are well thought out, though a bit too gimmicky at times

Echoes however has a pretty enjoyable narrative with good voice acting and writing, while Fates has the most insultingly bad story I've ever seen, with dull, unlikable characters and garbage-tier voice acting. Makes it painful to play the game at times.

I wish they could have just struck a decent balance

>>378573042
If anything I wish more villains like Jedah were used in media. He's fully devoted to Duma and in its own way thats admirable, and nothing he did was truly for his own gain, he just had a really dickish way of going about it. He genuinely thought that pleasing Duma was the only way forward.

>>378570502

b-because my d-deadbeat dad was k-king

>>378573205
>balance

How about make more games like conquest, and then the series can be great again

>>378573205
>Fates has the most insultingly bad story I've ever seen, with dull, unlikable characters
You have that wrong. Echoes has the 'dull' characters, while Fates has characters 'defined by a single trait'.

Why is the dread fighter's sprite so utterly disgusting? What's even supposed to be?

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>>378573205
>echoes with fates' weapon triangle
>archer range is 3 or 4 at max
>remove MU so the story isn't focused around a bland self-insert
>make dungeon segments more fun than running past skeletons and picking up ale and a tiny amount of coins
Would that help?

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>>378533905
>Beat act 2
>Go directly to fight Berkut in act 3
>Mfw the new map theme hits

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Guys I need help, I think I'm in love with Clair and I look like Gray.

>>378573381
Kinda reminds me of Catholic rulers.

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>>378551937
This is it Alm

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>buy Echoes
>Play for 3 hours and get bored
>Start Conquest from the start again after dropping it at Chapter 8 a year ago

How did this happen to me?

>>378572843
>Noish is "Naoise"
>Azel is "Azelle"
>Holyn is "Chulainn"
>Fury is "Erin"
>Lakche is "Larcei"
>Delmud is "Diarmuid"
>Johan and Johalvier are "Iuchar and Iucharba"
>Sety is "Ced"

The absolute fucking worst, however, is one specific change.
You know how 8-4 renamed Lachesis "Raquesis"? It was actually a pretty good change, at least in my opinion. Then, FUCKING NINTENDO CHANGED IT BACK TO LACHESIS IN HEROES. I'm forever mad.

>>378574129
What was Fates weapon triangle?

>>378573205
>garbage-tier voice acting.
I don't remember Fates having particularly bad voice acting and certainly no worse than Echoes.
Fates definitely didn't have anyone as offensively awful as Catria.

>>378574461
Swords and Tomes beat Axes and Bows
Axes and Bows beat Lances and Knives
Lances and Knives beat Swords and Tomes

>>378574536
b-but Catria is voiced by cutest wife Felicia

>>378554680
>how many FE games you've played
11.
>whether you like Echoes or not
It's by far the best 3DS Fire Emblem game, art direction and soundtrack are the best in the series, archer and magic casting mechanics are also great since they encourage a little more strategic thinking than just bruteforcing everything. I also like how you're actually encouraged to use all of your units instead of picking the most overpowered units and benching everyone else. Maps are very simple though, some are a bit repetitive since they rely on cantors spamming terrors rather than actual good enemy placement, some variety on win conditions would also be appreciated.
>whether you like Conquest or not
It's okay, there are too many problems with the game to really make the map design shine, particularly with the gameplay devolving to using units as power-ups for your more powerful units. The plot is absolute garbage, the localization is shit, everything about the child units is retarded. I also feel that most of the "difficulty" comes from the lack of scout feature rather than actually tough maps.
>whether you think gameplay or story is more important
Gameplay is more important, but you're not going to have a really good game if everything else is shit.

>>378554680
>10
>Yes
>Yes
>Both

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>>378574609
Was it really? I thought knives and shurikens were grey and not part of the weapon triangle, and that one tome was assigned per colour instead of all being one colour.
I didn't finish conquest

>>378574397
>Naoise
What
>Azella
Not terrible
>Chulainn
What
>Erin
Not even close
>Larcei
Maybe, the katakana is fucked
>Diarmuid
What
>luchar and lucharba
This can't be real
>Ced
Lol

Is this fanfiction?

>>378574884
You're thinking of the mobile game.

>>378574710
I didn't mind Felicia aside from the "we've got trouble" thing.

It was probably a direction issue then because Catria is supposed to be "cold" so they made her sound like a bored teenager reading off a script.

>>378574609
It makes sense for tomes to be strong against axes but being so weak really doesn't fit them at all. Also it's pretty weird for tomes to be weak against lances since killing knights is kinda their main purpose.

>>378574609
No more neutral? Can't say I like it

>>378574536
Err, you sure about that? Plenty of people give shit to Fates about voices.

Camilla and Effie are big ones, and there's more as well. I've seen far less people complaining about Catria.

>>378574884
Fuck off FEH shitter.

>>378574902
Naoise and Diarmuid are actually good since that's what they're supposed to be; they're actual figures from Irish myth which Jugdral gets a bunch of stuff from.

>>378537030
>36 hours
Too slow.

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>>378575278
I didn't play past the tutorial because the art irked me let me live

>>378575219
The problem with Effie isn't the VA, but that she has been rewritten into a walking DO YOU EVEN LIFT meme.

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tfw Alm and Celica's relationship reminds me of my last relationship. game is hard.

>>378575580
I kinda feel the same but with Luthier and his sister.

>>378575169
Tomes are weak because everything has fuck all res. The only problem with mages in fates was the sheer number of anti mages(ninjas), high hp/wary fighter enemies with 1-2/2 range weapons, and melee weapons having access to magic weapons stronger than most times.

>>378575486
"Nothing's stronger than our love

...

except my biceps"

Voice part of the problem mate.

>>378575486
But her She-Hulk voice is exactly her problem. Effie was always a stupidly strong airhead fixated on Elise. Making her sound like a 'roided up tranny completely changes the delivery, though.

Holy shit that final map was difficult. It wasn't until I realised Genny's Invoke army made Duma ALWAYS attack them instead of my party members.
Before that, one false step with Alm or Celica and I could do the whole fucking map all over again.

>>378554680
>how many FE games you've played (treat Echoes and Gaiden as separate games, treat 3 Fates routes as separate games)
10
>whether you like Echoes or not
I love Echoes, it's probably one of my favorite games
>whether you like Conquest or not
I love Conquest, it's probably one of my favorite games
>whether you think gameplay or story is more important
Conquest is my favorite exclusively for gameplay, where as echoes is great in spite of it. Most fire emblem games have just an "okay" story, good or okay characters, and good to great map design/gameplay. Conquest sacrifices the story for pretty fun characters and great maps. Lunatic was fun until I got to Ryoma's fun house.

Echoes also doesn't have bad gameplay, I like having active abilities that have a cost to them, and I enjoyed beating the game on hard.

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>>378575580
I hope you fucked your personal Faye.
Why had such a cute design to be wasted on a deranged character made only to suffer?

Speaking of VAs, I'm actually amazed the consensus here is that people like Mae's schtick. I was going to guess the "I'm so hyper, LET'S GO" would turn a lot of people off.

>>378576395
Enemies will always attack whoever they can do the most damage to

>>378576481
I've been thinking it was 'still'.

>>378558815
So are you ignoring the dungeon crawling being added properly instead of it just being a few screens with random battles? Is that what we're doing here when we claim Echoes didn't try anything different you liar.

>>378576395
>the one sorc doesn't use fortify for some reason
>send a unit in to kill the witches every turn
>Valbar, literally camus, and my other tanks kill literally dozens of moguls with the mages
>rescue-warp alm to pick at duma until SHIELD TOSS
ezpz but it still kicked my ass for a bit

>>378576481
I certainly don't like it
It's fucking jarring for a character in a vaguely medieval setting to talk like a 14 school girl from 2010

>>378576727
That would make more sense.

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>>378576832
leave my waifu alone

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Is there any ryhme or reason to how witches teleport?
I swear sometimes they go after the most vulnerable unit like a pack of wolfs, sometimes they don't teleport at all, or try to gang up on my magekiller or teleport just outside of attack range and do nothing.

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I don't get why conquest is treated as the best FE game even remotely
>pair-up is still just as shitty as it was in awakening and is now practically required for the high difficilties
>muh choke points
>completely guted magic
>bows were made "good" at the cost of completely changing what the fuck the class was supposed to be in the first place
>all those gimmick maps that start with Fuga's Wild Ride and carry on for the rest of the game
>conquest endgame
But no it had one good map 10 levels into the game that means it's the bestest for sure.
When conquest is actually good for like a 1/5th of the maps it's pretty damn good, but everything else about it is trash.

convince me to play waifu emblem, /v/

p.s Im gay, so waifus are not gonna work on me

>>378576998
Serra's talks like Claire though. I don't recall her saying shit like "hyper"

>>378577179
as far as I can gather they only seem to teleport to reach an unit they couldn't attack otherwise and only if that attack would be advantageous but not necessarily deadly (i.e. they like to target low RES units like knights but I've noticed they'll only do it if that wouldn't kill the unit, save for a lucky crit which has happened to me TWICE).

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>>378577230
you can be gay in Conquest with a sadistic brown cyclops

>>378577319
Her supports with Matthew and Erk make her seem pretty hyper, but the changes to her in Heroes mellowed her personality out a bit

>>378577214
what did you mean by the bows part?

i agree with the magic and gimmick parts tho.

>>378577179
The only I'm sure about is that they'll never attempt to kill an unit after warping.

>>378577230
echoes isn't really about waifus

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>>378577230

>>378577230
nigga there are probably equally as many husbandos in FE, Leon in Echoes is even a flaming faggot this time around for valbar (and who can blame the man)

>>378576481
The complaints seem to be about the content of the dialogue itself, but I think that the delivery itself was pretty good. The quality of the voice acting is also really consistent, which makes you appreciate how much effort Mae's VA put in her work.

>>378577453
I had a witch Alm once, which was like 8 layers of bullshit

I think they only go after "isolated" units, though I don't know how they determine that. I had my mage kliff stand by himself to the south of everyone in the last battle. Literally every time a witch teleported they'd attack him for some reason, even though he'd immediately BTFO them.

>>378547239
Conquest is a poor man's Thracia.

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r8 my doot

>>378577574
I remember there was a discussion on this in an ealier echoes thread, but in escence bows have always been long range chip machines that are useful for widdling the enemy down, which works for most enemies besides armour units because archers lack a weapon triangle attribute. Fates on the other hand makes archers into what are basically physical mages that can't attack at close range with a weapon traingle attribute. I know some people like this change but I can't see myself liking it too much.

>>378577785
>promote Alm to hero
>now every witch attack him just to get onerounded

>>378577550
I'm talking about actual dialogue, not personality

>That's not true! Those ruffians thought that we were with you!!! You got us into a terrible situation! Now, how are you going to get us out?

I can't find a quote but I'm pretty sure Mae says stuff like jerk, rather than ruffian even though ruffian would be more fitting to the setting. It's probably a localization issue anyway

>>378578002
goddess' favorite/10

>>378577785
They seem to have a priority for certain units behind your main force. I also think they have a limit on how many times they attack a character at the same time, like how I've seen witches teleporting to attack Clive twice and then switching to attack another unit in the same turn.

>>378577214
Because Conquest allows nuFEfags to feel "hardcore".

>>378577214
We get it, you're a Telliusfag

>>378577230
>Im gay
Tellius was made for you.

>>378578002
>31 Speed
She's fucking Sety reincarnated.

How is Echoes? I am an awakening babby and it's only a matter of time before I get it, but I have heard that it keeps much of the original game's outdated mechanics.

>>378578335
I can't decided whether grandpas or nuFEfags are the bigger cancer

>>378578051
I think it's pretty hard to keep both bows and tomes relevant if they have the same range, maybe bows should be 3 ranged by default with not amazing power while mages should be 2 ranged but able to kill shit easily.

>>378578051
Bows were always long range chip machines early on, but I remember units like Rebecca and Jamke become gods of death in their respective games a few levels before they promote Jamke was actually GOAT from the moment you got him, though I think that was due to the killer bow

>>378539873
Samson
Sonya in Gaiden, Deen in SoV
Johan
Haven't played Thracia yet
Echidna
Larum
Juno
Wallace
Harken
Tibarn
Both

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>>378578372
That's where you're wrong kiddo I haven't even gotten to play Ike's games yet

I started with Awakening and and making my way through the older stuff, currently working through Genology.