Is this a decent card game? How does it compare to Yugioh?

>>378381465
it has no way to interact with your opponent in their turn outside of a few secrets which are basically trap cards that activate automatically under some conditions.
there are so few of them and they are tied to classes that you can try to play around them

also game is super grindy, especially at first 10 hours or so, cause they want you to open your wallet.

I play it only for some events of randomness while I listen to something cause its a "mind-turned off" card game

>Is this a decent card game?

no. everything is based on rng, and you have to shell out a lot of money if you havent been grinding all these years.

>>378381465
eh honestly

I've probably put a hundred hours and 150 bucks into this game (mostly adventures, some cards packs) and I haven't gone back to it since the old gods expansion.

too many new cards coming out too fast and i dont want to shell out money for card packs unless they're physical like MTG

>>378382209
Hmm I know v will shit on me for this but I wouldnt mind shelling out some money due to the fact that it is free to play. Are there game breaking cards you just need? What am I in for?

Imagine if yugioh had 100x more randomness but the card descriptions only have 1 sentence instead of 3 paragraphs.

>How does this compare to Yugioh

If you want a "competitive" card game that's based around mulligans, lucksacking, and consistent power creep/constantly buying new cards to stay with the meta, yeah, it's exactly like Yugioh.

Don't fall for the meme, OP.

>>378382438
Not that anon, but you pretty much need to pay money these days because the power creep is ridiculous, and the default cards you get for your classes are absolute garbage in comparison. Netdecking has gotten infinitely worse as well, with everyone playing the same few overpowered builds (like Rogue Quest, fuck them).

Arena is the only decent format because it's basically like a normal draft, but you either have to grind gold to buy access or pay real money.

>>378382438
hey man, its your wallet.
have it in mind that the "pros" have all been leaving for other games though (before last expansion at least, though this one wasnt that amazing, just new content keeps people playing)

>>378382742
you willing to shell out hundreds?

Shadowverse exist.

>>378383379
No Anon, not really anymore.

If you have 400 dollars to shell out every month sure
Your only other option is to wait for pros to figure out the strongest meta decks and poorfag your way into making ONE single deck you will be using all expansion.

MtG is better, literally the only thing HS has over it is that the mana system prevents the "it's turn 6 and I've only drawn 2 lands" scenarios, but in every other way it's shittier and less interesting

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I've been playing since Naxxramas and I have bought every adeventure (rip) abd preordered every expansion. They recently sacked adventures and with the recent expansion doubled the amount of legenadries as well as added a large amount of epics. Now is not a good time to get into the game.

>>378384657
I always get to games too late :/ feels fucking bad

>>378381465
Shadowverse is the best card game right now.
It's very generous, they give you free packs all the time and the dailies are way better. You can make a good deck right away if you reroll well.
The actual gameplay is better, HS is a rng fuckfest.
F2p friendly, you gotta open up your wallet to have a decent deck in HS
Shadowverse has more balanced metas than HS.

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>>378382438
>What am I in for?
this is the lead designer

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>>378384901
>Shadowvwerse has a more balanced meta

Shadowverse is all midrange Shadow and Ramp Dragon you fucking idiot. Hearthstone out of ALL games has a healthier meta than Shadowverse. Now is not the time to be playing Shadowverse.

>>378382438
>Are there game breaking cards you just need?
Yes, but the only way to get them is via RNG. No direct training available.

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>>378384901
wasn't the meta so fucked up they had to nerf stuff a week ago?

>>378384810
They might try to reboot it sometime next year like they did with HoTS, which made things a lot more fair for newer players.
I honestly don't think their current model is sustainable in the long run. You have to dump around 400 dollars every expansion to get every card.

Just play magic duels

its quite generous with the gold so you really dont have to use money, if you really want to, play mtg irl instead

>>378385017
Shadowdragon meta just ended.
Also HS has had way more garbage metas while SV only had one unbearable meta.
>>378385114
They do nerfs every expansion to the top 2 crafts.

Just go play Gwent instead.

>>378381465
>Is this a decent card game?
Barely
>How does it compare to Yugioh?
It's about a million times better than that trash.

>>378385320
Gwent isn't a card game it's a got damn snorefest.

>>378384986
>"""earn more cards"""
>Get nothing but win dailies and actually have to be handed the wins while playing Casual cause your deck is that bad and even then there are a ton of cancer-farmers in fucking Casual farming up 100 Gold a day that said decks have a 0% chance, objectively, to win against
Yeah, Ben's always been a retard.

>>378381465
I recently got into the Plants vs. Zombies card game and while the grind is atrocious, they actually manage to make it pleasant so long as you play semi-constantly.
>All Quests except 1 special Quest you get once in a while earn you 10% of a Pack
>You get a new Quest every few hours up to a cap of 3 and can reroll 1 quest once every 6? hours
>They drip-feed balance for the most part unlike Hearthstone, releasing an Event card each week for people to add to their deck, which can range from mediocre to fucking absurd, but you can readily grind a few copies of it for free by just playing regularly
>Only real downside is you only get 6 of the 20 Heroes for free and you unlock the rest by either spending 750 Gems (Quests give 10 and ranking up in the Ranked MP play gives some too) or getting them from regular packs, same rarity as Legendary cards

>>378384986
He's right though

>>378384986
Are you retarded? Having filler cards is nothing new, Mtg has done it for decades. Do you also think that every single card in the game should be equally powerful?

>>378385470
Why don't they cut down on the filler cards then?
Particularly in this expansion which has the most legendaries yet.

>>378385234
Or if you have friends into it, play MtG on Tabletop Simulator, you can play it completely free with any cards you want that way (after the initial TTS purchase obviously)

There's even a really useful website that lets you pick cards and build a deck and then exports it directly into the image format TTS uses for decks

http://itszn.com/magicDeckBuilder

>>378385375
>this is what blizzdrone actually believes

HS is barebones card game that would never would have taken off if it wasnt made by blizzard while playing on nostalgia with all the wow references

>>378381465
>that medieval le troll man artstyle

Fucking disgusting. I'll never understand people who think literal shit like this is appealing.

>>378385643
And yugioh barely even fucking qualifies as a game, it's turned into two fucking players staring at their hand, fishing for their instant-win combos, with the game probably already decided based on who went first and what cards they drew.

Hearthstone is fucking garbage but at least you're actually playing a fucking game.

>>378385891
Didn't Yugioh alienate even more people with it's link summon mechanic? I don't think any card game is more jewish than Yugioh.

>>378381465
No.

>>378385891
You literally described Hearthstone in this expansion if you want to play with the big dawgs and have competitive decks. It's all just fishing for cards and your win condition combo.
Mage is particularly disgusting right now with primordial glyph

>>378385891
eh, the games at least are balanced enough so you can have fun.

what the real life game needs is fucking constructed formats like pretty much every other TCG has when it reaches a point, but konami doesnt want to bother.

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>>378386032
>Killing mage through 4 ice blocks

>>378385470
>Filler
>Starter player decks are 100% "filler"

>>378385470
Yes. Filler by any other name is still filler. We get it as far as physical TCGs go because they need to sell packs but the same things don't apply to virtual games because there's no production of goods involved.

>>378385992
Links are an interesting beast, I think they're for the best because they mix up the stagnant meta and make older decks more viable.

>>378381465
No. Its the most jew centric card game on the planet. Everything is gated behind micro-transactions, and you can't trade or sell your cards like a real card game.

>>378381465
Better than yugioh, worse than MTG

>>378386232
>We get it as far as physical TCGs go because they need to sell packs but the same things don't apply to virtual games
It does apply. Opening a pack and getting three cards is a lot less exciting than opening a pack and getting five, even if at least two of the five cards will most likely be trash.

Also: arena is a thing.

>>378384810
Gwent open beta started few days ago. It's still quite jewish game, but much-much more f2p-friendly than Hearthstone.

>>378382108
>it has no way to interact with your opponent in their turn
I never understood why this is universally reviled by CCG players when Codex doesn't have interaction on your opponent's turn but it is a fantastic game.

Duelyst is better.

Should I quit Hearthstone, /v/?

>>378390357
Yes.

>>378381465
ya its pretty good just play with whatever cards you get for free,

>>378381465
>card games
>ever

Dave Kosak is wasted on this.

>>378381465
I'm torn. I like Shadowverse's style of gameplay more, but Hearthstone is more playable with less monetary investment. While technically Shadowverse is cheaper to build up worthwhile decks from the beginning, it has a vastly heavier turnover between expansions. Wherein like 70% of your deck will become worthless when a new expansion comes out. Whereas in Hearthstone, probably 70%+ of the cards in all of my current Un'goro decks are made up of cards from prior expansions or even basic cards.

Neither one has something that's critically needed in modern CCGs, namely things to do as interactions on the opponent's turn. But seeing as how no one seems interested in that (and I don't really like Gwent at all), I'm sticking with Hearthstone for now.

No idea how it compares to Yugioh because fuck that.

>>378393535
>Hearthstone is more playable with less monetary investment
I thought the meme was that if you havent been playing since the beginning youd need a lot of money to be competitive

>>378386195

My Jade Golem Druid deck loses to Mage every time because they negated the need to draw cards with their "Gives three cards spell that aren't in your deck" shit.

While I fish for answers they beat face. When I attack, they stall for the random board wipe. Then I die to running out of cards because their TRUE deck size is enormous.

>>378385891
>he doesnt know about speed duels

yugioh is hearthstone now senpai shits gud as fug

>>378394014

There are key cards you can ONLY get through adventures.

Then there are the Legendaries you MUST have or you lose. You get a random legendary every 22 packs or so and there are a ton of useless ones so you aren't gauranteed one that you can use.

If you choose to farm for just one, you'd need to win fifty games or so, with a subpar deck. And then you have one legendary out of three you need in the deck.

>>378394014
Nah, with the way Standard is now, there are only like three expansions or so that you need to give a shit about, and only a few cards per class (if that) in them are necessary. And with card quality going up, we aren't in the era of needing tons of legendaries for most decks. Hell, I think out of my decks for each class at the moment, only half of them even have a goddamn legendary.

Yes, if you want to be competitive right out of the gate, you'll need to spend some money. Get a hundred packs or so from the latest expansion, dust the duplicates or ones you won't ever use, craft the rares and epics or whatever from prior expansions you need, and start playing. And in the future the vast majority of what you crafted will still be viable.

Unlike Shadowverse which - while genuinely fucking good - has power creep on a whole other goddamn level. A deck from a prior expansion in Hearthstone will generally still do okay. By okay I mean go from 50% winrate to 40% or 45%. In Shadowverse you'll drop to like 5%. 10% tops.

Hearthstone has the turn 1 problem. Shadowverse has the turn 2 problem. So the difference in turn balance is basically a wash there. I like the Evolve mechanic but after hundreds of games it's not really special anymore.

imo play whichever you like more, but in terms of keeping monetary value between expansions, Hearthstone is less jewish.

>>378395242
>only half of them even have a goddamn legendary.

And to clarify I have 95% of the legendaries in the game. The rest I have the dust to craft. You simply don't need legendaries in Hearthstone at the moment to have a great win rate.

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>>378393535
Honestly it kind of depends on what deck you play. If you get lucky you can maintain a competitive deck through expansions.

But the real problem with SV right now is the terrible balancing philosophy. The devs think that rotating whatever is tier 1 out and replacing it with another deck is good balancing. Every expansion they force deck archetypes instead of letting the meta grow naturally. Right before nerfs two classes in the game had a combined playrate of 80% on ladder making midshaman look fair.

Even the Japs are hating the game right now since literal whos that aren't even master rank are beating old veterans left and right. That's how brainless the game has become.

>>378381465
this game seriously need to refresh/get quest like every 3 hours or so so it is not that harsh on new players to get gold

>>378382714
>yugioh
>mulligan
what?

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>>378395242
Respectfully I don't think you have been playing Shadowverse very much recently.
Your point about powercreep and needing a new suite of cards to play competitive decks is spot on, and I agree mostly. However, a lot of decks will get support or branch off into different types in the new expansions without needing tons of other cards to support them. Storm Haven has been around since DE. It's still pretty strong on its own when centered around Garuda, but people are teching new stuff like Dark Jeanne and Grail for lategame, and the decktype has developed a lot into more aggressive and defensive lists. Same thing for Nephthys from RoB. Still a decently strong decktype that got midgame support with the new Ledger package, but doesn't require a million new cards to be playable now.
Also almost everyone wants to go first in this expansion, partly due to the aggressive decks running rampant and the tempo advantage becoming a much bigger deal thanks to cards like Grimnir and Rahab which will actually shit all over players who can't respond to them going second.

extremely dumbed down compared to yugioh

>>378385131
I hope they do so

game is grindier than pre-big bang maplestory

>>378391201
and never actually win or may win after playing 100 matches

>>378395720
>Respectfully I don't think you have been playing Shadowverse very much recently.

To be fair I quit SV about two weeks into the latest expansion (after playing vanilla through all of RoB) when the powercreep hit like a freight train and I wasn't going to get above 25% winrate (even after opening a lot of packs with saved up rupees) without throwing down a boatload of dosh. I still really like a lot about the game, and I might come back to it sometime, but frankly as a long term investment I just decided to go back to HS after realizing that I already had like 25 / 26 of the cards needed to make most current meta decks.

Every game has its issues though.

>>378389946

Codex is designed around a system to simulate a strategic game so that works for them.

Hearthstone is a watered-down bastardization of Magic with a smattering of YuGiOh (In the way you can have creatures directly attack your opponent's creatures). So yes, removing the concept of interacting during opponent's turns and deciding how react is a big deal.

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>>378396203
I understand, SV was at its worst fucking point these last couple of months and a lot of people were driven to quit because of Cygames autistically pushing archetypes by giving broken ass """support""". I actually crafted a ton of legendaries this expansion with saved up vials so I could make vengeance blood and Nephthys and had a good amount of fun grinding out points for the Masters rewards even with all the metaslaves plaguing the ladder. Whichever way you look at it the game just needs more variety at the moment and a way different balancing strategy.

>>378395720
It depends on the deck, but he's right. Before the nerfs shit like dirt rune dropped down to 20% winrate. In fact almost every other T1 deck from the previous expansion fell down below 50% winrate. It's pretty fucking ridiculous.

We're only a week in, but preliminary data has it that not much has changed in that certain decks get absolutely dumpstered between expansions.

That's fine by itself, but it's a symptom of the awful powercreep the game has going on. Considering the devs didn't bother touching cards like grimmnir, it's just a sign of things to come.

Also worth noting that the devs said they don't care much about competitive balance. They want the game to appeal to casuals first and foremost.

>>378381465
Play-Point based games play very differently from a game like Yu-gi-oh.

That said, play Shadowverse instead. Hearthstone is extremely stingy.

>>378396517
I'm concerned that it'll follow the same path as Rage of Bahamut or whatever the failed precursor game to Shadowverse was, before Cygames seemed to pull their head out of their ass and made Shadowverse. Because they're making a lot of the same mistakes with the new xpac with their previous title that crashed and burned hard.

Not saying RoB was perfect but it felt pretty good and comfy, with a huge variety of viable deck types and balancing wasn't too heavy handed.

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>>378396531
Honestly that's just because dirt rune is a garbage deck with no win condition, and the sigil generators are tempo suicide. Winrates (at least pre-nerf) showed that outside of the midrange shadow matchup, which was completely stupid, most good decks from last expansion were doing relatively well. Roach still went positive against everyone but shadow, as well as Nephthys actually getting an overall positive winrate. The only one truly fucked over this expansion is Sword who got completely and eternally cucked.
But I do agree about the powercreep and shit, the balancing strategy is simply off, and Hector is like the most powerful card in the fucking game not to mention his deck archetype getting actual GOOD support with various cards.
Grimnir I have gotten way less mad about with the Dragon nerfs helping drop their playrate. While he's still fucking stupid, the usage of him in ramp dragon was fucking egregious.

>>378396849
>Not saying RoB was perfect
the expansion that is, not the first game. I forget what it was even called. Rage of Bahamut? Something like that.

>>378381465
It is very fun but very money depending.

If you want to shell out cash for enough packs to create meta decks it is great.

If you play casually often you will be left frustrated when opponent beat you with his better deck.

Of course, whether you play HS or SV or whatever, it's all better than spending $800 for one current meta deck in real life TCGs.

>>378381465
>Is this a decent card game?
No the game is designed by literal monkeys and each win is dependent on rng
https://clips.twitch tv/RelatedBlueMonkeySuperVinlin

>>378397035
A decent meta deck will easily run you 100+ USD in packs to at least get enough dust to craft it.

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>>378396849
Pre-nerf Dorothy and Roach decks were fucking insane though, I'm still confused how Cygames managed to get decks even stronger than those through fucking testing in the VERY NEXT EXPANSION. That was a huge warning sign to me.
Post nerf RoB was pretty nice but I didn't get to experience much of the nuances as I was spamming aggro sword and shadow to get to Master as fast as possible :^)

>>378397117
> The incredible multilayered RNG bullshit that happened here
It was a 50/50 with the brawl, then if it failed it was another 50/50 with the hero power.
This is bullshit

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>>378397117
>>378397241
Someone recently tried to tell me that RNG wasn't a large part of Hearthstone, at least not in the important meta cards.
He was a fucking idiot, and should probably kill himself out of shame.

>>378396869
It's hard to talk about winrates of other decks considering they all made up like 20% of ladder combined so not enough data. What we do know is that they were lower, significantly lower than the T1 decks.

>Defending Grimmnir
He's literally a powercreeped card. He shows up in every fucking deck. Even some aggro decks run him because why the fuck not? 3/2/3 ward is an amazing statline. Then you remember at 10pp he's a soft board clear and unconditional 4 damage to face.

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>>378397241
>>378397446
Before the clip both players were just chucking fireballs at each other for four straight turns because none of them would hit face.

>>378385470
you can still have *smart* filler. Where a card is equal or slightly worse variant of an existing core card so that it is playable and not just useless.

>>378397495
Hey, I said I was LESS mad because I was running into fewer turn 6 10pp dragons wiping my board with 5 separate boardwipes. I still think he's a dumb card. Cygames really needs to step up their 3 cost followers so people are actually obligated to run shit other than him though. For example I don't run Grimnir in my Vengeance blood deck because I need Devil of Vengeance, Succubus, and Angel of the Word.
>>378397641
People defending the Discover mechanic in that game are just completely braindead.

>>378397446
>Someone recently tried to tell me that RNG wasn't a large part of Hearthstone
This is both false and true. False in the sense that it's important. True in the sense that despite the RNG, it'll even out after enough games played, and the better players (and for the most part the ones who've played the game the longest and know how to make the 1% to 5% gamechanging decisions) will end up climbing the ladder to high Legend.
>>378397784
>People defending the Discover mechanic in that game are just completely braindead.
Honestly it's no different than when Mad Bomber was a viable card and it decided games. It's just a little more flashy.

>>378397981
Didn't some pro gamer and his buddy go into full autism mode playing this game 20 hours a day for months only to find out there's very little room for skill and eventually everything evens out?
As in there's no room for improvement in this game, and any braindead player can beat a good player just by sheer luck and it will happen often

>>378397784
>Cygames really needs to step up their 3 cost followers so people are actually obligated to run shit other than him though.
You mean continually powercreep the game instead of nerfing blatantly overstatted golds and legendaries?

Please.

>>378397981
>True in the sense that despite the RNG, it'll even out after enough games played, and the better players

that's only true given they have the same cards.

Hearthstone has a double whammy. you get bad beat variance from people with better card libraries than you and you get bad beats from people who are worse but just get lucky RNG.

>>378397641
>>378397784
Discover is a good mechanic. What needs to be altered are the pools and secondary effects.
>3 Mana 1/4 Taunt Discover a Taunt
>5 Mana 4/5 Elemental Discover an Elemental if you played an Elemental last turn
>2 Mana Discover a Mage Spell and reduce its cost by 2
>2 Mana Discover a Spell from your Deck
ESPECIALLY Primordial Glyph, that card is fucking ridiculous in both Standard and Wild.
>It's basically 2 Mana Pick a copy of the most valuable Mage Spell you will need either now or later
>It'd be almost fine if it generated a random like Unstable Portal
>It'd be almost fine if it didn't reduce cost
>It'd be fine if both
This card has single-handedly stolen games through no ability of either the player nor the opponent's lack of ability or understanding.
>Glyph into Cabalist's Tome into Glyph into Glyph into Pyroblast

>>378385470
>defending money-grabbing practices that are only good for the company selling the game
k i s s yourself

>>378398074
>As in there's no room for improvement in this game, and any braindead player can beat a good player just by sheer luck and it will happen often

No. The ladder is full of shit players who play every single day and never get past rank 12. Anyone who says "Hurr rng will carry me to high legend" is a fucking moron who'll never get past the teens. Much less ever see legend.
>>378398198
>you get bad beat variance from people with better card libraries than you
If you ever expect to get to high rank in a video game CCG, you should drop the expectation that not having a large library will ever not be a crippling handicap. No game exists where that's not a problem.

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>>378397981
>>378398074
There really is very little room for a skill ceiling in Ranked. Arena would be a better skill meter, but surprise surprise, it's even more of an RNG fuckfest thanks to drafting in general, and slapping as many value generating and Discover cards into your deck as possible.
>>378398194
I don't mean strictly more powerful 3 drops. I mean 3 drops that will be more useful to the player's game plan. I can't play Grimnir in Vengeance blood because Succubus is conducive to my game plan of doing lots of unavoidable damage to the enemy face, and Devil of Vengeance allows me to threaten them with an overstatted dude. You see how this works? They can make 3 drops that will benefit you more than Grimnir and in different ways.
>>378398207
I'm inclined to agree with you as I've heard Discover has gotten way out of hand recently as it's the feature the design team has latched onto in the last expansion or two. I will also NEVER understand cross-class discover cards. Complete fucking recipe for disaster.

I've honestly never seen the point of online CCGs. Everyone always runs the netdecks with the highest wr and it turns into a game of luckier draw, not to mention it's repetitive and boring as shit.

>>378398207
>glyph into CT into glyph into glyph into pyroblast
Congrats you just spent 7 mana to draw a card that barely has higher than a 1/1 damage mana ratio even discounted. The only way this is even an issue is if you already had the game won and were topdecking answers because you clearly weren't doing shit for an entire turn.

>>378398469
you only need boosters if thats your monetization method. there are card games where you pay money for the entire set in the expansion.

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>>378398621
Well people are always going to do that in CCG regardless. If you like to think outside the box and play fun meme decks you will have a more rewarding experience, especially if you're a good enough deckbuilder to actually make dumb strategies work competently.
Some of the actual strong decks in Shadowverse are actually fun though, Vengeance Blood requires you to put your HP to 10 or lower by turn 4 and then outvalue your opponent while simultaneously keeping their board clear.

Its a good card game. Probably the best online card due to it being so streamlined. There is a level of RNG, but a solid player should have no trouble slowly ranking up due to the new ranked floors. On the subject of buying packs, its up to you honestly you won't be able to play most of the OP decks, but there are several really good F2P decks that can compete at the higher levels. . Plenty of people are able to reach the highest rank legend using only the most basic of cards and no legendaries ex. F2P hunter. Compared to Yugioh not as much interactive, but much easier to get into due to it being online.

>>378398469
Anyone who says HS is all RNG doesn't even play the game or are too bad to know how it works. There's a reason why all the major tournaments have consistent faces. Ironically this isn't the case for SV, as the recent tourneys have had literal whos beat people who have been playing since July.

>>378398603
>I don't mean strictly more powerful 3 drops.
But that's what will happen if Cygame's balancing history is anything to go by.

>>378398917
I think there's plenty of room for 3 drops with good but not too powerful effects, especially seeing as Devil of Vengeance was an entirely useless card for the entirety of his lifespan and suddenly he's a 3 of in the best Blood deck in the game

In the end, Shadowverse and Hearthstone are both really fun. Just be ready to spend some money. If you're f2p then other games might be better for you.

>>378399428
I just play HS for Tavern Brawl. If I'm going to play an RNG shitfest it may as well be one with interesting deck construction.

>>378398985
I really don't know what your point is when every expansion has been powercreeping the game with very little alternative cards.

Even if Shadowverse is full of walletdragon (a bit less now), if you are starting I doubt you'll find many of them, and you can do well with some budget decks. There's also the rerolling thing.

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>>378381465
It's super rng heavy. Even if you're running a garbage deck just to complete a shitty quest that wants you to play 30 cards of a specific type or whatever you'll still occasionally win out of pure luck. One of the driving factors of this is the mana system. You have to draw just the right card for the level of mana you have and the state of the field. Unlike yugioh where you can play basically anything at any point in the game.

And card effects are super boring. It's not like yugioh where every monster has a unique effect. It's more like MTG effects, but even more samey. So deck building isn't very fun. You can't make some cool deck off the top of your head centered around tokens or something. There just aren't enough interesting card effects to create combos for.

And you have way less interesting gameplay because they were trying to make it really simple to play. So there's no traps or card effects that you can choose to activate in response to anything. The only traps are secrets that go off automatically even when you don't want them to, and there are only like 4 of them per class. They did this so you don't have dialogs constantly popping up asking if you want to chain something, but the result is boring gameplay.

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>>378399428
>>378399663
You don't need to spend a cent on Shadowverse. You can have a meta deck with 6+ legendaries immediately after rerolling your account if you go hard and liquefy stuff outside of that craft, but you don't have to at all. I floundered for a while because I had no idea what I wanted to play and would only liquefy extras, but I could definitely have played popular decks in low ranks if I really wanted to.
Also wallet dragon is all but dead, they're running Storm Ramp now after the nerfs. It's nowhere near the powerhouse it used to be.
>>378399595
Sounds like you have a very one-dimensional view of the game. There have been a good amount of side-grades and good techs that they have been introducing lately like Dark Jeanne, Orthrus, and Belphegor but you only seem to look at the most overpowered additions and judge the game entirely based on those.

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OKAY /v/ - VIDEO GAMES

NAME A GENUINELY GOOD CARD-GAME
IF SOMEONE NAMES A GOOD CARD-GAME, GIVEN A (YOU)
THE GAME IS ONLY GOOD IF YOU GET 5 [FIVE] (YOU)s

>>378399782
I have to play all decks available. I can't just do the one deck main thing.

>>378399818
Codex. It's not vidya, but it's good.

>>378381465
It's fun if you play it once in a while

>>378398667
That's pretty common versus Mages nowadays.
>They basically skip a turn playing with themselves and then obliterate you over the next few

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>>378399820
Yeah that was my problem and it was a while before I could get the vials together to play multiple complete decks. I've got pretty much an almost-full Shadow, Blood, and Sword collection with the vast majority of the stuff that I would actually want to play. I've got complete ledger/non-ledger Nep, midrange/aggro shadow, vengeance blood, aggro/midrange/control sword decks as well as incomplete storm haven by now and the room to make a couple more decks right now so I feel pretty comfortable (besides sword being all but unplayable right now)

>>378399818
PVZ: Heroes. Shame it's still phone-only.

>>378399992
More people should start teching in Eaters.

What is a good way to design a collectible game? What are some unique things that haven't been done?

>>378399818
>NAME A GENUINELY GOOD CARD-GAME
Magic: The Gathering

>>378400438
There's plenty, just mess with the deck construction or move outside the standard duel format and it's easy to make something unique.

>>378381465
I play but at this point I don't recommend new players unless you really want to sink money into it. Unlike real life card games you can't sell or trade cards so it's a pretty shitty investment no matter how you look at it.

>>378400765
I've considered trying a 1v1ve set up, which would make it play more like a strategy game, in theory. The issue here is that strategy games can't have as much of a barrier on what units you can have without feeling pay to win.

Trying real time would likely be a disaster if minion control is a major factor. And having them be AI wouldn't feel like the players have much agency.

>>378401768
>I've considered trying a 1v1ve set up
what do you mean 1v1ve?

>>378402056
Two players in an environment that works against both of them, be it through obstacles or uncontrolled units

>>378399782
>Sounds like you have a very one-dimensional view of the game.
I could say the same about you. Every expansion will have powercreeped cards - it is the design philosophy behind the game since RoB. To think otherwise is quite silly.

>>378381465
people meme blizz games alot and call em bad just because they're popular. But this game is actually terrible.

>>378402242
Right, but how would that work in a constructable card game format?

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>>378402286
I listed several cards that expand their crafts' library, opening up new options and synergies to be played with. These cards are neither overpowered nor unplayable and are in fact used in popular and high winrate decks. Are you going to defend your one-dimensional view of the game by breaking down the examples I provided of cards that aren't powercreep and actually improve the game or are you going to just continue saying the same thing over and over? There is plenty to complain about in the game, bad balance and powercreep included, but to say that is the only driving force behind new expansions is dishonest

>>378402458
No idea. I considered it and it seems too out there right now.

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>>378402526
How do you reconcile Bahamut and Fafnir? Sibyl as a ramp anchor? Thane and Lich? Sword's entire library being aggressive storm?

Yes, every expansion offers some variations, but they also powercreep cards/the game in general by very noticeable degrees and to think Cygames is going to stop when they've been doing it for over 6 months now is extremely naive and dishonest.

Your view of the game is one dimensional and you are hypocrite. I'm done entertaining you. Have a good night, shitposter-kun.

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>>378402928
Fafnir's simply a badly designed card, back from when they thought Dragon was going to be based around dropping a bunch of bombs and hoping your opponent runs out of answers. There are a lot of these awful cards from Standard.
There is literally nothing wrong with Thane, he is a well-designed card that is actually underplayed because Shadow got so much broken shit this expansion. No powercreep evident here, using older cards as tokens to make them relevant is actually good design, and the double Wight airdrop is a pretty decent threat.
Sword leaning more towards Storm is a misstep, but in no way powercreep. You seem to actually not know what that word means because two of your examples contain no relation to powercreep in the slightest. I'm glad you're not returning to the thread and said your goodbyes because you've realized your posts were terrible and had nothing to offer discussion-wise. Nothing in what I said suggests my view of the game is one-dimensional; I take the good and the bad, the powercreep and the well-designed cards and I evaluate them on their own merits, while you deign to judge the entire direction of the game on cards that you simply don't like.

>>378402697
If you have no idea, let me have a crack at it.
Perhaps each player has a second deck of "environment" cards, at the end of each turn they draw one and put it in the environment area where it has an effect on the game that is bad for both players. e.g. Rampaging orcs, at the end of your turn deal 1 damage to all of your creatures, (it would also be a creature so you can attack and kill them).

The idea is you load them up with cards that are worse for your opponent than yourself (e.g. the above card would go in a deck full of big creatures so they can whether the damage better).

If you're making it digital you could shuffle both players' environment decks together, so a random one comes out each turn.

>>378403294
Ooh, that's really great!

>>378403498
Glad I could help. It feels like it would be tricky to pull off, but I'm sure you can pull something out of it.

If you want to go map based like Summoner Wars you could instead of cards use Tiles and you set up your opponent's side of the board or something like that.

>>378402928
>>378403264
Fuck I'm tired, I completely missed Sibyl. Sibyl is stupidly powerful and a huge enabling card but is also in no way powercreep as she fills an entirely new archetype that ramp decks didn't have in any expansion past. That argument is entirely meaningless here.
Also realized you meant Lich King which is another really shitty card, but it fits an entirely different spot from Thane. Lich King is meant to be the largest version of the sticky Shadow followers but is another awful card that they didn't design very well. No one runs this guy and it's still not powercreep because he doesn't fill the same function as Thane.

>>378402928
You are a retard who has no idea what powercreep means.

>>378381465
Don't play hearthstone. Getting into hearthstone may or may not have been the biggest mistake of my life, the game is absolutely terrible and you spend 90% of the time just being angry about shit that's out of your control. The other 10% gives you a slight satisfaction. It's really addicting though and you'll end up playing it again and again only to have the same thing happen over and over. Un'goro has been a good expansion so far, but it doesn't matter, this is always what happens, they release a decent expansion then release like 3 garbage ones, repeat. Play Gwent or something since it just entered open beta.

DON'T. PLAY. HEARTHSTONE.

>>378404979
I forgot to mention, it got 10/10 memes, that's literally the only reason you'd ever get into it. But otherwise, STAY AWAY.

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>>378381465

I've been legend multiple times (not that hard but is a grind).. Hearthstone is the worst card game I've ever played and the developers have no idea what they're doing. The game does take some skill but there is a fuckton of RNG and way too often you feel like there's nothing you could have done to win some games. Yogg-saron is the dumbest card in the history of card games and before the nerf games and tournaments were being decided by its mega-coinflips. Right now a large portion of matches are being decided by hero power coinflips, mage card generation, and other cancerous bullshit. This isn't even mentioning how grindy and jewish the game is for a new player. Hearthstone's only saving graces are the UI and warcraft references

If you want a card game try gwent. It's not as pretty and needs a few touch ups, but it's mechanically a much better game