A lot went right. What went wrong?

I started playing it again on nightmare a couple months after beating it, and I got to the argent tower finale and it keeps locking my pc. what the fuck. the only way I was able to fix it was to lower all my settings down to low, window the game, and turn the resolution down to the lowest.
other than that I guess mantle doesn't work how I hope it should most of the time

>>377616004
Multiplayer sucked and was very unfun. Snapmap was clearly an afterthought and was too limited.

Gameplay should have been faster without upgrade shit from the beginning.
Leveldesign needed more maze.
Monster traps like in old doom instead of shitty wave spawn tumor.
The enemies pinata'd too many items.

Multiplayer and custom maps.
Singleplayer was pure GOTY though.

>>377616004
>upgrade system
>not enough backtracking and exploration of level to find key cards and have some quiet time between slaying daemons
>muh ebic kill cams got old REALLY quick
>dabbing in multiplayer
>multiplayer

>>377616004
having to restart the game when you switch modes

No singleplayer dlc

>>377616303
You playing it with the Vulkan API?

No modding tools. Fuck you id and Bethesda

Those shit mods that it inspired

Should have been a hack and slash where you play as one of those knight fags DoomSlayer belonged to and cut demons MGR style

>>377617112
>Doom spin off inspired by Demonsteele

snapmap was a dissapointment, the amount of demons on screen was pitiful

>>377616882
there's no good mods you can make for a modern AAA shooter

>>377616004
Painkiller game formula instead of Doom game formula.

>samey arenas
>no SP expansions
>some weapon upgrade paths are flat out worse than the alternatives
>challenges/masteries got old and annoying real quick, same as Wolfenstein

>>377616004
level and sound design were ass

>>377616004
Glory kills got too much focus
Assault Rifle was underpowered
In general I'm not a fan of respawning enemy waves but DOOM pulled it off
Multiplayer is boring
Pistol shoots energy blasts and has unlimited ammo but still ejects a shell after every shot ???

>>377617696
Modding can improve anything, even shit that looks beyond help like Minecraft or any Bethesda game.

Also every single Doom game had modding support besides Doom 2016, this is not okay.

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>>377616004
>A lot went right.

Like what?

The areas are over-designed and extremely saturated, causing enemies to frequently blend in if you aren't six feet away from them. Instead of health packs you have to watch the same three second kill cutscene every single time. Enemies don't fire projectiles that are difficult to dodge, they fire homing projectiles. Many of the guns feel as though they have no weight or damage output. There is obnoxious movement blur you can't toggle off. By the end of the game everything feels trivial because you have so many perks (retarded idea) and guns that you can circle strafe the final boss and hold M1 even on the hardest difficulties. It doesn't even run at 60fps on the most optimal machines.

Nice try Todd, but Doom 2016 isn't a very good game. There's a reason everyone has already forgotten about it.

>>377617819
They call "modding" snapmap trout carp!

It was honestly as close to perfect as can be.

it's biggest flaw however, is being arena based. the few actual level based segments with enemies are the best parts

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>>377618156
>It was honestly as close to perfect as can be.

Pathetic attempt

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looks like /v/ is now entering it's typical contrarian mode.

"X was good and it was successful, therefore we must hate it and we never liked it because it was always shit and everything went wrong"

never change, /v/

>>377616004
Upgrade system functionality
Upgrade system necessitating secret hunting
Upgrade system necessitating challenge rooms
The occasional platforming section
The one or two times where the game stops to loredump at you, like at Hayden's Office where you can't leave.

>>377618285

It's a cynical cash-in. Now whenever you type "Doom" into Google you see the shitty new Doom instead of the real one, and thus idiot children such as yourself will think that's the one everybody is always praising.

>>377616546
>he likes the backtracking
Holy shit, what garbage taste. That was the worst part of the original DOOM. Not the exploration--that was fine--it's having to do nothing while traversing a fucking maze of a level, searching for keycards. That's not fun, it's just busywork.

>>377618462
I'd rather they found D44M than call of duty or other shooters. As far as modern shooters go, the fact that D44M sticks closest to many of it's roots, is for the best. no reloading, no stamina bars, no 2 weapon loadout bullshit, (multiplayer notwithstanding) entirely optional story and "lore" that you can ignore, etc

>>377618775
>the fact that D44M sticks closest to many of it's roots

Many of these are superficial. That new Quake Heroes thing feels more like original Doom than this does.

>>377618062
I really, REALLY like this picture!

>>377618062
>>377618268
>Todd
Has nothing to do with DOOM, retard.

>>377619004
it's not superficial at all, the game has good enemy variety, melee enemies that have been missing from FPS, along with dodging with is even more rare than them, good frantic pace in the fights, the game doesn't let you take a break and hide in cover as modern shooters do

There are flaws but D44m did many things right, it's much better than Doom 3 was

>>377618462
>i don't like it
>that makes it a cash-in

>>377619237
>Doom (2016)
>Not "Doom: The New Era" or "Return to Doom"
>just Doom

This is how cashing in on old brand names works. You get as close to the original as you can in terms of recognition.

No demon footsteps, resulting in even the biggest shit like pinkies and barons sneaking up on you
Also no single player DLCs and shitty ending, that cliffhanger so Jewthesda could make a sequel few years later is the biggest corporate sellout moment in the history of gaming.

Nu-doom has nowads

>>377618462
>These people liking something I don't like are children, they don't enjoy mature things like I do.
That is how you sound.

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Game starts to get repetitive after a while. There's just not enough to break up standard encounters, I wish there was better platforming and better bosses to make the campaign feel more distinct and varied. I can't remember that many moments from the campaign because it started getting very same'y after a while.

The upgrade system was also shit because it fucked with the balance of the game.

>>377619472
At least there are mods inspired from it like D4D, D4T and what else?

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>>377619578
>using a fallacy that didn't even make sense in 2008

>corpses disappear
>arena based encounters that get repetitive and boring too quick
>underpowered guns in the final levels
>nightmare dificulty is broken because fucking enemies keep spawning
>unnessesary story
>execusions were ok but got repetitive
>only one good track(bfg division)
>fucking corpsses disappearing
>shit bosses
>not using the original art style from the first 2 games (it was inspired by giger's work)
>not backtracking in levels to find secrets
>the old levels play's like shit
>weapon and character upgrades, there's even a fucking perk that tells you when you are close to a secret
>FUCKING CORPSSES DISAPPEARING
The gunplay and enemy reactions were very good tho, if only you could see all the afthermath after every fight

>>377617754
Not a bad thing when Painkiller is the superior game.

Wishlist for the sequel that they'll surely announce this E3?

>>377619357
>publishers trying to make an extra dollar
>looks like the whole game is garbage!

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>>377619357
because D44M is a soft reboot.

it's honestly quite clever.

It's a reboot, so it's just called DOOM, but it's also a sequel. So technically it's also Doom 4. But it's been too long since Doom 3 to call it Doom 4 without people avoiding it due to baggage, or not having been alive when the originals were around, so the way they did it, this sort of back door reboot, was I think, genius.

the plebs play it and say "hey this is a neat new game with a neat story and gameplay" while Doom fans play it and say "wait a minute, this is a sequel..."

>>377619875
>I'm here to defend those poor defenseless multi-billion dollar corporations

>>377619984
Imagine what a fucking dolt you must be if he chooses to back those.

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>>377616004
Very little went right 2bh. Almost everything went right
>Full of cinematic shit, including real fucking cutscenes. (inb4 "t-they're just few seconds, goy!!")
>All guns suck. Unless you use upgrades. No penetration, no kick.
>Armor is literally a 2nd HP bar that depletes first, instead of just reducing damage.
>You can barely hold any ammo. Unless you level-up your stats.
>Checkpoints.
>Maps are linear pipes, connecting obligatory combat arenas you get locked into.
>Yet you got mission reminders, mission-location indicators, compass with an arrow....etc.
>Platforming sections. With insta-death pits. Seriously?
>Only around half-a dozen enemies on screen at once, not counting "zombies". No Pinkie packs.
>Berserk pack is a timed boost that makes you invincible and unable to use guns.
>Rune challenges are just annoying filler.
>Everything glows.
>A goddamn robo-guy literally handholds you through the game, via radio.
>No mods, and the Snapmap is literally just all about connecting handful of pre-made rooms together, with strict enemy limit.
>Only 4 players max in Snapmaps (yeah they're apparently NOW "fixing" this).
>MP is Halo-tier shit. Period.
>Spider is the last boss, and is not hitscan anymore either.
>No, hitscan enemies are not a cancer. I miss my easy to gib shotgun zombies.
>Bosses have HP bars and almost Zelda-style attack patterns.
>Ending was literally a slap to face + "lol, look forward to teh sequel, goy!"

The fact that people praise this shit (which already has next to no players now) just shows how desperate people are for good games.

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>>377619958
>it's honestly quite clever.

Give me a fucking break please. You can find ten games in the last year or two alone where they used this identical "clever" strategy. If you think that is in any way creative or interesting maybe you really are ten years old.

>>377619984
Keep moving those goal posts, Anon.

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>>377619958

this is the most disingenuous manipulative corporate dick sucking post I have ever seen

>>377616004
The marketing. Why the hell would they release a multiplayer demo over the singleplayer one?

>>377619958
This.
The name sucks, but this is the reason why they chose it. It's why other long-standing franchises have done this as well; just look at MK if you want a good example. And I'd say MK really benefitted from it.

>>377616004
I'm just angry this shit got released instead of a new Wolfenstein.

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>>377618285
the game has problems but yeah /v/ can never be happy
I've seen people here unironically say doom 3 was better and that's what really kills me

It's still pretty embarrassing the way they handled Doomguy. It's like someone saw a few RIP AND TEAR memes and decided "hey it'd be sooo cool if we did this!"

What mods did this game inspire?
Are they good?

>>377620473
It would have been better if they just went with Doom: Subtitle really

wouldn't affect people's perceptions go with Doom: Hellslayer or whatever

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>>377617784
>sound design was ass
You take that back right now

>>377619958
>while Doom fans play it and say "wait a minute, this is a sequel..."

That's being generous. The real thought of most Doom fans is "oh fuck, the company responsible for raping Fallout is cashing in on this game I love, better ignore it and play the original games I enjoyed instead."

>>377620727
>>377618285
>Every criticism is contrarian
I just hate this blissful ignorance / shill mentality.

>>377620916
not him, but he's right.

>>377616004
Great game but for fuck's sake- if you're going to have pre-scripted takedowns make at least a few different animations for each enemy. It stops being rad after the 100th time and is just a chore.

>>377621160
don't be melodramatic, in terms of level design, enemy variety, enemy speed, Doom 2016 is closer to the originals than Doom 3

>>377621430
>compared to fetid old dog shit, this slightly newer dog shit is much better

>>377621540
Yeah compared to Doom 3, D44m is much better, isn't this worth praising?

You're complaining too much, some franchises have been butchered left right and center while D44m managed to avoid many pitfalls of modern shooters. it is not without its flaws but it would be stupid not to give it some credit at least

>>377616004
>What went wrong?
Too short.
Snapmap isn't that good: both map making and modding are very limited, and they attached some sort of weird retarded XP/level up system to it so most played/popular maps are the most efficient in terms of xp/minute.
No instant replayability, arcade mode is fun and so is ultra-nm, but I don't know.
I don't care about multiplayer really.

Otherwise a really good game, I was sincerely impressed, but I also admit I was expecting the biggest shit in the universe so maybe the impact it had on me is higher because of that.

>>377621720
>I was expecting the biggest shit in the universe
Same here. It was a nice surprise at the very least. I had wrote Doom the fuck off after 3 but this one was fun as fuck.

>>377616004
>A lot went right
wrong
>What went wrong?
literally every single thing

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>>377621720
>I was expecting the biggest shit in the universe
And I got just that.
It's weird that people seriously can't seem to gather up enough info from the pre-release materials to form up a realistic picture of the upcoming product. While everyone and their mothers were whining out loud about the MP beta, I was trying to point out all the dangers the SP would have, with little success. Then when the game came out and all of the worst predictions did indeed turn out to be true, the gray masses were merely relieved that SP wasn't AS BAD as the MP beta... and suddenly it's their GOTY candidate??

>>377622006
>>377622149
trying too hard to fit in

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>>377622286
Sucking Bethesda's cock is the ultimate "trying to fit in" of post 2016.

Thinking that nuDuum and all the other half a dozen recent reboots of the past few years are somehow groundbreaking or even good? That's just having shit taste and no standards. Sorry that I cannot be happy about couple baby-steps towards "right" direction, after dozens of huge leaps backwards in the past two generations as a whole.

Nor do I appreciate or accept literal undermining and blackmailing of user feedback and restricting freedom of speech with (unlawful) C&D messages to public, anonymous websites and video upload services, just so that the initial reception would appear more positive to ignorant masses.

>>377621254
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHRuTYtSbJQ
kys

>>377622645
you're still doing it, D44m was not perfect but it was not trash as you imply

>>377622676
>thinking that sounds "good", or represents the entire audio world of the game
>>>/school/

>>377622761
No game is perfect. NuDuum just is extremely over-hyped AND shilled trash.

>>377618732
It's a pretty good example of why nostalgiafaggotry is the worst

>>377622826
>Thinking its meant to me a musical masterpiece
Its supposed to keeping you killing, and they often succeed with the music

>>>/Hell/

>that 360 /v/ did on the game after it became too popular
nice

>>377616004
first playthrough on ultraviolence and it was fun and chellenging. It would be 2x fun if i could sprint.

>>377621160
>The real thought of most Doom fans
99% of the "Doom fans" I know liked it, then went back to playing the originals just like I did.
Being a long time "Doom fan" doesn't turn you into some kind of vidya prophet anyways, I still don't understand why people are so eager to show their "Doom fan" medal at any chance, the game's been out for more than 20 years and it's always been critically acclaimed, even my mom played it at this point, you're not that special.

I unironically enjoyed Doom 3 more than Doom 4, while 4 is definitively closer (but still far away) to the original than 3. I also didn't like the new story they brought in. The hell-expeditions and stuff is cool and fitting but I really dislike that they had to go with the "doom slayer" stuff instead of just going: here is you, a regular human marine. Pick up this gun and murderfuck all the demons. No you HAD to be some kind of ultimate uber-entity instead of regular Joe kicking ass.

music sucked and the levels really weren't "mazey" enough. could have used better monster placement instead of just horde mode spawns in every room too. gameplay itself was pretty good though and it's a good starting point for sequels that can fix up some of that shit

>>377623140
People love their ecred

>>377623165
Doomguy wasnt a normal person either. He had a rabbit and they killed it. Thats enough to turn any man into a monster.

It's amazing to me that after all this time, the only defense against any criticism of the game is still "lol contrarian." A whole year and you people still can't come up with a better defense?

>>377620202
>HE IS DEFENDING THING I DONT LIKE
>SHIIILL SHIIIILL

>>377623660
Plenty of flaws get acknowledged
It's only when you go for max /v/ cred >awful game 0/10 I'd rather staple my balls to by toes that people start calling you a ridiculous cunt

>>377622972
>Its supposed to keeping you killing
yeah, that techno crap with random bits playing whenever you run a GK on a demon totally did that to me... NOT.

>>377616004
How well optimized is it for toasters? Planning it to pick it up during the summer sale. Have a 7870, don't care about graphics.

>>377616004
>10 corridor into arena
>20 kill a few doods that will dispense ammo on kill
>30 goto 10

>>377623836
Spare me.
>>377618285

>>377623973
Pretty well, the 7870 will do well enough

>>377616004
The dlc was all for multiplayer instead of single player.

An extra level to give closure to the cliffhanger ending would have been perfect

>>377624096
wow it's almost like both extremes exist and you're not being dishonest by cherrypicking the post that supports your point while ignoring the ones that don't
This is the point where I'm calling you a ridiculous cunt for using these cheap-ass tactics

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>>377621254
did you even read my comment? I said the game HAS PROBLEMS

>>377624261
Yeah except those posts exist in literally every doom thread, and there are plenty of them every time. This thread is actually pretty tame in comparison to most, since the word "contrarian" has only been used twice.

>>377623913
>... NOT

13 year old girl detected

>>377622826
what modern game do you think does a way better job of being an old school FPS then doom 4

>>377619602
>Game starts to get repetitive after a while. There's just not enough to break up standard encounters

Name me a single action FPS that doesn't have this problem.

>>377625549
Serious Sam
Painkiller

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>>377619602
>Game starts to get repetitive after a while
I mean yeah its kill room after kill room but the enemies have such varied abilities it often feels different for me
>better platforming
I found the platforming to be way less annoying then most fps platforming I mean yeah it wasn't that hard but at least it wasn't a bitch
>better bosses
the cyberdemon could have used more health he goes down to easy but he's fun to fight same with the spider mastermind but the hell guards suck I agree with that
>The upgrade system was also shit because it fucked with the balance of the game
yeah they did this so that the game wouldn't be too challenging which is unfortunate but the game doesn't make you upgrade if you choose so and sometimes going crazy on demons with OP weapons can be really fun if you just wanna fuck around the worst part about the upgrade system for me was that you couldn't downgrade after upgrading to challenge yourself

>>377625549
Doom
Doom 2

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>>377626284
>serious sam doesn't get repetitive

I love the series but seriously pic related

>>377618268
Nice argument, meme spouting loser.

>>377618062
I think you need to upgrade I ran the game at 90fps 2560x1440 with all setting on max. The game looked fantastic and ran fantastic

>>377626882
You said "problem." It's not a problem for Serious Sam because the game is still entertaining. DOOM is not.

>>377627146
don't type words into my mouth I was just replying because you said Serious Sam doesn't get repetitive which is false

you're basically saying that everyone that beat Doom 4 just beat it once and had no initiative to go back because the repetitive killing unlike in serious sam is boring I and my over 100+ hours in doom 4's SP mode disagrees

>>377621160
Why does being a Doom fan should make you into the average parroting obsidrone who cant stop crying about Bethesda boogeyman? Fuck off, fallout always had trash gameplay anyway, Doom is a legit great game, even today.

>>377626284
Delusional fanboy. Serious sam is the perfect example of a game getting so repetitive it makes people drop it halfway, literally nothing but killing the same waves of AI lacking monsters, horrible game design.

>>377616004
No mod support.

Personally:
Arena-style maps
Not a fan of the music

>>377627146
Serious sam is borig as fuck ffs, stop overhyping your brainless shooter. Croteam sucks at level design.

I'd have appreciated an optional mode with even less exploration and plot. Just a lot of arena sections with a trillion demons to kill.

Kinda like the Arcade Mode, but adapted to cut through all the bullshit.

>>377627146
Serious Sam is beyond boring

>>377628326
>>377628734
If Serious Sam is boring, then what does that say about nuDoom?

>it's a "I have no defense for this game so I'll shit on other games" episode
Shouldn't these guys be busy marketing for Quake Champions?

>>377625549
Doom
Quake
Quake 2 (to some extent)
Unreal
Half-Life 1
Half-Life 2 Episodes 1 & 2 (original game gets tedious though)

There's more but that's just off the top of my head. For some of the games I listed, it's because they're fairly short (hl2's episodes), but D44M got tedious for me two levels in.

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>>377623913
>totally did that for me... NOT
By god, its almost like you have absolutely no testosterone in your entire body

>>377625549
Duke Nukem 3D
FEAR
Shadow Warrior

>>377625549
Return to Castle Wolfenstein

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>>377627146
Serious Sam 3 has awful level design, the first levels are fucking trash because Croteam was making a Call of Duty esque game yet they still reused those shitty levels for SS3. The last level of SS3 is a fucking corridor where 2 trillion things spawn. SS3 is severely overrated, if we're talking recent shooters since the better SS games such as The Second Encounter were easily 10+ years ago.

The Hell bits weren't as interesting as the UAC levels

>>377629967
Who said anything about 3?

>>377630131
The UAC levels were just Doom 3 UAC levels with some open areas thrown in.

>>377618062

Glory Kills were all less than a second long (the devs made sure of this) and they don't REPLACE health packs, they're IN ADDITION to health packs. You don't have to use Glory Kills and on higher difficulties, it's not really worth it since you only get like 2-5 health per kill. They're really mostly useful if you're on the verge of death since they drop more then. You can even get runes to make Glory Kills faster if you want.

Did you actually play the game?

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>>377630131
All i want is a kf2 / risk of rain styled last stand co-op mode and it will be perfect.

Post your level 1 scores shitters

>>377616390
so less depth? lol okay.

>>377630287
>and they don't REPLACE health packs, they're IN ADDITION to health packs.
That's even worse though.

>>377616004
>what went right
looks good
performance is good generally
>what went wrong
everything that matters unfortunately
>movement
>enemies
>weapons
>levels
all terrible, half baked ideas or just plain broken
It's pretty amazing that they managed to fuck it up so badly and convince people that it is anything like the originals
anyone defending this game or it's dogshit "mechanics" need to get their head checked.

>>377618303
bollocks.

>>377630287
>You don't have to use Glory Kills
You don't have to use upgrades.
You don't have to use the chainsaw.
You don't have to use runes.
You don't have to play the game the way it was built.

>>377630458
>making the game easier
>"depth"

If i could change one thing it would be to either fix or remove the plasma gun because it fucking sucked

>>377618303
>The one or two times
It was more than that man, they did it at least once in nearly every level. Obviously some times were a lot longer than others though.

>>377630571
Excellent argument.

>>377623913
You know what would be even better to "keep you killing"? Not making you go collectible hunting for bullshit upgrades. I'd be way happier with the game if it was just a straight slog through hordes of enemies, but instead its enter the arena and shoot a bunch of enemies that just spawn right in, shoot a few enemies on your way to the next arena, or do neither and, again, hunt for collectibles to make you better at killing things.

>>377630487

How is it worse?

>>377630573

It's not the same as just ignoring an entire system. If Glory Kills are inconvenient or don't work well enough for you, just don't hit RS. Problem solved. They're designed to be helpful but optional. That IS their design. I don't get why you're confused.

>>377616004
Multiplayer was a cheap knock-off of CoD mixed with Halo, seems appropriate since the MP dev has worked on MP for both franchises. Foregoing actual mod or custom content support like ID has always been known for with Snapmaps.

Really no complaints at all about the single player absolutely loved it, reminds me why I take people's opinions here with a grain of salt because there were so many people on /v/ saying it was shit.

>>377630849

Play Arcade Mode.

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>>377630979
>playing DOOM on a console

>shit soundtrack
>default shotgun is shit
>levels are gigantic instead of a good linear progression despite there being few secrets to make exploring feel worthwhile
>fucking grenade throw straight out of Halo
>that part where they literally lock you in a room to shove a plot dump down your throat
>melee has this weird habit of missing: its hard to describe, but i'll be right next to some staggered enemy, hit the melee prompt, and end up missing them entirely and just swinging at empty air

>>377630979
>console shitter thinks he knows anything about game design
>>377631189
arcade mode is a joke and offers absolutely nothing new

>>377631175
Even if they were given a game that gameplay wise was a carbon copy of Doom or Doom II just with DOOM graphics they would have complained. Nobody here likes video games, they just like the idea of the video games they played when they were children.

Singleplayer was an 8/10
Multiplayer and Snap map are a 3.5/10

seriously fuck them for not creating mod tools, it's a disgrace considering the legacy of the original doom

>>377631454
>shit soundtrack

I don't even need to read the rest of your points, but I'm sure they're equally retarded.

Could have had more interesting levels than enter room, defeat 5 waves, enter room, defeat 5 waves.

Enemy variety could have been better

>>377630979
>How is it worse?
You're asking me how it's worse that the game gives you even more health packs than the plenty it already offers, making it significantly less difficult?

>>377630979
>it's not the same as just ignoring an entire system
Ignoring an entire system is absolutely equivalent to ignoring an entire system.
>They're designed to be helpful but optional. That IS their design.
Like upgrades?

>>377630979
>RS
Way to completely lose all your credibility.

>>377631970
>significantly less difficult
Not that guy but I see you didn't read his initial post. Its arguable that on the hardest difficulty it is a worse idea to go for glory kills because the 2-5 health gives you isn't worth the compromising position you have to put yourself in to go for them.

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>>377629967
>SS3 is severely overrated,
On the total, polar opposite. It's underrated as fuck, and first it was totally ignored as Skyrim, BF3 and whatnot came out at the same time, and now it's being blashed by nuDuum fanbois who are buttmad about a small slavic AA dev group doing better job at making a "Doom 4" than nu-ID.

SS3 > TSE > TFE > SS2

>>377630849
>You know what would be even better to "keep you killing"? Not making you go collectible hunting for bullshit upgrades.
this, 100%.
Anyone claiming D4 plays or feels anything like ye olde shooters of 90s is a literal 2010s kid.

>>377631189
Not an argument nor the same thing.
The arcade mode is almost WORSE than the main game, and shows total ignorance and lack of commitment from the devs of this shitty game.

>>377631881
What do you mean? You had
>enemy that doesn't move much and shoots projectiles
>enemy that moves a lot and shoots projectiles
>bullet sponge enemies that shoot projectiles 1-5
>enemy that rushes you 1-4
>enemy that rushes you, but this time is invisible
>"enemy" that does zero damage and can be discarded with a single bullet
>floating enemies that shoot projectiles
>floating enemies that explode

>>377630652
>plasma gun sucked
>short cd aoe stun sucks
come on now

>>377632262
Just because he said that doesn't mean it's true.

>>377632434
But it's completely true

>>377632567
Whatever you say.

>>377630287
>it adds even more health packs than you need
>but it's useless on higher difficulties
Do you not realize you're doing more to prove what a bad system it is than you are to defend its existence?

>>377630203
I thought the discussion was about recent shooters.

>>377632280
Having similar enemies does not make the games the same. SS3 has a lot of hitscan shit like the scorpions, terrible level design overall. Some pyramid levels are like a series of very narrow corridors. No, this is not acceptable at all.

The last level of SS3 is all about figuring where the enemies are coming from, how the pathfinding works and just backtracking while shooting. The level design is just not engaging at all and you know the first levels are absolutely garbage. The problem is that the rest of them is also quite mediocre.

>>377633054
>I thought the discussion was about recent shooters.
Literally nothing should have given you that impression.

>>377631234
>>377631479
>>377632207

I played on PC using a controller. That aside, why not address my point instead of focusing on what input method I used to play the game?
>>377631970

Again, have you played the game? Unless you're on the verge of death, Glory Kills give next to no health. On higher difficulties they're more of a risk than a way to get out of a tough spot.

>>377632129

No, not like upgrades you twat. Upgrades are an integral part of the game (unless you play Arcade, in which case they're already unlocked) that will bar you from ways to use your weapons u less you unlock them. Glory Kills are literally just sub-one-second animations that give you a small bit of health and/or armor depending on your setup. They're not necessary and are designed that way. Upgrades were designed for you to progress and unlock more powerful and varied abilities as you run into more and more difficult enemies.

Fuck. This isn't rocket surgery.

>>377616303
NEVER EVER

>>377632280

>SS3 is totally Doom 4 guys!

>The shittiest SS ranking that you could possibily conceived. Especially after bitching about MY PURITY OF THE 90S

This is some top shelf shit opinion you got there, champ.

>>377633295
>I played on PC using a controller.
I actually agree with you, but I wouldn't blame them for not wanting to continue talking to a self professed retard.

How come there are always people complaining about the glory kills but you were never actually supposed to use them?

In fact, the higher the difficulty, the less useful they were. On nightmare I avoided them completely because they would get me insta-killed the moment the animation ended.

>>377633050

But that anon said that Glory Kills were used "instead of" health packs and that just isn't true. Health Packs are still your primary way of regaining health. On Normal and maybe Hard they can be a benefit but on Nightmare and up they're more risk than they're worth because you get less health per kill and enemies do a fuckton of damage.

I don't get what's so hard for you. It's useful in lower difficulties and less so on higher difficulties. This was obviously intentional or they wouldn't have changed the health values on higher difficulties. It's intended that players gradually use fewer Glory Kills a they get used to the game.

UNSKIPPABLE
CUTSCENES

Seriously, fuck that part in Hayden's office. Any portion of unskippable cutscenes in video games can ruin replayablity.

>>377633568

The game plays fine with a controller and it's comfier from my bed.

I'll never get bothering with KB+M for anything other than online multiplayer and maybe Serious Sam style shooters. Controller works fine for almost everything else Single Player.

>>377633606
you get more health pickups if you perform a glory kill compared to just killing them with weapons

>>377616390
>Level design needed more maze.
Fuck that, everything would have to look the same

>>377633864
>3 minutes in 10 hours
>ruin the game

>>377633930
I know that but on higher difficulties 4/5 times the glory kill will cost you more health than it gives you because as soon as the animation finishes you get hit by all sorts of projectiles. I rarely found it useful, yet people keep saying how the gameplay was built around it and you can't just ignore it completely. I can only see them being useful on easy/normal.

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>>377616004
I don't like how the game shuttled you from arena to arena, and it was basically like a glorified arcade mode as you enter an arena, maybe there's a powerup or otherwise ammo everywhere, and you bounce around slaughtering everything.

But at the same time, I really don't miss keycard hunts.

>>377634297
I played it on Nightmare and found myself wanting to do them because muh health kits. I understand what they went for, but I don't think the pinata enemies were a good solution.

>>377633295
>why not address my point instead
you don't have one, all you are doing is regurgitating PR fluff and making excuses
>le rocket surgery.
congrats you are the target audience for this neutered excuse of a game

>>377633295
>w-wait I wasn't playing on console, I was just intentionally gimping my experience!

>>377633295
>Upgrades are an integral part of the game
No they most certainly are not.

>>377633715
>This was obviously intentional or they wouldn't have changed the health values on higher difficulties. It's intended that players gradually use fewer Glory Kills a they get used to the game.
[citation needed]

>>377633295
>rocket surgery

How are you getting this many replies while being this obvious

>>377633606
If you're not supposed to use them then why were they put in the game?

At this point all you people are doing is making baseless assumptions as your defense. I even like glory kills, but that doesn't stop me from being blind to the flaws of the system.

Yeah singleplayer was great ( I really love story) but multiplayer was a little slow, and boring.

Doom 2016 was repetitive as shit

I think the only people who like this game are people who played it in short bursts instead of the whole way through

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>>377616004
>What went wrong?

Nothing worth mentioning.
I knew it gon b gud when I heard "Rip and tear" right in the beginning.

The funny thing about the glory kills giving health is that it's completely useless at all levels of play because the game showers you with health as soon as you need it and all you have to do is kill something.

>>377630287
They really do replace health packs, in the sense that they are a significantly more prevalent way to replenish health. Health packs supplement glory kill heals, not the other way around.

You may have a couple of health packs in your skatepark, but considering the damage enemies deal (meaning one health pack really doesn't do much for you), that a single pinata heal gives more health than a health pack when you're on low hp, and that glory kills are easily abused, they're just better overall.

Finally, you're ignoring several consequences of the glory kill system, like how the chainsaw was butchered to make it a gimmick instead of a useful tool in your arsenal, or that damage is balanced around being able to glory kill (e.g. the shotgun is so shitty against weak mobs because the designers want you to be able to weaken them then glory kill them). Even if you do your best to avoid using the glory kill system, these are aspects of the glory kill system you simply cannot ignore.

>>377630979
>How is it worse?
What you're implying is that you can ignore the glory kill system on higher difficulty, because of the presence of health packs. If we assume this is true, then there is an overabundance of healing resources, which trivializes resource management.

>>377635528
Guilty. Played about one level an evening after work, so had fun for a few days. I agree thought, don't think I would replay it anytime soon.

>>377616004
The multiplayer was outsourced to a less competent studio who weren't in close enough contact with id to properly emulate the feel of the singleplayer and who did a mediocre job in general. The Snapmap also isn't nearly as powerful as it needs to be to allow for modders to match the sheer variety that WADs for the first two games have.


There's also only three boss encounters and they're deeply flawed.
>All three take place in largely featureless arenas that make no use of the movement mechanics of the game and feel bland compared to the more rich and complex ones found in normal gameplay
>The first makes no usage of movement beyond basic dodging except for when the Cyberdemon sends three energy waves after closing off your flanks that you have to avois - but it is in the same pattern everytime, removing all real skill from it
>It's also mostly just a bullet sponge you dump ammo in
>Second with the Hell Knights completely cuts the platforming stuff and gives the dual boss stage a joint health bar so you never have to really think about which you're shooting or try to focus one down
>Spider is actually almost decently designed aside from it never trying to get in close to attack you and just letting you kite it, but the platforming stuff is still pretty simple and largely amounts to just jumping on a pillar to avoid the electricity attacks

They also all come in the final two hours so they've no excuse for being so simple, they should have been real tests of ALL your skills - not just your ability to strafe and dump ammo at a large target continuously, with MAYBE a bit of jumping.


Fantastic game otherwise, an easy 9/10

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>actually liked the game
>can't criticize it or else I'm contrarian or didn't play it

>It's a great game
>IT'S SHIT
>Nah, it's perfectly alright
>IT'S STILL SHIT
>Nah, dude, the game is fun as fuck and does a lot of things right
>WHAT ABOUT THESE THINGS THAT ARE SHIT
>Alright, yeah, the game has flaws, but it still--
>SEE? THE GAME IS SHIT.

Every DOOM thread ever

>>377637416
>Every [GAME] thread ever
ftfy

>>377637416
>I
>AM
>SILLY

>>377616389
These. Also single player was too short, and while the arenas were fun they took up too much of the game. They need to balance them out with some more traditional enemy placement in the inevitable sequel. Also Cyberdemon not being a regular enemy later on is gay.

>>377617762
>some weapon upgrade paths are flat out worse than the alternatives
Yeah, this was something I noticed too.

>Shotgun
Three round burst quickly becomes irrelevant after starting out as your highest dps early on. Useless by the time you get a rifle.
4/10
The grenade is always solid due to it popping most grunts in one hit, though the SS does this too.
6/10
>Heavy Assault Rifle
Sniping is shit in this game. Even the damage increase isn't enough to match the minigun without constant headshots.
3/10
Micro missiles are okay for the dps but really need to be fully upgraded to be worth it. Okay but also outclassed later on.
6/10
>Plasma Rifle
Built up shot is a good aoe attack to use when swarmed due to the lack of self damage. Situational but effective.
6/10
Stun shot trivialises pinkies and makes many of the larger foes more manageable for the whole game. Quite literally is never not handy to have.
10/10
>Rocket Launcher
Remote detonation offers tiny benefits until fully upgraded, at which point it doubles the damage of each rocket should you time them well - but this requires you to be at range to do it consistently, which also means your fire rate is slowed to accomodate timing detonations.
6/10
Lock-on is just a straight upgrade that is never not better than firing normally when fully maxed out.
7/10
>Gauss Rifle
Zooming in is a good way to get more bang for your buck but is really only usable in the larger areas.
6/10
Siege-mode when fully upgraded is the second highest burst damage in the game and lets you gib nearly every enemy in one shot on a headshot. But it's very situational until maxed out.
8/10
>Heavy machinegun
The spin upgrade is just a QoL feature and a damage buff essentially. Pretty good overall.
7/10
The portable sentry upgrade makes this the highest dps weapon in the game when maxed out but is awkward to use until then. Pretty fucking good overall.
8/10

shit multiplayer
no maps
no strafe jumping
no mods
no proper chainsaw weapon
no resource management
hardly any handplaced encounters
no monster closets

>say you can just walk past the story if you don't want to care about it
>forces you multiple times to stand still and listen to it before you can move on
I'm okay with everything else.

>>377638408
>no strafe jumping
Fuck off quake fanboy

I just wanted the Harvester and Prowler as enemies in SP.

I actually picked this game up for the first time since it originally came out, and holy hell, I had forgotten exactly how much fun this game really is.

So long as we can all agree that, even with the flaws, it's a damn fine game, way the fuck better than we had any right to expect in 2016, and its flaws are more jumping off points for improvement in the inevitable sequel, than straight impediments to enjoyment in this game.

>>377638757
strafe jumping is not exclusive to quake

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NOT FAST ENOUGH

>>377639697
In the context of a Doom thread complaining about the lack of strafe jumping is the surest possible giveaway that the poster is some Quake dickrider mad that id catered to the Doom fanbase instead of them.

>>377639680
I agree. This game is Metal Gear Rising levels of 'so close to perfect it hurts'

>>377639842
Doom 3 had strafe jumping and the multiplayer was far better for it. I didn't mention straferunning because it's not present in id tech.

>>377640005
id tech 2 and up*

>>377640005
Doom 3 isn't a real Doom game.

>>377616004
>nightmare gets too easy because of the quick upgrades.
>the checkpoint system needs a rework
>equiment underused
>Mp is terrible

>>377640179
It's more Doom than 2016

>>377640383
How so?

>>377640383
LOL no

it was a poor attempt at horror with small levels and few enemies, shit weapons, and muh darkness system

it was more of a tech demo than a good game, it's clear they just wanted to sell idTech with it and their last priority was making a good Doom game

>>377640383
Explain.

>>377616546
>have some quiet time between slaying daemons
Do you really miss that?
I liked that the game was a series of arenas with very little idle time in-between.

>>377640527
Resource management, handmade encounters, monster closets, and classic multiplayer.

>>377638578
Twice.
That happens twice.
Do you have fucking ADD or Asperger's or something?

>>377618062
>they fire homing projectiles
>can circle strafe the final boss and hold M1 even on the hardest difficulties
>It doesn't even run at 60fps on the most optimal machines
pure bullshit

Who else here hated TNO but liked D44M?

>>377640179
That's fucking rich coming from someone defending this game.

>>377616546

>not enough backtracking and exploration of level to find key cards and have some quiet time between slaying daemons

Leave that archaic shit in the past.

>>377640527
It's made by Id

>>377641124
I would say I liked D44m much more than I did TNO but I did not hate it.
You can't have Blazkowitz be this squishy when he's facing tons of enemies with hitscan weapons, forces you to cower behind corners way too much.

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Not enough monsters on screen.
I appreciate the game having nice graphics, but I'd rather have them be less shiny if it means I get to have twice as many demons to kill at once. Compared to the original I miss methodically clearing out rooms, but there's practically no roaming monsters in D44M between arenas, and when there are, they're not especially challenging. Also I wish shotguns had more range and that enemies didn't become susceptible to finishers every two seconds. Also wish the finishers themselves weren't more effective at finishing off enemies than half your weapons - a bit annoying when you try quickly shooting an enemy to death but it's easier to do the mini-cutscene you've seen hundreds of times.

>>377638189
>Even the damage increase isn't enough to match the minigun without constant headshots.
consolebaby detected
the upgraded sniper is the fastest way to kill low tier enemies period

>>377641586
So was D44M you mouth breathing fuck, learn the difference between publisher and developer, Christ.

>>377616390
The game has so much classic Doom references, including monster traps. You just have to find them, theyre not shoved into the forefront

>>377618062
>Doom isn't a good game

Lol that's cute, buddy.

>>377641970
no John Carmack, no Adrian Carmack, no John Romero, it's not Id

>>377642115
if references made something good then Family Guy would be a good show

>>377628151
I dont agree with him but thats no excuse to shit talk serious sam. If you think about it as a SHMUP in first person where the gameplay is interesting because of the enemy design and all of their varied attacks that demand different reactions from the player, its not just "literally nothing but killing the same waves of AI lacking monsters" enemy placement and variety is carefully planned.

For me, the highlight of playing E1M1 on Nightmare was seeing imps spawn 5 meters from me, on top of their fallen brethren, because of that lovely monster limit.

Quality game my dudes.

>>377641764
I played on PC and thought it was just more hassle than it was worth on any difficulty above Hurt Me Plenty.

Having to deal with the limited LoS + tracking heads while also avoiding attacks is just no fun, there's much better alternatives that take less effort and let me play in a style I prefer.

6/10 it alright

>>377640383
I've gotta agree
doom 3 has problems but at least it didn't fuckup the fundamentals

>>377616004
>A lot went right. What went wrong?

Doomguy's base movement speed should have been faster. Not by much, but like 15-20% faster.

More enemies. Monster closets. Frankly, less Hayden, more isolation. More boss fights and more interesting ones could have been nice too.

Hell and the enemy design needed to be far more satanic.

>>377616004
Not enough classic music. E1M1 music plays now and then but no other classic music though.

>>377645716
>less Hayden, more isolation
Agreed, they could have left VEGA as the only source information for the important parts like how to open a portal to hell and stuff. VEGA was a bro though.

>>377645907

There's bits of it snuck into the new tracks.

Like, more than once have I heard the beginning of the Imp's Song in the start of a level

>>377646203

It's hard, because I think Hayden and Vega are done well, but I can't help but think it'd be better if it returned to just being you against the world, especially with the way they were pointing this game.

I feel like Hayden and Vega's plot and interactions were more akin to how that one officer would talk you through things in DOOM 3.

>>377626590
>the cyberdemon could have used more health he goes down to easy

I'm not sure that would have helped. He's easy even on a pistol-only playthrough - the issue is that he's extremely pattern based, and so long as you recognize the pattern and move to the right place, there's not much skill needed to never take a single hit.

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I dont know what the fuck everyones problem here is, this game was great. You guys love to shit on everything that isn't ocarina of time or chrono trigger.

>>377646923

I think the game is great too, I just don't think it was perfect.

It's a 9/10 game for me. I'm just discussing what could have been done to turn it into a 10/10 game.

>>377645716
>Doomguy's base movement speed
it's not even how fast you move but how you move and many other factors like enemy interaction, how closely they target, how often a prediction shot is fired, how the prediction is determined and when etc.
It's all tied into this big system that should be autonomous but I think in the case of Doom 4 it revolves far too much around the player

>>377646923
Game is bogged down by killcams, unnecessary upgrade paths when there shouldn't be any, and lack of interesting locations

>>377616004
Only the usual consoleshitters pandering, forcing a limit on enemies spawned.
I kept thirsting for more fucking mayhem, and the game never delivered

>>377624242
>The dlc was all for multiplayer instead of single player.

/thread

Wolfenstein TNO is better than Doom based on the sheer fact that every level of Doom is lockdown, kill waves of enemies, search for two keys in between. Repeat.

Doom is still really good but it's that structure that prevented me from getting hooked on it like I did TNO.

>>377619725
>nightmare dificulty is broken because fucking enemies keep spawning
Doom 1 and 2 also had respawning enemies on Nightmare.

>not backtracking in levels to find secrets
Sometimes you did and sometimes you go back to levels you completed to get some of the collectibles once you get the appropiate weapons, upgrades, etc.

>>377616004
Upgrade system is garbage, I really hate when games tell me HOW to play. I just wanna mess around, having to do shitty arbitrary challenges to upgrade your weapons just suck.

>>377647746
Killcams? unnecessary upgrade paths? did you even play the game? you've literally made yourself out to be an idiot.

>>377647159
Fine, I'll take that. It was a 10 for me, but that's opinion. I just dont see how there's so much bitching about how it didn't deliver. It's a fun game, played it through twice. Multiplayer? Whatever man I don't play doom fro multiplayer, that's what quake is for,

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>>377616004
>walk into large room
>doors lock
>music starts playing
>enemies starting spawning from the air
>you kill them all
>doors open
>music stops
>proceed to the next large open room to repeat this process.
Almost no sense of flow or rhythm. Combat was admittedly really fun and everything about it was satisfying. The level design itself wasn't even terrible, just the way they went about the player going through it and enemy "placements" really killed a lot of the fun for me.

>>377649042
The game would have been better with a Horde-like mode that just has you killing guys.

Arenas should not be a common element of level design in doom.

Having the game stop and lock all entrances to a room and slowly spawn a few enemies over time until the game feels like you are done is terrible.
If you wanna lock the player in a room, at least have the decency to spawn all enemies at once. The player is massively overpowered, he can handle at least 5x what the game throws at you.

Leave the constant monster arenas to serious sam.

>>377647746
The killcams are literally suicide at higher difficulties
Upgrade paths I guess make the game more interesting for the new audience
the classic doom audience isnt enough make a profit
despite your interest of level design being subjective I do agree that they are sort-of boring
would of loved a catherdral like level after hearing about cults

>>377650219
>The killcams are literally suicide at higher difficulties
Not really.

>>377649610
>Having the game stop and lock all entrances to a room and slowly spawn a few enemies over time until the game feels like you are done is terrible.

Except they literally did this in Doom 1 and 2 time and time again.

E1M8, literally get locked in and have to kill the Barons of Hell to proceed. It was in the shareware version FFS.

>>377650567
One level of 9.

>>377617810
>assault rifle was underpowered
yeah because it's not fucking call of duty. the wanted you to focus on the shotguns and rocket launchers

>>377650567
I said
>Arenas should not be a common element
>common
Reading comprehension fella
they should not be on every level.

Once or twice is fine, but they are way to fucking common in nu-doom.
not to mention in doom the enemies don't keep spawning. The doors close and you kill all the enemies that appear once, and that's it.
In arenas of these modern games the enemies keep spawning in waves, or a few at a time.

>E1M8, literally get locked in and have to kill the Barons of Hell to proceed.
boss fights are not arenas m8

>>377642417
John Carmack isn't even a developer, he's a fucking engine maker.

>>377649042
this, the bouncing around a like a fairy on acid is what makes this game fun.

DID SOMEONE SAY DOOT?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNVXg-4LGrw

>>377649042
Fucking this.

If it didn't constantly lock you in a slaughter room, it would feel much more free flow and restrictive.

>tfw gpu is too weak to play this masterpiece

What are some other games likes this that are less graphically intensive?

>>377651802
LESS RESTRICTIVE

GODDAMNITALL I'M QUITTING THE THREAD NOW

>>377651809
Quake 1-2

>>377617784
this. It sounded like an annoying transformers movie.

>>377651809
Shadow Warrior runs pretty good, Painkiller, the Serious Sam games, and the originals can be easily gotten for free. There isnt that many if you mean modern games.

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>>377652109
but it wasn't dubstep, it was some metal music and in the Doom context it made sense

different opinions I guess

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>>377651809
>>tfw gpu is too weak
I thought the game was pretty well optimized. My shitty 660ti would dip below 60FPS after tweaking some settings.

Idk I liked it.

>>377653623
>would
wouldn't

>>377653623
if his card doesn't support opengl 4.5 it won't work properly

>>377616390
>Monster traps like in old doom instead of shitty wave spawn tumor.

>Doom 3 has monster traps
>WAH WAH WAH OUTDATED DESIGN
>DOOM16 has no monster traps
>WAH WAH WAH WEHERE ARE MY MONSTER TRAPS

>>377620727

I'm not going to argue that vanilla doom 3 was better than this game at all, but I will point out that certain mods and total conversions of doom 3 are very much more enjoyable (Mars City Security for example)

on top of that, doom 3 was much more ahead of its time and had some very groundbreaking graphical techniques and stuff.

>>377651342
>isn't even a developer, he's a fucking developer
what did he mean by this

>>377620727
doom 3 was better suck a dick doombabby

>>377656563
he isn't responsible for any gameplay design of game development,. Carmack makes ENGINES, he isn't responsible for level design or anything like that

>>377656707
yes he was, you can even look up the old patch notes and plans for id where he would outline engine changes and balance changes for quake 3
id's max team size was around 20 people up until the bethesda acquisition and you're going to argue he didn't have any say in the making of games?