Find a flaw.

Netcode is shit.

Defense doesn't exist

Everything about it is flawed.

It's Street Fighter.

what do you mean find?

Ed can walk up and do an invincible move without a visible crouch input

>>377559634
Birdie doesn't have more costumes.

>>377559634
>Game has been "simplified for a wider audience" aka casuals who just want to mash buttons
>Slow as shit movement and walk speed
>Huge floaty jumps with next to no horizontal range
>Tiny ranged normal's
>Tiny hitboxes on everything
>Normal's have a shitty priority system
>Throws are slow as shit with no range
>Links are gone and combos are now mashable
>Huge buffer window
>No close standing attacks
>No neutral jump attacks
>Dizzy making people fall out of combos
>Game is full of comeback mechanics desinged to "lower the effectivness of player skill"
>Only super can chip kill
>V-Trigger a huge universal buff you get as a rewarded for losing
>V-Reverasl a get out of jail free you are rewarded with for losing
>Receve less damage the less health you have
>Worst roster in a street fighter game to date fan favorites replaced with characters no one wanted like birdie and rmika
>Risk/Reward is skewed due to high damage from jump ins yet pitifully low damage on anti airs and how you can no longer get large damage punishes from a jab
>Huge amounts input lag
>Constant fps loss on ps4 and high end PC's
>Random input drops
>Dumbed down mechanics
>Top players already saying the game is casual garbage
>P2W
>Game literally released in an unfinished state
>Online doesn't work correctly
>No punishment for rage quitters
>lobbies that dont even work most of the time with no flags or ping
>8 frames of input lag
>Actually install malicious Kernel level rootkit that grant unauthorized access to your machine

Fight Money system is retarded and I would have preferred the traditional SSFV if it came with the extra stages and costumes. If you bust your ass playing unfun single player modes and do everything for every character then you'll have just enough money for Seasons 1-2. After that you're just gonna pay five bucks a month.

>>377559763
How so, matchmaking is solid and 4-5 bar honestly feel like offline, "thanks" to the forced input delay masking lags. Even in the 3 bar range I'll take some choppy rollbacks over variable input delay / slowdowns like in pretty much every other 3d fighter any day. I would honestly argue it's the best netcode any 3d game ever had with the exception of Rising Thunder which kinda sorta doesn't count though I guess

We can talk about, like, arbitrary disconnects or the lobbies crashing and shit but actually playing people doesn't get much smoother than this?

You could have tried to come up with a harder problem, such as "find a good thing"

>>377560037
Balanced because its not a real reversal with it's dogshit start up frame, same for his CA. You can make both whiff by doing light meaty on wake up.

>>377559634
is the new cfn actually good?

EIGHT
FUCKING
FRAMES

>>377560574
this

>>377560161
Buffer windows, chip kills, priority system, speed or movement or throws or range on normals, half of these are either flat out positives or at the very least just a matter of taste - or, have been fixed ages ago. No punishment for ragequitters? They lose twice the points for the match they quit, and get a symbol of shame next to their name upon repeated offense, and preferentially get matched with other quitters, I can't tell you another game which goes this hard on people who quit midmatch. Nevermind the infamous 8 frames of input delay which haven't been a thing forever, is this pasta from a year ago?

You know it's flawed when it makes the studio want to change direction. Let's not kid ourselves.

>>377560268
I honestly think it's cool. I can just get the characters I think look interesting for free, ignore the ones I don't care about, and in the end I don't have to shell out and capcom can still make money off DLC characters, which, I understand, they have to. Like I got 3 characters cause I felt like I wanted to play them and still have fight money for another 4 saved up and I never really forced myself to play more survival mode than I wanted to. Not for fight money anyway, just for the colours, THAT is the bullshit part... But in the end I just paid for the game once, don't have to partake in the microtransactions shit, don't have to buy a new iteration of the game anytime soon, and still don't feel left out as new content rolls in every couple of months. I'm all for it really.

>>377559634
Xrd Rev2 is better
BBCF is better
Tekken 7 is better
DOA5LR is better
KOF14 is better

play GOOD games instead of this trash.

The game has potential, but Capcom keep on going on the opposite direction.

>>377560037
That move has no range. Its also got 16 frames startup, you can meaty him and your attack can still recover in time to block his wakeup DP.
>>377559763
>>377559859
>>377560268
These are the real problems.

>>377562185
Seriously, I dont know why people play sf5 when there is literally a ton of other and better fighting games available.

>>377562976
Name some, please.

>>377563148
hi retard

>>377562185
^

>>377559634
They removed the nipple bumps.

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1MB, 1031x1513px

>>377559634

>>377559634
Load times

>>377562185
>Tekken 7 is better
>DOA5LR is better
LOL, no, just no

No Dee Jay. Omega Dee Jay was fun as fuck and I'll never understand why omega wasn't the online standard

>>377563586
sure thing capcvck

>>377559634
Its trash and dumb to smoke. Id rather play tekken 7 than that insulting garbarge.

Shit gameplay
Shit netcode
Shit roster and reworked characters
Shit graphics
Shit ost
Shit dlc plan
Shit community

Go play a real fighting game 16'er

>>377563726
tekkuck detected

>>377563980
>has no argument
>goes full defensive
>can't actually defend his shit game in the process

loving every single laugh.

>>377559634
>no execution
>overly high stun damage
>practically no neutral game
>still unbalanced
>v-trigger is even dumber than ultras
>no defensive options aside from a gimped and shitty version of alpha counters/dead angles
>bad netcode
>ugly models, color palette, and artsyle
>music ranges from passable to terrible

Aside from the ESPOOOORTS appeal, what does this game even have going for it?

>>377559859

If you're bad

>>377562976
Let's see... I don't want the crazy long combo airdash setup heavy anime stuff. I TRIED marvel, skullgirls, blazblue, guilty gear... but it's just not my thing. I just feel like I get a more "pure" competitive experience with the limited movement options of a game like street fighter, where between just controlling the space in front of me and being ready to antiair I can provoke a crazy level of fear without doing much of anything

I don't want the NRS games - because can we just be honest and say that everything you hate about sfV is present in mkx and injustice too? stumpy normals, slow walkspeed, animations don't feel satisfactory, netcode is ass...

And 3d games are essentially a different genre alltogether so those don't count

...and I don't want to have to scout discord servers for half an hour to find an opponent, so, no I will not pick up samurai stalkers 2 to play with the two other nerds

SFV is where the players are at, is where the esports hype is at... and despite all it's flaws, still gives me something on a fundamental level that most other titles fail to do. It's not perfect, but it feels like the best option

>>377564128
>no execution

Do people really miss 1FL's that much?

>>377564128
>b-b-but you have to play it to be 'relevant' to the fgc and the tourney scene!

capcombux is the only reason.

>>377564128
>gimped and shitty version of alpha counters

It's funny because I always thought they were the ultimate get out of jail free card you're granted like 10 times throughout the match free of charge and that's why they're stupid

>>377564185
>I don't want the crazy long combo setup heavy stuff

And SFV isn't a crazy combo setup game? The only difference is that the setups and combos are easy as fuck to the point that they don't take the work and practice that they do in those anime games.

>it's where the esports hype is at
literally kill yourself. Play games that you actually like.

>>377564104
>has no argument
>goes full defensive
>can't actually defend his shit game in the process

loving every single laugh.

>>377564227
No, but SFV's 3 frame input buffer on top of every bnb being 5 frame links at worst takes all of the reward out of practicing. It also doesn't make the game any more entertaining to play or watch.

1 frame links shouldn't be necessary for you to complete your bnbs or your punishes, but a little freedom is nice. SFV's simplicity only stifles creativity.

>>377560574
I like Dhalsim's changes. that's about it.

The fact that he can go in and out to fight and having normals that are dedicated to going every direction instead of varieties of horizontal fists was good.

>>377564185
Same, I laugh when people recommend GG to new players. Are you kidding? GG is a dirty-ass game and the people online have been playing for YEARS. I don't give a shit about any NRS games for that matter either.

>>377564104
>>377564354
One of you is bullshitting. SFV players don't know what going full defensive is like.

>>377559634


More like find no flaw...

>>377564324
Yeah well I actually like the games where the esports hype is at. Or, well, the one I've got a local scene for how about that. The one where there's a fucking scene at all. The one where I can fantasize about that big tournament I'll attend in two weeks and how awesome it would be to beat some big names and place high.

It annoys me how people dismiss the community aspect with a handwave, like the real high ground is sitting in fightcade with 4 other guys smugly talking about how much new games suck like idiots, haha SFV is on espn, haha SFV tournaments can earn you a living, what a bunch of shit rite how can anyone get excited about that

>>377564552
>takes all of the reward out of practising

You say this like there is no difference between bottom and top level play

>>377560484
>one player teleports
>other player doesn't
>asshole players can control who gets the teleporting
I would take minor slowdown over playing psychic fighter in half my games. Granted, this may have been solved since launch, but it totally ruined my experience since roughly a quarter of all matches had this.

>>377564809
There's a difference for sure, but saying that SFV's skill ceiling and floor aren't low as fuck compared to other games out there is just wrong.

>>377560161
Biggest issue here are generally shit punishes for AAs. Hell, if you win an air-to-air because your character has good options for that, chances are you'll get punished since they'll recover before you do. Otherwise you might get a single move or light as your AA.

It encourages retardation when many AAs don't even lead into oki.

>>377564884
>I would take minor slowdown
Thats not how it works, retard

>>377564775
Everyone that takes their game seriously wants to play it at the highest level. The people like you that are afraid of playing and promoting any game that isn't SFV are the worst kind of cancer though.

>>377564552

>No, but SFV's 3 frame input buffer on top of every bnb being 5 frame links at worst takes all of the reward out of practicing

I dunno, for me, it's just shifted the focus away from combos. Setups are so powerful in SF5 that I end up spending most of my time searching for different ways to set up oki and mix-ups.

It helps that I play Vega, Ibuki and Bison.

>>377565175
That's not how it works right now, no. I realize the code is rollback based. I'm saying I'd rather have a system with tiny bits of slowdown over a chunk of my matches being literally unplayable.

>>377564947
As with every fighting game I'm aware of, the skill ceiling is virtually infinitely high. Comfy buffer windows and easy inputs don't make winning matches easier, if anything they do the opposite as slaving away in training mode no longer gives you an edge over newcomers struggling with execution and decision making alone is what gets you ahead.

>>377559634
Only one?

>>377562976

Apart from the slight problem that the other fighters available have no playerbase, there's basically no reason not to pick up SF5 in some capacity.

The barrier to entry isn't high and it'll remain ground zero for fighting game fans for the foreseeable future. When Tekken 7 has no players left 6 months after release, SF will still be chugging along because it's SF.

Playing SF5 doesn't mean you can't play other fighters simultaneously.

>>377565123
>many AAs don't even lead into oki.

I would say that's intentional.

>>377565414
You dont get "tiny bits of slowdown" with none rollback netcode, you fucking retard you get input delay while the other persons data catches up, this is ontop of any innate input delay the game has.

Only a fucking inbicile, a complete fucking retard who has absolutely no fucking clue about fighting games would think delay based netcode is better than rollback netcode.

are Nash or Cammy good beginner characters?

>>377565764

Cammy is pretty much the ultimate beginner character. Incredibly powerful and dead easy to use.

>>377565198
I'm not "afraid", I just can not be assed. I mean, completely apart from the fact that no other games seriously interest me right now, the idea that I should pick a game I'd have an obligation to "promote" is ridiculous.

We've all had this one game / group / thing that was super niche and took effort only to keep alive at all, okay, it's exhausting, you know there's no shame in *not* fighting the powah and just succumbing to the mainstream now and again

And in fighting games, from where I stand, the established community is kinda sorta as important as the intricacies of the gameplay mechanics themselves. And you know you can keep traveling across the entire nation to get a set of xrd going, knock yourself out, more power to you honestly. But don't expect me to do the same.

>>377565482
I don't like that logic. Before we know it any kind of complicated motion or strict timing is going to be gone from competitive fighting games and everything will be like mobashit so we can shove as many people into the e-sports machine as possible.

Any competitive game or sport should have some sort of investment you have to make to get an edge over people that aren't making any effort in it. SFV already rewards players that practice their 50/50 setups and stun combos, so why not just give more reward to people that work on their execution too? Or at least have a few characters that require that dedication.

And the input leniency doesn't make games easier to win, but I'm not talking about winning. I'm talking about the reward of putting in your time into a game that isn't for normalfag overwatch and league of legends players. Pulling off something that's hard to do in the middle of a difficult match is satisfying to both perform and watch. Why take that out of the experience entirely?

I played street fighter all the time on emulators. This is my first online game and I don't think anything's wrong with it. I didn't play SF4 because I thought it looked too ugly with it's 'moving picture' look. I think this is an upgrade of that.

>>377565730
Sure, if rollback is done correctly, it's 100% superior. SFV's is not because it puts everything on one player. Like I said, I have no idea if it was fixed.

https://pastebin.com/G9qJjzsV
>The culprit is not the alt-tab, it's the fact that the netcode does not handle time-syncing between the two machines properly. One machine can end up "ahead" of the other. That's the basis of the problem, because when one player is ahead, they are constantly getting inputs from the other player "late" so they are rolling back a lot, whereas the other player is usually getting all the inputs they need when they need them, and doesn't roll back at all. If the game properly handled syncing, like GGPO does, then the other player's game would slow down for a microscopic moment to correct for your alt-tab hiccup, and both players would continue to experience about half of the possible rollbacks each.

>>377565627
And it's a shit decision. You should either eat a combo or be put into oki for jumping in and failing like a retard.

>>377566009
>I mean, completely apart from the fact that no other games seriously interest me right now, the idea that I should pick a game I'd have an obligation to "promote" is ridiculous.

my point is that you shouldn't be playing SFV if you don't enjoy the game at an intrinsic level. The fact that you said that SFV has a lot of flaws and that you're just playing it because you like e-sports says to me that you're supporting a game you don't necessarily like. And if that's the case, I can't get behind that.

>>377559634
>Urien, Laura, Balrog, Gief, Guile
>Stun is awfully balanced
>Too many characters put you in coin toss situations, removing actual skill
>You shouldn't be able to match with Mexico and Canada while in US East

>>377566107
I can see the sentiment that fighting games are not just a test of wits and reaction but also of execution, and that they'd lose something if that was culled completely.

I just hate when people talk about the "skill ceiling being low" as if the game suddenly granted you free victories or whatever. Got to say Rising Thunder was pretty damn hardcore when everyone can flawlessly dp between any jab you do, I had a lot of fun with that even though "execution" as we know it was not a thing in that game period, when you completely remove the motions and timing requirements, anything else automatically becomes proportionally more important.

>air to air opponent
>get thrown or beaten by lights when lading

What's the point of air to airing ?

>>377566346

>And it's a shit decision. You should either eat a combo or be put into oki for jumping in and failing like a retard.

As far as I am aware, most AAs in SF5 place the opponent at a significant disadvantage in one way or another. Some of the slower ones even CC and/or lead to a full combo (see: Vega's s.HK).

>>377566596

>What's the point of air to airing ?

You do it when the rest of your character's AAs are shit, when you're preventing your opponent from jumping out of the corner, or when you have the ground covered with a projectile.

>>377566606
It's pretty universally agreed upon that the risk/reward for jump-ins is skewed a bit too far towards jumping in.

Honestly, my biggest issue is how slow walking is. Faster walks would negate stubby normals and reduce effectiveness of dash/jump-ins to be a bit more risky.

>>377566960
A few characters have great walk speeds:

>Karin, Rashid, Vega, Cammy

>>377566352

I can only reiterate and say, the fact that I can go to the local gaming bar on any given weekend and play people offline and win free drinks if I do good, that *is* intrinsic to the game to me.

Would I prefer if every fucking body on the planet played, say, Skullgirls instead? Yeah. Yeah I would. The fact of the matter is, people *do not*. Playing Skullgirls the way I play SFV is not a matter of what I *want*, I CAN'T. People don't fucking play it. What am I supposed to do. Be the lone warrior who brings a setup with SG to every local, desperately trying to get people into it, pretending like I don't have 2000 hours worth of setups I could unleash on them, fuck that

I don't support a game I don't like. SFV supports me and my needs. SG does not. I don't "support" shit. I just want to play fighting games.

>>377566548
Fighting games have always had good longevity because of high skill ceilings though. You can buy a full priced game and get way more playtime out of it just because you'll always have something to improve on, even if you only play one character. "Easier wins" have nothing to do with the problem that simplifying the genre raises. It creates a less rewarding experience. A game with a purposefully low skill floor to put you in ranked or competitive matchmaking earlier gets repetitive really fast compared to a game that forces you to spend time in the lab. These are just my two cents though. I obviously have a bias against esports because they typically promote games that are massively dumbed down, but there are some competitive games that retain their depth and get along just fine.

>>377566960

That's more because of the input delay and unreliable anti-airs rather than the follow-up options.

Many would argue that season 1 AA jabs were broken largely because they offered a free side-switch mix-up.

>Faster walks would negate stubby normals and reduce effectiveness of dash/jump-ins to be a bit more risky.

It doesn't help Vega at all. His whiff punishing is still garbage and his AAs are the worst in the game.

>>377567139
Karin and Cammy are legit threats due to that. Punk's success in neutral can be seen through his usage of Karin's mobility. Vega/Rashid suffer from their kits being a bit more gimmicky.

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13 days until Street Fighter is dead

>>377567423
I can't agree with the idea that a low skill floor intended to get you into competitive matchmaking early necessarily makes you get less out of a game long term, or even just that it constitutes "dumbing down" the genre.

Using Rising Thunder again as an example, because honestly I *really* enjoyed that despite being used to more technically demanding fighting games before, I did not get the feeling it sacrificed any depth as far as core gameplay principles such as positioning yourself properly, weighing your options on the offense / defense, when to reversal, when to tech, chosing the most efficient confirms / combos with regard to corner carry, meter build and damage and anything else is concerned - apart from the executional requirements, that is.

There will always be games around which place more emphasis on being able to input stuff correctly, made for all your fighting game needs. But if that is the breaking point for so many people, if that seriously is the thing that keeps the masses from enjoying fighting games, being unable to sit down in training mode and practice the dp motion for 5 fucking minutes, then that's the way it is. Then that's the game that will eventually come around and make a lot of people happy, and that's an evolution you can't halt.

>>377569026
>Using Rising Thunder again as an example, because honestly I *really* enjoyed that
You're the exception, not the norm.
Also you're someone who obviously has at least a fundamental understanding of what to do in fighting games

Most people dropped it and ignored it.
You know why?
The people it was pandering to were still losing because execution isn't the only thing fucking them over. Dumbing down the game doesn't actually address the issue that casuals are having, it only bothers the actual players who are sticking around

People who aren't already into fighting games don't have the drive to improve at them and all the tutorials and simplifying mechanics in the world won't help.
The people who do stick around do so to get better because there's always more to learn. Doesn't happen if a game is too simple.

Rising Thunder is a terrible example and it's dead.

>>377559634

Jabs that beat damn near everything if you just spam them

>>377569026
Execution makes the game interesting from a spectator perspective, it's interesting seeing hard to do things, it adds risk mentally to the player to even consider doing the combos.

Execution barrier being lowered is fine for the most part but just like >>377569705
the people who it caters too aren't going to go out of their way to learn the mechanics.

Although the thing that makes SF5 uninteresting for the most part is the game is plagued with a lack of defensive options if you get caught in throw loops you have to take a massive risk defensively

>>377569026
>>377569705
>>377570523
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0WetHkYVtw

Always related

>>377570523
>Although the thing that makes SF5 uninteresting for the most part is the game is plagued with a lack of defensive options if you get caught in throw loops you have to take a massive risk defensively

This. Once you get a knockdown its either eat throws or take a 50% crush counter combo. This shit would not fly AT ALL if crouch tech were still a thing. As dumb as it was I'd take it over DPs that cost a meter AND crush counter on block and V-reversals which take an important piece of your meter AND can still get grabbed.

One time at a tournament, I stood next to Phenom and farted in his general direction.

>>377559634
> crap tutorial
> shitty challenges
> looks ugly
> slow as fuck and boring to watch
Only plus is that it's the only fighting game with active players

>>377560268
This. Fight Money is such a stupid thing. I would've been cool with it if everything costed maybe 20k less, at least, but I really have to grind that much in order to buy characters and stages?

An updated rerelease would've been better, honestly.

>>377560484
>matchmaking is solid and 4-5 bar honestly feel like offline,

this is a fucking lie a good chunk of the time and you know it

>>377567690
I hope this is good

>>377559634
It's not tekken 7

>>377567690
Anyone who's been exposed to more technical, more dynamic fighting games will quickly pass on tekken. Other top fighters, namely Street Fighter, KoF and MK/Injustice have advanced impressively in their latest installments; but the relic that is tekken just can't seem to evolve, furthermore many combos can be done simply by hitting 1-button, and the nearly "instant-kill" rage art moves are just laughably broken. Instead of a supplying a proper fighting engine, matches in T7 seem to rely heavily on "who can get their rage move off first". So many elements of the gameplay don't even require any sort of skill. In my book, slow motion over and over again also gets old very quickly. And in the end, it's more of a novelty or gimmick rather than an actual, thought-out fighting game mechanic. But hey, the casual crowd will be pleased!

If you want something a little more "button-masher-friendly," tekken might be your cup of tea.... Key word, might.

>>377565482

???

What takes more skill, Rock Paper Scissors, or Chess

I'll wait

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>>377567690
Street Fighter V: 5065
Super Smash Bros. for Wii U: 2637
Super Smash Bros. Melee: 2350
Pokkén Tournament: 1165
Guilty Gear Xrd: 903
Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3: 770
Mortal Kombat X: 707
Tekken 7: 543

>>377578210
Pretty good considering it isn't even out

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789KB, 320x214px

>>377578765
Its been out for 3 years in arcades

also
Ultra Street Fighter IV – 1979.
Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 – 1014.
Super Smash Bros. Melee – 970.
BlazBlue: Chronophantasma – 508.
Killer Instinct – 338.
King of Fighters XIII – 319.
Injustice: Gods Among Us – 311.
Tekken Tag Tournament 2 – 257.

Wheres your excuse now?

>>377579000
Yep, people are playing injustice 2 and sfv now, I don't understand your argument
Everyone knows sfv is garbage

>>377579152
>Everyone knows sfv is garbage
Better than tekken atleast

>>377579225
>>377563726

>Find a flaw.

It's owned by Capcom.

>>377559634
The amount of fuck ups this game had since launch is inexcusable. Sure they fixed some from launch and now, but I expected them to fix a lot fucking more than they did with the time they had. Modern Capcom is an incompetent joke and you'll do better with any fighting game out there at the moment. I mean that to no hyperbole. You'd do better with shitty NRS fighters, and that's a pretty low bar.

>>377579327
>>377563980

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474KB, 423x650px

>>377559634
It doesnt have best dude

>>377579842
He's dead anon