How do we fix the MMO genre?

You can't fix people.

>>377319963
you rollback internet before 2007

Make interacting with other players the goal of the player.
Engaging with others needs to break out of text windows and emotes.

>>377319963
Make combat actually fun instead of it being macros and meters for everything

>>377319963
make it more action, no "press buttons while you stand still and watch big numbers for hours" bullshit

>>377319963
Make Ragnarok online 3 based on the first one.

>>377319963
Remove everyone with double digit iq from the planet.

>>377320527
so every 4chan posters? That will also kill you, anon.

I never understood why all MMOs control in a clunky awful way. It's like moving a cursor around a map.

Why can't an MMO control like any other game? Like a third person shooter, or a PS2 era 3D platformer where twitch controls and feedback make the character feel like an extension of the player?

Is this impossible to do for some reason I don't understand?

File: ERP.jpg (1MB, 1152x3618px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1152x3618px

>>377319963
We have this conversation everyday, and the answers will always be TO MAKE IT TURN BASED, so it can have actually good and fun combat, and to make it more sandbox oriented.

>>377319963
Make MMOs more like vanilla WoW, before "convenience" killed it.
Look at all the changes made for convenience and tell me that's not the reason the game is shit now.

>>377319963
First tell that guy to uninstall his fucking addons jesus christ
Second, more sandbox elements like Star Wars Galaxies.

>>377320674
and on top of that why can't the HUD be minimal?

>>377320468
this

>>377320850
Because in any given MMO bossfight there is a shitton of skill effects, buffs and debuffs going on at any moment.

>>377320695
Happy Thursday May 18th 2017 :)

>>377320695
Yawn, turn based is for nerdddds.

Good way to ruin world PvP and PvP in general.

>>377320962
What if combat didn't involve all that noise?

Let me hear some suggestions:
10 players against 1 big bad boss, in a new type of MMO combat mechanic.
How could it be fun?
What roles other than traditional tank, DPS, heal, could exist?

>>377321382
Tera tried that

>>377321382
On the roles:
Make skilltrees that are not class restricted (kinda like path of exile did, but even more open), no restriction on the weapons (like old days in tibia), no restrictions on armors but with obvious side-effects (you can be a tanky mage, but good luck trying to dodge, still not restrictive enough to make it unplayable), KEEP LEVELS BEING A THING

File: ffxiv_11062015_200321.png (3MB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 1920x1080px

>>377319963
>That shitty UI with 10000 addons.

Do WoWplayers still play like that? After WoW I played SWTOR and FFXIV (both don't allow addons) and now I can't go back to this clusterfuck of pointless handholding information.

>>377322118
>Dagger/meleemage could be real

I like you

Every time we have this thread we get a chorus of "Make it an action game" and it pisses me off, the problem with the genre is catering to solo players and the ridiculous, single minded focus players now have on "end game". Can't add a level 20 Goblin Fortress or a level 40 elemental domain because "the max is 100 and that's the only part of the game that matters".

Slow MMOs the fuck down again, make them too difficult to reasonably solo, add more horizontal progression systems, and focus on improving the entire experience instead of adding more end game treadmills.

>>377319963
Have levels not raise power exponentially - a flatter power curve. Have the leveling be so grindy that it takes several years to get to max. No one but a few autists will be max level - the game will be based around people who are midlevel. Better yet, have a dozen or two skills to individually level up instead of one character level. Get rid of soulbound items, let almost all gear be tradable. Bosses then will not be killed in hopes of getting gear to use, but instead getting gear to sell. And let there be full loot pvp.

>>377322550
>infusing the daggers for elemental damage
>giving yourself speed buffs or invisibility that could be only achieved with magic
I don't see the problem

File: wow ui.png (1MB, 1600x900px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1600x900px

>>377322518
>not realizing op's picture is a meme
modern wow ui is way more minimal than the clusterfuck you posted
Hell, WoW's default UI is more minimal than that

File: Fantasy_World.jpg (270KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

270KB, 1920x1080px

The goal is to be a massively multiplayer experience right? Have an many different people filling as many different roles as possible.
I think this is one of the few game genres I'd like to pander to casuals.
Make a world that's fun, relaxing and has shit to offer to people of a wide variety of backgrounds, desires, and goals.
Have arena PvP and a world filled with monsters and PvE combats and open world adventuring- but also build in career paths other than than those.
Maybe make crafting, armor, weapons, etc. a fun creative thing, not just crafting in a text window with x/10 resources, click craft and watch a loading bar.
Not as free form and batshit as Second Life, but you know, basically offer the player a skin creator, (think animal crossing) where they can earn all sorts of blank models and paint and decorate how they desire, Maybe build in basic music editors, a writing/ illustrating system for users to make books, or other kinds of creative tools for users to share their creations in a world setting.
The town could have all the types of businesses that exist in the real world, libraries, clothing shops, music venues, art museums, full of player created content.
Basically build an MMO in a setting where you never have to leave the town if you don't want to. There's treasure and monsters outside, PvP arenas and such but the game could be completely satisfying to play as a merchant.

>>377319963

Break the holly trinity. Support and Debuffers should be a MUST on every MMORPG. I want a Log Horizon-like MMO

File: Breath-of-the-Wild-Explore.jpg (155KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

155KB, 1280x720px

>>377323146
Still more bullshit than this

>>377320206
It's actually this.

changing the combat won't help at all

MMO's that I spent time on and enjoyed:
Runescape, WoW, EVE Online

Most other MMO's are shit. Sandbox is usually better than theme parks though.

>>377323146
>not realizing op's picture is a meme


When I played WOW like 5 years ago that was how every high end player had to play, with 10000 addons telling them EVERYTHING, even where they had to move in order to dodge boss's aoes

File: Untitled.png (2MB, 1366x768px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1366x768px

Personally, I just stuck with the MMO that seemed the most polished, in my view.

Also, the genre is just trash. The only way to "fix" it is to not make an MMO and just make something like Monster Hunter.

>>377320254
This
Poor people have been the death of gaming communities

>>377319963
kill Blizzard and WoW shit wait for Destiny 2.

>>377323475
gee i wonder why a game that came in 2017 has a more streamlined ui than one that came in late 2004
also there's a such a thing as too much minimalism, and that ui wouldn't let you play a complex game like wow properly

Spritual sucessor to Guild wars when?

>>377323475
BotW is a much simpler game than an MMO

>>377319963
delete wikis
make things hard
make it so you can't level effectively solo so you have to meet and talk to people

File: ss (2017-05-18 at 12.39.49).jpg (10KB, 241x208px) Image search: [Google]

10KB, 241x208px

Play ones where you aren't obligated to do specific content

>>377322118
Some other ideas:
Skill mastery: skills have their own level that increase based on use, rising 2 or more certain skills could get you a combination skill (wich has a standalone mastery level)
Stats: give stat points per level, and they are not set automatically or retarded like a "suggested stats" button, that shit was cancer, allows unique builds

>>377323936
>Not just meeting and talking to people on your own accord
Learn to socialize, nerd

>>377323986
Then whats the point

>>377320206
It has nothing to do with server communities, because it's so simple to just LFD, LFR, and queue-PvP.

Not to mention, MMOs are pretty shoddy right now. The average itemization system is awful. The economy isn't deep..

Grinding is no alternative for what should be keeping [subs] immersed.

>>377324031
I don't have trouble with it, the issue is that other people don't bother so even if there is 1000 people playing it only feels like 100 because nobody is fucking talking

>>377320989
>Caring about PvP in an MMO

>>377323176
Mabinogi was somewhat close to this before it turned to shit.

>>377322118
>>377322550
>>377323145
I like you boys.

>>377324137
Gain levels, get power, and make money.

>>377319963
Make it so people HAVE to socialise while leveling, trading and raiding. Get rid of all the automated systems: we Amish now.

They need to stop going to the standard fantasy mmo with actionbar wow gameplay.

You have to innovate, try a sandbox FPS with different classes, let players build bases/outposts/forts to defend resources or something with npc dungeon/raids like destiny for the PVE crowd.

Maybe do a dungeon/adventure MMO with Dragons dogma style combat and Guild Wars 1 world design. Towns and cities being the hub world where you can see all the players, while the outside zones are instanced

>>377324375
I'll check it out.

>>377324358
Oh, I feel you there.
Thats definitely a game by game issue though. In FFXIV people are usually friendly, especially if you start the convo

>>377324375
I used to sit around playing Runescape songs on my lute in that game
Every other aspect was shit desu

>>377324137
Do content you want to do. If I want to become the best swordsmith on my server, and every item i craft has my name on it, and I sell it to people, that's fucking rewarding.
Make crafting an elaborate skill tree that a player couldn't possible be the best if they devote play to other things.
make all the horizontal aspects of character development rubber band the others, Good fighter is bad crafter, good ranger is bad CQC. don't have any specific classes and create a system that has near infinite "builds"

MMOs need to stop trying to be too big for their britches. They need to focus on group dynamics, guilds, team-play etc. As soon as an MMO goes after the solo-player casual audience they're going into the shitter.

It's okay to have a game that has a smallish number of dedicated players. MMOs without heavy social aspects are just single player games with terribly unfun mechanics.

Also the holy trinity is good, they need to stop forcing jack-of-all-trades classes because that shit is incredibly stale.

>>377319963
There are other standalone games that offer far superior social experiences. MMO's are just glorified chat rooms.

>>377325032
>Also the holy trinity is good
Fucking this
Why do people meme that the trinity is ruining the genre?

>>377320343
This.
And keep the numbers (damage and hp and the like) small.

>>377325196
Correction: The BEST MMO's are glorified chatrooms. Normal MMOs are terrible ARPG's you play with humans that never talk, that may aswell be bots

>>377325209
It derivates to only seeing 3 builds in the endgame and shit gets old really fast
I'm not saying jack-of-all-trades are good, but freedom of skills that don't allow you to do everything, but having a unique playstyle (while still having an specific use in a party) would be good

>>377325209
>wanting the same old shit
no fuck off

>>377325032
I thought MMOs were incredibly expensive? Don't they need the support of casuals to be able to survive?

>>377325573
>wanting watered down generic garbage
no fuck off

>>377325032
WildStar fits exactly what you're talking about (trinity, group, guild, and team centric gameplay) and it's about as shitty as they come.

>>377325501
This already exists though
Some tank archetypes can heal, some healers can deal damage, and dps can be a fuckton of different kinds of classes

Its not like everyone is a fucking Fighter, Cleric, and Knight

>>377325640
>>377325573
>>377325209
>>377325298


Why not just go the CoX route?

They didnt stick with the holy trinity and it was fun as fuck.

>>377325573
see >>377325721

>>377319963
Perma-ban ANYONE not roleplaying their character across every MMO. Even just 1 evening of being out of character gets a Perma-ban.

File: Screenshot_21.jpg (41KB, 506x144px) Image search: [Google]

41KB, 506x144px

>>377320375
[WoW's] PvP is still fun, but it's just not worth much, especially now that PvP gear is effectively nonexistent.

>fun
There are plenty of abilities vs. MOBAs ~4. I'm not sure what the gaming community is on about with MOBAs, even if they're free and have hats.

I guess MMOs could just make PvP some semblance of persistent.

More horizontal progress, even between potential expansions.
There's no reason to have every expansion raise the level cap.
You can introduce leveling areas to supplement the existing areas/serve as an alternative without increasing the max level.

>>377320206
sadly this.even 18+ restiction can't protect you for fucking useless human wastes

>>377325701
>WildStar fits exactly what you're talking about (trinity, group, guild, and team centric gameplay) and it's about as shitty as they come.

It's shitty not because it has those things but because of literally everything else

>>377319963
The genre needed some innovations but it's too late for that now because it's stagnant and dying. MOBA basically "solves" some of its problems in a completely different format.

>>377325949
this.

this is what made FFXI the GOAT mmo. debate me on this if you want, you will lose

>>377325413
Essentially this. Focus should be on getting people to play the game and have fun together, regardless of what your combat system is. Community first, gameplay and everything else second.

So basically just make an MMO version of dwarf fortress where each player is one dwarf. Make players interact and rely on each other.

>>377326265
>it's stagnant and dying
I wish this were true, but it really isn't
Maybe some of them are dying, like WoW, but not all

>>377325897
>There are plenty of abilities vs. MOBAs ~4
Unique abilities on unique characters >>> 20 variations of "Fireball", "Big Fireball", "Great Fireball", "Ultimate Fireball", "Ice Shower", "Big Ice Shower"....

>>377322118
I think this would be cool but a Tammy mage probably wouldn't be as viable as a pure mage. Or maybe it would be too good and replay vs tanks. My point is that people will always play meta stuff and nothing but meta stuff so diversity is kinda wasted nowadays

Is having an actually engaging battle system rather than floaty click-on-target-press-skill too much to ask?

>Collision so you can't go through people and tanking can get tactical with choke points and shield walls.
>dodging/blocking done through your own inputs instead of %
>Reasonably precise aiming and reach or weapons and attacks

I don't need the ultimate fighting mechanics, just something solid that lets one improve and git gud without relying on equipment stats and level.

>>377323640
>even where they had to move in order to dodge boss's aoes
That mod get removed officially pretty quickly after it was announced.
If you DBM, that's still not a big cluster fuck, and can be crazy edited. Even in TBC days
Sounds like you played with scrubs

>>377319963
Make it a niche genre again and purge it of all the erp and normalfaggotry who just want the games to be dungeon runs and webchats. This would probably eliminate the majority of wow players, so its probably a good idea.

>>377327109
>wanting more MMOARPGs
Kill you are self.

>>377327109
TERA, BDO, and a few others tried this
Its really awful in an MMO

The ultimate method to scare away casuals from ruining MMOs

Disable all kinds of fast travel

Search your feelings you lazy cunts, you know it to be true

File: oculus-rift[1].jpg (92KB, 1200x698px) Image search: [Google]

92KB, 1200x698px

Reclaim this from Zuckerjew and make a MMO with it
Any better VR is good too, specially if they have controllers that track your hands

File: wwo.jpg (361KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

361KB, 1920x1080px

It's already in the process of being saved.

>>377327607
Riding boats and fishing off the deck in FFXI ruled.
This doesn't count, right?

>>377323723
>blanket statement
Not an argument.

>>377325701
>team centric
>spend the entire game leveling alone because quest mechanics are single player.
Yeah nah its just a wow clone whos only saving grace is housing.

>>377327607
It depends on whether the game is designed for this or not. If you have fast travel you can have quests and hotspots spawning all over the place. If you don't, you can't expect people to make it from one end of the world to another for a weekly world boss or something. It's not something that's a good or a bad thing by itself.

>>377319963
Wait for Pantheon to come out.
If Pantheon fails then there really is no hope.

>>377327791
What, that the genre is shit?
I could write a masters thesis on why MMOs make for shitty games. Only reason to play them is for the social aspect

>>377327783
fast travel would be what ffxi turned into a few years ago where you can teleport to pretty much any zone from towns.

pre-abyssea FFXI is the mmo people in here seem to be wanting

Give a simplistic fucking UI.

File: Maple0000.0[1].jpg (126KB, 800x600px) Image search: [Google]

126KB, 800x600px

>>377327607
Fuck free fast travel, this shit right here was good

>>377327769
What's this?

File: ffxiv_18012017_184805.png (3MB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 1920x1080px

>>377327238

I remember a boss in Black Temple (Mother?) that required 3 raid members to stack and then run in opposing directions. DBM would put an ARROW over the heads of those 3 players to tell them the direction they had to run in order not to wipe.

That was fucking stupid.


Of course, there's the other side of the Coin: Retards in FFXIV that still TODAY can't handle easy mechanics as Zurvan's EX Soars

>>377327915
Pantheon looks like hot garbage visually. Having mechanics from pre-2000 MMOs doesn't mean having graphics from Everquest as well

>tfw no friends to play Lotro with

>>377319963
There's nothing to fix. Wow's doing it about as well as it can be done.

If you had to actually think while playing, you probably wouldn't play for months and months. It'd be tiresome.

>>377327769
honestly the game sounds pretty cool. i didn't think it would be

>>377328005
it's wild west online. the game is completely pvp. players will be in charge of law enforcement and all that to stop gankers. what interested me a lot was that there's non combat roles you can specialize in like being a prospector

File: wwo.jpg (338KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

338KB, 1920x1080px

>>377328005
Wild West Online. Slated for release later this year.

http://playwwo.com/

Call me a shill all you want. I will shill the fuck out of an mmo that isn't the usual fantasy/scifi schlock

>>377327865

Vehicles with locked routes should be the only form of fast travel. The moment you allow for easy access teleporting you're basically killing the open world and the hotspots will be the only thing that matter.

>>377319963
Go outside hangout with your friend, gang up on some niggers tada you got the full mmo experience

>>377328247
It's not completely PvP. There's still PvE content for those that like that side of MMOs.

But the economy and law enforcement is indeed run by players. It's probably easiest to summarize it as EVE in the old west minus spreadsheets.

>>377328302
Alternatively, join /pol/ and punch antifa faggots

>>377319963
Just go to the folders an rename interface, cache, and WTF to old. Then everything is fixed.

Someone needs to spread a virus that auto deletes add ons

Make legacy servers accessible in game so your current 110 character gets set back to 60 and vanilla is exactly how it was, one large PVP map like it should be. Old dungeons and raids and PVP gets you rewards for your 110 and 60.

>>377327946
you know theres private servers for ffxi to play like when it used to be good, right?

>>377328264

If this was WestWorld MMO I would be totally in.

Just play Oldschool Runescape if you want a decent MMO.

>>377328915
MMOs ≠ WoW

>>377329046
I personally think going with the actual old west (or at least its hollywood representation) as the setting is the best thing they could have done.

It sets the game apart from other games in the genre purely because of it.

>>377328915
wow is the problem, not the solution. fuck off, degenerate

>>377328984
Do people actually play on them? i remember playing one a couple years ago and there was like 100 people max

>>377320695
is there a ff14 version of this?

>>377328061

Pantheon is my hope too, but I remember what Brad McQuaid did with Vanguard. So I don't have much faith at all.

Lots of good ideas, but that's all they are so far. Just ideas. And yeah, fix the fucking graphics. The game is butt ugly so far.

>>377329229
I mean, it's kind of, you know, the most popular MMO ever.

>>377323104
>years to hit max
good luck still having a player base in 6 months

>>377320389

go back to dark souls you roll spamming retard

>>377328004
pretty sure they made it free or so cheap it may as well be

>>377330327
dark souls combat in an MMO might be tite tho

File: 1495077750552.png (1MB, 996x1450px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 996x1450px

>>377320254

>>377330216
Solution to that just being, not restricting all content behind being max level like most MMOs. Actually give players shit to do while leveling instead of making them hit max level before having fun.

>>377330209

Like COD is the most popular FPS and not makes them the best.

>>377330393
because having to fight server latency as well as the mobs in the game would be fun, right?

People say convenience say it's bad for MMOs but do you honestly think anyone has the time or patience to walk 10 minutes to a place instead of warping? Then lets look at queues and LFG systems. What if your MMO isn't as big as WoW? You're going to spam "LFG X" over and over for 30 minutes looking like a loser and being at the mercy of other people to progress on your own character?

File: 1494511477024.jpg (73KB, 640x837px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 640x837px

>>377330483
What the fuck happened

>>377330628
This.
Fuck the "the game starts at max level" bullshit.
I mean, I get it. character progression is satisfying (note that i didn't say "fun") but could you make a game where different numbers go up? like rank or money or skill stats? the whole leveling system is dated and doesn't serve what MMOs should be striving for.

>>377330393

>rollrolldollrollrollroll
>15 seconds later land one attack

yeah, fun for autists maybe
hell just give mobs 97% invulnerability uptime.

>>377327525
Tera and BDO had great combat but the usual downsides of MMOs. Their combat is the only redeeming feature.

Rust is an incredible MMO where real threats are always present and the rewards are huge. You have to work together to achieve anything of importance.

The only people that defend leveling are delusional vanillafags in their early 30s. Just about every single popular game right now is a multiplayer where you click play and experience the game to the fullest. No one wants to spend hours upon hours doing non-challenging non-rewarding trash mob quests spamming 1 and 2.

>>377330929
Just make story missions and/or other things level capped.

Lets people be relevant without being max level, and it keeps lower level equipment somewhat relevant as well.

>>377330990
You only need to roll once for most enemies in dark souls. And that is enough for a couple counter attacks, if youre not bad and rolled through their attack.

I always thought that things like auto que for dungeons and easy access to information hurt mmos instead of helped them. Before you needed to find friends to get help, look for parties, for people to tell you things. You had to cooperate with other people to succeed, forming a sense of community and creating bonds. MMOs in the end are about playing with other people. It seems like mmos these days are just single player adventures with other players dropping in to help you with raids.

An MMORPG's game design shouldn't just encourage single player play, it should basically require it, and without any auto que meet and leave systems that allow people to go through the entire game without having to talk to anyone.

>>377331602

doesnt change the fact that you have a 95% invulnerability uptime.

>>377331804
This ONLY works when an MMO is huge. If you're low-mid population it would never work and cause enough frustration that most newbies would quit and the game would inevitably fail.

>>377319963
Make Borderlands 3 fully open world multiplayer, no session p2p shit

You can't fix MMOs. You can't prevent access to data mined information, you can't change current player mindsets in any significant way, and you certainly can't be innovative while maintaining a steady stream of profit.

>>377330483
why do you underage faggots always post runescape? the game is garbage and always has been garbage. runescape is part of the problem

>>377332482
because runescape is the greatest.

speaking of which, i have 100 raw lobbies, anyone want to buy?

File: dfo early level.webm (3MB, 638x360px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 638x360px

>>377323101
>A small percentage of a classes abilities
>tuning content for 10 level brackets
Why? Action combat is a good suggestion because you can even keep the hotbar-GCD.

>>377323104
It comes exponentially because end-game is like leveling within a level.

>Several years
I refuse to accept that as good game design.

Getting rid of soulbound items is helpful to the game with a way to lose items, else the economy becomes full of each. Getting rid of items from the economy is *the* method for sandbox gameplay though.

Stop making MMOs where the player is THE HERO. THE CHOSEN ONE. The one who's there to save the world.

Give people the ability to simply be some average joe and enjoy themselves.

>>377319963
What the hell is going on in that image?

Raid is on Jarry
>top DPS is 10k from a frost DK
>That dps has 12 slot bags that you get at fucking lvl 20
>rogues doing that low dps in a 25 man raid.
>A fucking mage doing 4k dps
>All of this with bloodlust on

Thank god this shit is dying.

>>377333284
>the game of life mmo

2.5
SECOND
GLOBAL
COOLDOWN

>>377334184
People just want a game they can live in and enjoy themselves in. Carve their own path. Instead everyone is the fucking hero of Kvatch. That guy next to you? He's ALSO the chosen one. That guy over there? Yup. Also chosen. The world is doomed and it needs to be save and only YOU can save it. Oh and those thousands of other people.

File: 1494869929343.jpg (39KB, 240x226px) Image search: [Google]

39KB, 240x226px

>>377319963
By making it appease to a small subset of gamers that are the only ones who like a lot of the bullshit old WoW used to have.

>>377324957
The rubber-banding is content for the sake of content, and that's not fun. I should be able to fight and craft.

Completely abandon the WoW battle system and make all of them beat em ups/hack n slash ,making grinding actually fun.
Introduce a PvP 1 vs 1 system that is basically a fighting game and a group PvP system,i have no ideas for a group pvp system though ,but its mandatory,also have a nice artstyle.
There,i cured a genre

>>377334337
play second life then

>>377319963
don't hire people with facebook/mobile games background and give them any kind of creative responsibility. Don't hire people who produced AAA single player games - we don't need vocie acting or cinematics.

>>377334989
Second life is just a 3d chatroom.

>>377334960
Oh i forgot to add to abandon quests and make it completely adventure/exploration-based

>>377334960
>Completely abandon the WoW battle system and make all of them beat em ups/hack n slash ,making grinding actually fun.

This is actually what they are trying to do at the moment though. WoW is essentially turning into World of Diablo for every day that passes by.

>>377326378
>Community first, gameplay and everything else second.
Gameplay is what make the community, so making that "secondary" isn't clear. What really gets players to come together is loss and gain, so territory, constructed bases, and storing goods for positioning and free trade.

>>377325701
>>377326052
MMOs should have more than "leveling and raiding".

>>377326378
>Community first, gameplay and everything else second.

That makes no fucking sense. In order to have a community you need interesting gameplay. Community isn't a game design element.

>>377325701
It sucks ass because the battle system is beyond horrendous

>>377325501
RPGs should have roles.

i've said it once already in here, but you guys are describing final fantasy 11 for the most part. combat system being the only thing that is flawed

>>377325591
"Casuals" isn't a design sheet.

>>377330209
That has nothing to do with what the thread is about though.
World of Warcraft is not every MMO.

>>377326531
You're trying to make this statement about WoW, as a reply, and there's no way for it to apply. Each class has unique utility. There are so many types of CC to DR that MOBAs don't even account for, plus tanking, DPSing, and healing.

>>377323753
>Back when I got started, which sounds like ancient history, back then the demographics of people who were into computer games, was totally different, in my opinion, then they are today. ... I think in the last 5 or 6 years, the demographics have really changed, now this is my opinion, because computers are less expensive so more people can afford them. More "average" people now feel they should own one.

Go home Roberta Williams

File: 1484056658429.jpg (44KB, 400x250px) Image search: [Google]

44KB, 400x250px

>ITT people that has played WoW and no other MMO tries and argue what needs to be done to fix the genre
>the things they list have all been done and are in healthy MMO's atm.
I hate these threads. The worst part is "The community is dead meme" When even back in 2004 it was fucked because of WoW casualization of the MMORPG genre.

>>377337192
I'm pretty sure it's Everquest's fault, not WoW. Everquest is literally the model of MMO that WoW runs on.

>>377337192
>the things they list have all been done and are in healthy MMO's atm.

What healthy MMOs? There is only Korean grindshit, shitty WoW clones like FFXIV, and niche games like EVE?

>>377337192
>a lot of shitty games that each do one specific thing right is the same as one game doing all those things right

>>377332970
>playing runescape when you could been playing something else like Everquest or SWG.

>>377331804
>auto que meet and leave systems that allow people to go through the entire game without having to talk to anyone.
True. I think i leveled my char without talking to anyone random since like cata? Just hit the button, faceroll, gz, you won dungeon!

>easy access to information
This, fucking this. Fucking data miners, now you know (and even worse, you are expected to know) all bosses mechanics before it's even go live.

>>377338554
>all bosses mechanics before it's even go live.

Blame the community for requiring you to know a run before you even do it

>>377338997
>Blame the community for requiring you to know a run before you even do it
that's exacly what im talking about.
In the end, as always, mmos worst part is community.

MMOs once filled a niche. They were a convenient way to communicate and spend time with people from all over the world, all located in one virtual world where you could coexist and do shit together.
Social media now fills that niche.

It also was once that you used these games to meet new people. But it seems these days, people who play them are not really interested in meeting new people.

File: 1464249996731.jpg (24KB, 570x574px) Image search: [Google]

24KB, 570x574px

>Played WoW during Vanilla and TBC
>Want to go back but I heard a lot of people complaining retail is beyond shit
>Buy Legion and start playing
>It's fun as fuck

People who claim WoW is dead are the worst. Take off your nostalgia goggles.

>>377319963
WoW needs to die so we can move away from the concept of MMOs having rotation based combat with targetting

>>377320695
Turn based is a dead format, the current gaming culture has no space for such a slow pace.

To fix the MMO genre you need money in the scene, and for that you need popular games

>>377336940
Third worlders aren't buying more computers though. They're going straight to smartphones/tablets.

we can just hope for Pantheon to be good tbqh, if not, mmos will keep sucking big balls
pls Brad gib us another everquest

>>377319963
Make a world instead of a content delivery system

>>377330483
>2007 felt like the last real year to me

Holy shit I was in that thread like two days ago. One of the replies to that post is mine.

>>377330483
>Went from 14 to 15
Yeah that's about the time when things change.

everyone needs to migrate to runescape to see what a real mmo is

>>377319963
Damn what a cluttered UI.

Why do mmos even care about graphics if they're going to plaster your screen with shit?

>>377340347
I'd like to play it but can't help but feel like I missed the boat at this point.