Madarame done nothing wrong

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>it's legal so it's fine!

you got me OP

>>376979529

Did you forget about the part where he let Yosuke's mom die so he could steal her painting

>>376979529
>exploited students with blackmail so he could keep all the fame
>let his yusuke's mother die in front of him as a convenient way to keep yusuke under his wing
>did nuffing wrong

He didn't, the phantom thieves are self-righteous SJWs who think they know what's best for everyone and force people to conform to their beliefs

>>376979703

That's not illegal.

I thought the phantom thieves delivered justice not their own brand of moral faggotry. They acted as criminals when they attacked Madarame. The law was rightfully on madaramea side. He's the only villain who wasn't a criminal. Yusuke just could handle it.

>>376979529
> allow his friend to quick death painlessly instead suffering further from her illness
> raise her autistic son, teach him art, and save him from the japanese cold
> sell his art using his name for 1000x the price he would have gotten since art is 90% brand name, 10% aesthetic
> yusuke becomes a poorfag as soon as he leaves his care

>>376979627

Laws define what justice is retardo.

>>376979875
Making someone feel sorry isn't a crime you know.

>>376979906
>quick painless death
>suffered a seizure

>>376979875
>I thought the phantom thieves delivered justice not their own brand of moral faggotry.
Their entire thing is rebelling against society, what do you mean they follow the law to the letter?

Besides, he broke the law when he sold fake Sayuris on the black market and fucked with other people's careers

>>376979906

>Autistic son

That was a really good unexpected kek.

>>376979529
>Let Yusuke's mother die
>Abused his students
>Took their paintings for himself
>Committed fraud selling Sayuri on the sly too

He was the least of the villains for sure, but definitely still a villain.

>>376979875
They acted as criminals when they attacked anyone. They're vigilantes. It's what they do.

>>376979529
>let's a 3yo child's mother die during a seizure in order to make money off of her work
>raises the child in order to look sympathetic and become more famous
>as soon as the kid shows any promise in his artistic abilitues, he forces the kid to hand over his artwork and then proceeds to display it as his own
And that's not even counting the claims of abuse from prior apprentices. Madarame's palace had nothing to do with the legality of his actions, it was all about morality, which is why he was able to justify and get away with it for so long.

he didn't really do anything wrong he's just an asshole

>>376979906
>sell his art using his name for 1000x the price he would have gotten since art is 90% brand name, 10% aesthetic
>sell his art
Play the game, he stole that art and vandalized it

>>376980091

He inherited it then edited it then sold it. Yusuke was just too jelly.

>>376979865
Why were they given the power to do that to people though?

>>376980091
> erase yusuke from the sayuri painting

He did it to save yusuke from bullying. Imagine the amount of extra bullying yusuke would get about his ded mom. Everyone hates how their mom show your baby picture to your peer. Imagine if your mom paint a picture of you as a baby in her arm to show her love for you and it becomes a world famous painting. Yusuke will be forever known as mama little baby in the art school.

>>376980360
I'm almost fairly certain the law says differently. There was no real will, and if there was, the painting would have been left to Yusuke, not Madarame. Madarame committed third degree murder, stole property that didn't belong to him, and committed acts that could be seen as child abuse. He was most certainly breaking the law.

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>>376980036
>Least of the villains
>Not Kamoshida

>>376979703
That was his Shadow talking though, how the actual fuck is that trustworthy?

He probably froze up like any normal human being would, I mean he doesn't even confess this crime in the real world, just the plagiarism and fraud

>>376980510
>third degree murder
Manslaughter, i'm a retard

He was selling counterfeit art. I'm no Japanese lawyer, but that's got to be illegal there. So he isn't innocent.

But yeah, the Phantom Thieves didn't know that he was committing that particular crime when they started. They were after him for unproven child abuse and just being a general dick to his students.

>>376980510
Not being able to treat a seizure is in no way manslaughter

>>376980745
No, but not calling an ambulance or some kind of help because you'd prefer they die, is manslaughter

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Check out my latest work in progress

>>376980745
Neglecting to call the ambulance was what made it manslaughter.

>>376980845
Most people don't react to emergency situations that calmly, anon, most people freak out

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>>376979529
I AM THE BONE OF MY BRUSH

>lets Yusukes mother die to grab her painting
>ruins her last message to her son so it will sell better
>Takes in pupils. mistreats them, pumps them for art then kicks them out when they cant give anything else
>ruins their careers and futures if they try to speak out about this
>pretended to have the sayuri stolen then sold fake ones

Dudes a class A scumbag.

>>376980873
That's still not manslaughter, you could call it morally wrong but it's not a crime to fail to help someone

That fucking happens all the time

>>376980901
Are you a special kind of stupid? What retard doesn't call 911 or whatever Japan's emergency service number is in a life or death emergency, unless they have an ulterior motive

>>376981021
Most people because they have no fucking idea what's happening especially for something like a seizure

You SEVERELY overestimate how active humans are in this situation

>>376980980
A bunch of college kids went to jail after failing to call the cops for 12 hours after a kid was knocked unconscience and died just recently. But this is in murica and not Japan

>>376980901
Yeah. It would be different if you could prove he intentionally didn't get help then it would be different, but that's impossible so it's hard to claim it was manslaughter.

>>376981097
why are you going to such lengths defending a cartoonishly evil JRPG villain?

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>>376980498

>"He did it to save yusuke from bullying"
>"Imagine the amount of extra bullying yusuke would get about his ded mom."
>letting a kids mom die and defacing her self portrait in order to protect him from bullying

>>376980980
Intentional neglect is a crime, especially when dealing with that kind of emergency.

>>376979529
When do the phantom thieves claim to be supporters of the law? It's said multiple times that they don't like adults who abuse and take advantage of others, which is what Madarame did. It may have been legal technically, but that doesn't make him not a douchebag.

>>376981191
That's not an argument, and because I have personal experience with people failing to help someone having a seizure

They aren't criminals

>>376979529
>thieves care about legality
lmaoing @ ur life

>>376979627
Like Jim Crow laws?

>>376981251
>intentional
So you're taking a shadow's word at face value? Bullshit.

>>376979529
>plagiarizing is legal
It isn't

Technically, what he did to Yusuke's mother could be counted as negligent homicide.

>>376981408
Yes, yes I am. Do you not understand Jungian psychology?

>>376979529
No plagiarism is not legal, if he did nothing illegal he wouldnt have gone to jail.

>>376981324
did these people also want said person to die in order to steal their intellectual property?

>>376979875
>They acted as criminals when they attacked Madarame.
Wheres the law that says what they did was illegal?

>>376981157
That's a bit different. With a group, it's unlikely that they were all freaking out enough to not call for help. Also, nobody would panic for 12 straight hours.
However, a single old man with a crying baby might freeze for long enough for a seizure victim to die.

>>376981408
Yes. If anything, Shadows are completely honest. They are the incarnation of one's desires unhampered by any trappings of civility or self-denial.

>>376981157

Weirdly enough, it isn't illegal to not call 911 for someone dying in the US. I think it should be but whatever.

The college kids are going to jail because they pumped him full of alcohol. So they're responsible or something.

>>376981570
He froze so that he could let her die & steal her painting, yeah.

>>376979875
>I thought the phantom thieves delivered justice not their own brand of moral faggotry.

I'm starting to think that "red-pill" is actually code for "Validate my stupidity everyone!"

>>376981498
Have you not played any other game in the series? Shadows are always extorted and exaggerated. Why are you blatantly spouting bullshit because I disagree with you.

Fuck you douchebag, ill explain it for you anyways. For someone scummy like Madarame, it might be easier to think accept being a murderer, rather than someone who failed to react properly and cost someone their life. Especially if you have the very real thought of financial gain

>>376981509
except it wasn't technically plagiarism

>>376981547
One could easily argue that mind control is a form of psychological coercion which is illegal.

>>376979875
>That's not illegal.

I'm pretty sure actively choosing to do nothing while someone is dying in front of you is considered manslaughter.

>>376981656
All of them misrepresent something that is essentially true, but you're right Kanji is gay

Fuck you retard

>>376981935

But it's not. That's a fact.

>>376980498
How would anyone make the connection it was Yusuke if no one knew his mother was the one that painted it you turbotard?

>>376979875
>That's not illegal.
It's a crime

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>>376981991

>>376980901
>>376980745

Except you know damn well Madarame didn't "freeze up" and he outright admitted he let her die on purpose for his own gain. That's negligent homicide over here in bongland, and I'm sure the law isn't too different in Japan. If the police had known that he damn well would have been charged for it.

Dude was a scumbag for that by his own admission even if he technically skirted the law. Come on now. It would be like if my parents were having a heart attack and I calmly went into the next room and made tea without even attempting to call 911 because I wanted their life insurance once they were dead.

>>376981991
But it is a crime
It's illegal as fuck

>>376982080
not in the US, dunno about Japan

>>376979875

>I thought the phantom thieves delivered justice not their own brand of moral faggotry.

How do you miss the point of the game so hard?

>>376982234
>not in the US
???

>>376982185

>tfw I had to stop reading at United States

I can't tell if you're baiting or just the slowest person in this entire thread

>>376982301

I'm baiting, this is my bait thread.

Keep arguing for my amusement, puppets.

>>376982185
>The law does not impose criminal liability for a failure to act unless a specific duty is owed to the victim
there you have it. If you're a lifeguard, you have a duty to try to save someone drowning. If you are an average joe, you don't have a duty.

>>376982189
I bet you think kanji is gay or that naoto is undergoing ftm surgery.

>>376982189
>he outright admitted
No, his fucking Shadow did. Say for example the day before the seizure he had a creeping thought about how he wished Yusuke's mother dead, then the next day she's having a seizure and he stands around like a retard (which is a natural response)

That would fuck your psyche up, oh and of it's his worst crime you'd think he'd admit it after the change of heart. And that's not mentioning Yusuke's confidant

dasfdgh

>>376982482
Kanji is totally into dudes tho

>>376981891
Its not mind control though. Mind control implies the thieves are controlling their targets thought patterns when really they're just making them not being giant fucking cunts for once in their lives.

>>376982354
But negligent homicide is a crime in Japan too

>>376982495
"the guy's inner self admitted to his crimes!"

>>376982446

Which is what we've all been specifically saying since the start because we all knew this. I think the guy opposing us on this is a teenie bopper

>>376982495
>he stands around like a retard (which is a natural response)
Are you fucking retarded?

>>376982312
>dunno about japan
what don't you understand?

>>376982446
>Another example could be leaving a child locked in a car on a hot day.

It could easily be argued that the average citizen has a "duty" to call for help when someone is dying literally right in front of them.

>>376982354
Criminal negligence is a crime in Japan also.

>>376982604
Please tell me how you'd perfectly react in an emergency situation, that has never happened to you in your entire life, enlighten me

You're full of yourself you worthless scum

>In 1990 the police identified over 2.2 million Penal Code violations. Two types of violations — larceny (65.1 percent of total violation) and negligent homicide or injury as a result of accidents (26.2%) — accounted for over 90 percent of criminal offenses

Totally doesn't exist in Japan, nope.

>>376982704
Call 911
Wow so hard

>>376982446
Isn't Good Samaritan law a thing in general?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPnK0NCn_MQ

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_Samaritan_law

>this idiotic thread again
Report, sage, hide

>>376982518

After his dungeon he is very ambiguous about it and he definitely shows more interest than girls than guys even when he's supposed to be comfy in his skin I think he's like 80% straight oriented and slightly queer, but even then nah I think he's straight but just into feminine shit but because of Japan's stupid culture he was made to feel like less of a man

He only ever openly expressed interest in women and unlike everybody else he didn't straight up accept his shadow he knocked it out as if quashing his bi curiosity when he discovered who he really WA

>>376981770
I understand where the Persona games drew the terminology from, and by extension, the conceptual framework for how shadows operate. Shadows are the aspects of the self that we divorce ourselves from, a sub-personality that we have within. Confronting such a thing is always painful and can cause massive trauma if not well prepared or properly supported. Of course the shadows will be distorted, they represent a denied self that still exists and functions in the background of one's psyche. Jungian psychology is the bedrock of the Persona series, thematically speaking. To understand the series properly, one needs to understand the basis it was built on, educate yourself before spouting sophistry.

>>376982772
He was totally into Naoto when he thought it was he.

He's into feminine penises even if he ain't gay.

If Madarame is wrong then why was he given his own redemption arc in Yusuke's Slink?

>>376982704
Yeah, there is literally nothing that could possibly be done in this day and age. What else can you do other than watch them die and maybe make a video of it on your phone?

>>376982806
Thank you for proving my point, this complete lack of self-awareness is completely disgusting

Fuck off

>>376982765

Just don't come into the thread you raging autist, saging doesn't even work anymore thanks for the bump

>>376982543
It's still mind control but not total control. "Making them" not be cunts is changing their mind through some weird magic shit. If you could prove they did it, you could easily prove that it was coercion.
Lucky for them, nobody would believe the method. So there would have to be evidence that the Phantom Thieves used some other method of coercion, and of course none exists.

>>376982656
It has been argued, and overwhelmingly resulted with not holding citizens accountable for deaths. You can't define what constitutes attempting to help, you can't hold someone accountable for being thrown into a life or death situation if they don't have any experience in them.

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>n-no, they didn't actually commit these crimes their shadows just said they did
>t-they were just brainwashed into confessing stuff they didn't actually do they're completely innocent
>n-nothing shadows say is actually true...

>>376982765
Blame Berserk for these kinda memes

>>376982758
The good samaritan law is just to protect the people that do decide they can help, it in no way forces people to help.

>>376982443
>I was merely pretending

>>376982973
>Naoto should listen to herself and undergo ftm surgery

Damn nigger you're fucking retarded

>>376983064

Thanks for the bump retard, reply and give me another one

>>376983076
Well, she is transgender
Or he

>>376983106
I saged

>>376983076

Shadows exaggerate certain aspects, but what they say and represent is still based somewhat in truth. If they were complete liars then none of the bad guys in P5 are guilty of anything at all.

>>376983175

>he thinks saging still works like that

Why are all the villains so one dimensional? The only guys with palaces who are sympathetic are pretty much the ones siding with you.
>>376982983
>Donovan and Griffith did wrong
Disprove? Or are you a chump?

>>376983175
I didn't. thanks for giving me something to reply to.

>>376983195
Yes, Madarame is a greedy bastard. That's the point

>>376982914
>>376982443
For someone baiting you're pretty asshurt.

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>>376983076
Then why does every person in Persona 4 have to accept themselves because what they're saying is true.

>>376982973
Fuck off yosuke, were not throwing the dude into the tv

He sold millions of dollars worth of counterfeit paintings you dumb fuckers. No, not the ones he stole from Yusuke either, he kept repainting the Sayuri and selling it to collectors claiming it was the original. This is fraud and its explicitly illegal. Did none of you fucking pay attention?

>>376983251
>Why are all the villains so one dimensional?
Did you not pay attention? They're all based of the deadly sins.

>>376983298

I think the person referencing multiple posts and using childish phrases like that sounds mad but okay friendo xD

>>376983382
No one gets hurt from a little fraud and all he did was scam rich morons anyway.

>>376981837
Taking others stuff and passing it off as your own is the definition of plagarism.
I dont know what the laws are in japan but in the US what he did would be illegal.

>>376983305
See
>>376983076

>>376983076

The main of theme of P4 was accepting yourself and acknowledging your inner desires but not letting them rule your life. It was all about coming to terms with who you are. That's why characters literally only defeated their Shadows once they stopped rejecting them so hard.

>>376983409

What was okumaru then?

>>376983480
Again that doesn't answer my question

>>376983460
>Madarame did nothing illegal! the law is on his side!
>b-b-but nobody gets hurt when he actually does this illegal action so its okay
Fuck you and fuck this entire thread.

>>376983460
oh yeah that makes it legal

>>376983526
You should try using your brain then

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>>376983460

>madarame never broke the law
>except for when he did break the law but it's okay because it's not like he was murdering people

>>376983460
You're clearly just being purposefully obtuse for the sake of keeping your shitty bait thread going.

>>376983454
>xD
wow you're mad

>>376983474
It literally wouldn't because everything he "passed off as his own" was given to him. He owns the pieces because in a way he had them commissioned.

>>376983486
Yes Kanji is gay and Naoto wants gender surgery, we get it, we all played P4 here

>>376983553
Except the what the protags are also illegal. Specifically obstruction of justice and vigilante.

>>376983514
Wrath

>>376983460
A crime is a crime, 'victimless' or not. Crime must be punished. Scamming the rich makes what Madarame did a crime with a victim anyway, so your point is moot from the start.

>>376983669
And nobody denies that. Doesnt make Madarame any less of a criminal.

>>376980642

>That was his shadow talking though, how the actual fuck is that trustworthy?

Welcome to the series! There are plenty of guides to help you understand how the game mechanics work. Shadows are an essential part of the Persona series.

According to Carl Jung, shadows are the parts of us within our consciousness that the conscious self does not accept. Your ego seperates you from it as much as it can. The unconscious doesn't tell conscious lies.

You don't have to be notorious, famous, or held to any esteem by others -- I would wager every single person has shadow aspects. Jung makes this clear, and so does Persona 4.

Again, welcome to the series.

>>376983623
>>376983610
>>376983558
>>376983553
>Phantoms Thieves do illegal shit
>GO PHANTOMS THIEVES
>Others do illegal shit
>CHANGE THEIR HEARTS
Fuck off Mishima

>>376983629

I wonder why you keep using the word mad and why you're still in my thread, I mean it's obvious what I'm doing here but you seem to be on a mission to out reply me now

>>376983758

The Phantom Thieves are criminals too. That still doesn't somehow magically negate the fact that Madarame was breaking the law.

>>376983709

Well that wasn't very well done then, where was the wrath at any point?

>>376983636
He took stole Sayuri from a women who was fucking dead. She wasn't alive to "give" it to him.

>>376983758
People generally agree that they're both doing illegal shit

>>376979875
You may have missed the major theme of the game.

>>376983564
All shadows tell the truth, they only exaggerate it.big time.
The exaggeration comes from what they think of themselves in Palace.

>>376983739
>parts of us
>parts
Congrats! You proved my point!

>>376983382
White collar crime (fraud, embezzlement, ponzi schemes, forgery, etc) is still a crime. It is just not going to be as personally motivating from what I've seen in general compared to some of the other villains. It's why someone like Kamoshida is detested way more compared to Kaneshiro and Madarame in comparison.

>>376983514
Okumura supposedly coincided with greed. Personally, I would switch him with Kaneshiro (Gluttony) because both of them are clearly greedy, and why not have the Gluttony villain be the one with an attack that is a giant hamburger that hurts you if you aren't hungry.

>>376983837
Using people like their something that can be replaced to get whatever you want.

>>376983853
So you're saying Madarame is greedy and is exaggerated to the point where he thinks he would let someone die for money? Because that fits perfectly with every other shadow

>>376983840
And who's to say she didn't will it to him with her dying declaration?

>>376983758
I don't think anyone is arguing that what the Phantom Thieves do is ethically dubious, at best, but that's the whole point of the game. They're kids that the system and people that are supposed to be there to protect them has failed, and often abused instead. With no one to rely on, they take it upon themselves to bring other criminals to justice, in the process committing illegal, though often less morally reprehensible acts themselves.

It's like saying Robin Hood wasn't a good guy because he also did illegal things.

>>376983929

Wrath to me means violent anger, seems like shido was most wrathful

>>376979529
The only innocent person they targeted was Kamoshida. Everyone else was guilty of some crime to some degree.

>>376984025
Wrath was apparently the bird lady

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>obvious bad guy does something obviously bad
>/v/ bends over backwards to make them seem like an innocent victim

Why is this place the epitome of contrarian

>>376984031
The persona fanbase will tell you that Kamoshida is detestable while liking a murderer like Adachi.

>>376984071

The bird lady? What?

>>376984031

Go to bed, Kamoshida.

>>376983969
That's not how it works

>>376984071
>>376984121
I mean sphinx lady, sorry. Wakaba

>>376981324
So you know people that didn't call an ambulance or take said person to the hospital after they had a seizure and just left them to die?

>>376983856

I think what you're communicating is different than what it's in your head. Take your time typing it out, no one's rushing you.

>>376984031
>sexual harassment
>innocent
>physical abuse
>innocent
>expelling students because he doesn't like them
>innocent

>>376984071
Wrath was also Futaba. Depression is often one's own anger turned on oneself, rather than levied on others.

>>376984087
But this isn't a Kamoshida thread
>be artist
>consent to having my art stolen
>WOW WTF THIS IS BULLSHIT
What a crime

>>376984115
They were both great guys.

>>376984189
Besides the expelling part each of the male Phantom Thieves are guilty of this to some extent. Hypocrites.

>>376984087

I think if I felt misunderstood or like an underdog for my entire life I'd want to root for them in fiction, too. Poor guy.

>>376984174
You don't think, that's the problem here

>>376983951
Nope, he just think he's god/ruler of a museum

>>376981324

Intent is one of the most difficult things to prove in court, yes, but you're still defending Madarame based on an assumption. Since we don't actually see the scene ourselves we have no idea how it really went down and only have his Shadow's word to go on.

Maybe he did actually freeze up and she died as a result and he decided to use that to his advantage after the fact. But he just as well could have stood there laughing and stroking his beard.

>>376984147
a dying declaration is admissible in court as evidence as hearsay, so if Madarame had to testify about the ownership of the painting, he could pretty much get away with whatever he wanted because he was the only one there when she died. Now, whether or not he could call it "his" artwork is entirely another matter, and would probably get him in trouble legally, provided anyone could prove he didn't author the work.

>Lets Yusuke's mom die

Why are you assuming she could be saved? It's not like he drugged her or something.

>>376983076
Do you have brain damage? All shadows tell the truth but they just exaggerate it out of proportion.

>>376984293

Sassy, I love it! Like I said, take your time. Develop a well-thought out argument and people might take you seriously.

>>376979529
>le epic sociopath /v/ meme
xD

What is WITH jap teenagers and dead parents

>>376984269
Not at all to the same degree as Kamoshida, who abuses his position and talent to get away with his shit.

>>376984387
You're right anon, seizure's have a 100% fatality rate, every time.
All those times they taught you how to react to a fellow student having a seizure in school, and how to react properly? All lies, they all instantly die, and you can do nothing to save them.

>>376979875
Not attempting to help someone who is dying, when you can help them, is actually a crime you moron.

>>376984546

It's not you Fucking moron read the fucking thread it's been proven 4 times already

>>376984387

Regardless of if she could have been saved or not, it's about whether or not he even attempted to try and help her. Surviving a seizure or heart attack isn't uncommon as long as the ambulance gets there in time.

Even if the chances are slim, you're not supposed to just shrug your shoulders and go "oh well, they're going to die anyway so there's no point calling someone".

>>376984025
"Wrath can be defined as uncontrolled feelings of anger, rage, and even hatred, which often reveals itself in the wish to seek vengeance."
His whole thing about never being poor is from him not being able to buy that model kit as a kid. So he grew to hate the world and only focus on him.
While I agree his dungeon didn't show it off very well. e is still Wrath.
>>376984194
No, Futaba is just Sloth.

>>376984601

Except it's been pointed out that criminally negligent homicide is a thing, even in Japan.

>>376984408
>Naoto wants ftm surgery
See
>>376983076

>>376984601
I seriously hope you are fucking underage because no one over the age of 21 should be this stupid about the law.

>>376984601
Negligent homicide, the very situation you say is not illegal, is a crime in Japan. This has come up several times in the thread.

>>376984546
uh oh looks like someone didn't read the chain. Is it past your bedtime?

>>376984723
That's quite the argument there

>>376980871
poor wojak

Official Persona 5 'Did Nothing Wrong' Power Rankings

>Confused and Misled Tier
Akechi
>Did Nothing Wrong Tier
Kamoshida
>Misunderstood Tier
Shido, Yaldabaoth
>Self-Defense Tier
Kaneshiro, Madarame
>Did What They Had To Do Tier
Okumura

>>376984682
If you read the thread, criminally negligent homicide requires the person who is accused of being negligent to have a DUTY to respond, which they failed to do.
This is easy enough to prove with doctors, or other people who deal with protecting peoples lives, but for average citizens there's no real 'duty'.
Though I wonder, do married couples/people in relationships have a presumed 'duty' to help each other?
In the example of leaving a child locked in a hot car, there is a presumed duty on the parents, so does the same sort of thing apply here?

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>>376984716

No matter how many times you quote yourself it doesn't make you any less wrong.

>>376984741
>>376984723
>>376984682
No one is saying otherwise. You guys are missing the point that Madarame did not commit criminally negligent homicide, according to the US definition. If some bitch ass weeb knows Japanese law for some reason, and can post a source and translation saying why the standards for criminally negligent homicide in Japan are different from those in the US, go right ahead. Until then, we have to use the definition we are familiar with, and Madarame did NOT commit a negligent homicide by that definition.

>>376984741

You're thick as shit boyyyy.

That only applies if you are a trained professional capable of helping the person on the spot. Otherwise you're golden. Nobody is obligated to phone emergency services.

>>376984894
You're right Naoto was all about gender reassignment surgery, that's true

>>376984741

It's not being negligent if you can't help what's wrong with the person. Failing to alert authorities is not negligence in that sense, just deal with it

>>376985019

This. There could be a million different reasons why you didn't phone emergency services, it's not a crime it's that obvious and simple. You are not forced to get involved

>>376984893
>>376984921

It depends on intent, which is incredibly hard to prove in court. You can be charged for straight up manslaughter if you let someone die without even attempting to help them because of personal reasons. There's a difference between a little old lady panicking because her husband is having a heart attack and forgetting to call 911 as opposed to straight up doing nothing and letting him die because she wants to cash in on his life insurance policy.

All we have to go on is what Madarame's Shadow said, which implies malicious intent.

>>376985250

Wat

I can't even anymore, no, I'm done you're just obtuse

Everyone knows you're wrong and you must as well

>>376983758
it's illegal shit that no one could ever believe so it's perfectly fin until it gets known.

>>376984678
The whole of Japan was sloth.

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>>376979529
it was the artists of the game just venting how much guys like Madarame piss them off
only artists really get it, most people don't really care
pretty ironic that their game actually did have a guy tracing their art

>>376985459

I think the whole 'guys the bosses are the 7 deadly sins' thing is just bullshit

None of them are an extreme representation of one of the sins except Kamoshida being lust

They only consented to let him use their art due to his threats, right? If they give up the art through coercion he really is stealing their art.

>>376985250
Fortunately for Madarame, they can't put his shadow on trial. I don't think he could be charged with negligent homicide unless they could prove that the Sayori painting was not authored by him, and even then the homicide charge would be tough to make stick. All he would have to do is say that he plagiarized the work in order to provide for the son of the person he watched die, because he felt guilty about not being able to save her. His crimes were done to provide for the person he could save. Ta-da, no negligence.

Any easter eggs on NG+? I know you carry over your social stats and the items your max rank confidants give you, does the compendium carry over?

How is Merciless mode? I found the game mostly very easy, and only struggled when I was just trying to zone out through dungeons. I think P3P hard mode didn't let you use the compendium, is that how P5 is?

>>376985423

>criminal negligence is a 'misfeasance or 'nonfeasance' where the fault lies in the failure to foresee and so allow otherwise avoidable dangers to manifest. In some cases this failure can rise to the level of willful blindness where the individual intentionally avoids adverting to the reality of a situation. The degree of culpability is determined by applying a reasonable person standard. Criminal negligence becomes "gross" when the failure to foresee involves a "wanton disregard for human life"

>Young and inexperienced individuals may very well not foresee what an adult might foresee, a blind person cannot see at all, and an autistic person may not relate to the world as a non autistic person. Cases involving infancy and mental disorders potentially invoke excuses to criminal liability because the accused lack full capacity

If you are a perfectly functioning person without some kind of mental disorder and you intentionally let someone die right in front of you, you're guilty. No matter how hard you want to meme up the "dindu nuffin wrong" angle for obvious villains, you're factually wrong. Madarame was a piece of shit, end of story

>>376985662
And he's not going to do that, the entire point of stealing a treasure is to make them feel guilty and want to confess their crimes. Madarame isnt gonna lie to save his own skin, he'll tell the truth because he feels too guilty not to.

>>376980871
what the hell is this shit

>>376985649

No they just felt they owed him their work for him looking after them.

I don't see how it's so unfair, he's the artist with the big name that gives the paintings their value anyway. What the fuck does that fag yusuke think would have happened if Madarame wasn't his master, does he actually think his art is worth what Madarame can sell it for

Yusuke is just a mad asshole who couldn't stand how much money Madarame had, Madarame was hurting nobody

>>376985864

Nice source bro

>>376985880
Yeah but we saw his press conference, he only brought up plagiarism

It's likely the shadow was an exaggeration, like always

>>376979529
t. Midnight Animal dev

>>376985880
Oh yeah, of course. I thought we were talking about a hypothetical situation where he was on trial without having his heart stolen.

>>376985864


What you just posted proves you wrong, it's telling you that you would only be held accountable if you were a doctor just like everyone told you. Are you done now l, also why the fuck are you posting like that with no source at all?

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>>376985597
some of these are acceptable uses of references though, I dont get it.

>>376986207
are they really though?

Is there a stronger man than Madarame Uchiha?

>>376986207

Seems like some faggots think they are the first person to invent a pose

>>376985864
Madarame was a piece of shit, but he wasn't criminally negligent. look up the precedent cases instead of the legalese next time.

>>376986207
tracing can be forgivable, especially for comics where artists gotta make deadlines
but knowing some guys could make a living off just that puts a bad taste in the mouths of other people who appreciate art

>>376982648
letting someone die and stealing from them is illegal in america.

it's second hand manslaughter and looting

>>376986440

Sounds like more jealousy about money

I also thought that was kinda weird.

It took Kamoshida raping a girl for them to take action, because they didn't want to mentally fuck him up beyond repair, but a guy steals others people's artwork and they're perfectly fine with brainwashing him.

It was such a bizarre leap that I thought the game was gonna go for the slippery slope angle, and this is saying nothing about the mementos sidequests where you do pretty much the same thing to purse snatchers and cheaters

>>376986691
Well when they hit madarame they had the confidence that they could change him without turning him into a vegetable

What was the relationship between Yusuke's mom and Madarame again?


You're not obligated under the law to help someone if you have no relationship towards them. For example, if you're walking through the park and you see some hobo bleeding out in the bushes you can't be charged for letting them die because it's not your duty to render them aid nor does the law say you have to. The only time you would be held responsible would be if you went over and started to help them but then backed out or changed your mind and just left. After that point you're considered responsible because you got involved with them and your actions could have led to them being saved if you followed through.

But if you have a personal relationship with a person or they're in your care, then it's considered your duty to help them to the best of your ability, even if it's just dialing 911 and standing by. Like people have been saying, a doctor just letting their patient die is negligence, or even a teacher not giving a shit if one of their students has a seizure in the middle of class. If he was her caretaker or teacher then he could 100% be held liable for not calling for help which resulted in her death because it would have been considered his duty to try and help her.

>>376979703

This was the real shit got real moment of his palace, holy hell do you want to punch his scumbag face in.

>>376986691

I thought this too, they even risk vegetabling Mishima and sorijos daughter , the main cast just don't give a fuck

>>376986953

This. The main cast are on some serious 'MIND CRUSH' levels of apathy sometimes

>>376986691

Kamoshida was their first target and they weren't even all that confident that changing his heart would work. Even Morgana, their guide, admitted that he had never done it before and that things would "probably" be okay. With Madarame you could see that they were emboldened by their previous success and more confident that they could change his heart without the risk of vegetabling him.

>>376986953

Futaba was fine, she asked for it, and probably would have killed herself anyway.

The others didn't get to give their consent before being mindfucked.

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>>376979529
OP is a faggot
>Blatantly plagiarized other people's works
>Besides the details behind her death, let Yusuke's mom die so he could steal her work
>Proceeds to paint over it for his own selfish goals
>Proceeded to raise her son so he could steal his work too
>Stole several other pupils works and ruined their art careers
>Slandered rivals artists and sabotaged their careers
>Sold forgeries and copies to the Black Market
>Deceived the public about his finances and living conditions

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Kamoshia - Lust
Madarame - Pride
Fat yakuza guy- Gluttony
Futaba - Sloth
Okumurama - greed
Niijima - Envy
Shido - wrath
Momentos - all

is this right?

>>376986953

Morgana explains after the end of Kamoshida's palace that as long as the Shadow is intact after they steal the treasure and leave the Palace, then the target won't become a vegetable.

This is a purposeful plot point because destroying shadows is how the main villains have been fucking shit up for a while.

>>376987089
>>376986953
>People are forgetting all the cringe-worthy 'ARE YOU SURE THIS THE RIGHT THING' conversations and text messages

They were second-thinking themselves up until Haru's dad which ironically was the one that actually went south

But keep in mind, that wasn't their fault--literally every heart they changed was for the better.

>Go to sleep Yalba

>>376987338

He repeatedly makes it clear that he doesn't fully understand the rules and that they could fuck people up somehow

He sold forgeries, which is illegal.

>>376986898
You know, this sort of mentality is why China is such a shit hole that it current is, complete with leaving children dying in the street because they don't want to get involved.
>Go to sleep Yaldaboath

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>>376979529
>Bullied, abused and ran the creativity of his pupils into the ground for his own personal gain
>Then cast them out and destroyed all prospects they might have once they were either worn out or useless to him
>Destroyed the careers of anyone who opposed him because he was famous
>Made the boy he raised for thirteen years live in a barren hovel while he hung out in luxury with his mistress, all to cultivate an image that would see him getting richer
>Swindled art collectors with fake Sayuris (which is a crime)
>Didn't call an ambulance for a dying woman in his house because he wanted her artwork for himself

>>376987635
He only emphasizes that aspect before they change Kamoshida
afterwords he's gung ho about it.

>>376987282
Madarame is Vanity, Futaba is wrath, Shiho is pride

>>376987652
It sounded like he sold forgeries to people who knew they were fake, who would then try to pass them off as the real thing. So I think that would still technically be legal.

>>376987635

He doesn't understand Mementos, but after Kamoshida he's quite confident about how Palaces work. The point is emphasized so matter-of-factly, again, to contrast later story elements that involve shadows being eliminated on purpose.

>>376987635
Half of that was because there was no rhyme or reason why he should know that in the first place.
Imagine being created for the sole reason of acting as a guide, without the actually knowledge of doing so--wouldn't you question your every action
Just like Morgana
Just like the twins?

It's like people didn't even play the game

>>376987282
Okumura doesn't really fit in as a seven deadly sin. Neither does Shido. Kaneshiro could just as easily be greed as he is gluttony, and hell, you could argue that even Kamoshida was Pride as his downfall was ultimately how he saw being an olympic metalist as putting him above everyone else.

>>376987831

He did both. He said he would disclose to regular buyers that what he was selling were only copies because the original got "stolen", but when people with the big bucks showed up he would lie and tell them that he was selling them the original but they had to keep it private and not display it anywhere. It's kind of his buyer's fault for being dumbasses, but they took what he said at face value because of his reputation.

Though it's hilarious thinking how many people flipped their shit once he admitted to selling frauds on TV.

>>376982704

One of the girls in my school used to have seizures, the first time she had everyone, including the teacher, panicked because we did not know how to react, and yet the first thing the teacher did was dial 911 on his cellphone and call for a ambulance, the guy on the phone then told him how to keep her stable until the paramedics arrived, taking special care to not let her bite or choke on her tongue.

Its not exactly that hard to just fucking dial 911 and ask for help.

Nice bait you fucking faggot, you earned this you

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>>376987784
>smelly neet that never goes outside is wrath
>not sloth

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>>376987784
I don't think the 'seven deadly sins' theme was ever set in stone, and I think it's just coincidence that Momentos was named after them.

The stupid thing about the seven deadly sins is that they're all interchangeable and piggyback off of one another. The order from least to worst of the sins is always up for debate because it's believed all the sins derive from the worst.

But for example
>Kamoshida could have been both Pride and Lust (his treasure was a medal, an accomplishment people praised him for)
>Madarame could have been Pride or Envy (his treasure was someone else's painting)
>Mishima could have been Avarice or even Pride (his treasure was fake money)
>Futaba was definitely sloth though
>Haru's dad could have been Avarice or Envy (note, his treasure was something he couldn't have)
>Sae could have been Avarice or Envy(her palace was a Casino and she also went on that rant about climbing up through society)
>Shido could have been Avarice or Envy (he wanted control of everything)

>>376982704
>WOW, 911 IS SO HARD TO DO.
You've been turned retarded by making /v/ your basis of education more than 2nd grade.

>>376988374

Especially since calling 911 is usually the first thing that pops into people's head when they witness an accident or someone getting hurt. It's pretty much a reflex even if the victim in question is undoubtedly dead already.

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>>376979529
Why do people try to somehow justify the terrible things that any antagonist does in basically any medium ever? The "Griffith did nothing wrong" meme has gone too far.

>>376988567
Naturally you have to call 911 if somebody is dead because the police have to make a report.
Said report has to be reported to next of kin, the government, workplaces, insurance, etc--anyone who's stupid enough NOT to pick up the phone and dial 911--one of the easiest things to do in most scenarios, shouldn't be breathing.

>>376986953
>the main cast just don't give a fuck
Actually the problem is that they give too much of a fuck. All the shitty text messages straight up tell you this. After the second change of heart and the requests they constantly take, they should realize that it works 100% all the time.

>>376988469
Let's not forget the whole theme of the game was control
>Kamoshida wanted control over the school
>Madarame wanted control over his pupils
>Kanoshiro controlled people through extortion
>Futaba literally wanted control over her life
>Haru's dad wanted control over his company and finances
>Sae wanted control over her career
>Shido wanted control over everything
>Yaldaboath wanted uber-control over everything

I don't know why /v/ defends the PT so much, the bad ending pretty much proves they would have went too far eventually.

>>376988469
It's about the major sin that's the most prioritized, not about their personality.

Kamoshida's desire for superiority and sweet ass is what causes him to be abusive and dominating. Pride is just something that comes from the ability to do so.

Madarame is finding the people he steps over as his own work.

Kaneshiro obsessively demands money he doesn't even have any purpose to have.

Okumura even with great success, sacrifices priceless things like his fucking daughter for more power.

Nijima lets her bitterness step over the line just as much as the people she envies.

Shido REALLY doesn't need to be jelly at all, he's basically Super JFK to people.

>>376987313
did /pg/ make this?

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I agree, honestly someone please tell me what this fellow did that was so incorrect. Wasn't it all completely within law? Did he earn a mental destruction? Appeared to be a matter of resentment from yusuke to I.

>stealing isn't a crime

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>>376980593
>raping kids and beating them isn't worse than stealing art and negligence

>>376984929
>he thinks laws are the same in every country

>Moral =/= Law
>Wrong =/= Unlawful
But then, most of /v/ is autistic.

Why does he look like the old dude from Totally Spies?

>>376989941
I love people arguing about laws when there are no laws written about things that are not even known to exist

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>Haru's dad's only crime was being stingy and potentially selling his daughter to some guy
>She still sticks with him afterwards

I know this is the guy who shakes the teams morals but can we admit he's the real dindunothing?

>>376980642
You do realize that a Shadow is your true self that you don't want know about/ashamed about

>>376982704
Well recently, I was a witness to some domestic violence.

Ran away like a bitch and locked myself in the bathroom where I called the police.

>>376990123
>>Haru's dad's only crime was being stingy and potentially selling his daughter to some guy

He ordered for mental shutdowns on his competitors.

>>376990123
>implying he didn't have criminal business practices and assasinate competitors

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>Changing the heart of a dude that cheats at video games
A bit much don't you think?

He was still evil, just underwhelming compared to the guy before

>>376991292
Nah. Madarame Uchiha is big leagues compared to DuckShima

>>376979875
I'd say "justice" is probably not the right term, they were more pursuers of righteousness, not necessarily justice. madarame was evil as fuck, even if he was a lawful citizen.

the phantom thieves are criminals for the entire game. they made no illusion that they were acting outside of the law -- hence the god damn name.

The worst guy is probably the mobster but his misdeeds are all offscreen
He might as well have been some schoolyard bully if all he was gonna do onscreen was frame makoto

>>376990123

He was helping fund Shido in return for having him arrange mental shutdowns on competitors.

>>376982518
No.
Kanji like Naoto as a dude, yes. But he still liked her as a girl after. Kanji felt true love for naoto. She is his soulmate. Sadly, the opposite is not true. Kanji is cursed.

>>376979939
That would mean calling a law unjust is a contradiction, which it obvious isn't, you fucking moron.

>>376979529
He stole his own painting from a museum and sold copies on the black market.
That is illegal. Forgery, fraud and grand larceny.

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>Kamoshida, Madarame, Kaneshiro, Okumura, and Shidou get locked up behind the bars.
>Akechi's gone in ambiguous death. Setting himself to appear again in the spinoff or sequel.

SEE YOU ALL IN THE SPINOFF , FOLKS!

>>376979875
it's not illegal but it's an irredeemably cunty move
if you didn't have autism and weren't 16 you'd understand that

go to bed, it's a school night

>>376979529

Stop starting Kamoshida and Madarame threads asking what they did wrong you fucking braindead moron.

If you only see the world in terms of what is legal/illegal then you are dangerously narrow minded and should stay in doors at all times and refrain from using the internet, lest your retardation spread to the rest of the population.

>>376992621
He's definitely going to be in P5 Arena.

>>376979529

>Seemed like a case of sour grapes from Yusuke that Madarame let his mum die in front of his own eyes so he could steal her painting

Wew lad, looks like you're setting the new bar for just how much of an idiot one person can be.

>but it's not illegal

Shut up you fucking dingus.

Not calling an ambulance when someone obviously needs medical help is a crime, at least here in Germany, it's called unterlassene Hilfeleistung(but the maximum you get for that is one year in jail, even if the person dies). Plagiarism is a crime nearly everywhere though.

>>376983514
okamura was greed.

When he gets his calling card it says that he has committed the sin of greed. (Contrast this with say, futaba, whose card says she committed the sin of sloth.)

>>376993109
To follow up on this better. Look at the names of the trophies, they each correspond to the palace.

Castle of Lust
Museum of Vanity
Bank of Gluttony
Pyramid of Wrath
Spaceport of Greed
Casino of Jealousy
Cruiser of Pride

Futaba's is the only one that seems out of place. Her cognition of her mother is wrath, whereas futaba herself is sloth.

Also, for what it's worth, pride and vanity are technically different sins, there used to be 9 sins, but the church thought 7 was a much better number, so they nixed Acedia (Which is basically apathy) and took vanity and rolled it up into pride.

Within P5 it can be stated that if futaba is sloth and her cognitive mother was wrath, then apathy is a pretty good fit for the concept of mementos/endgame wherein the characters simply dont care, and want to live their lives in cages, etc.

>>376986076
Yeah, shadows have a habit of that. It's 100% true that he felt what his shadow expressed at or around the seizure, but it could be anything from

*flails around like a retard, "that painting doe" flickers across his mind for a split second, mom dies before he even has a chance to dial a digit* tier to

*picks up unconscious cowboy and skewers them onto a set of armor while framing a small girl for the crime, ingenious criminal plan thought up in the span of 5 seconds of tie tightening* tier of masterminding. I'd say it's probably somewhere in the middle, maybe leaning towards the former going by Yusuke's social link.